Am I a complete asshole?

Werebat

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Jun 26, 2001, 2:38:57 PM6/26/01

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Some of you remember me from my posts under various names over the past
year or so... I won't get into my story too much because I think it is
too long and convoluted (or maybe I just think too much).

I'm just in a funny mood right now and I'm wondering -- am I a complete
ass? I mean I know I did some things that I would have done differently
if I could go back in time, heck, most notably I probably would not have
gotten married in the first place... Certainly I wish I had not
had an affair, but my alternative choice always seems like it
should have been "leaving before it got to that point" rather than
"working it out" (which I think I TRIED, for three years, but it just
kept getting WORSE).

But...

I don't know. Sometimes it's like I wonder if I should just be alone for
the rest of my life. I mean, it isn't really so bad. I see women I am
attracted to, sure, but unfortunately my sphere of operations has always
been more successful when I played the "future hubby" than the "playa".
I guess I feel doomed to choose between husband and being alone... And
I'm not even sure anymore if either of those is "doomed". Or is it?

Well, whatever. I'm just feeling a bit guilty and screwed up.

Not that I think staying with my wife would have been "the answer". I
seriously doubt that. I just wonder if I made... An acceptable
choice... An OK choice... Would I be worth being with? Or was I so
selfish in saying that I could not spend my life with a chronic severe
depressive, than I'm just never going to be worth anyone's time to get to
know and invest their future in?

Just thinking again. I think I'll read to my son.

- Ron ^*^

JWB

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Jun 26, 2001, 3:07:56 PM6/26/01

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if you meet the right girl, the whole attitude will change. Don't think of
yourself as "future husband material" in a general sense.Think of that
aspect if, and only if, you meet someone you want to be a husband TO.

And no, you're not an asshole ;)
--
JWB

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"Werebat" <ronpo...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:3B38FF...@earthlink.net...

Karen Ronan

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Jun 26, 2001, 3:37:56 PM6/26/01

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Werebat <ronpo...@earthlink.net> writes:

> Some of you remember me from my posts under various names over the past
> year or so... I won't get into my story too much because I think it is
> too long and convoluted (or maybe I just think too much).
>
> I'm just in a funny mood right now and I'm wondering -- am I a complete
> ass? I mean I know I did some things that I would have done differently
> if I could go back in time, heck, most notably I probably would not have
> gotten married in the first place... Certainly I wish I had not
> had an affair, but my alternative choice always seems like it
> should have been "leaving before it got to that point" rather than
> "working it out" (which I think I TRIED, for three years, but it just
> kept getting WORSE).

It sounds like you feel sorry for yourself.
People make mistakes, and you made some.
Welcome to the human race.
All you can do is learn from your mistakes and do
better in the future.

> I don't know. Sometimes it's like I wonder if I should just be alone for
> the rest of my life.

(time to get out the violins)

> I guess I feel doomed to choose between husband and being alone... And
> I'm not even sure anymore if either of those is "doomed". Or is it?

You're doomed to make the same mistakes until you
decide to use other options.

> Not that I think staying with my wife would have been "the answer". I
> seriously doubt that. I just wonder if I made... An acceptable
> choice... An OK choice... Would I be worth being with? Or was I so
> selfish in saying that I could not spend my life with a chronic severe
> depressive, than I'm just never going to be worth anyone's time to get to
> know and invest their future in?

Where did you learn that martyrdom is the way to live?
If you can answer that (and you can), then you know
what to look at: your tendency to go toward martyrdom
and how to minimize it.

Karen

Forrest Tanaka

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Jun 26, 2001, 4:36:21 PM6/26/01

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[edited down the newsgroups]

I sometimes think this too. I mean, I sometimes think *I'm* an asshole,
not you! But really, I know I can fix myself by being aware of my
problems and putting together and updating and modifying plans to fix
them. I'm sure you can fix whatever you don't like about yourself as
well.

I also for a time felt maybe I shouldn't ever be in a relationship
again. For me, the sight of a woman threw *that* thought out of my mind!

I compromised with myself, by planning on *not* being in a relationship
for a while until I know I can be part of a healthy relationship. That
means testing myself against my ex as well as other people. I try to
learn something about myself from every interaction.

Maybe you are selfish for not wanting to spend life with a chronic
severe depressive. But I'd venture not many of us could. There's
someone out there who can, and there are many out there who you would
cherish, I'm sure.

Ellie

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Jun 26, 2001, 5:44:02 PM6/26/01

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Werebat wrote:

> I'm just in a funny mood right now and I'm wondering -- am I a complete
> ass? I mean I know I did some things that I would have done differently
> if I could go back in time, heck, most notably I probably would not have
> gotten married in the first place... Certainly I wish I had not
> had an affair, but my alternative choice always seems like it
> should have been "leaving before it got to that point" rather than
> "working it out" (which I think I TRIED, for three years, but it just
> kept getting WORSE).

So you have made some mistakes. So far nothing unusual, mistakes are rather
common among humans. But...

> I don't know. Sometimes it's like I wonder if I should just be alone for
> the rest of my life. I mean, it isn't really so bad. I see women I am
> attracted to, sure, but unfortunately my sphere of operations has always
> been more successful when I played the "future hubby" than the "playa".
> I guess I feel doomed to choose between husband and being alone... And
> I'm not even sure anymore if either of those is "doomed". Or is it?

I think you expected to be able to recover from your mistakes in no time and
find the "right" woman right away. Things haven't happened exactly as you had
hoped, and now you are doubting your past decisions. I don't know what time
frame you are talking about (when did you have your affair and when did you
divorce), but it is very likely that you need more time to just "be", and not
feel the pressure of "I have to find the woman of my dream and the happiness
that I want now, or I am doomed". Allow yourself some down time. It's OK to
be alone for a while, but not if you feel sorry for yourself.

> Well, whatever. I'm just feeling a bit guilty and screwed up.

> Not that I think staying with my wife would have been "the answer". I
> seriously doubt that. I just wonder if I made... An acceptable
> choice... An OK choice... Would I be worth being with? Or was I so
> selfish in saying that I could not spend my life with a chronic severe
> depressive, than I'm just never going to be worth anyone's time to get to
> know and invest their future in?

You feel guilty because you are wondering if you made the right choice for
YOU, not because you think you hurt someone else. Living with a chronically
ill person is not easy, and I think you know that. If things had turned out
differently and right now you had the woman of your dream, you wouldn't feel
guilty for being selfish or leaving your wife (nor should you. No one can
tell you you had to martyr yourself). But it is important that you recognize
the distinction between feeling sorry for yourself and feeling guilt over
doing something wrong to another person. You can recover much better if you
know which one it is you are feeling -- and my guess is the former.

Nothing like a little time, without the pressure of grand expectations, will
make you whole and ready for the ride again! Good luck.

glosette

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Jun 26, 2001, 5:46:35 PM6/26/01

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Werebat wrote in message <3B38FF...@earthlink.net>...

Ron,

You are certainly not alone in these thoughts. I have and still every once
in a while feel this way about myself also. When I truly think back of what
it was like and ask myself what I could have done different? I still can't
think of the perfect solution. I don't know if there is a way to avoid
these feelings, I think they are just part of the process. Now I know that
doesn't make the feeling a whole lot better, but from what you have wrote
here and how you contemplate it all, means that you are not a complete
asshole....so give yourself the break, and think of all your positive
attributes and abilities to make life a good one.

Glos

Werebat

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Jun 26, 2001, 6:38:53 PM6/26/01

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Ellie wrote:

(Snip)

> Nothing like a little time, without the pressure of grand expectations, will
> make you whole and ready for the ride again! Good luck.

You know, when I separated, I gave myself ten years to find the right
person, before I'd worry about it. I've got nine left. So, you're
right. There isn't any rush.

BTW, the "other woman" was named Elle.

- Ron ^*^

Mary Lou

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Jun 26, 2001, 8:03:56 PM6/26/01

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In article <3B3937...@earthlink.net>, Werebat <ronpo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

>You know, when I separated, I gave myself ten years to find the right
>person, before I'd worry about it. I've got nine left. So, you're
>right. There isn't any rush.

I really think we don't "find" the "right person" when we're looking for them.
It's like having a mold ready to stick someone into.

I think it's more like when we're not even thinking about whether or not we'll
ever remarry or be alone or whatever, and someone comes into our life (or
someone already there becomes apparent to us) we feel that we want to be with
that person, for who that person is, and not what mold they can fill. (talk
about run-on sentences!)...

I hope that made some sense... Fill your life with friends... One may turn
out to be "the one", and if not, you'll still have lots of friends. Don't
settle for someone that you really don't connect with (i wish i could explain
what i mean by "connect" - it's an emotional/spiritual-type thing that doesn't
happen often between just any two people).

Message has been deleted

Werebat

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Jun 26, 2001, 9:24:42 PM6/26/01

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Ellie wrote:

>
> Werebat wrote:
>
> > BTW, the "other woman" was named Elle.
>

> And what happened to you and her? Didn't work out?

I'm still not really sure, really. I called her a few months ago, in
December, and she said she would rather leave things as they were,
because she didn't want to deal with people looking at her and thinking
she broke up a home.

Personally I think she may have been just looking for a "fling",
something extramarital on my part, and didn't expect it to blow up in her
face with me actually wanting to leave my wife. I still don't really
know. For a time it looked like it would be cool with her if we met
privately for sex and no one knew -- she seemed to balk when I moved in
with a mutual friend, who would have known about it. Go fig.

In any event, at the time, I wasn't really LOOKING for just sex... I
really wanted to be with her... But that rejection set things straight
for me pretty quickly. It's a shame we can't even be friends, IMO -- we
were friends for years before the affair, and unlike my wife, most of my
friends liked her -- but there you go.

Oh well, I'm over it.

- Ron ^*^

Werebat

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Jun 26, 2001, 9:26:38 PM6/26/01

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Igor9591 wrote:
>
> If you are worried whether you were an ass, then you probably were.
>
> Enjoy being single... It is not so bad.

As I told my good friend this evening, after listening to him complain
about not having a girlfriend in sight...

There are worse things than being single, like wishing you were.

- Ron ^*^

Scott Barnhill

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Jun 26, 2001, 9:47:09 PM6/26/01

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For the affair, yes.... you are an asshole. You should have divorced first.
For the other stuff, time will change things and someone will come along
when you least expect it. However, if you start to feel antsy with a second
wife, divorce first or you'll be a double asshole.

Werebat

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Jun 26, 2001, 11:27:25 PM6/26/01

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Scott, I think I agree with you on all counts.

- Ron ^*^

Werebat

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Jun 27, 2001, 9:43:17 AM6/27/01

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Igor9591 wrote:
>
> Werebat <ronpo...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> * Igor9591 wrote:
> * >
> * > If you are worried whether you were an ass, then you probably were.
> * >
> * > Enjoy being single... It is not so bad.
> *
> * As I told my good friend this evening, after listening to him complain
> * about not having a girlfriend in sight...
> *
> * There are worse things than being single, like wishing you were.
>
> Yep. The worst thing of all is to wish that you were single, becoming
> single, and then wishing you did not become single... Married life can be
> pretty nice, and so can be single life -- you can enjoy both.

Surely, then, the best thing in life would be to have no aspirations at
all?

- Ron ^*^

Werebat

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Jun 27, 2001, 10:09:56 AM6/27/01

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Igor28016 wrote:
>
> Werebat <ronpo...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> * Igor9591 wrote:
> * >

> * > Werebat <ronpo...@earthlink.net> wrote:

> * > * Igor9591 wrote:
> * > * >
> * > * > If you are worried whether you were an ass, then you probably were.
> * > * >
> * > * > Enjoy being single... It is not so bad.
> * > *
> * > * As I told my good friend this evening, after listening to him complain

> * > * about not having a girlfriend in sight...

> * > *
> * > * There are worse things than being single, like wishing you were.

> * >
> * > Yep. The worst thing of all is to wish that you were single, becoming
> * > single, and then wishing you did not become single... Married life can be
> * > pretty nice, and so can be single life -- you can enjoy both.
> *
> * Surely, then, the best thing in life would be to have no aspirations at
> * all?
>
> That is not bad until you get closer to death... At which point you might
> regret it.
>
> I think that the best thing is to have fulfillable aspirations.
>
> igor

I have often thought that the happiest people are the ones who are
content with what they have, but still have an eye towards bettering
themselves and their situations, and the means to do so.

- Ron ^*^

Kathryn Litherland

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Jun 27, 2001, 10:28:33 AM6/27/01

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That's what the Buddha said...not sure if I agree or disagree, though.

-----
Dr. Kathryn Litherland, Managing Editor
Journal of Latin American Anthropology

"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, concerned citizens can
change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has."
--Margaret Mead
http://www.students.uiuc.edu/~lither

wolf...@yourmamma.net

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Jun 28, 2001, 3:24:01 AM6/28/01

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On Tue, 26 Jun 2001 18:38:57 GMT, Werebat <ronpo...@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>I'm just in a funny mood right now and I'm wondering -- am I a complete
>ass? I mean I know I did some things that I would have done differently

I'd say not a complete ass

>Just thinking again. I think I'll read to my son.

And this is why.

Philosophers and plowmen,each must know his part
To sow a new mentality, closer to the Heart.
---------------------------------------------------------------
BOYCOTT CHINESE GOODS!

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tilt

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Jun 28, 2001, 8:52:57 AM6/28/01