Befuddled
Anonymous
read this or not, but I have a need to talk about this and there is no
one that I can talk to; after all, it's not like I can talk to a
golfing buddy, or a friend at church about this subject.
I married my wife twelve years ago. On our wedding night she told me
she had herpes. We had never had sexual intercourse before marriage,
although we had come close several times. Each time we came close,
she said that she was on her period so we did nothing. On our wedding
night, she cried, told me that she had herpes but had only had one OB
and had thought that herpes was a one-time thing so she did not tell
me she had it. Our wedding night was her second OB. I was shocked,
but loved her and did not want to make it any harder on her than it
need to be. She told me about the virus and that it was perfectly safe
to have sex as long as she was not actively broken out. I (like a
fool) did not check the facts. For 12 years we have had unprotected
sex.
Last night, a business associate (an MD) and I were out to dinner and
the conversation turned to a mutual friend who had just married a girl
from South America. He commented that our friend had "… better have an
Aids test done on her, and wear a condom for the rest of his life…" I
said that I understood the Aids test, but why a condom for the rest of
his life? He said down there in South America herpes is a problem,
much worse than here in the United States. I explained to him that the
virus couldn't be passed on unless there is an active lesion, so it
was perfectly safe.
I thought the guy was going to choke on his salad! He explained to me
that my conception was totally false, and worse, you can get the virus
and HAVE NO SYMPTOMS at all! He went on to say that unless extremely
careful it is more likely than not that an uninfected partner will,
somewhere in the course of a lifelong marriage, get the virus. Even
though my friend is an Ophthalmologist, not an infectious disease
doctor, I'd assume he knows what he is talking about. I did not want
to ask him a lot of questions because he knows my wife and I did not
want to raise any suspicion on his part that my wife may have this
disease.
So here are my questions:
1) Is it possible that somewhere in my 12 years with my wife I have
contracted the virus and have just never had an outbreak?
2) If I don't have it. . . I hate condoms, can I NEVER have sex with
my wife ever again without a condom?
3) Can I get herpes from oral sex with my wife?
4) If someone can have herpes without symptoms, how is anyone safe
with anyone? Virtually any person can have herpes and not know it.
5) If you have no symptoms, can you be tested for herpes?
6) If someone has herpes with no symptoms, when are they contagious?
7) My wife says she has way more OB's when we have sex. Is it
possible that I have a different strain of herpes and have given it
back to her in a different strain?
8) Did I mention I hate condoms?
9) It's worse than hate. I despise, loathe, abhor, and detest
condoms. So what are my safe alternatives?
I love my wife very much and plan to be with her forever, BUT I REALLY
don't want this problem. I have seen her suffer over the years and I
know I don't want this. I can't believe for all the years I have not
thought a lot about this, yet now I am very concerned.
I don't know if I need to be tested. I get a physical each year, but
do not know if herpes is part of the tests that are done. Also, is
there a good web site that has the CORRECT answers out there about
herpes? There is a lot of sites with conflicting information, and some
are so convoluted I can't make heads or tails of them.
Any help in better understanding this problem would be a greatly
appreciated.
Ted
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GUYonphone
In article <qbfcjt4ep3mbdtjdm...@4ax.com>, Anonymous
<anon...@anonymous.anonymous> writes:
Hiya Ted
Well, you didn't ask, but I'll say it anyway. Your doc friend here should
stick with eyes. He knows squat about STDs. Plus, he seems a tad prejudiced
against people from foreign countries.
>I thought the guy was going to choke on his salad! He explained to me
>that my conception was totally false, and worse, you can get the virus
>and HAVE NO SYMPTOMS at all! He went on to say that unless extremely
>careful it is more likely than not that an uninfected partner will,
>somewhere in the course of a lifelong marriage, get the virus. Even
>though my friend is an Ophthalmologist, not an infectious disease
>doctor, I'd assume he knows what he is talking about. I did not want
>to ask him a lot of questions because he knows my wife and I did not
>want to raise any suspicion on his part that my wife may have this
>disease.
>
Your assumption that he knows what he's talking about is probably more off-base
than on. GPs, Family docs, Urologists, Dermatologists, etc...those that
actually see a lot of herpes cases, are generally less informed than they
should be about herpes, given it's prevalence--let alone someone who treats
eyes, for heaven's sake. I mean, he may know a bunch about herpes around the
eyes, but STDs don't sound like his strong suit. The fact that he knows about
asymptomatic shedding (the ability of the virus to be on the skin surface, thus
contagious, with no symptoms whatsoever) is impressive though...many docs who
actually treat STDs don't know that. Anyway...I'll get off your friends ass
for now. ::grin::
>So here are my questions:
>
>1) Is it possible that somewhere in my 12 years with my wife I have
>contracted the virus and have just never had an outbreak?
Sure.
>2) If I don't have it. . . I hate condoms, can I NEVER have sex with
>my wife ever again without a condom?
Well, here are the stats I'm aware of. A guy has about a 5% chance per year of
catching herpes from an infected female partner if they avoid having sex during
outbreaks. If condoms are used all the time when they DO have sex, that
percentage could be reduced (depending on where her symptoms normally
appear--because some of the ... ahhh... 'areas' that are bumpin' 'round would
not be prevented from skin to skin contact even WITH a condom). Suppression
therapy (the infected individual being on daily prescription antivirals whether
having an outbreak or not) can further reduce the chances of an uninfected
partner getting infected. This is not a proven fact, but just assumed, since
suppression will reduce not only known outbreaks but asymptomatic shedding by
up to 95% as well. There's a study going on currently to prove this out, but
so far, no data can come of it since it's not over yet.
There's also a further stat that indicates the longer you can be with a partner
who has herpes and not catch it, the less likely you are of ever catching it.
This seems to kick in dramatically at about 18 months. The chances, per year,
for a male to catch herpes from an infected female after they've been together
for over 18 months is about .5%. Then it gets more difficult for the
uninfected partner to catch it the longer they're together. Seems that
somehow, in some folks, the immune system seems to recognize herpesvirus and
protect against infection. They don't really understand this yet though. And
of course it could also be partially attributable to the couple having sex much
more frequently the first 6 months they're together, then gradually tapering
off gettin' frisky withe each other as time goes on.
>3) Can I get herpes from oral sex with my wife?
Well, who's giving what to whom? If you mean, can you get oral herpes from
giving her oral sex, the answer would more than likely depend on the type of
virus she has. Has her herpes ever been typed? If she has HSV2 genitally, the
answer to this question would be "probably not". HSV2 rarely transfers to the
oral area...and if it does, it rarely outbreaks (once the initial outbreak is
over). Outbreaks of oral HSV2 recur about .01% of the time..so, once every 10
years or so (again...on average, okay? Statistics can always break down in the
individual's case). Then again, if she has genital HSV1, it's going to recur
less often for her, shed less often, and when virus is around, there will be
less of it around (HSV1 is not entirely comformatable in the genital area, so
it's usually less severe than a similar HSV2 infection would normally be), thus
putting you at less risk of catching it. So, the usual transfer for genital
HSV1 is from someone giving an uninfected person oral sex while the giver is
contagious (whether with symptoms or not) from their oral infection--NOT the
other way around (getting it orally from a genital infection). However, since
HSV1 is more comfy in the oral area, it's not impossible for a transfer to
happen that way. (sheezz... are there NO firm answers with herpes???? :-)
Now, if you meant can you get genital herpes from her giving you oral sex, the
answer would be "no". Unless... (sheez, there's another answer with an
exception) she also has oral herpes...even if she's unaware of her infection.
And many people do have it and have no idea they do (my Lady is one..she's
never had a coldsore in her life -- that she remembers).
Stats: 1 out of 4 people 18 years of age and older in the US already have
antibody to HSV2 (that means, they have HSV2). 50%, or possibly more, of
people already have antibody to HSV1 (usually located orally, but 30% of new
genital cases test out to be HSV1 if accurately tested). Yet, less then 1/3rd
of the people who are infected are aware they have herpes. One study even
found that 92% of the people who tested positive didn't know. Now, one thing
to know about that. Once they were informed of the symptoms, many said 'oh,
yeah...I've had that a time or 2, but they were still unaware whatever symptoms
they did have were connected to herpes. Herpes symptoms can be redness,
itching, burning, lesions that are scratch-like, rash-like, pimple-like, any
one of them, a few of these, or no symptoms at all. The herpesvirus has not
been around for thousands of years cause it doesn't know it's business.
>4) If someone can have herpes without symptoms, how is anyone safe
>with anyone? Virtually any person can have herpes and not know it.
Bingo!
>5) If you have no symptoms, can you be tested for herpes?
Yup... there are a couple really good blood tests for herpes. Both you and
your wife should be tested before deciding on changing any sexual practices.
It'd be useless to start to use condoms, with all the problems you've obviously
got with them, if you both already have antibody to the same type of virus
(either HSV1, HSV2, or both). Oh, and there are less accurate blood tests out
there too, so read up on them first...and then try and get one of the good ones
(sometimes, more difficult than it should be).
>6) If someone has herpes with no symptoms, when are they contagious?
Without symptoms, about 2-5 % of the time. But, that varies between people, it
varies for each person with the passing of time, etc. The problem is, there
are no symptoms when someone is subclinically shedding the virus, so it's
impossible to know they're doing it. However, studies have been run where
people have agreed to culture themselves daily, and this is how asymptomatic
shedding was found and verified.
>7) My wife says she has way more OB's when we have sex. Is it
>possible that I have a different strain of herpes and have given it
>back to her in a different strain?
Nope, you don't "give it back" to each other. That's been referred to as the
"ping-pong effect" here a few years back, and that's not how herpes works. Once
you have herpes, it outbreaks on whatever schedule it needs or wants to. You
don't pass it back and forth between partners. Now, what COULD be happening
is that one of your wife's triggers for outbreaks is friction. The friction of
sex is a known trigger for herpes (among others, like foods, stress over time,
lack of rest, etc). Just as friction is a known trigger for oral herpes
outbreaks. Try using supplimental lubrication (I've heard "Astro-glide"
mentioned here...but I don't find friction a problem for me, so I'm unfamiliar
with what's out there).
However, just because that's not what's happening to your wife and you, you're
not passing it back and forth, doesn't preclude the possibility that you aren't
already infected. Whether by your wife, or someone else in your past--herpes
can stay dormant for YEARS before first raising it's ugly head. A friend (who
owns a STD clinic) just recently told me about a 62 year old lady who came into
her clinic to find out what the "pimple" was on her privates. It cultured
positive for HSV2 and the lady was aghast when told! She hadn't had sex in 10
years, and had NEVER had any type of symptoms prior to that either.
>8) Did I mention I hate condoms?
Yup. And I'm in agreement. Which is why I recommend both of you get tested
before changing habits on a permanent basis. Could be, that particular horse
is already out of the barn.
>9) It's worse than hate. I despise, loathe, abhor, and detest
>condoms. So what are my safe alternatives?
>
See above. Actually suppression therapy for the wife would probably be even
more effective than condoms...but again, that part of suppression hasn't been
totally proven out yet. The study testing it won't be done for a couple more
years.
>I love my wife very much and plan to be with her forever, BUT I REALLY
>don't want this problem. I have seen her suffer over the years and I
>know I don't want this. I can't believe for all the years I have not
>thought a lot about this, yet now I am very concerned.
>
Yeah...odd how getting informed brings up even MORE questions (and concerns).
Herpes, and your body's reaction to it, is a very individual thing. So, I
think, is your attitude towards it. What I'd recommend for you right now is
that both of you get an accurate herpes blood test (typing IS important,
regardless of what a doc might say about it). Once that's done, come on back
with the results and everyone can give you their .02 about what you might do
from then on.
>I don't know if I need to be tested. I get a physical each year, but
>do not know if herpes is part of the tests that are done.
Rarely is a herpes blood test even included in a "standard STD panel", let
alone a physical. So no...you've probably never been tested before. But yeah,
you should be. ASAP, just to know what your present circumstances are. Same
for the wife.
> Also, is
>there a good web site that has the CORRECT answers out there about
>herpes? There is a lot of sites with conflicting information, and some
>are so convoluted I can't make heads or tails of them.
>
I like http://www.viridae.com/gen4.htm? (be sure to add the "?") and
http://www.westoverheights.com/freebook.html for accurate herpes info.
>Any help in better understanding this problem would be a greatly
>appreciated.
>
Scoot over to those websites, read what's there..read the other responses to
your post here, and then come on back with more question. A nicer bunch people
than the ones here'll be hard to find.
Unless you had an extreme reaction to herpes, I think you'd find it to be not
the major buggaboo that many make it out to be--after all, most who have it are
unaware they have it. Granted, there are some nasty reactions to it, and
there's no way to know how YOUR system will react to it until it has it...but
then again, you already may have herpes. Find that out...then come on back and
chat some more.
Hang in there
-G
Daryl Szady
Anonymous <anon...@anonymous.anonymous> wrote in message
news:qbfcjt4ep3mbdtjdm...@4ax.com...
> I have a few questions. I don't know if anyone will take the time to
> read this or not, but I have a need to talk about this and there is no
> one that I can talk to; after all, it's not like I can talk to a
> golfing buddy, or a friend at church about this subject.
>
> I married my wife twelve years ago. On our wedding night she told me
> she had herpes. We had never had sexual intercourse before marriage,
> although we had come close several times. Each time we came close,
> she said that she was on her period so we did nothing. On our wedding
> night, she cried, told me that she had herpes but had only had one OB
> and had thought that herpes was a one-time thing so she did not tell
> me she had it. Our wedding night was her second OB. I was shocked,
> but loved her and did not want to make it any harder on her than it
> need to be. She told me about the virus and that it was perfectly safe
> to have sex as long as she was not actively broken out. I (like a
> fool) did not check the facts. For 12 years we have had unprotected
> sex.
>
> Last night, a business associate (an MD) and I were out to dinner and
> the conversation turned to a mutual friend who had just married a girl
> Aids test done on her, and wear a condom for the rest of his life." I
> said that I understood the Aids test, but why a condom for the rest of
> his life? He said down there in South America herpes is a problem,
> much worse than here in the United States. I explained to him that the
> virus couldn't be passed on unless there is an active lesion, so it
> was perfectly safe.
>
> I thought the guy was going to choke on his salad! He explained to me
> that my conception was totally false, and worse, you can get the virus
> and HAVE NO SYMPTOMS at all! He went on to say that unless extremely
> careful it is more likely than not that an uninfected partner will,
> somewhere in the course of a lifelong marriage, get the virus. Even
> though my friend is an Ophthalmologist, not an infectious disease
> doctor, I'd assume he knows what he is talking about. I did not want
> to ask him a lot of questions because he knows my wife and I did not
> want to raise any suspicion on his part that my wife may have this
> disease.
>
> So here are my questions:
>
> 1) Is it possible that somewhere in my 12 years with my wife I have
> contracted the virus and have just never had an outbreak?
> 2) If I don't have it. . . I hate condoms, can I NEVER have sex with
> my wife ever again without a condom?
Will yoo stay with her the rest of your life?
> 3) Can I get herpes from oral sex with my wife?
Yes
> 4) If someone can have herpes without symptoms, how is anyone safe
> with anyone? Virtually any person can have herpes and not know it.
No one is "safe".
> 5) If you have no symptoms, can you be tested for herpes?
Yes
> 6) If someone has herpes with no symptoms, when are they contagious?
When they are shedding
> 7) My wife says she has way more OB's when we have sex. Is it
> possible that I have a different strain of herpes and have given it
> back to her in a different strain?
You would only need to give it to her once.
> 8) Did I mention I hate condoms?
Yes
> 9) It's worse than hate. I despise, loathe, abhor, and detest
> condoms. So what are my safe alternatives?
Yes - No sex
>
> I love my wife very much and plan to be with her forever, BUT I REALLY
> don't want this problem. I have seen her suffer over the years and I
> know I don't want this. I can't believe for all the years I have not
> thought a lot about this, yet now I am very concerned.
It is easier on men - we don't have the mucous membranes that women do
>
> I don't know if I need to be tested. I get a physical each year, but
> do not know if herpes is part of the tests that are done. Also, is
> there a good web site that has the CORRECT answers out there about
> herpes? There is a lot of sites with conflicting information, and some
> are so convoluted I can't make heads or tails of them.
>
Yes, this site - just ask
> Any help in better understanding this problem would be a greatly
> appreciated.
>
> Ted
>
>
>
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M2sl...@hotmail.com
>1) Is it possible that somewhere in my 12 years with my wife I have
>contracted the virus and have just never had an outbreak?
uh huh ... It's possible.
>2) If I don't have it. . . I hate condoms, can I NEVER have sex with
>my wife ever again without a condom?
If you haven't contracted it by now, I don't think I'd worry about it
much. Maybe you've developed some immunity. Maybe she doesn't shed
virus very often between O/Bs. Who knows. And if you *have* contracted
it, but show no symptoms ... well ... a condom's not going to do
either of you any good now ... except maybe as birth control.
>3) Can I get herpes from oral sex with my wife?
If she doesn't have it orally, she won't give it to you genitally. And
if she has HSV2, chances are you won't pick it up orally (slim chance,
but after 12 years? nnnaaawwww......) If she has HSV1 genitally, you
have a better chance of picking it up orally, but again, you may
already have it. I think now, after 12 years, is not the time to
worry much about this.
>4) If someone can have herpes without symptoms, how is anyone safe
>with anyone? Virtually any person can have herpes and not know it.
Right. But we're not talking about some life threatening disease
here. And there's blood tests available if you're really interested in
finding out about your situation.
>5) If you have no symptoms, can you be tested for herpes?
Yep. By blood test. There are a couple of good ones available. Only
problem is they won't tell you the location. But the Western Blot
*will* tell you type. Sometimes that can be a big help.
>6) If someone has herpes with no symptoms, when are they contagious?
Usually, not very often. Just depends. Studies show that asymptomatic
shedding can happen on 1-4 days out of 100 on the average. But
remember, that's just an average. Some people will shed on more days
than that, and some will shed less. And asymptomatic shedding doesn't
necessarily last all day. It may start quickly and end just as
quickly. So even on the days a person sheds asymptomatically, there
are times during that day when they're *not* shedding. The studies
didn't study it down to the average number of hours per day, I don't
think. And they also didn't take into account the fact that a person
may be shedding so slightly on some of those days that transmission is
unlikely ... especially to a partner that may have some sort of
natural immunity. So risk of transmission is practically impossible
to estimate for an individual couple. There's just to many variables
involved. But if you're still uninfected after 12 years, I'd think the
chances of it happening now are pretty slim.
Having said all that, there are no guarantees. Several folks on this
group can testify to that.
>7) My wife says she has way more OB's when we have sex. Is it
>possible that I have a different strain of herpes and have given it
>back to her in a different strain?
Nope. Different people have different triggers for outbreaks. For
some, certain foods will do it. For some, it's stress. For some it's
the friction (sex type friction). You might try something like KY
jelly. Or Astro Glide. That's pretty fun stuff. And it might prevent
her from having outbreaks if friction is a trigger for her.
>8) Did I mention I hate condoms?
You didn't have to ... but I think maybe you did.
>9) It's worse than hate. I despise, loathe, abhor, and detest
>condoms. So what are my safe alternatives?
Again, after 12 years, I think you're making a big deal over nothing.
However, if it's going to keep you awake at night, you might try a
blood test. If you're already infected, you won't be infected again,
so you can get some sleep. If you're not infected, at least you'll
have a better idea of your situation.
If you're *still* worried about it, there are ways, other than
condoms, to cut your risk of infection. For example, she could get on
suppressive medication.
Read back through some of the posts for the previous months. The
subject of how to cut risk of transmission comes up fairly frequently.
And if you're interested in a blood test, we can give you info on who
to call and what to do.
Here's a site with the straight scoop. It'll get you started.
http://www.viridae.com
There are more.
M2
Arlyn Grant
You have already gotten some great information from the folks here. I
just wanted to add my 2 cents.
There are two types of herpes simplex. That's the std. (Chicken pox
is another herpes virus). The two types are type 1 and type 2.
Type 1 herpes used to be found mainly around the mouth in the form of
cold sores or fever blisters. Have you ever had one? You may have
had a cold sore once when you were a child. That means you've got
herpes. Due to the growing practices of oral sex, type 1 herpes has
become popular in the genital region as well.
Type 2 herpes is pretty much always found on the genitals. It can be
found around the mouth but that seems to be very rare.
Both viruses have the same symptoms and are fairly similar. The
biggest difference is that people with type 1 genitally tend to have
fewer outbreaks and don't suffer as much with them. Though the first
year or so with either type can be pretty devestating.
Now, the question is: if you already have herpes, what will you do?
And, if you don't have herpes, what will you do? You really need to
answer those questions for yourself.
Then you can answer the condom question. Condoms only protect the
covered area. You can still get herpes on the unprotected parts.
There are medications that will help your wife to cut down on the
frequency of her outbreaks and her shedding. This will, in turn,
protect you. But absolutely nothing is 100%. Except abstinence, and
even that won't protect you because you can still get oral herpes from
kissing someone who has it.
My personal favorite blood test is the Western Blot. It will cost you
$104 plus any fees from the doctor to draw the blood. My insurance
covered 80% of the blood drawing fee and 60% of the test fee. The
Western Blot will tell you if you have herpes. It will also tell you
which type you have. And it will leave no room for doubt. It takes
12 - 16 weeks for the herpes antibodies to build up in your body
enough to be measured. So, if you decide to have ANY blood test, you
should go without sex for 16 weeks before you schedule the test. That
way you will know for sure.
Many doctors are confused by the Western Blot. But we have the
accurate information here and can give you phone numbers to call to
get the information to your doctor.
I have type 1 both genitally and orally. My husband and I have been
together for 16 years. Sometimes we use condoms, sometimes we don't.
He has never shown any symptoms of herpes. And he refuses to be
tested because it makes no difference to him if he has it or not.
(And he fears blood tests.....)
Please, please keep making lists of your questions and we will do our
best to answer them.
ar
On Sun, 24 Jun 2001 15:24:27 -0400, Anonymous
<anon...@anonymous.anonymous> wrote:
>I have a few questions. I don't know if anyone will take the time to
>read this or not, but I have a need to talk about this and there is no
>one that I can talk to; after all, it's not like I can talk to a
>golfing buddy, or a friend at church about this subject.
>
>I married my wife twelve years ago. On our wedding night she told me
>she had herpes. We had never had sexual intercourse before marriage,
>although we had come close several times. Each time we came close,
>she said that she was on her period so we did nothing. On our wedding
>night, she cried, told me that she had herpes but had only had one OB
>and had thought that herpes was a one-time thing so she did not tell
>me she had it. Our wedding night was her second OB. I was shocked,
>but loved her and did not want to make it any harder on her than it
>need to be. She told me about the virus and that it was perfectly safe
>to have sex as long as she was not actively broken out. I (like a
>fool) did not check the facts. For 12 years we have had unprotected
>sex.
>
>Last night, a business associate (an MD) and I were out to dinner and
>the conversation turned to a mutual friend who had just married a girl
>from South America. He commented that our friend had "ů better have an
>Aids test done on her, and wear a condom for the rest of his lifeů" I
Chump
mo.aol.com>, guyon...@aol.com says...
> Yup... there are a couple really good blood tests for herpes. Both you and
> your wife should be tested before deciding on changing any sexual practices.
> It'd be useless to start to use condoms, with all the problems you've obviously
> got with them, if you both already have antibody to the same type of virus
> (either HSV1, HSV2, or both). Oh, and there are less accurate blood tests out
> there too, so read up on them first...and then try and get one of the good ones
> (sometimes, more difficult than it should be).
>
A question - I thought a blood test was inconclusive if
you had chicken pox as a child. I was told this by my
college doctor. Is this not the case?
Arlyn Grant
>A question - I thought a blood test was inconclusive if
>you had chicken pox as a child. I was told this by my
>college doctor. Is this not the case?
Many doctors believe this to be true. We have no idea why. The virus
that causes chicken pox is a herpes virus. The blood tests are for
simplex only and do not test for zoster.
The Western Blot is a highly accurate blood test and having had the
chicken pox makes no difference.
ar
GUYonphone
(Arlyn Grant) writes:
>>A question - I thought a blood test was inconclusive if
>>you had chicken pox as a child. I was told this by my
>>college doctor. Is this not the case?
>
>Many doctors believe this to be true. We have no idea why. The virus
>that causes chicken pox is a herpes virus. The blood tests are for
>simplex only and do not test for zoster.
>
>The Western Blot is a highly accurate blood test and having had the
>chicken pox makes no difference.
>
My *theory* on how this happens is that someone walks into a docs office and
requests a herpes blood test. Maybe their partner has herpes, or someone they
know has it and they want to make sure they don't have it. The doc gives one of
the blood tests to the patient. 2 weeks later it comes back positive for HSV1
antibody. The patient says "well, I've NEVER had symptoms of herpes" so the doc
reverts to what he heard at some point...that the blood tests can confuse
antibody to chicken pox, which WE ALL HAVE HAD of course (plus, it's much more
*acceptable* to have had chicken pox too). Bingo... an answer to the mystery,
and the patient can go home and continue on without being disturbed. It's
'easy'.
Many docs still currently think there is NO reason to diagnose someone with
HSV. Many, MANY docs! They think..."there's no way to 'cure' someone, there's
little reason for someone to have to know about it if they aren't having
symptoms, and all it does is create havoc within their lives to find out". And
who knows...through their ignorance of the facts, some docs may even *believe*
that the blood tests confuse antibody for chicken pox with antibody for one of
the HSVs. Research into that, though, will indicate that's an inaccurate idea.
Hang in there
-G
Arlyn Grant
>antibody to chicken pox, which WE ALL HAVE HAD of course (plus, it's much more
>*acceptable* to have had chicken pox too).
I haven't. :-)
ar
M2sl...@hotmail.com
>>antibody to chicken pox, which WE ALL HAVE HAD of course (plus, it's much more
>>*acceptable* to have had chicken pox too).
Arlyn wrote:
>I haven't. :-)
Me neither :-(
M2
M.L.S.
>Me neither :-(
And I had it soooo lightly that everybody wondered whether I might not
be able to catch it again!?!? But I think in light of what I know now
about viruses and antibodies and whatnot, that since I had it I had it
and I won't get it again unless it's shingles. Yawn.
So, did everybody have a nice weekend? I just mixed three
wheelbarrows full of cement and boy does my asphalt.
:-D
Mike
Arlyn Grant
>So, did everybody have a nice weekend? I just mixed three
>wheelbarrows full of cement and boy does my asphalt.
>
> :-D
>
>Mike
>
What are you faulting your ass for???
I'm still trying to decide if I want to spend the money on a new
refrigerator....
ar
M.L.S.
posted:
>On Sun, 22 Jul 2001 18:48:39 -0400, M.L.S. <mso...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>>So, did everybody have a nice weekend? I just mixed three
>>wheelbarrows full of cement and boy does my asphalt.
>What are you faulting your ass for???
It's somebody's fault. And it's usually my ass that's blamed for it.
Just thought I'd skip the runaround. <weak grin>
>I'm still trying to decide if I want to spend the money on a new
>refrigerator....
Yes, do. Get the fridge. Get the fridge.
Remember those seals I saw in the ocean? This story takes place in
*exactly* that spot (yikes):
http://www2.bostonherald.com/news/local_regional/shar07232001.htm
(Ooops, is this off topic for this newsgroup?)
Mike
Arlyn Grant
That story sounds a bit....well...made up. :-) Sharks don't normally
act that way. But I'm no shark master. :-)
ar
Sati
Sorry to burst your bubble, but I had chicken pox "lightly" when I was 3 or
4 years old, then I caught it majorly when I was in my early 30's (from my
kids). So, watch out around little kids - you CAN still get chicken pox!
(and if you ever do, let me know, I have a homeopathic remedy that will kick
it in the "asphalt"!!).
Nice to cross paths again...
Sati
PS: Come to think of it, it's my ass'phalt that I caught chicken pox twice!
(by having more kids!)
"M.L.S." <mso...@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:ogkmlt8sqr060sdml...@4ax.com...
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.265 / Virus Database: 137 - Release Date: 7/18/2001
M.L.S.
posted:
>Hi Mike!
>Sorry to burst your bubble, but I had chicken pox "lightly" when I was 3 or
>4 years old, then I caught it majorly when I was in my early 30's (from my
>kids). So, watch out around little kids - you CAN still get chicken pox!
>(and if you ever do, let me know, I have a homeopathic remedy that will kick
>it in the "asphalt"!!).
>Nice to cross paths again...
Oh! We got the same thing?!? Kiss me???
XOXO
Mike
Arlyn Grant
children. I wonder how that happens?
ar
On Wed, 25 Jul 2001 20:02:30 -0700, "Sati" <xs10...@pacbell.net>
wrote:
Tim Fitzmaurice
> I've heard of this happening to people who had a mild case when
> children. I wonder how that happens?
Its fairly rare, and not always just if you have a mild case. It means
that you didnt setup a good memory reponse in the system and the virus
gets in. The argument blows up a little over precision. It perfectly
reasonable to say once you have had chickenpox you wont get it again since
thats the basic way things work and for that not to happen then what it
means is something went wrong somewhere, but it is not as Sati pointed
100% correct as some people get it more than once...its a bit like saying
that a parachute allows you to jump out of a plane, the statement is
OK and a reasonble thing to say, but not 100% precise until you qualify it
with '..assuming it opens correctly'.
All down to how much precision was needed involved in the case in point
really. (if someone is asking generalities of chickenpox its fine, if
someone is asking how did I get chickenpox as an adult I had it as a kid,
its not...bits in between well, we're all thinking adults, I'll let people
draw their own lines in the grey bits.)
Tim
When playing rugby, its not the winning that counts, but the taking apart
ICQ: 5178568
Arlyn Grant
ar
Sati
>
> Oh! We got the same thing?!? Kiss me???
>
> XOXO
>
> Mike
Sure Mikie! (Don't tell anyone tho, ok?)
Ok, ready? Here comes a big juicy one.....mmmmmmmmmmmmSMACK!!!!
(How does one make a "kiss" icon? You can tell i don't frequent any online
'sex' groups! lol...)
Hugs & mo' kisses, and then some!
(mmmmmmMMMM!! Good stuff!)
luv ya,
~sat
Sati
Did you buy the new fridge? Mike's right, you deserve it - go for it!
I'll bet you're right about Mike's "ass" too....I'll bet he's got a real
FINE one! ;^)
Luv,
Sati
PS: Can you tell I'm feeling better today?
"Arlyn Grant" <arl...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3b5c1b46...@news.mindspring.com...
Sati
"parachute jumping"!!!!
Thanks for the warning!
xoxo,
Sati
"Tim Fitzmaurice" <tj...@cus.cam.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:Pine.SOL.3.96.10107...@virgo.cus.cam.ac.uk...
GUYonphone
<xs10...@pacbell.net> writes:
>Sure Mikie! (Don't tell anyone tho, ok?)
>Ok, ready? Here comes a big juicy one.....mmmmmmmmmmmmSMACK!!!!
>(How does one make a "kiss" icon? You can tell i don't frequent any online
>'sex' groups! lol...)
>Hugs & mo' kisses, and then some!
>(mmmmmmMMMM!! Good stuff!)
>luv ya,
Well, as they used to say on the aol chat boards (knowledge from over 4 years
ago when I met my Lady in a chat room...)... Sheezzz, would you 2 get a
room?? ::grin::
Hang in there
-G
Sati
several thousand miles apart is only one of the problems....)
Wow, you really met your lady online in a chat room! I'm impressed. You're
a brave man, (but she's a braver woman). Just kidding, you always sounded
like a nice guy to me too (even if we don't agree on 'most' things!).
;^)
Sati
"GUYonphone" <guyon...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010727170337...@nso-cr.aol.com...
GUYonphone
<xs10...@pacbell.net> writes:
>Wow, you really met your lady online in a chat room! I'm impressed. You're
>a brave man, (but she's a braver woman). Just kidding, you always sounded
>like a nice guy to me too (even if we don't agree on 'most' things!).
>;^)
We were BOTH brave. But not to be stupid, the first time we met in person was
at a public restaurant for a mid-morning coffee break about equal distance
between our 2 cities. You know...coffee so's it wouldn't be too much of an
inconvenience for either if things didn't go well. And the public
place...well, that was mostly for my benefit of course... a guy's gotta always
be careful--wouldn't want a new gal to get the wrong idea and think she could
get fisky on the first date! ::grin:: I had told her that if we liked each
other in person, then we could maybe find a park and swing on the swings for a
while (I spare no expense on first dates, as you can see :-). Within about 20
or 30 minutes we had already found out from the waitress where the closest park
was and we ended up spending the entire day there together.
And my feet have not touched the ground since.
Hang in there
-G
Arlyn Grant
>We were BOTH brave. But not to be stupid, the first time we met in person was
>at a public restaurant for a mid-morning coffee break about equal distance
>between our 2 cities. You know...coffee so's it wouldn't be too much of an
>inconvenience for either if things didn't go well. And the public
>place...well, that was mostly for my benefit of course... a guy's gotta always
>be careful--wouldn't want a new gal to get the wrong idea and think she could
>get fisky on the first date! ::grin:: I had told her that if we liked each
>other in person, then we could maybe find a park and swing on the swings for a
>while (I spare no expense on first dates, as you can see :-). Within about 20
>or 30 minutes we had already found out from the waitress where the closest park
>was and we ended up spending the entire day there together.
>
>And my feet have not touched the ground since.
>
>Hang in there
>-G
This is sooooooo romantic!!!!!!!
ar
Arlyn Grant
:-)
I would like to see Mike's ASSets. We should all exchange pictures
one day. But AFTER I lose the additional 45 pounds I still have to
dump.
No - I did not buy my new fridge. Though I am pining away for it.
But, for some STUPID reason I figured I had better have a JOB first
before I start spending money..... *sigh* the summers are soooo long
when you freelance in entertainment.....
ar
On Fri, 27 Jul 2001 12:41:10 -0700, "Sati" <xs10...@pacbell.net>
wrote:
Sati
> or 30 minutes we had already found out from the waitress where the closest
park
> was and we ended up spending the entire day there together.
>
> And my feet have not touched the ground since.
>
> Hang in there
> -G
>
(and halos??)....and never need to 'touch down' again!
Way to go, you two!
~Sati
M.L.S.
Wow. That must really save on shoe leather!!
You Guys and your Dolls are sooo sweet.
Mike
M.L.S.
posted:
>Sati! My day is always brighter when I've seen a few posts from you.
>:-)
>I would like to see Mike's ASSets. We should all exchange pictures
>one day. But AFTER I lose the additional 45 pounds I still have to
>dump.
Ladies, ladies. Puhleeeze. I have a white pillowy ass and ...
Well, I'm almost tempted to take a pic and show you something really
funny. I ordered my first ever wet suit and it came into today, and I
just tried it on. The choice was between a large and a medium and
since I've been trying to lose weight all year (after giving up
ciggies last year) and thinking "I must lose weight" I ordered the
medium. It's a tight fit, ladies. A very tight fit. But it's so
BLACK that I can't tell how funny I really must look. Hee hee.
When I lose ten more pounds I'll take pix of me in my shortie wet suit
and put 'em on a web page. k?
>No - I did not buy my new fridge. Though I am pining away for it.
>But, for some STUPID reason I figured I had better have a JOB first
>before I start spending money..... *sigh* the summers are soooo long
>when you freelance in entertainment.....
I need a new fridge, too, but for some reason it's not tormenting me.
You know you'll find work, Ar. Just go for it.
Mike
Arlyn Grant
I think posting pictures of ourselves after we lose our weight is a
great insentive. ??? Well, maybe not. :-)
Naw. There's no work here in the Summertime. Too hot to shoot
anything. It's like this every summer. I thought of check-out girl
at the local supermarket but I can't stand up that long....
ar
M.L.S.
posted:
>Hi Mike,
>I think posting pictures of ourselves after we lose our weight is a
>great incentive. ??? Well, maybe not. :-)
Is Bart's Picture Page still around? The ciggy quitters have a nice
set of picture pages (I forgot to shave for mine, dang.) Maybe we
should have a picture page, too, with little black rectangles over our
eyes . . . heh heh just kidding.
>Naw. There's no work here in the Summertime. Too hot to shoot
>anything. It's like this every summer. I thought of check-out girl
>at the local supermarket but I can't stand up that long....
They could give you a chair. Though it sounds like you're more
management material than check out girl to me. ;-)
Mike
Arlyn Grant
>
>They could give you a chair. Though it sounds like you're more
>management material than check out girl to me. ;-)
>
>Mike
That has been the problem I've faced this summer. Over qualified for
some jobs. Under qualified for others......And no one offered me a
chair!
ar
Sati
"Arlyn Grant" <arl...@mindspring.com> wrote:
> Sati! My day is always brighter when I've seen a few posts from you.
> :-)
>
Oh, Ar! what a sweeeeeeeeet thing to say. 'YOU' are the day brightener!
> I would like to see Mike's ASSets. We should all exchange pictures
> one day. But AFTER I lose the additional 45 pounds I still have to
> dump.
>
(hee hee!) Wouldn't it be fun to meet up some day? Hopefully someday when
MY assets
are in better shape too!
> No - I did not buy my new fridge. Though I am pining away for it.
> But, for some STUPID reason I figured I had better have a JOB first
> before I start spending money..... *sigh* the summers are soooo long
> when you freelance in entertainment.....
>
> ar
"Freelance in entertainment", you make it sound SO romantic, though, Ar!
Something I always wish'd I'd stuck to that too (play guitar, sing, etc.).
Well, here's hoping a high-paying, 'easy' job, comes your way soon, (so your
food doesn't spoil!).
lol,
Sati
Arlyn Grant
wrote:
>"Freelance in entertainment", you make it sound SO romantic, though, Ar!
>Something I always wish'd I'd stuck to that too (play guitar, sing, etc.).
>Well, here's hoping a high-paying, 'easy' job, comes your way soon, (so your
>food doesn't spoil!).
>lol,
>Sati
Ah, yes. The romance of working in entertainment. My friends and I
laugh about that one all the time. People think our jobs are so
glamorous. I can't tell you how many times I was covered in sweat and
mud, starving because I couldn't get a lunch break, being yelled at by
an idiot director, etc, to only remember that THIS is glamor. :-)
Now, a high paying EASY job is definitely the way to go. Where do I
get one of those???
Take care,
ar
Jonathan Price
> PS: Come to think of it, it's my ass'phalt that I caught chicken pox twice!
> (by having more kids!)
Must have a *very* fecund ass, Sati. Your call for pictures didn't inspire me at
first, but now it *is* sounding like a good idea ;-).
- Jonathan
Sati
> Ladies, ladies. Puhleeeze. I have a white pillowy ass and ...
I'll bet it's MUCH cuter than a plumped pillow!! ;^)
>
> Well, I'm almost tempted to take a pic and show you something really
> funny. I ordered my first ever wet suit and it came into today, and I
> just tried it on. The choice was between a large and a medium and
> since I've been trying to lose weight all year (after giving up
> ciggies last year) and thinking "I must lose weight" I ordered the
> medium. It's a tight fit, ladies. A very tight fit. But it's so
> BLACK that I can't tell how funny I really must look. Hee hee.
>
That's one of the nice things about 'black', huh? Sorta....
Good for you for quitting smoking!! I'd rather have a guy whose a tad
overweight or outta shape than one whose a smoker ANYTIME!
> When I lose ten more pounds I'll take pix of me in my shortie wet suit
> and put 'em on a web page. k?
OOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooo (as in 'you')!!! Sounds good to me! When *I* lose
another 10 lbs I'll take a current photo of me too. I've almost lost all
the weight I need to lose, but now comes the hard part - getting back in
shape!! UGH!
> I need a new fridge, too, but for some reason it's not tormenting me.
> You know you'll find work, Ar. Just go for it.
>
> Mike
>
I don't need a fridge, I need a house!! (Yeah, right, who's got a cool 1/2
mil to loan me to buy a two-bedroom house in the ghetto in California?) No
kidding :( tch, tch, oh well! poor me!
heehee...
luv ya!
Sati
Sati
> Hi Mike,
>
> I think posting pictures of ourselves after we lose our weight is a
> great insentive. ??? Well, maybe not. :-)
>
It'll do! It'll do! (Everything helps when one is trying to get back into
shape, right?)
> Naw. There's no work here in the Summertime. Too hot to shoot
> anything. It's like this every summer. I thought of check-out girl
> at the local supermarket but I can't stand up that long....
>
> ar
That's been my problem too for awhile (sciatica); but since I've been
working out on my 'Health Ryder' I've "toned up" and have lost about 30 lbs.
Also, I just this week found a homeopathic remedy that is LITERALLY "kicking
my (sore) BEhind" (gently). The pain in my leg is disappearing, and so are
the herpetic outbreaks and fever/sweats! YAY HOMEOPATHY!! I'll keep y'all
informed as to this remedy's effect on the Herp!
BTW: the name of the Homeopathic remedy I'm using is China (cinchona
officinalis). It's for treating chronic fever, which is one thing that I've
had w/the herpes. The fever caused generalized swelling which caused the
'sciatica'!! Amazing how the body responds to these teeny little remedies!!
Well...as far as an "easy", high-paying job, Real Estate wasn't really all
that much "work". It's more about "socializing" than anything. I'll bet
you'd make a great Real Estate agent, Ar! I think I was just about your age
when I became one (not sure how old you are tho, but i think you're younger
than me). I did that for just a little while before my auto accident which
has had me incapacitated ever since (9 years ago!); but I wasn't in it long
enough to make any 'good' money. It WAS fun, though. Think about it!
Love,
Sati
Sati
>
>snip
>
> They could give you a chair. Though it sounds like you're more
> management material than check out girl to me. ;-)
>
> Mike
Don't you think Arlyn would make a GREAT real estate agent? I do!! (I know
cause I was one for awhile).
Sati
Arlyn Grant
ar
On Wed, 1 Aug 2001 14:21:07 -0700, "Sati" <xs10...@pacbell.net>
wrote:
Arlyn Grant
wrote:
>BTW: the name of the Homeopathic remedy I'm using is China (cinchona
>officinalis). It's for treating chronic fever, which is one thing that I've
>had w/the herpes. The fever caused generalized swelling which caused the
>'sciatica'!! Amazing how the body responds to these teeny little remedies!!
Great news, Sati. I hope you are feeling 100% real soon.
>
>Well...as far as an "easy", high-paying job, Real Estate wasn't really all
>that much "work". It's more about "socializing" than anything. I'll bet
>you'd make a great Real Estate agent, Ar! I think I was just about your age
>when I became one (not sure how old you are tho, but i think you're younger
>than me). I did that for just a little while before my auto accident which
>has had me incapacitated ever since (9 years ago!); but I wasn't in it long
>enough to make any 'good' money. It WAS fun, though. Think about it!
>Love,
>Sati
I'm 36 yesterday. :-) I really like looking at houses. But, would I
have to dress nice? :-)
ar
Sati
You're right about that, re:"fecund"!!! I had to look that one up in the
dictionary, but it fits perfectly! (5 kids later...{sigh}) Yes, I'm glad I
had 'em, but DAMN I'm TIRED!!!
After 15 years of breastfeeding (straight), who wouldn't be? (and my breasts
could still win beauty contests - even if i do say so myself). Guess i was
'born' to be a mom!
I'm also glad you liked my idea about taking 'photos' of ourselves after we
reach our respective "goals". Maybe next spring??? (Spring of '02?)
Count me 'in', unless you hear differently...{{chuckles}}
~Sati
"Jonathan Price" <pjona...@qwest.net> wrote in message
news:3B66FA1D...@qwest.net...
Sati
Yeah, that's right, you need to take a 'course'. I forget how long it
took...maybe 3 months total?, maybe less. They probably have crash courses
now that can get you through faster (what with the internet and all). The
web was just starting to happen when I began doing the Real Estate school
thing.
And, yes, you SHOULD dress nice when on "floor" and such. But, I'll bet
there's alot less "in person" time now (due to the net). It's fun! You
should do it; I know you'd be great at it!
Thanks for the well wishes, I'm getting stronger every day! I wish you
great success with your dieting and exercise regimen. How's the juicing
coming along? Guess what? I found my juicer and have been doing arugula
and carrot juice lately. I add my arugula juice to a short glass of V8 (and
a short 'snort' of vodka once in a while too!) ;^)
Njoy life, Ar! You're just a wee babe....
Love ya bunches,
Sati
"Arlyn Grant" <arl...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3b6b80e9...@news.mindspring.com...
Sati
"Sati" wrote
>(and my breasts
> could still win beauty contests - even if i do say so myself). Guess i
was
> 'born' to be a mom!
What? ME, vain? ;^)
lol,
Sati
my very humble website:
http://www.amasati.com
All these pictures were taken years after I had my last kid (#5).
(if anybody wants to donate website development time and energy, I can SURE
use it! And I did say DONATE...thanks. Think about it....you'd be reaping
tons of good karma....)
>snip
GUYonphone
<xs10...@pacbell.net> writes:
<snip>
>(and my breasts
>could still win beauty contests - even if i do say so myself)...
<snip>
Well, now... that's no fair. "Beauty contests" aren't judged by the
participants. They have impartial judges to decide who wins. I think, if
you're so sure, you should submit pics of them and let the people here decide
if they're winners or not! ::grin::
<then later said>
>I'm also glad you liked my idea about taking 'photos' of ourselves after we
>reach our respective "goals". Maybe next spring??? (Spring of '02?)
>
>Count me 'in', unless you hear differently...{{chuckles}}
Sounds like YOUR pics should be from the waist up! ::wicked evil grin::
Hang in there
-G
Arlyn Grant
:-) I even got your hair color correct in my mind.
ar
On Fri, 3 Aug 2001 12:13:26 -0700, "Sati" <xs10...@pacbell.net>
wrote:
Arlyn Grant
daft????? :-) Honestly, though, I will definitely consider this.
The juicing is going great. I don't juice as much as I should,
though. Perhaps if I try the vodka trick I will be more motivated? I
don't think I'm ready to juice arugula. But I do try to remember to
add my favorite lettuce (red leaf) to my carrot juices.
Take care,
ar
On Fri, 3 Aug 2001 12:09:23 -0700, "Sati" <xs10...@pacbell.net>
wrote:
Sati
Does this mean that I sound like a 'blonde'? Lol ;^)...
My hair color changes according to how much sun I get. It's darker now,
cause i've been too sick to get much sun :(. Oh well...there's always the
'beauty' parlor!
Can't wait to see a pic of you too!
~S.
"Arlyn Grant" <arl...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3b6d1cf4...@news.mindspring.com...
Sati
(i think).
:)
~Sati
"GUYonphone" wrote:
> Well, now... that's no fair. "Beauty contests" aren't judged by the
> participants. They have impartial judges to decide who wins. I think, if
> you're so sure, you should submit pics of them and let the people here
decide
> if they're winners or not! ::grin::
>
> <then later said>
> >I'm also glad you liked my idea about taking 'photos' of ourselves after
we
> >reach our respective "goals". Maybe next spring??? (Spring of '02?)
> >
> >Count me 'in', unless you hear differently...{{chuckles}}
>
> Sounds like YOUR pics should be from the waist up! ::wicked evil grin::
>
> Hang in there
> -G
>
Arlyn Grant
really like. It was taken right before the thyroid disaster so I was
skinnier. And my hair hadn't gone the way of the dodo because of
thyroid - so it was long. (I had to cut it all off). And I still had
my glasses....so, I don't think it looks like me anymore. :( I think
I may have a few scanned of me that I can send you. But I don't think
I have any decent pictures post thyroid and hair cut. I'm usually the
one BEHIND the camera taking the pictures....
ar
On Fri, 3 Aug 2001 15:08:36 -0700, "Sati" <xs10...@pacbell.net>
wrote:
>Thanks, Ar. :)
Melissa Gail
You can place orders via https://drolorimiraclemedicine.weebly.com/