Evidence suggests missing toddler attacked by mountain lion
Chocolic
Associated Press
Jaryd Atadero, shown in an undated family photo, disappeared during a hike
in 1999. At right, his father chokes back tears during a news conference,
in which his son's clothes were displayed.
Associated Press
Jun. 10, 2003 04:36 PM
FORT COLLINS, Colo. - Authorities said Tuesday they believe a 3-year-old
boy who vanished on a mountain hike 3 1/2 years ago was attacked by an
animal, probably a mountain lion.
"Everything that we're finding is consistent with that theory," Larimer
County Sheriff Jim Alderden said at a news conference called several days
after Jaryd Atadero's clothing was found in rugged terrain not far from
where he disappeared.
The boy's father, Allyn Atadero, choked back tears and said he was not yet
certain Jaryd was dead.
"The clothes don't tell me what happened. All we can do is speculate," he
said. "I would give anything to hold any part of Jaryd right now. When I
look up at the stars at night I would like to know that I'm looking up
there for a reason."
Red-eyed, he added: "If my son is in heaven - I want to know that you can
hear me because God knows I've been talking to you every day."
Jaryd's jacket, tattered pants and shoes were found Thursday in the
Comanche Peak Wilderness Area west of Fort Collins, several hundred feet
above the trail where he disappeared on Oct. 2, 1999. He was on a hiking
trip that day with a church group, and had been running ahead to hide so he
could jump out from his hiding place and say "boo."
Two fishermen who saw him later told search crews he asked them whether
there were bears in the woods.
Searchers spent six days combing the area after Jaryd vanished but found
nothing. The sheriff said the mountainside where the clothing was found was
searched by helicopter, but not by foot because authorities thought it
unlikely the boy had clambered up the 45-degree slope.
No remains have been found, but Alderden said search teams will return to
the site Saturday. He also said wildlife officials will test two hairs
found on the clothing to determine their origin.
The sheriff said the case appears to be consistent with an attack by a
mountain lion. But he also said he's unsure authorities will ever be able
to determine what happened.
"I'm not optimistic that we will find anything conclusive," he said.
Fatal attacks have been recorded in Colorado before. In 1991, an
18-year-old man was killed by a mountain lion as he jogged near Idaho
Springs. And in 1997, a 10-year-old boy was killed by a lion as he hiked in
nearby Rocky Mountain National Park.
But Fred Quartarone of the state Division of Wildlife said such attacks are
rare. He said mountain lions can reach 150 pounds; Jaryd weighed 35 pounds
when he disappeared.
Atadero said he was struck by the excellent condition of the shoes.
"The shoes look like he had them yesterday, almost as if he took them off
and left them there and I could walk up to him and tell him 'Why'd you
leave your shoes here? Why don't you put them away?' " he said.
Atadero has kept mementos of the day his son disappeared - rocks from the
canyon, a bottle of water from the South Fork of the Poudre River where
investigators thought the boy may have drowned, a walking stick. All are
kept on a shelf at his Littleton home.
"Everyday I walk by it, touch it and make sure he's part of my life," he
said.
Over the years, Atadero has talked to people who have offered him various
theories on Jaryd's disappearance. Three months ago, a psychic group called
him to say the boy had been abducted and taken overseas.
He said he's listened to such people with an open mind while waiting for
evidence. That evidence came Friday when sheriff's deputies told Atadero
about the clothing and e-mailed him photos of the discovery.
The camel-colored fleece jacket appeared intact, and the blue-and-white
tennis shoes also appeared unscathed.
But the blue cotton pants appear to be turned inside out and the right leg
is missing. Atadero said that doesn't make sense to him.
"There are several theories. That he could have frozen, been abducted, been
taken by an animal or he fell in the river and drowned," he said. "Right
now, all we know is that he is not in the river."
Atadero said he probably will wait until the weekend to visit the site. He
stopped to compose himself as he recounted a recent conversation with
9-year-old daughter Josallyn, who was on the hike with Jaryd.
"'Daddy, I would much rather know that Jaryd is dead on the mountain than
to spend my whole life searching,' " Atadero said.
-------------------------
The evidence suggests he was attacked by a mountain lion? How? Wouldn't
you think the clothes would be strewn farther apart and not together? And
they still don't explain why the shoes are still in such good shape.
Chocolic
annein...@attbi.com
wrote:
>Evidence suggests missing toddler attacked by mountain lion
>
>Associated Press
>Jaryd Atadero, shown in an undated family photo, disappeared during a hike
>in 1999. At right, his father chokes back tears during a news conference,
>in which his son's clothes were displayed.
>Associated Press
>Jun. 10, 2003 04:36 PM
>
>FORT COLLINS, Colo. - Authorities said Tuesday they believe a 3-year-old
>boy who vanished on a mountain hike 3 1/2 years ago was attacked by an
>animal, probably a mountain lion.
>
>"Everything that we're finding is consistent with that theory," Larimer
>County Sheriff Jim Alderden said at a news conference called several days
>after Jaryd Atadero's clothing was found in rugged terrain not far from
>where he disappeared.
>
>-------------------------
>The evidence suggests he was attacked by a mountain lion? How? Wouldn't
>you think the clothes would be strewn farther apart and not together? And
>they still don't explain why the shoes are still in such good shape.
>
>Chocolic
>
As I've said elsewhere, I don't see an attack by a mountain lion
either. I'm also puzzled by the condition of the clothing. Why would
it still be in such good shape after being, supposedly, outside for
two years?
anne in chicago
Hownow
<annein...@attbi.com> wrote:
Don't know about mountain lions but the first thing bears do is strip
off the clothes ... to them it's a layer of skin.
The clothes close together might support a theory that the child was
already dead when the mountain lion came upon the body so had little
difficulty in ripping off the clothes.
- hm
ponyduck
>On Wed, 11 Jun 2003 04:04:42 GMT, "Chocolic" <chatt...@hotmail.com>
>wrote:
>>The evidence suggests he was attacked by a mountain lion? How? Wouldn't
>>you think the clothes would be strewn farther apart and not together? And
>>they still don't explain why the shoes are still in such good shape.
>>
>>Chocolic
>>
>As I've said elsewhere, I don't see an attack by a mountain lion
>either. I'm also puzzled by the condition of the clothing. Why would
>it still be in such good shape after being, supposedly, outside for
>two years?
>
>anne in chicago
Make that almost 4 years. Jaryd disappeared in Oct. of 1999.
I left an old shirt outside behind the garage for about a year. Later
during a clean-up I found it, and I could barely lift it in one piece,
it was so rotted, full of roly-poly bugs and mold. Granted, the
weather here is more conducive to rot I'm sure--but after four years
exposed to the elements, those clothes & shoes should have shown more
soiling & deterioration IMO.
--pony
SageJelly
>either. I'm also puzzled by the condition of the clothing. Why would
>it still be in such good shape after being, supposedly, outside for
>two years?
I'm also surprised a mountain lion would strike with a group of people nearby.
A lone traveller is one thing, but usually animals will flee from noisy groups
of hikers. I guess if the animal was starving, it's a possibility.
Hownow
<sage...@aol.com> wrote:
The child was seen alone by a couple of fishermen.
We don't know how long after he went missing -- and likely wandered off
from where he was last seen -- that he was killed.
It might have been hours later.
A three-year-old's voice does not carry far outside and even a shorter
distance if it's in the woods, and they don't shout or even cry loudly
for long. They tend to quieten down from exhaustion and go to sleep.
- hm
Brigid Nelson
Perhaps the mountain lion caught the child by the
neck and shook it vigorously causing the neck to
break. Wouldn't take long to neutralize the prey
in that manner and then all the time in the world
to peel and eat it.
IMNSHO people are way to casual about hiking in
the woods. A path doesn't make it a safe place.
brigid
Phoenix
@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>,
irja...@teleport.com says...
Big cats don't usually shake their prey the
way dogs do. They grab the neck and suffocate
or bleed out their prey.
Maybe the kid removed his own clothes? To
swim? to wade in some water?
No idea...
bel
stargazer
"nicki" <nick...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:jqleevsk0m2q5eekk...@4ax.com...
> still picture they looked better and not as raveled.
>
> We saw a mountain lion cub walking down our street once and I see
> coyotes all of the time. They scare me and they usually stand still
> and watch me as I watch them in this open space where i walk.
>
> Of course..Mamas Boy is never allowed outside to enjoy this part of
> nature
>
>
> nicki
For me it was the bright blue color of the pants that amazed me, after four
years outside? And the new appearance of the shoe.
sg
Phoenix
how...@cogeco.ca>, how...@cogeco.ca says...
A mountain lion wouldn't eat carrion, they
only eat freshly killed meat, but a bear
would.
bel
>
> - hm
>
Hownow
Brigid Nelson <irja...@teleport.com> wrote:
My ex-father-in-law, a Colonel in the Indian Army serving the Raj up in
the Punjab, told me about tigers periodically preying on villagers,
usually getting a dozen or so before the detachment got around to
hunting it down.
He said the man-eating tigers he came across were all old males, too
slow to catch the usual prey so had turned to what they could catch,
children and old people going down well-trod paths.
I constantly make noise going through the bush. Anything in front of it
will usually scamper away ... except, maybe for an old cougar that
hasn't eaten in a few days and is lying on a rock overhead.
We had an unusual case here in Ontario a few years ago
A couple went missing when they'd gone camping in May on a small island
in the middle of a not-very-large lake.
A bear had got them both.
The bear should not have been on the island and the speculation was
that he had crossed on the spring ice and got stuck there and hunger
drove him to attack. He was barely skin and bones when they tracked him
down and killed him.
They say wolves do not attack humans. But I came to believe those
stories and graphics art out of Russia showing wolves attacking people
on horseback or riding on troikas.
It's that old-age thing again but the other way around.
I once worked in the bush in the days when pulpwood was hauled out by
horses. I had a job driving lunch into the outcamp on a wagon. It was
in late November and on the return trip the wagon wheels slipped into a
deep rut of mus and ice and the old nag did not have the power to pull
it out.
I unhitched for the three-or-four mile walk back as the sun went down.
And that's when the wolves came. A pack of about a dozen that trailed
me about 50 yards off to the side through the dusk and dark until
lights from the main camp came into view.
They were not after me.
They had the scent of the old horse in their nostrils, and they could
smell that this animal was not long for the world. The stench of the
horse was so strong that it covered up any whiff of me. What kept them
from moving in was the confusion of sound from rattling harness and
from me making sharp noises as I trailed the horse's rear end.
The aftermath: The wolves eventually did get that particular prey.
About a week later, the quasi-vet from the village said the horse
should be put down. So we took it out into the bush and shot it ...
leaving a great whacking amount of fresh-killed carrion for the wolves.
- hm
Phoenix
how...@cogeco.ca>, how...@cogeco.ca says...
Your father worked for the Raj! How cool is
that! Bet he has great stories.
>
> We had an unusual case here in Ontario a few years ago
> A couple went missing when they'd gone camping in May on a small island
> in the middle of a not-very-large lake.
> A bear had got them both.
> The bear should not have been on the island and the speculation was
> that he had crossed on the spring ice and got stuck there and hunger
> drove him to attack. He was barely skin and bones when they tracked him
> down and killed him.
Poor bear. Poor couple. I wonder why the
bear didn't just swim back? They're great
swimmers.
>
> They say wolves do not attack humans. But I came to believe those
> stories and graphics art out of Russia showing wolves attacking people
> on horseback or riding on troikas.
> It's that old-age thing again but the other way around.
> I once worked in the bush in the days when pulpwood was hauled out by
> horses. I had a job driving lunch into the outcamp on a wagon. It was
> in late November and on the return trip the wagon wheels slipped into a
> deep rut of mus and ice and the old nag did not have the power to pull
> it out.
> I unhitched for the three-or-four mile walk back as the sun went down.
> And that's when the wolves came. A pack of about a dozen that trailed
> me about 50 yards off to the side through the dusk and dark until
> lights from the main camp came into view.
>
> They were not after me.
> They had the scent of the old horse in their nostrils, and they could
> smell that this animal was not long for the world. The stench of the
> horse was so strong that it covered up any whiff of me. What kept them
> from moving in was the confusion of sound from rattling harness and
> from me making sharp noises as I trailed the horse's rear end.
>
> The aftermath: The wolves eventually did get that particular prey.
> About a week later, the quasi-vet from the village said the horse
> should be put down. So we took it out into the bush and shot it ...
> leaving a great whacking amount of fresh-killed carrion for the wolves.
Great stories How! I could listen to them all
night around a campfire.
bel
>
> - hm
>
Hownow
Phoenix <avian...@yahoo.com> wrote:
.
>
> Your father worked for the Raj! How cool is
> that! Bet he has great stories.
>
Ive written here before about a weird experience with the Colonel (my
ex-father-in-law) and I've stuck it up on a web page should you be
interested:
http://home.cogeco.ca/~hownow/Just%20Stuff%20/Colonel.html
>
> >
> > We had an unusual case here in Ontario a few years ago
> > A couple went missing when they'd gone camping in May on a small island
> > in the middle of a not-very-large lake.
> > A bear had got them both.
> > The bear should not have been on the island and the speculation was
> > that he had crossed on the spring ice and got stuck there and hunger
> > drove him to attack. He was barely skin and bones when they tracked him
> > down and killed him.
>
> Poor bear. Poor couple. I wonder why the
> bear didn't just swim back? They're great
> swimmers.
>
Probably came out of hibernation, walked the ice, foraged a bit but
instinctively too weak to try a swim back.>
>
- hm
Phoenix
how...@cogeco.ca>, how...@cogeco.ca says...
> In article <MPG.195138e28...@news-server.carolina.rr.com>,
> Phoenix <avian...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> .
> >
> > Your father worked for the Raj! How cool is
> > that! Bet he has great stories.
> >
> Ive written here before about a weird experience with the Colonel (my
> ex-father-in-law) and I've stuck it up on a web page should you be
> interested:
>
> http://home.cogeco.ca/~hownow/Just%20Stuff%20/Colonel.html
This is just perfect for my afternoon -
waiting on employers calls for new work
(grumble, grumble, can't they take one minute
to call and tell me yes or no?) I need some
stories to read so I won't just sit here and
stare at the phone.
>
> >
> > >
> > > We had an unusual case here in Ontario a few years ago
> > > A couple went missing when they'd gone camping in May on a small island
> > > in the middle of a not-very-large lake.
> > > A bear had got them both.
> > > The bear should not have been on the island and the speculation was
> > > that he had crossed on the spring ice and got stuck there and hunger
> > > drove him to attack. He was barely skin and bones when they tracked him
> > > down and killed him.
> >
> > Poor bear. Poor couple. I wonder why the
> > bear didn't just swim back? They're great
> > swimmers.
> >
> Probably came out of hibernation, walked the ice, foraged a bit but
> instinctively too weak to try a swim back.>
Sounds about right. I get so sad with these
kinds of things.
bel
> >
> - hm
>
Glek
news:110620030844433582%how...@cogeco.ca:
I would like to know why these fishermen didn't ask where his mom and dad
were, and if they did, what the boy said to convince them not to contact
authorities immediately.
Chocolic
"stargazer" <star...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:aVIFa.27290$Nl2...@fe10.atl2.webusenet.com...
I thought that at first too, but if the pants were made of a nylon or
polyester, they don't usually fade so much.
Chocolic
Teresa
> during a clean-up I found it, and I could barely lift it in one piece,
> it was so rotted, full of roly-poly bugs and mold. Granted, the
> weather here is more conducive to rot I'm sure--but after four years
> exposed to the elements, those clothes & shoes should have shown more
> soiling & deterioration IMO.
>
> --pony
>
I think a shirt made of 100% cotton would probably decay,
but one made of polyester or other man-made fabric might
stay new looking for quite a while. Same thing with the shoes.
Nowadays, lots of athletic shoes are made of vinyl, not leather.
Teresa
Teresa
Officials said that when Jaryd was reported missing, they used a helicopter
to search the area where the clothing was eventually found but did not
search that site on foot. The mountainside was so steep and rugged there
that investigators doubted Jaryd would scale it, said Major Bill Nelson.
Search dogs also failed to show interest in the terrain.
Here's the entire article:
Lion may have killed boy in '99
3-year-old's clothing found up steep slope
By Coleman Cornelius
Denver Post Northern Colorado Bureau
Wednesday, June 11, 2003 - FORT COLLINS - Investigators and the hikers who
found Jaryd Atadero's clothing said Tuesday that they think a mountain lion
attacked the 3-year-old and dragged him up a steep ridge near the hiking
trail where the boy was last seen.
"Everything we're finding is consistent with that theory," said Larimer
County Sheriff Jim Alderden. He later added, "We've kept all the
possibilities open."
The Littleton boy vanished in October 1999 while hiking with a group of
adults on the Big South Trail in Poudre Canyon west of Fort Collins. Two
Fort Collins hikers found his tennis shoes, sweat pants and jacket scattered
on the mountain last week - the first signs of the boy since he disappeared.
At a news conference Tuesday, the sheriff's office displayed the clothing,
which might hold microscopic clues about what happened. No one has found
blood, bones or any other trace of the child.
Officials said the clothing might help rule out theories that Jaryd was
abducted or drowned in Cache la Poudre River.
On Saturday, about 25 members of Larimer County Search and Rescue will
return to the area where Jaryd's clothes were discovered to search for the
child's remains and other clothing, said Don Davis, a team leader.
But it is possible that the child's physical remains, including blood traces
and skeletal remains, have completely decomposed in the harsh mountain
elements, said Dianne Fairman, chief deputy in the Larimer County Coroner's
Office.
"Realistically, we may not find anything else," she said.
Allyn Atadero, the boy's father, said he wants conclusive evidence before he
requests a death certificate or plans a memorial service for the
dark-haired, energetic child he called "Bubba."
But he knows that evidence might be elusive.
"There are so many questions and not enough answers. Until there's something
I can hold onto, I'll always wonder what happened," Atadero, a Jefferson
County schoolteacher, said later.
"Every parent in a situation like this would just love to be able to hold
their child again. I would give anything in the world to hold any part of
Jaryd, to be able to go to sleep at night and know that when I look up in
the heavens, I'm looking up there for a reason and not looking up for
answers," said the father, who fought to contain his emotions while speaking
to a throng of reporters.
"Everything I do, I think of my son, and I just want to release it."
Alderden said laboratory tests of the clothing could yield results by week's
end.
Jaryd's tennis shoes were unscathed, but his blue sweat pants were tattered.
And his beige fleece pullover, with a Southwestern design, was dirty and
covered with small tears or cuts, as if sliced in multiple spots with
scissors.
The clothing will undergo DNA tests. Examiners will look for traces of
blood. And experts - including wildlife biologists - will analyze two types
of hair found on the clothes, dark hair that could have been from Jaryd, and
light-colored hair whose source is unknown.
Experts with the Colorado Division of Wildlife will weigh in on whether a
mountain lion could have caused the cuts on Jaryd's jacket, Alderden said.
Hikers Robert Osborne, owner of well-known Avogadro's Number restaurant in
Fort Collins, and Gary Watts, a restaurant employee, found the clothes while
hiking last Wednesday.
The two had hiked the Big South Trail previously but lost the main trail as
they trekked, Osborne said. The experienced hikers still had their bearings,
though, and decided to bushwhack up a steep ridge - at times scrambling on
their hands and knees over boulders and through underbrush.
Then Watts came upon one of Jaryd's little blue-and-white shoes. "I can't
believe this. Come see," he called to Osborne.
The hikers, who have children and were deeply touched by Jaryd's story, knew
the shoe was likely his, they said.
"When we saw the first shoe, we knew right away. There was no doubt in my
mind," Watts said. "It was like opening up a door to light. I knew there
were answers."
The two found all the clothing but took just one shoe and the jacket to the
sheriff, carrying the items in a bread bag in Osborne's backpack. The hikers
led a group of investigators back last week.
The clothing was about 1 mile south of the Big South trailhead, 1,054 feet
from where Jaryd was last seen near the trail, and 436 vertical feet above
the trail, Alderden said. The garments were scattered over about 25 feet.
Investigators think a mountain lion might have snatched Jaryd when he got
separated from the 11 adults in his group and carried him up the steep and
rugged ridge. Atadero expressed frustration that Jaryd was lost by the
members of a Christian singles group, some of whom were Atadero's friends.
The adults had been staying at a mountain resort Atadero co-owned.
Lions, which are known to live in the area, typically kill prey and drag it
to an isolated spot, said Fred Quartarone of the Division of Wildlife.
Officials said that when Jaryd was reported missing, they used a helicopter
to search the area where the clothing was eventually found but did not
search that site on foot. The mountainside was so steep and rugged there
that investigators doubted Jaryd would scale it, said Major Bill Nelson.
Search dogs also failed to show interest in the terrain.
Humans rarely see Colorado's estimated 5,000 mountain lions, Quartarone
said. People report five to 10 incidents involving the predatory cats each
year; of those, perhaps one encounter a year is threatening to a person, he
said.
Still, a mature 150-pound cat could easily overcome a boy weighing 35
pounds, as Jaryd did, officials said.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
DETAILS
HOW TO AVOID AN ATTACK
Do not hike alone: The majority of mountain lion attacks on people have
involved individuals hiking or running alone.
Do not run: Running stimulates a mountain lion's instinct to chase. Instead,
stand and face the animal. Pick up small children so they don't panic and
run.
Avoid bringing pets: Dogs tend to attract lions.
Do not approach a lion: Most mountain lions will try to avoid a
confrontation. Give the lion a way to escape. Always leave lion cubs and all
baby wildlife alone.
Do not crouch: A person squatting or bending can look like a four-legged
prey animal.
Try to appear larger: Raise your arms. Open your jacket. Keep everyone in
your group together, appearing as one large shape to the lion. Wave your
arms slowly and speak firmly in a loud, low voice.
Fight back: Throw stones, branches or whatever you can reach without
crouching or turning your back. Since a mountain lion usually tries to bite
the head or neck, try to remain standing and face the animal. Don't play
dead.
Source: Colorado Department of Natural Resources' Division of Wildlife
ponyduck
I can perhaps understand the things not decaying, but not looking as
clean as they did, esp. the shoes. Like sg (I think) said, the
shoelaces were snowy white, and the shoes didn't look to have a speck
of dirt on them. I'm still waiting to hear the tests from the lab.
Surely if there was ever any blood on them, they'll be able to tell.
Because that's another thing I find almost impossible to believe--that
a mountain lion could maul a body & devour it, and not leave any blood
on the clothes.
--pony
Chocolic
"Teresa" <ctfedor@at&tbi.com> wrote in message
news:t8TFa.3978$YZ2.5336@rwcrnsc53...
> Interesting tidbit from today's Denver Post:
>
> Officials said that when Jaryd was reported missing, they used a
helicopter
> to search the area where the clothing was eventually found but did not
> search that site on foot. The mountainside was so steep and rugged there
> that investigators doubted Jaryd would scale it, said Major Bill Nelson.
> Search dogs also failed to show interest in the terrain.
>
This is unbelievable. It wasn't too steep and rugged for the hikers to
find the clothes a few years later. But professional searchers couldn't
do it or tracking dogs? And the article stated any blood traces or
skeletal remains would have completely decomposed in the "harsh mountain
elements", but yet the clothes survive looking as good as they did in the
picture? Something just doesn't seem to add up. Maybe the picture of the
clothes is doing them too much justice and they aren't really in as good a
shape as they seem to appear in the pics. That's gotta be it.
Chocolic
ponyduck
wrote:
>
>"Teresa" <ctfedor@at&tbi.com> wrote in message
>news:t8TFa.3978$YZ2.5336@rwcrnsc53...
>> Interesting tidbit from today's Denver Post:
>>
>> Officials said that when Jaryd was reported missing, they used a
>helicopter
>> to search the area where the clothing was eventually found but did not
>> search that site on foot. The mountainside was so steep and rugged there
>> that investigators doubted Jaryd would scale it, said Major Bill Nelson.
>> Search dogs also failed to show interest in the terrain.
>>
>
>This is unbelievable. It wasn't too steep and rugged for the hikers to
>find the clothes a few years later. But professional searchers couldn't
>do it or tracking dogs? And the article stated any blood traces or
>skeletal remains would have completely decomposed in the "harsh mountain
>elements", but yet the clothes survive looking as good as they did in the
>picture? Something just doesn't seem to add up. Maybe the picture of the
>clothes is doing them too much justice and they aren't really in as good a
>shape as they seem to appear in the pics. That's gotta be it.
>
>Chocolic
I thought the same thing about the "harsh mountain elements" being
able to totally disintegrate bones, but leaving cloth relatively
intact. As far as maybe the pictures giving a false
impression--possibly for the cloth items, but the shoes! The picture
I saw was very clear and detailed, and they looked pristine.
I'm also somewhat amazed that the searchers didn't climb that slope.
Don't they realize that if someone is missing, chances are that they
*are* in one of these out-of-the-way places? Stories like this also
disillusion me about dogs and their ability (but I tend to ascribe
near-Godlike powers to dogs I think they're so amazing, so maybe a
dose of reality is good for me).
--pony
Lori
Exactly, Glek. A toddler alone in the woods? I can't imagine that he
would not have looked frightened and most likely even been crying.
The fishermen probably hadn't caught their limit yet.
At first I was very skeptical about the mountain lion theory....now I
am starting to rethink that scenario. With the clothes found in such a
steep, remote area it does sound plausible that a lion would drag it's
prey up there for a leisurely meal. It has been reported that the group
that this little boy was with had split up and each smaller group
thought the kid was with the other. This much activity, along with the
fishermen, would be all the stimulus needed to drive the lion to higher,
less accessible ground.
Lori
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Lori
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Dogs are only as good as their handlers. The majority of dogs are
kept on a lead while searching to prevent them from getting too far
ahead of their human partner. And if the handlers discouraged the dogs
from heading up the steep slope thinking that the kid would not head in
that direction, that decision would prevent a successful search.
Most dogs, with the exception of bloodhounds, track by scent left on the
ground. Considering the number of people that had, presumably, been
frantically running around looking for the boy it was not the optimum
situation for the dogs. Also, if a mountain lion did snatch the
toddler, he probably held the little boy by the neck which would limit
the chance that the boy's scent was dragged on the ground. We might
also assume that the lion's scent was much stronger than that emitted by
the little victim thus confusing the dogs. It was also reported that
the boy was allowed to run ahead to hide and jump out to "scare" the
adults. He most likely went in circles, hiding behind trees or rocks and
then crossing his own path again and again...one of the most difficult
tracks for dogs to follow.
Don't give up your faith in man's best friend. I would bet if this gang
of hikers/baby sitters had brought along old Rover, he would have proved
to be a much more attentive companion and protector than any of the
humans involved.
Long...I know.
Hownow
wrote:
The father has said the adults in the hiking party and the fishermen
will have to live with themselves.
I doubt that the child appeared distressed when the fishermen noticed
him. They might have been on the opposite bank of the stream and
already seen the adults nearby as they had likely seen on other fishing
expeditions to the spot ... and let's face it, maybe did not want to
approach a child in the woods who did not look to be in trouble.
- hm
stargazer
"Glek" <gle...@email.com> wrote in message
news:Xns9397EBD71...@140.99.99.130...
IIRC, I believe at the time the fishermen were not close to the child. They
may have been on the far bank or something. I thought I remembered
something about them saying he was there one moment and had moved along, out
of sight by the next, something to that effect. It wasn't as if he'd just
come along right close to them where they could see that he was alone or
frightened. I know, like you, I questioned that when this first happened,
but there was some credible explanation for why the fishermen didn't
comprehend the situation or weren't able to grab the kid.
sg
Teresa
> >
> > Officials said that when Jaryd was reported missing, they used a
> helicopter
> > to search the area where the clothing was eventually found but did not
> > search that site on foot. The mountainside was so steep and rugged there
> > that investigators doubted Jaryd would scale it, said Major Bill Nelson.
> > Search dogs also failed to show interest in the terrain.
> >
>
> This is unbelievable. It wasn't too steep and rugged for the hikers to
> find the clothes a few years later. But professional searchers couldn't
> do it or tracking dogs? And the article stated any blood traces or
> skeletal remains would have completely decomposed in the "harsh mountain
> elements", but yet the clothes survive looking as good as they did in the
> picture? Something just doesn't seem to add up. Maybe the picture of
the
> clothes is doing them too much justice and they aren't really in as good a
> shape as they seem to appear in the pics. That's gotta be it.
>
> Chocolic
The slope was *so* steep and strewn with rocks that the
searchers three years ago must have assumed that there
was no way a three year old boy could possibly have wandered
up that slope. But, they did an aerial search of the terrain, just
in case. In hindsight, I'm sure they would agree that searchers
on the ground *should* have trudged up the slope, but if a
mountain lion drug him off, surely he would have taken his
prey further away as he heard the searchers approach, so maybe
they still wouldn't have found him in time to save his life.
Teresa
Chocolic
That makes sense.
Chocolic