Re: A Deadly Fairy Tale: The Pharmaceutical Industrial Compl
noauth
> In the end, we all have responsibility for our own health.
Absolutely!
> Talking about the industry having a "hidden agenda" isn't
> exactly helpful in that regard. We depend on the industry
> for our medicines. We depend on the doctors and other
> qualified professionals to tell us how to use them - not
> cranks with some health food to sell.
There are plenty of anti-industry cranks who post here.
You know who they are.
> There are plenty of cranks with books to sell as well.
> The MentalMeds book at http://www.MentalMeds.org is in
> a different category - it is a statement of facts with
> no quackish "treatment" to sell.
It's written by someone with no medical training.
Buyer beware.
> There are some good CMI sites with a similar purpose.
> Treatment should be a team effort between yourself and
> a qualified health professional.
Agreed, but ultimately, the responsibility for health
rests with the patient.
> My problem is that my wife is a pharmacist, so my pdoc
> and she talk shop and don't even ask my opinion.
Four options:
1) Complain about that to both your wife and your pdoc.
Ask them to include you.
2) Ditch your wife. Find one who isn't a pharmacist.
3) Ditch your pdoc. Find another.
4) Ditch both your wife and your pdoc.
> If it works, I need to be taken off it, apparently.
Taken off what? What are you going to the hospital for?
Electroshock therapy?
> I am hoping that when I finish up in hospital, my
> pdoc will get the message.
What are you going to the hospital for?
Electroshock treatment?
And what message do you expect your pdoc to get from
your hospital stay if you don't tell him what you want?
Get the Vegemite sandwich outta your mouth and tell him
what's on your mind!
Anonymous
Absolutely!
Four options:
1) Complain to both your wife and your pdoc.
Ask them to include you.
2) Ditch your wife. Find one who isn't a pharmacist.
3) Ditch your pdoc. Find another who will listen to you.
4) Ditch both your wife and your pdoc.
> If it works, I need to be taken off it, apparently.
If what works? And taken off what?
> I am hoping that when I finish up in hospital, my
> pdoc will get the message.
What are you going to the hospital for?
Electroshock treatment?
And what message do you expect your pdoc to get from
your hospital stay?
Get the Vegemite sandwich outta your mouth and tell him
what's on your mind, man!
Anonymous
> Soc.support.depression.treatment is the usenet forum
> chartered for yourself and other drug dependent individuals
> to swap info and exchange mutual support wrt your/their
> myriad dependencies arising from their alleged depression.
Is it really chartered that way?
Be honest now.
> Denial isn't a river in Egypt.
Funny!
Keep up the good work!
> Furthermore, misusing symbols, such as, donning a
> white coat, or, donning a stethoscope, or, affixing an
> MD or Phd to one's Nom De Plume....
Hopefully, unqualified folks do that only at Halloween.
> ...when one doesn't possess an MD or Phd, or, affixing
> a Phd to one's Nom De Plume while offering health related
> advice when one doesn't possess a Phd in any health
> related field can and will eventually get oneselves ARSE
> in the slammer for the felony a/k/a practicing medicine
> without a license.
Same can apply to one who doesn't possess an MD or PhD in
a health-related field and *counsels against* seeking
medical treatment for certain known symptoms of illness.
Anonymous
Linda
> Linda <indomitab...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Soc.support.depression.treatment is the usenet forum
> > chartered for yourself and other drug dependent individuals
> > to swap info and exchange mutual support wrt your/their
> > myriad dependencies arising from their alleged depression.
>
> Is it really chartered that way?
> Be honest now.
Substituting a false issue for the actual issue, again?
Whatever John Grohol and other charlatans say and do to herd flawed
individuals into their offices, hospitals, and/or the social support
groups which Grohol et al establish is besides the point, which is,
A) Usenet's SOC heirarchy is the Usenet heirarchy where social support
groups are located, and, B) Soc.support.depression.treatment is the
Usenet forum explicitly chartered for flawed individuals like Doug
Laidlaw to seek information/support regard Laidlaw's myriad
dependencies consequent to the Laidlaw's choices wrt coping with
Laidlaw's alleged depression.
> > Denial isn't a river in Egypt.
>
> Funny!
:-)
> > Furthermore, misusing symbols, such as, donning a
> > white coat, or, donning a stethoscope, or, affixing an
> > MD or Phd to one's Nom De Plume....
>
> Hopefully, unqualified folks do that only at Halloween.
Rarely a week goes by without the lame stream media reporting yet
another story containing the details of the State of California's
arrest of yet another Swindler and his/her devotees for misuse of
symbolism to deceive "marks" into falsely perceiving these health care
Swindlers as health care workers when they're not.
>
> > ...when one doesn't possess an MD or Phd, or, affixing
> > a Phd to one's Nom De Plume while offering health related
> > advice when one doesn't possess a Phd in any health
> > related field can and will eventually get oneselves ARSE
> > in the slammer for the felony a/k/a practicing medicine
> > without a license.
>
> Same can apply to one who doesn't possess an MD or PhD in
> a health-related field and *counsels against* seeking
> medical treatment for certain known symptoms of illness.
How "schizogenic" of you to substitute a false for true construction
of what's being done and what's going on in order to substitute a
false issue for the actual issue of the legal troubles which "Doug
Laidlaw" is courting by unlawfully spamming links advertising a
Swindler's website/books etc.
.
noauth
> Why do the Japanese have total lifetime depression rates
> at 2%, while Western Europe and North America has a
> 15-20% lifetime rate?
> Especially since:
> They are less happy than Americans.
> They work more and are stressed more.
> They live a modern, hectic lifestyle.
> They smoke like crazy.
> Their brains are clearly "protected" from the effects
> of prolonged stress. And this is where we must go back
> to why some brains are more protected from the effects
> of stress than other brains.
> The only discernible difference is that their diets are
> radically anti-depressant and anti-inflammatory in nature.
> Ours are obviously pro-inflammatory in nature.
I agree the Japanese diet provides some sort of protection
to them against depression.
But I also think that depression has probably been dampened
down in their genes by operation of their national culture
over the centuries. They are a large population on a
relatively small land mass, a mountainous island, no less.
Their had to find a way to survive and prosper rather than
stagnate. They placed high valve on things important to
cooperation and the collective. Defeatist attitudes, often
associated with depressive states, were not tolerated.
Can anyone imagine bees in a bee hive getting depressed?
I can't. There's too much of a instinct there for survival
of the colony no matter the sacrifice of the individual bee.
noauth
By Howard W. French
The New York Times
Published: Saturday, August 10, 2002
When Eiko Imai thinks back to the dim and blurry stretch of
years when she silently suffered from depression, she often
wonders how she survived.
"I couldn't do housework, read a newspaper or even watch
television," said the part-time office worker, who is 50.
"On my days off, I would just sit on a stool in the kitchen.
I would often think of throwing myself in front of a train."
Ms. Imai's health took a turn for the better four years ago,
when she finally saw a doctor who diagnosed her depression
and began prescribing medicines.
Even then, the road was far from easy. In a society that
stigmatizes any kind of mental illness, she interrupted her
treatment repeatedly, buffeted by her husband's initial
criticism of her medication, by the shame she felt at work,
and a lacerating guilt over not being able to overcome her
problems on her own.
"I went through so many cycles of taking medicine and
feeling better, and stopping and getting much worse,"
Ms. Imai said. "I just had a terrible image in my mind about
using any kind of psychological drug."
Ms. Imai stands out as something of a pioneer in Japan,
where depression is thought to be widespread, but largely
hidden and undiagnosed.
The contrast with the United States, where family
practitioners readily prescribe antidepressant drugs like
Prozac, is striking.
Japan has more suicides than the United States, yet less
than half the population. Still, the use of drugs in
Prozac's class has only recently begun to spread.
"Thirty thousand people commit suicide in Japan every year,
but if we could diagnose them and treat them in time, that
number would go down dramatically,'' said Tadashi Onda,
a Tokyo psychiatrist, almost half of whose practice
consists of depressed patients. "I've never even heard of
anyone specializing in depression, though. The bigger
problem in Japan is that a stigma attaches to anyone seen
as treating crazy people, and the status of psychiatrists
remains very low."
Selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors, as Prozac's
generation of antidepressants is known, were introduced in
Japan in 1999, more than a decade after Prozac was first
sold in the United States. Generic versions of Prozac are
available now in the United States, but the drug will not
be introduced in Japan until 2004 at the earliest, according
to the manufacturer, Eli Lilly.
Experts say Japan's failure to treat depression has deep
roots in the country's culture, from the oppressive weight
of shame to the organization of the medical profession.
The cost is measured in unnecessary misery and productivity
losses.
"In Japan, we don't have family doctors," said Noritoshi
Shinkai, a specialist in geriatric psychiatry, who said that
70 percent of his patients suffered clinical depression.
"People choose a doctor according to the organ they think
they have a problem with. But no one wants to think they
have a mental problem," he said, "and most doctors say they
just don't know anything about that area."
Many experts say the biggest barrier to treatment is the
sense of shame about psychological conditions, which some
liken to the way depression was whispered about darkly in
the United States in the 1950's, in the era of shock
therapy.
When Japanese experience depression, doctors say, they
prefer to imagine something is wrong with their character
rather than their heads, and a cultural impulse known as
"gaman" or the will to endure, takes precedence over medical
care.
"In a culture of shame, the only thing to do about illnesses
of the mind is to hide them," Dr. Onda said. "They still
carry a stigma here that can haunt families down through
the generations. The best parallel I can imagine is the war,
when tens of thousands of Japanese soldiers preferred dying.
One 45-year-old woman who is being treated for depression
described the stigma this way: "I told an old friend of
mine, a very straightforward person, that I had depression,
and she warned me not to tell anyone else," said the
patient, who asked not to be identified. "I could see the
shock in her face, and all I could think is that she doesn't
want a sick person as her friend. I feel I can't let my
neighbors know about my condition, and I am certain that
if my company knew, I would get the tap on the shoulder."
With his office in Tokyo's Shibuya section, the center of
Japan's cosmopolitan youth culture, Dr. Onda said many of
his younger patients had been influenced by Western views
of depression, and felt much less hesitation about getting
treatment.
"Still, most of the patients who take time off from their
jobs to see me ask me not to write anything about the
diagnosis in the medical note they must show to their
companies," Dr. Onda said. "The other day, an airline
stewardess actually told me she would be fired if her
company knew she was depressed, so I wrote her a note
saying she had a slight hormonal imbalance."
Mental health experts say that a few large corporations
are leading the way in helping break down taboos like these,
through employee assistance programs, strict confidentiality
and more generous health plans that cover depression and
other psychological conditions.
Sony, for one, found itself hit by the costly high incidence
of suicides and depression among midcareer managers and
engineers. Three years ago, the company began a "preventive
mental health care program" for 18,000 employees offering
off-site consultations and confidentiality, and officials
say the service quickly became a popular success.
"It's not that the number of serious cases of illness is
increasing, it is that we are trying to lower the barriers
to care," said Satoshi Ishiguro, general manager of Sony's
Wellness Center.
noauth
explored country�s increase in mental health issues.
noauth
noauth
and Labor found that 24% of Japanese people had suffered
from some kind of mental health problem.
Anonymous
George Orwell
number would go down dramatically," said Dr. Tadashi Onda,
a psychiatrist.
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