vasectomy for 2/18/5 and getting a little nervous
4rest
I am new to this. I am 42 and have 2 wonderful children. I am getting
my vas on next friday, 2/18. I am REALLY a bit nervous about this. I
want it. I fear the needle to the vas and the procedure. Plus, what
will the orgasm feel like after. Anyone help?
The preop went fine. He examined me and located both vas easily. Like I
said, my concern is more with "what will it feel like and look like"
after, and the needle to numb....
Talked to my dr and his nurse today. He called in some drugs for me to
take next thurs and fri before operation. I am scheduled for 12 noon.
Assured me I was normal to be a bit scared.
Thanks
Forrest
David
Oh yes - being scared is quite normal. I don't think any of us here would
say that we weren't.
There is a difference between being scared of the procedure, and being
uncertain that you want to have it done. From what you say above, I'm
guessing that you have thought about this a while, and are happy to go
ahead. Therefore it's just a case of getting you through this.
You do read negative reports of the procedure here. However, they are
statistically in the minority. Regards orgasms after vasectomy, the majority
reports are that vasectomy either doesn't change your sex life, or it
improves it. There is a phsycological aspect to vasectomy, and the men that
have difficulties after vasectomy have a tendency to be those that weren't
happy about going ahead with it.
http://www.vasectomy-information.com/pages/wellconn.pdf is probably the best
written discussion of these issues.
In my case, I had the vasectomy nearly 8 years ago. I too had two kids, and
we had decided that two was the limit. It was my decision to have a
vasectomy. After doing some research it boiled down to the least risk
alternative for permanent birth control, and so it has proved.
We both hated condoms, so that's an improvement for a start. Also, all the
fiddling around with them (and disposing of them after) has gone, allowing
more spontenaeity.
Nearly 8 years on and no problems whatsoever - it's been a very positive
thing for us.
Please post back if you want to chat.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
4rest
Thanks, David. As I said, I am more nervous about the pre op prep and
actual "cutting", then what it will feel like afterards. I don't like
condoms, and my wife had had the depro prevara injections and "the
Pill". I don't like the side affects with those. She gave birth 2
months ago and is tring to get back to her normal weight. We are
blessed to have a boy 2 months and a girl 6 years. She had several
miscarriages and we talked prior to the last child being born and said
this was our last try, no matter what. God took care of the rest. An
odd thing though, in our area, they offered to tie her tubes @ birth.
We both said no, as this was a more "major" procedure. Yet, 2
urologists refused to do the vasectomy on me until the second child was
6 months old. Since I am a golf course superintendent, this would put
the surgery in April or May for me, which is my busiest time. Both our
children, we had in the "off season" purposly so I could spend as much
post partum with them and her trying to help. I did find it odd that
during the pro op vas check, 2 guys flat refused to do the surgery.
Their reason was SIDS. I was emphatic with the one, as he was checking
the vas, he told me this. infact, I told him my situation and would go
elsewhere. He was like "well, that'sour policy, sorry"
I have seen the horror stories online and I guess I should just ignore
them and put them our of my mind. I was talking to a buddy in the
Sunday school class I teach (I do the young adults age 20-40 who had
one done). He did say the post op pain was meduim, but do differance
afterward. This has eased my mind. Anyhow, after helping deliver both
my kids, I think this is the least I can do for our marriage.
I am getting the usual ribbing from my friends at work and church,
which, oddly I enjoy. Our youth director is going to go with me the day
of as my wife has to work (she does the after school programming at
church). The joke is the pets in our family are all "fixed" and now
it's daddy's turn to get "tutored" (instead of nutered).....
Lots of laughs at this point. I just hope I don't chicken out the last
minute.
Thanks,
Forrest
4rest
could you bring it in? How long did you wait until the first post op
ejaculation? Was there any pain? If you had to do the sample in the
office, what was the procedure? How long did it take to zero out? How
many samples do you have to give?
Just wondering...
grea...@hotmail.com
Had my vas yesterday. Not bad at all. I had a NSV. I felt more
discomfort gettinge my wisdom teeth out. The lidocane injections (he
gave me 3) were not that bad, just a minor sting. After that, I did not
feel much of anything. I went home and iced the area until bedtime and
have been taking 5oomg tylenol. I have not iced yet this morning, but
will do just to be safe. I have no pain today but am taking it easy
none the less. I do admit the nervous time before the procedure is
worse than the procedure itself.
If you have any questions, you can email me
Good luck!
Daron
David
> odd thing though, in our area, they offered to tie her tubes @ birth.
> We both said no, as this was a more "major" procedure.
We did consider this option if the second child turned out to be another C
section, but as we changed hospitals at the last minute didn't have time to
arrange this. To be honest, I think waiting helped me to know that the
decision was one that wasn't made under any sort of pressure, so I'm glad it
worked out that way.
> Yet, 2
> urologists refused to do the vasectomy on me until the second child was
> 6 months old. Since I am a golf course superintendent, this would put
> the surgery in April or May for me, which is my busiest time. Both our
> children, we had in the "off season" purposly so I could spend as much
> post partum with them and her trying to help. I did find it odd that
> during the pro op vas check, 2 guys flat refused to do the surgery.
> Their reason was SIDS.
I've not heard of urologists refusing to do it on those grounds, but it's
not entirely without sense and reason. I waited 5 months after our son was
born before I got it done, as my wife wanted to wait until the SIDS window
was over. We call it "Cot death" over here in the UK.
> I am getting the usual ribbing from my friends at work and church,
> which, oddly I enjoy. Our youth director is going to go with me the day
> of as my wife has to work (she does the after school programming at
> church). The joke is the pets in our family are all "fixed" and now
> it's daddy's turn to get "tutored" (instead of nutered).....
Tee hee - I'll have to tell the kids I've been "tutored". I think the
response would be something rude along the lines of "About time too you
ignorant old git" - or something equally charming :(
>
> Lots of laughs at this point. I just hope I don't chicken out the last
> minute.
If you are happy with the decision, and sure you want to go ahead I really
don't think the last minute jitters will actually make you chicken out. You
clearly have thought this through, and discussed it thoroughly with your
wife (and others - which is good).
Keep us posted as to how things progress.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
4rest
support. I am feeling better already. You did yours yesterday...all ok
today? Any bleeding?
Luan
you would like someone to come from the other side of the fence and give
assurance that everything is going to be ok and that you will like the
outcome. I was in your shoes just 6 months ago. After many years of
having interest in this BC method I finally came to a situation where I
needed to decide. I relied on some close friends who I discuss intimate
things with. They assured me nothing changed in their sex life.
Everything worked just as well as before. I knew of risks concerning
infection and so on because I had some friends who were unlucky in this
part of the operation but my health is excellent and I heal fast and I
tolerate pain well. I have dental work done without Novocain if the
dentist will allow it. Of hundreds of his patients Pat Liedl, my
dentist, says I am alone in this ability. The actual vas operation was
nothing for me…. Less pain than a bee sting.
The problem with vasectomy is simply this: I know of no screening process
available that might sort out the men who may have problems from those who
will never regret having done it. Don’t expect the medical establishment
to provide anything like this as it is not in their financial interest at
this time. I think some answers to the important questions might be
lurking inside you. I hope someone will soon generate a list of
questions that might give a score which would translate into your risk
factor for either good outcome or risky result. I really think this might
be quite easy to do. If any questionnaire exists now I am unaware of it .
I have a little illustration you might like to try and use to estimate
your risk. First assume the possibility of serious regret is more than 1%
because I believe it is about 5 to 10% in reality.
Imagine a group of small boys. They have been given beautiful violins as
toys and as they grow they play with these violins pretty much daily.
There is no instruction or demonstration just play and invent uses for
the instruments. Many will discover that tones can be created by plucking
the strings. Some will use the fiddle as a drum tapping it with a stick.
Still others will put some pebbles inside and shake it like a rattle. All
combinations of sounds will be experimented with and all boys will think
they have mastered the instrument with their own methods. Very few will
be using the bow to vibrate the strings as it is tricky to use and nobody
else is doing it. Now the girls appear and they have beautiful violas
and cellos, but same as the boys they have had no instruction and know
little about making music. In less than one year babies appear, not much
musical ability is required to reproduce, we all know that. More babies
and more work everyone is busy and there is not much time for music or
practicing some of the tunes boys and girls might have learned together,
but they dream and plan for the future. One day information is circulated
that if the E-string is cut from the fiddle babies will stop appearing and
there is a mechanic down the street who does this for a small fee. The
boys say, “This is good to know. Maybe someday I should do this.” The
girls say, “ This is great to know and I think I’ll suggest it.” So one
by one many boys visit the mechanic and have the e-string removed. Some
boys say, “But honey I love my violin and I am not so sure I should alter
it, maybe some of the tunes I have learned will not play properly if I
remove the e-string.” Some girls say, “Honey I love your violin too but
the sounds you make with that e-string hurt my ears. I’m sure you can
play tunes without it.” The mechanic says, “Don’t worry I never had
anyone complain, everyone is happy.” – as he makes bank deposits.. Most
boys say, “Sure darling, I never used the e-string anyway and I have 3
other strings to pluck.” The boys who already had the e-string removed
say to the other boys, “No problem, everything is the same as before.” A
very few boys say, after visiting the mechanic, “This is a disaster, my
life is nearly ruined and my orgasms are changed for the worse.” The
boys who said everything is the same as before say, “There must be
something wrong with that boys head, he he he.
So if you are one who believes you are already making music with 4
strings or plans to explore this possibility in your future I suggest you
don’t alter your fiddle. If you know you are perfectly happy plucking one
or two strings or shaking your fiddle as a rattle then for sure you will be
happy to lose that terrible screeching e-string.
My biggest concern is this: As we age our sexual activity changes. I am
58 and from my early 40s to mid 50s the change in what I experience during
lovemaking surprised me. I never could have imagined that sex would bring
me to these new places. But to the casual observer nothing happened, I
still have sex about XX times a week as before. You may have heard 90% of
sex in the brain. But it is connections from the organs that feed the
sensations into the powerful centers that control so many body functions.
We are all different and quite a bit so. I know from talking to other men
that the spread of experience in sex is very wide!! Using advice for a
vasectomy decision from even close and trusted friends is not a good
idea. I made this mistake. Most doctors are no help. We need a
screening process to predict your possible success but we don’t have it to
my knowledge. I wish some people in this field would get off their lazy
asses and get to work on it!
David
> available that might sort out the men who may have problems from those who
> will never regret having done it. Don’t expect the medical establishment
> to provide anything like this as it is not in their financial interest at
> this time. I think some answers to the important questions might be
> lurking inside you. I hope someone will soon generate a list of
> questions that might give a score which would translate into your risk
> factor for either good outcome or risky result. I really think this might
> be quite easy to do. If any questionnaire exists now I am unaware of it .
I see where you are coming from, and appreciate what you are saying here.
However, I don't think it's as simple as having a questionaire that people
fill in, score over 80% and you get the vas, under and you don't. I think
the issues involved are certainly more complex.
It's an elective procedure. We, as patients/consumers have some say, and
some responsibility in the decision making process. Doctors also have rights
and responsibilities in the decision making process - people *do* sue them.
Most of medicine is governed by the general principles of the hippocratic
oath - doctors undertake to act in the best interests of the patient. This
is fine with fixing problems and curing diseases, but it doesn't really
cover elective procedures.
As far as I'm aware, the legal situation (certainly in the UK) is that when
performing an elective procedure, the doctor has to be sure in himself that
a jury of his peers would have made the same decision - IE the procedure was
in the best interests of the patient.
Doctors can, and do refuse to carry out the procedure if they feel it's not
in the best interests of the patients, or there is a chance that a jury of
his peers would not agree with the decision to proceed. How do you make that
decision?
Example 1:- 21 year old man requests vasectomy. The statistical likelihood
is that he will change his mind later on. Therefore it is likely he will be
refused for this reason. Most doctors will refuse unless there are extremely
compelling reasons to proceed. Even then, they probably would not take the
chance.
Example 2:- 45 year old man, two kids, no obvious conflict between husband
and wife on the issue. No reason to refuse the patient.
There are a *lot* of shades of grey in between.
The doctor *does* have a responsibility to the patient to inform him of
risks, ensure the patient understands them, and that the decision is well
thought through.
The patient *does* have a responsibility to listen, and heed the advice. But
do we???? The number of men who are told that they must submit samples and
not engage in unprotected sex until they are cleared, and ignore that advice
completely is astounding. There is a great deal of discussion (and has been
for a while) on what the best protocol is for getting as many men as
possible to comply.
It's probably also fair to say that if a doctor explains the risks, the
chances of the patient who has gone in there to demand a vasectomy actually
listening, or changing his mind is slim. How much of what the doctor tells
us do we absorb? Only what we choose usually.
We have the freedom to choose vasectomy, but with that freedom comes
responsibility for the ultimate decision.
So what can be done?
There are clear danger signs. the "Well connected" document on the website
links page has a good section on who is a good and a bad vasectomy
candidate. I've posted it here recently. The problem is to a greater extent
that counselling is often insufficient, and decisions are made in a rush.
We know that the better the counselling, and the longer men have to reach
the decision the more satisfied they are. I posted an Irish survey recently
that had a satisfaction rate of 99.7%. The men on average were in the older
age group, and had taken 22 months on average between the idea and the
procedure. Some states in the US have a minimum time between counselling and
the procedure. In the UK the NHS waiting list provides this function, and in
France there is a mandatory three month waiting period.
We know that counselling is patchy - some doctors will have a very informed
discussion with you, and some will just ask a few cursory questions. We also
know that all the prospective patient has is the memory of the conversation
with the doctor.
Probably the best way forward is to work on standardising the counsellling,
and include written information for the patient to take away and digest. In
the UK that's happening very soon. The guidelines for sterilisation have
been finalised, and are in the last stages of implementation.
Basically, the doctor is required to give standardised information
(including the fact that some men suffer long term pain), and the patient
will be given written information to take away. The patient leaflet is not
that good (I've seen it), but the information in full is available on the
website the leaflet mentions.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
Bruce L.
Although the injection hurt me pretty bad (felt like somebody squeezing
my nut) everything else was easy, even the days afterward. Felt good.
Until I had a blowout 6 days later. Following that I had the "squeezed
nut" feeling (chronic, not acute) for about 2 weeks. Then another 5
weeks of constant aches, discomfort and strange sensations, and always
wondering if it would ever go away. In the last 6 weeks I've felt pretty
good, although I still have discomfort for a few days from time to time.
The surgery and expected discomfort following it are not what I would
worry about or even think about. Any healthy person can tolerate
short-term pain.
Instead, think long-term, think of the unexpected. Think of how it
feels, after 40 years of nomal climaxes (I'm 54) to climax and then have
somebody squeeze your nut immediately afterward.
(And believe me, it's a great form of birth control because with that on
your mind, sex is not particularly appealing).
Could it be a long-term problem? It only happened to me once, but who
knows if it could happen again? The doctor doesn't even know.
Maybe in 6 months or a year from now I'll feel better about the whole
thing, assuming no more problems.
grea...@hotmail.com
4Rest:
As I sit here, still little to no pain. The snugness of the jock is the
only thing causing discomfort. My vas was just 24 years ago. I had
nsv, there was a band aid over the site, as I was changing pants last
night, it came off. Pretty cool to see the hole there where the uro
went in!! Anyway, I put a new one on. Just a little bleeding, I think
its pretty much stopped now. I havent changed it yet today. I am more
worried about pulling out what little hair I have left on my sac while
I replace the band aid, i may wait until it fall off itself!! I have
only had one dose of Tylenol 500mg today (that was this am). I am now
enjoying a cool lager!!! I have iced the area for a few hours today,
will ice more tonight.
All in all things are going really well, I hope things remain this
good.
Daron
David
> As I sit here, still little to no pain. The snugness of the jock is the
> only thing causing discomfort. My vas was just 24 years ago.
24 years and you are still wearing the jock??? Would I be right in thinking
there is a typo!
> I am now
> enjoying a cool lager!!! I have iced the area for a few hours today,
> will ice more tonight.
You could always store the near-frozen tinnies between your legs until they
get to drinking temperature :)
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
4rest
grea...@hotmail.com
you have "brain" surgery!! David, that is a great idea about storing
the cold brew there!!
Chillin with the peas!
Daron
Luan
>I see where you are coming from, and appreciate what you are saying here.
>However, I don't think it's as simple as having a questionnaire that
people
>fill in, score over 80% and you get the vas, under and you don't. I think
>the issues involved are certainly more complex.
I am speaking as a USA citizen where it seems the most likely attitude a
man encounters is that this problem of PVP is easier to “sweep under the
rug” than to address. I say “might be quite easy to do” because basically
all that needs doing is to listen to the men who come back with complaints
and want to tell of their problems. When I did this I was met immediately
with a memorized speech. Obviously nobody was interested in perfecting any
guideline to prevent future victims from suffering. It is easy to sit and
wait for individuals to come in and talk and they DO and they WILL. Record
information and began to organize and analyze it and I am sure some
profiles will emerge. But as often happens it is easier to shoot the
messenger than to read and record the message. PVP is a very well kept
secret and this has been accomplished primarily by denying it exists.
Shooting the messengers is a lazy mans way of avoiding work.
Luan
rest:
>Most of medicine is governed by the general principles of the Hippocratic
>oath - doctors undertake to act in the best interests of the patient.
This
>is fine with fixing problems and curing diseases, but it doesn't really
>cover elective procedures.
I have a question for you concerning this oath. How is it that doctors
can perform Circumcision where the patient (baby) never requests it and
always protests it and seldom is there a medical need. My Urologist
brother-in-law explained, even though he hated to do it and thought it
totally wrong he did it because he could not stop the parents, they would
simply go elsewhere, and at least he knew the best way to do it giving the
infant a better outcome. I wonder how many vasectomy doctors believe one
thing and do another??? The Vasectomy doctors obviously participate in
keeping secret the numbers of men who return with reports of problems. I
visited web sites like MayoClinic.com and a few others and read what they
had to say on vasectomy before going in for mine and there was no mention
of the common problems I am having. I also wrote to them saying it is
time to put some mention of complications on their site because at least
one man now has reported in with problems, but so far nothing. I also
gave my name and address so they might contact me for any research or
questions but I am not expecting that to happen. Might you reconsider
that American medicine is governed by something other than “the general
principles of the Hippocratic oath“ I think it is pretty obvious that
profit is the main concern of doctors… and unless there is profit in your
problem you have to wait till some organization or clever individual doctor
has figured out how to include you and your problem in the profit game.
Now when a man comes in and complains of pain and suffering from a
vasectomy and he is immediately given the speech that says this pain is
most likely not connected to the elective vasectomy procedure – why
doesn’t the Hippocratic Oath kick in again? Now he is just a sick man
with “unknown” causes but not so many doctors will take this case or get
serious about helping according to many reports. It seems to me the
Hippocratic Oath is mostly just a nice piece of poetry.
>We know that the better the counseling, and the longer men have to reach
>the decision the more satisfied they are. I posted an Irish survey
>recently that had a satisfaction rate of 99.7%. The men on average were
in the
>older age group, and had taken 22 months on average between the idea and
the
>procedure. Some states in the US have a minimum time between counseling
>and the procedure. In the UK the NHS waiting list provides this function,
and
>in France there is a mandatory three month waiting period.
I mostly blame myself for not knowing about the details of PVP before
hand. I did receive a brief but good session of the facts and questions
concerning my decision to be sterile. What I never knew was the
possibility of PVP problems. You cite a number 99.7%satisfaction… meaning
I am one is no more than 333 who has a problem bad enough to make him
regret his decision. I guess I better see what the satisfaction is about.
Even I with my problems and suffering as satisfied being sterile, so I
could be included in this one.
David
answer the points you raise in some form of logical pattern.
Firstly, I was under the impression you were advocating some sort of
screening test for men considering vasectomy in order to highlight those why
may be
susceptible to future problems:-
"I know of no screening process available that might sort out the men who
may have problems from those who will never regret having done it."
> I am speaking as a USA citizen where it seems the most likely attitude a
> man encounters is that this problem of PVP is easier to “sweep under the
> rug” than to address. PVP is a very well kept secret and this has been
> accomplished primarily by denying it exists.
This does read as though you believe that doctors are aware of problems, but
purposefully don't disclose information. The difficulty is that despite what
you may believe, pvp is rare and doctors simply don't have much experience
of it. Pvp is not a well defined syndrome - it even has a variety of names
because nobody can agree what to properly call it. In addition, it has
multiple deffinitions. Bearing in mind that many of the syptoms men present
with are in fact the symptoms of common urological complaints, doctors will
follow up those avenues first, and in the vast majority of cases treatment
will be successful. There does exist a small percentage (nobody has been
able to define this) of men that are not cured by conventional treatments.
I have in front of me three review articles on pvp published in recent
medical journals.
1, Chronic testicular pain: an overview. Granitsiosis & Kirk, European
Urology 2004
2, Testicular pain following vasectomy - a review of post vasectomy pain
syndrome. Chrisiansen & Sandlow Journal of Andrology 2003
3, Vasectomy surgical techniques. Labrequ et all Engenderhealth 2003
(discusses pvp)
Two out of the three were published in US journals, and all studies draw
predominantly on reseach done in the US. There are many others, but I just
happen to have these to hand.
There is a common misconception that men with a vasectomy are the only ones
to get chronic testicular pain - this simply is not the case. Whilst
discussing the incidence of chronic testicular pain, study 1 points out that
"the only statistical information we have regarding the prevalence of
chronic testicular pain is for the post vasectomy pain syndrome".
Schwingle/Guess (2000 onwards) points to a comparative study of ctp in
vasectomised men. In the first year the vasectomised men are more likely to
have pain, but after the first year the incidence is not that different. The
recommendation of the study was that further work be done to categorise the
risks, but it did point out the practical difficulties.
> I say “might be quite easy to do” because basically
> all that needs doing is to listen to the men who come back with complaints
> and want to tell of their problems. When I did this I was met immediately
> with a memorized speech. Obviously nobody was interested in perfecting
> any
> guideline to prevent future victims from suffering. It is easy to sit
> and
> wait for individuals to come in and talk and they DO and they WILL.
> Record
> information and began to organize and analyze it and I am sure some
> profiles will emerge.
Clearly there is work to be done - I would not suggest otherwise. However,
if you read the first two studies you will see that this has to some extent
been done over the years.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
David
> can perform Circumcision where the patient (baby) never requests it and
> always protests it and seldom is there a medical need. My Urologist
> brother-in-law explained, even though he hated to do it and thought it
> totally wrong he did it because he could not stop the parents, they would
> simply go elsewhere, and at least he knew the best way to do it giving the
> infant a better outcome.
Well, I'm with you on that one! I had a circumcision at age 37 for Phimosis.
The operation and recovery was unpleasant, and I preferred how it looked and
felt before. However, the pain was cured.
The hippocratic oath is a general principle, but very, very much flexed due
to the fact it was formed many generations ago, and doesn't have much
relevance to a lot of modern day medicine. I guess the argument in the case
of circumcision is that no matter what you feel about it, there isn't much
harm in it. The problem is that you have it done for religious and cultural
reasons, and stopping that particular
train isn't an easy task. I do believe the tide in the US is turning just
very slightly.
> The Vasectomy doctors obviously participate in keeping secret the numbers
> of men who return with reports of problems.
I'm never convinced by this argument. It sounds just a bit too much like a
conspiracy theory.
> I
> visited web sites like MayoClinic.com and a few others and read what they
> had to say on vasectomy before going in for mine and there was no mention
> of the common problems I am having.
I agree that the quality of information is lacking on many sites. I
particularly dislike the ones that fail to mention any problems at all. One
site I visited had the picture of a man holding a basketball, and grinning.
Apparently it was meant to show that you can participate in sports as normal
afterwards. I emailed the guy telling him it gave the impression that
vasectomy would result in one rather large, bright orange testicle and a
moronic grin. he didn't see the humour behind this.
Although some doctors websites are lacking, I just did an experiment. I did
a search on Google for the keyword vasectomy. As webmaster of one of the top
ten sites, I can assure you that this is how well over 95% of site visitors
get there. I pretended to be someone with no prior knowledge that had an
interest in finding out about complications. I looked at the top 10 sites,
specifically to see if they mentioned complications. After less than 5
minutes I was aware of the fact that PVP existed, I was aware that some men
have phsycological problems as a result of vasectomy, and I had a reasonable
picture of the general complications.
I don't consider that PVP is a "Well hidden secret", and I think the above
justifies that statement. If you do a search on vasectomy + complications
you get en even clearer picture.
Personally I'm hoping to increase awareness of potential complications using
my cyberspace presence. The original group website is in the top 10 on most
search engines, and I'm hoping I can use this to give the new website that
deals with vasectomy FAQ a bit of a boost. It will have a page detailing the
common problems, incidence and treatment options. It's on it's 100th
re-write at the moment as I can't quite decide on the look.
> Might you reconsider
> that American medicine is governed by something other than “the general
> principles of the Hippocratic oath“ I think it is pretty obvious that
> profit is the main concern of doctors… and unless there is profit in your
> problem you have to wait till some organization or clever individual
> doctor
> has figured out how to include you and your problem in the profit game.
I think that the above has an element of truth to it - yes. Some doctors are
more money motivated than others. I don't think it's a universal truth that
most doctors enter the profession with their eye solely on making megabucks.
After all, it's an area of high litigation. I think you have to believe in
what you are doing to enter medicine.
There is a particular element of the "keeping secret of statistics to
protect profits" argument that nobody has been able to answer. In the US,
the "Hard sell" is the normal way of doing business - you are subjected to
it all the time. If the argument were to have some truth in it, then you
would logically expect to see more procedures per head of population
performed in the US. This is not the case. The highest uptake of vasectomy
tends to be in countries where the procedure is performed by salaried
doctors. They gain nothing out of performing an increased number of the
procedures. In New Zealand the official statistics say that some 23% of men
have undergone vasectomy - as compared to the 12% in the US. The UK is not
that far behind NZ.
> Now when a man comes in and complains of pain and suffering from a
> vasectomy and he is immediately given the speech that says this pain is
> most likely not connected to the elective vasectomy procedure – why
> doesn’t the Hippocratic Oath kick in again?
I don't see that making the assumption that problems are automatically
caused by a procedure without investigation is covered by the Hippocratic
oath - it would be extremely bad practice. It's a doctors job to look at the
whole picture - and not just make assumptions. It's true that some men do
suffer conditions that are directly as a result of vasectomy, and it's also
true that a lot of the routine problems are also routine urological
complaints and not necessarily caused by the vasectomy.
I'd agree that they may well be stumped on occasions. But if we aren't happy
with what we hear, then there is the option of getting a second opinion, or
asking for a referral to a specialist.
> I mostly blame myself for not knowing about the details of PVP before
> hand. I did receive a brief but good session of the facts and questions
> concerning my decision to be sterile. What I never knew was the
> possibility of PVP problems.
I'm curious. In a previous post you described a condition relating to
painful ejaculations that you had learned to manage prior to vasectomy. Did
you discuss this with the doctor, and try to figure out how vasectomy might
affect it?
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
Luan
> hand. I did receive a brief but good session of the facts and
questions
> concerning my decision to be sterile. What I never knew was the
> possibility of PVP problems.
I'm curious. In a previous post you described a condition relating to
painful ejaculations that you had learned to manage prior to vasectomy.
Did
you discuss this with the doctor, and try to figure out how vasectomy
might
affect it?
David
Glad you brought this up as it was one reason I thought some simple but
clever questionaire might have saved me this misery. To be honest I never
thought a little pain was abnormal if sexual activity was too infrequent.
My Urologist brother-in-law told me the worst cases of prostate infection
and other chronic problems in this area came from celebate Priests he was
treating regularly. My good friend and neighbor also told me he had pain
related to "too little" sex activity just like me. I have had this
condition for about 30 years that I recall and never have I even seen a
Urologist doctor about anything except 3 bladder infections in my life.
The first 2 were brought on by dehhydration when I was in college. Once I
had a problem I did not understand and waited a few weeks till I saw my
brother-in-law. I explained the symptoms and he said it was a bladder
infection from my description. He sent a 6 week antibotic program
consisting of 3 different drugs with my sister the next day (samples) with
instructions. I did not want to take meds for 6 weeks, So I gave nature
one more chance with the meds for back-up. I drank lots of water and
cranberry juice and in a few days I was cured. I never told Him I didn't
take the medicine, about 2 years later I threw it away. That is over 25
years ago and no problems since. One item my neighbor and I compared was
the effect of cold. His "nuts' ache terrible when they get cold. (we live
in northern wisconsin and driving tractors without cabs in cold weather can
be a bone chiller) my experience is that the only part of my body that is
not sensitive to cold are my sex organs and they become handwarmers in
this situation!! He tells me of a family of boys, more neighbors, that
have insentive nuts and a kick in the balls doesn't even phase them so I
know we are all individuals pretty much. However, the pain I have now in
orgasm is nearly identical to the pain I became so good at managing for
many years. The problem now is that it will not go away. I had orgasm 7
times in the past 3 days with my wonderful G/F (I am amazed she still can
arouse me since I feel nearly nothing usually, that is, the pretty girls
of Bangkok that used to get plenty of my attention now go unnoticed)and
that should have cleared it but it either stays the same or gets worse.
Aside from the pain there is something totally missing in the orgasm.
Today I told someone "Before the vasectomy I was an accomplished chess
player, now I am an average checkers player." The orgasmic sensation does
not trigger my brain to react. The fuse burns but every time it is a dud.
It is like a stroke victim needing to relearn walking or talking, but this
pain I beleive will prevent any progress. This disconnect from my brain
was immediately noticed after the vasectomy (had sex next day). I will
consider a reversal if a doctor says it might restore my old system to
working order. If people with painfull ejaculations should be screened
out then I could have been saved some terrible on-going misery. In the
USA every year there are 500,000 vas preformed I read today, don't tell me
there are not plenty suffering as I am and enough to conduct some simple
research on. I guess it would take some law suits to wake up the sleeping
giant who likes business as usual. I am not blaming doctors that are
working with the people it is the organizations they work for that decide
how best to control the bottom line. They are the ones who have no
concern for the individual and ignore and cover-up to increase the
profits. Our system is terribly flawed when it comes to health care.
4rest
the traditional 2 cut and burn all 4 ends when done. He gave me an RX
for Lorazepam to take, one the night before, one when I get up, and
one when I get to the hosp 1 hour before surg. I almost asked him to
bump the procedure up. I want to get the damned thing over.
Anyone ever take Lorazepam? What's it like?
Bruce L.
Sometimes I have a racing heart, where it pounds so loud I can hear it, and
keeps me from falling asleep (stress) so I was prescribed Lorazepam. It is
similar to Valium ("diazepam"), although I don't recall getting as strong of
a "drugged" feeling like with Valium. It just calms things down, apparently.
It DOES make my heart go back to normal.
Although depending on dosage, you might get the relaxed, "who gives a shit"
feeling like with Valium.
"4rest" <for...@oakhillumcgroup.com> wrote in message
news:1108352289....@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
grea...@hotmail.com
I have not taken Lorazepam. Did have 5mg valium. Not sure it did
anything though. The anticipation is the worst part of a vas. I had
mine on Friday and have had little to no pain, no swelling etc. I feel
great today and am going to work as usual. Im not going to work out
until a week or so. Hang in there!!!
Daron
grea...@hotmail.com
I did not tale lorazepam, they gave me 5mg valium. I dont think it did
much. Just remember the anticipation of the procedure was worse than
the procedure itself. I had mine friday and things have been relativley
pain free all weekend. I am going back to work today and hope to be
back working out next week.
D.
4rest
have my normal doc give me another Rx for Loranzapan for this week
prior. My regular Dr. refused. I think I will be getting a new Dr. I
have never cared for his bedside manner and he is rough as hell. One
would think having male anatomy he would be a little gentler
french
local , I take some homeopathy . It worked very fine in my first surgery
. It 's Argentum Nitricum nad Hypericum Perforatum . Arnica Montana for
swelling .
I'm not worry now about things which may happen after the procedure but
during the procedure . The needle for local injection ,when he will
pull out the vas when he will do the stitches
Remember most people post here because they had problems and they are a
minority . Most have no problem and no pain or only some discomfort
during two to four weeks .
I completely agree with greatloop , the anticipation of the procedure is
worse than the procedure itself. I was afraid I don't wake up in my
first . A french politician had a big problem some years ago when he had
a general .
About your bedside manner, I think this will not be a problem . For me ,
it wasn't .
4rest a écrit :
Giraud
interesting sensation - it relaxes you, definitely. You feel kind of
"drugged," but you can still think and talk to people. I remember
sitting in a guy's office at work and chatting with him as it took
effect. I felt washed over with a sort of calm - it definitely took
away the "bouncing off the walls" anxiety.
4rest
evening; hopefully I can get a decent night's rest. Should be able to
get another rx for Lorazapan.....I just didn't want to take them and
NOT have them for the day of the surgery. If I can get through this I
am going to have a party.
Thanks,
Forrest
4rest
all I could think about was the grip on my righit side and the
shot...ouch. Couldn't eat and keep it down.....
4rest
bro) knew I was having problems. That helped. You have helped. God
Bless You
Forrest
4rest
evaluated my siuation and gave me 20 valium @ 5 mg each...told me to
use as I needed...Took 2 this evening and am really
nervous.....AAARRRGGGG..................Get this damned thing over with
Forrest
for...@oakhillumcgroup.com
4rest
tonight...
I don't need this shit
David
> DAMNED IT...Getting cold feet. Went to another Dr. Swithced dr's. She
> evaluated my siuation and gave me 20 valium @ 5 mg each...told me to
> use as I needed...Took 2 this evening and am really
> nervous.....AAARRRGGGG..................Get this damned thing over with
> Screw this...I am going to cancel tommorrow. Had a fight with my wife
> tonight...
> I don't need this shit
HEY - CALM DOWN WILLYA!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's probably the nerves that sparked the row with your wife. If you cancel
now, you will be a lot more nervous next time.
Before you make that call, take some time out alone. Go for a walk or
something. You need to work out if you really want to do this, and what the
alternatives are. Don't worry about the procedure - concentrate if you want
to have it done or not. I know - easier said than done.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
kdp
Whatever works for you and makes you happy !
Cheers,
//kdp
4rest
I feel like such a pussy
This site is such a help
Forrest
4rest
Forrest
David
> Thanks David....I want to have it done
OK - good luck with it then! Let us know how it all goes please.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
4rest
it's mind.
David, You have been a tremendous help
I'm ready and calm; sleeping well
Forrest
David
OK - that's good! Best of luck with it, and let us know how it goes.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
BoDiddley
before you know it. Afterwards, you will be thinking, "Why did I
stress myself out so much about this?, That wasn't bad at all"
That is how it was for me.
4rest
est
i REALLY Appreciate you guys
Forrest
grea...@hotmail.com
Good Luck tomorrow!!! You will be fine!! I had mine last friday and
things are pretty much back to normal. I had very minor swelling on
Monday (I drove a lot). No swelling yesterday or today. Tomorrow at
this time you can enjoy pain medication and a coctail :).
Let us know how it goes!
Daron
4rest
I intend to enjjoy all the pain meds they will give me. It is amazing
the number of friends I have who are quizzing me and want more infe. I
have pointed the ones with net access to this site. Their wives want
them to get "it" done. They want to know what it is like...so; if
nothing else, I will be able, as will the readers of this support
group, to ease some minds. THis is a great newsgroup
Thanks a zillion
I will post as soon as I am up to it tommorrow...
Forrest
4rest
be at the hospital at 630 so I had better get a move on. If I can get a
computer after, I will update.
Again, thanks to you all so much.
I feel good, relaxed and ready
As Captain Picard of the USS Enterprise would say "Engauge"
Forrest
trif...@netscape.net
Or even better, "Make it so."
Good luck. See you on the other side!
Giraud
luck anyway!!
4rest
I was supposed to get to the hospital at 6:30. Made it there by 645.
They took me back, drew some blood, and hooked up the IV's. The nursers
were great. Told me to get into my birthday suit, put the hospital gown
on, and lie back down.
Wheeled me into the holding area. I am feeling fine...(the drugs), but
not "doped".
The surgeon checked me and looked at the site. I was in a dead sleep.
Said "What is your name?" I told him Forrest Smith. He said "and what
are we doing this morning? I told him "penis enlargement, dr". The
whole place howeled. Then I told him the truth, "Vasectomy"...he
smiled. Got the IV's going now, the D5W and valium, plus the pain
killer which I can't remember what they told me it was. I kept falling
asleep. They freaked when they tried to wake me. Thought I had passed
out. My wife & 2 month old are still with me and she reminded them I
sleep deep.
Ed, one of my nurses came bace and said "we have to shave you and put
some iodine on you"...Checked the package and since I had already done
some trimming, skipped the shave. Buttered my scrotum and penis up like
a thanksgiving roll.
Tramsferred from the holding bed to the operating table. Straped my
legs and arms to the table. I was super calm. Told me to relax. I told
them easy for you to say...but I was really relaxed. (10 mg valium and
1 mg loranzapam plus the IV drip of valium, pain killer, and sedation
going).
He started on my right side. I felt him take my right testicle in his
hand and locate the vas. He said "this is going to hurt; I am going to
inject the local" I am thinnking to myself...OK here it somes. IT WAS
NOTHING. Very little discomfort with the numbing. Then he went to town.
Left side done in 15 mmintes. He was taking his time and a nurse named
Cindy was talking to me. Giving me play by play. I asked to watch. Dr
yould not let me. Cindy was there talking to me, so it was fine..On to
the left side.
My left hangs lower. He began to locate and numb, no problem, then he
began to cut. I almost came off the table...Cindy told him to stop and
give me more local, which he did, also injected something into the IV.
Left side took about 20-25 minutes and the cuts are almost on the
bottom left of the scrotum. All the time, I am alert and totally aware
of what is going on. Cindy giving me the play by play...Thegs. left cut
is almost on the bottom of the scrotum. I think it is just the way the
testicle han
"OK, you're done"...The nurse (Ed) helped me fit into a suspensory,
which I have never seen. Like a jock but the penis hangs out. I ask how
long the numing will last. THey tell me 2 hrs. OK....Total surgery
time- Began at 850 and out at 10 am, I checked out the 2 specimens they
cut out. "That's your vas" Ed said...No more babied for you bu
I feel great now. Been alseep on the couch all afternoon. Took 1
hydrocodone/app 1000 mg. But this was just because of the discomfort on
the left side. NO PAIN on the right side. I feel like such a baby! All
the worry and panic over nothing. I credit my lack of pain to my
skilled surgeon and the team at Raleigh Memorial Hospital, plus you
guys here on this board.
Just checked the package and site. Some blood and NO swelling. I am
going to stay in my back for a coupe of days, then do what I can.
Keeping the ice packs changed and fresh.
I cannot thank you members of this site enough. I was ready to throw a
fit and cancell. Sorry, that's the "MAN' in me. I am sure glad I did
this...
Many thanks to you all & God bless you....
I will keep you posted...
Got any questions? JUst ask
Forrest
Giraud
grea...@hotmail.com
shirt somewhere on the net that said "Vasectomy...All Juice..No Seeds"
it had a \\pic of 2 oranges on it!!
Have a great weekend relaxing.
Daron
David
Thanks for letting us know how it went, and I'm really glad that you got
through this!
I'd like to post the story to the website if that's OK, but how I'd like to
do it is to cut and paste sections of your earlier posts into a sort of
diary of the days beforehand. I think what you have already posted here
shows just how nervous you were, and a diary of your thoughts at the time
would show that off to best effect. Besides - it saves typing! If you are
happy with the idea, I'd like to assemble it, and add the bit below.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
"4rest" <for...@oakhillumcgroup.com> wrote in message
news:1108762234.4...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
4rest
Sure, go ahead. I have posted it a couple of times. YOU really helped
me (David), especially the night I got super paniced and wrote
something like "I 'm calling it off".
It is now 700AM 2/19/5 EST. Been keeping down and iced. No swelling,
the left lower side of the testicle IS tender to the touch, but not bad
at all. Pain raing 1 to 10 scale...MAYBE, MAYBE a 1.5
Forrest
David
> Sure, go ahead.
Thanks for that - I'll cobble it together over the weekend and post here to
let you know. Then you can check it's what you want.
> I have posted it a couple of times. YOU really helped
> me (David), especially the night I got super paniced and wrote
> something like "I 'm calling it off".
All I did was shout at you!!!! I do that to the kids all the time, and they
NEVER say thank you :(
>
> It is now 700AM 2/19/5 EST. Been keeping down and iced. No swelling,
> the left lower side of the testicle IS tender to the touch, but not bad
> at all. Pain raing 1 to 10 scale...MAYBE, MAYBE a 1.5
That's good to hear.
--
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
4rest
the surgery STRICTLY in place.
On a humorous note, they kept asking me my "name" & "what I was here
for" in the hospital. At one point I told one of the male nurses my
name and I was here for penis enlargement, not vasectomy.
I don't clearly remember doing that, but my wife does...she laughed..
You gotta have faith and smile....
Forrest
David
> Sure, go ahead. I have posted it a couple of times.
OK - it's on the website. Please have a look at it to make sure it's OK.
--
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
4rest
A thing that has helped, even though I feel fine..I am almost no pain
(1-10 being a 0.5) I have kept iced and lifted NOTHING. I feel like I
can do anything, but I know; if I do, strain those delicate chords.
They myst heal. I also used to do Karate. I have a cup w/ supporter. I
have been wearing the supporter with the ice packs in the pouch where
the cup goes. I have done this continually since the surgery, 27 hours
ago.
Guys, I feel fine. I was all worked up over nothing.
I looked at the site this morning, no swelling, no bruising. He did use
silk stitched. I have to go back 2/25/5 and get them out. I have been
stitched several times, (for other injuries) and I don't think that
will be a big deal. I looked at Dave's site; thanks for adding my
story. I will continue to update here and then let you know how my 30
day semenalysis goes. I have seen where you have to do 10-20
ejaculations, but my Dr. wants me to come back on 3/18 and give them a
sample. I sure hope I don't have to "fill the cup"...we could be there
awhile...
Hey, I had to throw in a joke! I feel GREAT!!!
I won't say the name of the hospital, but they did a teriffic job
there. My wife had our baby there in December and I was impressed then
and am really impressed now. I will have to write them a thank-you.
Also, cheers to David
Forrest
4rest
Doing nothing but keeping on the icepacks. I feel great.
Doctor tells me to keep doing what I am doing for a good recovery. Not
lifting (except the baby), not worrying.....just chillin
Pain factor on a 1 to 10
0.25
Thank You God!
Forrest
french
GO on doing nothing even if you fell fine . at Day + 2 , I walked a
little and I live in a house with two floors , I must get up and down
stairs . I think I doesn't rest enough and friday swelling began and
pain increased . Not too much , but I have blue skin at the incision
site and the penis base ( I am not sure it's good word in english ) .
Now , swelling decrease and I use ice but I have still a big discomfort
like my right testes weigh three pounds .
Now , I am at Day+5 , for my first surgery , I could ride my bike . Now
, I can walk but It's very unconfortable .
I'm sure on one thing , I will never go for a third surgery even I'm not
all clear .
herve
4rest a écrit :
trif...@netscape.net
>I have blue skin at the incision
> site and the penis base ( I am not sure it's good word in english ) .
That is perfectly expressed!
> Now , swelling decrease and I use ice but I have still a big
discomfort
> like my right testes weigh three pounds .
Tres impressionant!
> Now , I am at Day+5 , for my first surgery , I could ride my bike .
Now
> , I can walk but It's very unconfortable .
Il faut porter un "slip" assez collant comme on porte pour faire du
sport. (Ici on l'appelle un "athletic supporter.") Ca m'a fait du
bien pendant deux semaines apres la vasectomie, *sourtout" en montant
des escaliers!
>
> I'm sure on one thing , I will never go for a third surgery even I'm
not
> all clear .
Une bonne decision!
trifold
www.vasectomy-information.com
4rest
A follow up on things. Had my one week post-op checkup. Doctor said all
looked good. Some swelling in testicles, he said it should go away in a
minth; no pain.
Got my little specimen container. Gotta bring it back in a month too.
Going well
Hopefully will get the all clear then
4rest
David
liberty of using this to update the website.
--
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
"4rest" <for...@oakhillumcgroup.com> wrote in message
news:1109370758.6...@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
trif...@netscape.net
So if one sample is clear after a month, you get the all clear? I had
to give two clear samples. Anyway, have fun!
4rest
go..I hope they know what they are telling me...
Anyhow, got the instructions and kit....should be interesting. I have
to have the sample to the lab within 40 minuted of collection and keep
at body temperature...
Oh well...
4rest
trif...@netscape.net
There are instructions somewhere at the website. lol. One bit of
advice there is to do it lying down, with the cup "pre-positioned."
That way there is no awkward bending downward of . . .ermmm. .
."things". . .at the critical moment. (I wish I had thought of this!)
If you plan your partner "assisting,' I'd definitely practice a few
times--timing is critical. (Besides, it's fun!)
After sealing the jar well (!), you can keep it warm by carrying it in
your shirt pocket. Re: two samples or one: Different doctors seem to
have different views of how many is enough, how long after. Again,
David has some good stuff on this at the website. Mine wanted 2 clear
samples, one about 4 weeks after, the other 2 weeks after that. I
guess if you're nervous about it, you could always ask for a second
reading. Here's hoping for a quick "all clear."
Bruce L.
before, just be sure to refrigerate. Whether the sperm are alive or dead
doesn't really matter if you're testing for sterility -- what matters is
if there ARE ANY sperm.
trif...@netscape.net
> My instruction sheet said the sample could be collected the night
> before, just be sure to refrigerate. Whether the sperm are alive or
dead
> doesn't really matter if you're testing for sterility -- what matters
is
> if there ARE ANY sperm.
I expect some doctors would be willing to declare a man sterile if the
sample only showed dead sperm and if it was really fresh. If it was
stored overnight, they would have to assume any dead sperm came out
kicking but died during the night. Under these conditions, it would
not be prudent to give the all clear. Since 4rest's doc. wants his goo
within 40 minutes, I'm guessing he will be looking for live ones. (At
least he doesn't want to see it within minutes, which could create
logistical challenges!)
4rest
semenalysis today. One month post; no sperm present. All is well and I
am "shooting blanks"..
Yay
Thanks to all!
Forrest
David
> Well, I guess this is the end of the road for me. I had my first
> semenalysis today. One month post; no sperm present. All is well and I
> am "shooting blanks"..
Thanks for getting back to us with the update. Glad to know it's going well.
I will add the update to your story on the website later tonight or
tomorrow.
--
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org