Station Tones
Jackson
sinewave, etc.) of the three Station 51 alert tones?
TIA
Rich
SCA 1 0 3 8
Motorola 1 0 3 8
GE 1 0.2 3 8
Plectron 0.75 0 0.25 4
Reach 1 0.1 1 4
All Times in Seconds
"Jackson" <n...@atr.com> wrote in message
news:9p05jf$8e7$1...@eeyore.INS.cwru.edu...
resqchf701
The chart you posted shows timing of different tone formats, but I dont
think it applies to E!. The format used in Emergency! was the Motorola
Quick Call 1 format. It sent a total of FOUR tones in a 2+2 format. (two
sent together, then two others sent together.) This format used (IIRC, My
notes are at work) Tone 1= 0.75 seconds; Pause of zero seconds, then Tone 2=
0.75 seconds, standard configuration. Motorola used at least three groups
of tones for 2+2 formatting (They called them Tone Group A, B, & Z.) Each of
the tones (at least in Group Z which we use) had a letter to identify the
tone:
Ex: C, D, E, F, G, H, J, K, L, M, N, P. C is the lowest in Frequency, P is
the highest. These were set up by Civil Defense in the late 50s. (Our
county 1957)
(Note to Jackson: When the boys are in quarters, the third sound you hear
is a claxon or horn in the station. This is what the tones activate.)
Of the four tones used, 1 in the first pair, and one in the second pair were
used by EVERY station. The other two made the
"unique" tone for the individual station. If you sent the two tones common
for every station out for eight seconds, EVERY station was alerted.
Getting the timing, and the tuning right on these systems to make them work
proved to be a downright P.I.T.A. One of the final adjustments was adjusting
the deviation of the transmitter. As we found out, modern radios dont have
this adjustment AT ALL. Motorola abandoned QC1 in the seventies, and you
can't get parts anymore. Bramco and some Plectron receivers used these
tones, and alas they are gone also. For these reasons, one by one, the
stations in my county are saying goodbye as many (including L.A. county)
have done before to the old familiar tones heard on E!
My station is a hold out however :-)
I do not know which tones from which groups form the station 51 tones, I
wish I did. If anyone knows, jump in.
Also on www.emergencyfans.com and in some messages to this group, the term
SCU are used to describe the tones.
If anyone can explain what SCU stands for, Please post.
I hope I didnt bore you.......;-)
Kevin S.
resqchief 701
"Rich" <Rich...@home.com> wrote in message
news:EYRs7.56098$5A3.20...@news1.rdc2.pa.home.com...
______________________________________________________________________________
Posted Via Binaries.net = SPEED+RETENTION+COMPLETION = http://www.binaries.net
Bill W.
If anyone can explain what SCU stands for, Please post.
Station Call Unit
Bill W.
resqchf701
Kevin
"Bill W." <wwa...@javanet.com> wrote in message
news:9p1gku$j7b$1...@bob.news.rcn.net...
>
> If anyone can explain what SCU stands for, Please post.
>
> Station Call Unit
>
> Bill W.
>
>
Fred Garvin
>
> Station Call Unit
I have also heard it being called Selective Calling Unit or Station Control
Unit.
Paul Keenleyside
"resqchf701" <kdsn...@SPAMBITESjuno.com> wrote in message
news:3bb43...@corp-goliath.newsgroups.com...
> Hello Rich and Jackson,
>
> The chart you posted shows timing of different tone formats, but I dont
> think it applies to E!. The format used in Emergency! was the Motorola
> Quick Call 1 format. It sent a total of FOUR tones in a 2+2 format. (two
> sent together, then two others sent together.) This format used (IIRC, My
> notes are at work) Tone 1= 0.75 seconds; Pause of zero seconds, then Tone
2=
> 0.75 seconds, standard configuration. Motorola used at least three
groups
> of tones for 2+2 formatting (They called them Tone Group A, B, & Z.) Each
of
> the tones (at least in Group Z which we use) had a letter to identify the
> tone:
This was neat stuff. I kept a copy of your email for reference. Always
wondered on how they worked. The only Motorola Quick Call I saw was resting
comfortably in retirement behind glass at the LACoFD Fire Command Center.
One learns something new everyday!
Thanks!!
Burnaby 51 Clear KMG 941
Jasper
Thanks so much for the information! Exactly what I was looking for. I did
some digging on the web and found a couple pages relating to Motorola Quick
Call 1 tones. Check out
http://www.genave.com/mot_quick_call_1.htm
and
http://www.rfwiz.com/VertexTwo-ToneChart.htm
I also found a reference on a link to a defunct web page that said that the
tones used for Station 51 on E! are/were used in real life by LA County FD
Station 50 in Commerce City.
I ran the .wav file containing the Station 51 tones through a PC frequency
analyzer (there are a bunch of these applications out there available to
download free) but it's difficult to pick out which are the actual tones
being played and which are the harmonics that also appear as strong
frequency spikes. I suppose given sufficient time and given the information
about how some common tones were used across all stations, it would be
possible to use a multistation call sequence to figure out which were the
common tones. But it might be easier to just call out to Los Angeles and
find someone with the information...
Which brings me to another question: why were Station 51's tones always
played last on the show when a multi-station call came in?
Jack
"resqchf701" <kdsn...@SPAMBITESjuno.com> wrote in message
news:3bb43...@corp-goliath.newsgroups.com...
> Hello Rich and Jackson,
>
> The chart you posted shows timing of different tone formats, but I dont
> think it applies to E!. The format used in Emergency! was the Motorola
> Quick Call 1 format. It sent a total of FOUR tones in a 2+2 format. (two
> sent together, then two others sent together.) This format used (IIRC, My
> notes are at work) Tone 1= 0.75 seconds; Pause of zero seconds, then Tone
2=
> 0.75 seconds, standard configuration. Motorola used at least three
groups
> of tones for 2+2 formatting (They called them Tone Group A, B, & Z.) Each
of
> the tones (at least in Group Z which we use) had a letter to identify the
> tone:
>
> If anyone can explain what SCU stands for, Please post.
>
> I hope I didnt bore you.......;-)
>
> Kevin S.
> resqchief 701
>
> "Rich" <Rich...@home.com> wrote in message
> news:EYRs7.56098$5A3.20...@news1.rdc2.pa.home.com...
> > Maker Tone 1 Pause Tone 2 Group
> > SCA 1 0 3 8
> > Motorola 1 0 3 8
> > GE 1 0.2 3 8
> > Plectron 0.75 0 0.25 4
> > Reach 1 0.1 1 4
> >
> > All Times in Seconds
> >
> >
> > "Jackson" <n...@atr.com> wrote in message
> > news:9p05jf$8e7$1...@eeyore.INS.cwru.edu...
> > > Does anyone know the frequencies, durations, and type (i.e.
squarewave,
> > > sinewave, etc.) of the three Station 51 alert tones?
> > >
> > > TIA
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________
__
Jackson
Thanks so much for the information! Exactly what I was looking for. I did
some digging on the web and found a couple pages relating to Motorola Quick
Call 1 tones. Check out
http://www.genave.com/mot_quick_call_1.htm
and
http://www.rfwiz.com/VertexTwo-ToneChart.htm
I also found a reference on a link to a defunct web page that said that the
tones used for Station 51 on E! are/were used in real life by LA County FD
Station 50 in Commerce City.
I ran the .wav file containing the Station 51 tones through a PC frequency
analyzer (there are a bunch of these applications out there available to
download free) but it's difficult to pick out which are the actual tones
being played and which are the harmonics that also appear as strong
frequency spikes. I suppose given sufficient time and given the information
about how some common tones were used across all stations, it would be
possible to use a multistation call sequence to figure out which were the
common tones. But it might be easier to just call out to Los Angeles and
find someone with the information...
Which brings me to another question: why were Station 51's tones always
played last on the show when a multi-station call came in?
Jack
"resqchf701" <kdsn...@SPAMBITESjuno.com> wrote in message
news:3bb43...@corp-goliath.newsgroups.com...
Paul Keenleyside
"Jasper" <n...@aer.com> wrote in message
news:9p9kak$ibq$1...@eeyore.INS.cwru.edu...
> Kevin,
>
> Thanks so much for the information! Exactly what I was looking for. I
did
> some digging on the web and found a couple pages relating to Motorola
Quick
> Call 1 tones. Check out
>
> http://www.genave.com/mot_quick_call_1.htm
>
> and
>
> http://www.rfwiz.com/VertexTwo-ToneChart.htm
>
> I also found a reference on a link to a defunct web page that said that
the
> tones used for Station 51 on E! are/were used in real life by LA County FD
> Station 50 in Commerce City.
>
> I ran the .wav file containing the Station 51 tones through a PC frequency
> analyzer (there are a bunch of these applications out there available to
> download free) but it's difficult to pick out which are the actual tones
> being played and which are the harmonics that also appear as strong
> frequency spikes. I suppose given sufficient time and given the
information
> about how some common tones were used across all stations, it would be
> possible to use a multistation call sequence to figure out which were the
> common tones. But it might be easier to just call out to Los Angeles and
> find someone with the information...
That might be a tad difficult as the Motorola system was phased out in the
1970's and most of the guys
In Comunications are retired. Buit there must be something there at HQ in
the basement for example.
I forget my basic electronics (having took only one class in Grade 9), but
what frequency or tone would be
considered a "low" tone, and another one considered a "high" tone? The only
frequencies I was exposed to
were those used on our VHF radio aboard our boat.
> Which brings me to another question: why were Station 51's tones always
> played last on the show when a multi-station call came in?
Some were played with Station 51 tones and the klaxon (buzz), followed by a
first response sequence.
But then I also noticed that there were Station 51 tones no first response
tone pair sequence, and there is the actual spoken radio call for first
responding units.
One thing I've wondered about the Motorola Quick Call. There doesn't seem to
be any lights for each of
the buttons so how would one keep track of the right tone pair to set?
Any of you guys mind if I consolidate all of this (with proper credits of
course) to my Emergency! Fire Shop Web site? (A web site devoted to the
apparatus and equipment used on the show) This thread will eventually expire
and when it does this information will be lost (this is why I've been
keeping it along with who's been writing it. I'm rewriting the Emergency!
Fire Shop web site with new apparatus material, and this information on the
Quick Call would be a great addition. It does fill in the pieces.
Keep writing this is fascinating stuff!!
Fred Garvin
127 and 36 being dispatched to a call with the old Motorola quick call. It
was recorded in the early to mid 1980's. E-mail me if you want it.
Remove the "S" to reply.
resqchf701
"Paul Keenleyside" <pl...@paralynx.com> wrote in message
news:3bb892d1$0$11...@fountain.mindlink.net...
>
> "Jasper" <n...@aer.com> wrote in message
> news:9p9kak$ibq$1...@eeyore.INS.cwru.edu...
> > Kevin,
> >
> > Thanks so much for the information! Exactly what I was looking for. I
> did
> > some digging on the web and found a couple pages relating to Motorola
> Quick
> > Call 1 tones. Check out
> >
> > http://www.genave.com/mot_quick_call_1.htm
> >
> > and
> >
> > http://www.rfwiz.com/VertexTwo-ToneChart.htm
And thanks for the links! The genave site has them has the chart, but is
missing tone PZ which is 106? hz. That tone WILL awaken you in most any
condition.
> >
> > I also found a reference on a link to a defunct web page that said that
> the
> > tones used for Station 51 on E! are/were used in real life by LA County
FD
> > Station 50 in Commerce City.
It would fit with the "keep it authentic" Jack Webb influence.
> >
> > I ran the .wav file containing the Station 51 tones through a PC
frequency
> > analyzer (there are a bunch of these applications out there available to
> > download free) but it's difficult to pick out which are the actual tones
> > being played and which are the harmonics that also appear as strong
> > frequency spikes.
I will have to look for those applications. I guess I spend too much time in
usenet 8-)
Does the analyzer give any readings close to the tones on the chart?
I suppose given sufficient time and given the
> information
> > about how some common tones were used across all stations, it would be
> > possible to use a multistation call sequence to figure out which were
the
> > common tones. But it might be easier to just call out to Los Angeles
and
> > find someone with the information...
That multistation capability was incorporated in our area, and was utilized
for Civil Defense warnings. I cant say it was used everywhere. It might be
that all battalion 14 stations had the common two tones. Or not.
>
> That might be a tad difficult as the Motorola system was phased out in the
> 1970's and most of the guys
> In Comunications are retired. Buit there must be something there at HQ in
> the basement for example.
You never know what you may find. Paul makes a good point about the loss in
experience in the comm business. I have two friends who are radio techs,
one who is drawing social security, one who is getting close, who I learn
from. One is independent, one works for a service company. The
independent made some cash wiring claxon systems in fire stations "just like
Station 51"
>
> I forget my basic electronics (having took only one class in Grade 9), but
> what frequency or tone would be
> considered a "low" tone, and another one considered a "high" tone? The
only
> frequencies I was exposed to
> were those used on our VHF radio aboard our boat.
Look at the charts from the above link. My station code is HKDM.
(hzkz+dzmz)= siren activation. M is higher frequency than C.
> > Which brings me to another question: why were Station 51's tones always
> > played last on the show when a multi-station call came in?
>
> Some were played with Station 51 tones and the klaxon (buzz), followed by
a
> first response sequence.
Were they last? I always thought they were first, (to give them a chance to
run to the trucks while the other tones are sent)
I also wonder if the B.C. had his own tone?
>
> But then I also noticed that there were Station 51 tones no first response
> tone pair sequence, and there is the actual spoken radio call for first
> responding units.
If the squad is returning from a call, they sent a 3 beep alert sequence and
called the squad (Sam knowing they were not back in quarters).
If the engine was needed, the station tones were sent (IIRC)
>
> One thing I've wondered about the Motorola Quick Call. There doesn't seem
to
> be any lights for each of
> the buttons so how would one keep track of the right tone pair to set?
I saw the QC encoder (BIG TECH TERM) on your site. It is an
electro-mechanincal monstrosity. They button was programmed and labeled by
station.
If you sent the tones too quickly (and in some cases the wrong sequence) you
get false trips.
Example: Station A has tone group DMEK; Station B has tone group
DMHK; If you send these too quickly, the ancient reeds in the station
decoder (Another Tech term) at Station C who has tone group EKDM WILL be
activated. TRUST ME!!!
We had two BRAMCO 2+2 encoders. One was preprogrammed with all 24
combinations we had. This was similar to what you saw Sam using in
operation, but not in looks. 24 small black buttons and a send button on
top of a box about the demensions of a laptop computer.
The other one had 4 rows of buttons, labeled from C to P with a send and
clear button. This was the back up that was used to set the tones manually.
This allowed you to activate other county's tones if they had an equipment
failure, or your own for that matter. Motorola had one of those also. All
these, especially as old as they were when I used them, were contemptable.
I remember a part-timer in a neighboring county
doing the weekly siren test. The checked both their boxes on alternate
weeks. He used the program-it-yourself box, and didnt make sure
all the buttons were reset. He sent the first tone, got all his stations,
and some in every surrounding county in one shot.
>
> Any of you guys mind if I consolidate all of this (with proper credits of
> course) to my Emergency! Fire Shop Web site? (A web site devoted to the
> apparatus and equipment used on the show) This thread will eventually
expire
> and when it does this information will be lost (this is why I've been
> keeping it along with who's been writing it. I'm rewriting the Emergency!
> Fire Shop web site with new apparatus material, and this information on
the
> Quick Call would be a great addition. It does fill in the pieces.
By all means! I glad I can contribute to Burnaby 51 Fire Shop. Your
knowledge of the equipment is quite evident, and you are to be commended.
BTW, can I get appointed Chief radio geek? :-)
>
> Keep writing this is fascinating stuff!!
>
> Burnaby 51 Clear KMG 941
>
>
I could ramble on aimlessly, If you have any specific or non-specific
questions, post them.
Kevin
>
>
>
>
>
______________________________________________________________________________
Jasper
> > I also found a reference on a link to a defunct web page that said that
> > the tones used for Station 51 on E! are/were used in real life by LA
County
> >FD Station 50 in Commerce City.
>
> It would fit with the "keep it authentic" Jack Webb influence.
More on that is available at: http://shade.grove.iup.edu/~vbyprdb/faq.html
> > I ran the .wav file containing the Station 51 tones through a PC
>> frequency analyzer (there are a bunch of these applications out there
available to
>> download free) but it's difficult to pick out which are the actual tones
> > being played and which are the harmonics that also appear as strong
> > frequency spikes.
>
> I will have to look for those applications. I guess I spend too much time
in
> usenet 8-)
> Does the analyzer give any readings close to the tones on the chart?
It's hard to tell -- there are several spikes and plugging them into a tone
generator doesn't generate sounds that sound right. You can look yourself -
one analyzer I used is available at www.download.com - search for analfreq.
The second is available at http://www.relisoft.com/freeware/index.htm
Speaking of tone generators (if you want to make your own tones), here are
locations of two good ones:
http://www.esser.u-net.com/ and http://www.nch.com.au/action/index.html#TONE
If you want to make multiple tones, just start two or more copies of the
programs (each application has its pros and cons) and set each to create a
different frequency.
> > Any of you guys mind if I consolidate all of this (with proper credits
of
> > course) to my Emergency! Fire Shop Web site? (A web site devoted to the
> > apparatus and equipment used on the show) This thread will eventually
> expire
> > and when it does this information will be lost (this is why I've been
> > keeping it along with who's been writing it. I'm rewriting the
Emergency!
> > Fire Shop web site with new apparatus material, and this information on
> the
> > Quick Call would be a great addition. It does fill in the pieces.
Yes - please consolodate anything you wish for future reference.
Paul Keenleyside
"> > That might be a tad difficult as the Motorola system was phased out in
the
> > 1970's and most of the guys
> > In Comunications are retired. Buit there must be something there at HQ
in
> > the basement for example.
>
> You never know what you may find. Paul makes a good point about the loss
in
> experience in the comm business. I have two friends who are radio techs,
> one who is drawing social security, one who is getting close, who I learn
> from. One is independent, one works for a service company. The
> independent made some cash wiring claxon systems in fire stations "just
like
> Station 51"
Geezus, people actually do that? The Fire Chief must had a cow.
>
> >
> > I forget my basic electronics (having took only one class in Grade 9),
but
> > what frequency or tone would be
> > considered a "low" tone, and another one considered a "high" tone? The
> only
> > frequencies I was exposed to
> > were those used on our VHF radio aboard our boat.
>
> Look at the charts from the above link. My station code is HKDM.
> (hzkz+dzmz)= siren activation. M is higher frequency than C.
I've studied them, gues it's elbows propped on the desk time again :-)
>
>
> > > Which brings me to another question: why were Station 51's tones
always
> > > played last on the show when a multi-station call came in?
> >
> > Some were played with Station 51 tones and the klaxon (buzz), followed
by
> a
> > first response sequence.
>
> Were they last? I always thought they were first, (to give them a chance
to
> run to the trucks while the other tones are sent)
> I also wonder if the B.C. had his own tone?
I've heard some that were last, others that were first. Battalion 14 had
his own tone set,
as for major incidents, Battalion 14 responded with Station 51.
LACoFD Battalion 14 doesn't serve the region where Station 51 was in the
show. But then again as I found out
by personally checking out L.A. E! locations when I was there in April that
Squad 51 was all over the county. That took a day and a half to get to the
locations I was looking for and haven't gotten to others I knew or DJ here
knows about.
(In Camera Bug, the boys respond from Rampart to Station 68. Station 68 is
at least a forty minute trip from Rampart Emergency as Sta. 68 is in
Calabasas, north of Malibu).
> I saw the QC encoder (BIG TECH TERM) on your site. It is an
> electro-mechanincal monstrosity. They button was programmed and labeled by
> station.
>
> By all means! I glad I can contribute to Burnaby 51 Fire Shop. Your
> knowledge of the equipment is quite evident, and you are to be commended.
> BTW, can I get appointed Chief radio geek? :-)
Welcome to Emergency! HQ. Chief of Communications! (Sounds better than
Chief Radio Geek!!)
I'm remodelling the Fire Shop (adding new stuff and writing the second
edition of the E! Manifest that will be easier to read than the old one. A
new page will be devoted to the Dispatch system as there's too much to
put in for just a couple paragraphs!
Hmm now about that biophone...