Ephedra Ban
Mike1
>
>"JimmySmith" <wyoming...@aol.comjimmys> wrote in message
>> The REAL reason ephedra has been banned is because it is the
>> main ingredient in the manufacture of methamphetamines.
snip
>yes you can,
*Bullshit*.
...Ephedrine-hypocloride (the athsma med) can be used in meth-man, but
it has NOT been banned.
...Meanwhile, weight-loss product herbal ephedra (essentially ground-up
weed compressed into tabs along with caffeine and aspirin and mineral
additives -- impurities that no mether is going to want to deal with
trying to separate out) is what is being banned.
...Herbal ephedra NOT marketed in the form of weight-loss tabs (i.e.,
"traditional Chinese medicine") is EXEMPT from the ban.
IOW, the *only* ephedra which is being banned is the ephedra which
competes with the trillion-dollar/year parmecuetical snake-oil industry
which has co-opted and now runs the FDA. This is why kills-test-subjects
products like Viagra that cost $9 a pill are approved while SAFE and
NON-PATENTABLE products (like ephedra) are outlawed.
> ....that's why I don't care if they banned ephedra lol.
In short, you "don't care" when your country becomes a communazi
nanny-state, and the reason for that is because you're a *moron* with a
slave-mentality.
--
Reply to mike1@@@usfamily.net sans two @@, or your reply won't reach me.
"An election is nothing more than an advance auction of stolen goods."
-- Ambrose Bierce
Skipperbeers
>IOW, the *only* ephedra which is being banned is the ephedra which
>competes with the trillion-dollar/year parmecuetical snake-oil industry
>which has co-opted and now runs the FDA. This is why kills-test-subjects
>products like Viagra that cost $9 a pill are approved while SAFE and
>NON-PATENTABLE products (like ephedra) are outlawed.
>In short, you "don't care" when your country becomes a communazi
>nanny-state, and the reason for that is because you're a *moron* with a
>slave-mentality.
I don't like the language or the attitude. It's unfortunate that there's some
truth to the comments, though.
In 1967, my dad got a Jeep Wagoneer with seat belts, the first car I recall
having them and made us all buckle up because he was safety conscious. The
government didn't have to tell us to do it, and as long as they weren't in our
car, we didn't think those who didn't "click it" should get a "ticket"
(Michigan campaign, not sure if "click it or ticket is national or local.)
When I was 16 and giving fellow baseball team members a ride, they certainly
were annoyed at my seat belt rule. My dad said I woldn't be driving if I
didn't buckle it, I listened and developed the habit. Now I believe they can
stop you if they even suspect you are not wearing a seat belt? It's absurd.
They chink away at our liberty a little at a time. And it affects the medical
industry, the nutrition industry, and thyroid treatment. The legal
implications of thyroid treatment don't allow the profit margins of those whose
lobbyists have influence, so they got rid of Dr. Barry Durrant-Peatfield in the
UK and then immediately went after Dr. David Derry in British Columbia, Canada.
Even though he had a lot of his patients supporting him, they alone couldn't
create enough of an uproar to make the British Columbian government reconsider.
Some day, those in the United States are going to have to start getting upset
about the loss of liberty. Either that, or lose it. It would be a terrible
thing to many of us if there wasn't enough profit in Armour, so the lobbyists
went after a ban on it. The trend in the loss of liberty for the common man is
scary. ON the other hand, under our current president, the rich and the
industrial polluters have a lot more of it.
Skipper
Kevin J. Coolidge
"Mike1" <mike1_justfo...@usfamily.net> wrote in message
news:mike1_justfordangoodman...@phswest.com...
Kevin J. Coolidge
meth. Perhaps we ought to be more scared of carless people like you than the
government. I actually was not thrilled with the ephedra ban. I don't use
it, not because it doesn't work, but because it has a rebound affect. Good
for losing fat short term, but you usually gain most of it back if you are
allready fairly lean. A very overweight person probably wouldn't, but they
probably would be at increased risk. In case you aren't aware. LOL stands
for laughing outloud. I was trying to denote sarcasm, but I obviously went
over your head. Sorry about that chum
"Mike1" <mike1_justfo...@usfamily.net> wrote in message
news:mike1_justfordangoodman...@phswest.com...
Mike1
In article <HdGMb.9937$Bv6.3...@news1.epix.net>,
"Kevin J. Coolidge" <kc...@epix.net> wrote:
>and if you read closer. He asked if ephedrine not ephedra could be used for
>meth.
You stupid ass; if you're going to make a claim like that, you should at
least bother to READ THE MATERIAL WHICH YOU REQUOTED IN ITS ENTIRETY.
Now go back and re-familiarize yourself with what "JimmySmith"
originally wrote.
>Perhaps we.....
"We"? Do you have a gerbil somwhere?
Mike1
>>From: Mike1 mike1_justfo...@usfamily.net
>
>>IOW, the *only* ephedra which is being banned is the ephedra which
>>competes with the trillion-dollar/year parmecuetical snake-oil industry
>>which has co-opted and now runs the FDA. This is why kills-test-subjects
>>products like Viagra that cost $9 a pill are approved while SAFE and
>>NON-PATENTABLE products (like ephedra) are outlawed.
>
>>In short, you "don't care" when your country becomes a communazi
>>nanny-state, and the reason for that is because you're a *moron* with a
>>slave-mentality.
>
>I don't like the language or the attitude. It's unfortunate that there's some
>truth to the comments, though.
The language and attitude are reserved for those who *earn* them.
>In 1967, my dad got a Jeep Wagoneer with seat belts, the first car I recall
>having them and made us all buckle up because he was safety conscious. The
>government didn't have to tell us to do it, and as long as they weren't in our
>car, we didn't think those who didn't "click it" should get a "ticket"
>(Michigan campaign, not sure if "click it or ticket is national or local.)
>When I was 16 and giving fellow baseball team members a ride, they certainly
>were annoyed at my seat belt rule. My dad said I woldn't be driving if I
>didn't buckle it, I listened and developed the habit. Now I believe they can
>stop you if they even suspect you are not wearing a seat belt? It's absurd.
>
>They chink away at our liberty a little at a time. And it affects the medical
>industry, the nutrition industry, and thyroid treatment. The legal
>implications of thyroid treatment don't allow the profit margins of those whose
>lobbyists have influence, so they got rid of Dr. Barry Durrant-Peatfield in the
>UK and then immediately went after Dr. David Derry in British Columbia, Canada.
> Even though he had a lot of his patients supporting him, they alone couldn't
>create enough of an uproar to make the British Columbian government reconsider.
>
>Some day, those in the United States are going to have to start getting upset
>about the loss of liberty. Either that, or lose it.
This has been going on full-blast for a whole century.
>It would be a terrible
>thing to many of us if there wasn't enough profit in Armour, so the lobbyists
>went after a ban on it. The trend in the loss of liberty for the common man is
>scary. ON the other hand, under our current president, the rich and the
>industrial polluters have a lot more of it.
Marxist twaddle.
Kevin J. Coolidge
ranting and raving, you don't get listened to. Take up a real cause
"Mike1" <mike1_justfo...@usfamily.net> wrote in message
news:mike1_justforscottsmith...@news.usfamily.net...
Mike1
The nice audience will duly note that you couldn't handle the arguments.
Kevin J. Coolidge
"Mike1" <mike1_justfo...@usfamily.net> wrote in message
news:mike1_justforscottsmith...@phswest.com...
Mike1
<top-posting fixed...again>
>"Mike1" <mike1_justfo...@usfamily.net> wrote in message
>>"Kevin J. Coolidge" <kc...@epix.net> wrote:
>> >it's people like you that give weightlifters a bad name....
>>
>> The nice audience will duly note that you couldn't handle the arguments.
>
>what argument? You moron.
These ones, dingbat, in this very thread:
<cite>
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet,alt.sport.weightlifting,alt.support.thyroid
Subject: Re: Ephedra Ban
Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2004 16:47:11 -0600
From: Mike Schneider
"Kevin J. Coolidge" <kc...@epix.net> wrote:
>
>"JimmySmith" <wyoming...@aol.comjimmys> wrote in message
>> The REAL reason ephedra has been banned is because it is the
>> main ingredient in the manufacture of methamphetamines.
snip
>yes you can,
[Yo, Dingbat: You see Jimmy writing "ephedra" up there instead of
"ephedrine"? Wence then your retort, a few posts back,"...and if you
read closer. He asked if ephedrine not ephedra could be used for
meth." Are you blind, forgetful, or just functionally illiterate?]
*Bullshit*.
...Ephedrine-hypocloride (the athsma med) can be used in meth-man, but
it has NOT been banned.
...Meanwhile, weight-loss product herbal ephedra (essentially ground-up
weed compressed into tabs along with caffeine and aspirin and mineral
additives -- impurities that no mether is going to want to deal with
trying to separate out) is what is being banned.
...Herbal ephedra NOT marketed in the form of weight-loss tabs (i.e.,
"traditional Chinese medicine") is EXEMPT from the ban.
IOW, the *only* ephedra which is being banned is the ephedra which
competes with the trillion-dollar/year parmecuetical snake-oil industry
which has co-opted and now runs the FDA. This is why kills-test-subjects
products like Viagra that cost $9 a pill are approved while SAFE and
NON-PATENTABLE products (like ephedra) are outlawed.
> ....that's why I don't care if they banned ephedra lol.
In short, you "don't care" when your country becomes a communazi
nanny-state, and the reason for that is because you're a *moron* with a
slave-mentality.
--
Lois
Could you please remove alt.support.thyroid from this and other cross-posted
threads. We ask people not to cross-post to our group in our Posting
Guidelines at http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/pgdlines.php. On that page,
we explain why cross-posting can be a problem for us.
We don't expect you to have read our Posting Guidelines before, but you now
know the preferences of the alt.support.thyroid newsgroup. Thanks for your
consideration.
Lois
JC Der Koenig
Thyroid making you fat?? Yeah, right.
--
JC
Eat less, exercise more.
--
"Lois" <thiswil...@excite.com> wrote in message
news:xmlNb.872$vK3...@fe02.usenetserver.com...
Lois
"JC Der Koenig" responded to my request not to cross-post to
alt.support.thyroid:
: Learn how to use a killfile <snip>
My expectation of the above immature and self-centred response is why I
didn't post this request in a previous thread. Some of the posters showed a
lack of ability to see beyond their own egos, and I didn't think it was in
them to be considerate. I gave it a try in this thread, and unfortunately,
my original expectation was right.
To newbies, when you see a thread where people are talking like adolescents,
look to see if it's cross-posted. Most likely it came from another
newsgroup. To block a thread in Outlook Express, first click on the subject
line of a post in that thread, and then click on Message and Ignore
Conversation. Most other newsreaders have something similar.
Let's see if someone from another newsgroup posts this post or part of it in
a cross-posted post and illustrates the above-mentioned immaturity again.
Or, block this thread and you won't have to see it.
Lois
Grant
doesn't seem to be.
When I posted my comment in the thread, I deleted all the other newsgroups
but then someone from the thread came into our newsgroup and reposted my
comments to the entire newsgroup list.
I think that the behavior of the posters in this thread strongly illustrate
why ephedra is a problem. :)
ar
"Lois" <thiswil...@excite.com> wrote in message
news:HnoNb.968$vK3...@fe02.usenetserver.com...
PlumBob
elect
"Mike1" <mike1_justfo...@usfamily.net> wrote in message
news:mike1_justforscottsmith...@phswest.com...
Mike1
>I think that the behavior of the posters in this thread strongly illustrate
>why ephedra is a problem. :)
The mentality of people who are insufficiently motivated to research the
actual facts of the subject they're willingly discussing (in a state of
ignorance), and who believe that examining "the behavior of posters" is
an adequate rational substitute to that research, is a much bigger
problem.
just...@me.com
already made . . This is about our right to make our own choices about
what works for us. Those of you who believe that you have a right to
take Amour thyroid, Cytomel, or combination T3/T4 products may be able
to see where I'm going with this.
I have hypothyroidism and I used to use large amounts of coffee and
occasionally ephedra to summons the energy to survive before I finally
got a doctor to agree to check the thyroid hormones (I had to threaten
malpractice). Even after hormone replacement, I continued to suffer
more fatigue than my "normal" co-workers, family and friends. Other
people could work full-time, raise their families and still have some
free time. I had to choose which one of those three I would do in a
day. So I continued to use caffeine and ephedra to boost my energy on
days that I had to do something like attend a school play after working
all day. Finally, after the appropriate tests, and foot dragging by the
endo who was hesitant to diagnose or treat rare disorders, I've been
diagnosed with three different hormone deficits (cortisol, testosterone,
and thyroid) I'm still waiting the results of a human growth hormone
stimulation test that was low, but not low enough for insurance
reimbursement on the first test.
Now, with these hormones replaced, I finally have enough energy that a
little coffee is enough to give me a boost if I need it. Now, what
would I have done without the ephedra? I'll tell you: my docs would
have continued to tell me to "just deal with it." My wife and kids
would have grown hateful of my lack of attention to them. I would have
been fired from my job for poor work performance or attendance.
No one in the FDA is in a position to tell me that there are medical
solutions or alternatives for people like me. B.S! I lived witht he
fatigue of having hormone deficiets for nearly 10 years. I may have
"graduated" from the need for ephedra, but what about the others walking
the path I did right now? Should I no longer care? How many of them
out there right now would take an over the counter stimulant to survive
if they had access to it? I found that it is not as simple as going to a
doctor for cure. Many people see those with chronic debilitating fatigue
as malingerers - because they don't see the medical problem they see a
moral problem.
Now lets talk about REAL the relative danger of ephedra.
--It kills less people than Tylenol each year (5000 estimated to die
from Tylenol, numerous others require a liver transplant related to
Tylenol abuse). The Center for disease control web site has an official
document on it that mentions an estimate that NSAIDS (non-steroidal
anti-inflamitories - like Asprin, Motrin, Advil, and Aleve) result in
about 100,000 hospital admissions and up to 20,000 deaths a year.
-- It kills less than alcohol
--It kills less than cigarettes
The truth of the matter is that it is a rather safe drug compared to the
other over the counter drugs. The idea that we need the government to
protect us by denying us access to this drug is an admission that we
cannot be trusted even with moderatly low risk choices. If that is
true, then certainly we should not be allowed access to the other above
mentioned over the counter drugs.
The idea that we do not have an inherent "right" to possess ephedra is
also wrong. We should have the right to do anything we want provided
that it cannot be shown that doing so imposes an undue danger to self or
others. Ephedra certainly does not meet that criterion, but the above
mentioned freely available drugs do.
Lastly, lets not forget that this country, as well as the majority in
government believe that it is our right to keep a loaded gun in our
house. Now I ask you how many children died from ephedra versus how
many died from accessing those loaded handguns? I trust that my
children won't eat my ephedra, and if they did, they would read the
bottle and take the reccomended dose. The consequences of taking two at
once would be that they would probably feel like crap and they would not
do it again. Now if they fired a loaded handgun . . .
To put this topic to rest:
--The truth is, that the snivvelling "its not fair" crowd imposed this
ban on us. You may not need or even want ephedra, but the fact of the
matter is - they took your right to decide away. They couldnt do it by
lawsuit, so they ran to the government crying "it's not fair."
It wasn't fair that some athletes took anabolic steroids, so they took
that issue to the government who then reclassified a nonaddicting
medicine as a "narcotic" and threatened doctors who prescribed it with
investigations. Now that the "unfair" performence advantage conferred
by ephedra has been eliminate, they will go after Creatine monohydrate
next. And where will the slippery slope of banning things go?
Some athletes have access to better gyms - so lets ban all work-out
facilities except free weights. Maybe we should restrict protein
intake.
In article <mike1_justforveldhouse_-9B3CEA.01111818012004
@news.usfamily.net>, mike1_justf...@usfamily.net says...
Grant
of ephedra. Thank you. I will pay far more attention to what you have
written and what you have to say on the matter than I will to the others who
have nothing but angry words to say.
I completely see your point. I still think it is a dangerous thing to use.
But I also feel that way about caffeine. It helped you to get through the
day but didn't help your health. And that's my point. It isn't fixing the
problem, it's only masking it and may even make it worse in the long run.
Of course, having a crappy doctor certainly doesn't help matters. Sure,
guns are more dangerous but you would probably have a different view on the
subject if your kid took one or two of your ephedras and then died because
of an adverse reaction. For that matter, peanut butter kills, too. :) And
if we eliminated the bans on cocaine, etc...well, that gives people energy
too. Would you like your children using that when they feel they are having
a low energy day? I'm not really for or against banning ephedra. I'm just
for people getting healthy instead of hurting themselves.
By the way, your comment about restricting protein intake made me laugh.
There are a large amount of people who believe that it is all the excess
protein that we eat that creates a lot of our bodily disfunction. We only
really need a little bit. So, there's more than one thought on pretty much
everything, I suppose. I know that I got a lot healthier when I stopped
eating all that protein...and my work-outs improved as well.
ar
<just...@me.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1a750856b...@news-server.rochester.rr.com...