3 weeks and still in pain help!
Doug
keeps having miscarriages and we decided we are done having kids anyway. So
I thought I would do the right thing and get a vas and not make my wife go
through the trouble of getting her tubes tied. At 3 weeks post we are now
thinking I made a big mistake.
The day of my vas it was near 0 outside and I was the first one of the day
at 8 am. So you guessed it the boys we way high and inside and being naked
in a cold Dr. office did not help them drop. The doc come in and takes a
look and says them guys need to come down for me to do this. I am just about
to say man it's cold in here what do you expect and he grabs hold and starts
to pull them down. I almost jumped off the table in fact the nurse had to
hold me down. Within a few sec he had numbed my testicals and I no longer
felt the pain. I think he missed at one point because I felt this warm
feeling go into my penis and then that went numb. At that point I thought to
myself that I made a big mistake because this was to rough in a tender area.
Within 20 min he was done both sides and I was on my way.
I kept it all iced that day and the next and had very little swelling but
lots of pain. Now because the Dr told me I could go back to work on the 19th
I did because I did not have a note to stay out. It was a bad move I was
still in pain and did not feel well at all. I went home and called the Dr
and he gave me a note to stay out. On the 20th I noticed a lot of bruising
and overall I was very sore and in pain. I noticed my right testical was way
up inside and not dropping. I have been back to the Dr 4 time since the vas
and he keeps saying everything is fine just wait it will hear and be fine.
Problem is he is the same guy who told me I would be fine to go to work in a
few days and I was far from that. I did get a small infection in the
incision and believe it or not the last stitch just fell out a few days ago.
The incision is still oozing very very little it is almost fully healed. It
took almost 2 weeks for the scab to fall off. Overall the incision looks
good now but you can still see 2 of the 4 small holes from the stitches.
Here is my question.
It's been 3 weeks and overall I have slowly improved but only to a point. I
have felt about the same for the past 5 day with no farther improvement.
Right now, I get on and off aches and pains in the testicals and the general
area including my legs and lower abdomen. Here is the big one pain best I
can describe it. Both my testicals ache, maybe can be described as burning,
or even pain from pressure, maybe like blue balls. The pain is most intense
where your testicals touch a chair when you sit (in the rear). I have had
this from about the 2nd day and it is not changing or improving. The Dr days
it should get better and he wont conceder pain a problem until it has gone
over a month. Well I am getting close and I still have the pain. I have been
taking Bextra for any inflammation and have other pain meds but nothing get
rid of the pain. Did I ruin my life.
Can anyone give me some advice this pain is 24/7 and driving me nuts, I am
getting worried.
My poor wife is so upset (and so am I but trying not to show it) with this.
We did not do enough research and if we had, we may not have did this. She
feels very bad because this was supposed to be a nice thing I was doing for
the both of us. Long term pain was not our idea of birth control.
Thanks,
Doug
Bruce L.
difference.
I wore one for 7 weeks, suffering through various levels of
pain/ache/discomfort/extreme tenderness. I don't think I could have
worked without it, and even sometimes in the evening I wore it when
sitting or laying down.
I've felt good for 5 weeks now, and I hope this is all behind me. I
totally understand your frustration -- it is VERY depressing. Ibuprofen
will also help, although I took too many and had stomach problems
because of it.
Doug
help less then it did at first but I am still wearing it. The pain I have
the most of is in the back end of my testicals it is always there no matter
if I have the supporter or not. It almost is like a burning pressure pain
that just wont go away. I was taking the Ibuprofen (did nothing for this
pain that is driving me nuts) but switched to the Bextra. Bextra is an NSAID
that you take once a day and it works the same as Ibuprofen without the
stomach problems.
Like right now my right testical is very very tender, aches a bit, but this
other pain in the back is the real killer pain. If you were to sit on
something flat the part of your scrotum that touches the thing you are
sitting on is right where the pain is. Best I can say is the rear of the
testicals very frustrating. Looks like you are saying that I have several
more weeks of pain and discomfort to look forward to and then if I am one of
the lucky ones it will all go away.
I think the Dr should have given me more discloser of the possible problems.
He made is sound like it was like getting a tooth filled and said he himself
had it done years ago and is fine. I guess he was a good salesman.
"Bruce L." <bra...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1aSdnQYtuv7...@usadatanet.net...
Bruce L.
> Thanks Bruce I am wearing the supported and it helps. The supporter seems to
> help less then it did at first but I am still wearing it. The pain I have
> the most of is in the back end of my testicals it is always there no matter
> if I have the supporter or not. It almost is like a burning pressure pain
> that just wont go away. I was taking the Ibuprofen (did nothing for this
> pain that is driving me nuts) but switched to the Bextra. Bextra is an NSAID
> that you take once a day and it works the same as Ibuprofen without the
> stomach problems.
There are plenty of people here that know a lot more about this than I
do, and I will gladly stand corrected if need be.
I think the epididymus is on the back side of the testicle, and from
what I have learned in the last 3 months, I would guess that it is the
source of your pain. I will also guess that it is pressure from sperm
build up, now that the vas is blocked. This is supposedly "normal,"
although apparently people have widely varying reactions to this, from a
rupturing of the epi, "a blowout," (as I had) to no noticeable change at
all.
> I think the Dr should have given me more discloser of the possible problems.
> He made is sound like it was like getting a tooth filled and said he himself
> had it done years ago and is fine. I guess he was a good salesman.
I ABSOLUTELY AGREE. My family doctor had a vas done by the doc he
referred me to, and to be honest, I don't think he even KNEW about any
of this stuff we're talking about, because he, and most men, have little
pain after the first few days.
But the vas doctor knows all about it, and he never mentioned ANYTHING
about it BEFORE he cut me. Was I angry about that? Very much so.
Doug
epididymus does look like it is on the backside right where I feel the pain.
Tonight it is getting worse I have real bad pain, it feels like my balls are
ready to explode. What did I do to myself I took a 100% working pain free
part of my body and turned it into a pain infested part that still works if
you can stand the pain. I am taking a few classes and I cannot function to
do my work. This pain is constant and I cannot concentrate on my work,
schoolwork, or anything for that matter, it wakes me up a night. If I take
the narc pain meds then I cannot drive plus they make me very sleepy and I
don't want to do anything. If this is pressure pain how long does it last
and will it go away. We were very active before the vac so I am sure things
were are full capacity. I will say I did not search the net (big mistake)
but I did ask my Dr and several others that had vas's and was told this is
no big deal a few days and you are good to go.
"Bruce L." <bra...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:j5mdndSYf4I...@usadatanet.net...
Bruce L.
> Thanks Bruce I think you may be right because I looked up a picture and the
> epididymus does look like it is on the backside right where I feel the pain.
> Tonight it is getting worse I have real bad pain, it feels like my balls are
> ready to explode. What did I do to myself I took a 100% working pain free
> part of my body and turned it into a pain infested part that still works if
> you can stand the pain. I am taking a few classes and I cannot function to
> do my work. This pain is constant and I cannot concentrate on my work,
> schoolwork, or anything for that matter, it wakes me up a night. If I take
> the narc pain meds then I cannot drive plus they make me very sleepy and I
> don't want to do anything. If this is pressure pain how long does it last
> and will it go away. We were very active before the vac so I am sure things
> were are full capacity. I will say I did not search the net (big mistake)
> but I did ask my Dr and several others that had vas's and was told this is
> no big deal a few days and you are good to go.
Doug: Hopefully David (he runs the website, I think) will check in here,
read your post and give some good advice. When I was in pain, he
explained to me what a "blowout" was, and then at least knowing what was
going on was some comfort to me. I'm *guessing* that your epis are
adjusting to the retained sperm, and will get better in time.
Seems to me you should go back to the doctor, and if he won't help you,
find someone who will.
I was sorry I didn't find vasectomy-information.com BEFORE I got cut. I
did go to a few medical sites first and read what they said about
vasectomies, and it was just routine, generic information, nothing about
possible complications. Then, after the problem, for several weeks I was
VERY sorry I had it done. Whether I was, or would become sterile, was
the farthest thing from my mind.
Now, after 4-5 weeks of being more or less (98%?) normal, I'm neutral,
although that could change if I have problems in the future.
However, I am NOT neutral about the lack of information that vas doctors
give you beforehand. If you read some of these threads about
post-vasectomy pain, you will find that there is not a whole lot of
information about it that is known by the medical community in general,
or at least very little that they want to talk about. My family doctor,
who I guess to be in his early 40s, was unaware of what "blowouts"
were.
Here is some of what David wrote regarding the epi, and maybe applies to
you: (DAVID -- WHERE ARE YOU??) When I read this, it was somewhat
comforting to find that at least SOMEBODY out there knew what was going
on.
QUOTE: "Now in the case of vasectomised men, the blockage is permanent.
At some point, the body realises this, and another defence mechanism
kicks in. In non-vasectomised men, approx. 50% of the sperm produced
never make it out of the epididymus. What happens is that the sperm
degrade within the epididymus, and the fluid part leaves the epididymus
via a membrane and passes into the bloodstream to be disposed of
elsewhere in the body, with the solids being broken down by Macrophages
(cell eaters) and ultimately being absorbed into the bloodstream as
well.
In vasectomised men, the defence mechanism is that the membranes
quadruple in size to absorb the increased fluid, and more Macrophages
are recruited from the bloodstream to break down the solids. At some
point, an equilibrium is reached, and all of what is produced is
re-absorbed.
Granulomas are a temporary measure to protect the testicle before the
second defence mechanism kicks in. Sperm granulomas are actually
perfectly common in vasectomised men - 60% of us will get them, but most
have no symptoms. Some granulomas are painful, and the main way to deal
with them is allow the body time to re-adjust to its new state, hence no
rush to consider surgical options. In the case of the open-ended
procedure, 98% of men have granulomas, but the statistics indicate fewer
long term problems overall.
If what you have is a granuloma, then it can be confirmed by ultrasound.
The main treatment option is to allow the body time, and treat with
antibiotics/pain killers if necesary. If they don't dissapear of their
own accord (usually within 6 months or so) then there are surgical
options available.
I would say that although it sounds like a granuloma, it's not a
certainty. Therefore you need to work with your doctor, and if he's not
able to help then get a referral to a specialist." END QUOTE
David
Sorry - the kids have been ill all week, and I've not been checking in much.
Reading through the thread it seems that you haven't contacted a doctor
about this - am I reading correctly??
From the description you have given, and the discussion between you and
Bruce it may well be that you have epididymitis. It's characterised as a
dull ache where you describe.
I think you should go back to your doctor to get this checked out. If it is
epididymitis then it can be treated with antibiotics.
> However, I am NOT neutral about the lack of information that vas doctors
> give you beforehand. If you read some of these threads about
> post-vasectomy pain, you will find that there is not a whole lot of
> information about it that is known by the medical community in general,
> or at least very little that they want to talk about. My family doctor,
> who I guess to be in his early 40s, was unaware of what "blowouts"
> were.
Disclosure is an interesting topic - what exactly should doctors tell you???
Should they just say that most people have no problems, or should they give
you a list of every medical condition that has been studied to see if there
is a connection with vasectomy (positive or not) no matter how irrelevant
the information actually is?
Somewhere along the line is a happy medium. There are quite a few studies
that suggest doctors warn that there is the possibility of lingering pain
afterwards, but the difficulty for doctors is that there are no reliable
statistics to quote when the patient asks "How often does it happen"? I
guess they would fall back on their personal experience which may be that
they haven't had a case yet.
Unfortunately counselling is notoriously patchy, with no official guideline
as to what should, or shouldn't be included in the session. Personally I
think the new UK guidelines are a movement in the right direction. They have
spent a lot of time analysing all the evidence into what they term an
"Evidence based guideline". The document is available online in three
flavours -
"Lite" very basic leaflet with a few pictures
"Medium" Most of the information in full but without the data tables
"Full" Complete guideline pluss all the evidence tables
The full document discusses all the conditions that have been investigated,
and makes judgement and recommendations based on the evidence. However, I
personally think that the "Safety and effectiveness" and "Well connected"
documents available on the website are written better.
For our bit, I have been working on a new version of the website FAQ. It's
got a bit wordy over the years it's been online and growing. I decided to
split it into sections, and trim it down a bit to make it easier to read.
I'm still working on the site, but I'm hoping it will help. There is a page
specifically on risks that I still have quite a bit of work to do on. I'm
listing all the most likely complications, their incidence from a variety of
sources, and treatment options.
The new version of the faq is at www.vasectomy-faq.org - comments welcome,
but be aware it's still under construction.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
Doug
pain and called him 2 times on the phone. I also plan to call him again
today and see what he has to say. But he keeps saying everything looks ok
give it some time take the Bexta (NSAID) wear briefs and rest if you can.
Easy for him to say it's not his balls in pain not his life or his job that
is effected.
Thanks,
Doug
"David" <david...@tesco.net> wrote in message
news:foENd.46$JG1...@newsfe2-win.ntli.net...
Doug
examined me and said nothing is wrong, no swelling, no lumps, nothing all
looks good. I said ok then why am I in pain? He said most likely post opt
inflammation or maybe an infection. So he said keep taking the Bextra and he
gave me a week of Levaquin as an antibiotic. He said I can double up on the
Bextra for a week if I want to and also I can take other pain meds like
Tylenol if I don't want to take the narc stuff. I asked him if he had any
problems with my procedure and he said it was uneventful no problems he
found everything just where is should have been and nothing was done out of
the ordinary. He went on to say he does 100's of vas's and I will be fine. I
said but I thought you said I would be fine in a few days. He said well on
average it is more like 2 weeks so you are just a little over normal but not
at the high end yet. He said he hope I will be much better in one week if
not I am to call him right away to let him know.
What do you think?
"Doug" <cloak-v...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:hFINd.7967$5x1....@fe08.lga...
trif...@netscape.net
Hi Doug,
I'm sorry for the trouble you're having.
> OK I called the Dr and he said to come in and I did. I just got back
and he
> examined me and said nothing is wrong, no swelling, no lumps, nothing
all
> looks good. I said ok then why am I in pain? He said most likely post
opt
> inflammation or maybe an infection. So he said keep taking the Bextra
and he
> gave me a week of Levaquin as an antibiotic.
It's good he's given you some antibiotics, just in case you do have
infection.
>He said he hope I will be much better in one week if
> not I am to call him right away to let him know.
>
> What do you think?
Well, at this point, I'd say wait another week, then go see him. It
sounds as if he does have a plan in case the pain persists. But if you
don't like what you hear, then definitely seek out another doctor, at
least for a "second opinion." (This happens all the time, and doctors
don't take offense when patients ask.)
My own view is that your doctor's approach to "bringing those guys
down" in the cold office (as you lay naked on the table) might have
contributed to your difficult recovery--also maybe going back to work
a little too early (his fault, not yours). But I suspect your system
is just taking a little longer to adjust to the reabsorption of the
sperm. If it is any consolation, the standard definition of true pvp
seems to be pain that lasts more than 3 months after. So you are not
there yet (I know if your balls are hurting, this won't make them
better!). By the way, have you told us which version of vasectomy you
had? Do you know whether both tube ends were sealed on each side
(closed ended version), or if the testicle ends were left open (the
"open ended" version)? I'm asking because if you had the open ended,
then maybe you are having a reaction to sperm antibodies, which could
conceivably form this early after an open ended version. If you had
the closed ended version, which is more common, then one possible
explanation is that your epi. are experiencing backpressure. This will
probably resolve, as your doctor and David suggest. But if it doesn't,
one possible strategy would be for them to go back in (preferably this
time in a WARM office) and simply reopen the vas tubes at the testicle
ends. (Of course, only a doctor would know for sure whether this would
make sense in your case. But we have heard here of this working in
some cases of chronic scrotal pain after vasectomy.)
Keep us posted!
trifold
Steve
never! ;^) , but would offer a point of clarification:
"From the description you have given, and the discussion between you
and
Bruce it may well be that you have epididymitis. It's characterised as
a
dull ache where you describe.
I think you should go back to your doctor to get this checked out. If
it is
epididymitis then it can be treated with antibiotics."
I agree with David - you should go back to the doctor. If you have
epididymitis, you should receive a round of antibiotics. Antibiotics
will certainly help with bacterial epididymitis - but if you're
experiencing congestive epididymitis, as I did after my vas, you'll
find that antibiotics have no effect. You should get the round of
antibiotics to cure/rule out bacterial epididymitis. If it's
congestive epididymitis, the swelling and pain is related to the fact
that the testicles haven't slowed down in their production, and your
body isn't absorbing the sperm quickly enough. There are no good
solutions here.... I found that prescription anti-inflammatories
helped - but didn't make the pain go away.....mine only went away after
I started testerone therapy treatment, which temporarily shut down
sperm production. Hopefully this isn't your problem....
I hope you're better!
Steve
yabig23
I know exactly what you're going through, physically and emotionally
and wanted to offer both my support and some advice. Based on what
you've written you may or may not be in for a long ride but also know
that life can and may return to normal one day, as it has for me. Like
Steve I ultimately had relief from a reversal but for different
reasons. For others time was all that was required to heal. My story is
up at http://turkey.jbcc.com/misc/pvpdiary.pdf if you want the details.
I'll go out on a limb here and say that It sounds like the uro that did
your vas is not the right person to help work through the available
options and you should find someone that is more of a problem solver
than a technician and has seen these type of cases before. A few
comments/questions:
1) Did you have an open or closed ended vasectomy?
2) Be careful with antinflamatories. Long term use of Bextra, etc has
been getting a lot bad press and it may only offer limited relief. Even
ibuprofen is dangerous with extended use. Ice packs (the soft kind that
comes wrapped in cloth) became my best friend and in looking back did
as good a job as anything else.
3) Antibiotics is a very good place to start, and should be taken for
at least 4 weeks from what I've heard. If that doesn't work I'd be very
skeptical of other medicines you may be prescribed as I never found any
that did more than give me side effects. Pain pills (vicodin, tylox)
helped a little but can't be taken regularly for obvious reasons. I
used to give the prescriptions to my wife to hold onto just to make
sure I had someone else watching intake, because the pain was so bad I
probably would have taken them every day if left to my own devices.
3) Even after seeing a doctor I suspect there's not much that you can
(or should do) for the next few months but wait it out. There's a good
chance that the pain will subside by itself but it could take a while.
That part of the body heals slowly, at least it did for me.
4) If it stops improving and levels off you may want to consider the
Testosterone therapy that Steve refers to which may help with the pain
short term and also help diagnose whether additional surgery may offer
relief. But I wouldn't even consider it for another 6 months.
5) I had the same "back of the testicles" pain when sitting that you
describe and found a suspensory really helped me get back to work
again. Unlike a supporter it works by supporting the testicles when you
sit down so there's no pressure underneath. There are a bunch of
different models but I found this one worked the best
http://internationaljock.com/zpage13-8507.html
I don't want to alarm you but also can tell you want some realistic
expectations if it becomes a worse-case scenario. Even if it does it's
important you know there are roads back from "the abyss".
Bruce L.
> > However, I am NOT neutral about the lack of information that vas doctors
> > give you beforehand. If you read some of these threads about
> > post-vasectomy pain, you will find that there is not a whole lot of
> > information about it that is known by the medical community in general,
> > or at least very little that they want to talk about. My family doctor,
> > who I guess to be in his early 40s, was unaware of what "blowouts"
> > were.
David replied:
> Disclosure is an interesting topic - what exactly should doctors tell you???
> Should they just say that most people have no problems, or should they give
> you a list of every medical condition that has been studied to see if there
> is a connection with vasectomy (positive or not) no matter how irrelevant
> the information actually is?
I don't know what the answer is. But by doctors not saying anything,
people like me get the impression that it is a simple snip snip, and the
only "risk" is from possible infection at the incision. This *IS* what I
thought, and I bet most other men think the same thing.
When I called my v-doc after I had my blowout, he was discussing options
on the phone, and one of them was to remove my testicle! That was the
WRONG thing to say to me, or I suspect, any other man. Why he would even
SAY anything like that, 2 days after the blowout, and not even have
examined me yet, is incomprehensible to me.
Doug
had problems and there are things that can be done to help me.
I know I have options but something extreme like removal scares the death
out of me. Even another procedure is scary in a way knowing all the pain. I
hope it never comes to something like that for anyone. But as you all know I
like many I thought just a simple snip, few days and good to go no problem,
yea right.
I guess for now at only 3 weeks I need to wait and see what time brings.
Maybe if all goes well it will clear up and go away. If not I can see a long
road ahead.
For now I will take the NSAID and the antibiotics and see what one week
brings me.
BTW I had the both ends closed vas so I am hoping this is just back pressure
and I am hoping that goes away soon with no blow outs.
I still think this is way more serious then any Dr lets on that it is. I
know I would not have jumped at the vas so fast if I had any idea. I would
have at the least went on the hottest day of the year when the boys were
low.
Tonight it is a bit better but I am on double NSAID and the antibiotic. We
will see what each day brings and then if its better next week I will drop
the NSAID to std dose and see what happens.
The info on the suspensorie that Adam posted looks like a good idea.
Thanks again for everyones post,
Doug
Steve
first time (saw 4 in 2.5 yrs). My interpretation of this is that it's
a first line of defense - let's see if he's really serious about this,
or just whining. If he's just whining, I'll scare him away by
mentioning testicle removal....it was almost verbatim from all 4 - I
came to the conclusion that they were trained to say it when confronted
by a pvp patient.....
Bruce L.
> Thanks for all your post I feel a bit better knowing there are others that
> had problems and there are things that can be done to help me.
That's exactly how I felt after I came here, aching like someone kicked
me in the nuts, and thinking it would never end. (THANKS David, Steve,
trifold and many others.)
An interesting point, and one that I don't know the answer to: I ached
for 2 weeks after blowout with no improvement, then one day I got up in
the morning (they always felt better in the morning) and felt mostly
"normal" all day, and that was pretty much the end of the "getting
kicked" ache. I don't know why it improved so suddenly. (I still had
another 5 weeks of other lesser pains, discomforts, and sensations that
I never thought would go away either.)
> I still think this is way more serious then any Dr lets on that it is. I
> know I would not have jumped at the vas so fast if I had any idea.
I agree 101%.
Keep us posted as to what happens.
David
> I don't know what the answer is. But by doctors not saying anything,
> people like me get the impression that it is a simple snip snip, and the
> only "risk" is from possible infection at the incision. This *IS* what I
> thought, and I bet most other men think the same thing.
It has to be said that there are some good doctors out there. We have had
posts that have said they dicsussed all sorts of issues with their doctor -
including pvp. The problem is that the standard is so very inconsistent.
It's my feeling that there should be some form of standard guideline for
doctors as to what specifics to mention. Unfortunately there isn't one -
well certainly not in the US.
I agree with you that the infomation given tends to be sketchy, and I
particularly dislike some doctor's websites and the lack of clarity. We even
had a couple of threads recently regarding what is normal with respect to
bruising, swelling and soreness recently. I feel there should be no need for
us to provide this information. We can provide the support bit, and yes we
can provide the information, but clearly it's the doctors job to give more
information than they do sometimes.
>
> When I called my v-doc after I had my blowout, he was discussing options
> on the phone, and one of them was to remove my testicle! That was the
> WRONG thing to say to me, or I suspect, any other man. Why he would even
> SAY anything like that, 2 days after the blowout, and not even have
> examined me yet, is incomprehensible to me.
Absolutely. The general method of treating problems is to take a
conservative approach. This is done because this approach actually resolves
most problems. I'd say that giving that sort of information without an
examination and without having pursued all the normal avenues is barking
mad!
FWIW - removal of testicle and vasectomy. I have note seen a single study on
how effective esticle removal is at curing pvp. I'm guessing nobody's ever
undertaken such a study. There*is*, however a study into castration to cure
Chronic Testicular Pain (yes, non vasectomised men get pvp symptoms too) and
it was only about 60% effective. I know some doctors mention this as an
option, but why is completely beyond me. There are other surgical methods
that have 60% - a documented 98% success rate of curing pvp.
David
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
Luan
I lost a few thousand dollars because I couldn't work full days (I am self
supporting) On the 9th of nov at 2 pm I noticed the serious pain was mostly
gone! not sure exactly what exact hour that happened (I was operating a
backhoe at the time) Since then till now I have the dull ache and the
"kicked in the balls" orgasms sometimes. I went to the doctor where this
was preformed to ask the exact method used and told him about the pains.
He had a little speach memorized which basically said, "The pain you are
suffering is not the result if the vasectomy. You need to visit a
urologist." I got the information I was after but wish I had been better
prepared for the "Speach". I think the correct responce would have been
to Hit him in the mouth hard enough to knock out some teeth. When he got
back to his feet inform him: "Your broken teeth are not the result of me
hitting you in the mouth, and I suggest you should visit a dentist."
Boys, we are being lied to big time here by doctors and the organizations
they work for. It is our fault for not asking the right questions in the
first place but often the wife or lover has heard that this is easy and
quick and nearly painless.... they are selling it as well as the 70 or 80%
of men who don't feel any difference. Maybe it is 90% but doctors know of
plenty cases where men complain. How easy to just tell a man he is fine
and there is nothing wrong and if there is pain it is not caused by the
event that we think it is caused by. I know all about pain and it is true
that a combination of orginal pain plus depression and imagination can
result in pain that is not really there from a medical perspective but it
still hurts and needs treatment. A good friend of mine almost died after
Prostate surgery (slightly botched) because of pain. Finally a somewhat
intelligent doctor used antidepressants for 6 months to cure him. He had
lost 85 pounds during the 2 years several doctors were telling him he was
OK. Remember doctors "practice" and as often as medicine it may be
Marketing. Vasectomy is a perfect surgery. It usually makes people very
happy. They talk about it - especially the female. It is seldom fatal
and so easy to preform it almost cannot be done wrong if the doc has any
skill at all. You pay big time if you change your mind and reverse and
that is your problem. The long term effects are not so well known but
there are Viagra and Cialis waiting for you already.
My pain is now a dull ache that runs in a cycle unpredictable. Last week
I was sure I was going to look for a doctor to try something. That pain
lasted 5 days but nearly disappeared for 2 days and has returned now to
about 20% of what it was at the worst. Saturday night I had sex 2 times
and again in the morning. It was almost papinless but try to imagine
this, painless is still without any of the pleasure I was used to before
the vas. I am speaking of orgasm only here, the rest is fine. On a
recent post here I stated that I have not had a test for sperm and that
was because it is nearly impossible to masterbate. Someone says "bring a
magazine" I don't want to say that is a stupid suggestion but it is in my
case. No magazine will help even an iota. I had lady try to help me a few
days ago. I have been telling everyone of this situation. She undressed
and did usual things for 15 minutes but got no result. She asked what
could she do to make me excited, I told her the only thing that can excite
me is for you to make me believe you want sex with me. I was proved
correct but please understand painfull orgasms pretty much end
masterbation unless you are a saddist I suppose. A real alive female that
I love can excite me but nothing less. How much longer will this work I
wonder, will I buy Viagra? I am perfectally happpy to be sterile as there
were many problems with being fertile. I got past the phycological
problems of vas in a few weeks. I told my girlfriend who I did this for
that this is excellent birth control! It is in fact perfect (as it now
looks like I may never see her again.) She accused me of being sarcastic.
I have to say all those who encouraged or influenced me to do this are not
my best friends anymore, at least till this pain problem is solved. I
waited a full year from the time I said I would do this till I actually
did. During that time I did not look for problems because I knew I would
not do it if I uncovered anything questionable. Men have no alternatives.
pleaase don't tell me something stupid like Condoms are an alternative, I
cannot stand the frustration of rubber between me and my lover. I have
tired and tried for 40 years, it doesn't work for me. Any girlfriend,
doctor or wife can type "vasectomy complications" in google and spend a
few hours sorting out some truth. If they don't care enough to do that
and share it with the one they love then I question their dedication. I
researched Birth Control Pills I U Ds and so on for my lover but she took
the advice of her female doctor and that led to complaining about any BC
on her part. I fear man often don't get consideration because the females
think we have the perfect method but are just scared of a little temporary
pain. I only hope they are finally correct!!!
Bruce L.
>. . . I went to the doctor where this was performed to ask the exact method used and told him about the pains.
>He had a little speach memorized which basically said, "The pain you are
>suffering is not the result if the vasectomy. You need to visit a
>urologist." I got the information I was after but wish I had been better
>prepared for the "Speach". I think the correct responce would have been
>to Hit him in the mouth hard enough to knock out some teeth. When he got
>back to his feet inform him: "Your broken teeth are not the result of me
>hitting you in the mouth, and I suggest you should visit a dentist."
When the old coot that cut me suggested removing my testicle because of
blowout pain, hitting him in the mouth was one of my less violent
thoughts.
>Boys, we are being lied to big time here by doctors and the organizations
>they work for. It is our fault for not asking the right questions in the
>first place.
I agree about the lying, but as patients we should not have to educate
ourselves first -- THEY should explain possible risks without us
peppering them with technical medical questions. We are the untrained,
trusting customers; they have a moral obligation to be upfront and not
hide anything.
If anyone ever asks me if they should have a vasectomy, I would tell
them NO. It isn't worth the risk, however small it may be statistically.
I was pretty much symptom-free from around Xmas-New Years til this past
week. I thought it was all behind me, but the last several days I have
had varying levels of discomfort. I feel lucky compared to you, and some
other guys here, but the whole thing still pisses me off.
Good luck to you.
Doug
uncontrollable twitching, muscle pain, and made me very anxious. I call the
pharmacist and he said stop taking it and call the Dr and by the way taking
Levaquin with an NSAID doubles the risk of some of the side affects (nice
the Dr told me to take the NSAID). I called the Dr and he gave me a new Rx
for Sulfamethoxazole 800mg / Trimethoprim 160mg that like all drugs has side
effects but at least it can be used with NSAID.
Actually today is not to bad maybe I don't have an infection and it is just
congestion and maybe that is letting up a bit. I doubt that taking one
antibodies (with a reaction to it) could have made me feel better that fast.
I decided to not take my Bextra today just to see if it gets worse and to
let my system clear from the bad reaction. If the pain level is the same
tomorrow or worse I will take a Bextra in the am. This may be a bad idea but
I still have muscle pain and twitching so I am freaked out and really want
to give my body 24hr to clean itself out.
BTW I looked up Levaquin and it has many newsgroups and websites dedicated
to the side effects and problems that it has caused people. So if any of you
get this drug or a drug in the same family you may want to look it up before
you put it in your mouth.
Will keep you updated.
Doug
Bruce L.
> I had a bad side affect to the Levaquin it gave me (and I still has some)
> uncontrollable twitching, muscle pain, and made me very anxious. I call the
> pharmacist and he said stop taking it and call the Dr and by the way taking
> Levaquin with an NSAID doubles the risk of some of the side affects (nice
> the Dr told me to take the NSAID). I called the Dr and he gave me a new Rx
> for Sulfamethoxazole 800mg / Trimethoprim 160mg that like all drugs has side
> effects but at least it can be used with NSAID.
Doug: My previous girlfriend, who was a nurse and whose brother was a
pharmacist, told me that pharmacists have MORE education in drugs than
medical doctors do. When it comes to side effects, interactions with
other drugs, and cheaper, just-as-good alternatives, the pharmacists are
the ones to listen to.
When both my parents got sick and died in the last 5 years (from old
age) I found these websites to be invaluable for information on what was
wrong with them, and details as to the drugs they were given. I have
also referenced them numerous times since my problems with vasectomy:
http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/hp.asphttp://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/hp.asp
. . . and . . . http://www.medlineplus.gov/
I agree with the idea of cleansing oneself of drugs. Some doctors seem
very quick to prescribe the "magic pill" to whatever one complains
about. Ridding your body of all foreign substances and starting over,
methodically tracking all variables, seems to be the prudent course, and
I think most scientists, who are not blinded by money and pressure from
drug companies would agree.
trif...@netscape.net
Luan wrote:
> Boys, we are being lied to big time here by doctors and the
organizations
> they work for. It is our fault for not asking the right questions in
the
> first place but often the wife or lover has heard that this is easy
and
> quick and nearly painless.... they are selling it as well as the 70
or 80%
> of men who don't feel any difference. Maybe it is 90% but doctors
know of
> plenty cases where men complain. How easy to just tell a man he is
fine
> and there is nothing wrong and if there is pain it is not caused by
the
> event that we think it is caused by.
Have you been to see a urologist? Maybe one could help, regardless of
the source of the pain (that is, whether it was caused by the
vasectomy, as you suspect, or some other thing, which is what the vas.
doctor thinks).
Longterm effects are well understood. Erectile dysfunction, which
viagra and cialis are designed to relieve, is not a longterm effect of
vasectomy.
> My pain is now a dull ache that runs in a cycle unpredictable. Last
week
> I was sure I was going to look for a doctor to try something. That
pain
> lasted 5 days but nearly disappeared for 2 days and has returned now
to
> about 20% of what it was at the worst. Saturday night I had sex 2
times
> and again in the morning.
Lots of sex for a guy who implies he can't get it up! lol I think you
should see a different doctor. Pain at ejac. could be caused by lots
of things, including prostate problems.
> this, painless is still without any of the pleasure I was used to
before
> the vas. I am speaking of orgasm only here, the rest is fine.
So now you say you don't have pain at ejac., you just don't feel
pleasure?
> recent post here I stated that I have not had a test for sperm and
that
> was because it is nearly impossible to masterbate. Someone says
"bring a
> magazine" I don't want to say that is a stupid suggestion but it is
in my
> case. No magazine will help even an iota. I had lady try to help me
a few
> days ago.
I was asking if they want to test your semen to see if you are sterile
or as a test looking for a source of the pain. In either case, maybe
you could wear a rubber next time you fuck, and use that to collect the
semen.
>I have been telling everyone of this situation. She undressed
> and did usual things for 15 minutes but got no result. She asked
what
> could she do to make me excited, I told her the only thing that can
excite
> me is for you to make me believe you want sex with me. I was proved
> correct but please understand painfull orgasms pretty much end
> masterbation unless you are a saddist I suppose.
I don't understand. Are orgasms painful for you, as you just said, or
pleasureless, as you say above?
> A real alive female that
> I love can excite me but nothing less.
Or, as you say, a lady who can make you believe she wants to have sex
with you.
>How much longer will this work I
> wonder, will I buy Viagra? I am perfectally happpy to be sterile as
there
> were many problems with being fertile. I got past the phycological
> problems of vas in a few weeks. I told my girlfriend who I did this
for
> that this is excellent birth control! It is in fact perfect (as it
now
> looks like I may never see her again.) She accused me of being
sarcastic.
> I have to say all those who encouraged or influenced me to do this
are not
> my best friends anymore, at least till this pain problem is solved.
I
> waited a full year from the time I said I would do this till I
actually
> did. During that time I did not look for problems because I knew I
would
> not do it if I uncovered anything questionable.
I don't understand. If you wanted to do it, why didn't you do it right
away? If you didn't, why were you afraid of finding reasons not to?
>Men have no alternatives.
> pleaase don't tell me something stupid like Condoms are an
alternative, I
> cannot stand the frustration of rubber between me and my lover. I
have
> tired and tried for 40 years, it doesn't work for me. Any
girlfriend,
> doctor or wife can type "vasectomy complications" in google and spend
a
> few hours sorting out some truth. If they don't care enough to do
that
> and share it with the one they love then I question their dedication.
I
> researched Birth Control Pills I U Ds and so on for my lover but she
took
> the advice of her female doctor and that led to complaining about any
BC
> on her part.
So after studying complications from the pill and IUD, you decided the
risk to her was worth it? But you are convinced risks of vasectomy are
so great that they are only done because want the money? I think the
situation is just the opposite. That risks from the pill and IUD are
much greater, esp. after a certain age.
My advice is to see a different doctor if you are serious about trying
to find a solution to the pain problem. And don't go in telling him
the vasectomy is to blame. Tell him about your symptoms, and see what
happens.
Doug
that I took (mostly twitching and muscle pain). The pressure pain seems to
have let up and did not increase that much even though I skipped the Bextra
because of the reaction to the antibiotic yesterday. So that is looking like
it was from congestion and not an infection maybe. I did take a Bextra this
am and that cut the pain from pressure even more. Right now the pressure
pain is about 80% gone 20% still there. That is a big difference from Sunday
so I am happy about that. Now I am starting to notice other pain that I must
not have noticed before because the pressure pain was so great. That pain
reminds me of the pain you feel a few hours after getting kicked good in the
balls. Actually right now I would describe the way I feel as uncomfortable
with aches and pains that are not nice but tolerable and I can function. I
decided to not start the replacement antibiotic since things are improving
without it. I don't like taking them if not needed especially after the bad
reaction to the other one.
Again thanks for all your post and I will keep updating everyone. I know
that I am not out of the woods yet from the many post that I have read. Just
because today was better tomorrow may be worse. One day at a time.
Doug
Giraud
> I
> decided to not start the replacement antibiotic since things are improving
> without it. I don't like taking them if not needed especially after the bad
> reaction to the other one.
I'd advise following your doctor's instructions to the letter with
regards to antibiotics. If you stop too early, it can cause an
infection to get worse or tolerant to the drug. They always tell to you
complete the prescription, even if you feel better. Since you have
stopped now, I'd ask your doc what to do next.
Giraud
Doug
Remember they are Practicing physicians, practicing on you that is.
I was doing well on Wed and Thursday the pain from the rear of the testicals
was almost gone and I was left with just soreness. Then last night out of
nowhere it flared back up to the level it was on Monday. I took a half of
Bextra and today I still feel it. I think this is like blue balls. I got
aroused, that is when the pain came back, and it's still here. If that is
what this is then there is no relief for it because I am plugged. I hope it
clams down again if not by mid morning I will take the other half of the
Bextra and see how it goes.
What do you guys think?
Remember I never did start the new antibiotic but I don't see how 1 day of
the other could have made such an improvement.
Doug
Bruce L.
with
regards to antibiotics. If you stop too early, it can cause an
infection to get worse or tolerant to the drug. They always tell to you
complete the prescription, even if you feel better. Since you have
stopped now, I'd ask your doc what to do next."
Doug, I believe Giraud is quite correct on this. My late mother used to tell
me when I was a kid (a long time ago) that this was true of antibiotics. If
you start to feel better and quit taking the drug, there can still be
bacteria present but no drug to kill them, so they can multiply and
re-infect. And as he says, if a lot of people do this, over the years, that
specific bacteria can then build up a resistance to anti-biotics.
FWIW, regarding PVP, mine seems to come and go for no specific, obvious
reason.
"Doug" <cloak-v...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:C21Pd.15499$uP6....@fe12.lga...
Giraud
quickly, at least in terms of making one feel better. It's been a
while, but when I have had things like strep or a tooth infection, I
recall that the drug took away the pain very fast (maybe even as quickly
as a day, but I do not remember exactly). But as Bruce says, stopping
early can make matters worse. So I think it's premature to rule out
infection or to draw any other strong conclusions at this point.
Giraud
Doug
antibiotic works that fast. But he did say that I could maybe have an
infection and taking the antibiotic can rule that out. But agreed that
taking them for no reason is not good. So again it is a toss up who knows
what is best. Now today about 3:30 I noticed the pain again was 80% gone and
I got happy. Then within an hour it came back but maybe half way 50% and now
for the past several hours it has been varying between 40% to 65% pain. Plus
the pain started yesterday when I was with a lady and it does feel like blue
balls. So I am still siding with congestion over infection. If it was an
infection I don't think I would be swinging between pain levels plus I am
thinking that the female would not have made it worse. I was thinking though
if I have any increased pain in the morning maybe I will take the new
antibiotic. You must understand that the first antibiotic almost sent me to
the ER with a single dose. So I have good reason for not wanting to take
something that I may not need. Because from what I know an antibiotic will
do nothing for congestion. One a side question to someone who has had
congestion pain what did you find to be the most effective treatment.
Thanks,
Doug
Luan
I am very busy here in BKK trying to do work of 2 men and have a vacation
too. This complication of a ruined sex life is one frustration I didn't
need. Often I don't have time to read, study and answer these posts
timely as I normally would.
Have you been to see a urologist? Maybe one could help, regardless of
the source of the pain (that is, whether it was caused by the
vasectomy, as you suspect, or some other thing, which is what the vas.
doctor thinks).
First the vas doctor doesn't think... his speach was memorized.
Second, I am getting prepared to visit a "doctor" but I know from some
past experiences that to go see a doctor without knowing the subject
matter is like going to buy a used car with no idea what you really want,
You will come home with what the used car dealer wanted to get rid of.
> the vas. I am speaking of orgasm only here, the rest is fine.
So now you say you don't have pain at ejac., you just don't feel
pleasure?
> recent post here I stated that I have not had a test for sperm and
that
> was because it is nearly impossible to masterbate. Someone says
"bring a
> magazine" I don't want to say that is a stupid suggestion but it is
in my
> case. No magazine will help even an iota. I had lady try to help me
a few
> days ago.
I was asking if they want to test your semen to see if you are sterile
or as a test looking for a source of the pain. In either case, maybe
you could wear a rubber next time you fuck, and use that to collect the
semen.
Yes - they are only interested in the success of the vas operation and are
happy to have a look for me if I produce a FRESH sample I did not see any
place where I could relax with my G/F and accomplish this and they did not
respond when I suggested I would need her help.
> masterbation unless you are a saddist I suppose.
I don't understand. Are orgasms painful for you, as you just said, or
pleasureless, as you say above?
> A real alive female that
> I love can excite me but nothing less.
Orgasms are basically without possibility of the pleasure I was used to
before. My orgasms began right there in my epididymis area - presure
builds a little - when things are right not to a painfull level, I still
have control, I can stay here for some time or stop here and let the
orgasm fade back. Beyond a certain level of excitment this chnages from
under my control to teh real thing and then I must let my body go into the
automatic mode of full orgasm. The trigger mechanism is there. Now that
system is chnaged. My body will still go into the orgasm and preform its
thing but my brain is unable to follow. With or without pain the
connection I have with the orgasm seems severed just as the vas cord is.
As I have been telling people it is exactly like lighting a firecracker
that does not explode. The fuse burns fine and that is it! And exactly
like that dud firecracker it is usual to think, oh well - it doesn't
always work... maybe next time. But now it is 6 months and it has never
worked, pain or no pain. If pain free I might learn to reinvent the
pleasure but with pain that cannot happen.... unless I can learn to like
Pain - is that clear?
The only pleasure I can find is teh pleasure of my lover and my reward is
the sharing of her happiness. But if she knows I am in this condition she
feels bad for me so this is not going to continue long term as a way to
enjoy sex.
> waited a full year from the time I said I would do this till I
actually
> did. During that time I did not look for problems because I knew I
would
> not do it if I uncovered anything questionable.
I don't understand. If you wanted to do it, why didn't you do it right
away? If you didn't, why were you afraid of finding reasons not to?
I thought about vasectomy for 20 years but had gut level resistance to the
idea that it is totally without complications long term. I also knew 4 of
about 22 men who had terrible post op. complications that took weeks to
heal like infections etc. I thought I was getting around that when NSV
was availablle. I knew my girlfriend was misinformed and that the best
way was the pill since she was only with me 3 months a year and 45 so this
problem would go away soonb anyway. However, I could see she was concerned
and believing her doc in KL, malaysia. I loved her and wanted no chnage in
her even if it was jsut a mistaken psycological reaction so I decided this
NSV with the assurance that nothind would chnage long term from some close
friends was the right thing to do.
My advice is to see a different doctor if you are serious about trying
to find a solution to the pain problem. And don't go in telling him
the vasectomy is to blame. Tell him about your symptoms, and see what
happens
The vas is the cause that is certain... I was not struck by lightning that
I know of since Sept. 6 but as U may suggest a cure could come from some
other treatment, even a bullet in my head could be effective. I will tell
him this happened the day of the operation and it has chnaged in some ways
since then but if he tells me something stupid like there is no way the
vas can cause this set of complications--- one or the other of us better
be looking for a door
Luan
I am very busy here in BKK trying to do work of 2 men and have a vacation
too. This complication of a ruined sex life is one frustration I didn't
need. Often I don't have time to read, study and answer these posts
timely as I normally would.
Have you been to see a urologist? Maybe one could help, regardless of
the source of the pain (that is, whether it was caused by the
vasectomy, as you suspect, or some other thing, which is what the vas.
doctor thinks).
First the vas doctor doesn't think... his speach was memorized.
Second, I am getting prepared to visit a "doctor" but I know from some
past experiences that to go see a doctor without knowing the subject
matter is like going to buy a used car with no idea what you really want,
You will come home with what the used car dealer wanted to get rid of.
> the vas. I am speaking of orgasm only here, the rest is fine.
So now you say you don't have pain at ejac., you just don't feel
pleasure?
> recent post here I stated that I have not had a test for sperm and
that
> was because it is nearly impossible to masterbate. Someone says
"bring a
> magazine" I don't want to say that is a stupid suggestion but it is
in my
> case. No magazine will help even an iota. I had lady try to help me
a few
> days ago.
I was asking if they want to test your semen to see if you are sterile
or as a test looking for a source of the pain. In either case, maybe
you could wear a rubber next time you fuck, and use that to collect the
semen.
Yes - they are only interested in the success of the vas operation and are
happy to have a look for me if I produce a FRESH sample I did not see any
place where I could relax with my G/F and accomplish this and they did not
respond when I suggested I would need her help.
> masterbation unless you are a saddist I suppose.
I don't understand. Are orgasms painful for you, as you just said, or
pleasureless, as you say above?
> A real alive female that
> I love can excite me but nothing less.
Orgasms are basically without possibility of the pleasure I was used to
before. My orgasms began right there in my epididymis area - presure
builds a little - when things are right not to a painfull level, I still
have control, I can stay here for some time or stop here and let the
orgasm fade back. Beyond a certain level of excitment this chnages from
under my control to teh real thing and then I must let my body go into the
automatic mode of full orgasm. The trigger mechanism is there. Now that
system is chnaged. My body will still go into the orgasm and preform its
thing but my brain is unable to follow. With or without pain the
connection I have with the orgasm seems severed just as the vas cord is.
As I have been telling people it is exactly like lighting a firecracker
that does not explode. The fuse burns fine and that is it! And exactly
like that dud firecracker it is usual to think, oh well - it doesn't
always work... maybe next time. But now it is 6 months and it has never
worked, pain or no pain. If pain free I might learn to reinvent the
pleasure but with pain that cannot happen.... unless I can learn to like
Pain - is that clear?
The only pleasure I can find is teh pleasure of my lover and my reward is
the sharing of her happiness. But if she knows I am in this condition she
feels bad for me so this is not going to continue long term as a way to
enjoy sex.
> waited a full year from the time I said I would do this till I
actually
> did. During that time I did not look for problems because I knew I
would
> not do it if I uncovered anything questionable.
I don't understand. If you wanted to do it, why didn't you do it right
away? If you didn't, why were you afraid of finding reasons not to?
I thought about vasectomy for 20 years but had gut level resistance to the
idea that it is totally without complications long term. I also knew 4 of
about 22 men who had terrible post op. complications that took weeks to
heal like infections etc. I thought I was getting around that when NSV
was availablle. I knew my girlfriend was misinformed and that the best
way was the pill since she was only with me 3 months a year and 45 so this
problem would go away soonb anyway. However, I could see she was concerned
and believing her doc in KL, malaysia. I loved her and wanted no chnage in
her even if it was jsut a mistaken psycological reaction so I decided this
NSV with the assurance that nothind would chnage long term from some close
friends was the right thing to do.
My advice is to see a different doctor if you are serious about trying
to find a solution to the pain problem. And don't go in telling him
the vasectomy is to blame. Tell him about your symptoms, and see what
Doug
subsided in the testical area. It still does come and go but the constant
pressure pain is not 24 hr a day like it was. So that may be a good sign for
me, I sure hope so. But now I have this pain that is right between my
scrotum and rectum. I feel there and it is tender I was thinking hernia but
nothing is sticking out or feels weak. So I did some research and found that
this type of pain is what you get when you have prostate problems. I do not
have all the symptoms but I do have some like the pain between the scrotum
and rectum, sometimes nausea, back pain, and general discomfort in the lower
area. I did start the new antibiotics the Dr gave me so maybe that will
help. But if this is a prostate infection it will take more then 7 day of an
antibiotic to clear it up from what I read. Does anyone have experience with
vasectomies and prostate infections or pain/problems.
Thanks,
Doug
Bruce L.
Doug: During my 7 weeks of pain, discomfort, and hyper-sensitivity in
the scrotal region I also had the exact pain you describe: between the
scrotum and rectum. I only had that particular sensation at the end, for
maybe less than a week, then it went away.
I think it may be part of the vasectomy procedure, especially for those
of us who do not heal like the majority.
I read somwhere (on this NG or on vasectomy-info.com, I think) that the
nerves that run to the testicles also connect to the kidneys; this is
why a severe nut kick is felt in the guts.
When I was still wearing a jock every day, after I took it off in the
evening I'd get up off the couch to go to bathroom or kitchen and I
could feel the ache going right up to my intestines. By supporting my
nuts with my hand while walking, the ache would immediately disappear.
I'm guessing that this nerve has something to do with the area between
the sack and rectum also. Does anybody here know? David?
I also had a slight burning sensation on my thigh for several weeks
(which I still don't know why), and that turned into a "tightness"
towards the last few days. I still get the burning once in a while, but
it's not really bothersome.
So my point is there were, for me anyway, various pains, aches,
sensations and sensitivities, including the one you describe.
Doug
areas that are near the real pain. I think the vas that they cut runs to the
prostate so I was thinking that it is possible some bacteria got in and
found its way up to the prostate. I would like to get off drugs as we all
know they are not good to take long term but have there place for the short
run. I notice that when I walk for a while the pain between the scrotum and
rectum gets worse for a while not sure what that means. I ran into an old
friend who had a vas 3 years ago. Believe it or not by the same Dr that did
my vas. He had it done on a Mon and was back to normal by Wed. I wanted to
kill him when he said that. He could not believe that I was still having
problems after 4 weeks when he only took 3 day to recover fully and forget
he even had the procedure. I think a vas depending on the person cause
trauma in a large area. Because if I move the wrong way I get pains in my
testicals that last for minuets to hours after. I am hoping that all my
problems go away and stay away in time.
Doug
"Bruce L." <bra...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:kNSdnRmDNdb...@usadatanet.net...
yabig23
same doc that I went to and all had no problems whatseover. My Dad had
one 30 years ago and was fine. For some reason I lost the pain lottery
and suffered in many ways. People who don't have major trouble
(understandably) can't imagine how much even a few weeks of pain can
affect the quality of life. I hope you get relief and I suspect that
when you do you'll appreciate things in ways you never thought. I now
live every day without pain as if it's a gift.
Doug
likely from the vas. Now I am on antibiotics for at the least 2 weeks. I
hope it clears up I read that prostate infection are very hard to get rid
of.
Doug
Bruce L.
Wow, no kidding.
Is the pain still there? Is it constant? How did the doc test for this?
Doug
a bike I would go through the roof. It is a burning pain right between your
legs makes walking difficult also. He did a prostate exam like they do for
all me over 40 (I am 39) and then you pee in a cup so they can test for
bacteria. I am kinda upset because I had this from the start and was not
being properly treated for it because they and I thought the pain was just
from the vas. So it looks like my original pain was from the vas but as that
subsided the pain of the prostate took over. The thing is the symptoms are
virtually identical. With a prostate infection it is so close your testicals
hurt also. I am hoping that once the prostate infection is under control the
pains from the vas are also gone. Right now since the symptoms are so close
it is hard to tell what is pain from the vas and what is pain from the
prostate. But it looks like the bacteria got in during the vas and traveled
up the vas def to the prostate. I know the testicals and area are not fully
healed because of the way I feel still. Plus I am sure the infection is
making healing slower. This is turning out to be a mess I hope it settles
down in the end and I don't have recurrent prostate problems.
Doug
"Bruce L." <bra...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:Da-dndrRv-Z...@usadatanet.net...
Doug
I think the antibiotic is kicking in my prostate is getting better. I still
would not want to ride a bicycle but at least I can sit and walk in general
comfort.
My left testical is almost pain free and I am happy about that. My right
testical is still tucked up high, does not drop that far, and aches on and
off with varying pain levels and is sometimes very tender to the touch. The
Dr cut the hole in my scrotum more to the left I wonder if he had to pull
more on the right testical to get the job done and that is why that one is
still sore.
Doug
trif...@netscape.net
earlier. I got a prostate infection about a year after my vas. The
doctor treated it with bactrim and it cleared up nicely, although I
took the stuff for a couple of months. In my case, I doubt there was
any connection between the vas. and the prostate infection. At the
time, I did some research and didn't find any evidence of association
between vasectomy and prostate infection. But maybe this is what
happened to you. It stands to reason cutting the vas tubes could
introduce some bacteria upward into the prostate. Anyway, I just
wanted to say the problem did clear up. My symptoms were
different--mostly really weird ejacs. But I did get better. I hope you
do too. (Keep taking the abx though: it takes a while to know this
stuff out.)
trifold
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
Doug
for now maybe much longer like months on the Bactrim. It started to really
let up after about 8 days but I still feel it like a 1 on a 1-10 scale. So
since I am almost at the 2 weeks I bet I will be taking Bactrim much longer.
Doug
<trif...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:1108675668.5...@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
trif...@netscape.net
Doug wrote:
> Thanks for the info trifold I am on the Bactrim also. The Dr told me
2 weeks
> for now maybe much longer like months on the Bactrim. It started to
really
> let up after about 8 days but I still feel it like a 1 on a 1-10
scale. So
> since I am almost at the 2 weeks I bet I will be taking Bactrim much
longer.
>
> Doug
Good luck with it. My doc. was really conservative, and said 2 weeks
wasn't enough to be sure. Eventually though I told him I thought it
was best to stop, that the weird ejacs. had cleared up, and that I
thought the abx itself was causing some mild burning. He agree that
was possible and told me I could stop. (I think that was in the second
month.)
trifold
www.vasectomy-information.com
www.vasectomy-faq.org
Doug
on antibiotics for my prostate infection from the vas. I think the infection
complicated and delayed my healing and made things worse overall. Now I can
tell the difference between the testical pain and the prostate pain. The
prostate pain right now ranges between 1 and 2 on a scale of 1-10. So that
is not bad it can even drop off the radar if I am busy with other things.
The testical pain is a bit more complex. Sometimes it is fine no pain at all
(not often but nice when it happens). Most of the time they both have a
varying degree of soreness pain and or pressure pain, plus the right with a
more dull ache and the left a sharper spike pain. This comes and goes and is
between a 1 and 3 maybe a 5 spike one a scale of 1-10. I have had a few
strange ejaculations but none painful. What I also notice is after
ejaculation I sometimes have not a pain but a strange feeling in the back of
my testicals that last from 20 min to a few hours. I cannot believe this but
I am still sore in the pelvic area. In other words crazy sex is out I still
must be careful and so must my wife or I wind up being sore afterwards; no
jumping around or doing acrobatics yet. Plus I can do something simple and
cause pain in the testical area. This could be walking up a large set of
steps, turning to look at something, walking fast (running still out for
me), taking a leap or big step, just things we all do everyday. At this
point, I am still unsure but I think if I had this to do all over again I
would not do it. I just turned in my first sample today. The Dr said to do
it after 20 ejaculations no matter the time but I waited to 31 because 20
would have been only about 4 weeks post. Time will tell if it was worth all
the pain.
Doug
Doug
Good news no sperm found I am free.
Bad news I still have pain. I think the bulk of my problem is my prostate
because I can hold my testicals in my hand and that is not where I think I
feel pain. but I am not sure since pain can travel and be hard to pin point.
I ran out of antibiotic this weekend because the Dr said if I was still in
pain he wanted me to come in. A few days after I ran out the pain came back
stronger so I called the Dr and have an appt tomorrow. I wish I knew if I
had infectious or non-infectious prostate problems. I am hoping the Dr will
shed some light on it. I have been doing some reading and looks like this
will be hard to heal. What makes me mad is I got this prostate problem from
the vas.
I still get pain in the testicals but here and there on and off, like the
other night I carried a cloth basket up the steps. I got about ΕΎ up and bang
what a pain in the right testical into my leg. I still have the pain 2 days
later on and off and I plan to ask the Dr what he thinks. I am still not
sure if I did the right thing here because I have several problems where I
had none before. Overall I think if I can get rid of the pain in the
prostate area I could live with the other pain. I think that had I known all
the risks I would have never did this but it's to late now. It sounds crazy
I am willing to live with a small amount of pain where I had no pain before.
Am I nuts, I guess I just don't want to risk having any more surgery because
of the possible problems so I am willing to tolerate some pain like an
insurance policy. I know from now on if it isn't broke, I don't fix it.
Doug
Dave
Well, still got the pain, so I went back to the doctor who carried out the
vas today and it transpires that I have a haematoma which is a fancy word
for a blood clot apparently!
He had a good feel around and felt a lump and immediately said "haematoma".
He seemed quite sure of this. He said he couldn't do much and that it should
clear up within a week or so and in the meantime keep using the ice packs
and taking Nurofen 3 times a day. He was pretty thorough about the whole
thing and reassured me that things will be OK. Trouble is I'm gonna have to
take more time off work. There's absolutely no way I can drive at the
moment, let alone sit at a desk all day.
Watch this sapce!!
All the best
Dave
Doug
The Dr as usual said all is good and I should be pain free but I am not. The
prostate problem seems to be subsiding with the use of acupuncture and
acupressure (they provided the most effective results yet so no one should
pass them by if they are in pain).
Now that the prostate pain is subsiding, I am feeling pressure pain in the
testicals. I have on and off pains in my testicals and groin area from time
to time. On a few occasions, I have turned or lifted something and then had
pain in the testical for up to 2 days. The Dr said that would happen nothing
to worry about (not sure I buy that). Right now, if I am busy I don't notice
the pain but if I stop or have nothing else to do it is there. It is at the
level that you can feel it but if your mind is busy you don't notice it. I
still think I should be and would like to be pain free but who knows that
may not be possible. I have done some more reading and see that the pain
from backup can last up to 12 weeks so I guess I still have 2 more weeks
before my pain is over the limit.
Things do work well and my wife and I are enjoying the benefits of worry
free sex. That is the great benefit out of it all. Still right now I don't
think I would have done it knowing what I know now. My body does not heal
quickly or well apparently and this was much more involved then I was ever
lead to believe in the first place. I still think that Dr's need to better
inform patents what the risks are before the surgery. It is not as risk free
as it is marketed to be and I know fist hand.
If anyone is interested in trying the acupressure it's free you can look up
the pressure points on the web and just do it yourself. You have noting to
lose except maybe some pain if it works.
Doug
Giraud
it in two weeks. My discomfort sounds exactly like yours, the way you
describe it. Mine has gotten better over time, and my open-ended
conversion did help (although it set me back a little due to the extra
cutting and needed recovery time), but it's been over 2 years since my
vasectomy. At this point, I would say the mild ache is more just
"sometimes there" than "usually there." This may sound ominous and
long-lasting, but it's not - hard to describe, really, but as time
passes, I feel more "normal" down there, and the periods of complete
pressure/ache-freedom grow longer and make it easy to forget about any
problem. Even when the ache is there, it's often "below the radar."
And a funny thing is that stress very conspicuously magnifies it - strange!
My discomfort, when it reveals itself, is mostly on the right side,
where I think I may have a blockage from long ago (maybe all my life) -
this is a guess based on similar aching I had about 20 years ago that
slowly subsided over a couple of years. The open-ended conversion may
not have done much good on that side if this is the case, but I will say
that the sensation of pressure seems to have been reduced or eliminated,
especially on the left.
I get another kind of soreness after sex (especially great sex), but
it's not really a bother - feels more like I really "used" those
[cremaster] muscles in the testicular cords (kind of how your bigger
muscles feel after a good workout). Trifold has mentioned a similar
thing, but his theory is different for his case. Mine is that the
muscles get flexed during arousal, ejaculation, sex itself, etc., and
they are very near where the cutting was done, so there is some residual
tenderness in the area. This particular soreness feels centered more in
the cords and equal on both sides, rather than in the
epi/testicle/tube-near-epi (like my random mostly-right-side ache). I
want to emphasize that I would not call this one an issue at all, and I
suspect the effect will lessen with time anyway.
I think that, for some men, doing this operation in such a tender site
takes a long time to heal, on the order of months or years. I'd rather
have had no pain at all, but regardless, I have never regretted the
vasectomy. If I thought I would always have constant (even dull) pain
of the sort I have sometimes on my right side, I would not be happy
about that, but I do not think this is the case. It just "feels" like
time will slowly heal.
Giraud
Doug
I think you may be right in time the pain may mostly be below the radar. I
am glad that things work well and having sex does not seem to increase the
pain. Sometimes I still get sore down there in general but no functional
pain yet and I hope it stays that way. I think I know that pain you refer to
after sex I did notice that a few time right after the vas and a few times
after as you say great sex. But that only last a few minutes tops so I did
not think much of it. I have also noticed that stress increases the pain
greatly. In fact I was thinking that stress plays a big roll in pain in
general. I have a torn muscle in my neck and a bad tendon in my toe. Both
have pain that is mostly under the radar but can flair up big time under
high stress and worry. I sure hope that I don't have to convert to open end
I just don't want to disrupt that area any more then needed. You are right
about some people healing slower. I should have known since my toe surgery
took 3-4 times longer to heal then the Dr expected and everything went
perfect. I have come to a point that the pain is low enough that I can
tolerate waiting some more time for it to heal. It is clearly to early for
me to run back to the Dr and demand something extreme like converting,
undoing, or anything evasive. Also at this point slowly week after week I am
improving. So as long as I continue to feel improvement I will just give it
more time. If I ever get to a stalling point with no improvement for several
weeks even months depending on the pain level at that time I will need to
make a decision about what my next step is.
You said it has been 2 years and things are still getting better for you,
right. Did you have any stalling points and if so how long or did you just
see healing slow over the 2 years. I just want to know so I can judge my
recovery and better gauge expectations.
Thanks,
Doug
Giraud
progress stalled. I think the biggest one was leading up to deciding to
get the open-ended conversion. When things are up and down, coming and
going, it's hard to know if the trend is positive, and it can be
frustating. I'd try to look at the big picture and smooth out the ups
and downs as much as you can to see if you think there is overall
improvement.
Giraud
dave
Well I'm at week 3 and I'm sorry to say that things are not improving for
me. I had a lot of pain after the op and since really. I've been back to the
docs on numerous occasions and he's just prescribed me a course of
antibiotics which I'm about halfway through. The problem with me is left
sided. Visually things still look swollen in that area and the testicles in
general just don't look or feel the same as they did before the op. Right
side is fine. The pain is a deep dull ache that is now fairly constant and
difficult to ignore. Next step is an ultrasound scan, but I'm really
starting to wish that I hadn't had this done. I'm wondering if any of this
is to do with a varicocele that I've had for years left side.
Dave
"Giraud" <gir...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:114ht9r...@corp.supernews.com...
Giraud
problem, and there was no varicocele (at least that I knew about).
About 20 years ago I had a bout of aching (I was just graduating from
college, well, I guess it was more like 18 years...!). The docs never
could figure it out. It came and went, and slowly resolved over about 2
years. My theory is that I had a blockage (who knows when - maybe all
my life) that caused the aching. The vas exiting my right testicle
feels "different" (lumpy). Not sure if that was so way back then, as I
didn't feel around down there as much, but I do remember that my right
epi felt larger than my left, and it still does.
My vasectomy probably perturbed things enough to bring back some of the
issues. It may have added "blockage" as well (100%, this time!). Or
who knows!
But in your case, it's only been 3 weeks. That is a very short time,
really. I would not conclude you have PVP this early. 3 weeks is
nothing, and I would almost expect that aching could be "normal," even
though many guys report being fine after a day. And since you have
swelling, this could be coupled with that. When/if this goes down,
maybe your ache will too. I'd talk to the doc regarding the varicocele,
etc. of the antibiotics don't end up helping. Has he had anything to
say about if it could be related (sorry if you already posted this).
-Giraud
dave
Thanks very much for your reply. I agree that compared to many on this
newsgroup, 3 weeks is nothing so maybe more time is all that is needed.
Regarding the varicocele, the doc reckons it could be adding to the
problems. I've had it about 10 years or maybe longer. It used to give me
some discomfort but this was quite rare and certainly bareable. It's true
that the vas could have somehow awakened things again ... the doc thinks
this may be the case.
At this stage I've only been dealing with this at GP level. The guy that did
the op is a GP trained to carry out vasectomies so I've only been seeing
him. He wants me to finish the course of antibiotics and then the next step
is ultrasound.
Will ultrasound show up any abnormalities concerning the varicocele etc??
Thanks again for the reply.
Kind regards
Dave
"Giraud" <gir...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:114j9u6...@corp.supernews.com...
Doug
prepared the mental strain will increase the longer you are in pain. I know
what you mean when you say you are thinking you wish you did not do it. I
never had a single pain in my testicals my whole life and now I have some
form of pain all the time. So I ask myself everyday what on earth did you do
to yourself. But to late now we both did it and have to do our best to make
it better. Did the vas flair up your varicocele, I think it sure could have
after all my vas somehow gave me prostate problems that I am still dealing
with on top of testical pain. At this point I find that loose paints and
shorts are more comfortable for the boys then the tight fitting jock strap
that was my friend for several weeks. Try the acupressure it did help me and
you do yourself anytime and it's free. Also my testicals did not look mostly
normal to me until the 6 or 7th week and still at times they seem different
then I remember. So I think you still have a few weeks to go before things
start to seem normal for you. Also my right testical was way tucked up
inside for the first 5 weeks and then slowly dropped and not looks like it
did most of the time. This vas is not the simple thing it is marketed to be
for many of us. Give it some more time and lets see what happens you should
see some improvement soon.
Doug
"dave" <da...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:42497019$0$304$cc9e...@news-text.dial.pipex.com...
dave
once-dormant varicocele now deciding to become un-dormant if you see what I
mean!!
Best regards, Dave
"Doug" <cloak-v...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:6sm2e.9658$iG1....@fe12.lga...
dave
accupressure you're referring to?
Dave
"Doug" <cloak-v...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:6sm2e.9658$iG1....@fe12.lga...
kdp
> Well I'm at week 3 and I'm sorry to say that things are not improving for
> me. I had a lot of pain after the op and since really. I've been back to the
> docs on numerous occasions and he's just prescribed me a course of
> antibiotics which I'm about halfway through. The problem with me is left
> sided. Visually things still look swollen in that area and the testicles in
> general just don't look or feel the same as they did before the op. Right
> side is fine. The pain is a deep dull ache that is now fairly constant and
> difficult to ignore.
Hi Dave: When i had my vasectomy (open-ended nsv), i had to wait for
4-5 weeks to get a normal w.r.t going down the stairs, etc, even
though I was in good shape physically and medically and I wore double
boxers for about a month. Hope it will be the same with you. I wish
you a speedy recovery.
//kdp
Doug
easy to follow guide
http://www.geocities.com/jrh_iii/acupressure/acupoints.html
You can just use the index to find testicals and follow instructions for the
pressure points. There is a section with basic instructions and procedures
you can use. Give it a try it is free, does not hurt, and may help. Let me
know if it works for you I had some relief right away but more after about 2
days of doing the points.
Doug
"dave" <da...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:424a4812$0$302$cc9e...@news-text.dial.pipex.com...