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Will Holley TBI on S-10 with 2.8L Help
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Craig R
Jun 14, 2002, 3:44:42 AM6/14/02
to
Holley sells a replacement throttle body injection system that is
designed as an OE replacement and uses the standard GM electronics and
sensors. They claim a horsepower improvement over the stock TBI, but I
am wondering if it is even noticeable. Has anyone installed this TBI
and noticed much of an improvement?
designed as an OE replacement and uses the standard GM electronics and
sensors. They claim a horsepower improvement over the stock TBI, but I
am wondering if it is even noticeable. Has anyone installed this TBI
and noticed much of an improvement?
"Doc"
Jun 14, 2002, 10:48:51 AM6/14/02
to
They claim the larger bore diameter increases the amount of air the TB can
physically take in, hence making the 02 sensor detect more oxygen in the
exhaust and tell the PCM to dump more fuel in. More air+more fuel=more
power, at least in theorey. I have a few pals who have tried everything
from "big bore" throttle bodies to oversized MAF sensors to increase airflow
in the pursuit of power. The difference is psychological. You'll feel like
the truck is faster and more powerful, but per her on a dyno and you'll see
VERY little gain.
physically take in, hence making the 02 sensor detect more oxygen in the
exhaust and tell the PCM to dump more fuel in. More air+more fuel=more
power, at least in theorey. I have a few pals who have tried everything
from "big bore" throttle bodies to oversized MAF sensors to increase airflow
in the pursuit of power. The difference is psychological. You'll feel like
the truck is faster and more powerful, but per her on a dyno and you'll see
VERY little gain.
Waste of money IMHO. Want more power? Upgrade to a 350.
Doc
"Craig R" <cra...@cableone.net> wrote in message
news:3D099EEA...@cableone.net...
Dean Dardwin
Jun 14, 2002, 11:29:20 AM6/14/02
to
Doc,
Slightly off-topic. This comes up all the time. Somebody buys a truck with a dink engine and then wants it to go faster. In my 40+ years of turning wrenches I have never once had somebody say to me..."my engine is too big, can you make it smaller so my truck goes slower?".
"there's no replacement for displacement...there's no replacement for displacement...there's no replacement for displacement..."
Dean
Slightly off-topic. This comes up all the time. Somebody buys a truck with a dink engine and then wants it to go faster. In my 40+ years of turning wrenches I have never once had somebody say to me..."my engine is too big, can you make it smaller so my truck goes slower?".
"there's no replacement for displacement...there's no replacement for displacement...there's no replacement for displacement..."
Dean
"Doc"
Jun 14, 2002, 1:27:20 PM6/14/02
to
Dean,
Also slightly off-topic...........
I agree 150%. Buy the truck you want, not the
truck you can "comfortably" afford at the time and then try to get 200+ HP out
of a wee little 2.8!
When I bought my bruiser (the one that's currently
in the shop getting repaired after my run in with the red-light runner) I knew
I'd be dissatisfied as hell with the 305 (which is and will always be a
dog). This one's not too bad as it's been bored .60 over and had some head
work done, puts out around 230 HP. I bought it because the price was too good to
refuse, the body was PERFECT as was the interior, and the amount I saved was
going right back into the truck under the hood. I guess most folks figure
they can "tweak" the motor to get massive improvements out of it with
aftermarket bolt-ons. I've always thought that if you weren't impressed
with the power during the test drive, don't buy the damn thing! I wasn't
impressed with the power, but I knew I'd HAVE to drop another engine in it to
get the performance I wanted.
Still at a stalemate regarding the engine
swap. I'm truly torn between the HT 383 and the RamJet 502. Money
isn't really an issue (go ahead everybody, start yelling at me
again because I make good money, hell at least I drive a truck and not a
friggin' Mercedes like everyone else I work with), it's more an issue of how
much work I want to put into it. Anywho, with the big block I'll
have to do quite a few more mods with the drivetrain than with the 383 which is
a drop and go; add the vortech TBI intake and modified PCM chip, I can use my
existing TBI setup as well. Then again, I know me, I'll want more power 6
months down the line.
Any personal experience with the RamJet 502
Dean? Likes, dislikes? It's a toy truck so I'm not worried about gas
mileage which is an obvious dislike! Looks like I'd have to get a new hood
with cutout for a scoop with the size of that intake plenum too!
Take care,
Doc
"Dean Dardwin" <d...@dxd.com> wrote in message news:3D0A0BD0...@dxd.com...
Dean Dardwin
Jun 14, 2002, 4:42:13 PM6/14/02
to
Doc,
No, not with the RamJet but some with carbureted 502s. They do have a way of putting a smile on your face. Lots of easy power with no fuss. If I ever grenade my 454, a 502 is going in. Of course that means a modified 4L80E.
That brings up a point. Your HT383 makes a lot of sense. If you get a built 4L60E for it (you and Gary are almost neighbors, right?) it's pretty much a bolt it in and fire it up deal.
The RJ502 option requires a built 4L80E, a 14 bolt FF axle, and new driveshaft and u-joints. Of course, they only come in 8 bolt hubs so you need new wheels and then the front won't match so then you need a D60 or 9.25" IFS front axle... I'm sure you see where I'm going with this.
If it were me, I'd do the HT383. It's a fun project. If you wake up some morning and decide it's still not fast enough for you, you can pick up a 8600# GVWR truck with the 454/4L80E/14-bolt FF/9.25" IFS already in place. Then get the RJ502 and the $1,500 540 stroker kit. If that doesn't float your boat, then all I can suggest is changing careers and becoming a top-fuel driver; 0-335 in 4.5 seconds!
Any ETA on when you might be getting your pride and joy back?
Dean
No, not with the RamJet but some with carbureted 502s. They do have a way of putting a smile on your face. Lots of easy power with no fuss. If I ever grenade my 454, a 502 is going in. Of course that means a modified 4L80E.
That brings up a point. Your HT383 makes a lot of sense. If you get a built 4L60E for it (you and Gary are almost neighbors, right?) it's pretty much a bolt it in and fire it up deal.
The RJ502 option requires a built 4L80E, a 14 bolt FF axle, and new driveshaft and u-joints. Of course, they only come in 8 bolt hubs so you need new wheels and then the front won't match so then you need a D60 or 9.25" IFS front axle... I'm sure you see where I'm going with this.
If it were me, I'd do the HT383. It's a fun project. If you wake up some morning and decide it's still not fast enough for you, you can pick up a 8600# GVWR truck with the 454/4L80E/14-bolt FF/9.25" IFS already in place. Then get the RJ502 and the $1,500 540 stroker kit. If that doesn't float your boat, then all I can suggest is changing careers and becoming a top-fuel driver; 0-335 in 4.5 seconds!
Any ETA on when you might be getting your pride and joy back?
Dean
Iwantit122
Jun 14, 2002, 4:48:31 PM6/14/02
to
>Subject: Re: Will Holley TBI on S-10 with 2.8L Help
>From: "\"Doc\"" som...@nowhere.net
>Date: 6/14/2002 10:48 AM Eastern Standard Time
>Message-id: <nnnO8.1081$iE1.45...@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com>
>
>They claim the larger bore diameter increases the amount of air the TB can
>physically take in, hence making the 02 sensor detect more oxygen in the
>exhaust and tell the PCM to dump more fuel in. More air+more fuel=more
>power, at least in theorey. I have a few pals who have tried everything
>from "big bore" throttle bodies to oversized MAF sensors to increase airflow
>in the pursuit of power. The difference is psychological. You'll feel like
>the truck is faster and more powerful, but per her on a dyno and you'll see
>VERY little gain.
>
>Waste of money IMHO. Want more power? Upgrade to a 350.
>
>Doc
*****************************
I plan to swap my 4.3 V-6 in my 91 S-10, for a V-8. I dont know what type of
horse power i want, and how much it will cost to do the swap.
Maybe around 290 to 330 hp will do nice, i plan to go first class, with the
truck, money is no object...
>From: "\"Doc\"" som...@nowhere.net
>Date: 6/14/2002 10:48 AM Eastern Standard Time
>Message-id: <nnnO8.1081$iE1.45...@newssvr15.news.prodigy.com>
>
>They claim the larger bore diameter increases the amount of air the TB can
>physically take in, hence making the 02 sensor detect more oxygen in the
>exhaust and tell the PCM to dump more fuel in. More air+more fuel=more
>power, at least in theorey. I have a few pals who have tried everything
>from "big bore" throttle bodies to oversized MAF sensors to increase airflow
>in the pursuit of power. The difference is psychological. You'll feel like
>the truck is faster and more powerful, but per her on a dyno and you'll see
>VERY little gain.
>
>Waste of money IMHO. Want more power? Upgrade to a 350.
>
>Doc
I plan to swap my 4.3 V-6 in my 91 S-10, for a V-8. I dont know what type of
horse power i want, and how much it will cost to do the swap.
Maybe around 290 to 330 hp will do nice, i plan to go first class, with the
truck, money is no object...
Chas.
Anthony Kimmell
Jun 14, 2002, 6:06:44 PM6/14/02
to
>I plan to swap my 4.3 V-6 in my 91 S-10, for a V-8. I dont know what type
>of
>horse power i want, and how much it will cost to do the swap.
>Maybe around 290 to 330 hp will do nice, i plan to go first class, with the
>truck, money is no object...
>
>Chas.
>of
>horse power i want, and how much it will cost to do the swap.
>Maybe around 290 to 330 hp will do nice, i plan to go first class, with the
>truck, money is no object...
>
>Chas.
You can easily get 350 hp out of a 350 if not more. All depends on what you
want to do to it.
Tony Kimmell
Normal, IL
Craig R
Jun 14, 2002, 6:33:00 PM6/14/02
to
Doc, I can't help but laugh at your humor on this issue. I bought the truck new
in 1987, just before the 4.3L came out. I bought this truck as I liked the
looks better than the Ford and didn't like the imports at all. It has done fine
these last 15 years, mostly because I don't have to tow things. If I haul a
load, it is obvious the engine is weak (and I suspect the manual transmission as
well). I thought a simple improvement like a new TBI might give me a little
more edge and a little better gas mileage.
in 1987, just before the 4.3L came out. I bought this truck as I liked the
looks better than the Ford and didn't like the imports at all. It has done fine
these last 15 years, mostly because I don't have to tow things. If I haul a
load, it is obvious the engine is weak (and I suspect the manual transmission as
well). I thought a simple improvement like a new TBI might give me a little
more edge and a little better gas mileage.
MINDBENDER225869
Jun 14, 2002, 7:25:29 PM6/14/02
to
>Subject: Re: Will Holley TBI on S-10 with 2.8L Help
>From: bigch...@aol.comAOLSUCKS (Anthony Kimmell)>Date: 6/14/2002 6:06 PM Eastern Standard Time
>Message-id: <20020614180644...@mb-bj.aol.com>
350 Hp in my S10 would be the max, for my S-10. I hear Chevy makes a 4.3 with
290 hp, that would be about perfect, dont know what the 290hp 4.3 would cost...
Chas
"Doc"
Jun 14, 2002, 9:45:44 PM6/14/02
to
The fastest, easiest way to increase RWHP lies within your exhaust. A nice
set of long tube, small diameter headers with X or Y crossover will give you
some added punch. Add a Borla cat-back performance exhaust system (the much
less expensive generic brands work just as well) and you're rockin' and
rollin!
set of long tube, small diameter headers with X or Y crossover will give you
some added punch. Add a Borla cat-back performance exhaust system (the much
less expensive generic brands work just as well) and you're rockin' and
rollin!
Regarding air intake, switch from the factory air box to an aftermarket open
style. Not knowing which engine you have in that thing, the air filter unit
is either circular or a square box. If circular, hit Autozone and pick up
an Edelbrock chrome air filter housing for 20 bucks, then stuff the tallest
air filter you can find in it. If an air box, remove it and buy one of
those cone-shaped filters in the import section and attach it to the air
tube which used to lead into the factory air box. You will notice better
air flow and increased HP.
Save your money, don't spend $250 on a K & N Cold air intake kit! WASTE OF
MONEY!!
Hope this helps,
Doc
"Craig R" <cra...@cableone.net> wrote in message
news:3D0A6F1C...@cableone.net...
"Doc"
Jun 14, 2002, 9:49:26 PM6/14/02
to
Dean,
She's going on the frame machine Monday morning to
straighten her out, then it's reassembley and painting. Looks like another
two weeks or so. I'm planning some vacation time in August which is when
I'll probably hit the HT 383 retro-conversion. You're right, the RJ502
would be a royal pain in the wazoo. I'm sure there's some head work that
could be done to the 383 to give it even more punch.
You mention a built 4L60E............I have a
TH-400 in her right now, that'll work too right?
Doc
"Dean Dardwin" <d...@dxd.com> wrote in message news:3D0A552...@dxd.com...
Dean Dardwin
Jun 14, 2002, 10:02:26 PM6/14/02
to
Doc,
A TH400? Absolutely. Wont' need to touch it. They live behind 454s forever with simple maintenance.
Dean
A TH400? Absolutely. Wont' need to touch it. They live behind 454s forever with simple maintenance.
Dean
Gary Glaenzer
Jun 14, 2002, 10:07:32 PM6/14/02
to
and an Allison 540 converter and a re-worked PR set-up makes 'em even nicer
.................
.................
"Dean Dardwin" <d...@dxd.com> wrote in message
news:3D0AA032...@dxd.com...
> Doc,
>
> A TH400? Absolutely. Wont' need to touch it. They live behind 454s
> forever with simple maintenance.
>
> Dean
>
> \"Doc\" wrote:
>
> > Dean,
> >
> > She's going on the frame machine Monday morning to straighten her out,
> > then it's reassembley and painting. Looks like another two weeks or
> > so. I'm planning some vacation time in August which is when I'll
> > probably hit the HT 383 retro-conversion. You're right, the RJ502
> > would be a royal pain in the wazoo. I'm sure there's some head work
> > that could be done to the 383 to give it even more punch.
> >
> > You mention a built 4L60E............I have a TH-400 in her right now,
> > that'll work too right?
> >
> > Doc
> >
> > "Dean Dardwin" <d...@dxd.com <mailto:d...@dxd.com>> wrote in message
> >> "Dean Dardwin" <d...@dxd.com <mailto:d...@dxd.com>> wrote in
"Doc"
Jun 14, 2002, 11:08:14 PM6/14/02
to
Oops! Hit the "Y" key instead of the "H" key. I meant to say X or H type
crossover. I didn't mean to come accross as a smartass in my reply to your
original post. You didn't mention that you've owned the truck since new and
I wrongfully assumed that your post was like most others on this topic which
are usually "I just bought this old truck which has zero power, how do I get
more?"
crossover. I didn't mean to come accross as a smartass in my reply to your
original post. You didn't mention that you've owned the truck since new and
I wrongfully assumed that your post was like most others on this topic which
are usually "I just bought this old truck which has zero power, how do I get
more?"
GMPP currently has a HT 3.4 litre V-6 which bolts in place of your original
2.8 litre motor. They produce 160 HP and 194 ft/lbs of torque. $1789.59
brand spankin' new.
Doc
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