Update on Andrew
bobwhelan
<nos...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:l34hftglvtgc1blit...@4ax.com...
> On 8 May 2001 23:58:20 GMT, gemin...@aol.com wrote:
>
> >Anyone else concerned and wanting to know his car make and model no and
> >license plate number, Just in CASE, email me and I will provide infor to
> >allow you to see this guy "coming".
>
>
> Are you sure that Andrew is the only stalker here? His has never
> acted violently so I doubt that you really fear him and really need to
> "see this guy coming".
In RL Andrew is cultured educated and urbane
what has been done to him is pure wicked scapegoating..it is wrong to use
the internet to gang up and make people homeless because you dont like what
they post.
>
> Prozakians Unite!
> http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
Kahnadah
"bobwhelan" <bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Iv0K6.6492$UV5....@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
bobwhelan
wouldnt have been anti-gay.
"Kahnadah" <kahn...@home.com> wrote in message
news:EE0K6.14203$Hk4.2...@news1.rdc1.ab.home.com...
headcase
>Everyone seems aware the YMCA asked Andyboy to sign an agreement not to post
>verbal vomit on the usenet. Well I posted aobut my divorce and when andyboy
>didnt reply I guessed he signed the agreement. WEll soon as I posted that on
>ASD-Medicated heard back that NO andyboy refused to sign that agreement and
>the police and YMCA evicted him! He took his computer, and allegedly left all
>his junk!
>...
>I personally did not want the guy evicted from the YMCA, cause at least we all
>knew exactly where he was. NOW, the idea of hsi driving around in that junk
>car crazy like he is, kind of concerns me.
I wasn't aware of the agreement. I shouldn't gloat but I think its hilarious
that Andrew's been evicted. So he left all his possessions except for his
precious computer? Let's hope he breaks it. Did all of this just happen?
He posted as recently as yesterday. Maybe he is posting from the homeless
shelter.
I wouldn't worry about him tracking you down. New Jersey is light years away
from Las Vegas. I doubt he has enough money for a single tank of gas. Plus
I would hope that you have not posted enough personal information for him to
identify you. I am worried that my letter to his probation officer might be
introduced as evidence and he will find out my address.
Maybe we can get this group back to normal. Everyone please stop replying to
crossposted messages.
headcase
bobwhelan
<nos...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:u56hft4eo4jb8pqd5...@4ax.com...
>
>
>
> No he is not a Nazi (he has killed no one) but you people may turn him
> into one. So he posts stupid homophobic and sexist crap on usenet.
not really unusual in a sexual abuse survivor..
> That is not worth making him homeless.
>
> Now you have made a bitter old man even more bitter. What good has
> that done? Do you think that will make him go away?
>
> Now that he is homeless where do you suppose he will go? Perhaps in
> your city and with an even bigger chip on his shoulder.
>
> All you people who claim that he is a dangerous man who belongs behind
> bars, I don't believe you. If you were truly afraid of him you would
> avoid him and hide from him. You would not stalk him.
>
> If homophobic Andrew goes to jail and gets sexually assaulted like so
> many men in prison do what do you think he will be like when he gets
> released?
*some* people have been taunting him for weeks with sadistic fantasies of
him being raped in jail..they think its a great idea!
Do you think he will hate gays less? Not likely. More
> likely it will be just the nudge he needs to move his homophobic
> hatred of gays from Usenet bashing to real life beatings and mugging.
>
> I'm ok with Andrew the way he is now. I've yet to be physically
> injured by a usenet post. I've yet to be made homeless by one too.
> But I'm really not comfortable with what Andrew may become after a
> stint in jail.
>
> Just remember folks if you do succeed in sending him to jail, he will
> get out very quickly and if you think he is angry now....
>
>
>
> On Wed, 09 May 2001 01:00:20 GMT, "Kampala" <kahn...@home.com> wrote:
>
> >the guy's a nazi. move on.
>
>
>
> >"bobwhites" <bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
> >news:Iv0K6.6492$UV5....@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
> >>
> >> <nos...@nospam.com> wrote in message
> >> news:l34hftglvtgc1blit...@4ax.com...
> >> > On 8 May 2001 23:58:20 GMT, gemin...@aol.com wrote:
> >> >
> >> > >Anyone else concerned and wanting to know his car make and model no
and
> >> > >license plate number, Just in CASE, email me and I will provide
inform
> >to
> >> > >allow you to see this guy "coming".
> >> >
>
>
> Prozakians Unite!
> http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
bobwhelan
<BIG...@GHCS.com> wrote in message
news:ec8hftshbkctnidpa...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 9 May 2001 02:32:02 +0100, "bobwhelan"
> <bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
> >> No he is not a Nazi (he has killed no one) but you people may turn him
> >> into one. So he posts stupid homophobic and sexist crap on usenet.
> >
> >not really unusual in a sexual abuse survivor..
>
>
>
Havent you seen the posts where they continually taunt him about his
brother?
Thts why the guys name and adress is always in some subject headings.
Apparently *some* people even got in touch with the perp to get him to
complain to Andrews probation officer..now that is sick!
> Prozakians Unite!
> http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
Mark D. Morin
>
> <nos...@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:l34hftglvtgc1blit...@4ax.com...
> > On 8 May 2001 23:58:20 GMT, gemin...@aol.com wrote:
> >
> > >Anyone else concerned and wanting to know his car make and model no and
> > >license plate number, Just in CASE, email me and I will provide infor to
> > >allow you to see this guy "coming".
> >
> >
> > Are you sure that Andrew is the only stalker here? His has never
> > acted violently so I doubt that you really fear him and really need to
> > "see this guy coming".
>
> In RL Andrew is cultured educated and urbane
The courts didn't agree with you.
Oh yeah, there's a big conspiracy going on in the State of Maine to
keep him from his son.
Right. Would you like to buy a bridge?
--
===============================================================
Don't sweat the small stuff, and remember,
most is small stuff.
--Anon
http://members.mint.net/mdmpsyd
for e-mail replies, remove the obvious
bobwhelan
<BIG...@GHCS.com> wrote in message
news:9kahftgs4lo80edmg...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 9 May 2001 03:01:28 +0100, "bobwhelan"
> <bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
> >Havent you seen the posts where they continually taunt him about his
> >brother?
> >Thts why the guys name and adress is always in some subject headings.
> >Apparently *some* people even got in touch with the perp to get him to
> >complain to Andrews probation officer..now that is sick!
> >
>
>
> mad at George for siding with the headcase dogkillers or his mother or
> something like that.. This makes more sense.
>
> Andrew would still probably be ok if he had not married a that creepy
> Psychiatrist Ingrid E. Runden, M.D..
Well..it takes two to tango..He loved her very much untill she went crazy..
She had all the financial and social power so what chance did he have?
Who knows why love evaporates and turns to hate..really?
I think its a tragedy that people shouldnt mock and make up stories about.
He got back on his feet with a stable home and a job and now hes been
knocked back to square one
He is a survivor though..if this Y story is true he will get back on his
feet..
Terrible to have your life destroyed by anonymous cowards.
>
> Prozakians Unite!
> http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
headcase
>Just remember folks if you do succeed in sending him to jail, he will
>get out very quickly and if you think he is angry now....
You seem to think that we have a lot of power. We are not the ones sending
him to jail. Only a judge can do that. It is not our fault if Andrew can
not abide by the conditions of his probation. I really don't care how
angry that psycho is or how angry he will be when he gets out of jail. I
can defend myself against him.
headcase
bobwhelan
<nos...@psychiatrykills.com> wrote in message
news:d8chftstlltintikm...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 09 May 2001 02:41:08 GMT, "Mark D. Morin"
> <mdm...@PETERHOOD69.earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> >bobwhites wrote:
> >>
> >> <nos...@nospam.com> wrote in message
> >> news:l34hftglvtgc1blit...@4ax.com...
> >> > On 8 May 2001 23:58:20 GMT, gemin...@aol.com wrote:
> >> >
> >> > >Anyone else concerned and wanting to know his car make and model no
and
> >> > >license plate number, Just in CASE, email me and I will provide
> >> > >allow you to see this guy "coming".
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Are you sure that Andrew is the only stalker here? His has never
> >> > acted violently so I doubt that you really fear him and really need
to
> >> > "see this guy coming".
> >>
> >> In RL Andrew is cultured educated and urbane
> >
> >The courts didn't agree with you.
the UK),
they are quite common in nasty marital break-ups and have no refection on
the character of the paticipants general character...
I wonder how you would react if you lost your son and home and wandered
bereft while other guys took over your home and family?
> >Oh yeah, there's a big conspiracy going on in the State of Maine to
> >keep him from his son.
> >Right.
As I understand it, its nothing to do with his son but an organised attempt
to stop him having his ex"s
license to practice removed.
Would you like to buy a bridge?
only if its London bridge which was looted and transported to America.
>
> Cultured educated and urbane people get sentenced as do and slack
> jawed local yokels that has nothing to do with it.
>
> Medical licensing boards are almost always going to side with the
> doctor and not the patient. Recently I posted an article here about a
> psychiatrist whose behavior was pointed out to the quality assurance
> board 7 times before he was sanctioned.
This is the husband making a complaint..harder to dismiss
Its a pity there cant be an amicable agreement where Dr Rundens apologies
are accepted and Andrew gets reasonable access to his son.
Its always the kids who suffer..a cliche but a true one
>
> He probably drove a black mercedes too.
what is this thing about mercedes?
Do all US pdocs have them?
>
>
lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com
<head...@scientologykills.org> wrote:
>geminigallv wrote in message <9da16s$hq5$1...@news.netmar.com>...
>>Everyone seems aware the YMCA asked Andyboy to sign an agreement not to post
>>verbal vomit on the usenet. Well I posted aobut my divorce and when andyboy
>>didnt reply I guessed he signed the agreement. WEll soon as I posted that on
>>ASD-Medicated heard back that NO andyboy refused to sign that agreement and
>>the police and YMCA evicted him! He took his computer, and allegedly left all
>>his junk!
>>...
>>I personally did not want the guy evicted from the YMCA, cause at least we all
>>knew exactly where he was. NOW, the idea of hsi driving around in that junk
>>car crazy like he is, kind of concerns me.
>
>I wasn't aware of the agreement. I shouldn't gloat but I think its hilarious
>that Andrew's been evicted. So he left all his possessions except for his
>precious computer? Let's hope he breaks it. Did all of this just happen?
>He posted as recently as yesterday. Maybe he is posting from the homeless
>shelter.
It was Friday...the Y gave him almost a week to sign the agreement.
Not only did Andrew refuse to sign, I heard he refused to leave until
the police got there.
I've always doubted that SSRIhater was Andrew. I think Andrew would be
defiantly posting under his own name if he was now able to.
Andrew always took his computer with him when he left the Y.
lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com
>
>
>
>No he is not a Nazi (he has killed no one) but you people may turn him
>into one. So he posts stupid homophobic and sexist crap on usenet.
>That is not worth making him homeless.
>
>Now you have made a bitter old man even more bitter. What good has
>that done? Do you think that will make him go away?
>
>Now that he is homeless where do you suppose he will go? Perhaps in
>your city and with an even bigger chip on his shoulder.
>
>All you people who claim that he is a dangerous man who belongs behind
>bars, I don't believe you. If you were truly afraid of him you would
>avoid him and hide from him. You would not stalk him.
>
>If homophobic Andrew goes to jail and gets sexually assaulted like so
>many men in prison do what do you think he will be like when he gets
>released? Do you think he will hate gays less? Not likely. More
>likely it will be just the nudge he needs to move his homophobic
>hatred of gays from Usenet bashing to real life beatings and mugging.
>
>I'm ok with Andrew the way he is now. I've yet to be physically
>injured by a usenet post. I've yet to be made homeless by one too.
>But I'm really not comfortable with what Andrew may become after a
>stint in jail.
>
>Just remember folks if you do succeed in sending him to jail, he will
>get out very quickly and if you think he is angry now....
He'll go to jail for his actions IRL, not because of the complaints
from the group. All the complaints did was let the authorities know
his true state of mind. Andrew is very successful at impersonating a
sane person in public...Det. Wagner was shocked when he saw the crap
Andrew posts.
I would have rather seen Andrew in a hospital getting help...but he
refuses to admit he has a problem, despite the fact that he has been
abusing newsgroups in exactly the same fashion for at least 6 years.
He was probably doing the same thing in the AOL forums before that.
>
>
>
>On Wed, 09 May 2001 01:00:20 GMT, "Kampala" <kahn...@home.com> wrote:
>
>>the guy's a nazi. move on.
>
>
>
>>"bobwhites" <bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
>>news:Iv0K6.6492$UV5....@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
>>>
>>> <nos...@nospam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:l34hftglvtgc1blit...@4ax.com...
>>> > On 8 May 2001 23:58:20 GMT, gemin...@aol.com wrote:
>>> >
>>> > >Anyone else concerned and wanting to know his car make and model no and
>>> > >license plate number, Just in CASE, email me and I will provide inform
>>to
>>> > >allow you to see this guy "coming".
>>> >
>
>
>Prozakians Unite!
>http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com
How about Andrew trying to get that guy fired because Andrew didn't
like what he posted?
>
>
>
>
>>
>> Prozakians Unite!
>> http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
>
bobwhelan
<lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com> wrote in message
news:i7hhfts6g93v07h0k...@4ax.com...
You"ll have to educate me on that one..Its the first Ive heard of it...
even if true two wrongs dont make a right..
What did the guy write?
Have you the post or reference toit?
> >
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Prozakians Unite!
> >> http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
> >
>
Mark D. Morin
>
> <nos...@psychiatrykills.com> wrote in message
> news:d8chftstlltintikm...@4ax.com...
> > On Wed, 09 May 2001 02:41:08 GMT, "Mark D. Morin"
> > <mdm...@PETERHOOD69.earthlink.net> wrote:
> >
> > >bobwhites wrote:
> > >>
> > >> <nos...@nospam.com> wrote in message
> > >> news:l34hftglvtgc1blit...@4ax.com...
> > >> > On 8 May 2001 23:58:20 GMT, gemin...@aol.com wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > >Anyone else concerned and wanting to know his car make and model no
> and
> > >> > >license plate number, Just in CASE, email me and I will provide
> inform to
> > >> > >allow you to see this guy "coming".
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > Are you sure that Andrew is the only stalker here? His has never
> > >> > acted violently so I doubt that you really fear him and really need
> to
> > >> > "see this guy coming".
> > >>
> > >> In RL Andrew is cultured educated and urbane
> > >
> > >The courts didn't agree with you.
> If you are referring to the restraining order
among other things.
> (we call them injunctions in the UK),
> they are quite common in nasty marital break-ups and have no refection on
> the character of the paticipants general character...
other than the fact that there is prima facie evidence that the
individual needs to be restrained.
> I wonder how you would react if you lost your son and home and wandered
> bereft while other guys took over your home and family?
I wonder what types of behaviors he manifested that resulted in him
not being allowed contact with his son.
>
> > >Oh yeah, there's a big conspiracy going on in the State of Maine to
> > >keep him from his son.
> > >Right.
> As I understand it, its nothing to do with his son but an organised attempt
> to stop him having his ex"s license to practice removed.
>
> Would you like to buy a bridge?
sounds like you've bought one or two--don't need them anymore?
>
> only if its London bridge which was looted and transported to America.
>
> >
> > Cultured educated and urbane people get sentenced as do and slack
> > jawed local yokels that has nothing to do with it.
> >
> > Medical licensing boards are almost always going to side with the
> > doctor and not the patient. Recently I posted an article here about a
> > psychiatrist whose behavior was pointed out to the quality assurance
> > board 7 times before he was sanctioned.
>
> This is the husband making a complaint..harder to dismiss
yet it was
> Its a pity there cant be an amicable agreement where Dr Rundens apologies
> are accepted and Andrew gets reasonable access to his son.
> Its always the kids who suffer..a cliche but a true one
unless allowing such access would lead to more suffering than is
currently the case.
jenwolf
> what is this thing about mercedes?
> Do all US pdocs have them?
No. There's this U.S. television show called Touched By An Angel. In the
most recent episode, one of the angels has turned away from god and is
walking along the road toward the desert. She is met by the devil on
this road and he's driving a black mercedes. Now Shawnee is obsessed
with black mercedes', the devil and psychiatrists. Given her obvious
hatred of psychiatrists, these three things are linked in her mind, and
it shows in her posts and crossposts.
jenwolf
> Jenwolf you must hate psychiatrists the devil, crossposts and mercedes
> because you just crossposted that all over hell and back.... :)
I only did that because I had no idea where CBI and Steve Harris were
reading from.
> My pdoc drives a mercedes or maybe two. I'm not obsessed with the
> christian devil.
I know you watched the show because you quoted lines from it (I watched
it too).
lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com
I've posted it several times...
http://imperium.lenin.ru/~verbit/crankery.html
Look at the file under Alexplore, an alias of Andrew's, and read about
Pruss. Of course Andrew now denies that this refers to him, but notice
that the posts by Alexplore are written in exactly the same style as
Andrew writes today, and notice that Andrew was working with Vulis,
who is still one of Andrew's heros...
Also notice the dates on these posts...you said something about the
effect on Andrew of losing his wife and son...this is proof that
Andrew was just as insane for years before the divorce.
BTW, Andrew still harasses those same people...see his recent posts
crossposted to the soc hierarchy.
You said Andrew's wife went crazy...did you read Andrew's complaint to
the Maine medical board, and her reply (which Andrew illegally
posted)? That should tell you who is crazy and who isn't.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Prozakians Unite!
>> >> http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
>> >
>>
>
lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com
the HMO <nos...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>On Tue, 08 May 2001 23:10:17 -0500,
>lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com wrote:
>
>>It was Friday...the Y gave him almost a week to sign the agreement.
>>Not only did Andrew refuse to sign, I heard he refused to leave until
>>the police got there.
>>
>>I've always doubted that SSRIhater was Andrew. I think Andrew would be
>>defiantly posting under his own name if he was now able to.
>>
>>Andrew always took his computer with him when he left the Y.
>
>
>Great, you took a vindictive hateful man who was only using usenet to
>spout off and got him evicted. I have a feeling he is going to use
>more than just usenet to spout off now.
>
>Prozakians Unite!
>http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
I didn't personally get him evicted. I haven't even talked to the Y. I
would have rather seen them just cut off his phone.
What I really want to see is for Andrew to get medical help. The ones
who need it the most are usually the ones who fight hardest against
it.
cy...@webtv.net
says...
personally did not want the guy evicted from the YMCA, cause at least we
all
>>knew exactly where he was. NOW, the idea of hsi driving around in that
junk
>>car crazy like he is, kind of concerns me.
>
>
yourself. You could have just ignored him. He
>never would have tracked you
down if you had just ignored him in the
>first place.
>
>I'm not saying that he
is a nice guy. But you could have ignored him
>none the less.
>
>Prozakians
Unite!
>http://www.geocities.com/prozakian/page1.html
Are you for real???
Wasn't that suggested to _YOU_ re: _YOUR_ stalker??? I had almost got to the
point of accepting you "as is" but this is the topper in a long line of you
showing your true colors. Gee...who said "oh yeah...those a**noles on asdm
always blame the victims." You are a real piece of work. You know so damn much
about being bipolar and how to research etc on the internet, but you do
absolutely NOTHING to get better...just complain, poke sticks at people or piss
& moan. You are a shit stirrer who would rather try to hurt others than do the
work it takes to make your own life/mind better. I don't have my own home or a
computer. Can't afford hobbies (like fish-I'd have to eat them to survive) and I
don't have insurance or an HMO. I don't get SSI, SSDI or any other public
assistance except the county medically indigent adult programs for mental and
physical care (no eye docs or dentists). If I didn't live with my MIL I'd be on
the streets. You are a ungrateful brat whose primary concern is yourself. Go
ahead now and turn this into how I've told you to suicide & deprive your
daughter like you did last time I got fed up with you. You are a self-centered
liar & hypocrite. Yeah you called me that too...a hypocrite & a crossposting
troll. You have an ill child and mental problems. I am sympathetic to that.
You've been a victim. Me too (rape, spousal abuse and robbery at gunpoint twice
to name a few.) Guess what! You ain't the only one who hurts so stop trying to
blame everyone else for your misery and stop taking pot shots at people who are
struggling as much if not more than you. God I can't believe what a bitch you
are! Bipolar, borderline or whatever!!! Doesn't matter what your dx is. You have
shown yourself for what you really are. AND I'VE BEEN TRYING TO IGNORE YOU!!!
caroly~vonne
Nearwidow
Liar.
Pants on fire.
Who's telling you this shit, the same people who post that I'm under
indictment for 'conspiracy'?
P
<gemin...@aol.com> wrote in message news:9da16s$hq5$1...@news.netmar.com...
> I am receiving conflicting information recording Andrews court date.
>
> People on ASD-Manic and across the usenet have emailed me they were told
May
> 11, but people who filed the very first complaint insist the court date
is
> May 14 as of email I recieved this very minute. The May 14 date is good
for
> the initial batch of complaints, so long as the judge doesnt reschedule,
and
> I would suggest anyone who has been informed their complait will be heard
May
> 11 better recheck and make sure they got the right date.
>
> Perhaps its two separate hearings, who knows, but check it out if you are
one
> of the complainants.
>
> Everyone seems aware the YMCA asked Andyboy to sign an agreement not to
post
> verbal vomit on the usenet. Well I posted aobut my divorce and when
andyboy
> didnt reply I guessed he signed the agreement. WEll soon as I posted
that on
> ASD-Medicated heard back that NO andyboy refused to sign that agreement
and
> the police and YMCA evicted him! He took his computer, and allegedly left
all
> his junk!
>
> Andyboy has allegedly also made those threates to "rescue" his child
again
> this time to the childs tutor or teacher or something.
>
> I understand the state was finally able to grab a few child support
payments,
> allegedly, whereupon Andyboy allegedly switched jobs so they couldn't!
>
> I personally did not want the guy evicted from the YMCA, cause at least
we all
> knew exactly where he was. NOW, the idea of hsi driving around in that
junk
> car crazy like he is, kind of concerns me.
>
> Anyone else concerned and wanting to know his car make and model no and
> license plate number, Just in CASE, email me and I will provide infor to
> allow you to see this guy "coming".
>
> Gemini
>
> ----- Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the
eb -----
> http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+
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> NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam. If this or other posts
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bobwhelan
Dont you know conspiring to tell the truth is a crime here?
"Nearwidow" <near...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:0NHK6.64566$sP6.3...@news3.aus1.giganews.com...
Nearwidow
"bobwhelan" <bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:4QJK6.12849$UV5.1...@news11-gui.server.ntli.net...
> Great to see you Patricia..
> Dont you know conspiring to tell the truth is a crime here?
> "Nearwidow" <near...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:0NHK6.64566$sP6.3...@news3.aus1.giganews.com...
> > Liar.
> > Liar.
> > Pants on fire.
> > Who's telling you this shit, the same people who post that I'm under
> > indictment for 'conspiracy'?
> >
> >
> > P
> >
> > <gemin...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:9da16s$hq5$1...@news.netmar.com...
> > > I am receiving conflicting information recording Andrews court date.
<<note: this is probably because there IS no such court date, Linda. I sure
hope you didn't take the day off work.
.........oh, of course, none of you mental defectives DO work...The
suffering mentally ill!!!! *sob* >>
Be afraid Bob! HA HA! They'll post bogus shit about you, but because you
are a MAN you will not wet your pants and cry. You need to hop over to AT
and see some of the responses Keith and his sweethearts have been getting
to their Anti-Widder post.... it'll make your day!
Love
P
jenwolf
>
> On Sat, 12 May 2001 13:33:14 -0400, jenwolf <jen...@email.com> wrote:
>
> >> > Thinking about it they probably did send forged posts to Anna when..
> >> Well they wouldn't be forged if the trojan was a remote access one would
> >> they?
> >> Makes sense.
I didn't write that. Get with the program, lady. ;)
> dumb as a box of rocks thanks to all the acid she used in the 60's was
I wonder what caving would be like while tripping.
Nah, not worth putting that crap in my body.
> interest of hacking Renegade BBS systems in the county. We were both
> sysop's of Renegade BBS system's well before there was a single ISP in
> our county.
Big F*cking Deal.
Get over yourself.
Sheesh.
jenwolf
>
> On Sat, 12 May 2001 15:23:47 -0400, jenwolf <jen...@email.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >Big F*cking Deal.
> >
> >Get over yourself.
> >
> >Sheesh.
>
Just fine thanks, you thinking of joining the group?
Salvidor Hedgehog
jen...@email.com says...
--
"The Big Fact Hunt" - BBC4
=========================
"I'm an ordinary Chinese woman writing you this letter in
tears from my sickbed."
=========================
"Don't go to bed with no price on your head.
Don't do the crime if you can't do the time."
=========================
"Your barking mad family will never get
air time anywhere else!". BBC4
=========================
/////////
///////////
__oo' ///////////
a ___ ///////////
^^ ^^
jenwolf
> Hopper has always patronized me but I like Anna.
Hopper has told you the truth about yourself as far as I can tell. Still
thinking of joining the DBT group?
bobwhelan
"GeminiGal LV" <gemin...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010513154402...@ng-mm1.aol.com...
> >Subject: Re: Update on Andrew
> >From: jenwolf jen...@email.com
> >Date: 5/13/01 4:56 AM Pacific Standard Time
> >Message-id: <3afe88b4$0$12825$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net>
posting
> what she knows or thinks based upon her knowledge, infomation and belief.
> In general, I find Shawnees perceptions and insight about things and
people
> reflect a firm grasp of reality. Like all of us she may have a few mental
blank
> spots, but in general I find her right on a lot of the time.
>
> I am having significant problems finding much truth in all the many
criticisms
> of her.
>
> I have reached the conclusion all these people are always on her case
cause
> Shawnees posts the truth as she sees it, with fairly good grasp of
reality, and
> her critics have problems with the truth, and/ or seeing reality as it is.
>
> I am relatively new here, so only know what been posted in recent months,
but
> the only thing Shawnees critics accomplished is make themselves look bad.
>
> Gemini
>
Bracketing all the "other business"..I strangely find myself in total
agreement with you here.
Bob
>
>
>
>
> Complaints Re: Andrew Chmilewsky being accepted by:.
>
>
> Probation Dept.
> Essex Co. Vicinage
> 60 Evergreen PL.
> E Orange, NJ.07018
> (Ms. Lamberts)
>
> Tel: 973-395-3117
> FAX 973-395-3099
jenwolf
> I am having significant problems finding much truth in all the many criticisms
> of her.
Are you able to see headers? Do you ever reply to any of her posts and
get groups like alt.auto.mercedes? Look at all the unrelated groups she
crossposts to for no good reason, certainly not one based in any reality
I'm aware of.
> I have reached the conclusion all these people are always on her case cause
> Shawnees posts the truth as she sees it, with fairly good grasp of reality, and
> her critics have problems with the truth, and/ or seeing reality as it is.
I don't have a problem with many of the things shawnee is saying. I have
a problem with her changing her name every five seconds, I have a
problem with her deliberately trolling other groups with her crossposts
and follow-up headers.
> I am relatively new here, so only know what been posted in recent months, but
> the only thing Shawnees critics accomplished is make themselves look bad.
I couldn't care less if I look bad.
bobwhelan
> >Subject: Re: Update on Andrew
> >Date: 5/14/01 2:23 PM Pacific Standard Time
> >Message-id: <mkm0gt8uccm960ifg...@4ax.com>
> >excuse
> >to rip me to shreds and to impersonate my mother on Mother's day. Very
> >flimsy
> >excuses but they need someone to attack now that Andrew is gone.
>
> Thats how I see it, this entire group of people have consicously or
> unconsciously decided to make you their whipping post, and are constantly
> ripping you to pieces, and highly critical of anything you post or do.
>
> Anytime anyone questions any of them who are doing this, about their doing
it,
> they either totally deny doing what they are doing, or cart out a list of
your
> actions, as if that accounts for their doing what they do, or excuses what
they
> do.
>
> You come here as a bipolar, for support and constantly are being asked to
> defend yourself for everything you say and do, as well as things you never
said
> or did, but which they say you did or attributed you as saying.
>
> After several months of observing all this, I concluded these people have
some
> problems where in they feel threatened big time by you to be so mean
spirted in
> their attacks.
>
> Perhaps you are too well for the group, too honest, perceptive,
insightful, and
> they cant cope with too much truth, too much reality feel threatened by
your
> ability to get to the meat of the matter when so many like to keep that
> obscure.
>
> I dont know, I just know these neverending attacks on you reflect the
problems
> of your attackers, not you.
>
> Not to say you dont have issues, as all people do, just that the attacks
are
> not about you, no matter what they say or how much they insisit you
deservie it
> and their justified.
>
> IMHO, FWIW
>
> Gemini
>
You seem a kinder more compassionate person by the day..
Isnt it time that Anna"s "list" of people who are malignant and must be
destroyed
was itself either destroyed or made public ?
>
> ,
lynx
<Menthe...@classical.gr> wrote:
> Is there anyone here who can say the the very worst thing they have ever
> done while manic is cross post?
you certainly can't. i'd like for you to cut the worse stuff the fuck out
already, thanks.
- lynx, who'd like to stay out of this shitfight, but shawnygirl will
have to leave me out of it too for that to happen. capiche?
--
PGP/GnuPG key (ID 1024D/BFE0D6D0) available from keyservers everywhere
Key fingerprint = 3EBC 97FC 68AA 65F1 65E6 3D36 35F6 4213 BFE0 D6D0
"...life goes on
long after the thrill of living is gone..."
jenwolf
> I change my nick constantly because I don't like crap to follow me everywhere
> forever the following is an example.
What, you hate yourself so much that you don't want your own name to
follow you anywhere? You seriously need help.
> I reposted this because I know it will not
> bother you in the least. You have stated repeatedly that this kind of stuff
> does not bother you at all. But it does bother me. So you will just have to
> live with my nick changes. Trust me the world will not come to an end because I
> like to change my nick. If it makes your head spin oh well.
What does bother me is that no one can criticize the GREAT SHAWNEE. I
said I don't like you changing your nick every 5 seconds, I don't have
to like it and it's no reason for you to go off on some rant and
dragging up old posts. But you see everything as an attack on you.
Prepare to be attacked because I've reached the limit with your shit,
bitch.
jenwolf
> So you see gemini they take my cross posting and changing my nick as an excuse
> to rip me to shreds and to impersonate my mother on Mother's day. Very flimsy
> excuses but they need someone to attack now that Andrew is gone.
Get the fuck over yourself, you whining worthless piece of shit. Why
don't you go pay attention to your daughter instead of spending so much
time worrying about what everyone is thinking of you on Usenet. Oh, and
in case you didn't notice (which, obviously you didn't), I didn't have a
damn thing to do with Andrew. I've never ripped you to shreds. I said I
was sick and fucking tired (BECAUSE I AM) of your stupid crossposting
and followup lines, and I said I didn't like (BECAUSE I DON'T) you
changing your name every 5 seconds. If everyone doesn't love you and
everything you do it's not the end of the goddamn world so get the fuck
over it.
jenwolf
>
> On Mon, 14 May 2001 17:35:20 -0400, jenwolf <jen...@email.com> wrote:
>
> >get groups like alt.auto.mercedes? Look at all the unrelated groups she
> >crossposts to for no good reason, certainly not one based in any reality
> >I'm aware of.
>
> posted.
Obviously that's the way you see it if anyone criticizes it. Get over
yourself, Shawnee.
> Is there anyone here who can say the the very worst thing they have ever done
> while manic is cross post?
I'd be happy to rip your spine out and beat you with it, if you had one.
Menthe...@classical.gr
Menthe...@classical.gr
>>
>> >Are you able to see headers? Do you ever reply to any of her posts and
>> >get groups like alt.auto.mercedes? Look at all the unrelated groups she
>> >crossposts to for no good reason, certainly not one based in any reality
>> >I'm aware of.
>>
>> OMG Western civilization is going to come crashing to it's knees because I cross
>> posted.
>
>Obviously that's the way you see it if anyone criticizes it. Get over
>yourself, Shawnee.
>
>> Is there anyone here who can say the very worst thing they have ever done
lynx
<gemin...@aol.com> wrote:
[...]
> Not to say you dont have issues, as all people do, just that the attacks
> are not about you,
if she doesn't back off my personal information, i'll change that
particular point myself. if and when i choose to attack her, it will be
*all* about her.
note: the wolf and i are two separate people. just because she doesn't
mind something, doesn't mean i won't, and vice versa. neither of us has
been "tearing [shawnie] to shreds" up until now; if she thinks she's been
flamed already, she'd do well not to piss us off in earnest. she might
have crossed the wolf's threshold already, and mine is close.
lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com
<bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>Isnt it time that Anna"s "list" of people who are malignant and must be
>destroyed
>was itself either destroyed or made public ?
"List" as Anna used it, is a rather archaic term sometimes used to
refer to a newsgroup. This comes from some overlap in the function of
newsgroups and email discussion lists. (As in ListServe)
Menthe...@classical.gr
>> Is there anyone here who can say the very worst thing they have ever done
>> while manic is cross post?
>
>I'd be happy to rip your spine out and beat you with it, if you had one.
For someone that does not mind having their name follow them around you sure are
getting upset.
Robert
<bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>Isnt it time that Anna"s "list" of people who are malignant and must be
>destroyed
>was itself either destroyed or made public ?
Why do you go on about Anna? You complain about people demonizing
Andrew yet you do the same thing to Anna. What list are you talking
about?
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
jenwolf
> Thats how I see it, this entire group of people have consicously or
> unconsciously decided to make you their whipping post, and are constantly
> ripping you to pieces, and highly critical of anything you post or do.
Why don't you go to http://groups.google.com and do a search on this
group with keyword Shawnie, check her history and then make your mind
up.
> Anytime anyone questions any of them who are doing this, about their doing it,
> they either totally deny doing what they are doing, or cart out a list of your
> actions, as if that accounts for their doing what they do, or excuses what they
> do.
Heh, if I wasn't ripping her to shreds when she and you claimed I was, I
am now. She damn well deserves it. No one can possibly be critical of
her in the slightest way, if they are she does anything to get them
pissed off. Then she cries that everyone is attacking her. You're buying
into her bullshit and thus egging on her behavior.
> You come here as a bipolar, for support and constantly are being asked to
> defend yourself for everything you say and do, as well as things you never said
> or did, but which they say you did or attributed you as saying.
''scuse me, but perhaps you missed her posting real names, addresses and
phone numbers because she *thinks* I or lynx posted something as her
mother? There's no fucking way she can possibly back up her accusation,
but yet she plunges forward with an all out attack. Why does she believe
one of us did this? Because I read some posts about it and simply asked
if she had asked her mother if it was her who had posted the post.
> After several months of observing all this, I concluded these people have some
> problems where in they feel threatened big time by you to be so mean spirted in
> their attacks.
You're delusional and buying into a load of crap. I don't feel
threatened by Shawnie Vedder or anyone else here.
> Perhaps you are too well for the group, too honest, perceptive, insightful, and
> they cant cope with too much truth, too much reality feel threatened by your
> ability to get to the meat of the matter when so many like to keep that
> obscure.
Would you care to try and prove who sent a message through an anonymous
remailer without anyone actually saying they did it? Would you care to
explain to me how any of her posts have anything to do with mercedes'?
Or caving? Or why they should be crossposted to alt.flame.pizza.greasy?
Would you care to show me the web page of her mother's that she carries
on about, but which I couldn't find? None of it's real and you're buying
it all.
> I dont know, I just know these neverending attacks on you reflect the problems
> of your attackers, not you.
Oh poor little Shawnie, never does anything wrong, everyone else is so
cruel. You know, I'm beginning to believe your name ought to be
sock-puppet.
jenwolf
>
> On Mon, 14 May 2001 19:46:15 -0400, jenwolf <jen...@email.com> wrote:
>
> >follow you anywhere? You seriously need help.
>
> yourself?
I am posting with my real name.
jenwolf
>
> On Mon, 14 May 2001 19:46:15 -0400, jenwolf <jen...@email.com> wrote:
>
> >said I don't like you changing your nick every 5 seconds, I don't have
> >to like it and it's no reason for you to go off on some rant and
> >dragging up old posts. But you see everything as an attack on you.
> >Prepare to be attacked because I've reached the limit with your shit,
> >bitch.
>
You have trouble with English grammar?
> You don't like me changing my nick, great reason to attack.
No, my attack comes after your attack at me just because I don't like
you changing your name and because you *think* I posted some shit as
your mother. Go back and read your own post Shawnie.
> I have not seen you add anything positive to this group since you came back.
That's your opinion. And it's my opinion that you have never added
anything positive here, so why are you here?
> What exactly are you doing here? I think you just come her to turn this place
> into your own personal dog and pony show.
You were here long before me, wouldn't want to take the stage away from
you.
> I was kind enough to turn on the no archive command before I posted that.
Big fucking deal, it was still an attack and you know it. Don't even try
to turn it on to me now.
> Think about it.
Please.
> Now why is it you are going to attack again?
Go back and re-read what you wrote and think about why you wrote it,
maybe you'll get a clue in your half baked brain.
> You stated very loudly
> and very clearly that I had no right to be upset about such things being done to
> me and that you would not be bothered in the least and were in fact not bothered
> in the least when such things were done to you in the past.
I'm not bothered about my name, etc being posted. I am upset about your
*reasons* for doing it.
jenwolf
It wasn't just my information that you chose to re-hash, dumbass. But
then, you obviously can't be expected to think about anyone else but
your damn self.
bobwhelan
<lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com> wrote in message
news:1lt0gt48ln9saliqs...@4ax.com...
thought she would start in on Shawnee and anyone she thought had exchanged a
friendly word with Andrew..you have put my mind at rest somewhat..OK
You must admit that the absense of Andrew hasnt led to an instant Shangri
La?
bobwhelan
"Robert" <robe...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:hpt0gt8d7jgs2gplr...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 15 May 2001 00:40:23 +0100, "bobwhelan"
> <bobw...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >Isnt it time that Anna"s "list" of people who are malignant and must be
> >destroyed
> >was itself either destroyed or made public ?
>
> Why do you go on about Anna? You complain about people demonizing
> Andrew yet you do the same thing to Anna. What list are you talking
> about?
You may not have read yet Annas tranference of her newly honed skills onto
me.
She is trying to demonise *me* not visa versa.
I think it is nominally going on in medication but its crossposted to
fourteen groups for crying out loud..
She is telling me I should commit suicide and is back to the you are Andrew
business.
I am not gunning for her at all..
It is clear to me that she has been totally traumatised by the hacking
,pornographic forgeries,
and has even adopted the nick of Internet cock Huntress.
She seems to think I am responsible and is on a mission to get me imprisoned
for some nameless offenses known only to her.
As for her list, what Kieth says sounds reasonable but I suggest you ask
her.
I got the impession it was a lst of people whose corpses had to be torn to
bits.
It seems a development of this satanic child sacrifice theme she is building
up.
At root its back to the Bob is an evil troll business.
cy...@webtv.net
says...
>
>>Subject: Re: Update on Andrew
>>Date: 5/14/01 3:46 PM Pacific Standard Time
>>Message-id: <3b007283$0$14451$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net>
<snip>
>Each situation is different and unique, and Shawnee is a different from andrew
>as night an day.
>
>And, after months of silence I am speaking up that I at least am against this
>"burn shawnee at the stake" mentality p[ermeating this group, and I think these
>attacks on shawnne very very wrong.
>
>Basically I have had it with these unfair unjistified, and avusive attacks on
>her.
I have kept quiet about Shawnee's behavior on this group and the crossposting and attempts to post false messages in order to bring an attack on her current object of hate.
Basically I have had it with Shawnee doing the crap she tries to do and has nothing to do with her "reality."
I haven't attacked her for her pov. I am sick to death of her twisting things to make herself look the victim. THAT is her reality. She believes she is unable to do anthing but be victimized. It's how she survives and getting the sympathy. But she never works on how to stop being the victim. She's not weak and just a poor, innocent little single mother of a fragile child.
THAT is my problem with her and it's a valid reason. Now, I try to avoid her posts but it's inevitable that her snide remarks get through. That is what she lives for. YOU are allowed to feel sorry for her but I have my reasons and until she quits crossposting, etc. I don't want to read her crap.
Whatever you may think of me Gemini, I am not a vile person and I don't appreciate her manipulations of the group to satisfy whatever ails her.
caroly~vonne
lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com
No, of course not. Sad, isn't it? That's why I'm really happy that the
moderated group is going so well now. People can choose whether they
want to be exposed to the nastiness or not.
Did you know that I am usually a very infrequent poster there? I was
one of the people who worked to get that group going, but it was
because I saw a need for others, not something I needed for myself.
Now if all the mental health groups had thriving moderated groups
attached to them, I wouldn't have cared so much about the Andrew
thing. It would still be sad that he so obviously needed help but
wasn't getting any. But he couldn't deny anyone the resources of the
support community anymore.
Andrew did cause harm, by making this group such an unpleasant place
that people chose not to participate here at all. No way to know how
much harm...how could we possibly know if someone had come here while
suicidal trying to reach out for help only to be scared away?
Easy to say that Andrew didn't create the climate of the group all by
himself. He had help. But when you are trying to troubleshoot a
process you look for the simplest cause first to eliminate the greater
part of the problems.
For each individual person, the correct thing to have done would have
been to ignore Andrew (or anyone else who upsets us so much). But as a
group, the reality is that doesn't work. It's not possible that
everyone will be able to ignore someone like Andrew. Flame wars break
out in so called "normal" groups, even. We are bipolar, and one thing
a lot of us share (have in common) is anger. It is often a part of our
cycling, in fact.
Where is the greater good here? Preserving a group that has saved
lives, or "being fair" to someone like Andrew?
bobwhelan
<lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com> wrote in message
news:vu61gt49k65fbpamr...@4ax.com...
groups
all the hostile hyper acting out is no use to repressed withdrawn people who
need gentling out of there shell.
a tighty controlled enviroment is no good to an energetic manic bursting at
trhe seams.
It would be nice to be able to set it up and tip-toe backwards leaving it
self-sustaining
I thought vitual groups wouldt have these problems ..but they do ..even down
to virtual whispering behind peoples backs....
Hell of a book here for someone..me if I functioned better.
Theres always abusive people though
> Now if all the mental health groups had thriving moderated groups
> attached to them, I wouldn't have cared so much about the Andrew
> thing. It would still be sad that he so obviously needed help but
> wasn't getting any. But he couldn't deny anyone the resources of the
> support community anymore.
>
> Andrew did cause harm, by making this group such an unpleasant place
> that people chose not to participate here at all. No way to know how
> much harm...how could we possibly know if someone had come here while
> suicidal trying to reach out for help only to be scared away?
>
Well I wont play the record again.. but that precise thing happened to me
and it wasnt andrew.
Im in that category and Ive been told again tonight that Im a monster and
should kill myself and it wasnt Andrew
> Easy to say that Andrew didn't create the climate of the group all by
> himself. He had help. But when you are trying to troubleshoot a
> process you look for the simplest cause first to eliminate the greater
> part of the problems.
>
Psychopathic though..people arent electronic systems
> For each individual person, the correct thing to have done would have
> been to ignore Andrew (or anyone else who upsets us so much). But as a
> group, the reality is that doesn't work. It's not possible that
> everyone will be able to ignore someone like Andrew. Flame wars break
> out in so called "normal" groups, even. We are bipolar, and one thing
> a lot of us share (have in common) is anger. It is often a part of our
> cycling, in fact.
>
sure but lok at tonight ..its a structural problem..People are allready
trying to push me into an Andy suit..
> Where is the greater good here? Preserving a group that has saved
> lives, or "being fair" to someone like Andrew?
>
Well thats an ethical question....each individual has to answer that
themselves..
A bit like the old debating question of who do you throw out of a balloon
Personally I follow Albert Camus on that one..
If we cant all be saved I dont want to know..I "lurk a bit in your moderated
group though.
Bob>
jenwolf
> Do you belong to those S & M clubs in real life and get to act out your sadism
> more than via verbal abuse, but physically as well.
The things done in so-called S&M clubs are between consenting adults,
and frankly I see nothing wrong with it if it's their cup of tea. What I
do see wrong is *your* using it as a potential way to abuse me.
> Or do you merely give vent to your sadism anonymously on NG where you can find
> vulnerable people to beat up on?
Since when am I anonymous? In case you haven't noticed, Shawnie Vedder
has posted, over and over I might add, personal details about me. I
guess Gemini is your real name, then?
jenwolf
> I have remained silent while people of your ilk have continously and
> incessantly and relentlessly ripped this poster to threads, while trying to
> understand where the people attacking her are coming from, and why this group
> is doing this to this poster. .
Get over yourself, Shawnie.
> Well its been three months I been reading these unfair and completely
> unjustified and extremely abusive attacks on this poster,
Uh huh.
> and I reached my limit with regard to saying nothing while this person is being so unfairly
> treated.
>
Boohoohoo, poor little Shawnie.
> I recognize Shawnee has a different POV regards Andy.
I don't give a shit about Andrew. I only care that Shawnie has attacked
me more than once and now she expects immunity from my attacks.
> with them about what to do with that situation, doesnt mean I obligated myself
> to agree with them forevermore about everything.
You are dumb and hypocritical. You say you don't have a we/them attitude
yet you lump me in with the anti-andrew crown ("you and your ilk"), I
had nothing to do with that man, and my attacks on Shawnie were earned
by her.
> And, after months of silence I am speaking up that I at least am against this
> "burn shawnee at the stake" mentality p[ermeating this group, and I think these
> attacks on shawnne very very wrong.
I didn't see you complaining when I asked a simple question and she
posted personal information ...and not just what she thinks is my
personal information. I didn't see you complaining when I asked a
question *about caves* at alt.caving and she responded to it with some
junk about how I'm afraid to take Risperdal. You haven't done your
homework, and so you are blind-sided by Shawnie's supposed innocence.
> Basically I have had it with these unfair unjistified, and avusive attacks on
> her.
So what the hell are you going to do about it?
> So apparently my new crusade is going to be "stop dumping your shit on Shawnee,
> carry it yourself".
LoL. Whatever.
jenwolf
> I made up my mind, the attacks on shawnne are unfair, unjustified, without
> merit and the people attacking her are dumping alot of their own shit on
> shawnne cause they dont want to carry their own load.
Then you are very dumb, or you are Shawnie.
> Shawnees only contribution to all this if you can call it that, is she happens
> to be a vey defensive person, and when attacked tries to explain herself when
Uh huh. You haven't answered my questions. How was my question to her
regarding the post by her mother (or whomever) an attack? I simply asked
her if she'd asked her mother whether it was her. I was in Detroit most
of Sunday and Monday. I came home and saw that and asked the question
and immediately she attacked me as if I was pretending to be her mother.
Frankly, I think she was desparate to find any excuse *not* to talk to
her mother about the post. Also, how do you explain her following me to
alt.caving and bringing up things I'd posted about at asdmm? I consider
that an attack because she's obviously trying to annoy me. There's
plenty more examples that you obviously missed or are too dumb to see
because you've been suckered by her.
> Its human nature to defend oneself when under attack,
Yep, so why the hell am I so bad for doing it?
> so i hardly think doing
> so contributes to the proble. NO, the problem wi people wanting to attack this
> poster, dump their shit on her, and I am sick of reading these unfair,
> unjustified, relentless, incessant, hatefilled posts attacking her.
Don't read them then, you obviously aren't reading all you need to in
order to see the big picture here, anyway.
> Hyencd I am going to crusade against these attacks on Shawnne, till they cease.
LoL. You are nothing to me, I will stop attacking Shawnie when I'm done
being pissed off at her for her attacks on me.
jenwolf
>
> On Mon, 14 May 2001 21:06:02 -0400, jenwolf <jen...@email.com> wrote:
>
> >I'm not bothered about my name, etc being posted. I am upset about your
> >*reasons* for doing it.
>
> noble and humanitarian?
It was pretty simple, I was (and still am) pissed off at you and did
what would hurt you. Don't like it? Then stop attacking me. You have no
way of knowing who posted that post of your mother, and neither do I.
Why did you blame me? All I did was ask you if you'd asked your mother
if it was her.
jenwolf
And you know this for a fact? No, you don't. But I know that your real
name is not Menthe_Nymph or any of the other hundreds of names you shift
to on an hourly basis.
jenwolf
> NO, you assassinate shawnne because according toyou she crossposts and you want
> to rid the world of crosspposters.
Please tell me where I posted that I am "assisinating" Shawnie because
of crossposts, and I'd also especially like to see where I said that I
want to rid the world of crossposters.
> If you ever want anyone else to do asyou suggest to keep in your good graces,
I couldn't care less whether I am in Shawnie's good graces.
> I dont crosspost except when unawres someone has xposted their post and my
> newsreader replies to each group they crossposted too,
Uh huh. How hard is it to trim those extra groups if you don't want them
going there?
> but others crossposting never bothered me, EXCEPT crossposts crossposted to demand, command, bully
> abuse people or take them too task for crossposting. Not the crosspost bothers
> me, but the hypocrisy!
LoL. Don't have a heart attack now.
jenwolf
> What i hear as explanation are lame, she crossposts and changes her addy's
You obviously haven't read what I've written or you have a problem with
English if you still think that that's what this is about.
> I am sick of the constant attacks on her, and sick of the lame excuses for the
> attacks.
I am sick of your stupid whining about it and refusal to read anything
you don't want to believe.
> IF the person leading the attack against shawnee backs off and suggests his
> followers do the same, then I will be satisfied.
Maybe Shawnie needs to back the hell off and appologize for the things
she's done to provoke the attacks.
> If that person doesnt, then they better be prepared to have evidence fo the
> fact they do do exactly what Shawnee said tehy do, outed, so their pose as
> sheep in wolf clothes will be exposed for all to seee.
Do it!
jenwolf
> You have been attacking me here for weeks.
Bullshit.
> You yourself admitted that I think that borderline is an insult,
You *do* you said so yourself and you get all defensive and upset if
someone so much as suggests it.
> then you went on and on and on and on and on and
> on about borderline.
Uh, where?
> But you are the one in DBT so we all know that this was projection on your part.
I went to DBT because I chose to go to DBT. BTW, I don't have an
official diagnosis of Borderline, only traits.
> Your biggest mistake was writing to the father of my child and telling him lies
> to try to get him to take our child away.
What the fuck are you talking about? I don't even know who the father of
your child *is*
> You're pretending to be my mother was just the icing on the cake.
I never pretended to be your mother either.
> The father of my child told me about your little
> scheme and how you have been writing to him for the past two weeks. You've
> been had.
No it's obvious you are accusing me of being someone else. Don't accuse
me of this shit unless you're prepared to prove it. I know you can't
because I wasn't the one who did any of it.
> That's right he told me EVERYTHING.
Uh, ok.
> Now you are finding out that I am not one to be messed with and you're angry
> because you are surprised and hurt now that I have finally gotten around to
> biting you back.
You're biting me back? You're doing nothing but blaming me for things I
didn't do.
> I had been ignoring all the letters to my child's father.
How the hell would I even know who he is or how to write to him?
> Still if you stop now I will stop. It's that easy Jennifer Pattison.
Fuck off, I never did any of it, Shawnie Vedder.
jenwolf
> Basically I have had it with Shawnee doing the crap she tries to do and has nothing to do with her "reality."
Actually, I think it has everything to do with her reality as someone
with Borderline Personality Disorder. Do some research on it and you
will see the pattern.
> I haven't attacked her for her pov. I am sick to death of her twisting things to make herself look the victim.
She's very good at that isn't she? It's too bad people buy into it and
send her further into denial and further away from help she needs.
> THAT is her reality. She believes she is unable to do anthing but be victimized. It's how she survives and getting the >sympathy. But she never works on how to stop being the victim. She's not weak and just a poor, innocent little single >mother of a fragile child.
I wouldn't go so far as to say she doesn't have problems at all, it's
obvious she does, but the turmoil she creates, especially with regard to
people who are trying to help or who are potentially friends, makes it
really hard for anyone to have any sympathy for her. Alot of people did
the same thing to me, so I have to feel sorry for her in that regard b/c
I know she is hurting. I can't take the stress of being the center of
her turmoil, though, so I'm not going to fight with her or be friendly
with her anymore. I really should, b/c when I was acting the way she is
I did desparately want *someone* to stick with me no matter what (and a
few people did). I guess I'm just weak b/c I can't take the stress, I'm
sorry I can't help you Shawnie. I'm sure you are a good person down in
there somewhere, but I just can't tolerate the turmoil you constantly
stir up. I hope you can just see your way into trying DBT or some other
kind of therapy/help that works for you.
> YOU are allowed to feel sorry for her but I have my reasons and until she quits crossposting, etc.
You are also allowed to feel any way you want about her and her
behavior. Don't let Gemini convince you that you aren't.
jenwolf
> oh how people love to gone on about shawnee, pick her apart, on and on, but I
> wasnt talking about shawnee, I have never talked about shawnee and I dont want
> to discuss shawnee. There is too much discussion about shawnee by het
> detractors.
Uh, excuse me, that's about all I've seen from you lately.
> I been talking about people like you who make these unfair, unjustifed,
> incessant, and relentless attacks on this and why YOU are doing that.
On what?
> If you people keep acting as one, collectively,
What people?
> Someone got on Shawnee,
Oops, thought you didn't want to discuss Shawnie.
> Perhaps all of you attacking her should go to google and review all your and
> her posts, with an OPENMIND, this time and see what you are doing here is
> appalling.
Snore.
> PS While there, look at the archives and check out how many times borderline
> personality is mentioned, and then how many times it being mentioned is due to
> someone labeling someone borderline because they cant find fault with their
> POV, but dont like the truth so call someone a borderline for daring to bring
> it up in gruops of people cling to false beliefs amd convictions.
I'm still waiting for the proof that I wrote to the father of her child
and posed as her mother.
jenwolf
> I see you are bent on not answering questions about your actions. Every time I
> ask you something about what you are doing, you tell me your opinions about
> what someone else is doing, or ask me questions.
The "opinions" are my answer to your questions. If you must know, no I
don't belong to any "sadist club," I'm just a mentally ill person who
gets really pissed off now and then, especially when someone blames me
for something I didn't do. Everyone's got their hot buttons, I'm sure
you do too, just a matter of finding them. As for asking you questions
so what? You don't think you should have to answer any?
> The question I have been asking is why you choose to abuse poster, Shawnee.
And I've given you the answer over and over. I'm done telling you why.
If you don't get it, forget it, stop asking, because you're too stupid
to understand.
> The fact you do is about you, not shawnee, not me but YOU. Its within you, now
> why do you do what you do.
That's right it's in me. Shawnie pissed me off by attacking me, I
attacked her back, she's amused by it, like only a Borderline could be.
> I'll rephase the question, are you this abusive in real life
Depends on the situation.
> to people who in yeis your habit OTo repeat the self,
Huh? Sorry, but I'm having trouble understanding your version of
English.
> and your actions and are willing to go to
> great lenghtogoiliYou really do not like answering questions, and refuse call
> My questions were eI see you neatly avoided answeringMy questions
Maybe you can try again, this time try in English, as an American, it's
the only language I understand. If you can't do that, don't bother
talking to me.
GeminiGal LV
>Message-id: <3b015465$0$12829$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net>
>
>GeminiGal LV wrote:
>
>> I see you are bent on not answering questions about your actions. Every
>time I
>> ask you something about what you are doing, you tell me your opinions about
>> what someone else is doing, or ask me questions.
>
>The "opinions" are my answer to your questions. If you must know, no I
>don't belong to any "sadist club," I'm just a mentally ill person who
>gets really pissed off now and then, especially when someone blames me
>for something I didn't do. Everyone's got their hot buttons, I'm sure
>you do too, just a matter of finding them. As for asking you questions
>so what? You don't think you should have to answer any?
>
>> The question I have been asking is why you choose to abuse poster, Shawnee.
>
>And I've given you the answer over and over. I'm done telling you why.
>If you don't get it, forget it, stop asking, because you're too stupid
>to understand.
>
>> The fact you do is about you, not shawnee, not me but YOU. Its within you,
>now
>> why do you do what you do.
>
>That's right it's in me. Shawnie pissed me off by attacking me,
You got pissed off at shawnee, when you perceived something shawnee posted as
an attack on you.
But why is it you perceived what she posted as an attack on you,
the entire rat pack believes the same thing, shawnee mere postin is an attack
and an affront to them. The fact she posts, revealing she is alive, and
breathing is an affront and perceived as an attack on you.
You have some problems, wqhen someones mere existence pisses you off nad makes
you angry and venoumous and so you become such an attack dog.
Same thing with the changing of addys, and crossposting, she chooses to include
among her posting habits. What s wrong with you and people who cannot cope
with the posting habits of others, with manners and respect for choices others
make you wouldnt?
The person most harmed by her changing addys is person changing it.
Fragmenting her posts like that, makes it harder for those who would support
her to follow her postings so we can.
I
>attacked her back, she's amused by it, like only a Borderline could be.
Your saying your borderline and attacks on you piss you off, and turn you into
an agry venoumous attack dog, while here amused reaction to attacks on her is
symptomatic of her being borderline?
Wow, that borderline dx certainly has an extremely wide range of ways it
manifests itself.
>
>> I'll rephase the question, are you this abusive in real life
>
>Depends on the situation.
>
The situation, or the person? Is it a case of if you can abuse another with no
consequences to yourself, you will?
Gemini
Pls send complaints re:Andrew Chmilewsky to his PO, (and not me), at:
Probation Dept.
Essex Co. Vicinage
60 Evergreen PL.
E Orange, NJ.07018
(Ms. Lamberts)
jenwolf
> shawnee mere postin is an attack and an affront to them.
Bullshit. I asked her a simple question and she thinks it's some signal
that I posed as her mother and as revenge for that she starts posting
intimate details on people she thinks are my husband and I. She earned
my attack on her.
> The fact she posts, revealing she is alive, and
> breathing is an affront and perceived as an attack on you.
God, would you get a grip already? You are about this >< close to being
plonked. Everything you say is way off center, ridiculous.
> Same thing with the changing of addys, and crossposting, she chooses to include
> among her posting habits. What s wrong with you and people who cannot cope
> with the posting habits of others, with manners and respect for choices others
> make you wouldnt?
It's simple. She tried to force me and everyone else who follows up to
her posts to crosspost as well or to crosspost to totally unrelated
groups. She did this by setting followup lines, sometimes even to groups
that *she* didn't originally cross/post to. It's obviously a game to
her, a game designed to annoy people. In the end I got annoyed and let
her know about it, and I don't think there was anything wrong with the
way I handled that. I didn't all out attack her until she blamed me for
ridiculous shit I didn't do, though, and perhaps I was a little harsh on
her.
> Fragmenting her posts like that, makes it harder for those who would support
> her to follow her postings so we can.
Say what?
> Your saying your borderline and attacks on you piss you off, and turn you into
> an agry venoumous attack dog, while here amused reaction to attacks on her is
> symptomatic of her being borderline?
Yes. One of the symptoms of Borderline PD is a poor concept of self. In
order to "feel alive" or to feel whole or just to know that they exist,
Borderlines will stir up shit any way possible. Once stirred, they can
be amused because they most likely are. They feel good, real, whole in a
crisis. It makes perfect sense, yes. Her amused reaction was probably
also another attempt to get me pissed off all the more, because it was
obvious that I was so upset. What better way to get someone even more
upset than to laugh at them being upset? Yes, her reaction could very
well be (and I believe it is a symptom of the disorder.)
> Wow, that borderline dx certainly has an extremely wide range of ways it
> manifests itself.
Not really.
> The situation, or the person?
The situation. A situation can include a specific person.
> Is it a case of if you can abuse another with no consequences to yourself, you will?
Certainly not. I've abused people I thought deserved it and it turned
out very detremental for me and my situation, even when I knew it was a
bad idea, that there would be bad consequences for me I've done it (no,
I'm not proud of doing any of that and I'm trying to stop doing it).
Shawnie does the same thing, she makes enemies where there are potential
friends. One thing about Borderline PD is that the person affected
desperately wants friendships, but at the same time can't stand them,
and at the same time again is terrified of being abandoned or rejected
in any way. It's very confusing and frustrating for the people who are
the focus of the Borderline's attention. I'm sorry for Shawnie. I
shouldn't have attacked her and I feel bad for her and for myself that I
was so angry about it, but I still think she provoked it purposely, both
to stir up trouble here and possibly with her mother as well.
jenwolf
> I wonder why it is no one can believe you Jennifer. Perhaps its the fact the
> spirit of all you post contains such venom, your attacks go for the jugular,
> your aim isnt to maim but to kill.
They can believe me because I do it all with this account and this email
address. I don't hide any of it behind remailers. I don't know who the
father of her child is, nor do I know his email address. If you think
you have evidence that proves I wrote to him or that proves that I posed
as her mother, or any other damned thing she's accusing me of, why don't
you present it? You threatened to, now I'm calling you on it. Show us
the evidence you have. I won't hold my breath b/c I know it's all
bullshit, more of Shawnie trying to stir up crap.
> While I do not see where any of the many many names you call Shawnee apply to
> Shawnee, every single one of the names you called her are the kind come to mind
> about you when I read your venomous posts.
You're entitled to your opinion.
Mad Hatter II
it is in here.
Lay version of DSM is titled, "Mental Illness Is A Game - The Players
Manual."
r
"jenwolf" <jen...@email.com> wrote in message
news:3b01904e$0$18890$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net...
jenwolf
>
> If mental illness is a game to you, it explains a whole bunch about how deep
> it is in here.
It's not a game to me, I was saying that the game Shawnie is playing is
a symptom of her mental illness.
lynx
> I have remained silent while people of your ilk have continously and
> incessantly and relentlessly ripped this poster to threads, while
you've got to at least try to understand *why* shawnee is being attacked.
it's because she's one annoying goddamned b*tch, that's why. technically,
that's not her fault - she has a personality disorder that does tend to
make people bitchy and extremely annoying, after all - but that in no way
diminishes her responsibility for her own actions, or obliges anybody to
like her in any way, for any action or quality of hers.
she's an adult. if the entire world hates her, she has several options.
demanding the entire world change its mind, forgive her anything and
everything she might ever have done or ever will do and immediately
commence loving her is not one. that is not how healthy adults function,
and borderline personality disorder does *not* mean she can, either.
the really painful thing about all this is seeing a presumably grown
woman consistently behaving like a petulant four-year-old, and having to
keep on treating her as if she was one, in the all too likely futile hope
it'll clue her in to her need to grow the fuck up already. it's
frustrating and enervating and annoying, which is a large part of why
some people treat her with a lot of annoyance.
> to understand where the people attacking her are coming from, and why
> this group is doing this to this poster. .
it's largely because she's a BPD who won't go to her bloody therapy
sessions, i'd say. and that's a perfectly good reason to treat her badly.
bipolar people who behave like jackasses on here in the throes of mania
get ripped on too, and i've seen some amazing flamewars centering on just
such people who six months later come back properly medicated and
balanced and are no trouble to anybody. i wish shawnee would.
such people get ripped on because they are MISBEHAVING, and since they're
over the age of majority, their illnesses are NO EXCUSE for it, and no
reason to let anything much slide. they're adults, and should take
responsibility for treating their own illnesses, and see to it they do
not misbehave; that much is simply expected of every adult everywhere.
ok, i'm done stating the obvious now. anything still unclear to you?
--
PGP/GnuPG key (ID 1024D/BFE0D6D0) available from keyservers everywhere
Key fingerprint = 3EBC 97FC 68AA 65F1 65E6 3D36 35F6 4213 BFE0 D6D0
"...life goes on
long after the thrill of living is gone..."
lynx
<gemin...@aol.com> wrote:
> Gees is everyone who attacks this woman going to deny what they are
> doing is attacking her?
at the time i posted what that was replying to, i had hardly ever said
two words about the woman! who the fudge are you, her evil twin? why are
you trying to smear me with an attack on somebody before i ever even got
the hell *started*?
>> if she thinks she's been
>>flamed already, she'd do well not to piss us off in earnest. she might
>>have crossed the wolf's threshold already, and mine is close.
> Oh, why is that?
because she's behaving like a stupid little spoiled brat bitch, that's
why i'm so close to my threshold. you seem to be working hard on getting
me to flame you, too - why? do you *want* a fight with me? you can just
say so, you know.
> Do you believe yourself to be VIP's
i believe myself to be a *person*. my relative importance really doesn't
matter; as a person, i'm entitled to some, if small, modicum of respect.
shawnee isn't displaying it, and you seem to be trying real hard not to,
either.
in case you stopped your social and interpersonal development in
kindergarten, that sort of thoughtless rudeness will get *anybody*
attacked, anywhere, and rightly so. it'd be a miracle if shawnee *wasn't*
attacked for it.
lynx
<Menthe...@classical.gr> wrote:
[...]
> You have been attacking me here for weeks.
she has been doing no such thing. you've got her started on it now,
through your own idiocy, but it certainly didn't start weeks ago.
what she *has* been doing is offering you honest criticism. because of
your personality disorder, you can't take that, and wrongly interpret it
as an attack, because she doesn't think the sun shines outta your arse,
which to you is insufficient adoration. and that, in short, why it's
called a *personality* disorder.
> You yourself admitted that I think that borderline is an insult,
how the FUCK can *she* admit to what *you* think? only you can _admit_ to
what your own internal mental state may be. she correctly surmised what
it was, but given even very simple knowledge of your disorder, that
really wasn't any stroke of genius.
> then you went on and on and on and
> on and on and on about borderline.
she's not your therapist, nor your mother. thus, she is not obliged to
treat you with kiddie gloves. YOU'RE NOT A CHILD, so stop acting
childish! she went on about borderline, because (1) that is your
condition, (2) you display all its worst traits in public, and (3) you
need to get off your arse and do something about it.
i have a few honest questions to ask you.
do you think your life sucks?
why do you think that is?
and what are you going to do about it?
*i* think your life surely must suck, given what you seem to think and
feel and how you keep on acting. i don't know why you think this is so,
but i can tell you it is *no* fault of the rest of the world's. the rest
of the world can, at most, be accused of indifference to you;
indifference is not hostility, however, and the rest of the world doesn't
give a shit about *any* of us, so you certainly can't expect it to treat
you any different.
> Your biggest mistake was writing to the father of my child
you're hallucinating. we don't even know who the guy is - it'd surprise
me to hear *you* know, in fact; if we ever find out, i'll let you know.
> and telling him lies to try to get him to take our child away.
if he has any acquaintance with you at all, i very much doubt anybody
needs to tell him anything to get him to try and do that. i'm a man, i
know something about men; and i tell you no man worth being called a man
would sleep easy knowing his child was being raised by a woman who kept
on consistently acting the way you do. you need to get therapy, shawnee,
before your child picks up on your behaviour and starts thinking it's
normal and accepted - because that behaviour would ruin her life as
surely as it will (already has?) ruined yours.
*you* have a personality disorder. please don't make it hereditary. for
your child's sake, get help.
[...]
> That's right he told me EVERYTHING.
you're psychotic, shawnee. everything we have ever had to do with you, or
your family, has been in public right here on the usenet.
> Now you are finding out that I am not one to be messed with
you're a little child, emotionally. i can't decide whether to be nice to
somebody so badly messed up, or whether to give you a good hard paddling
hoping it'll clear some of the clouds off your thinking, but if you keep
acting like you do for much longer, it'll be the rough treatment.
[...]
> When I come across people that I truly believe are paranoid I avoid
> them like the plague,
is it very difficult, trying to avoid yourself?
Mad Hatter II
Unless you are meaning to mold her real life issues into your definition of
a game.
What is JenWolf getting from all this has been the core here?
r
"jenwolf" <jen...@email.com> wrote in message
news:3b01a862$0$42882$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net...
lynx
<gemin...@aol.com> wrote:
> I wonder why it is no one can believe you Jennifer.
you're hallucinating, shawnie.
oh, and your little sock puppet game is up.
[...]
> While I do not see where any of the many many names you call Shawnee
> apply to Shawnee, every single one of the names you called her are the
> kind come to mind about you when I read your venomous posts.
there's where you give it away. "i'm rubber and you're glue" -
kindergarten sandbox insults; i hesitate to call this a symptom of BPD,
but it certainly is a symptom of being shawnee vedder.
bobwhelan
"lynx" <no...@nowhere.net> wrote in message
news:3b01a81d$0$14440$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net...
you dont get support if you are mentally ill..
Seems abit like a bank that only lends you money if you can prove you dont
need it..
or am I wrong?
bobwhelan
I think youve made your point man..
I mean she isnt even here ...?
GeminiGal LV
>From: "lynx" no...@nowhere.net
>Date: 5/15/01 2:03 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <3b01a81d$0$14440$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net>
I posses a different perspective entirely abgout the matter. What I think has
happened is people of a certain personality type got a foothold in this NG, and
have encouraged others with their personality traits to join in and discouraged
others so there is this malignancu here inbred, by a sort of weeding of other
personality types from the NG than those already here.
Lots of us with different personality types than the one dominating this group
would like to post here aobut bi polar disorder and our having it, and find
support here.
I personally started an incredible number of threads about bipolar, disorder
and my diesire discuss it. Maybe 30 or 40, fall flast as topic of discussions.
but, mention shawnee and I got a hundred times the replies I got to posts aobut
bi polar.
If this newsgroup is going to be a useful tool for me at all, this NG has to
change. And its not going to change if people like me just sit back and read
what you all write, because of what you all write, about shawnee, and anyone
else not of your particular pathologica personaltiy type.
Oly way this newgroup going to chang and be of use to so many others like me,
is if some of us begin posting along with shawnee.
L:uckily Newsgroups are fluid, and they will change with a change in the cast
of its contributors.
And they need to change because sometimes some malignancy in a newsgroup gets
entrenched, by the nature of people being attracted to remain like those
already here, and being different, desiring to leave where the mentality is so
repulsive to them.
Now I possess a need and desire to explore my being bipolar with others who are
bipolar, and i ma not of the rat pack attack mentality in strong evidence here.
so I am going to be working to bring in people who are repulsed by the popular
views entrenched here, so we become the majority, and you the minority and all
this rat pack attacking will finally end.
Shanee isnt the one been inhibitn my posting about a subject I dearly need to
disucss with others, its been the pack rat attack mentallity of all the others
here, been so intimidating and my problem.
Just look how many labels and names I been called in these posts today.
That settles it, this NG needs a change in composition of constituents, more
shawnees and geminis and less people only feel comfortable running in packs
like attack dogs.
GeminiGal LV
>Message-id: <3b01a986$0$14445$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net>
>
>In article <20010514214556...@ng-fz1.aol.com>, "GeminiGal LV"
><gemin...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> Gees is everyone who attacks this woman going to deny what they are
>> doing is attacking her?
>
>at the time i posted what that was replying to, i had hardly ever said
>two words about the woman! who the fudge are you, her evil twin?
No, but since the perception of people here is based solely upon whether they
agree with one or not I gather I am now to be made out to be her evil twin, for
questioning the actions of those who are in the habit of discrediting in any
way they can anyone who disagrees with their actions.
why are
>you trying to smear me with an attack on somebody before i ever even got
>the hell *started*?
>
I asked you a straightforward question, about a statement you made, which I
wasnt sure how to interpret having recieved on a ng where the some people have
delusions they are superior to others,, and others have made the effort to
impress me with the fact that if I cross them, in any way shape or form they
will make me very very sorry.
I was just wanting to know which you were doing, expressing your belief you
were superior, or expressing you are dangerous.
I prefer to know such things, where one of the interpretation of your comments
might be that your suggesting your dangerous.
>> if she thinks she's been
>>>flamed already, she'd do well not to piss us off in earnest. she might
>>>have crossed the wolf's threshold already, and mine is close.
>
>> Oh, why is that?
>
>because she's behaving like a stupid little spoiled brat bitch, that's
>why i'm so close to my threshold. you seem to be working hard on getting
>me to flame you, too - why? do you *want* a fight with me? you can just
>say so, you know.
>
>> Do you believe yourself to be VIP's
>
>i believe myself to be a *person*. my relative importance really doesn't
>matter; as a person, i'm entitled to some, if small, modicum of respect.
>shawnee isn't displaying it, and you seem to be trying real hard not to,
>either.
>
>in case you stopped your social and interpersonal development in
>kindergarten, that sort of thoughtless rudeness will get *anybody*
>attacked, anywhere, and rightly so. it'd be a miracle if shawnee *wasn't*
>attacked for it.
>
>--
> PGP/GnuPG key (ID 1024D/BFE0D6D0) available from keyservers everywhere
> Key fingerprint = 3EBC 97FC 68AA 65F1 65E6 3D36 35F6 4213 BFE0 D6D0
> "...life goes on
> long after the thrill of living is gone..."
>
>
>
>
>
>
Pls send complaints re:Andrew Chmilewsky to his PO, (and not me), at:
Mad Hatter II
The 'they did sumping wrong' song.
The 'WE say it so it must be right' plight.
The 'i can make them change so i don't have to' clue.
r
"HOppER" <GaHO...@yep.gov> wrote in message
news:dg13gt4hrppq0tb8t...@4ax.com...
On Wed, 16 May 2001 00:12:23 +0100, "bobwhelan"
<bobw...@ntlworld.com> informed me of this:
<A bit odd a mental heath support group where
<you dont get support if you are mentally ill..
<
<Seems abit like a bank that only lends you money if you can prove you
dont
<need it..
<
<or am I wrong?
Our point in this whole thing is giving support does not mean to give
in to someone who really needs to have clear cut borders of acceptable
behavior set for them.
GeminiGal LV
>Date: 5/15/01 12:05 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <3b01904e$0$18890$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net>
But your borderline and your not expressing any amusement, or is your anger and
venom some kiind of facade, and your greatly amused to participate in all this?
Gemini
GeminiGal LV
>Message-id: <3b019215$0$18897$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net>
You were not the wolf in sheeps clothing I spoke about, sorry you thought you
were and got upset and replied out of guilt. or something.
But you were not alone in thinking you were the person, when you werent. Seems
lots of people have some personal guilty made them thin k they were the party I
was referring to in my original post.
Theres just so many of you bashing shawnee, and feeling guilty about it you
thought you were the one specifically refereed to.
That is sad....
GeminiGal LV
>Date: 5/15/01 2:54 PM Pacific Standard Time
>Message-id: <3b01b443$0$42883$1dc6...@news.corecomm.net>
>
>In article <20010515111155...@ng-fa1.aol.com>, "GeminiGal LV"
><gemin...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> I wonder why it is no one can believe you Jennifer.
>
>you're hallucinating, shawnie.
>oh, and your little sock puppet game is up.
>
attempt to dismiss opinions you disagree with.
But you are making a mistake, cause this is really Gemini, and thats easy
enough for savvy usenet posters on this group to have determined by now.
And, I am expressing my opinion about whats what on here, and that shawnee is
not alone with some of the pov she has, though the pack rat attack mentality
entrenched here has been intimidating enough for people who disagree with your
version of reality here to inform you of the fact that the matchbook being held
up sure looks different on the side I am looking at, that the people here say
it looks like from their line of vision.
Gemini
>[...]
>> While I do not see where any of the many many names you call Shawnee
>> apply to Shawnee, every single one of the names you called her are the
>> kind come to mind about you when I read your venomous posts.
>
>there's where you give it away. "i'm rubber and you're glue" -
>kindergarten sandbox insults; i hesitate to call this a symptom of BPD,
>but it certainly is a symptom of being shawnee vedder.
>
>--
> PGP/GnuPG key (ID 1024D/BFE0D6D0) available from keyservers everywhere
> Key fingerprint = 3EBC 97FC 68AA 65F1 65E6 3D36 35F6 4213 BFE0 D6D0
> "...life goes on
> long after the thrill of living is gone..."
>
>
>
>
>
>
Pls send complaints re:Andrew Chmilewsky to his PO, (and not me), at:
Mad Hatter II
r
"GeminiGal LV" <gemin...@aol.comnojunk> wrote in message
news:20010515203446...@ng-fa1.aol.com...
lord_terabyte_and_th...@cox-internet.com
wrote:
>I posses a different perspective entirely abgout the matter. What I think has
>happened is people of a certain personality type got a foothold in this NG, and
>have encouraged others with their personality traits to join in and discouraged
>others so there is this malignancu here inbred, by a sort of weeding of other
>personality types from the NG than those already here.
>
>Lots of us with different personality types than the one dominating this group
>would like to post here aobut bi polar disorder and our having it, and find
>support here.
Well, some may not agree with me, but this really isn't a support
group anymore. The support is best found on the moderated group now.
I'm not saying that we should give up on trying to be supportive here,
but things have really changed...
caroly~vonne®
>IF the person leading the attack against
>shawnee backs off and suggests his
>followers do the same, then I will be
>satisfied.
OK. I want to know who this leader is cause I got pissed at Shawnee all
on my own with no help or encouragement from anyone else here. Do you
think there is some commitee on asdm that decides what "our" next move
is?
caroly~vonne®
>oh how people love to gone on about
>shawnee, pick her apart, on and on, but I
>wasnt talking about shawnee, I have
>never talked about shawnee and I dont
>want to discuss shawnee. There is too
>much discussion about shawnee by het
>detractors.
You weren't talking about Shawnee??? That's all you've talked about the
past few days. One of us, or maybe both of us is confused.
>I been talking about people like you who
>make these unfair, unjustifed, incessant,
>and relentless attacks on this and why
>YOU are doing that.
Uhhh, now wait a minute. If you've been following this whole shebang did
you not see Jenwolf interacting with Shawnee in a way not many of us
can? It was friendly and fun and not at all agressive. I thought this
was pretty cool because Jen has been working hard at understanding
what's going on with herself. I was hoping that Shawnee would be able to
accept advice given her by Jen if she "respected" her. But when Jenwolf
asked why she crossposts, etc, Shawnee started getting all riled up. Jen
didn't "attack" her at all. She didn't attack her "beliefs" or her
"reality." Next thing you know, all hell is breaking loose and Shawnee
is telling Jen fuck you. The reason she gave for putting all those other
groups in the return path was "because I can." THAT is what pissed me
off---that total lack of respect. That fuck you attitude. Certainly
does not make one feel all loving and cuddly.
>If you people keep acting as one,
>collectively, I am going to take up
>andrews theme, and start calling you all
>BORG, becaue you from all appearance
>you only possess a conscious in the
>collective, and are unable to think for
>yourselves as individuals.
Oh my....now that's gentle, loving and forgiving of you. Yeah, you
turning into Andrew would be the real kicker. Think about that statement
for awhile.
Don't be such a cornball. Of course we think for ourselves and each of
us has had some kind of encounter with her which endeared her to
us...NOT. Go ahead and call me borg. That's not the worst thing I've
ever been called. Puts you on about the same level as...oh I don't
know...maybe one of us borgs?
>Someone got on Shawnee, and you all
>jumped on the bandwagon, offering totally
>>shit excuses for your doing so.
>>Perhaps all of you attacking her should go
>to google and review all your and her
>posts, with an OPENMIND, this time and
>see what you are doing here is appalling.
HMMMMMM....I see you are still not talking about Shawnee. Nobody jumped
on any band wagon. She has willfully manipulated posters to the group
over and over and over again. She has a history with most of us. This is
nothing new. Just history repeating.....the same pattern.
>Gemini
Gemini the righteous. Look I've had no beef with you and what you have
done re: andrew. But this is different. You don't have to like it. But
just tell me this...why do you think it has happened over and over again
with Shawnee? Do you really believe she is an innocent who gets
"attacked" for no reason whenever she shows up here? That all of us are
these raving lunatics who are out for blood? Do you really never see the
provocation that she uses? Do you not read any of her posts where she's
posted personal info re: some poster? Haven't you been aware of some
forged postings being sent with the intent of getting them crossposted
and therefor making _YOU_ out to be some filthy crep. She's very good at
stirring up shit and when all hell breaks loose she sits back and says
"what did _I_ do?" like she didn't have a hand in it. I'm not sure if
she does it conciously, but THAT is the truth here.
>PS While there, look at the archives and
>check out how many times borderline
>personality is mentioned, and then how
>many times it being mentioned is due to
>someone labeling someone borderline
>because they cant find fault with their
>POV, but dont like the truth so call
>someone a borderline for daring to bring >it
>up in gruops of people cling to false
>beliefs amd convictions.
I'm really tired so I'm not sure if I understand what you are saying.
But it sounds a lot like you think we're all lemmings. Also, I don't
understand what you think is the trigger for anger with Shawnee. Do you
think her complaints about HMOs are what sets me off? No, it's the
personal campaigns she goes on to agitate someone. That is not some
"truth" or "reality" or "healthy."
>Complaints Re: Andrew Chmilewsky
>being accepted by:.
Do you realize that every time you post admonishing us for "attacking"
Shawnee, you are doing the same thing with that complaints Re: Andrew
line? Oh, but that's different.
I'm sorry that you feel I'm behaving so badly. I dislike getting angry
and I've worked pretty hard at letting things be rather than getting
into a rage. It is not typical of me to get into it with anyone here or
IRL or that matter. I do work at keeping love in my heart and I have
considered your arguements. Perhaps there is somewhere in there, some
truth to what you say. You said yourself that when one is attacked it's
natural to defend oneself. Well it's a two-way street my dear and
Shawnee has taken some pretty good potshots at people here. No one is
completely innocent or else we wouldn't be here. So maybe I'll get some
growth out of it, but I sincerely doubt that Shawnee will see her part
in the whole thing as anyhing but the innocent victim once again. Poor
Shawnee.
carol
caroly~vonne®
was great because I sort of have watched you go through some very
difficult times and work at coping with having to be here (living I
mean).
You _have_ been treated disrespectfully when you seemed difficult. And I
liked you when you were/are difficult because you could see that even if
you were so depressed you saw nothing but suicide as the solution, you
were desperately trying to go beyond that, to just be able to have a
good day today, to not just repeat the same behavior over & over. And
yes, I think some of us realized that you were really wanting someone to
stick by you. (You are lucky to have a good man who conveys is love and
respect for you when he posts. I got a good one too.) Although I don't
consider suicide every day, I still consider it an option. I can really
relate to that so I felt a connection there.
Re: borderline...LOL. I know this is unkind but everytime she has been
told that she's borderline, she wigs out, denies it and then pulls some
stunt like forging a post or accusations that are truly bizarre. That
just makes me think even more that she's borderline! All that is, is a
dx for god's sake. Ya take the same damn meds and therapy can do wonders
for most everyone. The sad part is, that is how she copes--just
repeating the same behavior and never understanding why & how she pisses
people off. She doesn't see her behavior towards oher people as a
problem.
Hell...I'm sick to death of the whole thing too and tired of the weird
shit she pulls _whatever_ her justification. My husband is dx'd
schizoaffective and pretty paranoid and when he is delusional his
beliefs, his reality is a very frightening world.Those weird thoughts
are absolutely real to him and I can never do anything to assure him
it's ok. Thank god his meds work pretty well and he is very compliant
because it allows him to enjoy things again. My only wish for Shawnee is
that she gets meds that help her, so she can enjoy things also. And she
stay on them even if she has to beg, borrow or steal to get them. (When
I've written to her before telling her that, she's taken it as an attack
and gone through the song and dance we've been privy to recently.) It
sucks to be on either end of paranoia. It's also very hard to live with
a paranoid person. Takes a lot of energy. I really do have compassion
for her, but every time I've extended my hand she's made it clear that
she holds grudges and she likes to "get even". So I like to keep my
distance.
Anyway, this is it for me too. I'd rather use that energy to work in the
garden or go ride the horses.
carol
caroly~vonne®
Jen wrote:
>Certainly not. I've abused people I thought
>deserved it and it turned out very
>detremental for me and my situation, even
>when I knew it was a bad idea, that there
>would be bad consequences for me I've
>done it (no, I'm not proud of doing any of
>that and I'm trying to stop doing it).
>Shawnie does the same thing, she makes
>enemies where there are potential friends.
>One thing about Borderline PD is that the
>person affected desperately wants
>friendships, but at the same time can't
>stand them, and at the same time again is
>terrified of being abandoned or rejected in
>any way. It's very confusing and
>frustrating for the people who are the
>focus of the Borderline's attention. I'm
>sorry for Shawnie. I shouldn't have
>attacked her and I feel bad for her and for
>myself that I was so angry about it, but I
>still think she provoked it purposely, both
>to stir up trouble here and possibly with
>her mother as well.
You know, this is like you have expressed my very ruminations on "What
Makes Shawnee Tick?" I know you, jen and I haven't be emailing each
other behind the scenes to see where the other stands and I know I
haven't corresponded with Hopper re:shawnee's behavior. In fact I really
haven't discussed it with anyone, let alone some imaginary collective
"we". Or anyone else for that matter. So isn't it interesting that we
all are finding, independently, the very same BEHAVIORAL PROBLEMS. Just
where the hell is that conspiracy meeting? Anyway...
carol
caroly~vonne®
>I wonder why it is no one can believe you
>all you post contains such venom, your
>attacks go for the jugular, your aim isnt to
>maim but to kill.
Just where did you get the idea no one believes her? You didn't poll me.
and I absolutely 100% agreement with her.
BTW, have you looked at the venom posted by your little angel. She can
dish it out but boy she can't take it. and on top of that she pulls all
kinds of games with forgery and misdirection, not to mention lies about
me destroying an as yet unnamed newsgroup. Yeah, you better believe I'm
gonna explode when she lies like that..
caroly~vonne®
>If mental illness is a game to you, it >explains a whole bunch about
how deep >it is in here.
RICHARD IF YOU CAN'T KEEP UP TAKE NOTES!!! She said to & about Shawnee,
a game to her.
carol-------->>You say I'm a bitch like it's a bad thing....