Off road and everyday use indoor power wheelchair...
Burgerman
thirds done should any wheelies be interested!
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/images-new-powerchair/casters-on-1200.jpg
picture.
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/power-wheelchair-off-road.htm
the page
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/powerchair.htm
The other ones that I did earlier. And finished... They all worked out
about 1500 uk pounds completed and you cant buy a chair this well engineered
or finished. At least I havent found one yet! I wish I couldit wouldsaveme
hours of work.
Anyway, this latest one looks a monster but its actually still 26 incheswide
making it narrower (and shorter) than my kuschall manual chair. And still
has 70 amp hour group 24 batteries and 100 amp controller and 6.5mph 4 pole
motors.
I had to build my own to get the width/battery capacity/ length as small as
this. All the rest are either bigger or mid drive (Which I loath for a bunch
of good reasons) or too long/ short on range/ or speed and finished about as
well as a chinese motorbike...
Burgerman.
Pete
> My latest cheap built in a bedroom off road wheelchair design is about
> two thirds done should any wheelies be interested!
>
> the page
I'm always interested to read what you've been up to Burgerman.
The chair's coming together nicely, It'll be interesting to see it when
it's complete.
Just on your point of running 7-10 psi in those rear tyres, I think 10
psi is the max rated pressure, plus, with only 3 bolts holding the split
rim together you'll need to be careful the rim doesn't distort. I only
run around 3.5-4 psi in mine, though you look a lot heavier than me, you
might find 5 psi is all you need.
Burgerman
news:02136826$0$20628$c3e...@news.astraweb.com...
> Burgerman wrote:
>> My latest cheap built in a bedroom off road wheelchair design is about
>> two thirds done should any wheelies be interested!
>>
>> http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/power-wheelchair-off-road.htm
>> the page
>
> I'm always interested to read what you've been up to Burgerman.
>
> The chair's coming together nicely, It'll be interesting to see it when
> it's complete.
>
> Just on your point of running 7-10 psi in those rear tyres, I think 10 psi
> is the max rated pressure, plus, with only 3 bolts holding the split rim
> together you'll need to be careful the rim doesn't distort.
No its not a split rim. Its welded so should bestrong. And it sort of needs
to be one bit to use tubeless tyres I prefer for the lack of punctures. .And
I may order a set od these
https://ssl11.chi.us.securedata.net/test.burrisracing.com/merchantmanager/popup_image.php?pID=110
I only
> run around 3.5-4 psi in mine, though you look a lot heavier than me, you
> might find 5 psi is all you need.
Could well be, as I am guessing. Tried the wheels on the
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/powerchair.htm chair and they were great but
never looked at the pressures. Although 8 inches too wide compared to my 27
inch standard width chair. Hence all the rebuilding and narrowed centre
section. I wont use it in mud or stuff with no grip anyway so may fit these
As they are only 5mm wider and are kevlar lined to stop eny punctures. Off
road type tyres are really needed only for places that have no grip. We will
see what works best,
I also plat to use an uninflated tube in there with asealed second valve and
valve hole, If I do get a puncture or manage to knock the tyre off the rim I
can re inflte via the dormant tube. Balance isnt a problem at our speeds!
Pete
> "Pete" <pe...@home.dud> wrote in message
>> psi is the max rated pressure, plus, with only 3 bolts holding the
>> split rim together you'll need to be careful the rim doesn't distort.
>
>
> No its not a split rim. Its welded so should be strong.
Fair enough, my rims are split so i just assumed your rims were as well.
> And it sort of needs to be one bit to use tubeless tyres I prefer for the lack of
> punctures. .And I may order a set od these
> https://ssl11.chi.us.securedata.net/test.burrisracing.com/merchantmanager/popup_image.php?pID=110
Nice rims.
>> I only run around 3.5-4 psi in mine, though you look a lot heavier than me,
>> you might find 5 psi is all you need.
>
> Could well be, as I am guessing. Tried the wheels on the
> http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/powerchair.htm chair and they were great
> but never looked at the pressures. Although 8 inches too wide compared
> to my 27 inch standard width chair. Hence all the rebuilding and
> narrowed centre section. I wont use it in mud or stuff with no grip
> anyway so may fit these
I ran 7-10 psi in mine for a while, but found the ride harsh, plus the
tyres were wearing in the centre, Once i dropped to 4 psi the wear
pattern evened out and the ride improved no end, as the tyres deformed
around obstacles rather than rode up over them.
To anyone else reading this, We're talking about low pressure balloon
tyres, not standard wheelchair tyres, running 4 psi in those will ruin them.
Burgerman
Have you ever had a puncture?
Would tubeless 4 ply tyres fit your rims? I mean will the two halves fit
together with some sealant ? Will these quad bike wheels fit yours? Using 3
bolts.
Burgerman
Just been looking at tyre pressures for quads with the same tyres. And the
manufacturer of your chair. they all use and I quote:
"Tires: 145-70/6 Low Pressure (3.6psi) Black Knobby" From your chairs site,
So it looks like thats about right.
Those lawn tyres in the other post run at 4.5psi.
Will see how it goes! Do you have a good photo of your wheels you could mail
me?
Thanks!
Burgerman.
Pete
> "Pete" <pe...@home.dud> wrote in message
>> tyres were wearing in the centre, Once i dropped to 4 psi the wear
>> pattern evened out and the ride improved no end, as the tyres deformed
>> around obstacles rather than rode up over them.
>>
>> To anyone else reading this, We're talking about low pressure balloon
>> tyres, not standard wheelchair tyres, running 4 psi in those will ruin
>> them.
>
>
> Have you ever had a puncture?
I'm probably tempting fate saying this, but no, i've never had a flat so
far. I think part of the reason is because the tyres run such a low
pressure they flex around sharp objects rather than resist, i've run
over my share of broken glass with them as well.
> Would tubeless 4 ply tyres fit your rims? I mean will the two halves fit
> together with some sealant ?
Interesting thought, though i think getting a good seal between the two
halves would difficult.
> Will these quad bike wheels fit yours?
> Using 3 bolts.
The hubs are five bolt so the 3 bolt rims wouldn't fit.
Pete
> Just been looking at tyre pressures for quads with the same tyres. And
> the manufacturer of your chair. they all use and I quote:
>
> "Tires: 145-70/6 Low Pressure (3.6psi) Black Knobby" From your chairs
> site, So it looks like thats about right.
>
> Those lawn tyres in the other post run at 4.5psi.
> Will see how it goes! Do you have a good photo of your wheels you could
> mail me?
No problem, just sent it through.
Burgerman
Thanks. I recognise that wheel. Its used on microlite aircraft etc. The stud
spacing is closer together with smaller pcd. You could just drill a cheap
quad bike wheel with 5 or 6 holes. as needed with a hand rill with care.
They are about 40 to 50 pounds a pair complete with tubeless tyres on ebay
or various online shops. Or you could fit tubeless tyres on your rims if
you assembled them with a rubber gasket cut from old car tube. Or a smear of
RTV silicone sealer. Should you want to!
The reasons I built my own rather than bought an X5
Page unfinished. Will have other chairs that are similar all day/off road if
I can find any!
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/off-road-wheelchair.htm
Burgerman
Replied in a different post!
Pete
> "Pete" <pe...@home.dud> wrote in message
>>> Those lawn tyres in the other post run at 4.5psi.
>>> Will see how it goes! Do you have a good photo of your wheels you
>>> could mail me?
>>
>> No problem, just sent it through.
>
>
> Thanks. I recognise that wheel. Its used on microlite aircraft etc. The
> stud spacing is closer together with smaller pcd. You could just drill
> a cheap quad bike wheel with 5 or 6 holes. as needed with a hand rill
> with care. They are about 40 to 50 pounds a pair complete with tubeless
> tyres on ebay or various online shops. Or you could fit tubeless tyres
> on your rims if you assembled them with a rubber gasket cut from old car
> tube. Or a smear of RTV silicone sealer. Should you want to!
True, There are a few options if i wanted to go tubeless. Though as i
said, as i've not had any puncture problems with the tubed tyres, so the
"if it ain't broke" rule applies.
> The reasons I built my own rather than bought an X5
> Page unfinished. Will have other chairs that are similar all day/off
> road if I can find any!
> http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/off-road-wheelchair.htm
That's quite a good piece on the X5, As an X5 owner i'd say i agree with
almost everything you've written. Your point on the seat, you can order
the same seat with just a flat pan for your own cushion, as well as a
one piece flip-up footrest instead of the removable footrests.
I agree about the armrests, they look like they'd break with any amount
of weight applied to them. I know a few people with the X5 as their main
everyday chair, IMO it's just that bit too large/wide and you sit too
high to be really used as a main chair. As an outdoor chair i've found
nothing better, the X5 is fast, comfortable and will go most places
without problem.
The chair your building is, IMO excellent, your got the soft ride and
traction of the balloon tyres, and managed to get the width down to
around 26", that extra 2" makes a big difference.
Burgerman
Ah well now you know why I had to build my own!
I wanted a full time small dimensioned daily chair with normal seat height
as you say,with the same narrow/short size and rear drive setup that would
let me also walk the dog on the fields/woods without crumbling away in
winter or having short range... Actually if the big black tyres were grey it
would suit almost all powerchair users whatever their usage. Personally grey
sucks!
How come if I can do it to a higher standard *in my bedroom* whilst
paralysed and living on benefits the manufacturers cant? Beats me. I am
sure if I manufactured something similar and properly built and finished it
would sell to all full time powerchair users like hot cakes. Small changes
make huge differences when you are living with it. But the bean counters
would make a cheap badly finished steel version...
Burgerman
MPS: 23.75" IS THAT A CAR SEAT??? Thats high!
Rehab: 20.75" TO SEAT BASE
Mines 18" (level seat) high to seat base sensible minimum (its adjustable as
I made the seat plates.
It could go 2 inches lower.
Any lower than that and it gets within inch of the batteries which while
possible you wouldnt want it to touch!
With a Recaro it could be 19" at the front at a push without much trouble..
Its set at 18" as it is now because I like it there as I have long legs and
want some ground clearance and dont like to be too low.
Thats 20 with a 2 inch thick Rajay cushion on it. But then its tilted back a
touch so the front edge is maybe an inch higher than it has to be.
Pete
> How come if I can do it to a higher standard *in my bedroom* whilst
> paralysed and living on benefits the manufacturers cant? Beats me. I am
> sure if I manufactured something similar and properly built and finished
> it would sell to all full time powerchair users like hot cakes. Small
> changes make huge differences when you are living with it. But the bean
> counters would make a cheap badly finished steel version...
I've thought about this myself at times, The only answers i can come up
with, are, at one end you have the bean counters trying to keep costs to
a minimum, at the other end you have designers trying to build something
that suits everyone. What you end up with, is an over-engineered chair
built down to a price point, no alloy or carbon composite parts, too
expensive, just plain old mild steel.
Burgerman
They all seem to be built by comittee. No plan. And anything it will do,
weight no problem just paint the frame a nice colour.
I prefer every part alloy, anodised (black!) and no weight. I will need to
buy a milling machine and build the lot from scratch and get Spondon
Engineering to make me a tubular big diameter alloy frame with a little
style. Could get it down to about a quarter of what they are now without
trying.
Pete
> MPS: 23.75" IS THAT A CAR SEAT??? Thats high!
It looks like a car seat, though whether it would pass crash testing is
another question. Looking at the frame that attaches the seat to the
chair base, i could drop around 2" to 3" in height, depending on how
much dump i want, by cutting the anchor points and drilling some new
holes. I assume the hight it is now is to cater for people who are tall
with long legs, not a problem for me.
> Rehab: 20.75" TO SEAT BASE
>
> Mines 18" (level seat) high to seat base sensible minimum (its
> adjustable as I made the seat plates.
> It could go 2 inches lower.
> Any lower than that and it gets within inch of the batteries which
> while possible you wouldnt want it to touch!
> With a Recaro it could be 19" at the front at a push without much trouble..
>
> Its set at 18" as it is now because I like it there as I have long legs
> and want some ground clearance and dont like to be too low.
> Thats 20 with a 2 inch thick Rajay cushion on it. But then its tilted
> back a touch so the front edge is maybe an inch higher than it has to be.
I like to end up with about 20"-21" total hight inc cushion, that way i
fit under most tables without problem.
Burgerman
Take it apart you kniw you want to!
Burgerman
I just ordered a set of these...
You may be interested...
http://www.tyre-rite.co.uk/detail_AllT.aspx?ID=265
Because they are strong 4 ply, and have a reinforced puncture resistant
layer that is perfect for us!
You can order them cheaper without it but I am all for not getting stuck.
They also run 4 psi. and with that flat shape there is little pressure on
surfaces and little sinking or damage. They should last forever too. I
ordered another pair of wheels (22 quid!) so I can have a set of each
depending on if its dry or wet or if I am going anywhere muddy/slippy. These
are better suited to pavements and dry areas. Tubeless too if you want
that. (I do. But at 4 psi I doubt is makes much difference) I just tried
running over my carer jennys foot. I weigh about 20 stone. The chair isnt
light either. It doesent hurt just deforms. And I hardly feel it. Why dont
all powerchairs come with these tyres? Never mind I already know...
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/power-wheelchair-off-road.htm
Pete
> I just ordered a set of these...
> You may be interested...
> http://www.tyre-rite.co.uk/detail_AllT.aspx?ID=265
Not bad, I've bookmarked it for later. As most of my time spent on
pavement, they might be a better option than the knobby ones fitted to
my chair.
The anti-puncture layer sounds useful.
Burgerman
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/off-road-everyday-powerchair.htm
For your interest!
I bought a set to look at.
They are ideal for puncture free long lasting rubber.
Should be pretty good on grass or dirt tracks too where I walk the dog and
better on pavements than the off road ones are. I will use them in summer.
In winter I will use the off road ones. In both cases the run at low
pressure and have good floatation.
As you can see they are about 1/2 inch bigger diameter (you sit 6 mm higher
which would be hard to notice) and about 6mm wider in total too.
Burgerman
picture of one fitted to the rim here. The one laying flat is at 25psi
though (way too high!) so too rounded. The other one is at 7psi and probably
about right / bit high. I suspect that about 5 will be right for these.
http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/off-road-everyday-powerchair.htm
Pete
The tyres look good on the rims. I had a bit of a look online, this site
http://tinyurl.com/ow2y63 lists the Kenda 15x6.00-6 with the K500 tread
pattern as being 6 ply? I think you said yours were 4 ply.
I notice you got all the bits back from the powder coaters, I'll look
forward to seeing it together.
Burgerman
6? no. most tyres this size are 2. Some are 4 like motorcyvle or car. 6 is
usually truck stuff...Must be a typo. The same tyre is acailable cheaper
with no anti puncture layer so be sure to get the right ones. When deflated
before fitting that layer deforms the tyres and they look mishapen so its
easy to tell.
Your own tyres may be 2 or 4 depending how careful its designer was when
choosing!
Burgerman
news:fu8Sl.669$oi1...@newsfe30.ams2...
test - ntl or virgin or whatever they are called this week seems to be
broken again...
Pete
> test - ntl or virgin or whatever they are called this week seems to be
> broken again...
msg arrived here ok
Burgerman
Strange. I couldnt see it or any recent posts earliier!