The Impossible Mission - you chose it - Life
Your Name Here=Harvey
Using all manner of sources to provide a cohesive understanding
of 'reality' here in all it's implications...
We all go through the same process - that of living a life here on
earth. What does that imply?
You chose this life, no one is forced to live a life here, against
their wishes --- except almost all memory of this agreement has
been erased. (Part and parcel of the process called 'birth' and/or
reincarnation).
What life difficulties you face now, was accepted and agreed to, by
you - and you in fact chose to go through all of life's current
and future difficulties.
Life by the nature of life itself - is to 'live' - and not to 'die'.
Dying is merely the exit from this reality, back to that one where
you were before, before birth.
To say - enough is enough, I'm going home - early, right now, is not
on the cards, is against all the rules - so many thousands of suicides
take place every year, and adding yourself to that list, would do you
no honor.
Every person who takes their own life, will instantly regret it - and
it is a door where you cannot return from.
Only in very exceptional circumstances is there divine intervention,
in which a near-death experience occurs. But for almost all, there is
none (as everyone is master of their own destiny, like it or not, as
this is the nature of being, and of the human condition).
Given that, you accept the above and know it is true (check it out
by any means, using long periods of deep and thorough thinking of any
means) - wouldn't you live life differently? Knowing your life is a
divine test, at the end of which, you will return home, to your real
home.
This is only but one aspect of the very many I will cover in my
proposed book - any feedback will be welcomed, so that I will be
positively motivated to finish it --- it's current working title
(which is constantly changing, although the material inside, doesn't)
is something like ---
Truth 101 - Everything you wanted to ask about but never got adequate
answers for...
Harvey
sumire
I have copied your two other posts in my files and
will concentrate on their content later. Too much
brainfood for this morning hour during which
I am allowing myself access to the computer.
So you may get a response to those in a few days, okay?
But replying to this post will just be right now.
You wrote:
> We all go through the same process - that of living a
> life here on earth. What does that imply?
>
> You chose this life, no one is forced to live a life
> here, against their wishes --- except almost all
> memory of this agreement has been erased. (Part and
> parcel of the process called 'birth' and/or
> reincarnation).
Yep, I go with you in this point.
> What life difficulties you face now, was accepted and
> agreed to, by you - and you in fact chose to go through
> all of life's current and future difficulties.
To complete this idea: I think the circle of our being spirals from one
life to another, and by solving the
problems of one life you can be reborn on a higher
level of existence.
> Life by the nature of life itself - is to 'live' -
> and not to 'die'. Dying is merely the exit from this
> reality, back to that one where you were before, before
> birth.
Yep - the memory of which has been erased. As you said.
> To say - enough is enough, I'm going home - early, right
> now, is not on the cards, is against all the rules /snip/
> would do you no honor.
I think the word *honor* is slightly misplaced here. I mean it is okay for
you if you think in terms of honor. I who
do not think in terms of honor but in terms of DIGNITY
would not use that coinage.
To my mind the simple fact of suicide is that someone who takes their life
simply gives up and leaves that one life's problem(s) unresolved and has
to make a new start on a
level very much lower than the one he/she has been on before. And all the
suffering starts from anew.
But what IS suicide? Who knows how many fatal illnesses that we attribute
to a *higher plan* are summat roused by subconscious processes?
Who knows how much we - more or less consciously, depending
on the level of our awareness - follow the higher plan.
Where is the limit of suicide? So many people are self-destructive, in my
language we spak about suicide with fork and knife and mean the fact that
people eat so unhealthy and much that they will die earlier.
Or other people who drive riskily and cause their death - maybe taking
others with them? Do you know what I mean?
Did you get my point? There can also be kinda slow suicide,
or a more or less subconscious one.
So what you call *to live - and not to die* also implies
to make the best of your life, even to avoid self-destructive behaviour
and to influence your environment to be as life saving and supportive as
possible.
But who will dare judge people by the results of making the best of their
lives? I mean in India the pariah are despised for their misery 'coz "all
get the life they deserve" and
so they must have been bad people in their former lives.
What utmost cruelty of thinking!!!
No-one must judge others like that. The only attitude is mercy. And
helping those who are worse off.
> Every person who takes their own life, will instantly
> regret it - and it is a door where you cannot return from./snip/
Not by this door but who knows if there is not
another one? A new chance? Though an even harder one?
> Given that, you accept the above /snip/
> wouldn't you live life differently? Knowing your life
> is a divine test, at the end of which, you will return
> home, to your real home.
Yes, this is why I am trying to make the best of my life
and have always done since I understood its principles.
Though it can be damned hard sometimes, really hard to
go your way. To bear the hardships of fate and not to
give up yourself. It is kinda hard work, really.
BUT IT HAS ITS MERITS :-)
> This is only but one aspect of the very many I will cover
> in my proposed book - any feedback will be welcomed,
Hm, could YOU give ME a feedback on my feedback?
> so that I will be positively motivated to finish it ---
> it's current working title (which is constantly changing,
> although the material inside, doesn't)is something like >---
> Truth 101 - Everything you wanted to ask about but never
> got adequate answers for...
Good title. It implies the humbleness of assuming there are
100 other truths or more - which I guess exist.
We can never maintain the One-And-Only-Truth. Only humbly
work on getting summat closer to what we feel in our core
is true.
Much energy and love for your seeking the truth :-)
Sumi
Your Name Here=Harvey
In article
<f1169e5a53c1806a...@localhost.talkaboutsupport.com>,
sumire_...@nospam.yahoo.co.uk says...
>
>
>Hi Harvey,
>
>I have copied your two other posts in my files and
>will concentrate on their content later. Too much
>brainfood for this morning hour during which
>I am allowing myself access to the computer.
>So you may get a response to those in a few days, okay?
>
>But replying to this post will just be right now.
>
>You wrote:
>
>> We all go through the same process - that of living a
>> life here on earth. What does that imply?
>>
>> You chose this life, no one is forced to live a life
>> here, against their wishes --- except almost all
>> memory of this agreement has been erased. (Part and
>> parcel of the process called 'birth' and/or
>> reincarnation).
>
>Yep, I go with you in this point.
>
>> What life difficulties you face now, was accepted and
>> agreed to, by you - and you in fact chose to go through
>> all of life's current and future difficulties.
>
>To complete this idea: I think the circle of our being spirals from one
>life to another, and by solving the
>problems of one life you can be reborn on a higher
>level of existence.
I guess you present the view that one is evolving higher and higher
through one's lives (in terms of reincarnation) - while this is
desirable - that may not always happen?
Meaning that it may be possible to not advance but to get sidetracked
and not advance...?
I don't think everything is so predetermined - that everything is
so predictable?
>
>> Life by the nature of life itself - is to 'live' -
>> and not to 'die'. Dying is merely the exit from this
>> reality, back to that one where you were before, before
>> birth.
>
>Yep - the memory of which has been erased. As you said.
>
>> To say - enough is enough, I'm going home - early, right
>> now, is not on the cards, is against all the rules /snip/
>> would do you no honor.
>
>I think the word *honor* is slightly misplaced here. I mean it is okay for
>you if you think in terms of honor. I who
>do not think in terms of honor but in terms of DIGNITY
>would not use that coinage.
Yes, I thought 'honor' may not be the best to describe it, but I
had nothing better at time of writing...
Dignity has the better edge to it, I guess.
>
>To my mind the simple fact of suicide is that someone who takes their life
>simply gives up and leaves that one life's problem(s) unresolved and has
>to make a new start on a
>level very much lower than the one he/she has been on before. And all the
>suffering starts from anew.
>
>But what IS suicide? Who knows how many fatal illnesses that we attribute
>to a *higher plan* are summat roused by subconscious processes?
>Who knows how much we - more or less consciously, depending
>on the level of our awareness - follow the higher plan.
>
>Where is the limit of suicide? So many people are self-destructive, in my
>language we spak about suicide with fork and knife and mean the fact that
>people eat so unhealthy and much that they will die earlier.
>Or other people who drive riskily and cause their death - maybe taking
>others with them? Do you know what I mean?
>Did you get my point? There can also be kinda slow suicide,
>or a more or less subconscious one.
Point taken. Many suicides may not be so obvious, in which the person
may decide consciously to spare their family/etc the horror of a 'suicide',
so it appears to be more like an accident/etc.
There are a lot of motorway/etc deaths, in which the reason why is not
obvious at all. Good stretch of road, no other vehicle involved, good
driving conditions, yet the driver drove off the road and seemingly
killed oneself.
>
>So what you call *to live - and not to die* also implies
>to make the best of your life, even to avoid self-destructive behaviour
>and to influence your environment to be as life saving and supportive as
>possible.
>
>But who will dare judge people by the results of making the best of their
>lives? I mean in India the pariah are despised for their misery 'coz "all
>get the life they deserve" and
>so they must have been bad people in their former lives.
>
>What utmost cruelty of thinking!!!
>
>No-one must judge others like that. The only attitude is mercy. And
>helping those who are worse off.
While reincarnation is accepted and taught in the far east, there are
some aspects of it, that seem to be totally false.
ie. reincarnating as an insect or animal.
and being in a poor life because of the previous life actions...
>
>> Every person who takes their own life, will instantly
>> regret it - and it is a door where you cannot return from./snip/
>Not by this door but who knows if there is not
>another one? A new chance? Though an even harder one?
>
>> Given that, you accept the above /snip/
>> wouldn't you live life differently? Knowing your life
>> is a divine test, at the end of which, you will return
>> home, to your real home.
>
>Yes, this is why I am trying to make the best of my life
>and have always done since I understood its principles.
>Though it can be damned hard sometimes, really hard to
>go your way. To bear the hardships of fate and not to
>give up yourself. It is kinda hard work, really.
>BUT IT HAS ITS MERITS :-)
Living is not easy - when you seemingly have a decent standard of
living, etc - yet life can still be very difficult.
A friend pointed out - it is what a person 'needs' that is of
prime importance. So you can seemingly have a lot of good things in
life, but when you're missing terribly what you really need and want,
life can be very miserable indeed.
>
>> This is only but one aspect of the very many I will cover
>> in my proposed book - any feedback will be welcomed,
>
>Hm, could YOU give ME a feedback on my feedback?
>
>> so that I will be positively motivated to finish it ---
>> it's current working title (which is constantly changing,
>> although the material inside, doesn't)is something like >---
>> Truth 101 - Everything you wanted to ask about but never
>> got adequate answers for...
>
>Good title. It implies the humbleness of assuming there are
>100 other truths or more - which I guess exist.
>We can never maintain the One-And-Only-Truth. Only humbly
>work on getting summat closer to what we feel in our core
>is true.
101 is used for university courses, in their first year and starting
at the start/bottom.
201 would be for the second year, 301 for 3rd year, etc.
It would be possible to climb to 100 truths, but I think the number
is much smaller actually - but rather complex to answer one truth
adequately and completely...
Like --- explaining what the term 'world of illusion' really means,
as mystics describe life on earth, as an illusion.
Another term is 'forcing shed' explaining the same as above.
And then to explain - that it's not our primary purpose to know
'the truth' here, in this life, that is not a prime requirement to do.
Which appears to be nonsensical - but life is, here, that obscure at
times.
>
>Much energy and love for your seeking the truth :-)
>
>Sumi
>
>
The western mind is so heavily focused on the physicality and appearance
of this reality, thinking that is so important?
There are deeper issues involved.
That other post/text is very heavy stuff - but it is relevent, if you
want to know the whole truth and nothing but the truth of this
existence/reality. The other forces at work.
Harvey
Intercranial Otter Filter
OTS
"Your Name Here=Harvey" <y...@somewhere.not.aus> wrote in message
news:e9p5d.5305$mZ2.4...@news02.tsnz.net...
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sumire
Esp. if you include the possibility of parallel universes.
> but when you're missing terribly what you really need
> and want, life can be very miserable indeed.
How right you are, man, how right.
But what is left to us is make the best of life, anyway. No way out.
Wish you joy and pleasure writing your book :-)
Sumi
Your Name Here=Harvey
within - and not without.
Harvey
In article <2rnsqbF...@uni-berlin.de>, omega...@ntlworld.com
says...
Sklenge
reincarnation. Obviously I don't know because no one can know this at the
moment. Perhaps you're desire to describe it, to pin it down as it were,
will take everyone another smidgen nearer a/the truth.
But at the moment I'm not convinced. And, I don't think it matters either.
No offence to your theory but even with this theory there is a set path and
you trudge it until it's over and then you move on to the next path and
trudge that one... it's all a bit pointless (it makes me tired just thinking
of it) but if it happens then it happens - in a way, so what?
At the moment I believe this is it - 'I' didn't exist before 'I' was born
and 'I' won't exist once 'I'm' dead. You get seventy or so years and then
you die and that's an end of it. I'm quite content to think this is the case
and that doesn't matter either if I'm right or wrong, it doesn't matter.
It can't be changed. It's just a process. A bit like the non-destruction of
energy it moves in a cyclical motion, the only reincarnation I can sign up
to at the moment is the idea of dust to dust, at a molecular level we move
on to another existence. Is that what you meant?
Pneumatic Haberdasher
"Your Name Here=Harvey" <y...@somewhere.not.aus> wrote in message
news:e9p5d.5305$mZ2.4...@news02.tsnz.net...
>
> you - and you in fact chose to go through all of life's current
> and future difficulties.
>
for breach of contract?
sumire
whatchycallit.... If you try to make the best of
your life - hey, what else is there left to us in the end? -
it really doesn't make a difference whether you think about
any kind of life after death or before birth.
Hmmm, there are just people who can't accept that that is
it, you know? I mean that very *me* .... it can't simply
disappear. I can think of my body to decay and get to dust.
I can even think of most part of my mind getting lost.
But the very notion of what is *me* - there must be
something before and after.......dunno.....
I can't accept that heaven and hell thing, that dualism, you know? What i
think is that we have heaven as well as hell inside ourselves and choose
between them.
The idea of reincarnation simply makes more sense than
the Christian view. Hmmm, I feel I'm getting a bit incoherent at this
point but I'm simply tired.
Nightie night, Sklenge, just be fine you
Sumi
Intercranial Otter Filter
and watching bad movies.
OTS
"Your Name Here=Harvey" <y...@somewhere.not.aus> wrote in message
news:i6G5d.5448$mZ2.4...@news02.tsnz.net...
OB
let alone three hundred. In fact I'm pretty sure I'm someone else,
someone I probably wouldn't want to meet in a dark alley these days.
After seven years (is it?) there ain't a single cell in your body
that's not been usurped without your permission by the constant
insidious growth of dark gelatinous newness. So what's this "I" thing
when it's at home? Ach, a dog-eared pile of tired old sepia memories
etched in the neural pathways. Most of 'em blurred and probably the
odd moustache scribbled in somewhere along the road. Load of junk
really. And Harv, you won't meet a nice girl through a ouija board.
Carpe diem and let the dead bury their dead.
Sklenge <skl...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:<BD7D9E89.2302D%skl...@yahoo.co.uk>...
Eleonore Beaudoin
I never understood why people did not instead sue for a beach of contact...
>
>
--
Eleonore Beaudoin
"Intercranial Otter Filter" (omega...@ntlworld.com) writes:
> My higher consciousness? Oh, I blew all that away when I took up drinking
> and watching bad movies.
Wait a minute...! I thought it was your "higher SomethingElsenousness"
you had said that you lost while drinking..?
Hm.. Maybe that is cause you had to lose your something elsenousness to
miss your higher consciousness in this lifetime?
And if you find it in this lifetime, in the next, you will be punished and
lose it again, of course...
Ah, human beings...They find ways to prolong their roller coaster of a life
even after death!;-)
;-)
--
Pneumatic Haberdasher
"Eleonore Beaudoin" <bc...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA> wrote in message
news:cjaiap$euk$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca...
>> I specifically said "No ear hair." I never agreed to ear hair. Can I
>> sue
>> for breach of contract?
>
> I never understood why people did not instead sue for a beach of
> contact...
Uhh, the sand can really gum up the works, as they say, and with enough
money a man can practice serial monogamy well into his seventies. Just ask
Anna Nicole's late husband. You'll need to conduct a seance, but he'll back
me up on this.
A woman only needs enough money for a hot tub with lots of powerful water
jets (unless the porn industry has been lying to me all these years). I
understand you can get these little jets to propel a concentrated stream of
water in three speeds:
1- Slow
2- Medium
3- Who needs a man?
Sklenge
Thanks, I'm fine ('cept for the afterglow of indigestion). Well I'm okay
about the idea of dying generally because I'm beginning to realize that I
have my secret to life extension - it's not quite living forever, at some
point I'm going to have to let it all go... The whole wonderful colourful
carnival etc. When I die that's it (at the moment this is how I feel it is
but I've been wrong before about many many things).
Life extension based on virtual reality based on how things are at the
moment your mind/imagination is your exit out of here whenever you want. You
can be whatever you want, whoever you want, do whatever you want with
whoever you want. Right now, for instance, Michaela has a vision/version of
me (Sklengebot 1.3) in pinny and grey bun putting Savlon on some younger
family member's knee - that's great! I can be that anytime. At the same time
I can be Michelle Pfeifer having sex with Donald Sutherland if I want... or
I can be my cat jumping down from the pergola running towards me as I feed
the fish... even stuff I haven't seen yet or can't really happen in reality.
Do you know I spoke to a dog this morning. He said it was great being a dog
but he'd rather be a human - I said he ought to give it a go. Maybe I'm just
going mad. That would make much more sense.
The Christian view, for me, is simply a method of approaching people in a
positive way rather than a negative one - it also touches on the idea of
eternal life in a state of bliss I guess, which I think we can have right
here, right now. But I'm still in the foothills of this very exhilarating
journey. I find it's always best to talk in riddles (become incoherent hehe)
in order to avoid saying what's really going on...LOL, because I don't know
what's really going on! (raucous laughter in my mind).
Your Name Here=Harvey
as far belief systems goes, is your own.
BTW - yes, some people do believe that when you die, you die,
and when they don't - ie. wake up dead as a doornail, and find they're
still living - well, that can surely happen...
Same for people not having a higher consciousness, etc.
When you die, you do have the same belief system you always had - except
your senses have changed... you no longer have your physical body with you.
As an aside --- it's OK to focus purely upon this physical dimension
in which we live - that is why we're here, to be immersive in it.
Not much point - in saying ---- well, I didn't agree to all this,
take me back home, NOW!!!!
Harvey
In article <BD7D9E89.2302D%skl...@yahoo.co.uk>, skl...@yahoo.co.uk says...
Eleonore Beaudoin
"Pneumatic Haberdasher" (scl...@blorch.net) writes:
> "Eleonore Beaudoin" <bc...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA> wrote in message
> news:cjaiap$euk$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca...
>>> I specifically said "No ear hair." I never agreed to ear hair. Can I
>>> sue
>>> for breach of contract?
>>
>> I never understood why people did not instead sue for a beach of
>> contact...
>
> Uhh, the sand can really gum up the works, as they say, and with enough
> money a man can practice serial monogamy well into his seventies. Just ask
> Anna Nicole's late husband. You'll need to conduct a seance, but he'll back
> me up on this.
I just did. He says that knowing where to place your money judiciously is
what matters, specially them good old roll of quarters.
>
> A woman only needs enough money for a hot tub with lots of powerful water
> jets (unless the porn industry has been lying to me all these years). I
> understand you can get these little jets to propel a concentrated stream of
> water in three speeds:
> 1- Slow
> 2- Medium
> 3- Who needs a man?
You got it all wrong:
1- Who needs a man?
2- Medium
3- I got a headache.
;-)
>
>
--
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:6ebc501c.0409...@posting.google.com:
> I'm not even convinced that I am the same person I was three years ago
> let alone three hundred.
I don't really see the point of reincarnation, since no one can remember
there past lives anyway, unless they pay 50 bucks an hour to some fraud who
convinces the gullible that he can 'regress' you to them.
--
"It's not a toy, it's a real oven that bakes muffins, and it's powered by
Love."
--Sea Lab 2021.
Sklenge
> nevil...@yahoo.com (OB) wrote in
> news:6ebc501c.0409...@posting.google.com:
>
>> I'm not even convinced that I am the same person I was three years ago
>> let alone three hundred.
>
> I don't really see the point of reincarnation, since no one can remember
> there past lives anyway, unless they pay 50 bucks an hour to some fraud who
> convinces the gullible that he can 'regress' you to them.
It's okay, you get the money back in your next life.
Eleonore Beaudoin
LOLROTFLMHO:)
--
Intercranial Otter Filter
OTS
"Your Name Here=Harvey" <y...@somewhere.not.aus> wrote in message
news:y7b6d.7571$JQ4.5...@news.xtra.co.nz...
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Your Name Here=Harvey
all preconceived notions you may have, and look at what evidence you can
see around you - to me, the strongest evidence is 'data' which shows
something to be 'real' - independent data that supports each other.
Reincarnation has more data to it, than anything else you care to offer.
We do go from one existence to another, upon our death...
Everyone, no matter what belief system you hold...
Reincarnation has more logic to it, than anything else, although
it is rather complicated to understand at first...
Harvey
In article <2s0kg8F...@uni-berlin.de>, omega...@ntlworld.com says...
OB
"consciousness" survives after the death of the body and goes on to
occupy another living body.
Philosophers have argued for centuries about what the "self" is, if
indeed it is anything at all. No agreement has been reached, even
among the scientific community.
To say that there is "data" in support of the doctrine of
reincarnation presupposes that you know what this "self" is. After
all, if you don't even know what it is, how can any such "data" tell
you anything about what happens to it?
Perhaps then, given this privileged knowledge you have, you'd care to
enlighten the philosophical and scientific communities with your
definition of precisely what this "self", this "higher consciousness"
or whatever, which according to you, gets "reincarnated", actually is,
and how it can be identified and measured.
Then you can tell us about all this "data" that supports the doctrine
in question. I have a feeling that all it will amount to will be
uncorroborated anecdotes about people who "remember" things that
happened before they were born.
The problem with all such stories is that it has to be demonstrated
that the event in question actually took place, and it also has to be
demonstrated that the person allegedly "remembering" it /could not
possibly have known about it/ in any other way than the one claimed.
No account I have yet come across fulfils both these criteria.
Instead, what you usually get is some sort of hilarious anecdote in
which a person claims to have "lived in France in the reign of Louis
XIV", as "evidence" of which we get the fact that the person
"suddenly" finds they can speak French and describe some of the
costumes worn at the time. Since French can be learned in evening
classes and costume details can be picked up in a trip to the library,
such anecdotes are worthless.
But perhaps you can do better.
OB
"So what you're saying is that something you have never seen is
slightly less blue than something else you have never seen?" (Black
Adder, forget the episode)
Your Name Here=Harvey <y...@somewhere.not.aus> wrote in message news:<6vQ6d.8338$JQ4.5...@news.xtra.co.nz>...
sumire
> Reincarnation is a doctrine that says the "self" or the
>"consciousness" survives after the death of the body and >goes on to
occupy another living body.
Didn't harvey mean that the consciousness is what gets lost
during reincarnation. There is a really new start for a new self. The soul
seems to be more than just the self, anyway.
Apart from all doctrine, OB, wherever mankind evolved from
animal existence, there was a sort of culture rising from
the question: Where do we come from? Where do we go to?
What was before birth and what will be after it?
The mere ability to muse upon such questions and whatever
consequences we take from the guesses we make has its
value.
I hold it with all those *primitive* folks and do not put myself above
them. Maybe they were closer to *essential* questions than we are now?
Sumi
Michaela
Harvey
I don't buy into reincarnation. This site pretty
much covers my views:
http://www.hinduism.co.za/reincarn.htm
Having said that, I can only think that you have
achieved some kind of realisation/enlightenment
that has changed your outlook of life on earth.
In that case, the unfortunate thing is that probably
no one will get to underestand that which you do.
But I'm sure we'll all try as best we can.
I hope you keep on trying to help us understand,
because we need to share what we know.
- Michaela
Sklenge wrote:
Michaela
"Ego is a concept.
It is a name for an activity of recurring thought, related
to another idea of "I".
The activity of thought makes it seem as if there is an
"I" or ego.
Making a thing out of an activity produces confusion.
People try to get rid of their ego when there is actually
no such thing."
Yes. I've quoted it befive. I could use my own words,
but sometimes people like Isaac Shapiro and OB have
already said it better.
- Michaela
--
Passion comes from a word that means 'to suffer'.
Michaela
> Thanks, I'm fine ('cept for the afterglow of indigestion). Well I'm
> okay about the idea of dying generally because I'm beginning to
> realize that I have my secret to life extension - it's not quite
> living forever, at some point I'm going to have to let it all go...
> The whole wonderful colourful carnival etc. When I die that's it (at
> the moment this is how I feel it is but I've been wrong before about
> many many things).
>
> Life extension based on virtual reality based on how things are at the
> moment your mind/imagination is your exit out of here whenever you
> want. You can be whatever you want, whoever you want, do whatever you
> want with whoever you want.
I wish I meant what you knew. There's something you /understand/
that I don't. I'm still resisting not *not being*. If you mean what I
know.
Right now, for instance, Michaela has a
> vision/version of me (Sklengebot 1.3) in pinny and grey bun putting
Only when you get all "You deviant youngsters!" on us. Most of the
time I have a rosy-spectacled view of you.
> Savlon on some younger family member's knee - that's great! I can be
> that anytime. At the same time I can be Michelle Pfeifer having sex
> with Donald Sutherland if I want...
The Michelle Pfeiffer I get. But the Donald Sutherland?
I see you with Martin or Charlie Sheen. <eg>
> The Christian view, for me, is simply a method of approaching people
> in a positive way rather than a negative one - it also touches on the
> idea of eternal life in a state of bliss I guess, which I think we
> can have right here, right now.
Yes. I think. Not sure. Maybe. No. I think the "state of bliss" is
egoless. And if it's egoless it can't be *here*. Because 'here' is
where there is imperfection/sin/missing the mark/ego/relativity/
reference points etc.
But maybe not.
But I'm still in the foothills of
> this very exhilarating journey. I find it's always best to talk in
> riddles (become incoherent hehe) in order to avoid saying what's
> really going on...LOL, because I don't know what's really going on!
> (raucous laughter in my mind).
You're either making fun of us or you are saying something
cos you have picked up on duality and realise how quickly
one's point bifurcates into negligibilityiousityness. I guess
things are only true up to a point. Arie, a former asl poster,
put it thus:
"For me it's been very simple, i've said it before: as soon as i
realized the limits of logic (which can be logically established),
i knew there had to be something beyond logic. Something that
integrates the logical "0" and "1". And that this unity is undefinable,
by definition, because if you define it, you also define its
opposite, which it doesn't have, so you get a contradiction.
In other words, reality is undefinable."
Ok. That wasn't a perfect fit for what I wanted to say,
but I wanted to quote him anyway. Arie has a way with
words.
The End.
- Michaela
Michaela
> I disagree (far too active a word for my stance)
What do you mean by "active"?
with the notion of
> reincarnation. Obviously I don't know because no one can know this at
> the moment. Perhaps you're desire to describe it, to pin it down as
> it were, will take everyone another smidgen nearer a/the truth.
>
> But at the moment I'm not convinced. And, I don't think it matters
> either. No offence to your theory but even with this theory there is
> a set path and you trudge it until it's over and then you move on to
> the next path and trudge that one... it's all a bit pointless (it
> makes me tired just thinking of it) but if it happens then it happens
> - in a way, so what?
Yes.
> At the moment I believe this is it - 'I' didn't exist before 'I' was
> born and 'I' won't exist once 'I'm' dead. You get seventy or so years
> and then you die and that's an end of it. I'm quite content to think
> this is the case and that doesn't matter either if I'm right or
> wrong, it doesn't matter.
Did I tell you I envy you this frame of mind?
> It can't be changed. It's just a process. A bit like the
> non-destruction of energy it moves in a cyclical motion, the only
> reincarnation I can sign up to at the moment is the idea of dust to
> dust, at a molecular level we move on to another existence.
But Sklenge and Michaela are no more? If that's what you are
saying, then so far I agree.
- Michaela
Your Name Here=Harvey
although it would be one of the core foundations upon which I subscribe to.
'Data' would be peoples' experiences - whether it be of the few memories
that survive into the present lifetime - cases I remember seeing in
television programs, are that of an Englishwoman who remembers her previous
family in Ireland, and is reunited with them, in a strange family connection/
reconnection, an Englishman who can remember being onboard a bomber during
WWII - he sat an aptitude test, and got a perfect score - because apparently
he was a morse code operator in his previous life. There are very strong
cases which defy explanation - while these are never acceptable (none are)
for 100% solid proof - I will address all issues with everything.
Why there is never that 100% proof available - there is, but skeptics would
pooh pooh it nonetheless.
I intend to pull all the strings together to form a coherent and cohesive
view of the universe/reality/etc - and major truths tend to support each
other, in explaining things overall.
Judiasm, Christianty and Islam never do - these come from the same
geographical area, and time frame(s) - have much in common, and yet deny
each other. Truth is not like that at all.
Current 'accepted' ideas and beliefs are far from the truth, therefore
the real truth will sound strange and weird at first - but if you will,
take the time to chew it over and unravel it (understand it) - you will
see that it does sound plausible and probable, and eventually acceptable.
Because you'll use the same critical thinking process of everyday life -
and apply it to that which demands it. Your own beliefs.
I don't have privileged information, it is right in front of us all the
time, and within us all, to realise it.
Harvey
In article <6ebc501c.0410...@posting.google.com>,
nevil...@yahoo.com says...
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:6ebc501c.0410...@posting.google.com:
> Reincarnation is a doctrine that says the "self" or the
> "consciousness" survives after the death of the body and goes on to
> occupy another living body.
Fie on thee, skeptic! Watch The She Creature! Dr. Lombardi will show the
disbeliever...um, that their disbelief...is, you know, wrong and stuff.
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:59b101ac288908d3...@localhost.talkaboutsupport.com:
> I hold it with all those *primitive* folks and do not put myself above
> them. Maybe they were closer to *essential* questions than we are now?
They just didn't know any better; hard-headed skeptics couldn't write books
until pen & paper existed--okay, clay tablets, but who reads clay anymore?
To put it another way, God is just an alternative hypothesis which explains
everything, predicts nothing, and therefore has no value other than
reassuring us that we're not alone in a meaningless, impermanent world, in
a world which is in fact lonely, meaningless, & impermanent.
And if you look at the 'original' buddhism, it really doesn't imply the
reincarnation of a single entity over & over. And the thought of being
reborn into this world and going through adolescence over & over again is
one I find incredibly depressing.
Who's to say that we wouldn't cherish & value life more, if more people
believed that this life was the only one? Isn't it possible that the world
is made more beautiful if we decide that every moment is utterly ephemeral,
unreapeatable, and that anyone of those moments could be the very last one
we experience?
But if you really require a religion, may I suggest the one from "Mad Max
III: Beyond Thunderdome"?
It's as good as any, and you won't have to pay any dues, although you may
want to purchase the filumum on DVD.
OB
> Hmmm, OB, you wrote:
>
> > Reincarnation is a doctrine that says the "self" or the
> >"consciousness" survives after the death of the body and >goes on to
> occupy another living body.
>
> Didn't harvey mean that the consciousness is what gets lost
> during reincarnation. There is a really new start for a new self. The soul
> seems to be more than just the self, anyway.
If consciousness is lost, and the "self" is lost, and the body too,
what is left?
Oh, the "soul".
I'm certain of very few things in life, but I'm certain I never had
and never will have a soul.
So presumably reincarnation doesn't apply to me. That's a relief.
> Apart from all doctrine, OB, wherever mankind evolved from
> animal existence, there was a sort of culture rising from
> the question: Where do we come from? Where do we go to?
> What was before birth and what will be after it?
> The mere ability to muse upon such questions and whatever
> consequences we take from the guesses we make has its
> value.
Yes. The trouble start when some people want to impose their "guesses"
on others. In such cases, the correct thing to do is to demand that
such guesses are subjected to a framework of rational enquiry and
verification.
Otherwise, you end up with religions-> wars, massacres, oppression,
the imposition of superstitious ignorance as a way of life.
> I hold it with all those *primitive* folks and do not put myself above
> them. Maybe they were closer to *essential* questions than we are now?
>
> Sumi
I expect that this point of view is what drives many Americans to vote
for Bush. :-)
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:6ebc501c.04100...@posting.google.com:
Frankly, the way you fail to prostrate yourself in self-loathing before my
god--Spunky the Wonder Squirrel--is repugnant to my entire being. Let's
just say I have a very sharp axe.
>> I hold it with all those *primitive* folks and do not put myself
>> above them. Maybe they were closer to *essential* questions than we
>> are now?
>>
>> Sumi
>
> I expect that this point of view is what drives many Americans to vote
> for Bush. :-)
>
*spittake*
WE CAN WIN THE WAR IN VIETNAM!
Eleonore Beaudoin
LOL:)
"Goal", as you'd say:)
C
> --
> "It's not a toy, it's a real oven that bakes muffins, and it's powered by
> Love."
> --Sea Lab 2021.
--
OB
"Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent" <a...@at.org> wrote in message news:<Xns9575CC6BF5F77fk...@68.6.19.6>...
OB
> Reincarnation is not the sole focus of the book which I am writing,
> although it would be one of the core foundations upon which I subscribe to.
> 'Data' would be peoples' experiences - whether it be of the few memories
> that survive into the present lifetime - cases I remember seeing in
> television programs, are that of an Englishwoman who remembers her previous
> family in Ireland, and is reunited with them, in a strange family connection/
> reconnection, an Englishman who can remember being onboard a bomber during
> WWII - he sat an aptitude test, and got a perfect score - because apparently
> he was a morse code operator in his previous life. There are very strong
> cases which defy explanation - while these are never acceptable (none are)
> for 100% solid proof - I will address all issues with everything.
Here's a story.
During a large part of my life, if anyone ever asked me what my
earliest childhood memory was, I would say without hesitation "oh,
that time I was in the car with my parents and the car got stuck in
the mud in the middle of the wood and had to be pushed out. It was a
black car. I think I was very small at the time, maybe only about 3 or
4 years old."
One day I was round at me Dad's house with various sisters and a gf,
and the conversation got around to childhood memories, and I mentioned
this one. Me Dad gave me a baffled look. "You can't possibly remember
that," he said, "It happened a year before you were born."
Does this, for you "defy explanation"?
To me the explanation is fairly obvious. Child overhears anecdote
recounted by parents. Child wrongly assumes he must have been present
when event occurred, even though he can't now recall it. Child files
event described away in memory for later recall. However, since the
child's conceptual framework is still fairly limited, he can't find a
mental pigeonhole labelled "things I presumably must have witnessed
even though I don't remember them". Instead, he finds two boxes: one
labelled "things I remember because I was there" and another "things I
don't remember because I wasn't there". Since he believes he must have
been in the car at the time, the story gets filed away in box 1.
Within a very short time, it's a bona fide "memory". As I say, I was
100% sure that I "remembered" this thing. (Turns out I got the colour
of the car wrong, though. It was red.)
I'm not saying this is the explanation for all "memories of past
lives". A similar process might account for one or two. What I'm
saying is that a lot of things that allegedly "defy explanation" may
turn out to have quite a simple one, all that's required is that you
accept that the human brain is fallible and subject to error. The
evidence for which certainly /is/ "right in front of us all the time,
and within us all".
Take deja-vu. First few times it happens to you as a child, you're
inclined to accept that you really did live "this, or something eerily
similar" at some time in the past. As you get older you begin to
realise that what's happening is actually simply a rogue misfiring
neurone, usually the result of tiredness, which results in an
incorrect function call to one of the memory modules in the brain.
In other cases, the allegedly inexplicable can fairly easily be
accounted for by the hypothesis of deliberate deception. Take your
WWII morse operator. I mean really. Anyone can learn morse in less
than an hour, and become proficient in its high-speed use with a few
days or weeks of practice. As for "he sat an aptitude test, and got a
perfect score"... does this not strike you as a bit OTT? How likely is
it that of all the WWII morse operators, the only one who remembers
his past life should "just happen" to also be the one in a thousand
capable of attaining 100% in an aptitude test? Personally, as a
teacher I can tell you I'm very suspicious of 100% scores. Nearly
always means someone had a peek at the answer sheet in advance.
I'm not saying I "know" that this or other "memories of past lives"
are hoaxes. But I think you have to go with what seems to you the most
likely explanation. It' true that generally, by default, we have to
assume people are usually telling the truth (exceptions: politicians'
speeches, or any conceivable answer to the question "How do I look in
this dress"), but for the skeptic, almost any explanation, however
improbable and even if it requires you to posit collusion and/or
elaborate preparation, is preferable to the notion that memories can
be transferred intact between different brains across large time gaps
by exclusively non-material means. The believer, of course, will
disagree and is entitled to do so. But I think you should be upfront
with your readers. Rather than claiming that such things "defy
explanation", simply invite them to decide, on the basis of whatever
evidence you can muster, between the alternative hypothetical
explanations that actually do exist. You could say something like
"Dear reader, how likely is it that a sizeable number of people
deliberately make up stories and go to some trouble to authenticate
such stories with the aim of hoodwinking the gullible and perhaps
gaining some attention or transient fame?"
> Why there is never that 100% proof available - there is, but skeptics would
> pooh pooh it nonetheless.
Try us.
> I intend to pull all the strings together to form a coherent and cohesive
> view of the universe/reality/etc - and major truths tend to support each
> other, in explaining things overall.
> Judiasm,
Judaism. A "judiasm" is what happens when you have sex with a girl
called Judy.
Christianty and Islam never do - these come from the same
> geographical area, and time frame(s) - have much in common, and yet deny
> each other. Truth is not like that at all.
Here, I agree.
> Current 'accepted' ideas and beliefs are far from the truth, therefore
> the real truth will sound strange and weird at first - but if you will,
> take the time to chew it over and unravel it (understand it) - you will
> see that it does sound plausible and probable, and eventually acceptable.
This could happen. After all, there are plenty of counter-intuitive
theories in science that gain acceptance simply because they have the
maths behind them. If you have the maths to support you, then go for
it. I haven't seen anything that persuasive in support of any theory
of souls, reincarnation or an afterlife, is all.
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
> Excellent post. Nothing to add (except pointless praise).
>
That's high praise indeed, in my book.
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:cjmgnk$2i$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca:
>> WE CAN WIN THE WAR IN VIETNAM!
>
>
> LOL:)
> "Goal", as you'd say:)
>
> C
heh heh, your welcome.
sumire
to be right in what you say about God,
that may be nothing but human fiction in order to make
"a world which is in fact lonely, meaningless & impermanent"
a lil more bearable.
And I hold it with what you say about every moment to be * utterly
ephemeral, unrepeatable* which is good for the bad moments and sad for the
beautiful ones.
For this reason I have developed a hedonistic attitude towards life - at
least as long as sadness does not pop up
too strongly.
But there must be some sense behind all that. Else I could
very much put an end to it right now, at this very moment.
And you know I'm very serious about that. I have had my life. I have had
those beautiful moments and felt all the agony of that *utterly ephemeral
and unrepeatable* - my that hurts :-( So why still go on?
Harvey has one possible answer.
What's yours?
Sumi
Sklenge
> Sklenge wrote:
>> Thanks, I'm fine ('cept for the afterglow of indigestion). Well I'm
>> okay about the idea of dying generally because I'm beginning to
>> realize that I have my secret to life extension - it's not quite
>> living forever, at some point I'm going to have to let it all go...
>> The whole wonderful colourful carnival etc. When I die that's it (at
>> the moment this is how I feel it is but I've been wrong before about
>> many many things).
>>
>> Life extension based on virtual reality based on how things are at the
>> moment your mind/imagination is your exit out of here whenever you
>> want. You can be whatever you want, whoever you want, do whatever you
>> want with whoever you want.
>
> I wish I meant what you knew. There's something you /understand/
> that I don't. I'm still resisting not *not being*. If you mean what I
> know.
It's quite simple really, so simple that I've always taken it for granted.
Recently I've tried to explain my thought processing to other people but
they don't always do what I do in my mind. I can keep myself entertained for
hours (within a few minutes) of 'daydreaming'. I know the difference between
the real and the unreal but I'm beginning to think that I'm only fooling
myself. I prefer the fantasy to the reality every time. That's all, it's
nothing spectacular.
>> Right now, for instance, Michaela has a
>> vision/version of me (Sklengebot 1.3) in pinny and grey bun putting
>
> Only when you get all "You deviant youngsters!" on us. Most of the
> time I have a rosy-spectacled view of you.
I can get a bit like that, can't I? Sorry.
>> Savlon on some younger family member's knee - that's great! I can be
>> that anytime. At the same time I can be Michelle Pfeifer having sex
>> with Donald Sutherland if I want...
>
> The Michelle Pfeiffer I get. But the Donald Sutherland?
> I see you with Martin or Charlie Sheen. <eg>
I see me with someone entirely different. But that's not really the point.
>> The Christian view, for me, is simply a method of approaching people
>> in a positive way rather than a negative one - it also touches on the
>> idea of eternal life in a state of bliss I guess, which I think we
>> can have right here, right now.
>
> Yes. I think. Not sure. Maybe. No. I think the "state of bliss" is
> egoless. And if it's egoless it can't be *here*. Because 'here' is
> where there is imperfection/sin/missing the mark/ego/relativity/
> reference points etc.
>
> But maybe not.
Egoless? Let me google for a short while there...
http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?EgolessCreativity
Yes. But although it's happening inside my mind (that's the venue) and
sometimes I'm not even in control of the outcome - I'm very much 'in the
mix'... my ego is definitely there because my mind is entertaining me -
nobody else (well I suppose I can't even be certain of that). It's like an
intuitively creative process; I've always done it - like listening to music
and choreographing the entire scene in my mind. I don't need to see it but
in my mind I do. We all do it I'm sure! That's what makes this so mundane.
Not really much of a revelation.
>> But I'm still in the foothills of
>> this very exhilarating journey. I find it's always best to talk in
>> riddles (become incoherent hehe) in order to avoid saying what's
>> really going on...LOL, because I don't know what's really going on!
>> (raucous laughter in my mind).
>
> You're either making fun of us or you are saying something
> cos you have picked up on duality and realise how quickly
> one's point bifurcates into negligibilityiousityness. I guess
> things are only true up to a point. Arie, a former asl poster,
> put it thus:
>
> "For me it's been very simple, i've said it before: as soon as i
> realized the limits of logic (which can be logically established),
> i knew there had to be something beyond logic. Something that
> integrates the logical "0" and "1". And that this unity is undefinable,
> by definition, because if you define it, you also define its
> opposite, which it doesn't have, so you get a contradiction.
> In other words, reality is undefinable."
Sounds like trying to describe quantum dynamics. You know it exists because
you can point at the place where it doesn't exist... kind of thing. So
reaching out for 'god' or 'the fundamental truth' becomes a futile act.
In my case it's likely to be a lack of intellect. I have an inability to put
into words exactly what I'm striving to say... in this case it's not a
difficult concept but I'm making hard work of explaining it. Sorry.
> Ok. That wasn't a perfect fit for what I wanted to say,
> but I wanted to quote him anyway. Arie has a way with
> words.
>
> The End.
>
> - Michaela
I don't think I've 'met' Arie.
Sklenge
> Sklenge wrote:
>> I disagree (far too active a word for my stance)
>
> What do you mean by "active"?
I mean I haven't built up a full and comprehensive argument to disprove the
theory I just disagree. I can do that can't I? Just to play Devil's
Advocate. Sometimes taking the opposing view can get us closer to the
answer. You have to be objective (that means objecting now and then.)
>> with the notion of reincarnation.
>> At the moment I believe this is it - 'I' didn't exist before 'I' was born and
>> 'I' won't exist once 'I'm' dead. You get seventy or so years and then you die
>> and that's an end of it. I'm quite content to think this is the case and that
>> doesn't matter either if I'm right or wrong, it doesn't matter.
>>
> Did I tell you I envy you this frame of mind?
No, I don't think you've told me that before. I don't see how you can envy
this. You either think this way or you don't but I don't see where envy fits
in. Or am I being dim again?
>> It can't be changed. It's just a process. A bit like the non-destruction of
>> energy it moves in a cyclical motion, the only reincarnation I can sign up to
>> at the moment is the idea of dust to dust, at a molecular level we move on to
>> another existence.
>>
> But Sklenge and Michaela are no more? If that's what you are saying, then so
> far I agree.
So you don't go in for spiritual reincarnation either?
OB
Harvey may have an answer, or he may have several alternative or
complementary ones. The one that's come up here doesn't strike me as
all that much of an answer, not only in terms of credibility but, as
others have pointed out, in terms of its emotional power to comfort.
You reach the end of your life, think "thank goodness, at last all
that's over", close your eyes, then wham! back you are again, another
infant mewling and puking in its mother's arms. Are we supposed to be
comforted by this? To me it sounds like a particularly nasty
nightmare. Reminiscent more than anything of the experience of having
a cable phone connection with Auna.
My answer to "why still go on"... or, differently expressed, "what
makes life still worth living in spite of all".
Hard to put into words.
Ultimately, I suppose for me it would be beauty. The contemplation of
which you can get lost in, or almost get lost in. I'm not referring
now to beautiful women (for a change), since in that case the opposite
seems to be true. I look at a beautiful (here, = sexually appealing)
woman and I feel very strongly unease, unhappiness, despair, a sense
of loss and unfulfilled possibility and loneliness and aching, eternal
misery. Sometimes I feel violent and irrationally angry on top of
everything else.(It still genuinely surprises me when other men claim
not to feel the same way in the same circumstances. How people
differ.) For me, at least these days, there is a direct and instant
mental connection between seeing a beautiful woman and wanting to die.
So I try not to see them too much, or try to "prepare myself" for
seeing them by drinking heavily and numbing my emotions in any way
possible.
No, I mean beauty as in music, art, poetry, streetscapes, rooftops,
parrots, or the contemplation of other people in which you abstract
yourself from the situation completely and just focus on them,
admiring and appreciating their individuality and idiosyncrasies.
The basic idea is to lose yourself, or to forget yourself in something
else. I suppose my mindset is basically Schopenhauerian. Abstract the
"Will", the wanting, the ego, keep the "Idea", and all is fine. But I
also know this doesn't work for everyone. And only intermittently for
me. It requires a certain mental discipline to go further than that,
and I'm mentally tired, befuddled and lazy at the best of times. And
of course, for a depressive person none of this would mean anything at
all. I hardly ever experience depression, but from the little I have
experienced of it I would define it as an inability to be moved by
anything at all. Against which I have absolutely no defence or advice,
since the problem would appear to be neurochemical and to require a
pharmacological solution.
Beyond this, there is something I am thinking more and more about
these days, and that is finding some way of emotionally reconciling
the desirability (from a certain, very deep and intimate angle) of
some sort of belief in a personal God(dess) with the fact that such a
being obviously does not and cannot exist. Ask me about this in a few
years' time.
OB (member of Catholics' Anonymous. Take each day at a time. Just tell
yourself "I will not touch that rosary. I will NOT.")
Eleonore Beaudoin
Hehehe:)
Thanks for making me giggle:)
Just saw pics of me from March and burst in tears. Wish they were at
least from Mars...
So...
My way is to read asl and hope someone makes me laugh, when I no longer
can tell myself any stories to smile.
--
Your Name Here=Harvey
clouding the issue further, by giving answers that are incomprehensible,
or mysterious.
I don't have 'my view' - I simply collect data (other peoples'
experiences) and correlate them with other data which I believe to
be authentic, true and genuine. And provide a cohesive understanding
of what is out there, for anyone else to understand too.
My view is nothing new at all - I am heavily influenced by 3 books
written around 1956 and since then...
You may completely deny that you're involved with the reincarnation
cycle, but that does not exclude you from it. In fact almost
everyone is --- and while it's possible some people aren't, they
would number very few, maybe Jesus as an example --- but he's been
used and used by christianity for propanganda purposes, that his real
life has been overlooked.
Like it or not -- being born, makes you part of the reincarnation
cycle.
I don't have a lot of faith or trust with Indian mystics, as they
come across as offering their own unique views, which does not tie
in with everything else - and to me, that is a sure sign they are
not offering a truthful understanding.
My ideas are not unique at all - they are somewhat startling,
compared to conventional views. I outline major topics that have
relevance to understanding life here -
eg. UFOs, death and dying, history of the earth (ancient civilisations
and technology) - and everything else ties in with this...
Harvey
In article <415de...@news1.mweb.co.za>, michaelashouse says...
OB
news:cjpoue$4h7$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca...
>
> OB (nevil...@yahoo.com) writes:
<snip incoherent gabble. Last night managed to combine two waking up
to phone ringings and a bout of cystitis-like symptoms. I am The
Undead. Just.>
> > (member of Catholics' Anonymous. Take each day at a time. Just tell
> > yourself "I will not touch that rosary. I will NOT.")
>
> Hehehe:)
> Thanks for making me giggle:)
Credo en un... um... De Dum De Dum De Dum.
At around 7 I still thought it was "factorem Jelly et terrae" (this
confusion lasted many years), and that the Arf Arthur began:
Arf, Arthur, who Art in Heaven, hello! Be thy Name!
I was an inattentive child.
> Just saw pics of me from March and burst in tears. Wish they were at
> least from Mars...
>
> So...
>
> My way is to read asl and hope someone makes me laugh, when I no longer
> can tell myself any stories to smile.
((((((((((((((((Chloe))))))))))))))
Eleonore Beaudoin
OB (nevil...@yahoo.com) writes:
> "Eleonore Beaudoin" <bc...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA> escribió en el mensaje
> news:cjpoue$4h7$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca...
>>
>> OB (nevil...@yahoo.com) writes:
>
> <snip incoherent gabble. Last night managed to combine two waking up
> to phone ringings and a bout of cystitis-like symptoms. I am The
> Undead. Just.>
Last night was up at 3 A.M. from caugh.
And the evenign before at 1 A.M., same thing. Or was it vice versa?
In any case, this afternoon I had planned a nap. Soemoen misdialed the
grocery store again just as I fell asleep....I amnaged to fnd sleep again
for a nap an hour later. Just then my sister dropped in with those pics.
Will never be able to sleep again.Sigh. Who cares about bags under THOSE eyes?
Tah.
>> > (member of Catholics' Anonymous. Take each day at a time. Just tell
>> > yourself "I will not touch that rosary. I will NOT.")
>>
>> Hehehe:)
>> Thanks for making me giggle:)
>
> Credo en un... um... De Dum De Dum De Dum.
Hum De Dum dee Una Wall?
:)
You remember that stiff way better than I. I was six when I knew those in
Latin, and yet never knew what I was saying at all.
Pfft.
OWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWEEEEEEEEEE. Grooooaaaargggggggggrumble mumble enough
with pain!!!
I just had a sneezing bad episode where sneezing, I bit my tongue!!!
Grrooowwwwr:(
Lovely. Tongue bleeding...That will learn me to not try and laugh when I
have a cold.
Ouch, dang it:(
And oh, here come the sneezes again? ARRgggroooowrr.
EEEEE NUUUUUFFFFFF, alread, I said:(
>
> At around 7 I still thought it was "factorem Jelly et terrae" (this
> confusion lasted many years),
Actually tryign to see what bot that would "correspond to"...
But me thinks it is a bit I can not even imagine anymore...
I stopped lating the day that pope died in the river by our house,
drowned, if you remember that episode:)
In case not, the pope had died. My father was driving my 13 year old
brother and I somwhere when we heard it on the radio. I heard my btoher
tell my dad "the pope died??" and my father answering that yes, he died. I
was all serious and asking "The pope died???? HOW?". Soemhow to me how was
important.Pfft. But no oen answered lil me. So I asked again...And
again...and again, where finally my brother, annoyed, and knowign how
afraid I was as we drove by the rapids f that river to fall in the water
in the car, said "Aw, bugger off. He died, period!" -But HOW...? -He fell
in the rapids with his car, there! He drowned!".
The idea was to scare me to ddeath into silence. It worked.
Once in school, that day, the teacher asks my class if we woudl have heard
of what big event happened...I raise my yand all happy to have heard grown
us talk about it and say "The pope died!:)" like it is the best news and
desrves an award:). "Very good, she says. And hwo did he die?"
-He fell in the rapids with his car, next to our place!
-!!!!!:( You bad tongue! You will have to stand before everyoen at lunch
time and be em,barrassed for sayign such idiocies and lies!
-But its not a lie!! I was told so!
-Oh? And who on earth would ahve told you so?
-MY BROTHER! Go ask him if you donlt believe me. I tell you, he died
drowning in the rapids next to our place!
My btoher was called to our class, laughed like mad and denied everythign
of course. I was taken from class to class made to rpeat what "lie" I had
just said with everyoen laughing at this lil kid I was....I did not have a
clue some wrong was even supposed to be involved in that embarrassmnt
parade, so frequient it was and so darn innocent I was all th e dang time:)
Then I had t be without lunch, standing for an hour on a stage, as
teachers woudl reminfd everyoen on the mic that that was what students got
for being caught lying....
Wowiie. School was so much fun:(.
And if there is a god for lil innocent six year old gorls, he will make it
so that pope dies in them rapids and rub the teacher;s nose in it when she
goes to heaven, nah!'
> and that the Arf Arthur began:
>
> Arf, Arthur, who Art in Heaven, hello! Be thy Name!
LOL:)
Wrell, Inever could remember hollow and h(a?o?)llow(?), i.e. the oen that
means
sanctified or something liek that and the one that means "emty in the
middle", where I never understood why every anglo asked for God's name to
be empty in the middle, but thought it was cause of the consonnants only
in his name, i.e."YHWH"!
> > I was an inattentive child. > >
Obvioulsy less than me. I must say though that they stopped all prayers in
Latin in the next year or two.
I relearned latin later, in highschool.
I remember next to nothing of it if I cabn decipher it. I coudl never
write a proper latin half sentence anymore though.
>> Just saw pics of me from March and burst in tears. Wish they were at
>> least from Mars...
>>
>> So...
>>
>> My way is to read asl and hope someone makes me laugh, when I no longer
>> can tell myself any stories to smile.
>
> ((((((((((((((((Chloe))))))))))))))
Thanks.
Cyber hugs is about all I will ever get for the rest of my life, I reckon.
My old mom tried to cheer me on the phone, sayoing:
-...take courage...Soemthign good will come....
To which I answered:
-Yeah....I know....And then it will see me. Pfft:(.
Soemtimes I think I need a cry longer than the years of life left.
And I think Titan is sick:(
And no vet in this area treats birds anymore, and I am broke and and and I
so hope she will be fine:(
In case it woudl be that she drank the aquarium water, I cleaned it all....
Did the dishes as if it mattered, too, but coudl not for the life of me
see what good doign the laundry woudl ever do. Who cares what I wear?
Best investment woudl be a brown paper bag on my head:(
That flu and fever are wearign me out.
Can't take anymore for today.....
Wish me luck for the week to come with dirty clothes.
Or a miracle of inspiration to manage to go do that Monday night, instead
of sleeping:(
Moan moan moan, grumble grumble mumble.
C
--
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:e969beb6dcb5bc38...@localhost.talkaboutsupport.com:
> But there must be some sense behind all that.
I disagree. From what I've seen, it makes no sense at all--it just is.
>Else I could
> very much put an end to it right now, at this very moment.
> And you know I'm very serious about that. I have had my life. I have had
> those beautiful moments and felt all the agony of that *utterly ephemeral
> and unrepeatable* - my that hurts :-( So why still go on?
A species which just 'got depressed & gave up' probably would become
extinct. Even when consciousness ceases, the body can continue living. So
there's no simple answer, other than maybe calling it 'will to live', or
whatever term you prefer.
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:e969beb6dcb5bc38...@localhost.talkaboutsupport.com:
> So why still go on?
>
> Harvey has one possible answer.
>
> What's yours?
Partly it's being a parent, and partly being able to see things that I
couldn't when I was younger, just being able to run & feel the wind & risk
being devoured by a wild animal, & in the early evening the chance of
snapping a femur in the dark, & hearing the coyotes howl at the moon...and
maybe being eaten by a cougar. And how wonderful all of that is, even if
in other ways I'm lonely, still I don't have to reckon with the various
negatives of marriage & whatnot, the burden of another's expectations upon
me and all that other stuff that drags one into a mire.
OB
> > At around 7 I still thought it was "factorem Jelly et terrae" (this
> > confusion lasted many years),
>
> Actually tryign to see what bot that would "correspond to"...
Jelly = coeli (in my church they pronounced it as if it were Italian)
> My old mom tried to cheer me on the phone, sayoing:
> -...take courage...Soemthign good will come....
> To which I answered:
> -Yeah....I know....And then it will see me. Pfft:(.
This an early entry for the Ugly All Over Trophy?
Bear in mind that for some reason I seem to have lost more hair in
last week than in preceding three years. (Poss. heavy smoking? dunno.)
New secret weapons also include two malevolent little lines over
eyebrows that give me a new "cruel, heartless monster" look...
sufficiently accurate for me to go check the portrait in the attic.
That and the bags and the jowls... bah. Getting old sucks. Weren't
there supposed to be compensations? Where did they go? Wisdom? HAH!
Stability? HAH! Achievement? HAH!
> Soemtimes I think I need a cry longer than the years of life left.
Well, OK. Maybe we could arrange an internationally acceptable date
and time for an ASL Cry-in. I've been doing a bit of the ol' cryin'
lately too, find it really does "work". Well, a bit.
> And I think Titan is sick:(
:(
> And no vet in this area treats birds anymore, and I am broke and and and I
> so hope she will be fine:(
> Moan moan moan, grumble grumble mumble.
Think positive. Let's get a posse together and go drown that thar
Pope.
Eleonore Beaudoin
OB (nevil...@yahoo.com) writes:
> bc...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Eleonore Beaudoin) wrote in message news:<cjq7rt$5a5$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca>...
>
>> > At around 7 I still thought it was "factorem Jelly et terrae" (this
>> > confusion lasted many years),
>>
>> Actually tryign to see what bot that would "correspond to"...
>
> Jelly = coeli (in my church they pronounced it as if it were Italian)
Was this not just before communion, when some would take the Host to the
sick? Part of the prayer to bless the coelophane?;-)
>
>> My old mom tried to cheer me on the phone, sayoing:
>> -...take courage...Soemthign good will come....
>> To which I answered:
>> -Yeah....I know....And then it will see me. Pfft:(.
>
> This an early entry for the Ugly All Over Trophy?
I think no one else could enter THAT category. They donlt even make
Halloween masks like that, as it would not be very credible.
> Bear in mind that for some reason I seem to have lost more hair in
> last week than in preceding three years. (Poss. heavy smoking? dunno.)
> New secret weapons also include two malevolent little lines over
> eyebrows that give me a new "cruel, heartless monster" look...
> sufficiently accurate for me to go check the portrait in the attic.
> That and the bags and the jowls... bah. Getting old sucks. Weren't
> there supposed to be compensations? Where did they go? Wisdom? HAH!
> Stability? HAH! Achievement? HAH!
Achieving to still survive and achieving to carry that face around and
compensating daily for the daily cracks and treatment for it is already
award deserving in itself.
>> Soemtimes I think I need a cry longer than the years of life left.
>
> Well, OK. Maybe we could arrange an internationally acceptable date
> and time for an ASL Cry-in. I've been doing a bit of the ol' cryin'
> lately too, find it really does "work". Well, a bit.
Fills in those bags under the eyes;-)
>
>> And I think Titan is sick:(
>
> :(
She still throws up her pablum unless I make it real thick, but that means
it will sort of "bloat" in her tummy too for not being doluted enough...
Shall see if she makes it with the cleaned aquarium filter. She sometimes
goes to drink at the 500 gallon filter chute, and if it is dirty, she gets
ill with fungus eating her tongue and throat alive, making her throw up
non-stop. I still have some bird antibio but HATE to give it to her as it
leaves her in much worse shape for ten days, if it saved her life twice.
But there is also a bacterial treatment she needs where that one kills the
good bacteriae as well, and requires additional good bacteriae to be
given. I got the good bacteriae, I goit the antibio, but no "bad
bacteriae" killer....And no bird vet left in the area.
Apparently, a dog and cat vet started doing birds, but the vet in question did
not impress me with cats way back, where his adding birds to his practice
20 years into it makes me think his avian knowledge is completely gone by
now. Besides, most vets will NOT treat pigeons. Mine did, but her clinic
decided they would not do birds anymore. It probably scared lients for
their cats and dogs due to the Nile Virus.
Shall see how Titan does with her morning meal in a few minutes.
My pets are all I have that donlt mind my face and don't treat me like
poop for "nothing" (i.e. for the face).
>> And no vet in this area treats birds anymore, and I am broke and and and I
>> so hope she will be fine:(
>> Moan moan moan, grumble grumble mumble.
>
> Think positive. Let's get a posse together and go drown that thar
> Pope.
Oh, I try all I can. I'll get there. Fever and flu just wore me out, where
it then requires help to jump start me at times, but where I still manage
t signal the need for help then to get the needed boost.
Thanks for obliging:)
(((((((((((((((((((((OB)))))))))))))))))))))))
C
--
Intercranial Otter Filter
knowledge is lost...so...um...
OTS
"sumire" <sumire_...@nospam.yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:59b101ac288908d3...@localhost.talkaboutsupport.com...
> Hmmm, OB, you wrote:
>
> > Reincarnation is a doctrine that says the "self" or the
> >"consciousness" survives after the death of the body and >goes on to
> occupy another living body.
>
> Didn't harvey mean that the consciousness is what gets lost
> during reincarnation. There is a really new start for a new self. The soul
> seems to be more than just the self, anyway.
>
> Apart from all doctrine, OB, wherever mankind evolved from
> animal existence, there was a sort of culture rising from
> the question: Where do we come from? Where do we go to?
> What was before birth and what will be after it?
> The mere ability to muse upon such questions and whatever
> consequences we take from the guesses we make has its
> value.
>
> I hold it with all those *primitive* folks and do not put myself above
> them. Maybe they were closer to *essential* questions than we are now?
>
> Sumi
>
>
>
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.772 / Virus Database: 519 - Release Date: 01/10/2004
Intercranial Otter Filter
Lessee...
Recently I've been told my hair is starting to gray, but it is quite
difficult to verify right now, highlights and stuff are confusing etc.
But: I can see some lines in my face that have been creeping up for some
time now.
Some joints might be making some cricking noises.
er...that's it.
OTS
"OB" <nevil...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6ebc501c.04100...@posting.google.com...
Intercranial Otter Filter
OTS
"Your Name Here=Harvey" <y...@somewhere.not.aus> wrote in message
news:uSZ7d.9534$JQ4.6...@news.xtra.co.nz...
Intercranial Otter Filter
OTS
"Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent" <a...@at.org> wrote in message
news:Xns9575CC6BF5F77fk...@68.6.19.6...
Michaela
> I believe in demystifying reincarnation/life/etc and not
> clouding the issue further,
Afaict at some point people have to take a "leap of faith"
or whatever. And that leap depends on each person's individual
circumstances. What you've maybe seen is possibly not that
easy to demystify.
by giving answers that are
> incomprehensible, or mysterious.
> I don't have 'my view' - I simply collect data (other peoples'
> experiences) and correlate them with other data which I believe to
> be authentic, true and genuine. And provide a cohesive understanding
> of what is out there, for anyone else to understand too.
> My view is nothing new at all - I am heavily influenced by 3 books
> written around 1956 and since then...
>
> You may completely deny that you're involved with the reincarnation
> cycle, but that does not exclude you from it. In fact almost
> everyone is --- and while it's possible some people aren't, they
> would number very few, maybe Jesus as an example --- but he's been
> used and used by christianity for propanganda purposes, that his real
> life has been overlooked.
> Like it or not -- being born, makes you part of the reincarnation
> cycle.
I have no problem being part of the reincarnation cycle
as such. I've a problem with understanding its relevance.
Why are you passionate about it. What good can come of
it? What bad can come of believing in reincarnation?
> I don't have a lot of faith or trust with Indian mystics, as they
> come across as offering their own unique views, which does not tie
> in with everything else -
I only refer to religions/philosophies where I have found
common ground. Afaict there is very little reason to believe
in reincarnation.
- Michaela
Your Name Here=Harvey
More so than fantasy or science fiction - that is how far we are away
from knowing the real truth about things.
It is not just one source that I align myself with - but with many...
Harvey
In article <2sduemF...@uni-berlin.de>, omega...@ntlworld.com
says...
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:2sdukjF...@uni-berlin.de:
> Cargo cults rule.
>
> OTS
I tellz ya' that cargo is a'comin' anyday now!
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
> "Intercranial Otter Filter" <omega...@ntlworld.com> wrote in
> news:2sdukjF...@uni-berlin.de:
>
>> Cargo cults rule.
>>
>> OTS
>
> I tellz ya' that cargo is a'comin' anyday now!
>
P.S. With a DVD copy of Fulci's "Zombi".
Your Name Here=Harvey
offered, that kinda makes sense.
As in another post by someone else, the point is made, that one
should make the most out of the present life situation, regardless
of reincarnation. Mainly because you do not know what the other
lives were, and how they tie in with each other.
The general point given, is that we don't have any memory of what
we are here for, because if you knew you'll probably ensure those
points are covered, and leave other essential niceitites to complete
disregard. Kinda like one expects in an exam, you cover what is
expected, and just skim the rest, thinking they'll not be in there.
To me, to try to make sense of the ultimate goal of reincarnation is
beyond this reality - is to comtemplate upon issues not of this world
and reality, which is very very difficult, seen from this view.
We are obviously here for a very important reason - usually it's in
some form of suffering (that is how most lessons are learnt well,
through suffering) - trials and errors, although it's possible to learn
from all the nice things you have experienced too, like love.
Harvey
In article <4161c...@news1.mweb.co.za>, michaelashouse says...
Michaela
I see some parallels in your thinking and mine.
Unfortunately, I don't believe I have the energy right
now.
- Michaela
--
Passion comes from a word that means 'to suffer'.
Gymd...@webtv.net
Michaela
> Michaela's post:
>> Sklenge wrote:
>>> I disagree (far too active a word for my stance)
>>
>> What do you mean by "active"?
>
> I mean I haven't built up a full and comprehensive argument to
> disprove the theory I just disagree. I can do that can't I? Just to
> play Devil's Advocate. Sometimes taking the opposing view can get us
> closer to the answer. You have to be objective (that means objecting
> now and then.)
Yes. I be very much in agreination.
>>> with the notion of reincarnation.
>
>>> At the moment I believe this is it - 'I' didn't exist before 'I'
>>> was born and 'I' won't exist once 'I'm' dead. You get seventy or so
>>> years and then you die and that's an end of it. I'm quite content
>>> to think this is the case and that doesn't matter either if I'm
>>> right or wrong, it doesn't matter.
>>>
>> Did I tell you I envy you this frame of mind?
>
> No, I don't think you've told me that before. I don't see how you can
> envy this. You either think this way or you don't but I don't see
> where envy fits in. Or am I being dim again?
You are aware of summat I'm not aware of. Just cos someone
doesn't believe in god (I don't necessarily) doesn't mean they
don't get it right in some ways and not in others. In ways I fall
short in my path towards spiritual awareness and just maybe in
other ways you fall shorter than I do. That doesn't mean that
either of us are "better" than the other.
>>> It can't be changed. It's just a process. A bit like the
>>> non-destruction of energy it moves in a cyclical motion, the only
>>> reincarnation I can sign up to at the moment is the idea of dust to
>>> dust, at a molecular level we move on to another existence.
>>>
>> But Sklenge and Michaela are no more? If that's what you are saying,
>> then so far I agree.
>
> So you don't go in for spiritual reincarnation either?
How can Michaela ever come back? Here's how I currently
see it (o how to put it into words...): if I learn to accept
myself and others my behaviour will change accordingly.
By showing (read: being) love, others can pick up on that
and they too might change. And in this way it gets passed
along. The love has to start *somewhere*. Why not with me?
Anyway, the more we can change our own outlook, the
more likely future generations will be influenced.
If we really are *one* in essence, my positive outlook
can not have anything but a positive influence on future
inhabitants of this f*d up world.
Even though Michaela won't come back (Michaela is
irrelevant anyway), her essence (oneness) will (and
the other forms that come to earth will also have
largely forgotten their essence, just like us). And
Michaela owes it to "essence" to be loving (o man,
I'm flailing...).
So, when Harvey speaks about compassion, I agree
with him. I see it as a long-term goal where we
play only a tiny role towards making things better
tomorrow.
I didn't quite put that as clearly as I wanted to, but
you're a bright girl and I'm sure you have filled in
where I've come short...
***
Wait. I wanted to say this, but got myself sidetracked...
As I become more aware that I'm more a spiritual being
than a human one, I seem more able to cope in this life.
I think that's because I am starting to accept that things
here don't matter nearly as much as I used to think they
did. And because I'm not worrying myself about life here
as much, I am not confusing myself as much with stupid,
confusing self-talk (like how to Keep myself looking good
in other people's eyes when I get "shot down" for example.).
The problem really does go away when one stops
concentrating (giving it power over one) on it.
Because when one pays attention to something in a
worrying way, one is resisting and resisting limits
one's real capabilities. Ok. That's enough rambling.
(You don't have to read it all :)
- Michaela
Sklenge
> Sklenge wrote: Michaela's post: Sklenge wrote:
>
>>>> At the moment I believe this is it - 'I' didn't exist before 'I' was born
>>>> and 'I' won't exist once 'I'm' dead. You get seventy or so years and then
>>>> you die and that's an end of it. I'm quite content to think this is the
>>>> case and that doesn't matter either if I'm right or wrong, it doesn't
>>>> matter.
>>>>
>>> Did I tell you I envy you this frame of mind?
>>>
>> No, I don't think you've told me that before. I don't see how you can envy
>> this. You either think this way or you don't but I don't see where envy fits
>> in. Or am I being dim again?
>>
> You are aware of summat I'm not aware of. Just cos someone doesn't believe in
> god (I don't necessarily) doesn't mean they don't get it right in some ways
> and not in others. In ways I fall short in my path towards spiritual awareness
> and just maybe in other ways you fall shorter than I do. That doesn't mean
> that either of us are "better" than the other.
Can I just say, in case anyone misconstrues me - I haven't got the answer
for anyone else and I can't even claim to have the final answer for myself.
Just like Harvey could so easily be right (or wrong) I could be wrong about
my little 'theory' such as it is. I'm prepared to die and sit up in
hell/heaven with everybody pointing and laughing, but I think the joke would
have worn thin by the time I get there.
>>>> It can't be changed. It's just a process. A bit like the non-destruction of
>>>> energy it moves in a cyclical motion, the only reincarnation I can sign up
>>>> to at the moment is the idea of dust to dust, at a molecular level we move
>>>> on to another existence.
>>>>
>>> But Sklenge and Michaela are no more? If that's what you are saying, then so
>>> far I agree.
>>>
>> So you don't go in for spiritual reincarnation either?
>>
> How can Michaela ever come back? Here's how I currently see it (o how to put
> it into words...): if I learn to accept myself and others my behaviour will
> change accordingly. By showing (read: being) love, others can pick up on that
> and they too might change. And in this way it gets passed along. The love has
> to start *somewhere*. Why not with me?
>
> Anyway, the more we can change our own outlook, the more likely future
> generations will be influenced.
>
> If we really are *one* in essence, my positive outlook can not have anything
> but a positive influence on future inhabitants of this f*d up world.
>
> Even though Michaela won't come back (Michaela is irrelevant anyway), her
> essence (oneness) will (and the other forms that come to earth will also have
> largely forgotten their essence, just like us). And Michaela owes it to
> "essence" to be loving (o man, I'm flailing...).
No you're not. You seem to be making sense to me at the moment.
> So, when Harvey speaks about compassion, I agree with him. I see it as a
> long-term goal where we play only a tiny role towards making things better
> tomorrow.
>
> I didn't quite put that as clearly as I wanted to, but you're a bright girl
> and I'm sure you have filled in where I've come short...
You put it exactly how it should have been put. It's like a celestial relay
race. [I have a problem with how that works in the future though. ie with
the notion of life extension into the realms of eternity, which will come
eventually.]
> *** Wait. I wanted to say this, but got myself sidetracked... As I become more
> aware that I'm more a spiritual being than a human one, I seem more able to
> cope in this life. I think that's because I am starting to accept that things
> here don't matter nearly as much as I used to think they did. And because I'm
> not worrying myself about life here as much, I am not confusing myself as much
> with stupid, confusing self-talk (like how to Keep myself looking good in
> other people's eyes when I get "shot down" for example.).
This last bit is where I stop converging with you, perhaps - I think we can
only make the most of this life, if we don't we're cheating ourselves and
the relay race. I agree that it doesn't matter - for instance: if /you/
don't say it someone else will, we will get there in the end. And I agree
that self image can get in the way of many things. But I think that no
matter what else happens or how else you affect the relay race - you get
seventy years or so in which to enjoy it, I wouldn't lose track of that
important, relevant, remembrance of the mortality we all have in common [at
the moment].
> The problem really does go away when one stops concentrating (giving it power
> over one) on it. Because when one pays attention to something in a worrying
> way, one is resisting and resisting limits one's real capabilities. Ok. That's
> enough rambling.
That bit is important. Why do I get the feeling that that bit is important?
I wish I had the brain power to slot it into place with the exact same
feeling I've been getting recently regarding interconnectedness and what
KrosRogue said, what was it? Reality is A Figment of the Imagination is A
Controlled Form of Insanity is Reality is A Figment of... ["To KrosRogue"
chat between Chloe/KR) I don't suppose it matters in the end. But it's fun
to play innit?
> (You don't have to read it all :)
>
LOL! Now you tell me! You can stop reading now too.
> - Michaela
Michaela
> Michaela's post:
>> Sklenge wrote:
>>> Life extension based on virtual reality based on how things are at
>>> the moment your mind/imagination is your exit out of here whenever
>>> you want. You can be whatever you want, whoever you want, do
>>> whatever you want with whoever you want.
>>
>> I wish I meant what you knew. There's something you /understand/
>> that I don't. I'm still resisting not *not being*. If you mean what I
>> know.
>
> It's quite simple really, so simple that I've always taken it for
> granted. Recently I've tried to explain my thought processing to
> other people but they don't always do what I do in my mind. I can
> keep myself entertained for hours (within a few minutes) of
> 'daydreaming'. I know the difference between the real and the unreal
> but I'm beginning to think that I'm only fooling myself. I prefer the
> fantasy to the reality every time. That's all, it's nothing
> spectacular.
No. I was playing dumb there. I'm with you now.
>> "For me it's been very simple, i've said it before: as soon as i
>> realized the limits of logic (which can be logically established),
>> i knew there had to be something beyond logic. Something that
>> integrates the logical "0" and "1". And that this unity is
>> undefinable, by definition, because if you define it, you also
>> define its
>> opposite, which it doesn't have, so you get a contradiction.
>> In other words, reality is undefinable."
>
> Sounds like trying to describe quantum dynamics. You know it exists
> because you can point at the place where it doesn't exist... kind of
> thing.
Yes.
So reaching out for 'god' or 'the fundamental truth' becomes a
> futile act.
No. One can visualise (or intuit?) it. But you (well not me
anyway) can't describe it. I find that I "see" it, but the moment
I try to explain it to myself even, I "lose" it.
(Aside: I am currently responding to franco's ass
"Questions about confidence" post and I keep swinging
between that and this one because in that post I am
trying to describe the same thing Arie spoke of above.
LOL. Talk of futile posting.)
I am not sure if reaching out is necessary even. The answer
is -as Harvey often says- within. God (I prefer the words
spirit or being at the moment) is within you. It's in the
middle; in-between. That's why I believe that extremes
are when one is furthest away from one's being. Well that's
how I feel today anyway :)
There are certain laws/principles that we can "use" to
our advantage in this world and as a means of getting
a little closer to our true spiritual nature.
But I don't believe for one minute that we can do it without
spirit.
> In my case it's likely to be a lack of intellect.
O crap. Are you fishing for compliments again?
I have an inability
> to put into words exactly what I'm striving to say... in this case
> it's not a difficult concept but I'm making hard work of explaining
> it. Sorry.
I feel the same way about the words thing. Except I don't think it's
an easy concept to explain. It's possible we're talking about
entirely different things. LOL
>> Ok. That wasn't a perfect fit for what I wanted to say,
>> but I wanted to quote him anyway. Arie has a way with
>> words.
>
> I don't think I've 'met' Arie.
No. I very much doubt you have. You'da liked him.
- Michaela
Michaela
> Egoless? Let me google for a short while there...
> http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?EgolessCreativity
Haven't read this yet...
- Michaela
Your Name Here=Harvey
palatable to them, that they can accept.
Real truth has no allegiance with anything else, it simply 'is'.
Peoples' experiences (provided they are genuine) - I view as 'data' and
if it keeps on happening again and again, independently and often
enough, independently confirm each other.
Such that things like - out of body experiences (astral travelling)
and near death experiences are variations of the same. Basically you
can see a matrix or web (if you will) forming, and these reach out and
out and confirm other things, which do explain each other - and
reincarnation fits in with all this (better than any other belief).
The problem with understanding, is that each person has their own
view of what reality is, according to what life experiences they have
been through - and rarely does one view of reality matches with another.
I believe that fundamentals can be agreed upon, but this will take
a lot of discussion in lots of details, over a long period of time.
This is what the world lacks, and why the world is not a peaceful
or a harmonious place.
There are a lot of misconceptions (untruths, lies, etc) taken as
truth - and religion has a lot to do with it.
Sorting out religions needs to be done, so that the rubbish of religion
does not get handed down to the next generation, and continues the
unrest carried over by past centuries...
Harvey
In article <41662...@news1.mweb.co.za>, michaelashouse says...
Gymd...@webtv.net
Sklenge
> I am not sure if reaching out is necessary even. The answer is -as Harvey
> often says- within. God (I prefer the words spirit or being at the moment) is
> within you. It's in the middle; in-between. That's why I believe that extremes
> are when one is furthest away from one's being. Well that's how I feel today
> anyway :) There are certain laws/principles that we can "use" to our
> advantage in this world and as a means of getting a little closer to our true
> spiritual nature.
>
> But I don't believe for one minute that we can do it without spirit.
>
one each or access to a 'collective spirit'? Can we influence it or does it
influence us? If it exists should we just accept it and forget about it. How
can we make use of it? Is it possibsle to make use of it? Is it adviseable
to make use of it? Other questions will be on there way eventually. However,
I ought to say right now that I'm about to get bogged down in a whole stack
of paperwork re: my forthcoming non-spiritual event so any chat on this and
other subjects is about to become sporadic on my side... Sorry in advance.
>> In my case it's likely to be a lack of intellect.
>>
> O crap. Are you fishing for compliments again?
>
No. I know nothing. Honestly I'm not 'fishing for compliments' when I say
I'm stupid or lack the intellect. I've been in the presence of fearfully
clever people and I love to hear them go on. It's all a matter of that
relativity thing like an intelligence pecking order. By many standards I'm
thick - and, not only am I thick, I'm too lazy to improve myself... which is
even worse. However there's something to be said for voluntary stupidity:
I'd love to be the woman in the cross-over pinny who sticks the cherry on
top of bakewell tarts. After work I'd go home to watch 'Coronation Street'
drink a half of mackesons and go to bed. I'd like to have two weeks in
Torremolinos every year and only get excited about Bingo. Essential to this
deal: I'd not even know that anything else outside of that existence need
exist as far as I care (no offence to women who do this). To many people
higher up the intelligence pecking order I already am that woman.
But I'm cursed with just enough intelligence to make me realize I'm missing
out somewhere and other people are much closer to 'the secret'.
>
>> I have an inability to put into words exactly what I'm striving to say... in
>> this case it's not a difficult concept but I'm making hard work of explaining
>> it. Sorry.
>>
> I feel the same way about the words thing. Except I don't think it's an easy
> concept to explain. It's possible we're talking about entirely different
> things. LOL
I was talking about having an over active imagination I think.
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:BD8EDB43.24D22%skl...@yahoo.co.uk:
> But I'm cursed with just enough intelligence to make me realize I'm
> missing out somewhere and other people are much closer to 'the
> secret'.
>
Are you aware of "Torgo", milady?
http://www.torgo.org/torgo/
--
"My name is Mike. I take care of the place while The Master is away."
--The shocking conclusion of "Manos"
Sklenge
> Sklenge <skl...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in
> news:BD8EDB43.24D22%skl...@yahoo.co.uk:
>
>> But I'm cursed with just enough intelligence to make me realize I'm
>> missing out somewhere and other people are much closer to 'the
>> secret'.
>>
>
> Are you aware of "Torgo", milady?
> http://www.torgo.org/torgo/
Erm. I'm a frayed knot. See how lacking my life is proving to be. I spoze I
could get my bruv to download it and send it over... I'm not sure if it's my
thing though.
Why do you ask?
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:BD8F512E.24E42%skl...@yahoo.co.uk:
It seemed funny at the time. You don't have internet access?
>
--
Critics express outrage that the federal government, which has contributed
$2.3 million in financing over the last four years for prayer research,
would spend taxpayer money to study something they say has nothing to do
with science.
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/10/health/10prayer.html
For America to even toy with the idea of electing a man who doesn't hate
homos, has the Lord so hopping mad, He's been killing almost as many people
as when He's happy.
http://www.landoverbaptist.org/sermons/halloweenmessage.html
Sklenge
> Sklenge <skl...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in
> news:BD8F512E.24E42%skl...@yahoo.co.uk:
>
>> Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent's post:
>>
>>> Sklenge <skl...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in
>>> news:BD8EDB43.24D22%skl...@yahoo.co.uk:
>>>
>>>> But I'm cursed with just enough intelligence to make me realize I'm
>>>> missing out somewhere and other people are much closer to 'the
>>>> secret'.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Are you aware of "Torgo", milady?
>>> http://www.torgo.org/torgo/
>>
>> Erm. I'm a frayed knot. See how lacking my life is proving to be. I
>> spoze I could get my bruv to download it and send it over... I'm not
>> sure if it's my thing though.
>>
>>
>> Why do you ask?
>>
> It seemed funny at the time.
I need to know why. And I have a right to know. You therefore have a duty of
care in this matter.
> You don't have internet access?
Erm. Yes I have bored band. But my bruv has subscribed to some kind of movie
download ftp site thing so I could get him to download it for me. Can I
download it off of Winmx? Will I regret it. My FiL has big knees.
Michaela
> Michaela's post:
> This last bit is where I stop converging with you, perhaps - I think
> we can only make the most of this life, if we don't we're cheating
> ourselves and the relay race. I agree that it doesn't matter - for
> instance: if /you/ don't say it someone else will, we will get there
> in the end. And I agree that self image can get in the way of many
> things. But I think that no matter what else happens or how else you
> affect the relay race - you get seventy years or so in which to enjoy
> it, I wouldn't lose track of that important, relevant, remembrance of
> the mortality we all have in common [at the moment].
I'm not sure where we are disagreeing here. I don't disagree with
anything you say above.
>> The problem really does go away when one stops concentrating (giving
>> it power over one) on it. Because when one pays attention to
>> something in a worrying way, one is resisting and resisting limits
>> one's real capabilities. Ok. That's enough rambling.
>
> That bit is important. Why do I get the feeling that that bit is
> important? I wish I had the brain power to slot it into place with
> the exact same feeling I've been getting recently regarding
> interconnectedness and what KrosRogue said, what was it? Reality is A
> Figment of the Imagination is A Controlled Form of Insanity is
> Reality is A Figment of... ["To KrosRogue" chat between Chloe/KR) I
> don't suppose it matters in the end. But it's fun to play innit?
Here's an example of that law of resistance (I have no idea
if this follows on from something you said or not, perhaps
I only imagine that we spoke about resistance somewhere).
On Sundays we have the usual assortment of spiritual
proggies on TV.
Yesterday, this South African TV actress was on talking
about her spirituality. I don't remember the question, but
she got on to how she started finding her name in the
papers every Sunday with all sorts of untrue gossip about
her. She says she was distraught.
What did she do, but what most of us would do (insert
Chloe's quote here):
"...as a sister of mine has put it "when someone hates our face,
we tend to try and show we are not this big bad thign they think
us to be. We double in patience and kindness, where then they
hate our face for being kind and patient on top of it. To insecure
ones, the nicer you are, the worse it is...".
This actress, thought to herself, "But I'm a nice person. Why can't
they see this? I've got to be nicer otherwise they'll never stop.
And she did this little pretend frantic impersonation of a run
that has probably lost something in the telling to show us how
she was trying to "overtake" the rumours.
Then she said that one day she suddenly realised that she was
ok in God's eyes. And that's when she stopped running. That's
when she stopped trying to prove herself to the public/
newspeople of SA.
She says that the gossip stopped. Just like that.
I have many of these stories in my life. When I gave up fighting
the problem went away.The flip side is about wanting something
and trying so hard that it eludes you. Again, when you stop
chasing it frantically it becomes yours. Or else you suddenly realise
that that wasn't what you really wanted anyway.
- Michaela
43 That which offers no resistance,
overcomes the hardest substances.
That which offers no resistance
can enter where there is no space. TTC
"The Chinese say that water is the most powerful element because
it is perfectly nonresistant. It can wear away a rock and sweep all
before it." ~ Florence Scovel Shinn "The Game of Life".
Eleonore Beaudoin
Logic has it that what does not exist can not be "proven".
It then is a waste of time to try and say what one is not...
All one can do is go on and be who they are.
In trying to say what one is not to accusations and insinuatiosn and
affirmations and all that, one is in reaction, and is not being themself.
They are not in action, but in reaction, not being, but being on a mod of
showing who they are not, in the face of gossips or slanders or rumours, etc.
Been there, done that, learned the hard way when I actually joined asl.
I tried at the time for 18 solid months, day in and day out, to clarify
what I thought had to be a mininterpretation that lead to some
misunderstanding. As long as I saw it that way and tried to clarify, to
statethat I was not this or that, it just went on with preconceptions just
making it stay ugly.
The day I anounced that too bad, I had it with trying and seing it as a
minunderstanding, that it had to be bad will after all that time, and that
from there one, I'd not even bother to answer belligerant ones, where one
can NOT prove what does not exist and hope that that would correct any
slander anyway, everything turned around.
I started posting whatever, unrelated to the immense feuding that was
ongoing, and slowly poeple tired of the feud andtarted replying to stuff
that was lighter, and non belligerant. Useless efforts of 18 straight
months that ahd elad to nothign were suddenly replaced by a complete
change over a few weeks.
That, for being in action rather than in reaction mode.
Of course, not trying is another thing all together, in that it can apply
to interactions, suire, but for instance does not apply to job hunting and
the likes.
In that, again, it best falls into attitude rather than just "behavior",
where perhaps spirituality has a lot to do with attitude, in the end:
good actions can be imitated, by politicians for instance, or even by
colleagues;-), but faking an attitude is something much harder.
If they say that actions speak louder than words, I'd say that attitude
speaks over behavior.
Two or ten can have a same behavior, and have a completely different
attitude behind it.
Think of the sect leaders, for instance....
They might use the right words, and prone good things...
And yet what is behind it all some somehow sense and detect.
Maybe those that detect it can not put it into words...But the attitude
gives it away, for not being in line with the actions and words.
And puttign anattitude into words is a very, very tough one.
All one could describe to talk about an attitude is...point at actions and
behavior, where then it can not be codified, bottled, nor faked, therefore.
I.e. it sure can be attempted to fake it, and often is, in fact. But the
very fake will give itself away for being phony, usually sooner than later.
Perhaps the fact that an attitude can not be put into words and
communciated that easily to toehrs makes it so that those who see no
""use"" for spirituality can not grasp whats in it for those who see
it as important.
Perhaps that is part of its "mysterious ways";-), where that very thing
that eludes most makes it so so many are yet manipulated and sucked in by
improvized gurus and sect leaders playing "mysterious";-).
Where playing msterious is yet still only behavior and not attitude.
I has to do with "want" more than with "being", and in that is a thing of
actions, therefore of image, and not of inner quest or inner growth.
C
>
> - Michaela >
> 43 That which offers no resistance,
> overcomes the hardest substances.
> That which offers no resistance
> can enter where there is no space. TTC
>
> "The Chinese say that water is the most powerful element because
> it is perfectly nonresistant. It can wear away a rock and sweep all
> before it." ~ Florence Scovel Shinn "The Game of Life".
>
>
--
Michaela
> Most people don't want the 'truth' - they just want something that is
> palatable to them, that they can accept.
The easy way out. They way we've always been taught. Old
habits die hard etc.
> Real truth has no allegiance with anything else, it simply 'is'.
Yes.
> Peoples' experiences (provided they are genuine) - I view as 'data' and
> if it keeps on happening again and again, independently and often
> enough, independently confirm each other.
Hmmm...
> Such that things like - out of body experiences (astral travelling)
> and near death experiences are variations of the same.
Each to his own and I neither dispute nor agree
with these. I simply haven't had enough evidence
to agree here. Re reincarnation, one of Mike's
friends says he went back to a previous life.
He says he has no way of proving he did, either
others or to himself, but he just feels he did.
I have no reason to doubt him. I've known him as
long as I've known Mike and he's never been a
sensationalist lying type, so I dunno.
Basically you
> can see a matrix or web (if you will) forming,
I see it too. I also get images of a giant jigsaw
puzzle and one of those that stays with me the most
is one of an orange splitting up into all its parts
(what are those little rain-dropped shaped things
in oranges called? Cells?) Anyway, I see the orange
splitting up cell by cell and then coming together
again.
A Course in Miracles says the split (where we separated
from oneness) happened and undid itself in the same instant.
I like that.
and these reach out and
> out and confirm other things, which do explain each other - and
> reincarnation fits in with all this (better than any other belief).
See now. That's what works for you. Astrology works
for others. And crystals for others. Me, I only
understand energy and a bit of how it works between
people. People steal other people's energy from each
other, for instance when they dominate another person,
they take their energy (have you ever tried making sense
when someone has intimidated you?). For energy here, read
brain power, ability to think.
> The problem with understanding, is that each person has their own
> view of what reality is, according to what life experiences they have
> been through - and rarely does one view of reality matches with another.
Yes. Paradigms. Layers and layers of paradigms.
Arie said maybe the mission is to rid ourselves
of all paradigms.
> I believe that fundamentals can be agreed upon, but this will take
> a lot of discussion in lots of details, over a long period of time.
>
> This is what the world lacks, and why the world is not a peaceful
> or a harmonious place.
> There are a lot of misconceptions (untruths, lies, etc) taken as
> truth - and religion has a lot to do with it.
> Sorting out religions needs to be done, so that the rubbish of religion
> does not get handed down to the next generation, and continues the
> unrest carried over by past centuries...
Yes.
>
> Harvey
Please keep talking. I don't always understand where
you are coming from, and I don't always have the
energy to listen, and I'm not really interested in
the notion of reincarnation, but I am sure you have
a lot to teach me.
- Michaela
Your Name Here=Harvey
in understanding different things.
I've cleaning some old style venetian blinds around the house. If I had
any money, I would throw them out, and put up conventional curtains or
similar instead, as venentian blinds are very difficult (time consuming)
to clean. But I have time, so cleaning them is what I'll do.
Through doing such drudgery - you can be contemplative with your thoughts
and see parallels in many different things.
I may wonder who put up these venetian blinds in the first place? How
wonderful they seem to be when new, but how troublesome they are after
5 years of dust have gathered on them - they no longer seem to be such a
good buy. That regular curtains would have been better, as they can be
throw in the wash.
And I think back to the times in other houses, in which venetian blinds
were used there, and how we use to clean them - that was drudgery back
then, when I wasn't able to see that cleaning times were times to
reflect - you don't do that, when you're young...
But there are venetian blinds in the real world, in terms of thoughts,
like as in the case of religions. Christians (and others) don't like the
real truth at all, they prefer their own 'brand' of truth, which is
hardly truth, that explains everything.
The early christian church set themselves up as an authority (as all
early religions do, when they are so-called 'forming') - they make
claims or promises --- they have fodder (dogma) to feed the masses, and
have some system to keep their flock happy or busy. Of course this isn't
the view that christians have of themselves ---- they'll say that those
early founders were men (they were always largely men at that time, women
were not viewed as equals, etc) of pure spirituality, in which their
purity of thought and intent were such that, that they were guided by
'god' - the holy spirit, etc.
But you can tell from the tone and 'feelings' behind the words as
worded in the bible --- that something isn't quite right, nor consistant.
Christians don't see these inconsistancies, or view that the bible is
seriously flawed - in many different ways.
They don't see that the bible is merely 'constructed' like any other
piece of writing, that the New Testament, is not written from the eyes
of this or that apostle - it isn't. That the writers of the bible are
largely anonymous, and that what was written was written in very different
time periods. Nor do they see the oddness that here we have a religion
that 'came' from the middle east, and sisters of christianity are
Judiasm (which is older) and Islam (which is younger) that has spread to
other parts of the world. Now is christianity the one and only true
religion? Are all of them right? Or are all of them wrong?
Did Islam suffer the same fate as christianity - that the originator did
have very good thoughts and ideas (like Jesus) but similarly had those
views and ideas changed by the early church that created the religion.
And I do get the sense that did happen - when they became a religion,
there was a power struggle, which changed the teachings to what is passed
down today.
Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
People of religion are no different.
I guess this is sidetracking still. Christianity doesn't have the answer
to everything, they only pretend to know, like other religions, pretend.
What is conventional thought - that which is accepted as knowledge or
history, usually isn't. It is only something that suffices in the meantime,
to give some sense of orderness and structure.
We don't know much of the history of this planet at all.
The truth would be startling, in light of what little we know.
I don't wish to discuss reincarnation in detail. I don't focus minutely
upon reincarnation and only discuss the general process of it.
For information about reincarnation, I'll suggest access the archives of
the newsgroup alt.paranormal.reincarnation in which there has been some
excellent lengthy in detail discussions about reincarnation - even about
how Jesus taught reincarnation, and that reincarnation was deleted from
the bible, although traces of it still remain.
Yes, there are christians who believe in reincarnation and the bible,
still.
I'll make some other comments in another post.
Harvey
In article <3271bf15.0410...@posting.google.com>,
michaelamack...@yahoo.com says...
Your Name Here=Harvey
You can't let someone else do it for you - although that is what religion
does - package it all up, leading people like sheep.
A skeptic would say - to a slaughter.
And sadly you could say, if you wanted to, it's a con, a confidence
trick. These religions are like a 'yes' club, in which all members are
saying 'yes' to the same belief system. Safety in numbers? No, it doesn't
happen that way. Truth is not like that...
A devout christian may say - why are you undermining my belief system?
Talking about my religion in that way. Why not?
You should be so critical. Everyone should be.
Like so many people - growing up, I accepted 'christianity' as anyone
can, with it present around you. But as the years roll by, and thinking
about it all, you can come to your own conclusions about christianity.
I was willing to believe in christianity - if it made sense, if it
rang 'true' - if there was evidence for it. And I just don't see any
real evidence for what it claims.
I am so critical about everything - especially my own views.
My lesson to people would be - to use your critical thinking, as you do
in your everyday life - about choosing to buy a car, house/home, TV, etc.
Use that process to examine the great questions you wanted answers for.
And to keep on wondering why? Eventually you will get answers and
formulate your own ideas and conclusions, with your own understanding.
Harvey
In article <3271bf15.0410...@posting.google.com>,
michaelamack...@yahoo.com says...
>
>
Michaela
I agree. I was never a "believer". If people said "things happened for a
reason" and "you were meant to bump into that person today" I'd say,
"What about all those times when you miss each other by a couple
of seconds?" I had every excuse not to believe at the ready. At the
time I made perfect sense now I can no longer see the logic in what
I was saying. Duality never lets us down.
- Michaela
Your Name Here=Harvey
There are a lot of people who make claims about 'god' and believe
they have a personal contact with the almighty - but ask for any
proof or evidence of any sort - and they cannot provide any.
And religions which do make claims about god in serious ways, cannot
offer any evidence in recent times, to show their unity and partnership
with god.
Of course, we need evidence and proof (of some sort - any will be
acceptable) so that we can tell whether someone or something is
truthful or not?
And simple logic can be proof too - seeing is believing.
We are all in the same boat - and we are all the same, in the eyes
of god.
I do believe in spirituality and the divine - but not that of
Judiasm, Christianity and Islam. These seem to offer false promises
(anything that makes claims, you will receive this, this and this in
the afterlife - rings false - if you become one of their flock.)
Harvey
Eleonore Beaudoin
That would be more like a belief in Fate, and in a god that already wrote
all that woudl happen, which does not fit with the fact that christians
religions are about a belief in God that is said to have given everyone
free will.
If all is prewritten, nothing is free will, then the god they believe in
would have given them nothing.
Note that there are soem christian religiosn that base their belief yet
exactly on fate and all being prewritten by God, while in the rest of them
is that confusion or mix of both, which is indeed dual and nonsensical.
That being said, oen can go "We were meant to meet" thinking of all the
past choices they did that happened to lead to their living where they
were and hapening to go to this place that day, on each their side. It
often comes from a simple need to believe that they are special, while yet
everyoen we meet is the result of our past choices and theirs coinciding a
moment in time. That we miss them or stop and say hi.
In that, the entire soul mate idea of only oen made only for us always hit
me as nonsensical too.
That woud have to do with predestination, with fate being already decided
and leavign no nothing to chance or to free will, again, on top of being
completely ...weirdo. I.e. to think that oen was made for our special
self, was born just to filfil one's own little desires, is quite
bellybutonist a way of thinking,seems to me (no, I am not implyign you
said that, I am just sort of letting the thoughts flow and follow as they
happen from somethign you said that lead me on other thoughts:)).
Of by soul mate one means a person they get along fantastically well
with, I'd rather believe there are actually many of those, i.e. not just
one, as that woudl require one heck of a mean saddistic god. Perhaps it
take a masochist person to believe that too, in that way.
And the train of thoughts stops here, as there is an old tune on the radio
that I do not particularly like, but that sort of sends different
triggerers to the brain. Tune is named "Ready for lil thing called love" LOL:)
:)
Chloe
> > - Michaela >
>
--
Eerie Cabinets of Dr. Rodent
news:6ebc501c.0410...@posting.google.com:
> Beyond this, there is something I am thinking more and more about
> these days, and that is finding some way of emotionally reconciling
> the desirability (from a certain, very deep and intimate angle) of
> some sort of belief in a personal God(dess) with the fact that such a
> being obviously does not and cannot exist.
Feeling smug, knowing that you're better than everyone else. Well it works
for me.
--
"Anywhere I'm standing is a free speech zone."
--Michael Badnarik, Libertarian Party presidential candidate