Certified True Transsexual Certificates

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Willow

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Apr 8, 2004, 8:52:40 PM4/8/04
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Now you can solve one of the riddles of "alt.support.srs"...

Do you think you are a true transsexual? For a mere $100 (U.S. Funds) you
can have your very own "Certified Approved Transsexual Certificate",
suitable for framing. Printed on the rarest of papers and engraved for
quality appearance, every certificate is accompanied by a wallet size
certificate, for your convenience.

Please contact us for this special offer. To insure quality control of our
certificates, we shall require a personal meeting to verify your standing as
a transsexual. Air fare, hotel and other expenses (not included in the
price) are required. To insure prompt service, please forward your credit
card name, number and expiry date. Your PIN number is also required for
full service.

Please do not apply if you are *not* a true transsexual. Those with beards,
a penis, testicles, hairy arm pits or legs, or Adam's apples may contact us
for our special consultancy service to advise on how you can become a
Certified Approved Transsexual ("CAT").


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Amanda Angelika

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Apr 8, 2004, 9:34:42 PM4/8/04
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In news:stmdc.52349$Pk3.8045@pd7tw1no,
Willow <pang...@shaw.ca> typed:

> Now you can solve one of the riddles of "alt.support.srs"...
>
> Do you think you are a true transsexual? For a mere $100 (U.S.
> Funds) you can have your very own "Certified Approved Transsexual
> Certificate", suitable for framing. Printed on the rarest of papers
> and engraved for quality appearance, every certificate is accompanied
> by a wallet size certificate, for your convenience.
>
> Please contact us for this special offer. To insure quality control
> of our certificates, we shall require a personal meeting to verify
> your standing as a transsexual. Air fare, hotel and other expenses
> (not included in the price) are required. To insure prompt service,
> please forward your credit card name, number and expiry date. Your
> PIN number is also required for full service.
>
> Please do not apply if you are *not* a true transsexual. Those with
> beards, a penis, testicles, hairy arm pits or legs, or Adam's apples
> may contact us for our special consultancy service to advise on how
> you can become a Certified Approved Transsexual ("CAT").

LOL
Reminds me of when the UK based company "Transformations" used to do
"Real Transvestite Certificates" LOL.

The best scam I saw recently was for the, actual hangman's noose used by
the English Hangman James Berry in the attempted hanging of the man they
couldn't hang. Money for old rope or what?! LOL

--
Amanda
--
Art auctions:
eBay: www.tinyurl.com/q5hx
eBid: http://tinyurl.com/37efa


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Willow

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Apr 8, 2004, 11:22:02 PM4/8/04
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Hi Amanda,

There was one English Group that started the Rochester Gender Clinic (or a
name like that) and offered very expensive and useless pills, potions and
creams. They even offer to finance a TS business. I suspect they are one
and the same.

For fun, I submitted a bogus business plan just to see what would happen.
Nothing did.

Do you know anything about the "rich businessman" who is suing his doctor
for allowing him to have SRS? What a story! The only noted American case
was in Buffalo, when they did a few SRS operations back in the 60s, and that
was settled out of court. My goodness, I would love to see the pleadings in
the English case. If you are passing by the Inns of Court, please get a
copy!

When may I expect your credit card number? A trip to England would be nice
about now...

Willow
"Amanda Angelika" <manic...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c54u4t$2pii0a$1...@ID-172934.news.uni-berlin.de...

Amanda Angelika

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Apr 9, 2004, 9:48:54 AM4/9/04
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In news:uFodc.52717$Pk3.51972@pd7tw1no,
Willow <pang...@shaw.ca> typed:

> Hi Amanda,
>
> There was one English Group that started the Rochester Gender Clinic
> (or a name like that) and offered very expensive and useless pills,
> potions and creams. They even offer to finance a TS business. I
> suspect they are one and the same.

Yes very likely the same company "Transformations". They have what they
call over here "The Albany Gender Clinic", and used to claim to be able
to do everything all the way to full gender reassignment. But generally
they seem to be known for tacky sex toys, crossdressing sessions with
dodgy make-overs and hugely expensive snakeoil pills, potions and
creams. It's a "sex industry" thing really, all they do really is sell
fantasies to closet CDs.

They don't seem to have a very good name, which is probably because they
can't actually deliver the goods, sexual fantasy is their stock-in trade
and that is about as far as it goes. And obviously once people come
"out" a bit and realise they can buy better clothes in Primark or even
eBay and the same snake oil potions, pills and creams in their local GNC
for half or even a 10th of the price, so people don't go back and tend
to slag them off something rotten.

> For fun, I submitted a bogus business plan just to see what would
> happen. Nothing did.

Well yes. Mind I dare say if you had wanted to set-up a business as a TS
Dominatrix or buy a franchise to set up your own Transformations shop
they might have been a bit more forthcoming, who knows? :)

My only dealings with Transformations, was I sent off 2 UKP in postage
stamps for their catalogue and literature once back about 11 or 12 years
ago now and could see strait-away it was a bit of a Joke.

I also visited one of their shops (in Bristol) once about 7 years ago
with a CD friend who wanted to buy some industrial grade foundation
(Dermablend) in a little pot for 40UKP. (more money than sense LOL)

I'm afraid being rather "out" I was pretty much full-time even then, my
friend and I had great hilarity about some of the stuff they were
selling such as fake plastic vaginas, and the most horrendous mutton
chop sleeve dresses and blouses we had ever seen, not to mention the
usual range of outsized school uniforms, maid and plastic nurse gear LOL

Course the fact we were taking the 'P' seemed to make them a bit uneasy
and this enormous bouncer appeared, must have been a Giant (looked like
a bit like that English actor Oliver Reed who used to play in spooky
1960s thriller/horror films, but this guy seemed much much bigger),
never seen a man so big in all my life, at least 7ft tall and broad with
it, I hate to imagine what he looked like in a dress, he seemed nice
enough though, he smiled at me in a leering sort of way, and I felt like
I was about to be eaten alive like a small animal with paper thin bones,
so we promptly left LOL

> Do you know anything about the "rich businessman" who is suing his
> doctor for allowing him to have SRS? What a story! The only noted
> American case was in Buffalo, when they did a few SRS operations back
> in the 60s, and that was settled out of court. My goodness, I would
> love to see the pleadings in the English case. If you are passing by
> the Inns of Court, please get a copy!

Yes it would be quite interesting to hear more about that case. I don't
know much about how to get hold of court transcripts but there have been
some write-ups about this in various Newspapers. The best place to find
news about this sort of stuff though is probably
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TNUKdigest/
Which says:

"A free Internet News Service acting as a 'news' focal-point for the
UK's Trans Community, and includes some carefully selected relevant news
stories covering the World's Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender
Communities. These news resources generally come from;
Various respected L.G.B.T. Activists Contributors
Notices from the UK's Trans Gender Organisations
Transgendernews and other news lists"

The only regular contributor I actually recognise though is Gwen Smith,
so it's not all UK stuff :)

> When may I expect your credit card number? A trip to England would
> be nice about now...

I'm afraid you'll have to join the cue along with EBay (feeBay) LOL

Willow

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Apr 9, 2004, 11:07:37 AM4/9/04
to
Dear Amanda,

Yes, the same group. My memory said "a town in New York" which was Albany,
not Rochester. Funny place from your description.

Like you, it seems, I have to limit my eBay time. The new on-line
bookstores tend to leave a little on the monthly table, and that almost
always finds a home at eBay. I have yet to get around the freight charges,
especially from the UK.

That bouncer! What a picture!!! Here we call them loggers and most could
carry a full log down from the mountains! Love your description!

It will be interesting, to say the least, to see what happens with that
case. English law is often used in Canadian courts, so it dies actually
have some impact here. I dare say that many such cases are settled out of
court - the only "for sure" one in North America is from Buffalo, when it
did SRS for a few years back in the 60s. That settled out of court. The
pleadings? Go to the court registry, ask for the court file (you need the
name and starting year) and pay a nominal copy charge. Easy if you can get
to the courthouse.

Willow


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Amanda Angelika

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Apr 9, 2004, 5:33:33 PM4/9/04
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In news:Z_ydc.55977$Pk3.10993@pd7tw1no,
Willow <pang...@shaw.ca> typed:

> Dear Amanda,
>
> Yes, the same group. My memory said "a town in New York" which was
> Albany, not Rochester. Funny place from your description.

:) Yes I always remember the name because there's an Albany Road not far
from where I live, quite a popular Cardiff Street really, I used to do
my shopping there and coincidentally my doctor has his practice there
to, so I was referred to Charring Cross via somewhere called "Albany
Road Surgery", but most definitely not to be confused with the Albany
Gender Clinic LOL

> Like you, it seems, I have to limit my eBay time. The new on-line
> bookstores tend to leave a little on the monthly table, and that
> almost always finds a home at eBay. I have yet to get around the
> freight charges, especially from the UK.

Well actually the Pound is strong at present about 1.80 USD, so out
postal charges probably do seem a bit scary. I always charge 5 UKP for
postage and packing within the UK, well it costs me about 2 UKP for
actual postage (recorded delivery) and about 1.50 UKP for packaging and
I round it up to 5 UKP to cover my eBay listing fees and time. I have to
charge 9 UKP to the US and Canada, if I am going to use signed For
International Air parcel service, which is the safest, because it offers
"track and trace" but pricey all the same. Course with my paintings
people know they are getting a bargain so don't seem to quibble about
it. :)

Mind a lot of people list things with a really cheap starting price and
add the shortfall to the postage and packing, it's the oldest eBay
marketing ploy in the book :)

> That bouncer! What a picture!!! Here we call them loggers and most
> could carry a full log down from the mountains! Love your
> description!

Thanks :)

> It will be interesting, to say the least, to see what happens with
> that case. English law is often used in Canadian courts, so it dies
> actually have some impact here. I dare say that many such cases are
> settled out of court - the only "for sure" one in North America is
> from Buffalo, when it did SRS for a few years back in the 60s. That
> settled out of court. The pleadings? Go to the court registry, ask
> for the court file (you need the name and starting year) and pay a
> nominal copy charge. Easy if you can get to the courthouse.

I don't know whether it has come up yet. The law takes it's time. I know
Russell Reid was up before the GMC about it, but was I believe
acquitted, but I shall look out for it. Should make the papers when it
does. :)


--
Amanda
--
Art auctions:
eBay: www.tinyurl.com/q5hx
eBid: http://tinyurl.com/37efa

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Jennifer Usher

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Apr 9, 2004, 10:21:36 PM4/9/04
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"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:stmdc.52349$Pk3.8045@pd7tw1no...

> Now you can solve one of the riddles of "alt.support.srs"...
>
> Do you think you are a true transsexual? For a mere $100 (U.S. Funds) you
> can have your very own "Certified Approved Transsexual Certificate",
> suitable for framing. Printed on the rarest of papers and engraved for
> quality appearance, every certificate is accompanied by a wallet size
> certificate, for your convenience.
>
> Please contact us for this special offer. To insure quality control of
our
> certificates, we shall require a personal meeting to verify your standing
as
> a transsexual. Air fare, hotel and other expenses (not included in the
> price) are required. To insure prompt service, please forward your credit
> card name, number and expiry date. Your PIN number is also required for
> full service.
>
> Please do not apply if you are *not* a true transsexual. Those with
beards,
> a penis, testicles, hairy arm pits or legs, or Adam's apples may contact
us
> for our special consultancy service to advise on how you can become a
> Certified Approved Transsexual ("CAT").

Or, you can do what I am doing, and go to a qualified therapist and request
your letters for surgery. Or you can do what Mr. Willow did, and find some
quack who doesn't know enough to protect someone from having surgery for the
wrong reasons.

--
Jennifer Usher


Jennifer Usher

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Apr 9, 2004, 10:40:52 PM4/9/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:uFodc.52717$Pk3.51972@pd7tw1no...

> Do you know anything about the "rich businessman" who is suing his doctor
> for allowing him to have SRS? What a story! The only noted American case
> was in Buffalo, when they did a few SRS operations back in the 60s, and
that
> was settled out of court. My goodness, I would love to see the pleadings
in
> the English case. If you are passing by the Inns of Court, please get a
> copy!

It was discussed here a few weeks ago. The case reminded me a lot of your
situation. The man was clearly not a transsexual, was an autogynephile, and
was approved for surgery in spite of the fact that it was clearly not
warranted. The poor few finally realized his mistake, and is now suing the
doctor who approved him for surgery. Of course it was also somewhat
different. His motivations for surgery had to do more with thinking women
had it easier than men, whereas yours arose from a fear of men after being
raped. So tell us, are you now thinking of cashing in on your mistake?

--
Jennifer Usher


Willow

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Apr 10, 2004, 9:42:30 AM4/10/04
to
Hi Amada,

...such a strange buzzing noise from the computer. Ah well, it is gone
now...

eBay is addictive. And I have found it to be a good place to look for
things that are not available in Canada. We get a lot of American products,
but certainly not all. Some movies for the TS collection have shown up
there, even a book or two.

I think my major find was a wonderful "Irish Walking Cape". I found it on
Amazon, at a store in New York, for $250. Out of my range. Then teh same
on an Internet search in Ireland for $150. I finally got one, totally new,
on eBay for $50. I also like Burberry accessories, and can find them on
eBay for a fraction of the store cost here. A few have been fakes, but that
is a small minority.

Willow


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Dame Foo

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Apr 10, 2004, 1:00:03 PM4/10/04
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"Jennifer Usher" <jenni...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:U8Jdc.3915$A_4....@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

> It was discussed here a few weeks ago. The case reminded me a lot of your
> situation. The man was clearly not a transsexual, was an autogynephile,
and
> was approved for surgery in spite of the fact that it was clearly not
> warranted. The poor few finally realized his mistake, and is now suing
the
> doctor who approved him for surgery. Of course it was also somewhat
> different. His motivations for surgery had to do more with thinking women
> had it easier than men, whereas yours arose from a fear of men after being
> raped. So tell us, are you now thinking of cashing in on your mistake?
>
> --
> Jennifer Usher

Oh look here, the crossdresser with progressive transsexual fetish, Tommy
Usher, attacks a post operative transsexual woman. It's for real now
Tommy - we believe you when you say you are a true transsexual because you
"almost" have your first letter after 7 or 8 years of being a transvestite.
You've taken all the right steps. You even moved to San Francisco where
nobody would care about your lifestyle.


Willow

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Apr 10, 2004, 3:39:21 PM4/10/04
to
Dame Foo,

It is, I fear, same old, same old, with Usher.

While Usher elects to use her own unique system, both Bailey and Blanchard
agree that there are two types of transsexuals - the homosexual transsexual
and the autogyniphilic transsexual. Neither is a "true" transsexual; both
are.. For more on that, I suggest you read the Summer (106) Edition of
TAPESTRY Magazine.

Usher, as she normally proclaims, is a church going christian. Of course,
going to church every Sunday no more proves you are a christian than
sleeping in a garage at night proves you are a car.

Willow


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Amanda Angelika

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Apr 10, 2004, 5:50:50 PM4/10/04
to
In news:aRSdc.69669$oR5.48269@pd7tw3no,
Willow <pang...@shaw.ca> typed:

> Hi Amada,
>
> ...such a strange buzzing noise from the computer. Ah well, it is
> gone now...
>
> eBay is addictive. And I have found it to be a good place to look for
> things that are not available in Canada. We get a lot of American
> products, but certainly not all. Some movies for the TS collection
> have shown up there, even a book or two.

Well I can't say I have ever particularly missed American products. That
said I used to like American cars, but in terms of size style and just
pure Art the heyday of American cars was the 1950s and early 60s and IMO
its all been downhill ever since apart perhaps from the Humvee :)

> I think my major find was a wonderful "Irish Walking Cape". I found
> it on Amazon, at a store in New York, for $250. Out of my range.
> Then teh same on an Internet search in Ireland for $150. I finally
> got one, totally new, on eBay for $50. I also like Burberry
> accessories, and can find them on eBay for a fraction of the store
> cost here. A few have been fakes, but that is a small minority.

Yes I've been thinking of buying myself a Gucci watch on eBay, fake of
course, but even the fakes are well designed :)

--
Amanda
--
Art auctions:
eBay: www.tinyurl.com/q5hx
eBid: http://tinyurl.com/37efa

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Jennifer Usher

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Apr 10, 2004, 7:08:36 PM4/10/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:J3Ydc.68733$Pk3.25834@pd7tw1no...

> Dame Foo,
>
> It is, I fear, same old, same old, with Usher.
>
> While Usher elects to use her own unique system, both Bailey and Blanchard
> agree that there are two types of transsexuals - the homosexual
transsexual
> and the autogyniphilic transsexual. Neither is a "true" transsexual; both
> are.. For more on that, I suggest you read the Summer (106) Edition of
> TAPESTRY Magazine.

Now there you go again, Mr. Willow. Like a bad shyster, which of course you
were before you had your penis inverted and started claiming disability
(while trying to work off the record in violation of the law), you simply
make stuff up, and present it, expecting people to accept it without
question. There is nothing unique about my system. Just as there is
nothing truthful in Blanchard's and Bailey's hateful attacks on
transsexuals. Of course, according to Bailey, there are no transsexuals at
all. Only gay men who are so effeminate that they have SRS, specifically in
order to have multible sex partners, and men who are so turned on by the
idea of becoming women that they go overboard and seek out the surgery. In
another words, Bailey denies your claim to womanhood. And yet, so that you
can be a "real transsexual," you pimp for him. How sad. You plug his
screwy theories, and he calls you a transsexual. I believe the word is
"codependent." And the saddest part for you is, you don't even meet
Bailey's and Blanchards criteria. You are a mentally crippled little man,
so scared of men that you had to stop being one yourself. If Bailey were
honest, which is not one of his qualities at all, he would point that out to
you. But as I said, he needs suckers like you who will trade their souls
for his imprimatur.

> Usher, as she normally proclaims, is a church going christian. Of course,
> going to church every Sunday no more proves you are a christian than
> sleeping in a garage at night proves you are a car.

Bailey has been exposed as a fraud, a pervert, a liar, and his theories have
been rejected by people who actually work with transsexuals. The only ones
who believe him are the Religious Right, and sad cases such as yourself, who
seem him as your only hope at being called a transssexual, even if it means
you won't really be called a woman.

Ah still the same bigot as always Mr. Willow? You are as predictable as
Lyle Blake, another male who likes to invade this group periodically. You
come in, try to prove yourself a "true" transsexual, fail, and leave
swearing to never return again.... You are, in many ways, a sadder case
than Lyle. At least he never made the mistake of having surgery.

--
Jennifer Usher


Karen A.

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Apr 10, 2004, 9:22:26 PM4/10/04
to
Willow <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote:

> While Usher elects to use her own unique system, both Bailey and Blanchard
> agree that there are two types of transsexuals - the homosexual transsexual
> and the autogyniphilic transsexual. Neither is a "true" transsexual; both
> are.. For more on that, I suggest you read the Summer (106) Edition of
> TAPESTRY Magazine.

Bailey and Blanchard "science" is notrhing of the sort. Their methodolgy
was simply not scientifically sound and the conclusions simple their oen
conjectures not supportd by any *valid* data...

In just about any other area papers published on that basis that kind of
"science" would never have been published in a peer reviewed journal...
and IMO the implications of *that* are tragic.

- karen

Willow

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Apr 10, 2004, 10:00:55 PM4/10/04
to
Tedious, Usher - really tedious.

The only think that might make it worse is if you understood what you were
writing about. As it is, just blather...

W.

Willow

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Apr 10, 2004, 10:05:37 PM4/10/04
to
Karen,

I have Blanchard's twenty one papers, starting in 1985 or so. The total
number of subjects was well over 2,000 - the Dutch brains studies used 7,
Anne Bolin 16 or so. Bailey doing an anecdotal book, he does not use the
more clinical methods of Blanchard. Msot TS studies have under 20.

I suspect from your comments that the only valid data you would accept is
that which supported your positon. Blanchard's work is indeed well
docuemnted and in not conjecture.

No matter. Like Usher, remain as you are.

W.

Jennifer Usher

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Apr 10, 2004, 10:40:34 PM4/10/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:rF1ec.71221$Pk3.29866@pd7tw1no...

> Tedious, Usher - really tedious.

If you wish. Of course, the last resort of one such as yourself is to
simply dismiss that which you cannot refute.

> The only think that might make it worse is if you understood what you were
> writing about. As it is, just blather...

In another words, you cannot respond, so like the classic shyster, you
simply wave your hand, and say "pish posh," it is unworthy of rebuttal. Of
course, we all know that you cannot refute what I said. Bailey and
Blanchard are both bigots with considerable disdain for transsexuals. They
have produced research to match their desired results.

--
Jennifer Usher


Jennifer Usher

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Apr 10, 2004, 10:49:49 PM4/10/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:RJ1ec.75401$oR5.24582@pd7tw3no...

> I have Blanchard's twenty one papers, starting in 1985 or so. The total
> number of subjects was well over 2,000 - the Dutch brains studies used 7,
> Anne Bolin 16 or so. Bailey doing an anecdotal book, he does not use the
> more clinical methods of Blanchard. Msot TS studies have under 20.

Blanchard has had well over 2,000 subjects because he held a monopoly on
their care, or more to the point, their denial of care. I have read
Blanchard's work. Prior to his "discovery" of autogynephilia, he had very
to say about transsexuals that was not negative. The clinic he ran put
transsexuals on low dose birth control pills for hormones, and then reported
the "scientific conclusion" that hormones have no real effect on them. And
that after requiring them to live full time for three months before they
were allowed even that. His associates made very hateful remarks about
their research subjects. And Bailey, fraud that he is, does not present his
book as anecdotal. He presents it as conclusive fact. Bailey clearly has
not met transsexuals outside of a very narrow range. His primary source of
subjects was a bar in Chicago. A bar that mostly caters to transsexual
prostitutes and their admirers. Even if his book were presented as
anecdotal, that would be bad writing.

> I suspect from your comments that the only valid data you would accept is
> that which supported your positon. Blanchard's work is indeed well
> docuemnted and in not conjecture.

ROTFL!!! How droll. You accuse Karen of exactly what Bailey, and
Blanchard, have done. Blanchard examined transsexuals in a tightly
controlled clincal situation where they were denied proper care. His
research is meaningless. I mean really, giving people low doses of
hormones, and then concluding that hormones have no effect? How can you
defend such as that?

> No matter. Like Usher, remain as you are.

Yes, smart enough to see through your bizarre prejudices.

--
Jennifer Usher


Willow

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Apr 10, 2004, 10:55:56 PM4/10/04
to
Actually Jennifer - don't bother. I am very sure you do not meet the
qualifications.

For a start, you must be human...

W.


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Karen A.

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Apr 10, 2004, 11:02:58 PM4/10/04
to
Willow <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote:

> I have Blanchard's twenty one papers, starting in 1985 or so. The total
> number of subjects was well over 2,000 - the Dutch brains studies used 7,
> Anne Bolin 16 or so. Bailey doing an anecdotal book, he does not use the
> more clinical methods of Blanchard. Msot TS studies have under 20.

No. Subjects do not speak to methodology and randomness of the sample.
Blanchard started oiut with belifs that he set out to "prove"... not
with a hypothesis suggested by data...

In any case I can unequivally say that his theories don't cover the
lives and motivations of many transsexuals... myself included... And
when speaking about myself the sample is 100% of the population...

- Karen

Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 10, 2004, 11:04:14 PM4/10/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:RJ1ec.75401$oR5.24582@pd7tw3no...

> I have Blanchard's twenty one papers, starting in 1985 or so. The total
> number of subjects was well over 2,000 - the Dutch brains studies used 7,
> Anne Bolin 16 or so. Bailey doing an anecdotal book, he does not use the
> more clinical methods of Blanchard. Msot TS studies have under 20.

And and just so you are shown for the fraud that you are, I have to point
out that it is more than a bit dishonest to refer to the Dutch study as
having only 7 subjects. That was true of the first study, which was
published in 1995. But a more recent study was done with 42 subjects, and
it confirmed the results of the first study, AND included better controls
which eliminated some possible issues from the first study.

It should also be pointed out that both Dutch studies were looking at
OBJECTIVE data, whereas Blanchard's research, as well as Bailey's, are at
best, subjective.

Now, Mr. Willow, what was that you were saying about not accepting data as
valid unless it fit one's desired results. Now is that what caused you to
ignore the second Dutch study, or are you just not as familiar with the
subject as you wish to pretend.

--
Jennifer Usher


Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 10, 2004, 11:06:18 PM4/10/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:0t2ec.75839$oR5.71811@pd7tw3no...

> Actually Jennifer - don't bother. I am very sure you do not meet the
> qualifications.
>
> For a start, you must be human...

How droll. No wonder you are no longer an attorney. Your wit rises almost
to the level of kindergarten.

--
Jennifer Usher


Paulinev01

unread,
Apr 10, 2004, 11:22:17 PM4/10/04
to
>Bailey and Blanchard "science"

Now if you believe them I have some swamp land in antartica I would like to
sell you.

most of us were4 never either. but then how can a straight man or woman
understand that. much less one who is in love with the idea of being a woman (
Anne Lawrence) or a homosexual who becomes a woman to justify sex with a man.

A woman who has a transsexual past does not have to be defined, she is just
another woman. It only important that the person you love loves you back, not
the sex they are.

P/B

WHEN ITS TIME ITS TIME
The hardest step of any journey is the first,
The most satisfying is the last.........
www.TAVAUSA.org
www.TSTGSociety.org
REV Pauline Overby
www.churchofopenassumptions.org
PAULINE/Paula

Amanda Angelika

unread,
Apr 11, 2004, 12:11:58 AM4/11/04
to
In news:RJ1ec.75401$oR5.24582@pd7tw3no,
Willow <pang...@shaw.ca> typed:

> Karen,
>
> I have Blanchard's twenty one papers, starting in 1985 or so. The
> total number of subjects was well over 2,000 - the Dutch brains
> studies used 7, Anne Bolin 16 or so. Bailey doing an anecdotal book,
> he does not use the more clinical methods of Blanchard. Msot TS
> studies have under 20.
>
> I suspect from your comments that the only valid data you would
> accept is that which supported your positon. Blanchard's work is
> indeed well docuemnted and in not conjecture.
>
> No matter. Like Usher, remain as you are.
>
> W.

Of course one could draw the conclusion that the behaviour Bailey
observed was simply a result of brainsex. Bailey's theories and findings
are as meaningless as two blind men thinking an elephant is a snake,
they are just theories based on Freudian psychology and about as
meaningful as explaining female sexuality as penis envy.


--
Amanda
--
Art auctions:
eBay: www.tinyurl.com/q5hx
eBid: http://tinyurl.com/37efa

---


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Willow

unread,
Apr 11, 2004, 12:21:06 AM4/11/04
to
Good heavens - not even a full moon and yet here they are!

No matter. It is rather fun to watch and Jennifer has done an excellent job
of providing some choice quotes. They shall be most useful. Pauline is
charming - she and I were both ordained by the same church. Amanda, I trust
you shall continue to enjoy eBay as do I. I so hope you have a life outside
of this list...

I really don't care to remain here too long at a time. It tends to be
depressing to see the same old types repeating the same old song - I believe
Paul Simon referred to a "one trick pony".

W.


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 11, 2004, 1:29:14 AM4/11/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:SI3ec.76444$oR5.70337@pd7tw3no...

> Good heavens - not even a full moon and yet here they are!
>
> No matter. It is rather fun to watch and Jennifer has done an excellent
job
> of providing some choice quotes. They shall be most useful. Pauline is
> charming - she and I were both ordained by the same church. Amanda, I
trust
> you shall continue to enjoy eBay as do I. I so hope you have a life
outside
> of this list...
>
> I really don't care to remain here too long at a time. It tends to be
> depressing to see the same old types repeating the same old song - I
believe
> Paul Simon referred to a "one trick pony".

How typical. You come in, spew your usual crap (talk about a "one trick
pony") and then leave when you arguments get shot down. I can just see you
in court. As soon as the prosecution rests, you look at your client and
say, "Whoops, I've got to run. The prosecutor made a pretty good case, but
I'm going to pretend it wasn't, so call me and let me know how many years
you get sentenced to..."

--
Jennifer Usher


Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 11, 2004, 1:31:58 AM4/11/04
to

"Karen A." <kaa-...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1gc1uge.xv2hpl1lewf9cN%kaa-...@comcast.net...

> Willow <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> > I have Blanchard's twenty one papers, starting in 1985 or so. The total
> > number of subjects was well over 2,000 - the Dutch brains studies used
7,
> > Anne Bolin 16 or so. Bailey doing an anecdotal book, he does not use
the
> > more clinical methods of Blanchard. Msot TS studies have under 20.
>
> No. Subjects do not speak to methodology and randomness of the sample.
> Blanchard started oiut with belifs that he set out to "prove"... not
> with a hypothesis suggested by data...

Exactly. His population was good, but his methodology offset that.

> In any case I can unequivally say that his theories don't cover the
> lives and motivations of many transsexuals... myself included... And
> when speaking about myself the sample is 100% of the population...

Blanchard and Bailey make broad assumptions, and then blind themselves to
anything that does not fit their preconceived theory. I know way more
exceptions than people who fit their views.

--
Jennifer Usher


Anne Marie Tobias

unread,
Apr 11, 2004, 8:24:08 AM4/11/04
to
Paulinev01 wrote:

>>Bailey and Blanchard "science"
>
>
> Now if you believe them I have some swamp land in antartica I would like to
> sell you.
>
> most of us were4 never either. but then how can a straight man or woman
> understand that. much less one who is in love with the idea of being a woman (
> Anne Lawrence) or a homosexual who becomes a woman to justify sex with a man.
>
> A woman who has a transsexual past does not have to be defined, she is just
> another woman. It only important that the person you love loves you back, not
> the sex they are.
>
> P/B

I actually know of a homosexual who lied his ass off, to a therapist. he
was so homophobic (a kid from Colorado, raised by serious Xtians, and
was in the Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs), that he convinced his
therapist to let him get SRS.

It ruined his life. He literally came apart at the seams and needed to
be institutionalized. These assholes in labcoats need to figure this
out. The center of a homosexual's life is HIS PENIS! Make it go away,
and he finds a high place to do a swan dive from the next day. Even drag
queens get all green around the gills when you mention SRS. If having
the penis inverted sounds good... then it's a transsexual... DUH! Drag
queens are men. People who get SRS aren't (except for maybe that itty
bitty bunch of fetishist on steroids... the AGs.)

A recent report suggested the vast majority of post-ops are celibate. It
makes no sense to have SRS, to get lots of sex with men, then become
celibate. Somebody needs to explain to these guys, the pure danger of
doing research, while wearing their own rectums like party hats.

Marie


Karen A.

unread,
Apr 11, 2004, 10:59:41 AM4/11/04
to
Anne Marie Tobias <mar...@got.net> wrote:

> A recent report suggested the vast majority of post-ops are celibate.

If it's true, I doubt it is because the majority prefer it that way.

- Karen

Willow

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 12:02:50 AM4/12/04
to
Jennifer, honey,

I came here to get a quotable quote. You provided that in minutes and so I
need not remain. You see, I needed a true example of absolute and total TS
garbage. Your posts gave me some wonderful examples.

Never mind, dear, you can see yourself in print shortly. I shall attribute
your words merely to this newsgroup (I don't think you would like to read
your own words attributed to you)...

Just one - the rest you have to wait for..

"Only gay men who are so effeminate that they have SRS, specifically in

order to have multible [sic] sex partners, and men who are so turned on by


the
idea of becoming women that they go overboard and seek out the surgery"

Willow


"Jennifer Usher" <jenni...@earthlink.net> wrote in message

news:KI4ec.5293$A_4....@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

Plain Jane

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 12:34:10 AM4/12/04
to
"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:Kxoec.84223$Ig.10853@pd7tw2no...

> Jennifer, honey,
>
> I came here to get a quotable quote. You provided that in minutes and so
I
> need not remain. You see, I needed a true example of absolute and total
TS
> garbage. Your posts gave me some wonderful examples.
>
> Never mind, dear, you can see yourself in print shortly. I shall
attribute
> your words merely to this newsgroup (I don't think you would like to read
> your own words attributed to you)...
>
> Just one - the rest you have to wait for..
>
> "Only gay men who are so effeminate that they have SRS, specifically in
> order to have multible [sic] sex partners, and men who are so turned on by
> the
> idea of becoming women that they go overboard and seek out the surgery"
>
> Willow

This should be good. Where will it be printed? Can't wait to see what the
rest of your ascerbic article tends towards.

Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 12:49:36 AM4/12/04
to

"Paulinev01" <pauli...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:20040410232217...@mb-m20.news.cs.com...

> >Bailey and Blanchard "science"
>
> Now if you believe them I have some swamp land in antartica I would like
to
> sell you.
>
> most of us were4 never either. but then how can a straight man or woman
> understand that. much less one who is in love with the idea of being a
woman (
> Anne Lawrence) or a homosexual who becomes a woman to justify sex with a
man.

The sad part of Bailey's theory is that he classifies as transsexuals as
being in one of two catergories where surgery is contraindicated. While
there have been cases of gay men who sought SRS to justify sex, they end
badly. Gay men do not wish to be seen as women by their partners. That is
why they are gay, they want to be men, having sex with men.

> A woman who has a transsexual past does not have to be defined, she is
just
> another woman. It only important that the person you love loves you back,
not
> the sex they are.

I agree. I need the love more than the sex, not that the sex won't be
important also. <g>

--
Jennifer Usher


Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 12:55:23 AM4/12/04
to

"Anne Marie Tobias" <mar...@got.net> wrote in message
news:1tOdnQdAbub...@got.net...

> I actually know of a homosexual who lied his ass off, to a therapist. he
> was so homophobic (a kid from Colorado, raised by serious Xtians, and
> was in the Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs), that he convinced his
> therapist to let him get SRS.

It happens.

> It ruined his life. He literally came apart at the seams and needed to
> be institutionalized. These assholes in labcoats need to figure this
> out. The center of a homosexual's life is HIS PENIS! Make it go away,
> and he finds a high place to do a swan dive from the next day. Even drag
> queens get all green around the gills when you mention SRS. If having
> the penis inverted sounds good... then it's a transsexual... DUH! Drag
> queens are men. People who get SRS aren't (except for maybe that itty
> bitty bunch of fetishist on steroids... the AGs.)

Uh, Bailey and his garbage aside, ego dystonic homosexuality has been
considered a major contraindication to SRS for a long time. As I said, gay
men want to be men having sex with men, not women having sex with men.

> A recent report suggested the vast majority of post-ops are celibate. It
> makes no sense to have SRS, to get lots of sex with men, then become
> celibate. Somebody needs to explain to these guys, the pure danger of
> doing research, while wearing their own rectums like party hats.

Funny, my therapist mentioned something along this line on Friday. She
mentioned that some post-ops find sex to be uncomfortable. Of course, that
can also be true for genetic women when they first start having sex. Of
course, if one is simply having sex for the sake of having sex, that would
be more of a problem than having sex because you are in a loving
relationship and wish to be intimate with your partner.

--
Jennifer Usher


Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 12:59:41 AM4/12/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:Kxoec.84223$Ig.10853@pd7tw2no...

> I came here to get a quotable quote. You provided that in minutes and so
I
> need not remain. You see, I needed a true example of absolute and total
TS
> garbage. Your posts gave me some wonderful examples.

That's nice.

> Never mind, dear, you can see yourself in print shortly. I shall
attribute
> your words merely to this newsgroup (I don't think you would like to read
> your own words attributed to you)...

Have at it. You use my name, and I will consider that an invasion of
privacy. Then again, I don't grant you permission to use my words, period.

> Just one - the rest you have to wait for..
>
> "Only gay men who are so effeminate that they have SRS, specifically in
> order to have multible [sic] sex partners, and men who are so turned on by
> the
> idea of becoming women that they go overboard and seek out the surgery"

Ah, I see. You plan to take a comment out of context. Oh well, as I said,
you are specifically denied permission to quote me for any purpose.

And I stand by what I said. You cannot answer points raised here, but you
try to bluster your way through.

--
Jennifer Usher


Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 1:00:31 AM4/12/04
to

"Plain Jane" <sc...@ofthedamned.com> wrote in message
news:6%oec.17968$rg5.39494@attbi_s52...

> This should be good. Where will it be printed? Can't wait to see what
the
> rest of your ascerbic article tends towards.

I suspect it will tend towards more BS from Mr. Willow.

--
Jennifer Usher


Plain Jane

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 10:48:07 AM4/12/04
to
"Jennifer Usher" <jenni...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:1npec.6498$A_4....@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...

> Have at it. You use my name, and I will consider that an invasion of
> privacy. Then again, I don't grant you permission to use my words,
period.

ROTFL :-) This kind of internet blather is always especially funny isn't it
then? You might consider it an invasion of privacy, but that would be a
delusional folly - for your statements are made to a public usegroup.
Everyone knows you cannot copyright or reserve rights on things like this.
You could be quoted in the San Francisco Chronicle or the New York Times,
and it is called Fair Use - you stated it publicly in a public forum, it's
"fair use" to use it to report news on the subject. You have made yourself
a public spectacle. The public should decide if you should be ridiculed or
marveled at. If you figure out how to stop this process, I am sure you
would make a lot of politicians happy as there are many who would love to be
able to control who has access to reprint their statements and who does not.
As it were, the way you have made a hypocritical ass of yourself on this
newsgroup, it would serve you right were your name in an article relating to
the facade of elitism, self-imagined greatness held forth at the expense of
others, or any number of topics. You don't have much to worry about I am
sure - it's doubtful Willow has contacts outside of Tapestry.


Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 12:36:45 PM4/12/04
to

"Plain Jane" <sc...@ofthedamned.com> wrote in message
news:H_xec.120149$w54.840326@attbi_s01...

> ROTFL :-) This kind of internet blather is always especially funny isn't
it
> then? You might consider it an invasion of privacy, but that would be a
> delusional folly - for your statements are made to a public usegroup.
> Everyone knows you cannot copyright or reserve rights on things like this.
> You could be quoted in the San Francisco Chronicle or the New York Times,
> and it is called Fair Use - you stated it publicly in a public forum, it's
> "fair use" to use it to report news on the subject. You have made
yourself
> a public spectacle. The public should decide if you should be ridiculed
or
> marveled at. If you figure out how to stop this process, I am sure you
> would make a lot of politicians happy as there are many who would love to
be
> able to control who has access to reprint their statements and who does
not.
> As it were, the way you have made a hypocritical ass of yourself on this
> newsgroup, it would serve you right were your name in an article relating
to
> the facade of elitism, self-imagined greatness held forth at the expense
of
> others, or any number of topics. You don't have much to worry about I am
> sure - it's doubtful Willow has contacts outside of Tapestry.

I'm not worried at all. I'm just messing with his mind on this one. I do
always find it amusing how some seem to think transsexuals guilty of some
sort of elitism simply because we don't care to have our experiences
coopted.

--
Jennifer Usher


Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 6:26:22 PM4/12/04
to

"Sandra251" <sand...@notmyrealaddy.com> wrote in message
news:Xns94C97DC483B34s...@207.217.125.204...

> It's always important to remember that libel, slander, and defamation of
> character are litigious issues, so one has to walk an extremely fine line
> when using someone else's words in the context of offering an opinion on
> something said by another. Especially if such quotes could actually be
> tracked back to the specific individuals involved.

This is true. Especially if they are put into print, or used in some manner
that makes money for the person using them. Of course, Arune has talked
about being in some sort of academic program. If they are used in a context
such as that...well, one only has to look at his hero Bailey to see what can
happen there. Actually, I suspect, as usual, it is just all bluster.

--
Jennifer Usher


Willow

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 7:14:26 PM4/12/04
to
Dear Sweet Jennifer,

If you had a mind, I am sure it was already messed up.

In any event, you post with a given name on a public list. I welcome
any legal action you might care to start. Need an address for
service??? actually, printing your name might give you some noterity,
which would be what you like, so you will have to simply make do with
the quotes only. I might just refer to the writer of some TV fluff
stories as the source...

"Every time you type you type crap from ..." Gosh - it even has a
tune.

W.

Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 7:25:55 PM4/12/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:1acbc92.04041...@posting.google.com...

Still around Mr. Willow?

> If you had a mind, I am sure it was already messed up.

Cute. Which is an appropriate description of your childish taunts.

> In any event, you post with a given name on a public list. I welcome
> any legal action you might care to start. Need an address for
> service??? actually, printing your name might give you some noterity,
> which would be what you like, so you will have to simply make do with
> the quotes only. I might just refer to the writer of some TV fluff
> stories as the source...

Legal action? I don't think it will be necessary, as I suspect this is all
more of your usual bluster. Of course, if you did choose to proceed as you
suggest, that would be a good cause for action, as such is not true, thus
depriving you of the primary defense in a defamation claim. But again,
bluster is just, well bluster.

> "Every time you type you type crap from ..." Gosh - it even has a
> tune.

Have fun. Your childish attempts at rhetoric still won't make you a
woman...just a childish man.

--
Jennifer Usher


Willow

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 10:06:46 PM4/12/04
to
Ah, Jenny Baby,

That's right. You and Sandra exchanging legal opinions is like two
blind men arguing over the colour green. But hey - that's you!

Actually, I think I have done well. I have at long last found a use
for you, Jenny dear. When totally useless for anything else, you so
serve so well as a bad example. The best I could find.

Plese, pretty please, sue. When the posts are public in nature, on a
public forum where you identify yourself. Damn - Sandra must be
right, eh? Head off to Legal Aid tomorrow. What you want is an
injuction to prevent me from writing! Mercy yes!!! Come on, Jenny.
Do it!!! Slander is verbal, liable written. And damages! You have
to prove those, dear.

One reason why lawyers like those like you - if you had any money,
that is - is that you make so much work in a loosing cause.

A reminder that if any registry actually accepts such an action, you
are personally liable for the costs of the other side when you loose.
That or dismissed as frivolous and vexations, not to mention trying to
get across one international boundary. Of course, you don't have any
assets, do you? But hey, there must be a lawyer out ther somewher to
help a beautiful woman like you. Mel Gibson is tied up with his move
and I don't think he has a license to practise.

Naw. Better go back to Blake bashing.

Geeze, you are a toot! Almsot as funny as "Homeland Security" on the
tube last night.

Jenny bacy, take an aspirin, go to bed, and all will be well in the
morning...

To good, Jenny, just tooooooooo good...

W.

Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 12, 2004, 11:19:42 PM4/12/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:1acbc92.04041...@posting.google.com...
> Ah, Jenny Baby,

Yes Mr. Willow?

> That's right. You and Sandra exchanging legal opinions is like two
> blind men arguing over the colour green. But hey - that's you!

No, but that just shows your lack of knowledge...


> Actually, I think I have done well. I have at long last found a use
> for you, Jenny dear. When totally useless for anything else, you so
> serve so well as a bad example. The best I could find.

Being used as a bad example by you would have to be considered an honor. I
certainly agree, I am quite the opposite of you.

> Plese, pretty please, sue. When the posts are public in nature, on a
> public forum where you identify yourself. Damn - Sandra must be
> right, eh? Head off to Legal Aid tomorrow. What you want is an
> injuction to prevent me from writing! Mercy yes!!! Come on, Jenny.
> Do it!!! Slander is verbal, liable written. And damages! You have
> to prove those, dear.

Knock yourself out. But then again, a lawyer who can't spell "libel?" You
really are a hoot. In any case, if you ever do commit libel, I will have no
problem proving malice.

> One reason why lawyers like those like you - if you had any money,
> that is - is that you make so much work in a loosing cause.

Again, as I said, your bluster is amusing, but....well, it is just bluster.

> A reminder that if any registry actually accepts such an action, you
> are personally liable for the costs of the other side when you loose.
> That or dismissed as frivolous and vexations, not to mention trying to
> get across one international boundary. Of course, you don't have any
> assets, do you? But hey, there must be a lawyer out ther somewher to
> help a beautiful woman like you. Mel Gibson is tied up with his move
> and I don't think he has a license to practise.

You know, silly little men like you, trying to pretend to be women, are so
funny. You take anything a woman says as so serious. Mel Gibson? Shoot,
he is happily married. I have my fantasies, like any woman, but I know the
difference between them, and reality.

> Naw. Better go back to Blake bashing.
>
> Geeze, you are a toot! Almsot as funny as "Homeland Security" on the
> tube last night.
>
> Jenny bacy, take an aspirin, go to bed, and all will be well in the
> morning...
>
> To good, Jenny, just tooooooooo good...

Such blathering bluster from a pitiful excuse for a man.

--
Jennifer Usher


Willow

unread,
Apr 13, 2004, 1:16:06 AM4/13/04
to
"Being used as a bad example by you would have to be considered an honour"

Consider yourself to be held in very high esteem by one and all, especially
me...

Take care, Jenny Baby. Must go do some other things now that the holiday is
over. Have a fun time looking for the true transsexual. Do you have a
candle???

W.

Jennifer Usher

unread,
Apr 13, 2004, 12:04:13 PM4/13/04
to

"Willow" <pang...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:qIKec.94436$Ig.33975@pd7tw2no...

> "Being used as a bad example by you would have to be considered an honour"
>
> Consider yourself to be held in very high esteem by one and all,
especially
> me...
>
> Take care, Jenny Baby. Must go do some other things now that the holiday
is
> over. Have a fun time looking for the true transsexual. Do you have a
> candle???

Yawn...

--
Jennifer Usher


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