Re: Serial Killer DOs and DON'Ts
goldenm...@yahoo.com
211
> With the BTK case apparently solved, its a good time to
> review the DOs and DON'Ts of serial killers. BTK has
> dominated alt.true-crime after he resumed his communication
> with the media, and has easily qualified for fame. So the
> question is, how do serial killers become famous? Here are
> a few DOs and DON'Ts.
>
> DO kill a lot of people. It seems real basic, but, really,
> meeting the minimum qualification of three just doesn't get
> it. Three might result in some articles in the local
> newspaper, but, especially without proper victims, might
> get you a short one time appearance on America's Most
> Wanted, certainly an accomplishment, but an easily forgotten
> one. Three might not even be enough for the police to tie
> them together as the work of one person. So go for a high
> body count.
>
> DO make sure the police attribute all or most of your
> killings to you. This is most difficult at the beginning.
> Remember that the police are motivated to supress the idea
> that there is a serial killer on the prowl. You may have
> to prod them into admitting the homicides are connected.
> Even with common crime characteristics staring them in
> the face, they'll try to deny it. At minimum, try to
> include common characteristics in each homicide - type of
> victim, methods, etc. Still, it may be necessary to contact
> the police or media to get the police to accept a connection
> among the crimes.
>
> DON'T make the police your primary contact. They will
> want to suppress information concerning contacts. Instead,
> make the media your primary contact. They're always
> interested in good stories, particularly those that put
> them one up on the competition. The competitive nature of
> the media can be used to your advantage.
>
> DO be unique. It is a bit difficult to do this through
> methods, as just about everthing - mutilation, necrophelia,
> cannibalism, implications of occult involvement - has
> already been tried. Perhaps you'll come up with something
> new. Figure it won't make a better TV story. TV tends not
> to mention more gruesome things. It will, however, guarantee
> your appearance on the Court TV web site, with plenty of
> page hits.
>
> DON'T keep the bodies hidden. Missing people don't prove
> there's a serial killer on the prowl. It takes bodies to
> prove that. Make sure the bodies are discovered as the
> crimes occur or you'll miss the opportunity to create
> years of suspense and interest.
>
> DO arrange for the bodies to be discovered while they're
> still relatively fresh. This allows preservation of
> evidence of your techniques and makes it easier for the
> killings to be attributed to you and the victims to be
> identified. Having skeletal remains discovered is a loser.
> Remember, fresh. However, its probably a bit risky to aim
> for having a body discovered while its still warm.
>
> DO be patient. String out the killings. Stop for a while.
> Let LE and the public think you're incarcerated, or even
> dead. Then strike again.
>
> DON'T move around. By killing in widely separated locations,
> it will be assumed there are two serial killers and you'll
> not get credit for everything you've done.
>
> DON'T select the homeless, illegal aliens, or prostitutes
> as your victims. The police, and society at large, don't
> care very much about these people. However, if you select
> people with spouses/boyfriends/girlfriends, the police
> will initially assume the spouse, boyfriend, or girlfriend
> is the perp - unless you kill them too.
>
> DON'T get caught. OK, to clarify, don't get caught right
> away. Length of time without being caught ranks about
> equally with body count in the quest for fame. Besides,
> spread it out, and you can imagine how many more posts
> there will be in alt.true-crime about you. Eventually, if
> you string it out, someone, or maybe several somenones,
> will want to write a book about you.
>
> DO have an exit strategy. At some point, if you're not
> caught, you'll have to stop. You'll get too old to pursue
> your hobby, or you'll be unable to do it due to illness.
> Perhaps only your death will end your career, or perhaps
> the police will be too close for you to continue. However,
> you do need an exit strategy that will give you credit
> for your accomplishments.
>
> The easiest is to turn yourself in, but that's not very
> artistic. Perhaps a better choice is to leave among your
> effects to be discovered after your natural death clear
> proof of your crimes. This has the disadvantage of not
> being able to enjoy your fame, but you can go to your
> grave assured you will be famous.
>
> If you have lots of money, and committed your crimes in
> a country with capital punishment, you could flee to a
> country that will not extradite to countries with capital
> punishment and publicize your exploits from there. This
> should surely produce plenty of grief in alt.true-crime,
> where they'll probably wish you'd be extradited, convicted,
> and sentenced to Devil's Island, to be hung daily by your
> ankles over the outhouse hole.
>
>
Some modified suggestions.
1. Avoid common characteristics. Try to stay in action. Remember what
Jeff said.
2. Don't worry about simplifying discovery. That's THEIR job. Let the
sleepers lie. New forensic techniques need to be publicized to keep your
successors and followers ahead of the game.
3. Feel free to move around. This adds spice to the sport. Just be
careful when selecting new hunting grounds.
4. Homeless, aliens and hookers are fair game. Look, they still haven't
decided if the Juarez jobs are legit or just the work of 200-some
amateurs. Most of us prefer to consider them the work of one inspired
artist, or a very few more inspired followers.
5. Longevity, or at least an appreciable body count is the key when
pursuing a new record. Don't get sucked into believing that a few
well-executed hits will ensure a highly-regarded record.
6. Exit strategy is as important for you as for Carly Fiorina. Where is
Scorpio today? Don't lose you chance at the big time.
Brian F. Nevercene
>Some modified suggestions.
>
>1. Avoid common characteristics. Try to stay in action. Remember what
>Jeff said.
What is the point of staying in action if you can't get the credit?
Avoiding common characteristics is fine, but you won't be credited unless
you let all the bodies be discovered in your back yard, which violates the
principle of letting it be an ongoing thing.
I suppose its a strategic choice.
>2. Don't worry about simplifying discovery. That's THEIR job. Let the
>sleepers lie. New forensic techniques need to be publicized to keep your
>successors and followers ahead of the game.
OK.
>3. Feel free to move around. This adds spice to the sport. Just be
>careful when selecting new hunting grounds.
Well, again the problem of getting credit enters into such a choice.
>4. Homeless, aliens and hookers are fair game. Look, they still haven't
>decided if the Juarez jobs are legit or just the work of 200-some
>amateurs. Most of us prefer to consider them the work of one inspired
>artist, or a very few more inspired followers.
I'm going to have to stand with my original statement here, based on BTK
being more famous than the perp(s) of the Juarez kilings.
>5. Longevity, or at least an appreciable body count is the key when
>pursuing a new record. Don't get sucked into believing that a few
>well-executed hits will ensure a highly-regarded record.
OK
>6. Exit strategy is as important for you as for Carly Fiorina. Where is
>Scorpio today? Don't lose you chance at the big time.
So, you think Carly is a crook?
Susan Cohen
Sniping seems a good way of going about it. Killing people from a
distance worked relatively well in the Maryland counties just a
few short years back. Might be better not to have an accomplice
tho'. You don't want a squealing, stoolpidgeon kid anyway. Use
a van rather than a hole in the boot tho'. You can stand in
a van and you could make a better gun turret or just open the rear
doors a tad.
For shear terror, nothing beats killing people at random out in
the open. It certainly kept a lot of cars off the streets. It
might be better to spread it out over a few months/seasons tho'.
Say, kill one person on the 1st of the month or something. Start
on April 1 and call yourself the April Fool Killer.
Talking to the media is good. They never get anything right. Remember
the pigs didn't ID Malvo right way. They thought he was white, had
a white van instead of a dark car etc. Remember to telegraph some
of your punches too. Say, if you live in the Bay area, that you'll
shoot someone on the I-80 and you'll have a clear run into work
that day. Use a hand gun even and make it open season on the
LA freeway.
Susan
Bananafish
"Susan Cohen" <flab...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1110685869....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>
> Sniping seems a good way of going about it. Killing people from a
> distance worked relatively well in the Maryland counties just a
> few short years back. Might be better not to have an accomplice
> tho'. You don't want a squealing, stoolpidgeon kid anyway. Use
> a van rather than a hole in the boot tho'. You can stand in
> a van and you could make a better gun turret or just open the rear
> doors a tad.
Make sure it's a white van Seems like whenever they are looking
for just one, there are dozens of them.
Susan Cohen
> "Susan Cohen" wrote
> >
> > Sniping seems a good way of going about it. Killing people from a
> > distance worked relatively well in the Maryland counties just a
> > few short years back. Might be better not to have an accomplice
> > tho'. You don't want a squealing, stoolpidgeon kid anyway. Use
> > a van rather than a hole in the boot tho'. You can stand in
> > a van and you could make a better gun turret or just open the rear
> > doors a tad.
>
> Make sure it's a white van Seems like whenever they are looking
> for just one, there are dozens of them.
Yes, its an old ploy. When you are looking for something in
particular, suddenly there are lots of the same thing around.
They use this in movies quite a lot. So pick a very common car
or van and the pigs will get tied up looking at all of them.
Susan
Laninna
Cletus Awreetus Awrightus wrote:
> And for Glub's sake, if you plan on trepanning and
> squicking your victim, at least have the common sense to
> flush out the newly-constructed orifice with sulfuric
> acid to destroy any semen that might ultimately be used
> for DNA extraction.
>Brian F. Nevercene wrote:
> >DO arrange for the bodies to be discovered while
> >they're still relatively fresh. Having skeletal remains
> >discovered is a loser. However, its probably a bit
> >risky to aim for having a body discovered while its
> >still warm.
DO write a manifesto. They're way cool.
Laninna
Brian F. Nevercene
flab...@gmail.com says...
>Sniping seems a good way of going about it. Killing people from a
>distance worked relatively well in the Maryland counties just a
>few short years back.
Isn't sniping too impersonal for serial killers? It was my impression
that the thrill including watching the light go out. However, strictly
from an efficiency standpoint in producing terror, I'd say you're onto
it.
Kris Baker
"Laninna" <lan...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:1110687238.8...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
Keep lots of souvenirs. Who knows? Maybe someday
you can use them for your Boy Scouts troop's arts-and-
crafts projects.
Keep thy wife in line, if thou must have one.
Kris
Susan Cohen
>
> flab...@gmail.com says...
>
>
> >Sniping seems a good way of going about it. Killing people from a
> >distance worked relatively well in the Maryland counties just a
> >few short years back.
>
>
> Isn't sniping too impersonal for serial killers? It was my impression
> that the thrill including watching the light go out. However,
strictly
> from an efficiency standpoint in producing terror, I'd say you're
onto
> it.
Yes, I think so. They had trouble profiling them. The trick is to
snipe at random and don't ignore minorities. Pop a negro here and
there as well as wetbacks, gooks and whites. Oh, and span the age
and sex demographics too. You end up with a generic serial killer.
Hmmm, better pick a generic rifle and bullets too. Stock pile them
a few months beforehand.
Susan
Pookie
> evidence of your techniques and makes it easier for the
> killings to be attributed to you and the victims to be
> Remember, fresh. However, its probably a bit risky to aim
> for having a body discovered while its still warm.
>
Don't send clues unless you're a BATMAN VILLAN
Offshore Eddie
"Brian F. Nevercene" <bfnev...@spamblock.yahoo.com.invalid> wrote in message
news:rewiocxlkmtHell...@tasteless.troll.org...
> With the BTK case apparently solved, its a good time to
> review the DOs and DON'Ts of serial killers. BTK has
> dominated alt.true-crime after he resumed his communication
> with the media, and has easily qualified for fame. So the
> question is, how do serial killers become famous? Here are
> a few DOs and DON'Ts.
>
> DO kill a lot of people. It seems real basic, but, really,
> meeting the minimum qualification of three just doesn't get
> it. Three might result in some articles in the local
> newspaper, but, especially without proper victims, might
> get you a short one time appearance on America's Most
> Wanted, certainly an accomplishment, but an easily forgotten
> one. Three might not even be enough for the police to tie
> them together as the work of one person. So go for a high
> body count.
I would argue with this. Quality over quantity. Andrew Cunanan had a very
small hit-list, all comfy middle-class or rich people. A celebrity kill ensured
national news coverage and quick-to-market paperbacks. In comparison, the
Green River Killer killed fifty prostitutes, and just few years later the task
force was disbanded. Police refused to even acknowledge the Vancouver pig-farm
killer until it was pretty much unavoidable. That is, of course, if you want
attention.
> DO make sure the police attribute all or most of your
> killings to you. This is most difficult at the beginning.
> Remember that the police are motivated to supress the idea
> that there is a serial killer on the prowl. You may have
> to prod them into admitting the homicides are connected.
> Even with common crime characteristics staring them in
> the face, they'll try to deny it. At minimum, try to
> include common characteristics in each homicide - type of
> victim, methods, etc. Still, it may be necessary to contact
> the police or media to get the police to accept a connection
> among the crimes.
Apparently, the skillful SKs include some proof of kill, as well as secret
codes, to ensure police verify their authenticity.
> DON'T make the police your primary contact. They will
> want to suppress information concerning contacts. Instead,
> make the media your primary contact. They're always
> interested in good stories, particularly those that put
> them one up on the competition. The competitive nature of
> the media can be used to your advantage.
Absolutely. The police department answers to the mayor who answers to the
chamber of commerce.
> DO be unique. It is a bit difficult to do this through
> methods, as just about everthing - mutilation, necrophelia,
> cannibalism, implications of occult involvement - has
> already been tried. Perhaps you'll come up with something
> new. Figure it won't make a better TV story. TV tends not
> to mention more gruesome things. It will, however, guarantee
> your appearance on the Court TV web site, with plenty of
> page hits.
A must.
> DON'T keep the bodies hidden. Missing people don't prove
> there's a serial killer on the prowl. It takes bodies to
> prove that. Make sure the bodies are discovered as the
> crimes occur or you'll miss the opportunity to create
> years of suspense and interest.
True.
> DO arrange for the bodies to be discovered while they're
> still relatively fresh. This allows preservation of
> evidence of your techniques and makes it easier for the
> killings to be attributed to you and the victims to be
> identified. Having skeletal remains discovered is a loser.
> Remember, fresh. However, its probably a bit risky to aim
> for having a body discovered while its still warm.
To insure this, the top SKs make a call to 911 directing the police to the body.
> DO be patient. String out the killings. Stop for a while.
> Let LE and the public think you're incarcerated, or even
> dead. Then strike again.
>
> DON'T move around. By killing in widely separated locations,
> it will be assumed there are two serial killers and you'll
> not get credit for everything you've done.
>
> DON'T select the homeless, illegal aliens, or prostitutes
> as your victims. The police, and society at large, don't
> care very much about these people. However, if you select
> people with spouses/boyfriends/girlfriends, the police
> will initially assume the spouse, boyfriend, or girlfriend
> is the perp - unless you kill them too.
Again, quality over quantity. Avoid the elderly and sick, as they tend to be
ignored also. Children are OK, but only if they have parents who can cry for
the cameras. You almost never hear of orphans being serial killed, and not
because they aren't.
I would add: Understand the media's needs. They need a story with victims they
can portray as members of their prime audience demographic, preferably also
beautiful and "innocent." They need a hook, too -- a "how could this happen
here" quality. And don't forget the terror and horror. That sells.
eartha...@yahoo.com
> distance worked relatively well in the Maryland counties just a
> few short years back. Might be better not to have an accomplice
> tho'. You don't want a squealing, stoolpidgeon kid anyway. Use
> a van rather than a hole in the boot tho'. You can stand in
> a van and you could make a better gun turret or just open the rear
> doors a tad.
Sniping scares and terrifies people but no one ends up remembering
their names, and I-80 Sniper isn't really much of a nickname.
eartha...@yahoo.com
211 wrote:
> Brian F. Nevercene wrote:
> >
> > as your victims. The police, and society at large, don't
> > care very much about these people. However, if you select
> > people with spouses/boyfriends/girlfriends, the police
> > will initially assume the spouse, boyfriend, or girlfriend
> > is the perp - unless you kill them too.
> >
haven't
> decided if the Juarez jobs are legit or just the work of 200-some
> amateurs. Most of us prefer to consider them the work of one inspired
> artist, or a very few more inspired followers.
Homeless, illegal aliens, or prostitutes as victims won't get you much
of a name or the front page. It's not only as Brian said, people don't
care very about about them, it's also that people feel like the crime
happened because of their life circumstances. So it doesn't scare
people. When victims seem like they could be you, it hits harder to
home, that's why the media also gives them lots of coverage.
clarence boddicker
"Brian F. Nevercene" <bfnev...@spamblock.yahoo.com.invalid> wrote in
message news:rewiocxlkmtHell...@tasteless.troll.org...
> a few DOs and DON'Ts.
>>
> include common characteristics in each homicide - type of
> victim, methods, etc. Still, it may be necessary to contact
> the police or media to get the police to accept a connection
> among the crimes.
How about reusing a practice from the military - death cards. "Let's
Charlie know who did this"
Get a pack of Tarot cards and leave random ones on the bodies. It will
confuse them as to what the messages mean.
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Hester Mofet
<eartha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Homeless, illegal aliens, or prostitutes as victims won't get you much
> of a name or the front page. It's not only as Brian said, people don't
> care very about about them, it's also that people feel like the crime
> happened because of their life circumstances. So it doesn't scare
> people. When victims seem like they could be you, it hits harder to
> home, that's why the media also gives them lots of coverage.
I disagree on this one. Granted it took them about 6 bodies to identify
a serial killer in the case of GRK, but he was one of the biggies and
he killed pros. Then again, maybe I know of him just because I'm an SK
geek. If you don't mind volume, the prostitute angle will work for you
eventually. And think! You get to kill a LOT more. Killing "normals"
may get you recognition sooner, but if you want to fly under the radar
for a while, go for the hookers. I do have an addition for the list,
though it doesn't have to do with BTK:
Make sure your car is in tip top shape and always has current plates
and tags. Drive like you know how. Nothing more embarrassing that to
get caught because your tags are expired and you didn't signal that
left turn. Take your time and follow the rules! Only losers get caught
with bodies in their cars. See: Larry Eyler, Joel Rifkin, Randy Kraft,
(almost) Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy (no body, but bad driving).
Hester Mofet
Joel M. Eichen
<HesterNO...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
>Make sure your car is in tip top shape and always has current plates
>and tags. Drive like you know how. Nothing more embarrassing that to
>get caught because your tags are expired and you didn't signal that
>left turn. Take your time and follow the rules! Only losers get caught
>with bodies in their cars. See: Larry Eyler, Joel Rifkin, Randy Kraft,
>(almost) Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy (no body, but bad driving).
>
>Hester Mofet
If its a traffic stop they do not take your DNA do they?>
Maybe they do!
Joel
proudmari
> 2005, 9:47am (PST+2) From:
> HesterNO...@speakeasy.net
> Make sure your car is in tip top shape
> and always has current plates and tags.
> Drive like you know how. Nothing more
> embarrassing that to get caught >because
> your tags are expired and you didn't
> signal that left turn. Take your time
> and follow the rules! Only losers get
> caught with bodies in their cars. See:
> Larry Eyler, Joel Rifkin, Randy Kraft,
> (almost) Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy (no
> body, but bad driving).
> Hester Mofet
Oh so true, so true! Change "a nail" to "tail light bulb" in the
following, and you could probably free at least 10% of all the felons
now in prison!
"For want of a nail the shoe was lost.For want of a shoe the horse was
lost.For want of a horse the rider was lost.For want of a rider the
battle was lost.For want of a battle the kingdom was lost.And all for
the want of a horseshoe nail"
proudmari
211
result would be a one by one pickoff of some large august body. NFL, UN
General Assy., GreenPeace Directorate, etc. Re UN G.A., none of them are
well-known anyway but SIZE MATTERS!
Vic Vega
"Joel M. Eichen" <joele...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:l7p831pbgv9pqbb7d...@4ax.com...
crime scene. You become someone they will look up a few days later after a
body is discovered. This only matters if you are pulled over while you ARE
leaving the crime scene. Timothy McVeigh is a prime example of this.
Joel M. Eichen
<stuck.in....@with.you> wrote:
>> If its a traffic stop they do not take your DNA do they?>
>>
>No, but it puts you on a list of suspicious people leaving the area of the
>crime scene. You become someone they will look up a few days later after a
>body is discovered. This only matters if you are pulled over while you ARE
>leaving the crime scene. Timothy McVeigh is a prime example of this.
>
Yep you are correct ......
Brian F. Nevercene
flab...@gmail.com says...
>
>
>Bananafish wrote:
>> Make sure it's a white van Seems like whenever they are looking
>> for just one, there are dozens of them.
>
>Yes, its an old ploy. When you are looking for something in
>particular, suddenly there are lots of the same thing around.
>They use this in movies quite a lot. So pick a very common car
>or van and the pigs will get tied up looking at all of them.
Selection of a sniper vehicle must address two goals
often in conflict: functionality and avoidance of
a distinctive appearance. Perhaps the most functional
vehicle would be a small motor home. With bathroom
facilities, a nice sound system and maybe even home
theater, it would have all the creature comforts
to make those long days of stalking easier.
Windows would, functionally, be gun slits, and the
height of the vehicle would give a commanding view
of the target area. For an even better view, an
additional AC unit could be installed on the roof,
gutted, and modified for use as a sniper post. But,
despite its obvious functionality, a motor home is
too distinctive, unless the target area is Arizona
snowbird vacation campgrounds. And what sniper is
going to consider these elderly slow moving targets
appropriate? (The to be announced scoring table for
serial killers gives less credit for victims actuarily
within a few years of death). So, for most uses, a
motor home, while functionally ideal, must be rejected
due to distinctiveness.
The ultimate non-distinctive vehicle isn't a specific
make and model, but rather a type. Any white four door
small car from Honda, Toyota, Nissan, or Hyundai, is
so non-distinctive as to be nearly invisible, and are
undiscernable from one another at any distance greater
than that from which the nameplate can be read. Ideal.
Except that they're too small for the typcial overweight
teenager to drive to school, let alone having the room
for moving and training weapons.
It is obvious a compromise is necessary. One possibility
is Ford or Chevy pickups, respectively, the number one
and number two selling vehicles in the US. The extended
cab models (not the four doors) are common enough to
avoid being too distinctive, while providing enough
room to work. As with the Asian tin cans, white is
the preferred color.
Another good choice would be a Ford or Chevy full sized
van. Not quite as common as pickups, they do provide
a lot more room, so they're a bit of a tilt toward
functionality versus lack of distinctiveness. As always,
select white.
Chrysler or Dodge minivans also merit a little thought.
They remain the biggest sellers in the segment, and the
new ones with stow and go seating provide the ultimate
in adaptability. But they're a little less "invisible"
in some environments, but perhaps ideal for sniping
in family areas, such as amusement parks or schools,
where they'd blend in perfectly.
Brian F. Nevercene
ed...@nospam.com says...
>
>
>LOL.
>
>"Brian F. Nevercene" <bfnev...@spamblock.yahoo.com.invalid> wrote in
message
>> DO arrange for the bodies to be discovered while they're
>> still relatively fresh. This allows preservation of
>> evidence of your techniques and makes it easier for the
>> killings to be attributed to you and the victims to be
>> identified. Having skeletal remains discovered is a loser.
>> Remember, fresh. However, its probably a bit risky to aim
>> for having a body discovered while its still warm.
>
>To insure this, the top SKs make a call to 911 directing the police to the
body.
Who other than BTK did this? I considered his doing it quite ballsy.
>> DON'T select the homeless, illegal aliens, or prostitutes
>> as your victims. The police, and society at large, don't
>> care very much about these people. However, if you select
>> people with spouses/boyfriends/girlfriends, the police
>> will initially assume the spouse, boyfriend, or girlfriend
>> is the perp - unless you kill them too.
>
>Again, quality over quantity. Avoid the elderly and sick, as they tend to be
>ignored also. Children are OK, but only if they have parents who can cry for
>the cameras. You almost never hear of orphans being serial killed, and not
>because they aren't.
Even with parents who can cry for the cameras, I think children are a poorer
choice than the elderly. Part of the respect for a SK is him selecting victims
who are not so easy to overpower, thereby placing himself at significant risk
during the crime.
>I would add: Understand the media's needs. They need a story with victims
>they can portray as members of their prime audience demographic, preferably
>also beautiful and "innocent."
So true.
jab...@backpacker.com
gacy, etc.
Susan Cohen
> In article <1110687374.0...@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> flab...@gmail.com says...
> >
> >
> >Bananafish wrote:
>
>
> >> Make sure it's a white van Seems like whenever they are looking
> >> for just one, there are dozens of them.
> >
> >Yes, its an old ploy. When you are looking for something in
> >particular, suddenly there are lots of the same thing around.
> >They use this in movies quite a lot. So pick a very common car
> >or van and the pigs will get tied up looking at all of them.
>
>
> Selection of a sniper vehicle must address two goals
> often in conflict: functionality and avoidance of
> a distinctive appearance. Perhaps the most functional
> vehicle would be a small motor home. With bathroom
> facilities, a nice sound system and maybe even home
> theater, it would have all the creature comforts
> to make those long days of stalking easier.
Yes, you have a point there. An RV would make a good sniper's nest.
> Windows would, functionally, be gun slits, and the
> height of the vehicle would give a commanding view
> of the target area. For an even better view, an
> additional AC unit could be installed on the roof,
> gutted, and modified for use as a sniper post. But,
> despite its obvious functionality, a motor home is
> too distinctive, unless the target area is Arizona
> snowbird vacation campgrounds. And what sniper is
> going to consider these elderly slow moving targets
> appropriate? (The to be announced scoring table for
> serial killers gives less credit for victims actuarily
> within a few years of death). So, for most uses, a
> motor home, while functionally ideal, must be rejected
> due to distinctiveness.
Yes, it needs to blend it. On, on that basis, while ideal,
an RV isn't practical.
> The ultimate non-distinctive vehicle isn't a specific
> make and model, but rather a type. Any white four door
> small car from Honda, Toyota, Nissan, or Hyundai, is
> so non-distinctive as to be nearly invisible, and are
> undiscernable from one another at any distance greater
> than that from which the nameplate can be read. Ideal.
> Except that they're too small for the typcial overweight
> teenager to drive to school, let alone having the room
> for moving and training weapons.
An SUV might be the go. The 4 wheel drive capability
would come in handy when offroading to elude police vehicles.
The sunroof could also double as a gun turret in a pinch.
> It is obvious a compromise is necessary. One possibility
> is Ford or Chevy pickups, respectively, the number one
> and number two selling vehicles in the US. The extended
> cab models (not the four doors) are common enough to
> avoid being too distinctive, while providing enough
> room to work. As with the Asian tin cans, white is
> the preferred color.
And a gun rack wouldn't look out of place either!
> Another good choice would be a Ford or Chevy full sized
> van. Not quite as common as pickups, they do provide
> a lot more room, so they're a bit of a tilt toward
> functionality versus lack of distinctiveness. As always,
> select white.
>
> Chrysler or Dodge minivans also merit a little thought.
> They remain the biggest sellers in the segment, and the
> new ones with stow and go seating provide the ultimate
> in adaptability. But they're a little less "invisible"
> in some environments, but perhaps ideal for sniping
> in family areas, such as amusement parks or schools,
> where they'd blend in perfectly.
Actually, a pickup could make a good escape vehicle. You
load the back tray with obstruction devices and rig the
rear tilt door to open automatically from a switch in the
cabin. If you are persued by police you drop your load.
That might work better on a hill (going up, of course).
Hmmm, I seem to remember a news report last year where
they made a security car for the gubmint that had gun
turrets and a compartment at the back that dropped little
pointy tyre spikes. They said the got the idea from a James Bond
movie.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> > Sniping seems a good way of going about it. Killing people from a
> > distance worked relatively well in the Maryland counties just a
> > few short years back. Might be better not to have an accomplice
> > tho'. You don't want a squealing, stoolpidgeon kid anyway. Use
> > a van rather than a hole in the boot tho'. You can stand in
> > a van and you could make a better gun turret or just open the rear
> > doors a tad.
>
> Sniping scares and terrifies people but no one ends up remembering
> their names, and I-80 Sniper isn't really much of a nickname.
You need to make up your nickname before you contact the media.
Call yourself something like *HeadExploda* and say you will
target anyone on any of the bay area freeways if your demands
are not met. The demands bit is just another ploy to fool them.
You can alo shoot at the BART from any number of vantage points.
There are lots of hills in the back areas of the bay.
Any time you want a dream run to work on any of the freeways,
you just ring up and give them your secret password. Once the
word gets out on the traffic reports, you're home and hosed (altho'
you're supposed to be going to work. You could use it on the
way home too, I suppose).
The other problem is copycats trying to steal your thunder.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> Only good if you have three names i.e. lee harvey oswald, john wayne
> gacy, etc.
James Tiberius Kirk?
Susan
HopalongHowie
Anyone have any suggestions for the budding spree killer?
Regards
Howie
Clave
news:1110775600.4...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> OK I've read a ton of great tips for the aspiring SK.
>
> Anyone have any suggestions for the budding spree killer?
Yes.
Thanks for asking.
Jim
Brian F. Nevercene
flab...@gmail.com says...
>
>
>Brian F. Nevercene wrote:
>An SUV might be the go. The 4 wheel drive capability
>would come in handy when offroading to elude police vehicles.
>The sunroof could also double as a gun turret in a pinch.
I figure if there's a police chase, the perp is toast - unless he can
shoot down the tracking helicopter.
>> It is obvious a compromise is necessary. One possibility
>> is Ford or Chevy pickups, respectively, the number one
>> and number two selling vehicles in the US. The extended
>> cab models (not the four doors) are common enough to
>> avoid being too distinctive, while providing enough
>> room to work. As with the Asian tin cans, white is
>> the preferred color.
>
>And a gun rack wouldn't look out of place either!
Hey! Good point. No need to hide the weapons. Just have an orange cap on
the dash to look like a hunter.
>Hmmm, I seem to remember a news report last year where
>they made a security car for the gubmint that had gun
>turrets and a compartment at the back that dropped little
>pointy tyre spikes. They said the got the idea from a James Bond
>movie.
I just knew those government types weren't practical.
Brian F. Nevercene
flab...@gmail.com says...
Kirk wasn't a Serial Killer. He was a Serial Seducer.
Moderate Mammal
What the fuck is wrong with you???
--
Keith
-------------------------------------
Fed up with illegal immigration?
_____
http://www.saveourstate.org
http://www.newswithviews.com/Wooldridge/frostyA.htm
http://www.americanpatrol.com/LINKS/LINKS.html
http://www.vdare.com/links.htm
http://www.stoptheinvasion.com/links/
_____
"Cosmic upheaval is not so moving as a little child pondering the death
of a sparrow in the corner of a barn." -Anouk Aimee, French Actor
_____
"Death is better, a milder fate than tyranny", Aeschylus (525BC-456BC),
Agamemnon
_____
"I wear no Burka." - Mother Nature
----------
To send mail: remove hutch
Steve Thompson
On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 19:42:18 GMT, "Brian F. Nevercene"
[sniper vehicle selection]
>Chrysler or Dodge minivans also merit a little thought.
>They remain the biggest sellers in the segment, and the
>new ones with stow and go seating provide the ultimate
>in adaptability. But they're a little less "invisible"
>in some environments, but perhaps ideal for sniping
>in family areas, such as amusement parks or schools,
>>where they'd blend in perfectly.
>
> What the fuck is wrong with you???
Speaking of which, I recall that you recently posted a link
to an article that described a drug invented in Russia that
is designed to enhance the effects of alcohol, allowing one,
in effect, to become drunk on fewer drinks.
What the article didn't say was who the Russians stole
the drug from. As we all know, those damn Russkies are
pathological liars and kleptomaniacs; known for ripping
off technology from Western cultures.
Any you chimps have a guess as to whether it was a US or
British drug firm that lost their product to russkie
industrial espionage?
Regards,
Steve
Bo Raxo
>If you have lots of money, and committed your crimes in
>a country with capital punishment, you could flee to a
>country that will not extradite to countries with capital
>punishment and publicize your exploits from there.
But if prosecutors agree to take the death penalty off the table, or
come up with another charge to extradite you on, you're toast.
I also have to recommend against using a gun. Too easy to make a
ballistics match to the weapon. You want a plan-b credible defense if
you're caught.
As for the getaway vehicle, the obvious choice is a motorcycle. Much
better acceleration and cornering than virtually any car (certainly
better than anything law enforcement will have). Easy to pick a model
that is pretty common. Easy to pop through places the police can't
pursue in a car. Easy to pick a model with better performance than
police bikes. Probably best to use something lightweight, a 600cc
sportbike or, if you've got the skills, an R1. Steal the bike, of
course, and switch the plates frequently.
As for mode of death, I'm unimpressed with the killers who off their
victims in secret and dump the bodies in the dead of night. Kill your
victims in public, in front of witnesses. A gun is good for that, but
there are plenty of other ways. I rather like the idea of
booby-trapping common objects, whether with explosives, to create an
electrocution, or something really creative like drenching your victim
in acid. You neededn't be anywhere nearby, but if you really want to
you could observe from afar.
And an ironic choice of victim is always a nice touch. Like, say, if
you killed some guy that posted a list of serial killer Do's and Don'ts
to the internet.
Bo Raxo
Bo Raxo
Never seen wrote:
>I figure if there's a police chase, the perp is toast - unless he can
>shoot down the tracking helicopter.
Not at all. Large parking garages are your best friend, assuming you
stole or bought for cash the getaway vehicle.
Airports have their uses, too, since flight traffic may prevent the
helicopter from following you (can't recall what movie I got that
from).
Or just commit your crimes at night.
Bo Raxo
Susan Cohen
> In article <1110766761....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
> flab...@gmail.com says...
> >
> >
> >Brian F. Nevercene wrote:
>
>
> >An SUV might be the go. The 4 wheel drive capability
> >would come in handy when offroading to elude police vehicles.
> >The sunroof could also double as a gun turret in a pinch.
>
>
> I figure if there's a police chase, the perp is toast - unless he can
> shoot down the tracking helicopter.
Yep, going point. He'd probably need a SAM or two for those.
Once again the sunroof gets an added bonus point.
> >> It is obvious a compromise is necessary. One possibility
> >> is Ford or Chevy pickups, respectively, the number one
> >> and number two selling vehicles in the US. The extended
> >> cab models (not the four doors) are common enough to
> >> avoid being too distinctive, while providing enough
> >> room to work. As with the Asian tin cans, white is
> >> the preferred color.
> >
> >And a gun rack wouldn't look out of place either!
>
>
> Hey! Good point. No need to hide the weapons. Just have an orange cap
on
> the dash to look like a hunter.
And sling a deer over your hood. Of course, that might look out of
place in some areas. What else could you use - bear, gator, bobcat?
That might cover most of the U.S.
> >Hmmm, I seem to remember a news report last year where
> >they made a security car for the gubmint that had gun
> >turrets and a compartment at the back that dropped little
> >pointy tyre spikes. They said the got the idea from a James Bond
> >movie.
>
>
> I just knew those government types weren't practical.
They're just slow.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> Never seen wrote:
> >I figure if there's a police chase, the perp is toast - unless he
can
> >shoot down the tracking helicopter.
>
> Not at all. Large parking garages are your best friend, assuming you
> stole or bought for cash the getaway vehicle.
Hey, that's a good point. I was going to suggest have more than one
vehicle. So, while they are looking for a white van, you'd use a
black one or something. So, if you park them in a large parking
garage, you can switch vehicles - and if they are chasing you, the
helicopters won't notice.
> Airports have their uses, too, since flight traffic may prevent the
> helicopter from following you (can't recall what movie I got that
> from).
Yes, that's true. And there are 3 or 4 airports in the Bay area -
SF International, San Jose, Oakland and one further out. And there
are interstates near them. They only problem is that its also
mostly quite industrial areas around them. So you'd need to be fast.
> Or just commit your crimes at night.
You're forgetting night vision. Choppers also have lights. But it
is better than at day time. Hmmm, bad weather like rain might be
even better. Things like heavy rain and fog really reduce visiblity.
Of course, that would affect you too. Only problem is California
isn't known for rain. It does get foggy around SF. The good thing
is that it sits in some valleys and not in others. So the variable
conditions might help you. Otherwise, you'd have to look elsewhere.
Susan
Susan Cohen
So, are you trying to tell us you only *hate* wetbacks and
you don't really want to get rid of them?
Susan
Susan Cohen
Yeah, that Keith is always rabbiting on about something.
Usually, he doesn't have much of a clue.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> > OK I've read a ton of great tips for the aspiring SK.
> > Anyone have any suggestions for the budding spree killer?
>
>
Yes, good point. Just poating about it ain't going to make it happen.
Susan
Susan Cohen
That wasn't my point. He was a serial something. So was it because he
has a middle name?
Hey, I just noticed you have a middle name.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> > For a real challenge you should try to establish multiple patterns.
See if
> > you can get the FBI thinking that you are 3 or 4 different serial
killers.
> > At some point you can then present the world with evidience that
the white
> > supremicist kook, the latino hooker torturer, the satanic child
killer, and
> > the homo trucker strangler were all just a practical joke you
pulled.
>
>
>
> but keep them straight in your mind! you don't want to accidentally
> strangle a latino hooker and carve a pentagram into her forehead.
>
> ("dear me, i seem to have accidentally strangled a latino hooker.")
What happens if you run into a satanic homo latino hooker/trucker?
Run?
Susan
Susan Cohen
> > Get a pack of Tarot cards and leave random ones on the bodies. It
will
> > confuse them as to what the messages mean.
>
>
> you always end up standing over a stabbing victim and the only card
you
> have left is The Hanged Man. and you remember you used the Ten of
Swords
> last month. dang.
Yeah, that could be a problem. Better to use playing cards. Does anyone
have any of the Iraqi most wanted ones?
Susan
Susan Cohen
> >If you have lots of money, and committed your crimes in
> >a country with capital punishment, you could flee to a
> >country that will not extradite to countries with capital
> >punishment and publicize your exploits from there.
>
> But if prosecutors agree to take the death penalty off the table, or
> come up with another charge to extradite you on, you're toast.
>
> I also have to recommend against using a gun. Too easy to make a
> ballistics match to the weapon. You want a plan-b credible defense
if
> you're caught.
In that case, rather than being a sniper, you'd want to kill them
in their own home and use their own things to do it. Kitchen utensils
or phone/power cords. Now, we've all seen the movies where this
backfires
so you'd have to wear a kevlar vest, at least. Pick single people in
remote or isolated houses. This could be good because nobody can see
you and they might not find the victim for days. You can also take
trophies. Getting in is the problem. A breakin might make it look
like a robbery gone wrong. But I don't think its ideal. How about
a phone/cable guy? Win their confidence and the police will think
the victim knew their assialant and instantly suspect friends,
relatives and neigbors.
Of course, you'd need to be physically strong. Is cholorform
detectable?
You could use that to pass out the victim first.
> As for the getaway vehicle, the obvious choice is a motorcycle. Much
> better acceleration and cornering than virtually any car (certainly
> better than anything law enforcement will have). Easy to pick a
model
> that is pretty common. Easy to pop through places the police can't
> pursue in a car. Easy to pick a model with better performance than
> police bikes. Probably best to use something lightweight, a 600cc
> sportbike or, if you've got the skills, an R1. Steal the bike, of
> course, and switch the plates frequently.
I think you'd need 750 cc at least. It is a good choice but you
can't carry much on a bike. If you have panniers, then yes, but
they make the bike more distinct. Tie it in with the cars and
use a parking garage to switch vehicles.
> As for mode of death, I'm unimpressed with the killers who off their
> victims in secret and dump the bodies in the dead of night. Kill
your
> victims in public, in front of witnesses. A gun is good for that,
but
> there are plenty of other ways. I rather like the idea of
> booby-trapping common objects, whether with explosives, to create an
> electrocution, or something really creative like drenching your
victim
> in acid. You neededn't be anywhere nearby, but if you really want to
> you could observe from afar.
If you want to kill in public, what wrong with slitting their throat?
Sit in a cinema and do it to the guy in front of you.
> And an ironic choice of victim is always a nice touch. Like, say, if
> you killed some guy that posted a list of serial killer Do's and
Don'ts
> to the internet.
Yeah, wouldn't that be cool! But do you have time to eat their liver
afterwards?
Susan
Vanilla Gorilla (Monkey Boy)
wrote in alt.fan.art-bell in message
<1110855044.4...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>:
You've seen "Fargo", I assume?
--
V.G.
"i would blame them it they went on a holy jhiad and killed off all the infidels, would you?" - AssLexa's "200+" alien-implanted IQ jumps the rails and crashes into a grade school, killing all inside.
Change pobox dot alaska to gci.
Sarcasm is my sword, Apathy is my shield.
My Left Foot
<eartha...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1110706552.9...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> Homeless, illegal aliens, or prostitutes as victims won't get you much
> of a name or the front page. It's not only as Brian said, people don't
> care very about about them, it's also that people feel like the crime
> happened because of their life circumstances. So it doesn't scare
> people. When victims seem like they could be you, it hits harder to
> home, that's why the media also gives them lots of coverage.
Jack the Ripper?
Bo Raxo
>> I figure if there's a police chase, the perp is toast - unless he
can
>> shoot down the tracking helicopter.
>Yep, going point. He'd probably need a SAM or two for those.
>Once again the sunroof gets an added bonus point
Nah, you can take down most helicopters with ordinary gunfire. Even
the hardened military models, at least according to the book Blackhawk
Down, can be taken out with an RPG to the tail rotor.
Besides, you don't have to take out the chopper, just the pilot.
Bo Raxo
detectable?
It's pretty hard to knock someone uncncious with chloroform without
killing them. It's really just a movie convention.
>I think you'd need 750 cc at least.
Today's 600 sportbikes are incredibly fast. With the rider aboard you
have a power to weight ratio of about six pounds per horsepower. Put
me on a 600RR or an R6 and no police vehicle could catch me.
> It is a good choice but you can't carry much on a bike. If you have
panniers, then yes, > but they make the bike more distinct.
And panniers (or saddlebags as most Americans call 'em) increase the
width of the bike. They're also easy to catch on things - I've caught
one on a car mirror and once on a metal sign (lucky they were soft
bags!). If you have to tote and evade, I'd say a tailbag or a tank
bag. Some tank bags have quite a large capacity. Another option is a
backpack.
mariposas morgan mair fheal greykitten tomys des anges
"Bo Raxo" <Cheneys...@deathsdoor.com> wrote:
> >> I figure if there's a police chase, the perp is toast - unless he
> can
> >> shoot down the tracking helicopter.
>
> >Yep, going point. He'd probably need a SAM or two for those.
> >Once again the sunroof gets an added bonus point
>
> Nah, you can take down most helicopters with ordinary gunfire. Even
> the hardened military models, at least according to the book Blackhawk
> Down, can be taken out with an RPG to the tail rotor.
an rpg is not ordinary gunfire
at least not in 43 of the 50 united states
> Besides, you don't have to take out the chopper, just the pilot.
arf meow arf - dogs and cats living together
the erisian constancy - though chaos is transformed
but never lost to sea - grey ordered ranks are swarmed
Brian F. Nevercene
flab...@gmail.com says...
No... that's a middle initial.
Brian F. Nevercene
Cheneys...@deathsdoor.com says...
>
>
>
>>If you have lots of money, and committed your crimes in
>>a country with capital punishment, you could flee to a
>>country that will not extradite to countries with capital
>>punishment and publicize your exploits from there.
>
>But if prosecutors agree to take the death penalty off the table, or
>come up with another charge to extradite you on, you're toast.
Yeah, but its a fair bet prosecutors wouldn't sell out to what they view
as nasty liberal countries who don't believe in the death penalty.
Bush's "we don't negotiate with terrorists" probably applies as in "we
don't negotiate with liberals".
>As for mode of death, I'm unimpressed with the killers who off their
>victims in secret and dump the bodies in the dead of night. Kill your
>victims in public, in front of witnesses.
Too unlikely to have a long career that way. Need a long career to be on
America's Most Wanted or Court TV, or to have people write books.
>And an ironic choice of victim is always a nice touch. Like, say, if
>you killed some guy that posted a list of serial killer Do's and Don'ts
>to the internet.
Not really. Ironic would be to inadvertantly kill a serial killer.
Brian F. Nevercene
flab...@gmail.com says...
>Yeah, wouldn't that be cool! But do you have time to eat their liver
>afterwards?
Does anyone have a recipe to make a truly abused liver edible?
Brian F. Nevercene
BunnE...@verizon.hutch.net says...
>What the fuck is wrong with you???
Nothing that I'm aware of. Why do you ask?
Susan Cohen
Oh, yes, an excellent point.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> In article <1110854905....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
> flab...@gmail.com says...
> >
> >
> >Brian F. Nevercene wrote:
> >> In article
<1110767159.2...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> >> flab...@gmail.com says...
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >jab...@backpacker.com wrote:
> >> >> Only good if you have three names i.e. lee harvey oswald, john
> >wayne
> >> >> gacy, etc.
> >> >
> >> >James Tiberius Kirk?
> >> >
> >> >Susan
> >>
> >>
> >> Kirk wasn't a Serial Killer. He was a Serial Seducer.
> >
> >That wasn't my point. He was a serial something. So was it because
he
> >has a middle name?
> >
> >Hey, I just noticed you have a middle name.
> >
> >Susan
>
>
> No... that's a middle initial.
F for Fake? Or is that too Awesome Wellsian?
Susan
Susan Cohen
Or the Yorkshire Ripper -
http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/predators/sutcliffe/mask_1.html?sect=1
He went on for 5 years before being caught.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> >Of course, you'd need to be physically strong. Is cholorform
> detectable?
>
> It's pretty hard to knock someone uncncious with chloroform without
> killing them. It's really just a movie convention.
I was thinking more of knocking them out so that they wouldn't
struggle giving you enought time to restrain them. Then you keep
them alive long enough to let whatever drug you used clear their
system. The police whould then ask how did they get the drop on
them?
> >I think you'd need 750 cc at least.
>
> Today's 600 sportbikes are incredibly fast. With the rider aboard
you
> have a power to weight ratio of about six pounds per horsepower. Put
> me on a 600RR or an R6 and no police vehicle could catch me.
OK. I like the FireBlades. Are they any good or do they just look
nice? I know some prefer European bikes like BMW or Moto Guzzi
to the Japanese ones.
> > It is a good choice but you can't carry much on a bike. If you have
> panniers, then yes, > but they make the bike more distinct.
>
> And panniers (or saddlebags as most Americans call 'em) increase the
> width of the bike. They're also easy to catch on things - I've
caught
> one on a car mirror and once on a metal sign (lucky they were soft
> bags!). If you have to tote and evade, I'd say a tailbag or a tank
> bag. Some tank bags have quite a large capacity. Another option is a
> backpack.
Yes, all good points. A tailbag also gives you some protection
if you are being shot at from the rear. Of course, you'd need to
protect your tyres too. I know I can get kevlar liners for my
mountain bike, what about for motor bikes?
Susan
Susan Cohen
With or without fava beans?
Susan
Joel M. Eichen
wrote:
Good one!
Actually with ........
Cartlon Shew
Hey, they can be pretty fast once they park the RV and start screaming
around the city in their golf carts or Harley's.
Brian F. Nevercene
Cheneys...@deathsdoor.com says...
>
>
>
>>Yeah, but its a fair bet prosecutors wouldn't sell out to what they
>view
>>as nasty liberal countries who don't believe in the death penalty.
>>Bush's "we don't negotiate with terrorists" probably applies as in "we
>
>>don't negotiate with liberals".
>
>up Ira Einhorn, or Charles Ng.
>
I was referring to an acquired attitude, not legal control.
Susan Cohen
> On 14 Mar 2005 18:35:03 -0800, "Susan Cohen" wrote:
>
> >Brian F. Nevercene wrote:
> >
> >>>> is Ford or Chevy pickups, respectively, the number one
> >>>> and number two selling vehicles in the US. The extended
> >>>> cab models (not the four doors) are common enough to
> >>>> avoid being too distinctive, while providing enough
> >>>> room to work. As with the Asian tin cans, white is
> >>>> the preferred color.
> >>>
> >>
> >> Hey! Good point. No need to hide the weapons. Just
> >> have an orange cap on the dash to look like a hunter.
> >
> >And sling a deer over your hood. Of course, that might look out of
> >place in some areas. What else could you use - bear, gator, bobcat?
> >That might cover most of the U.S.
> >
>
> Hell, be a real hero and tie your latest victim to the bumper. Make
> sure you field dress them first, and don't forget to save the heart
> and liver. Then drive to the local tavern, have a few beers, and
> show off your trophy before taking it home to skin.
And how do you propose having the pigs not notice?
Hmmm ... perhaps a hearse might be a good idea. You could lie down
in the back and shoot out the open rear window and you could
carry a body around in a coffin. Much less suspicious. An
ambulence might work too. You could use the siren to clear
traffic.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> >OK. I like the FireBlades. Are they any good or do they just look
> >nice? I know some prefer European bikes like BMW or Moto Guzzi
> >to the Japanese ones.
>
> IIRC). Haven't ridden one, but saw one go up against an R1 and get
> smoked. Iwas talking more about something like a 600RR or an R6, or
a
> GSXR600. In city street racing, where speeds are generally under 60
or
> so, pretty much any sportbike has more power than you can apply to
the
> rear wheel, so it's all about traction - getting that rear tire to
hook
> up. How fast you make it from A to B then depends on cornering
mostly
> - how deep in to the corner can you brake before apexing (which is a
> function of the bike+rider weight more than anything), and how
quickly
> you can turn (a function of wheelbase length and how quickly the bike
> turns in). In a tight cornering situation, like say the Streets of
> Willow track or most urban settings, the lightest bike with the
> shortest wheelbase will reign supreme.
OK.
> BMWs and Moto Guzzis? Don't make me laugh. Comfortable, beautiful,
> and in the case of the Beemers, reliable. But quick? Bwaaa haaa
haaa
> haaaa! A ten year old Japanese 600 will spank any of them.
Yes, I suppose they would. Not the marques they used to be.
> >Yes, all good points. A tailbag also gives you some protection
> >if you are being shot at from the rear.
>
> Well, if you load it up with bulletproof armor. I would think that
the
> impact of a bullet, even if stopped by armor, would be enough to
break
> your traction and put you down on the pavement.
I would think it would give you some extra push.
> >Of course, you'd need to
> >protect your tyres too. I know I can get kevlar liners for my
> >mountain bike, what about for motor bikes?
>
> Never heard of such a thing. I suspect the kevlar you are talking
> about isn't the same grade/formualtion as that used for bulletproof
> vests. The kevlar used for crash armor in bike leathers won't stop
> even a knife, much less a bullet.
Yes, it probably won't. I thought about getting the kevlar lining
after my mountain bike's tyres were punctured by pine needles
of all things. I suppose the tyres on a moving bike would be
hard to hit anyway.
> And AFAIK there are no run-flat tires for bikes (as there are with
> cars). Having had a bike tire go flat on the freeway (middle of the
> Golden Gate Bridge, where there is no place to stop), I can say you
> won't outrun a milk truck once that happens.
Hmmm ... do they make solid rubber ones?
Susan
Bo Raxo
"Susan Cohen" <flab...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1111029451.5...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Bo Raxo wrote:
> > And AFAIK there are no run-flat tires for bikes (as there are with
> > cars).
>
>
Not that I know of. Nobody would want to use them, since it would be a lot
of unsprung weight. Unsprung weight (weight that isn't carried by the
suspension) is the absolute worst thing for handling and acceleration, every
pound as detrimental to handling characteristics as several pounds of sprung
weight.
Hey, how about this for a serial killer m.o.: disturbed soldier comes home
with a secret stash of RPGs. Takes to the freeway on a sportbike, blowing
away the occasional SUV. Picks a color to do the first few, and mass
numbers of people start selling those. Then switches to a new color, and
does a few more.
Random enough to terrify people, just non-random enough to really get a
smaller but numerically large group of people really scared. And since
you're already on a freeway on a motorcycle, pretty easy to get away.
Bo Raxo
Vic Vega
> .
> The sunroof could also double as a gun turret in a pinch.
>
Looks like someone just tried this.
Police Believe Bar Fight Led to Shooting
By LISA FALKENBERG
Associated Press Writer
March 16, 2005, 6:29 AM EST
DALLAS -- A scuffle on the dance floor of a crowded college bar apparently
spilled out onto a freeway intersection a few hours later, with a motorist
opening fire on a car and killing three people.
University Park police Capt. Robert Brown said the shooter waited for the
other party to leave the bar, and then followed in a Jaguar and shot at the
other vehicle with an assault weapon Monday night.
"Apparently, there was a dispute on the dance floor in which somebody got
hit or punched," said Mike Turiace, who was tending bar at Jack's Pub &
Volley Ball club. "The guy just got angry and decided to pursue it."
Investigators have impounded a Jaguar they believe was involved and
authorities continued their search for the gunman, who squeezed through the
sunroof to fire his weapon. Two others may have been riding in the
light-colored vehicle with the gunman.
Killed were Eddie Pech, 36, and cousins Bernardo Andrade, 21, and Favio
Andrade, 19. Police said Osvaldo Juarez, a juvenile whose age was not
released, remained in "very critical" condition.
A police officer waiting at a traffic light at the intersection witnessed
the shootings and stopped to help when the gunned-down car crashed, Dallas
police Sgt. Gil Cerda said. Police policy prohibited the officer from
pursuing the fleeing Jaguar because he already had a prisoner from an
unrelated case in his back seat.
Turiace and others said Jack's Pub is normally a safe place that hosts
festivals and volleyball matches and attracts a college crowd from Southern
Methodist University campus, near where the shooting occurred.
But the clientele shifts a bit on Monday nights, when the business is open
to patrons 18 and older and advertises $2 drinks, $4 pitchers of beer, a
packed dance floor thumping with two DJs and a time so good "You won't
believe it's not Saturday," according to the pub's Web site.
In a statement, the owners of Jack's Pub said its security personnel tossed
some patrons at about 12:30 a.m. and is checking "to determine if this
behavior at Jack's Pub is linked to the tragedy."
University Park, a city of only 4.5 square miles, saw its last homicide in
2002, Brown said.
"I don't think it's going to be a hard case," Brown said. "Obviously, when
you have people who are at a location such as a pub, hopefully, we can find
witnesses who were at the location who can help us solve this crime."
Susan Cohen
> "Susan Cohen" wrote
Amazing! And the vehicle was light-colored. You'd think people
were reading this thread.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> "Susan Cohen" wrote
> > Bo Raxo wrote:
> > > And AFAIK there are no run-flat tires for bikes (as there are
with
> > > cars).
> >
> > Hmmm ... do they make solid rubber ones?
> >
>
> Not that I know of. Nobody would want to use them, since it would be
a lot
> of unsprung weight. Unsprung weight (weight that isn't carried by
the
> suspension) is the absolute worst thing for handling and
acceleration, every
> pound as detrimental to handling characteristics as several pounds of
sprung
> weight.
Shows how little I know about these things.
> Hey, how about this for a serial killer m.o.: disturbed soldier comes
home
> with a secret stash of RPGs. Takes to the freeway on a sportbike,
blowing
> away the occasional SUV. Picks a color to do the first few, and mass
> numbers of people start selling those. Then switches to a new color,
and
> does a few more.
>
> Random enough to terrify people, just non-random enough to really get
a
> smaller but numerically large group of people really scared. And
since
> you're already on a freeway on a motorcycle, pretty easy to get away.
I don't know how you can hide an RPG while on a bike.
It might be better to pull off and hide in a bush or
behind a tree and fire from there and then take off
on the bike.
Susan
Joel M. Eichen
wrote:
>I don't know how you can hide an RPG while on a bike.
>It might be better to pull off and hide in a bush or
>behind a tree and fire from there and then take off
>on the bike.
>
>Susan
You know the little bicycle pump that clicks onto the frame? The RPG
fits nicely inside that.
Joel
Brian F. Nevercene
>> In article <1110854905....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
>> No... that's a middle initial.
>
>F for Fake? Or is that too Awesome Wellsian?
Since it stands for nothing, you're welcome to assign any meaning you
wish.
Brian F. Nevercene
eartha...@yahoo.com says...
>people. When victims seem like they could be you, it hits harder to
>home, that's why the media also gives them lots of coverage.
Typical media technique, too. They even create illogical "this could be
you" or "this could be your kids" scenarios to prompt the emotion.
A ten pound dog falls through a tiny hole in a storm sewer grate, and
the coverage shows all the 80 pound neighborhood kids who couldn't
possibly fall through the hole, with the "this could be your kids" tag,
accompanied by a media indictment of the government agency responsible
for sewer grate maintenance.
Tomorrow, its the next trumped up "emergency" on TV. "Special report by
the Channel Seven on the Scene Investigators", blare the ads for the
daily news program. They're pushing attempted charisma so much, I expect
a scathing story, the next time they're popular, of the tremendous
threat to our kids perpetrated by the evil makers of Hula Hoops.
Vic Vega
stated that the vehicle had "fancy wheels" - something else unique to
identify it (as well as the ethnic backround of the owner).
Susan Cohen
Well, nobody's perfect.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> In article <1110890132.4...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> flab...@gmail.com says...
> >
> >
> >Brian F. Nevercene wrote:
> >> In article <1110854905....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
>
>
> >> No... that's a middle initial.
> >
> >F for Fake? Or is that too Awesome Wellsian?
>
>
> Since it stands for nothing, you're welcome to assign any meaning you
> wish.
OK Brian F for nothing Nevercene :-)
Susan
Susan Cohen
> In article <1110706552.9...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> eartha...@yahoo.com says...
>
>
> >people. When victims seem like they could be you, it hits harder to
> >home, that's why the media also gives them lots of coverage.
>
>
> Typical media technique, too. They even create illogical "this could
be
> you" or "this could be your kids" scenarios to prompt the emotion.
>
> A ten pound dog falls through a tiny hole in a storm sewer grate, and
> the coverage shows all the 80 pound neighborhood kids who couldn't
> possibly fall through the hole, with the "this could be your kids"
tag,
> accompanied by a media indictment of the government agency
responsible
> for sewer grate maintenance.
Damn sewer grate maintainers.
> Tomorrow, its the next trumped up "emergency" on TV. "Special report
by
> the Channel Seven on the Scene Investigators", blare the ads for the
> daily news program. They're pushing attempted charisma so much, I
expect
> a scathing story, the next time they're popular, of the tremendous
> threat to our kids perpetrated by the evil makers of Hula Hoops.
Don't get me started on the evil makers of Hula Hoops.
When I was a kid, I never could get them to work properly.
Susan
Susan Cohen
> On 17 Mar 2005 18:47:26 -0800, "Susan Cohen" <flab...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >I don't know how you can hide an RPG while on a bike.
> >It might be better to pull off and hide in a bush or
> >behind a tree and fire from there and then take off
> >on the bike.
> >
> >Susan
>
>
> You know the little bicycle pump that clicks onto the frame?
Yes, in a pushbike.
> The RPG fits nicely inside that.
>
> Joel
We're talking motorbikes here, Joel. I don't think you can make
all that great a getaway on a pushbike.
Susan
G W Shrub
> Don't get me started on the evil makers of Hula Hoops.
> When I was a kid, I never could get them to work properly.
Compare the fatality statistics for lawn darts and hand guns. Guess which
one was banned outright!
GW
The +Revd
<flav...@verizon.net> wrote:
>Suzy
That's because you were always too goddam fat to get inside one, you
thick Irish cunt.
Michael Baldwin Bruce
Don't forget to bite the heads of wippets or I'll take you for
a scrape found to Dinsdale's place.
(null)
>
>>Yeah, wouldn't that be cool! But do you have time to eat their liver
>>afterwards?
>
>Does anyone have a recipe to make a truly abused liver edible?
Another DO:
Get the wine right. Thomas Harris recommended a "big Amarone" in the book,
but the movie script writer, doubtlessly assuming the public is a grunting
pile of uneducated chimps (and for the most part correct), edited that to
"a nice Chianti", which anyone who's tasted the two would understand is
utterly unsuited to organ meat, whereas the hint of raisin in the bouquet
of a fine Amarone complements the slight gaminess of free-range liver.
Both meat and wine have complex tastes, nicely offset by the delicacy
of the beans - one wonders whether he drizzled the gravy over them or
kept them carefully aside.
Francois, hungry.