"A Journey from the Haphazard to the Deliberate."
Mr Jherek Chamaeleo
Does sperm have personality, that look upon your face !
Whilst it may be difficult for some of you to swallow.
It is the seed of the human race.
Taste the sword of degeneration, when you masterbate
hu do you think of , grasping each
little death, how, to whom, what, & where do you cry ?
Watch mud returning to the watery clay. When peeling apples
enjoy sharing the skin.
bitter for some
ya zawdgyi says "mmm"
getting ready for the apple pie to cum
fried jack morgan
> "A Journey from the Haphazard to the Deliberate."
>
> Does sperm have personality, that look upon your face !
> Whilst it may be difficult for some of you to swallow.
> It is the seed of the human race.
>
> Taste the sword of degeneration, when you masterbate
> hu do you think of , grasping each
> little death, how, to whom, what, & where do you cry ?
Why do you sorrow over that publically here other than to arouse
yourself through your own public humiliation?
Why relive the earlier humiliations of your life?
Mr Jherek Chamaeleo
learn how to
relieve the earlier humiliations of your life
fried jack morgan
Not with you. You don't know how to do it properly.
Thotful560
thanks for this.
People: this is not about jherek or even about what it seems.
Don't most of you know that one of the many ways to teach is to be humiliated?
it's not just wearing a bag of walnuts in the market!
think and
read this with a different eye.
teresa
Thotful560
ernobe
Eric Twose
Dear Teresa,
I would imagine that perhaps 1% (at alt.sufi and alt.islam.sufism) would see
him as some kind of crazed or secret saint.
Most likely 99% of the good folk here and at alt.autos.sport.rally,
alt.economics, alt.surrealism, and soc.culture.burma (who are not looking
for subtle deeper meanings amidst the masturbation and spermatozoa of this
pond life) would see Jherek's abusive cross-posting for what it really is --
abusive and annoying cross-posting.
Is it not said that a real teacher addresses people in accordance with their
understanding?
Best Wishes,
Eric.
fried jack morgan
posts. Here the word "relieve" can refer to sexual relief.
Two, there are many other people and examples of people who have relived
earlier life humiliations publically, and in healthier and much more
beneficial ways than Jherek. Many famous writers and poets and
playwrights have done so in a way that enlightened and informed, and not
by going around to various newsgroups and discussion sites and just
posting off-topic sexual material such as Jherek does. Type his name
into Google and you will find out just how much of this he has done.
Jherek does not want to be helped. He wants to wreck things for others
to get even for what was done to him. And he doesn't care if he wrecks
things for innocents or not. To him the only innocent in the world is
him.
But I am more than willing to let you have him.
fried jack morgan
But one can rob it of its teaching potential by converting it or
attempting to convert it into sexual titillation.
fried jack morgan
Jherek's postings.
Mr Jherek Chamaeleo
rebuilding atlantis in the bay of bengal
ba nana ama g ana
khin nyunt understand what eye meme
Thotful560
>But I am more than willing to let you have him.
>
That was not called for.
All I asked was what criteria did you use... to ascertain that you can really
*know* someone through their postings on Google.
Things are not always what they seem.
I believe this safely applies to all of us, at one point or another.
Often things that are annoying or obnoxious or hateful are so, through OUR
filters.
We bring alot of ourselves into what we think jherek is or says, with our
conditioning and our filters and our assumptions. that's what I meant.
Wasalaam,
teresa
Mr Jherek Chamaeleo
know one
fried jack morgan
taken in ways other than I intended. My intention with that line was to
try to say that I will gladly step out of the way and let you do what
you think is necessary or not with him.
Since I did not phrase it carefully enough to convey that message, I
apologize.
One does not need to really *know* someone to know that there is
something wrong. After all, does a doctor need to really *know* you to
know that you have a cold when you have a runny nose and a cough? Or
anyone else, for that matter?
You spend enough time among certain types of people, you start noticing
some of the patterns of their behavior, including some of the ones that
make them distinct from other types.
fried jack morgan
like Jherek. Most of them were thoughtful enough to not push it into
people's faces like Jherek does, but there were some that did like to do
that. You meet those kind face to face and you can pick up the
aggression behind it in their body language and voice tones. After a
while you learn that violation of boundaries like Jherek shows here and
other places on the web is usually due to aggression or mental illness
(or both). Great fear can do the same thing, but Jherek does not, to my
mind, write like a paranoid schizophrenic.
Mr Jherek Chamaeleo
cumming to the doctor with a cold
complaining of a runny nose
watering eyes rumi knows
best pursue some open questions to discover whats energy the matter !
Thotful560
>I apologize for that line. Looking at it again I see that it can be
>taken in ways other than I intended. My intention with that line was to
> try to say that I will gladly step out of the way and let you do what
>you think is necessary or not with him.
That was kind of you, and apology accepted, of course.
>After all, does a doctor need to really *know* you to
>know that you have a cold when you have a runny nose and a cough?
the thing about the internet is that we are not face to face, in person as we
might be with our favorite MD....
>You spend enough time among certain types of people, you start noticing
>some of the patterns of their behavior, including some of the ones that
>make them distinct from other types.
And you may be wrong, because you are going on the assumption that you are
right.
I am not saying that you should not draw distinctions-just that the conclusions
any of us make are liable to be flawed...both due to the flawed medium they are
presented in, and our own quirks that condition us to see things/people/posts a
particular way.
posting kernels of truth amongst obscenities is not a new sufi activity.
The crudeness serves as a screening device.
if it chased you away or put you off then you don't *need* to hear whatever
else is there, but others might.
Anything can teach, even a *dirty* word.
Because what you find repugnant tells you something more about yourself than it
tells about the writer or speaker of the word.
Wasalaam,
teresa
Thotful560
It's odd, but I don't see jherek at all the way you do.
I find little aggression in the posts that I read here at alt.sufi.
> After a
>while you learn that violation of boundaries like Jherek shows here and
>other places on the web is usually due to aggression or mental illness
Again, I don't see that in the same way you do.
While I agree that the posts seem to make little logical sense..they are not at
all deranged, or senseless. in fact, I find in them many puns and multiple
meanings..but that is what I am looking for.
such as *feeling al fil* which literally means feeling the elephant..which is
again a sufi teaching story in the most specific sense. To me that's a
pertinent remark.
You felt one part of the elephant fjm, while I have felt another here and while
we are talking about the same animal...we are not each seeing the others
portion!
or *best pursue some open questions to discover what's energy the matter!*
I admit that it may seem a bit disjointed... but hhhmmm....makes you wonder.
So where's an open question when we need one?
wasalaam,
teresa
fried jack morgan
I do not speak Arabic. I have not been able to find an online Romanized
Arabic to English dictionary in order to translate the Arabic that
gets thrown around here.
I have given up asking most people to translate for me for two reasons
-- one, the concepts do not always translate well, and two, not everyone
responds to requests to translate.
What is left afterwards, I agree, has multiple meanings and puns, but so
does Finnegan's Wake, by James Joyce, from what I understand. Have you
tried reading that?
As far as the aggression, I'll not argue with you on that. I've met far
too many people who coat their anger with a layer of words calling it
something else, whether they call it patriotism, or education, or love,
or what have.
Me, I grew up a hick, back country farm boy, so's I guess all this is
just too much over my head.
fried jack morgan
Sorry, Jherek, I do not really speak or understand any language other
than English. As I pointed out to another, I grew up a hick,
back-country farm boy, so I am not as sophisticated as to be able to
understand what you mean. You would be better off posting to someone
else other than I.
This is about all I can get out of your post above.
Atlantis -- a falsehood built out of a myth based upon a legend.
bay of bengal -- a bay named Bengal existing, I assume, in Burma.
eye -- visual organ
meme -- basic unit of cultural transmission
As there appears to be support for your posts here, I shall go elsewhere.
fjm
Eric Twose
A Journey from the Haphazard to the Deliberate
aka The King & The Handmaiden
ONCE upon a time, there lived a king in a beautiful land. One day, on his
way to the palace in his coach, the king saw a handmaiden sitting by the
road. The pretty slave girl stole his heart, and the king desired to have
her. So he sent a servant to recompense her master and then brought her to
his palace.
As the days passed, the poor maiden in captivity became sick, lost weight,
and grew paler every day. Every time the king went to see her, she refused
him. And so the king sent for the royal physicians, who were the best
doctors in all the land, offering valuable gifts and rewards to whoever
could cure the girl - but to no avail. Not one of them could diagnose the
illness, let alone prescribe an effective treatment.
Deeply discouraged and worried about his beloved, the king ran to the temple
to pray. He wailed for hours, imploring God from the depths of his heart to
cure his beloved. Finally, exhausted from weeping, he fell asleep. The Lord,
Who had heard his prayers, spoke to him in a dream: "Tomorrow a Divine
Physician will come to your town. He has the cure for the girl."
The next morning, the king went with his companions to the gates of the city
to await the Doctor. In the distance they spied a man approaching. When he
drew closer and the king saw his face, his body began shaking. The radiant
presence of the Doctor had taken over his soul, and he began to cry, saying,
"I realize now that I have been seeking You, not the girl. She was but an
excuse, and the cause of my awakening now."
The Doctor was brought to the palace, and he asked to be alone with the
maiden. After talking gently to the girl and reassuring her that her secrets
would be safe with him, the Doctor asked about her past. While he felt her
pulse, the girl told him where she was from and what her duties had been
before the king bought her. There was no change in her pulse. Then the
doctor asked about the places to which she had travelled. When he asked
about Samarkand, her pulse beat faster. He asked more about that city and
about the people she had met there. Finally, her pulse still beating
rapidly, the girl mentioned a certain goldsmith for whom she had worked for
a couple of years. The doctor had discovered her illness.
"Her problem is of the heart, not of the body," he pronounced to the king.
"To cure this girl, you must follow my instructions." The king said that he
would obey the Doctor wholeheartedly. So the goldsmith was sent for with an
offer of money and property on the king's land. Tempted by the windfall, the
goldsmith left his family, home, and work immediately and moved to the new
town.
With the king's blessing, the handsome young man was married to the
beautiful maiden, and they took up residence in the royal palace. The couple
enjoyed their new life together for six months, by which time the girl had
fully recovered from her illness. At that point, the Doctor oredred a potion
made for the goldsmith to drink every morning. The concoction made him pale
and weak, and he became so ugly that his wife eventually fell out of love
with him. Finally, one day, the goldsmith, who had not gotten out of bed for
months, died, and the girl became free of his bond.
from "Tales from the Land of the Sufis"
Mojdeh Bayat and Mohammed Ali Jamnia, Shambhala.
---o---
If you wish to take part in this competition, please write an essay
with the Title: "A Journey from the Haphazard to the Deliberate."
Other than the title, the substance as to both form and contents are
entirely down to you. The competition will close on the 29th of this
month. Although there is no guarantee that a winner/s will be chosen,
in the event there are any, they are in for a surprise of a life time.
You can either post your entry to this forum and/or e-mail it to
huuu...@yahoo.com. Also feel free to distribute this invitation to
others who may be interested in Sufi studies.
All the best...
H
Eric Twose
"Mr Jherek Chamaeleo" wrote:
A Journey from the Haphazard to the Deliberate
aka The Legend of the Design
A man was once sent to prison for life for something which he had not done.
When he had behaved in an exemplary way for some months, his jailors began
to regard him as a model prisoner.
He was allowed to make his cell a little more comfortable; and his wife sent
him a prayer-carpet which she had herself woven.
When several more months had passed, this man said to his guards: 'I am a
metalworker, and you are badly paid. If you can get me a few tools and some
pieces of tin, I will make small decorative objects, which you can take to
the market and sell. We could split the proceeds, to the advantage of both
parties.'
The guards agreed, and presently the smith was producing finely-wrought
objects whose sale added to everyone's well-being.
Then, one day, when the jailers went to the cell, the man had gone. They
concluded that he must have been a magician.
After many years when the error of the sentence had been discovered and the
man was pardoned and out of hiding, the king of that country called him and
asked him how he had escaped.
The tinsmith said: 'Real escape is possible only with the correct
concurrence of factors. My wife found the locksmith who had made the lock on
my cell, and other locks throughout the prison. She embroidered the interior
designs of the locks in the rug which she sent me, on the spot where the
head is prostrated in prayer. She relied upon me to register this design and
to realize that it was the wards of the locks. It was necessary for me to
get materials with which to make the keys, and to be able to hammer and work
metal in my cell. I had to enlist the greed and need of the guards, so that
there would be no suspicion. That is the story of my escape.'
~ Retold by Idries Shah in 'The Magic Monastery', Octagon Press,
www.octagonpress.com
fried jack morgan
> Thank you for your reply Fjm...
> It's odd, but I don't see jherek at all the way you do.
> I find little aggression in the posts that I read here at alt.sufi.
>
>
>>After a
>>while you learn that violation of boundaries like Jherek shows here and
>>other places on the web is usually due to aggression or mental illness
>
>
> Again, I don't see that in the same way you do.
> While I agree that the posts seem to make little logical sense..they are not at
> all deranged, or senseless. in fact, I find in them many puns and multiple
> meanings..but that is what I am looking for.
>
> such as *feeling al fil* which literally means feeling the elephant..which is
> again a sufi teaching story in the most specific sense. To me that's a
> pertinent remark.
I rather think Jherek is referring to is feeling his own penis, when he
is talking about "feeling the elephant", when you consider the number of
his posts about masturbation and about his own masturbation in
particular. Referring to one's penis in such a fashion is a not
uncommon way of bragging among males. And some of Jherek's poems are
addressed to his own penis.
You are aware that there are certain kinds of mental illnesses where
religiosity, spirituality and sexuality get expressed innapproriately.
There will partial truths in them that the discerning person can
perceive, but there will be no completeness, because the person is
harmed, ill, or damaged.
>
> You felt one part of the elephant fjm, while I have felt another here and while
> we are talking about the same animal...we are not each seeing the others
> portion!
Please. I did not feel Jherek's "elephant". I won't touch the rest of
your sentence there.
fried jack morgan
referring to his fingers encircling his erect penis (his "alif").
Again, I believe this usage of the word "alif" for an erect penis is not
completely uncommon, although in this case I do not know for certain.
I think if you start looking at his posts from the point of view of him
using spiritual and/or religious terminology for his own personal sexual
expression, you will find the disjointedness in his posts disappears.
Thotful560
>I rather think Jherek is referring to is feeling his own penis, when he
>is talking about "feeling the elephant", when you consider the number of
>his posts about masturbation and about his own masturbation in
>particular.
We each see what we want to see
>> You felt one part of the elephant fjm, while I have felt another here and
>while
>> we are talking about the same animal...we are not each seeing the others
>> portion!
I certainly was NOT referring to anyone's body parts..
I WAS referring to a thing unknown, that each person assumes he or she knows by
his own perceptions, and nothing more.
You are the one reading sexual content into MY post.
teresa
Jeffrey Qamar Nahaar
news:mj6Xb.83$M93....@news.uswest.net...
>
> You are aware that there are certain kinds of mental illnesses where
> religiosity, spirituality and sexuality get expressed innapproriately.
> There will partial truths in them that the discerning person can
> perceive, but there will be no completeness, because the person is
> harmed, ill, or damaged.
Regardless of if one assumes that Jherek's posts are the result of his own
limited mental state or a clever diagnosis of the state of this forum and/or
the larger world, the same essential question remains:
How can such a state be corrected?
If it's a form of mental illness, how is it treated?
If it's a matter of conditions that limit to a Seeker's progress, how is the
way cleared?
The difference between recognizing one's own problems and someone else's is
often simply a matter of opportunity.
Now that everyone seems focused on the problem, what is the solution?
-Jeff
Thotful560
>From: "Jeffrey Qamar Nahaar"
>How can such a state be corrected?
need *it* be corrected ?
this assumes damage or malfunction.
WE NEED to CORRECT OURSELVES
I believe posts such as jhereks's serve as a wake up bell to the rest of us..to
challenge our beliefs, our prejudices..our self righteousness.
>If it's a matter of conditions that limit to a Seeker's progress, how is the
>way cleared?
Whose way is really obstructed?
ours, perhaps? because in our own certainty lies our greatest fault?
(claiming we know)
I don't pretend to that.
jherek got my attention when he/she claimed to be a 13 year old female!
What if??
that prompted me to think about my own assumptions and beliefs about who and
what and why...
So, for me it's been good to examine my conditioning about obscenity, and what
provokes me and why...and about how I react internally by clinging to my old
familiar patterns of behavior.
words are just a collection of letters.
WE give them their power and flavor when we internalize them, along with OUR
concept of who we believe wrote them, and why.
We really do pretend to know each others habits and volitions...maybe jherek
has given us a good example of how we collectively do that.
nobody really knows a heart except the Creator of hearts.
I, for one, believe that Alif could symbolize more than a penis.
Alif is the first letter and stands alone, is it possible that Alif stands for
Allah??
The kufic script alif symbolizes the kneeling posture of salat..(sujud)
Could circling the Alif stand for tawwaf? (circling the kaaba)
If you read it with more than your head..there *could* be more to it.
But what do I know??
I am a dummy!
I work as a cook, I left high school at age 15. In no way can I compare with
the intellects that read and post here.
It's just made me think in new ways...and that has been good for me.
Teresa
fried jack morgan
>>From: fried jack morgan friedja...@netscape.net
>
>
>>I rather think Jherek is referring to is feeling his own penis, when he
>>is talking about "feeling the elephant", when you consider the number of
>>his posts about masturbation and about his own masturbation in
>>particular.
>
>
> We each see what we want to see
After much thought I posted the above reply to you because I realized
that not only are men ignorant of much of women's sexuality, women are
also just as ignorant of male sexuality. The only difference between
Jherek's posts and what gets said among men in gross-out contests in the
U.S. is his use of Arabic. Puns and double-meanings included. It is
kind of the white American male equivalent of doing the dozens (or
whatever it is currently called), but it is seldom, if ever, done in public.
Now, it is fine if you find deeper meanings and allusions in what Jherek
posts, there is nothing wrong with it, but one can do the same thing
with the trees and the grass and the sky and the sun and so on, and then
one is dealing with much more of sufi symbolism. And in a more
first-hand, experiential manner.
Also, you have missed some of the "levels" of Jherek. He posts to
alt.surrealism, and has for quite some time, probably longer than he has
posted to alt.sufi. I don't remember if he posted that he was a
surrealist. Salvador Dali, the surrealist painter (remember the melting
watches?) was kicked out the surrealist movement for exposing the
Freudian basis of surrealism. Of which one part was sex. Salvador
Dali, however, encompassed Freudian psychology as a whole, in which sex
was only one part of it, whereas Jherek merely settles for the most
obvious part that is apparently relevant to his own life.
And by the way, the elephant is found in surrealism, also. I believe
that there is a painting by either Marcel Duchamp or Max Ernst of a
teapot in the shape and design of an elephant. It often is found in art
textbooks when they are discussing surrealism.
>
>
>>>You felt one part of the elephant fjm, while I have felt another here and
>>
>>while
>>
>>>we are talking about the same animal...we are not each seeing the others
>>>portion!
>
>
> I certainly was NOT referring to anyone's body parts..
> I WAS referring to a thing unknown, that each person assumes he or she knows by
> his own perceptions, and nothing more.
>
> You are the one reading sexual content into MY post.
> teresa
I was making a joke. I was quite aware that you had put no sexual
content into your reply. What did you think I was doing?
fried jack morgan
> "fried jack morgan" <friedja...@netscape.net> wrote in message
> news:mj6Xb.83$M93....@news.uswest.net...
>
>>You are aware that there are certain kinds of mental illnesses where
>>religiosity, spirituality and sexuality get expressed innapproriately.
>>There will partial truths in them that the discerning person can
>>perceive, but there will be no completeness, because the person is
>>harmed, ill, or damaged.
>
>
> Regardless of if one assumes that Jherek's posts are the result of his own
> limited mental state or a clever diagnosis of the state of this forum and/or
> the larger world, the same essential question remains:
You forgot that both could be true. Perhaps the the problem is that we
are down at Jherek's low level and do not want to admit it, so we
pretend that he or we are something other. Perhaps we pretend that
Jherek is a sufi with symbolic meanings that we can't quite fully grasp,
or perhaps we pretend that we aren't as mentally disordered as he is.
After all, birds of a feather flock together, and Jherek, I do believe,
is here to stay.
Have a nice day.
fried jack morgan
You are not a dummy. At least not compared to me.
The following is true. I no longer have the source for it, but I
remember my psych professors being all agog over this experiment many
years ago when I was a psych undergrad.
Some psychologists took some rats and ran them through mazes. They then
divided them into smart rats and dumb rats based on how long it took
them to find their way through the maze. The psychologists then mated
the smart rats with smart rats and the dumb rats with the dumb rats.
And of course the smart rat offspring were able to run through the maze
even faster, and the dumb rat offspring took even longer. The
psychologists repeated the mating process, and after a few generations
were quite confident that they were proving the genetic basis of
intelligence and had bred super-intelligent rats. Until someone changed
the maze the rats had to run in. Then the smart rats failed it
miserably and the (so-called) dumb rats ran the maze brilliantly.
In other words, intelligence is relative. A number of us are here
because it is the only place where we can actually look intelligent,
self included.
Mr Jherek Chamaeleo
terminology or spiritual and/or religious expression you will find the
disjointedness in his posts disappears.
feeling lost
the question might be
hu is making love too
fried jack morgan
mitakuye oyasin
fried jack morgan
> "A Journey from the Haphazard to the Deliberate."
>
> Does sperm have personality, that look upon your face !
> Whilst it may be difficult for some of you to swallow.
> It is the seed of the human race.
>
> Taste the sword of degeneration, when you masterbate
> hu do you think of , grasping each
> little death, how, to whom, what, & where do you cry ?
>
> Watch mud returning to the watery clay. When peeling apples
> enjoy sharing the skin.
>
> bitter for some
>
> ya zawdgyi says "mmm"
>
> getting ready for the apple pie to cum
>
>
Hey, Jherek, not all alchemical doctrines are that literal.
fried jack morgan
Does your face have a personality, that looks out upon you?
Whilst it may be difficult for some of you to see.
It is the face of the human race.
Look upon the face of aging, while you degenerate
Hu do you think of , gasping each
little fear, how, to whom, what, & where do you cry ?
Watch your flesh return to the earth. When peeling your facades,
enjoy the Closeness.
bitter for some.
the alchemist sheds a tear that he cannot bottle
give the apple pie to Jherek Chamaeleo