More test results for Steve K.
Jeannie
following radiation was 0.003. The rad onc said this would probably happen
and not to panic as it's the next reading in six months that we need to pay
attention to. So, we're being optimistic, will enjoy the holidays and look
forward to a lower PSA reading in May.
Thanks Steve, for all you do.
Jean
Steve Kramer
news:hdse3g$p94$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
: Larry's three month post EBRT PSA was 0.014. The reading immediately
: following radiation was 0.003. The rad onc said this would probably
happen
: and not to panic as it's the next reading in six months that we need to
pay
: attention to. So, we're being optimistic, will enjoy the holidays
You have earned it! And, I believe the optimism, at least for the near
term, is warranted. Were I you, I'd be happy to have his PSA bounce around
under 0.10 for the rest of his life.
--
PSA 16 10/17/2000 @ 46
Biopsy 11/01/2000 G7 (3+4), T2c
RRP 12/15/2000 G7 (3+4), T3cN0M0 Neg margins
PSA <.1 <.1 <.1 .27 .37 .75 PSAD 0.19 years
EBRT 05-07/2002 @ 47
PSA .34 .22 .15 .21 .32 PSAD .056 years
Lupron 07/03 (1 mo) 8/03 and every 4 months there after
PSA .07 .05 .06 .09 .08 .132 .145 PSAD 1.4 years
Casodex added daily 07/06
PSA undetectable since; last checked on 06/04/09
Illegitimati non carborundum
Alan Meyer
Jean,
For whatever it's worth, I have read that men who reach a PSA
nadir (low point) below 0.2 rarely have recurrences of the
disease. Even 0.4 is considered pretty good and likely to be
a cure.
Radiation doesn't kill all the cancer at once. It damages
the cancer cells but some of them take months or even years to
die. They can continue to produce PSA during that time. It
doesn't mean that the patient has new, actively growing cancer
cells in his body. They may all be just old dying ones.
I know that you can't help being concerned, but I wouldn't be
too worried.
Good luck.
Alan
Steve Kramer
news:he1am2$db2$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
: For whatever it's worth, I have read that men who reach a PSA
: nadir (low point) below 0.2 rarely have recurrences of the
: disease. Even 0.4 is considered pretty good and likely to be
: a cure.
My goal, based on the experiences of those reported here, was to get under
0.150. I got TO 0.150, but not beneath. Within a year of EBRT, I was on
ADT.
That said, I would have been ecstatic at 0.014.
Jeannie
> My goal, based on the experiences of those reported here, was to get under
> 0.150. I got TO 0.150, but not beneath. Within a year of EBRT, I was on
> ADT.
>
> That said, I would have been ecstatic at 0.014.
Larry has always had a history of very low PSA's ... it was below 5 when he
was diagnosed in 2006 and had a G8, or was it G9, after surgery. (Don't
have the paper work in front of me, sorry.)
After surgery in Sept. of '06 his PSA went down to <0.008 and then steadily
climbed to 0.10 in April of this year. The cancer was back. Again, with a
PSA that anyone else would be thrilled to have! So, for his PSA to go from
0.003 to 0.014 in three months is unsettling. If the oncology radiologist
hadn't already told us that this might happen, and not to panic, we would
be! But since he said to wait six months and see what happens, we're okay
with it.
Don't know what else to say other than low numbers -- in Larry's case --
mean nothing!!!
Jean
Steve Kramer
: Don't know what else to say other than low numbers -- in Larry's case --
: mean nothing!!!
There has been a long standing debate herein; one side of which opines that
hundredths or thousandths of one nanogram of PSA in anybody's case means
nothing.
Jeannie
others -- probably so. :o)
And the debate goes on.
"Steve Kramer" <skr...@cinci.rr.com> wrote in message
news:he4cgh$4j3$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Steve Kramer
: Generally speaking, probably not. In Larry's case -- and probably many
: others -- probably so. :o)
:
: And the debate goes on.
That's not the optimistic Jeannie we've all come to know and love. :-)
Jeannie
low numbers that Larry has and says I should be thrilled, they just don't
realize that his cancer came back and his PSA was ONLY 0.10. And it has
gone up .011 in three months and for him, that's significant. Not for
anyone else, I know. I get that! It's just frustrating, I guess.
"Steve Kramer" <skr...@cinci.rr.com> wrote in message
news:he4g4b$ir2$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Steve Kramer
: Oh, I'm optimistic -- have to be. But when everyone talks about wanting
: low numbers that Larry has and says I should be thrilled, they just don't
: realize that his cancer came back and his PSA was ONLY 0.10. And it has
: gone up .011 in three months and for him, that's significant. Not for
: anyone else, I know. I get that! It's just frustrating, I guess.
The alternative is a higher PSA. And, 0.003 was 3/100ths of 0.10. And
0.014 is only 14/100ths of 0.10. And Thanksgiving and Christmas and a whole
new year will occur before you find out I was right. :-)
fred
I was diagnosed with PSA of less than 4.0 at age 54, with G7 (3+4)
with extraprostatic extensions,went down to 0.003 after surgery, PSA
went up to 0.110 after 3 years, did salvage radiation, went back down
to 0.008, now climbing slowly back to 0.090 6 years after surgery.
I thought (actually still think) that my cancer just expresses less
PSA than most. Doctors I have consulted generally say they don't buy
that theory; they say low numbers are low numbers.
Either way, in Larry's case, 0.014 is pretty darn good.
As for me, 0.090 isn't enough to get me doing anything yet by way of
further treatment, but I'll admit that the steady rise from 0.008 has
got my attention....
Fred
Alan Meyer
I didn't realize when I made my first posting that Larry had surgery
before radiation. That changes the interpretation of the numbers.
I don't know if there is such a thing as big cancer with small PSA,
but I know others here have expressed the view that that can occur.
I'm guessing a medical oncologist who specializes in PSA will no a
lot more about that than must urologists.
Still, for both Larry and Fred, we're still talking about really, really
small numbers. These numbers are very far from reaching a point where
the cancer could become dangerous or symptomatic. I think it's very
reasonable to hope that:
1. It may be years before more treatment is needed.
2. The standard treatment for recurrent cancer (ADT) may work for
years more.
3. During all of those years, some of the new therapies like
Abiraterone, Provenge, and others will become available, giving
still more years.
If I were forced to bet money on the outcomes, I'd put my money on
both of you surviving PCa.
Alan
Jeannie
both of you surviving PCa.
From your mouth to God's ears, Alan!! :o) Thank you.
>
"Alan Meyer" <ame...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:he78e9$mvk$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
Alan Meyer
> Alan said: If I were forced to bet money on the outcomes, I'd put my
> money on
> both of you surviving PCa.
>
>
> From your mouth to God's ears, Alan!! :o) Thank you.
Jeannie,
I'm hoping it happens. But in addition, I'd like to suggest some
more things. Larry's probably already doing them but just in
case he isn't, I think they might help.
He should adopt as healthy a lifestyle as he can. That means a
good diet with lots of vegetables and little fat, and lots of
exercise. This is particularly important on ADT because the loss
of testosterone will tend to make him gain weight and lose
muscle and bone mass. That doesn't have to happen however.
Watching his diet and exercising hard can keep his weight down
and his strength up. It can contribute to well being and good
spirits and it just might strengthen his immune system too to
help fight the cancer.
There are also supplements that a lot of people take. I am not
an expert on this and there are a lot of people giving advice on
supplements who, in my opinion, don't have good evidence for what
they're recommending, but there are some supplements that do have
some experimental support.
One report that impressed me was a study of pomegranate juice
that took two groups of men, one that drank pomegranate juice
every day and one that didn't. If I remember correctly, the ones
who didn't were said to have doubled their PSA every 15 months
while the ones who did were said to have doubled every 60 months.
That's a HUGE slowdown in the progression of the cancer.
I don't know if it's real or not. One study is not enough. We
need confirmation. But it impressed me enough that I take a
pomegranate extract pill every day and, if I were in Larry's
shoes I might take 2 or 3. A friend of mine with very advanced
cancer was told to take 5 pills a day by his oncologist. I get
mine over the Internet from Puritan's Pride. I don't remember
the price but I don't think they're too expensive.
Some other things people have taken include Vitamin C, Vitamin D,
Lycopene, Resveratrol, and maybe other things. They won't cure
Larry, but they don't need to. All they need to do is to slow
down the growth of the disease so that he can live with it. Who
knows, maybe they can help with that.
Best of luck.
Alan