[Firefly] Whedon says he's in love
Peter Hanson
Unlike some shows we could mention, much of the Firefly cast and crew
hang out on the official board and chit chat with the fans.
Joss Whedon just posted a message to the fans, which i'm reposting here
so that it might be archived on google :)
http://forums.prospero.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=foxfirefly&msg=2732.1
From: JOSS_WHEDON 1:02 am
Subject: This is Joss. Space is black and scary.
To: ALL
Hullo, friends and so-called "friends". (I know the difference: those of
you that are plotting my death are in BIG trouble. It was funny once.)
Tomorrow's the big night. I think we're in for some EXTRA-funny home
videos. Or, you know, you could watch that other show.
I'll tell you the truth. Rough month. We keep comparing ourselves and our
situation to Out of Gas. At once point I told an executive that I thought
my life had become that ep, and that I was no longer Mal, I was now the
captain of the crappy ship that shot him. I will do ANYTHING to ANYONE to
keep this bird in the air.
See, I'm in love. Which was unforseen and inconvenient. I've never felt
this way about a show, or about a cast or a working experience. I love my
other shows with gushy passion, but the coalescence of factors on this
show just changed me. If you knew the people I get to work with...
Well, I guess you sort of do. So many people have commented on how the
crew really seems to get along, to rely on each other on the show. Some
things you can't fake. My cast are the strongest, nicest bunch I've ever
known. I have dear dear friends in all my casts but this crew as a whole,
to a man, without execption, is truly a band of brothers. And sisters. A
band of siblings. Except they like each other. Is this coming through?
And forget the cast. The crew, the staff, the DP... you walk into this
world and it's breathtaking, the support and hardwork and offputting odor
(which turned out to be me, so that's okay). These people make me want to
work harder.
And you guys. We had this site up every day before we ever aired an ep.
Just saeeing the work and anticipation that went into building it
inspired us from the first days of fighting for our lives. You don't even
know. So thanks.
War Stories. I think it's an incredible ep, and you're gonna see sides of
just about everyone you haven't seen. It's the kind of ep that makes me
say "If we never make another, we've done all right".
And for the record, that's exactly what I plan to be saying in year
seven.
Thanks, guys. Sorry for the unexpected and inexcusable sincerity. It
won't happen again.
Sincerely (God! It happened again! I'm so lame!),
joss.
Papatom
This is-was an inspiiring eulogy. So our show is done, I will wait
and see.
pops
Paul Vader
>Unlike some shows we could mention, much of the Firefly cast and crew
>hang out on the official board and chit chat with the fans.
>
>Joss Whedon just posted a message to the fans, which i'm reposting here
>so that it might be archived on google :)
How often to people in TV write stuff like that? Pretty cool. *
--
* PV something like badgers--something like lizards--and something
like corkscrews.
Kevin Johnston
Peter Hanson <nospam_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Unlike some shows we could mention, much of the Firefly cast and crew
> hang out on the official board and chit chat with the fans.
>
> Joss Whedon just posted a message to the fans, which i'm reposting here
> so that it might be archived on google :)
>
> http://forums.prospero.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=foxfirefly&msg=2732.1
>
>
> From: JOSS_WHEDON 1:02 am
> Subject: This is Joss. Space is black and scary.
> To: ALL
[snip]
> I'll tell you the truth. Rough month. We keep comparing ourselves and our
> situation to Out of Gas. At once point I told an executive that I thought
> my life had become that ep, and that I was no longer Mal, I was now the
> captain of the crappy ship that shot him. I will do ANYTHING to ANYONE to
> keep this bird in the air.
BTW, what happened to that "big push" on FOX's part? I've seen ads for
tonight's John Doe, but not for Firefly at all this week. Not that I
watch tons of FOX TV -- did I miss any?
Kevin
Karen
<kevinj...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>eter Hanson <nospam_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Unlike some shows we could mention, much of the Firefly cast and crew
>> hang out on the official board and chit chat with the fans.
>>
>> Joss Whedon just posted a message to the fans, which i'm reposting here
>> so that it might be archived on google :)
>>
>> http://forums.prospero.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=foxfirefly&msg=2732.1
>>
>>
>> From: JOSS_WHEDON 1:02 am
>> Subject: This is Joss. Space is black and scary.
>> To: ALL
>
>[snip]
>
>> I'll tell you the truth. Rough month. We keep comparing ourselves and our
>> situation to Out of Gas. At once point I told an executive that I thought
>> my life had become that ep, and that I was no longer Mal, I was now the
>> captain of the crappy ship that shot him. I will do ANYTHING to ANYONE to
>> keep this bird in the air.
Awwww .... I love this guy! I love this show!! I love that he loves
this show. I want it to stay around for Year 7 - no doubt! :-)
>BTW, what happened to that "big push" on FOX's part? I've seen ads for
>tonight's John Doe, but not for Firefly at all this week. Not that I
>watch tons of FOX TV -- did I miss any?
I don't watch tons of FOX either, but I did see a promo for it last
night during the 11 p.m. syndicated airing of The Simpsons. It's the
only promo I've seen for Firefly in at least a month, and it looked
wonderful.
But hell, I keep thinking that the show's disappeared for a couple of
weeks, it's off people's radar screens, they figure it's cancelled (or
getting cancelled) anyway - I don't have a good feeling about all that
adding up to big numbers this month. Damn FOX - why don't they just
give it a vote of confidence based on Whedon's reputation and order
the full season and let it find its audience??
:-(
Karen
Jaime M. de Castellvi
<nospam_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Unlike some shows we could mention, much of the Firefly cast and crew
>hang out on the official board and chit chat with the fans.
>
>Joss Whedon just posted a message to the fans, which i'm reposting here
>so that it might be archived on google :)
>
>http://forums.prospero.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=foxfirefly&msg=2732.1
>
>
>From: JOSS_WHEDON 1:02 am
>Subject: This is Joss. Space is black and scary.
>To: ALL
>
>Hullo, friends and so-called "friends". (I know the difference: those of
>you that are plotting my death are in BIG trouble. It was funny once.)
>Tomorrow's the big night. I think we're in for some EXTRA-funny home
>videos. Or, you know, you could watch that other show.
Aw, all right then. Since you insist, I guess I will be watching
"Andromeda" after all. But I want you to know that I'm only doing it
because you told me too and I don't want to disrespect you. I hope
that you appreciate the fullness of the sacrifice.
OK, well, Joss won't be reading this post, since he doesn't hang
around these groups (dammed good thing, too!). But to those of you
who do, many of whom I've known as regulars for a while and many whom
I do not, here is an appeal, straight from the heart (if an appeal
should be needed, which I think for the most part it is not):
WATCH "FIREFLY" TONIGHT!!!!!
Please. Pretty please. Pretty pretty please.
"Farscape" is gone, and we are all sadly plagued with what "Andromeda"
(with some notable exceptions) has become. Let's do everything we can
for "Firefly" while we still have it. And maybe, if we can all
believe in fairies for just a fleeting moment, and then collectively
click our heels together wishing upon a star while we watch the show
tonight, maybe, just maybe, miracles are still possible if we can only
bring ourselves to believe with all our heart in them.
Cheers,
Jaime
Jaime M. de Castellvi
<kevinj...@yahoo.com> wrote:
Yeah, all the adds for tonight's "Firefly", it would appear.
If it's any consolation, so did the rest of us.
Cheers,
Jaime
Clifton Wood
> From: JOSS_WHEDON 1:02 am
> Subject: This is Joss. Space is black and scary.
> To: ALL
>
> just about everyone you haven't seen. It's the kind of ep that makes me
> say "If we never make another, we've done all right".
I have to WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree with Joss on this one. I've been
sitting down for the past hour trying to wrap my brain around
epic-like hour which was "War Stories".
I'm not going to sit down and describe or summarize the episode,
basically because there are just some things you have to *see*
to appreciate, and this episode is one of them. Words just
will NOT do it justice.
For the record, with a few minor exceptions (due to Fox's
brillant scheduling and pre-emptions) that I have been with
Firefly since the beginning. It took 3 episodes for it to
grow on me. I think I finally began to "get" the show
right after "Out of Gas", which was my favorite episode
of the series...until tonight.
I said I wouldn't summarize, but I will say this: WE
FINALLY see what happens when you put Serenity's crew
against the wall and call them out.
It was a damned fine sight to see, and I hope to see more
So to the cast, crew of Firefly: THANK YOU for one of the
best hours I've had the priviledge of sitting thru.
And to the fans: Hang tough. The network may be fucking
clueless, but the *show* is now on a roll.
Enjoy December.
--
- Cliff Wood
Paul Vader
>I do not, here is an appeal, straight from the heart (if an appeal
>should be needed, which I think for the most part it is not):
>
>WATCH "FIREFLY" TONIGHT!!!!!
>
>Please. Pretty please. Pretty pretty please.
And so I did. Phreeow!
First we have the answer to THE Inara "does she or doesn't she?" question.
Then we have a heartfelt relationship conversation punctuated by painful
electric shocks (normally it only *feels* that way). Then we have a
reminder how Gina Torres made Cleo 2525 watchable, Jayne using Vera as a
security blanket, and River pulling off an aiming trick that would have
made RoboCop lock up his servos. Not much to say other than ...
"I'll be in my bunk". *
P.S. Oh, and for George's purposes - 4.0, only because I know now that they
*can* do better still.
Irulan
news:3df14c69...@news.cis.dfn.de...> >http://forums.prospero.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=foxfirefly&msg=2732.1
>>much snippage<<
> WATCH "FIREFLY" TONIGHT!!!!!
>
> Please. Pretty please. Pretty pretty please.
>
> Jaime
Well, tonight's FIREFLY was just damn good. This show is getting better and
better all the time. Not just good, it's FUN! Here's to FOX PTB realizing
what a gem they have on their hands. Let's hope they make the right
decision. This show must stay at least for a full season.
--
Irulan
from the stars we came
to the stars we return
from now until the end of time
Lillith Blau
I loved tonight's show, War Stories. Why wouldn't they promote the
bejebers out of it? It was a fun Ep.
I am trying to think how well it would work for someone watching the
show for the first time, and I think it would have been a good intro
for someone who knows they are watching a show that has had previous
eps. True, the show has many characters, but I think that this show
was written in a way in which newbies would find it a good mid-season
intro. The main story only involved Mal, Wash, and Zoe, and could be
easily followed with no background. The other characters all had
parts which did not need much exposition, but added dimension to their
character.
Inara - her profession was clearly presented and the female client bit
was amusing.
Kaylee - I only watched the ep once, I do not recall a lot about her
own character shown in the ep, except for a bit of personality, but
she had some good interactions, especially with River.
Jayne - Like Kaylee, I do not recall there being anything new
introduced about him in the ep, but he was present enough to get his
personality across, especially in the volunteering to rescue Mal.
Simon - clearly shown to be a doctor, brother of River, looking to see
what was done to her, and new to being a bad boy.
River - spooky. What does Simon think was done to her?
Book - Gee, preacher knows a lot about guns.
This ep is one I would definitely recommend to newbies because not
only did it show the characters well, but it was packed with
interesting things-
Returning evil/insane bad guy
Amusing Mal/Walsh conversation while under torture scene
Inara/client interaction and reaction of crew
They cut off Mal's ear
Zoe telling the guys not to help Mal, 'cause he was handling the bad
guy
himself and then Mal saying he really would not mind the help.
River spookiness
Yea! they all got together and rescued Mal! How sweet.
I thought that it was an appealing ep and was a nice ep to follow the
previous ep, Ariel, which had a wonderful, but very different (tense,
dark, action driven) atmosphere and focus.
I promote the show. FOX should too.
Also, might I add, unlike a some other shows which were sci fi based
and on FOX Friday, I really do not see Joss letting the series go
lame.
The show has an interesting premise - Western in space - but the show
will last, if FOX gives it the opportunity, because the show does not
lean heavily on "Western in Space" - that is just the backgound. The
show has characters and adventures and mysteries and a whole universe
to interact with. This show should appeal to a wide audience, not
just sci fi junkies, they just need to be exposed to it.
FOX has a show here that can become a beloved classic with a
feverishly loyal audience for years (not even counting syndication),
if FOX does not do something stupid like kill it.
Lilly
Jaime M. de Castellvi
I think that you are right, and under normal circumstances I would
concur on the score. But since at this moment I don't know if they're
going to get the chance, this is the night for excess, revels, and to
toss all caution to the winds. A 5.0 from me, George, if you're
reading this thread (would you take a 5.01 ; ) ?
If there is a tomorrow after this, then there's always time. I'll
give out a 4.0... manana, manana : )
Cheers,
Jaime
Christine Marie
> Paul Vader wrote:
>
<snip>
> >P.S. Oh, and for George's purposes - 4.0, only because I know now that
they
> > *can* do better still.
>
> I think that you are right, and under normal circumstances I would
> concur on the score. But since at this moment I don't know if they're
> going to get the chance, this is the night for excess, revels, and to
> toss all caution to the winds. A 5.0 from me, George, if you're
> reading this thread (would you take a 5.01 ; ) ?
Me, too.
I don't think I could love Firefly more than I do. I'm ready to be proven
wrong, though.
5.0
Chris
David B.
>
> Peter Hanson <nospam_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Unlike some shows we could mention, much of the Firefly cast and crew
> > hang out on the official board and chit chat with the fans.
> >
> > Joss Whedon just posted a message to the fans, which i'm reposting here
> > so that it might be archived on google :)
> >
> > http://forums.prospero.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=foxfirefly&msg=2732.1
> >
> >
> > From: JOSS_WHEDON 1:02 am
> > Subject: This is Joss. Space is black and scary.
> > To: ALL
>
> [snip]
>
> > I'll tell you the truth. Rough month. We keep comparing ourselves and our
> > situation to Out of Gas. At once point I told an executive that I thought
> > my life had become that ep, and that I was no longer Mal, I was now the
> > captain of the crappy ship that shot him. I will do ANYTHING to ANYONE to
> > keep this bird in the air.
>
> BTW, what happened to that "big push" on FOX's part?
I think that they lied.
> I've seen ads for
> tonight's John Doe, but not for Firefly at all this week. Not that I
> watch tons of FOX TV -- did I miss any?
Oh, I'm sure there was one or two ads for it..somewhere.
David B.
> BTW, what happened to that "big push" on FOX's part? I've seen ads for
> tonight's John Doe, but not for Firefly at all this week. Not that I
> watch tons of FOX TV -- did I miss any?
I think that during Fastlane they flashed a new Firefly this Friday sign
on the screen.
jayembee
> "Farscape" is gone, [...]
Well, except for the 11 episodes that will be airing starting
in January.
> and we are all sadly plagued with what "Andromeda" (with
> some notable exceptions) has become.
Don't know. Never watched it.
Anyway..."War Stories" has continued the trend of each FIREFLY
episode being better than the one before it -- if you look at
the episodes in the order they were supposed to run, not the
order in which they *did* run.
("Serenity" will break the trend. Even the rough cut wasn't
worse than "The Train Job".)
I didn't think the show could be better than "Out of Gas",
and then we got "Ariel". I didn't think it could be better
than "Ariel", and then we got "War Stories".
Which means "Objects in Space" should be a killer.
-- jayembee
erilar
wrote:
> I think that during Fastlane they flashed a new Firefly this Friday sign
> on the screen
What's Fastlane? I only watch Fox for Firefly, John Doe(so far) and
Stargate reruns I've missed.
--
Mary Loomer Oliver(aka erilar)
Erilar's Cave Annex:
http://www.airstreamcomm.net/~erilarlo
Kevin Johnston
"David B." <both...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Kevin Johnston wrote:
> >
> > Peter Hanson <nospam_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > Unlike some shows we could mention, much of the Firefly cast and crew
> > > hang out on the official board and chit chat with the fans.
> > >
> > > Joss Whedon just posted a message to the fans, which i'm reposting here
> > > so that it might be archived on google :)
> > >
> > > http://forums.prospero.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=foxfirefly&msg=2732.1
> > >
> > >
> > > From: JOSS_WHEDON 1:02 am
> > > Subject: This is Joss. Space is black and scary.
> > > To: ALL
> >
> > [snip]
> >
> > > I'll tell you the truth. Rough month. We keep comparing ourselves and our
> > > situation to Out of Gas. At once point I told an executive that I thought
> > > my life had become that ep, and that I was no longer Mal, I was now the
> > > captain of the crappy ship that shot him. I will do ANYTHING to ANYONE to
> > > keep this bird in the air.
> >
> > BTW, what happened to that "big push" on FOX's part?
>
> I think that they lied.
Or change their minds, after the show went from life support to hiatus.
Kevin
Zombie Elvis
and cats lived together. One voice cried out in the wilderness: erilar
<erila...@SPAMchibardun.net.invalid> wrote in
<erilarloFRY-6559...@news.airstreamcomm.net>:
> In article <3DF1ADDC...@hotmail.com>, both...@hotmail.com
> wrote:
>
> > I think that during Fastlane they flashed a new Firefly this Friday sign
> > on the screen
>
> What's Fastlane? I only watch Fox for Firefly, John Doe(so far) and
> Stargate reruns I've missed.
It's like Miami Vice only not quite as good.
--
Roberto Castillo
cast...@enteract.com
http://www.enteract.com/~castillo
Captain Infinity
>Quoting Whedon:
>> "If we never make another, we've done all right".
>>
>>And for the record, that's exactly what I plan to be saying in year
>>seven.
Oh my god, seven years of Firefly. Kill me now.
>OK, well, Joss won't be reading this post, since he doesn't hang
>around these groups (dammed good thing, too!). But to those of you
>who do, many of whom I've known as regulars for a while and many whom
>I do not, here is an appeal, straight from the heart (if an appeal
>should be needed, which I think for the most part it is not):
>
>WATCH "FIREFLY" TONIGHT!!!!!
>
>Please. Pretty please. Pretty pretty please.
OK. Because I love you, I watched it. Now you have to read my review:
I absolutely cannot believe how much this show sucks. Don't "Pretty
pretty please" me again, Jaime; I'd rather rub ground glass into my eyes
than watch this show again.
Yuck.
**
Captain Infinity
..."There's going to be a lot of garbage today." --Willy Wonka
Laz
<Infi...@world.std.com> wrote:
Well, Captain, if you can watch "War Stories" and still have that
opinion, I'd say you are not capable of enjoying this show. I'd
recommend sticking with whatever TV shows you think are good. Those
would probably be the ones with the most cliches, judging by your
setting of the "Followups to:" header to "alt.dev.null". Can a troll
*be* more obvious? :)
--
Laz
A good friend will bail you out of jail, but your best friend will be
the one sitting next to you saying "That was ****ing awesome!"
-- Unknown
EyeDontNo
"Laz" <nos...@my-place.thanks> wrote in message
news:Xns92DE766053...@68.1.17.6...
> Laz
>
> A good friend will bail you out of jail, but your best friend will be
> the one sitting next to you saying "That was ****ing awesome!"
> -- Unknown
The only time I heard this quote was from Jeff Foxworthy, The Redneck
Comedian.
Laz
wrote:
Thank you! I hate being unable to give proper credit for quotes. I
was actually about ready to roll over to another quote, but now that I
have proper attribution, I'll let this one stay a while longer.
Thanks again.
--
Laz
A good friend will bail you out of jail, but your best friend will be
the one sitting next to you saying "That was ****ing awesome!"
-- Jeff Foxworthy
erilar
cast...@enteract.com wrote:
> It was a time of great turmoil. The strong preyed on the weak, dogs
> and cats lived together. One voice cried out in the wilderness: erilar
> <erila...@SPAMchibardun.net.invalid> wrote in
> <erilarloFRY-6559...@news.airstreamcomm.net>:
>
> > In article <3DF1ADDC...@hotmail.com>, both...@hotmail.com
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I think that during Fastlane they flashed a new Firefly this Friday
> > > sign
> > > on the screen
> >
> > What's Fastlane? I only watch Fox for Firefly, John Doe(so far) and
> > Stargate reruns I've missed.
>
> It's like Miami Vice only not quite as good.
>
sounds nauseating
Frank B.
> Or change their minds, after the show went from life support to
> hiatus.
hiatus? Oh... "cryogenic suspension".
Regards,
Frank B.
Growltiger
<56ydnUmyG7r...@giganews.com>...
I regret to say the network is in sad company with the legions who have
been staying away from the show. I do not want to bash Fox, but... who
am I kidding, bash away. They do not deserve sympathy. But however you
calculate the ratings, this show is way down near the bottom of the
list.
I guess turning out a dark, science fiction adventure just cannot find
takers when the country is in a recession and threatened daily by
terrorists. I have to ask how does one promote a show like this?
Critics like it, or at least those that I have read. Maybe it will get
some kind of award and so stay the executioners hand. Pity, folks just
do not know what they are missing.
--
Be seeing you,
Growltiger
Captain Infinity
Laz (if that *is* your real name) wrote:
>>>WATCH "FIREFLY" TONIGHT!!!!!
>>>
>>>Please. Pretty please. Pretty pretty please.
>>
>> OK. Because I love you, I watched it. Now you have to read my
>> review:
>>
>> I absolutely cannot believe how much this show sucks. Don't "Pretty
>> pretty please" me again, Jaime; I'd rather rub ground glass into my
>> eyes than watch this show again.
>>
>> Yuck.
>
>Well, Captain, if you can watch "War Stories" and still have that
>opinion, I'd say you are not capable of enjoying this show.
Exactly, in much the same way I cannot enjoy a steaming pile of dogshit.
>I'd recommend sticking with whatever TV shows you think are good.
I will.
>Those
>would probably be the ones with the most cliches, judging by your
>setting of the "Followups to:" header to "alt.dev.null". Can a troll
>*be* more obvious? :)
Nonsense. If I was trolling you I would want to read your reply. I
don't. I set f-u to adn because I'd like to clear My Usenet of
discussion of Firefly. Firefly is a floating turd and should be flushed
as soon as possible. That's not an opinion, it's a fact. I plan to
start a letter-writing campaign to get it canceled. Hey, it worked with
Crusade.
You are welcome, however, to sit in your own little corner with your
videotapes of Firefly and have a clit-whacking fan-wanking good time.
I just prefer not to hear your moans and sighs while you're at it.
**
Captain Infinity
...P.S. PEEP!
William December Starr
Captain Infinity <Infi...@world.std.com> said:
>> Well, Captain, if you can watch "War Stories" and still have that
>> opinion, I'd say you are not capable of enjoying this show.
>
> Exactly, in much the same way I cannot enjoy a steaming pile of
> dogshit.
[ *snip* ]
> Nonsense. If I was trolling you I would want to read your reply.
> I don't. I set f-u to adn because I'd like to clear My Usenet of
> discussion of Firefly. Firefly is a floating turd and should be
> flushed as soon as possible. That's not an opinion, it's a fact.
> I plan to start a letter-writing campaign to get it canceled. Hey,
> it worked with Crusade.
>
> You are welcome, however, to sit in your own little corner with
> your videotapes of Firefly and have a clit-whacking fan-wanking
> good time. I just prefer not to hear your moans and sighs while
> you're at it.
My gods, you're an asshole. Please die soon.
Plonk.
-- William December Starr <wds...@panix.com>
Paul Vader
>My gods, you're an asshole. Please die soon.
>Plonk.
What took you so long? *
Bobby D. Bryant
> wds...@panix.com (William December Starr) writes:
>>My gods, you're an asshole. Please die soon. Plonk.
>
> What took you so long? *
I was starting to wonder where this group's trolls were. I have trouble
imagining a group without them.
Bobby Bryant
Austin, Texas
Mara
>
Loud and clear. I wish it were on a better time slot..... I'm not used to
watching tv friday and saturday nights. I have to remember to tape it.
Mara
Laz
<Infi...@world.std.com> wrote:
> In article <Xns92DE766053...@68.1.17.6>
> Laz (if that *is* your real name) wrote:
>
>>>>WATCH "FIREFLY" TONIGHT!!!!!
>>>>
>>>>Please. Pretty please. Pretty pretty please.
>>>
>>> OK. Because I love you, I watched it. Now you have to read my
>>> review:
>>>
>>> I absolutely cannot believe how much this show sucks. Don't
>>> "Pretty pretty please" me again, Jaime; I'd rather rub ground
>>> glass into my eyes than watch this show again.
>>>
>>> Yuck.
>>
>>Well, Captain, if you can watch "War Stories" and still have that
>>opinion, I'd say you are not capable of enjoying this show.
>
> Exactly, in much the same way I cannot enjoy a steaming pile of
> dogshit.
>
>>I'd recommend sticking with whatever TV shows you think are good.
>
> I will.
>
>>Those
>>would probably be the ones with the most cliches, judging by your
>>setting of the "Followups to:" header to "alt.dev.null". Can a
>>troll *be* more obvious? :)
>
> Nonsense. If I was trolling you I would want to read your reply.
More than one kind of troll. You're the kind that is known in real
life as an asshole.
> I
> don't. I set f-u to adn because I'd like to clear My Usenet of
> discussion of Firefly.
So, it seems you're a liar as well. And not a very clever one.
> You are welcome, however, to sit in your own little corner with your
> videotapes of Firefly and have a clit-whacking fan-wanking good
> time. I just prefer not to hear your moans and sighs while you're at
> it.
I was curious about someone this desperate to get a reaction from
people, so I did a quick Google search for your name.
Is there *any* alt.tv group you don't hang out in? And you actually
watch Real World and Big Brother? Or do you just like to hang out in
their groups and belittle the viewers and the shows they like?
That's a really pathetic life you're leading there, dude.
Find yourself a girlfriend.
--
Laz
A good friend will bail you out of jail, but your best friend will be
the one sitting next to you saying "That was ****ing awesome!"
-- Jeff Foxworthy
Jaime M. de Castellvi
You know, OK, so maybe Captain Infinity doesn't get "Firefly" the way
we do. Ultimately, it is a matter of taste, and he is entitled to
his. If you have really read in detail a number of the Captain's
posts and you still think he is merely trolling or begging for
attention, then perhaps you don't get what his posts are all about,
anymore than he gets (or chooses to get) what we perceive "Firefly"
being about : )
Recently I've been thinking of how much alt.tv.firefly right this
instant reminds me of another group I used to love as a newbie,
rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5, as it was in its earlier days (concurrent
with most of seasons 1 & 2 of B5). Urban myth has it that the trolls
eventually ruined that group. In reality, it was as much the trolls
as intransigent attitudes and flames from the group's regulars, which
invited even more trolls, and from a lot of intelligent people who did
not necessarily start out as trolls. Eventually, it got to the point
where the group fluctuated between a witch hunt and a bar brawl. I'd
really hate to see the same thing happen to this group.
Prometheus is clearly an anger troll, of an unpleasant if slightly
incompetent sort. He was probably molested as a child and now,
online, he's a prisoner of his own fucked up usenet addictions and
habits. He is best dealt with by not feeding him until he starves and
leaves, or simply by laughing at and making a public mockery of him as
often as possible (in reality this is never going to happen since, in
a growing group with so many varying levels of usenet experience,
there is always going to be someone around willing to swallow his bait
in earnest, so if you get tired of ignoring him by all means flame
away and enjoy yourself... he certainly is asking for it). He is an
idiot, his M.O. is to engage in unprovoked personal attacks, so sure,
give him all the hell you want on his chosen arena.
It is certainly not the same with Captain Infinity. He may trollerize
if that's his mood, but he is not an anger troll. He may be angry on
occasion, and he will almost certainly always express his views in a
strong way which may rub a number of folks the wrong way, but that is
a different thing. Very rarely will you see him starting off by
insulting other posters, unless he is insulted first.
Yes, he has posted some strong, controversial opinions about
"Firefly". On that particular subject, since I love the show, it is
clear I disagree with him. What he said is not what I --or what many
of us-- want to hear. Nonetheless, it is how he feels, and he has as
much right to express his views as we do our own.
Of course, people in turn have a right to perceive him as a troll, as
a result. What bothers me is that while the Captain's post expressed
his uncompromising and --over here-- not very popular views about the
show as the subject matter, a number of the replies immediately became
personal; they were vicious ad hominems, insults and attempts at
character assassination.
Whatever one may think of the Captain's posts in this thread to date,
he didn't start this. And whatever the perceived provocation, such a
response immediately takes the respondant to the lowest gulley in any
claims to moral high ground on the thread.
There are going to be all kinds of folks who express views about the
show, and there will be a lot of people to whom "Firefly" doesn't
offer what they may be looking for right now in a teevee program. It
is a whacky, controversial and highly idiosyncratic show, so this is
only natural. Different strokes, and all that jazz.
Many of those people will express views as strongly as Captain
Infinity, if not more strongly. We may not agree with these views, so
we have the choice of ignoring them or engaging them in dialogue. But
if we choose to respond on the level of personal insult and if we
automatically treat them as trolls and outcasts, then they are going
to richly fulfill our expectations by becoming exactly that. It may
feel great in the short term, but in the long haul the group is going
to slowly go to hell... like so many others before it.
Just a few thoughts. You (as in "you", any person reading this, not
necessarily anyone specifically) don't have to agree with anything I
write. But I'd certainly be obligued if you dealt with by giving it
some thought, rather than by profering yet another utterly
uninteresting knee-jerk reaction.
Cheers,
Jaime
ToolPackinMama
> Prometheus is clearly an anger troll, of an unpleasant if slightly
> incompetent sort. He was probably molested as a child and now,
> online, he's a prisoner of his own fucked up usenet addictions and
> habits. He is best dealt with by not feeding him until he starves and
> leaves, or simply by laughing at and making a public mockery of him as
> often as possible (in reality this is never going to happen since, in
> a growing group with so many varying levels of usenet experience,
> there is always going to be someone around willing to swallow his bait
> in earnest, so if you get tired of ignoring him by all means flame
> away and enjoy yourself... he certainly is asking for it). He is an
> idiot, his M.O. is to engage in unprovoked personal attacks, so sure,
> give him all the hell you want on his chosen arena.
Boy, you sure got him pegged.
I don't care if people are for or against the show, as long as they are
on topic and civil. I am forced to wonder, though, how they have much
to say that is pertinent if they don't watch the show.
If they hate the show, they should IMHO watch it anyway, especially if
they are a Nielsen family. As long as they are watching, they can say
what they like about the show.
If I don't like chatting with somebody, I just give up and chat with
someone else. No big.
Jim Larson
Yo, wordboy! Summarize!
--
Jim, proffering knee-jerk reactions for fun and profit
Petri Wessman
Jim> Jaime M. de Castellvi wrote:
...
Jim> Yo, wordboy! Summarize!
Yo, newbie! Learn to quote! :)
//Petri
Tyler Trafford
Not all people have the same views. Don't judge someone by a single
post. Someone should feast on Prometheus' liver.
--
Tyler "Cliff Notes" Trafford
Jim Larson
mmmmmmmmmPrometheuslivermmmmmmmmm
--
Jim
Jim Larson
Newbie? NEWBIE!?! Well, I never...
(Besides. I know how to quote just fine, as exemplified by my last post. It's
the snipping department in which find myself woefully inadequate.)
--
Jim
Tyler Trafford
Larson, the newbie. That does have a ring to it...
--
Tyler Trafford
Jim Larson
Ring this, Trafford.
--
Jim
Petri Wessman
Jim> Petri Wessman wrote:
>> On 10 Dec 2002 15:59:29 GMT, Jim Larson <larso...@earthlink.net> said:
>>
Jim> Jaime M. de Castellvi wrote:
>> ...
Jim> Yo, wordboy! Summarize!
>>
>> Yo, newbie! Learn to quote! :)
Jim> Newbie? NEWBIE!?! Well, I never...
;). No offense intended as such, just saw one too many "zillion lines
of quoted message followed by one-line-comment" messages for one day.
Jim> (Besides. I know how to quote just fine, as exemplified by my
Jim> last post. It's the snipping department in which find myself
Jim> woefully inadequate.)
That's what I meant, yah.
And now back to our regular Usenet flamewar... *grin*
//Petri
Tyler Trafford
> Tyler Trafford wrote:
>> Petri Wessman wrote:
>>>
>>> Jim> Jaime M. de Castellvi wrote:
>>> ...
>>> Jim> Yo, wordboy! Summarize!
>>>
>>> Yo, newbie! Learn to quote! :)
>>
>> Larson, the newbie. That does have a ring to it...
>
> Ring this, Trafford.
The rosie?
--
Tyler Trafford
Jim Larson
Precisely.
Well, approximately.
Actually, not even remotely.
--
Jim
Tyler Trafford
Oh. You're a big meanie.
--
Tyler Trafford
GeeTeeExx
wrote:
Does anyone else have the words "fava beans and a nice Chianti"
running through their heads, too?
BTW, I thought it was a fine, old Firefly tradition to keep the whole
enchilada of the post in and just reply at the bottom. :o)
Jaime M. de Castellvi
<la...@lauragoodwin.org> wrote:
>"Jaime M. de Castellvi" wrote:
>
>> Prometheus is clearly an anger troll, of an unpleasant if slightly
>> incompetent sort. He was probably molested as a child and now,
>> online, he's a prisoner of his own fucked up usenet addictions and
>> habits. He is best dealt with by not feeding him until he starves and
>> leaves, or simply by laughing at and making a public mockery of him as
>> often as possible (in reality this is never going to happen since, in
>> a growing group with so many varying levels of usenet experience,
>> there is always going to be someone around willing to swallow his bait
>> in earnest, so if you get tired of ignoring him by all means flame
>> away and enjoy yourself... he certainly is asking for it). He is an
>> idiot, his M.O. is to engage in unprovoked personal attacks, so sure,
>> give him all the hell you want on his chosen arena.
>
>Boy, you sure got him pegged.
Not too hard. His type of anger troll is dime-a-dozen in usenet.
We've all seen it in spades (and far worse, the stalkers who actually
evince some degree of competence).
>I don't care if people are for or against the show, as long as they are
>on topic and civil. I am forced to wonder, though, how they have much
>to say that is pertinent if they don't watch the show.
>
>If they hate the show, they should IMHO watch it anyway, especially if
>they are a Nielsen family. As long as they are watching, they can say
>what they like about the show.
>
>If I don't like chatting with somebody, I just give up and chat with
>someone else. No big.
My kind of attitude : )
Cheers,
Jaime
Jaime M. de Castellvi
wrote:
Me, Tarzan. You, Jane... (*ook* *ook* *ook*!)
Cheers,
Jaime
>Jim, proffering knee-jerk reactions for fun and profit
Jaime, having more fun jerking something else though never, it seems,
(*sigh*) for profit.
Cheers,
Jaime
Jaime M. de Castellvi
wrote:
>Tyler Trafford wrote:
I suspect that some recipe based on Indian cuisine would do best. You
need a lot of spices to disguise the flavour, and a lot of
preparation, tenderizing and marinading to try to ammeliorate the
texture.
Cheers,
Jaime
ToolPackinMama
>> >Someone should feast on Prometheus' liver.
> >mmmmmmmmmPrometheuslivermmmmmmmmm
How to cook Prometheus liver:
First, extract liver. You'll find it's the most grossly enlarged organ
in the body, right next to the empty place where the heart should be.
Prepare liver by placing it on railroad track and letting train run over
it, a couple of times.
Butterfly liver and season. Stuff with a brick.
Roast in a slow oven (300 f.) for four hours.
Throw liver away and eat the brick.
Captain Infinity
>> I set f-u to adn because I'd like to clear My Usenet of
>> discussion of Firefly.
>
>So, it seems you're a liar as well. And not a very clever one.
You clearly have no idea what the "Follow-Up" header is for.
Go read news.newusers.questions, newbie.
**
Captain Infinity
..."I tinkered with the Tinkerbell." --Willow
Laz
Castellvi) wrote:
> You know, OK, so maybe Captain Infinity doesn't get "Firefly" the
> way we do. Ultimately, it is a matter of taste, and he is entitled
> to his. If you have really read in detail a number of the Captain's
> posts
Full stop. I've never heard of the guy until this massively
crossposted thread popped up. You're right: it is a matter of taste
and everybody is entitled to like what they want.
And if he gets vulgar and insulting, then he is entitled to hear
personal responses.
> and you still think he is merely trolling or begging for
> attention, then perhaps you don't get what his posts are all about,
> anymore than he gets (or chooses to get) what we perceive "Firefly"
> being about : )
>
> Recently I've been thinking of how much alt.tv.firefly right this
> instant reminds me of another group I used to love as a newbie,
> rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5, as it was in its earlier days (concurrent
> with most of seasons 1 & 2 of B5). Urban myth has it that the
> trolls eventually ruined that group. In reality, it was as much the
> trolls as intransigent attitudes and flames from the group's
> regulars, which invited even more trolls, and from a lot of
> intelligent people who did not necessarily start out as trolls.
> Eventually, it got to the point where the group fluctuated between a
> witch hunt and a bar brawl. I'd really hate to see the same thing
> happen to this group.
Then a good place to start would be to stop crossposting to umpteen
newsgroups. You're begging for witch hunts and bar brawls when you do
that.
> It is certainly not the same with Captain Infinity. He may
> trollerize if that's his mood, but he is not an anger troll. He may
> be angry on occasion, and he will almost certainly always express
> his views in a strong way which may rub a number of folks the wrong
> way, but that is a different thing.
> Very rarely will you see him starting off by
> insulting other posters, unless he is insulted first.
He did this time.
> Yes, he has posted some strong, controversial opinions about
> "Firefly". On that particular subject, since I love the show, it is
> clear I disagree with him. What he said is not what I --or what
> many of us-- want to hear. Nonetheless, it is how he feels, and he
> has as much right to express his views as we do our own.
Like this:
"You are welcome, however, to sit in your own little corner with your
videotapes of Firefly and have a clit-whacking fan-wanking good
time. I just prefer not to hear your moans and sighs while you're at
it."
- Captain Infinity, in this thread
He has a right to express himself like that. There's no law against
being vulgar and obnoxious. But he, and you, should understand that
when you ARE vulgar and obnoxious, then the topic changes from
whatever it started out as to you. In other words, it gets personal.
If I respond at all to crude, vulgar, and obnoxious posters, it's
going to be like this. Every time. If you find this disturbing,
please killfile me now and save yourself some grief.
> Whatever one may think of the Captain's posts in this thread to
> date, he didn't start this.
Well yeah, actually he did.
> And whatever the perceived provocation, such a
> response immediately takes the respondant to the lowest gulley in
> any claims to moral high ground on the thread.
Yup. It's a fight in the dirty, stinking trenches.
> There are going to be all kinds of folks who express views about the
> show, and there will be a lot of people to whom "Firefly" doesn't
> offer what they may be looking for right now in a teevee program.
> It is a whacky, controversial and highly idiosyncratic show, so this
> is only natural. Different strokes, and all that jazz.
I agree. I've seen all kinds of people who manage to express their
distaste for the show without trying to provoke people. I almost
never get involved in those conversations. Not on a crusade, here.
> Many of those people will express views as strongly as Captain
> Infinity, if not more strongly. We may not agree with these views,
> so we have the choice of ignoring them or engaging them in dialogue.
> But if we choose to respond on the level of personal insult and if
> we automatically treat them as trolls and outcasts, then they are
> going to richly fulfill our expectations by becoming exactly that.
> It may feel great in the short term, but in the long haul the group
> is going to slowly go to hell... like so many others before it.
Then understand this: don't crosspost to all of your favorite
newsgroups. There are many, many reasons why crossposting is frowned
upon in all but a very few special cases. This is one of those
reasons.
> Just a few thoughts. You (as in "you", any person reading this, not
> necessarily anyone specifically) don't have to agree with anything I
> write. But I'd certainly be obligued if you dealt with by giving it
> some thought, rather than by profering yet another utterly
> uninteresting knee-jerk reaction.
You obviously have a relationship with Captain Infinity outside of
alt.tv.firefly, and it bothered you that someone decided to attack him
for dropping one of his turds here. I'm sorry you were bothered by
it, but that's all the response articles like his deserve. Actually,
they don't deserve any response at all, and I was about to go to the
next message when his FollowupsTo header caught my eye. He set it to
alt.dev.null. That did it for me. It's one thing to dump a bunch of
provocative crap like that in a newsgroup; it's something else entirely
to try to stifle all responses.
The guy's a jerk. Sorry.
Jim Larson
That just means you're not trying hard enough.
--
Jim
Jaime M. de Castellvi
wrote:
>Petri Wessman wrote:
Aw Larson, yer such a godammed cherry!
(but I just want you to know that you mean the sun and the moon to
me... the sun and the moon)
Cheers,
Jaime
Jim Larson
> On 10 Dec 2002 16:21:35 GMT, Jim Larson <larso...@earthlink.net>
> wrote:
>
>>Petri Wessman wrote:
>>
>>> On 10 Dec 2002 15:59:29 GMT, Jim Larson <larso...@earthlink.net>
>>> said:
>>>
>>> Jim> Jaime M. de Castellvi wrote:
>>> ...
>>> Jim> Yo, wordboy! Summarize!
>>>
>>> Yo, newbie! Learn to quote! :)
>>
>>Newbie? NEWBIE!?! Well, I never...
>>
>>(Besides. I know how to quote just fine, as exemplified by my last post.
>>It's the snipping department in which find myself woefully inadequate.)
>
> Aw Larson, yer such a godammed cherry!
>
> (but I just want you to know that you mean the sun and the moon to
> me... the sun and the moon)
(Not the stars too?)
--
Jim
Jaime M. de Castellvi
Well, "Firefly" is pretty much OT on rast, and as for servo, it is
just a subset of rast with a very twisted way of looking at things.
>> It is certainly not the same with Captain Infinity. He may
>> trollerize if that's his mood, but he is not an anger troll. He may
>> be angry on occasion, and he will almost certainly always express
>> his views in a strong way which may rub a number of folks the wrong
>> way, but that is a different thing.
>> Very rarely will you see him starting off by
>> insulting other posters, unless he is insulted first.
>
>He did this time.
>
>> Yes, he has posted some strong, controversial opinions about
>> "Firefly". On that particular subject, since I love the show, it is
>> clear I disagree with him. What he said is not what I --or what
>> many of us-- want to hear. Nonetheless, it is how he feels, and he
>> has as much right to express his views as we do our own.
>
>Like this:
>
> "You are welcome, however, to sit in your own little corner with your
> videotapes of Firefly and have a clit-whacking fan-wanking good
> time. I just prefer not to hear your moans and sighs while you're at
> it."
Sounds more like a good old fashioned sexual metaphor than anything
resembling an insult (except by implication). It could be argued
(admittedly, from a certain point of view) that the Captain is just
riding the wave (wheee!), but S-E-X is definitely OT in this
particular junction of virtual time and space.
> - Captain Infinity, in this thread
>
>He has a right to express himself like that. There's no law against
>being vulgar and obnoxious. But he, and you, should understand that
>when you ARE vulgar and obnoxious, then the topic changes from
>whatever it started out as to you. In other words, it gets personal.
>
>If I respond at all to crude, vulgar, and obnoxious posters, it's
>going to be like this. Every time. If you find this disturbing,
>please killfile me now and save yourself some grief.
You kidding? I never ever killfile anyone. To read or not to read,
that may well be the question, but I personally refuse to let the
machine take the place of my personal judgement and choice. That's a
rub, sometimes, but mostly it would drive me bonkers to know that the
software is having all the fun of making the choice.
And as I said, different strokes.... My post is not so much about
taking issue with your personal preferences as to post a warning about
where I've seen this sort of thing end in the past, taken to an
extreme. I very much doubt it will be remembered a virtual hour from
now, much less heeded. Newsgroups go where they must as they will.
My warning was the extent of my power and desire to contribute to
this. For the most part, I'm just along for the ride, like everybody
else.
>> Whatever one may think of the Captain's posts in this thread to
>> date, he didn't start this.
>
>Well yeah, actually he did.
I will conced that it is a matter of perception.
>> And whatever the perceived provocation, such a
>> response immediately takes the respondant to the lowest gulley in
>> any claims to moral high ground on the thread.
>
>Yup. It's a fight in the dirty, stinking trenches.
Hey, with that I'm OK. Provided they are sited on the reverse slope
and nobody mistakes them from hallowed ground (particularly the sump
part).
>> There are going to be all kinds of folks who express views about the
>> show, and there will be a lot of people to whom "Firefly" doesn't
>> offer what they may be looking for right now in a teevee program.
>> It is a whacky, controversial and highly idiosyncratic show, so this
>> is only natural. Different strokes, and all that jazz.
>
>I agree. I've seen all kinds of people who manage to express their
>distaste for the show without trying to provoke people. I almost
>never get involved in those conversations. Not on a crusade, here.
>
>> Many of those people will express views as strongly as Captain
>> Infinity, if not more strongly. We may not agree with these views,
>> so we have the choice of ignoring them or engaging them in dialogue.
>> But if we choose to respond on the level of personal insult and if
>> we automatically treat them as trolls and outcasts, then they are
>> going to richly fulfill our expectations by becoming exactly that.
>> It may feel great in the short term, but in the long haul the group
>> is going to slowly go to hell... like so many others before it.
>
>Then understand this: don't crosspost to all of your favorite
>newsgroups. There are many, many reasons why crossposting is frowned
>upon in all but a very few special cases. This is one of those
>reasons.
Trust me, I've been around long enough to hear about the pros and cons
of x-posting many times over. Excessive and unreasonable x-posting is
certainly frowned upon. X-posting only to relevant groups --as in the
case of this thread-- can work both ways. Quite often it may
stimulate discussion and the humorous to-and-fro. But accidents can
happen too. As was the case in this thread.
In any event, it is all about choices, yours and mine. As I said in
my initial post, I was not so much trying to change yours as to bear a
little testimony.
>> Just a few thoughts. You (as in "you", any person reading this, not
>> necessarily anyone specifically) don't have to agree with anything I
>> write. But I'd certainly be obligued if you dealt with by giving it
>> some thought, rather than by profering yet another utterly
>> uninteresting knee-jerk reaction.
>
>You obviously have a relationship with Captain Infinity outside of
>alt.tv.firefly, and it bothered you that someone decided to attack him
>for dropping one of his turds here. I'm sorry you were bothered by
>it, but that's all the response articles like his deserve. Actually,
>they don't deserve any response at all, and I was about to go to the
>next message when his FollowupsTo header caught my eye. He set it to
>alt.dev.null. That did it for me. It's one thing to dump a bunch of
>provocative crap like that in a newsgroup; it's something else entirely
>to try to stifle all responses.
You are partially right. Captain Infinity is my son (yeah, he is
about my same age; long story...). I'm not bothered that you decided
to attack him. The Captain is quite capable of taking care of himself
whenever he chooses to (I'm actually more bothered by the fact that he
doesn't like "Firefly" as much as I do, but c'est la vie!).
But there is some bother there, and when I put my finger on it, I
think it has more to with the fact that his post might have been
misunderstood. You might well retort, "What was there to
misunderstand?", and again you would be right... from a certain point
of view.
There is no way that anybody can explain what Captain Infinity is
about in a single post. It might take a lifetime. Sometimes he may
be a troll --though not usually a mean spirited one--, sometimes he
may not. Suffice to say, he is an acquired taste and, like caviar,
not for everybody.
I will grant you that as far as "Firefly" goes, he appears to be on
major curmudgeon mode, which shames me as a father, and were he within
my reach I'd probably spank him on the butt over it. But he lives in
a different state, so this is not doable right now.
Anyway, to get back on track... beyond the bother I've described
above, which was minimal (more like a mild, resigned regret), I was
also motivated because atf does remind me somewhat of rastb5 seven
years ago. In this sense my post was by no means a hopeful gesture (I
couldn't muster that much hubris if I tried in my old age), but more
of a take-or-leave comment. FWIWW, WWM.
>The guy's a jerk. Sorry.
Don't be sorry about expressing your opinion. It causes me no pain.
You may change your mind in time, you may not. My own perception is
obviously based on a very different set of experiences, and has
solidified over the course of many years of knowing the good Captain
and being exposed to his posting (and of course, filial affection does
play a not insignificant part).
But thank you for your courtesy.
Cheers,
Jaime
P.S. Wordcount, Larson?
Jaime M. de Castellvi
wrote:
Give it time, and some fine wining and dining...
Cheers,
Jaime
Jaime M. de Castellvi
wrote:
At this point in my life, I have to be picky about the battles which
are both winnable and worth fighting for. And in that respect I must
accept the fact that I am a product of my upbringing. Raised as a
Catholic boy in Franco's Spain, alas, I was never given the
encouragement required to become either a gigolo or a successful porn
star.
But I've been masturbating since I can remember and I'm still not
blind. Also, I'm 6'4". Surely, this must count for something.
Still, I agree that my DNA (which in a perhaps naive act of
iconoclastic rebellion I choose to fancy as my "demon seed") is sadly
undervalued and misunderstood.
Then again, I haven't tried it on eBay yet...
Cheers,
Jaime
Captain Infinity
>>> Whatever one may think of the Captain's posts in this thread to
>>> date, he didn't start this.
>>
>>Well yeah, actually he did.
>
>I will conced that it is a matter of perception.
Gah. Jaime, *you* started this by crossposting your "Please please
watch" post to aft-s. You know what I think of Firefly, you should have
expected my response.
Don't toss marbles into a minefield if you're not ready for a blast or
two.
And for the record, I apologize to anyone whom I have personally
insulted with my comments about Firefly. I just really, really hate the
show, that's all. I don't plan on watching it any more, so it seems
unlikely you'll see any more reviews from me. Nothing I said was meant
in a personal way; I don't even know most of you people. I can
understand the fan mentality; I'm a fan myself, of other shows, and
would defend them in much the same way you have when presented with
negative reviews of the type I posted. If possible I would like to
suggest that we all chill out and recede to our own personal parts of
Usenet. Peace?
**
Captain Infinity
..."This could be trouble. We'd better
make a fort. I'll get some pillows." --Adam
William December Starr
3c...@comcast.net (Jaime M. de Castellvi) said:
> There are going to be all kinds of folks who express views about
> the show, and there will be a lot of people to whom "Firefly"
> doesn't offer what they may be looking for right now in a teevee
> program. It is a whacky, controversial and highly idiosyncratic
> show, so this is only natural. Different strokes, and all that
> jazz.
Somehow I have trouble seeing something like:
> Firefly is a floating turd and should be flushed as soon as
> possible. That's not an opinion, it's a fact. I plan to start
> a letter-writing campaign to get it canceled. Hey, it worked
> with Crusade.
>
> You are welcome, however, to sit in your own little corner with
> your videotapes of Firefly and have a clit-whacking fan-wanking
> good time. I just prefer not to hear your moans and sighs while
> you're at it.
...as "different strokes, and all that jazz."
> Many of those people will express views as strongly as Captain
> Infinity, if not more strongly. We may not agree with these views,
> so we have the choice of ignoring them or engaging them in
> dialogue. But if we choose to respond on the level of personal
> insult and if we automatically treat them as trolls and outcasts,
> then they are going to richly fulfill our expectations by becoming
> exactly that.
So we killfile the little rectums -- and learn to hit the 'n' key as
soon as we see any article that begins with "In article xxxxxx, The
Anus <ass...@troll.com> said..." -- and get on with our lives.
-- William December Starr <wds...@panix.com>
Launce Haught
>>>>Whatever one may think of the Captain's posts in this thread to
>>>>date, he didn't start this.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>Well yeah, actually he did.
>>>
>>>
>>I will conced that it is a matter of perception.
>>
>>
>
>Gah. Jaime, *you* started this by crossposting your "Please please
>watch" post to aft-s. You know what I think of Firefly, you should have
>expected my response.
>
>Don't toss marbles into a minefield if you're not ready for a blast or
>two.
>
>And for the record, I apologize to anyone whom I have personally
>insulted with my comments about Firefly. I just really, really hate the
>show, that's all. I don't plan on watching it any more, so it seems
>unlikely you'll see any more reviews from me. Nothing I said was meant
>in a personal way; I don't even know most of you people. I can
>understand the fan mentality; I'm a fan myself, of other shows, and
>would defend them in much the same way you have when presented with
>negative reviews of the type I posted. If possible I would like to
>suggest that we all chill out and recede to our own personal parts of
>Usenet. Peace?
>
>
>**
>Captain Infinity
>
>
Sounds Damn reasonable...
Can you take Prometheus back with you though?
--L
David B.
C'mon, that's mean. No one wants Prometheus.
David B.
Peace.
Jaime M. de Castellvi
<Infi...@world.std.com> wrote:
>Let's pretend that Jaime M. de Castellvi wrote:
>
>>>> Whatever one may think of the Captain's posts in this thread to
>>>> date, he didn't start this.
>>>
>>>Well yeah, actually he did.
>>
>>I will conced that it is a matter of perception.
>
>Gah. Jaime, *you* started this by crossposting your "Please please
>watch" post to aft-s. You know what I think of Firefly, you should have
>expected my response.
Just remember, son, as dear as you always are to my heart, there are
folks in servo other than you to whom I was appealing also.
I did think of you, but from what I'd heard in advance about the
episode, I thought it might turn you. After watching the episode, I
was convinced it would have. But I underestimated the thrall of the
dark side, my young son. In this I erred, and I admit that my
enthusiasm for "Firefly" did cloud my judgement.
>Don't toss marbles into a minefield if you're not ready for a blast or
>two.
At the time, I didn't think of it as a minefield son. Anyway, any
future messages I might post about "Firefly" to servo, please
disregard.
<*Kosh*>
"They are not for you."
</*Kosh*>
Your loving father,
Jaime
Laz
I understand. I have a 13 year old son who knows how to be pretty
obnoxious on-line (although he has never let me catch him being
vulgar). In real life, he's a gregarious, friendly kid with a heart
too big for his own good.
I understand about your newsgroup concern, too, having seen my
all-time favorite newsgroup disintegrate into meaningless and cruel
chatter. I appreciate your taking the time to explain all this to me,
and now, with a much better understanding of how this thread
developed, I'm deleting myself from it before I make it any worse.
Pistols in holsters now, backing off slowly with hands in air...
Tyler Trafford
> Jaime M. de Castellvi) wrote:
>
>> Very rarely will you see him starting off by
>> insulting other posters, unless he is insulted first.
>
> He did this time.
Did he? I thought someone else wrote that he should stick to what he
liked, which was more than likely one dimensional, etc... bad shows.
--
Tyler Trafford
Paul Vader
[Whatever - flamewar with some flounder]
Trim your damn quoted material! *
--
* PV something like badgers--something like lizards--and something
like corkscrews.
Jaime M. de Castellvi
wrote:
>3c...@comcast.net (Jaime M. de Castellvi) writes:
>[Whatever - flamewar with some flounder]
>
>Trim your damn quoted material! *
Why? You can trim them far better with your light saber.
Cheers,
Jaime
Jeffrey Lindemuth
"Jaime M. de Castellvi" <3c...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:3df6022d...@news.cis.dfn.de...
(most of well reasoned post snipped for space.)
> Recently I've been thinking of how much alt.tv.firefly right this
> instant reminds me of another group I used to love as a newbie,
> rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5, as it was in its earlier days (concurrent
> with most of seasons 1 & 2 of B5). Urban myth has it that the
trolls
> eventually ruined that group. In reality, it was as much the trolls
> as intransigent attitudes and flames from the group's regulars,
which
> invited even more trolls, and from a lot of intelligent people who
did
> not necessarily start out as trolls. Eventually, it got to the
point
> where the group fluctuated between a witch hunt and a bar brawl.
I'd
> really hate to see the same thing happen to this group.
>
Ah, yes, those were the days.
I'm taking one of my infrequent excursions out of lurking mode to ask
the following impertinent question, to wit:
Is it true that Jaime being the voice of reason is one of the signs of
the Apocalypse?
BW(not Jeffrey)L
And, lo, this shall be a sign unto you, when the one known as the
Spaniard shall speak the words of wisdom and serenity, be thou
prepared to cover thy ass.
Jaime M. de Castellvi
That's pretty much the case with Captain Infinity also. It might not
seem quite like it sometimes, from his usenet antics, but he is really
just a big, eminently huggable teddy bear.
Don't tell him I told you, though. He'll kill me.
>I understand about your newsgroup concern, too, having seen my
>all-time favorite newsgroup disintegrate into meaningless and cruel
>chatter.
Unfortunately or otherwise, there is not much one can do when this
happens. The individual can contribute, but ultimately it is up to
the collective to go wherever it will.
>I appreciate your taking the time to explain all this to me,
>and now, with a much better understanding of how this thread
>developed, I'm deleting myself from it before I make it any worse.
I don't see how. At the risk of sounding like a sop, if many more
people where as willing to read as open-mindedly as you have on this
thread, netiquette rules might well be rendered redundant.
>Pistols in holsters now, backing off slowly with hands in air...
You really want to do that with ToolPackingMamma lurking on the
background? She might interpret it as a sign of submission on your
part, and next thing you know we'd have a thread on our hands going on
about the repressed sado-masochistic yearnings between you and I...
Cheers,
Jaime
Laz
<tyler_t...@hotmail.com> wrote:
That wasn't someone else. That was me. And good point.
Laz
Hey, I might like that. :)
ToolPackinMama
> > You really want to do that with ToolPackingMamma lurking on the
> > background? She might interpret it as a sign of submission on your
> > part, and next thing you know we'd have a thread on our hands going
> > on about the repressed sado-masochistic yearnings between you and
> > I...
>
> Hey, I might like that. :)
I knew there was something I liked about you. :)
Jaime M. de Castellvi
>On 10 Dec 2002 16:20:16 GMT, Jim Larson <larso...@earthlink.net>
>wrote:
>
>>Tyler Trafford wrote:
>>
>>> Jim Larson wrote:
>>>> Jaime M. de Castellvi wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> You are welcome, however, to sit in your own little corner with your
>>>>>>> videotapes of Firefly and have a clit-whacking fan-wanking good
>>>>>>> time. I just prefer not to hear your moans and sighs while you're at
>>>>>>> it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I was curious about someone this desperate to get a reaction from
>>>>>>people, so I did a quick Google search for your name.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Is there *any* alt.tv group you don't hang out in? And you actually
>>>>>>watch Real World and Big Brother? Or do you just like to hang out in
>>>>>>their groups and belittle the viewers and the shows they like?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>That's a really pathetic life you're leading there, dude.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Find yourself a girlfriend.
>>>>>
>>>>> You know, OK, so maybe Captain Infinity doesn't get "Firefly" the way
>>>>> we do. Ultimately, it is a matter of taste, and he is entitled to
>>>>> his. If you have really read in detail a number of the Captain's
>>>>> posts and you still think he is merely trolling or begging for
>>>>> attention, then perhaps you don't get what his posts are all about,
>>>>> anymore than he gets (or chooses to get) what we perceive "Firefly"
>>>>> being about : )
>>>>>
>>>>> Recently I've been thinking of how much alt.tv.firefly right this
>>>>> instant reminds me of another group I used to love as a newbie,
>>>>> rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5, as it was in its earlier days (concurrent
>>>>> with most of seasons 1 & 2 of B5). Urban myth has it that the trolls
>>>>> eventually ruined that group. In reality, it was as much the trolls
>>>>> as intransigent attitudes and flames from the group's regulars, which
>>>>> invited even more trolls, and from a lot of intelligent people who did
>>>>> not necessarily start out as trolls. Eventually, it got to the point
>>>>> where the group fluctuated between a witch hunt and a bar brawl. I'd
>>>>> really hate to see the same thing happen to this group.
>>>>>
>>>>> Prometheus is clearly an anger troll, of an unpleasant if slightly
>>>>> incompetent sort. He was probably molested as a child and now,
>>>>> online, he's a prisoner of his own fucked up usenet addictions and
>>>>> habits. He is best dealt with by not feeding him until he starves and
>>>>> leaves, or simply by laughing at and making a public mockery of him as
>>>>> often as possible (in reality this is never going to happen since, in
>>>>> a growing group with so many varying levels of usenet experience,
>>>>> there is always going to be someone around willing to swallow his bait
>>>>> in earnest, so if you get tired of ignoring him by all means flame
>>>>> away and enjoy yourself... he certainly is asking for it). He is an
>>>>> idiot, his M.O. is to engage in unprovoked personal attacks, so sure,
>>>>> give him all the hell you want on his chosen arena.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is certainly not the same with Captain Infinity. He may trollerize
>>>>> if that's his mood, but he is not an anger troll. He may be angry on
>>>>> occasion, and he will almost certainly always express his views in a
>>>>> strong way which may rub a number of folks the wrong way, but that is
>>>>> a different thing. Very rarely will you see him starting off by
>>>>> insulting other posters, unless he is insulted first.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, he has posted some strong, controversial opinions about
>>>>> "Firefly". On that particular subject, since I love the show, it is
>>>>> clear I disagree with him. What he said is not what I --or what many
>>>>> of us-- want to hear. Nonetheless, it is how he feels, and he has as
>>>>> much right to express his views as we do our own.
>>>>>
>>>>> Of course, people in turn have a right to perceive him as a troll, as
>>>>> a result. What bothers me is that while the Captain's post expressed
>>>>> his uncompromising and --over here-- not very popular views about the
>>>>> show as the subject matter, a number of the replies immediately became
>>>>> personal; they were vicious ad hominems, insults and attempts at
>>>>> character assassination.
>>>>>
>>>>> Whatever one may think of the Captain's posts in this thread to date,
>>>>> he didn't start this. And whatever the perceived provocation, such a
>>>>> response immediately takes the respondant to the lowest gulley in any
>>>>> claims to moral high ground on the thread.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are going to be all kinds of folks who express views about the
>>>>> show, and there will be a lot of people to whom "Firefly" doesn't
>>>>> offer what they may be looking for right now in a teevee program. It
>>>>> is a whacky, controversial and highly idiosyncratic show, so this is
>>>>> only natural. Different strokes, and all that jazz.
>>>>>
>>>>> Many of those people will express views as strongly as Captain
>>>>> Infinity, if not more strongly. We may not agree with these views, so
>>>>> we have the choice of ignoring them or engaging them in dialogue. But
>>>>> if we choose to respond on the level of personal insult and if we
>>>>> automatically treat them as trolls and outcasts, then they are going
>>>>> to richly fulfill our expectations by becoming exactly that. It may
>>>>> feel great in the short term, but in the long haul the group is going
>>>>> to slowly go to hell... like so many others before it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Just a few thoughts. You (as in "you", any person reading this, not
>>>>> necessarily anyone specifically) don't have to agree with anything I
>>>>> write. But I'd certainly be obligued if you dealt with by giving it
>>>>> some thought, rather than by profering yet another utterly
>>>>> uninteresting knee-jerk reaction.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yo, wordboy! Summarize!
>>>
>>>
>>> Not all people have the same views. Don't judge someone by a single
>>> post. Someone should feast on Prometheus' liver.
>>
>>mmmmmmmmmPrometheuslivermmmmmmmmm
>
>Does anyone else have the words "fava beans and a nice Chianti"
>running through their heads, too?
>
>BTW, I thought it was a fine, old Firefly tradition to keep the whole
>enchilada of the post in and just reply at the bottom. :o)
Well then, I guess I'll trim my burritos if you cut your fajitas down
to size : )
Cheers,
Jaime
James Craine
Lillith Blau wrote:
>
> Kaylee - I only watched the ep once, I do not recall a lot about her
> own character shown in the ep, except for a bit of personality, but
> she had some good interactions, especially with River.
We learned she was a coward.
> River - spooky. What does Simon think was done to her?
But one heck of a pistol shot.
> Book - Gee, preacher knows a lot about guns.
Well he was a cop once ;)
> Amusing Mal/Walsh conversation while under torture scene
The funniest torture scene I have ever seen. Can anybody besides Joss
make torture funny?
> Zoe telling the guys not to help Mal, 'cause he was handling the bad
> guy himself and then Mal saying he really would not mind the help.
I loved that. Finally a man who (unlike say Xander) want outside help in
that situation. The whole honor thing is just dumb.
GeeTeeExx
If you do, you'll get a chili reception the next time we meet!
Woohoo! Bad puns...
Jaime M. de Castellvi
That was Porco. There is a difference!
The deeds of the past, both good and bad, are the price paid in
advance for every living moment of the precious present. The
acquisition of a proper conscience is a life-long endeavour, along the
course of many lives, most likely.
As is natural, one tends to remember the good, subjectively defined:
the endless laughter, paid for mostly by the usual suspects, by a
number of pompous souls (since I'm nothing if not a pompous ass
myself, I guess I picked of them out of spite for daring to profer
such a mocking mirror), and by more than a few unfortunate mistakes.
Remember old Ben Matterson, FI? A nice enough guy, but we sure
delighted in confusing the heck out of the poor dude, and of the few
other posters who came into tangential contact with these encounters
and made the awful mistake of giving a damm about something in them...
Ah, we've most been newbies once, insecure in our inner usenet
soulfullness, all too eager to prove ourselves at the expense of
anyone who would furnish us with an excuse. Those times are long
gone, and the younger usenet newbies will now be pulling irreverently
at our own white beards. Karma pecans.
Cheers,
Jaime
Bobby D. Bryant
> Peter Hanson <nospam_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Unlike some shows we could mention, much of the Firefly cast and crew
>> hang out on the official board and chit chat with the fans.
>>
>> Joss Whedon just posted a message to the fans, which i'm reposting here
>> so that it might be archived on google :)
>>
>> http://forums.prospero.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=foxfirefly&msg=2732.1
>>
>>
>> From: JOSS_WHEDON 1:02 am
>> Subject: This is Joss. Space is black and scary. To: ALL
>
> [snip]
>
>> I'll tell you the truth. Rough month. We keep comparing ourselves and
>> our situation to Out of Gas. At once point I told an executive that I
>> thought my life had become that ep, and that I was no longer Mal, I was
>> now the captain of the crappy ship that shot him. I will do ANYTHING to
>> ANYONE to keep this bird in the air.
>
> BTW, what happened to that "big push" on FOX's part? I've seen ads for
> tonight's John Doe, but not for Firefly at all this week. Not that I
> watch tons of FOX TV -- did I miss any?
I overheard _one_ for Firefly, _several_ for John Doe, and _piles_ for
Richter.
I guess "big push" means showing one ad for a show they don't actually
care about.
Bobby Bryant
Austin, Texas