Enterprise's ratings and the fall of Rome.
PARADOX OF BORG
>: STARTING FILE TRANSMISSION FROM COLLECTIVE CORE.
>: FILE TRANSMISSION TO DESIGNATION A...@SECTOR.001
>: DESIGNATING PARADOX FOR FIRST PERSON COMMUNICATION.
>: TRANSMITTING COMMUNICATION.
>: SUBJECT - Then how come you didn't know "Row, row, row, row your boat?"
Designation "Count 1" <omnipi...@yaoo.com> wrote in message
news:b3o9du$1oltc7$1...@ID-130993.news.dfncis.de...
> Reality TV is killing the ratings for fictional shows with marginal appeal
> like Enterprise. Plus, they're portents to the fall of the great
Republic.
> I'm not by any means an American basher - heck, I work for Americans in an
> American company - but the current crop of 'reality tv' shows are very
> similar to the depravity and self serving interests which lead to the
> downfall of Rome, another great republic.
>
Hollywood has been out of touch with the Heartland of America for
years. With Home Video, home Theaters, and Online Gaming and Chat eating
into the viewing times, America is turning off the TV more and more, and so
the programming becomes baser and baser, to drag in as much market share as
possible. I think the West in General is facing an overload of
Entertainment. You can only watch so much for so long, before you become
bored with it.
Music is not faring much better. Quality music in America has gone the
way of the Dodo, and the music sales from last year show it. Everything on
every Video Channel has become T & A, and a Dirty Dancing makeover that has
now become so mainstream it is laughable. I actually miss American
Bandstand and the cheesy Disco Dancing and slow dancing of old. I get tired
literally of today's "in your face 'bump' and 'grind'!"
I'll never be on one of those cheezy "reality shows!" I'm very sorry
9/11 had to happen and people had to lose life. But in another way, it
helped many of us to realize we have a life at home, and if we don't, we
need one. I never watched much TV in college, because of studies and social
life. Once I moved off to graduate school, and lost my social base, my
social life slowed, and I started watching more TV. After 9/11 I realize, I
need to get back into meeting new people, making more friends, hitting the
books to learn something new, and have more of a social life once again.
Back to watching ballgames with friends, playing silly board games, and yes,
even the occasionally RPG I dread getting dragged into, but hey, at least
its live in the flesh conversation and fellowship.
In College, I had one show to watch faithfully: TNG. Then it was DS9.
Voyager was boring until they brought the Borg back, and Enterprise, has
fallen victim to the "psychology" writing of TNG's seventh season.
I think in the West, creative writing and music has hit a Quagmire,
kind of like it did in the late 70's, early 80's when no one knew where
music was going. I'm sick to death and can do without "My MTV" which isn't
about music anymore anyway. Unless you pay out big money for digital
channels showing all video and no yack, you can't find any MTV! And I'm so
bored with the old stuff, I'm not paying big money to watch it all over
again. I can always throw in old Video's taped of MTV and VH1 in the early
90's if I get too bored and live in nostalgia if I get really bored.
I suggested a lot of script ideas for Paramount to improve Voyager, and
I saw many of my ideas implemented on the show. Later watching an interview
with Bragga, he said the Trek newsgroups were a great place to get writing
material from. Well, I have some more great ideas, but I think I'll save
them for my own attempt at future Trek Novels and make some dough there
instead of giving away my ideas for free from now on. In fact, I have some
great ideas for a 26th Century Trek which would leap well beyond what we
have now, but I'll save those for my Novels.
One thing they could most definitely do on Enterprise, is leave that
annoying Flox character and story line alone. I have enough reality TV to
watch if I want to see near simulated Orgy experiences. Flox's character is
wimpy and comes across as a cheap Gigolo 70's Pornstar reject that really
wants to be gay, but settles for bisexual, but will never admit it.
Personally, I'm a man's man and can stand the modern trend to Tattooing and
Piercing everything like you're some child whore prostitute from the Streets
of Hollywood in the 80's who simply grew old and kept trying to look that
lifestyle 20 years later, and ended up a sad adult who never passed the
through conflicts of adolescence to move into adulthood and are a retard in
your 30's!
The other thing is technology wise they go nowhere. If I were writing
for Enterprise, I would warp speed ahead to show how technology we even see
in Kirk's time came to be developed through trial and error. Bring some
additional regulars on, make us love them, and then kill them off in
accidents involving this new technology and drive the audience crazy like
the old Bonanza series did, but never letting any of the Cartwright boys get
married. Involve the crew in a lot of failures and disasters politically
that show why the Prime Directive became necessary. And for God's sake,
quit with the Voyager mentality of just one ship. Let's see some real fleet
development start, and work with Sisterships in the fleet. Let's see many
of them become popular crews and then like Bonanza, don't let the
Cartwright's (The Enterprise Crew) fall in love too quickly with the girl
(their Sistership crews) before they get killed off to make room for the
young and evolving Federation. Let's see some human blood on the hands of
those arrogant Vulcan's who learn the hard way to trust what seems like
Human logic gone awry, but its intuition that is correct.
Let's see Trip and other single Crewman fall in love more often, maybe
even let the Captain marry T'Pol and watch the tension of Husband and Wife
on deck and in missions. Let Hoshi lose her voice for a season, and she
just has to listen and use Voice synthesis to communicate, have Flox help
her out by enhancing Humans ability to use telepathy, and then the next
season a cure discovered to bring her voice back.
Man if I was writing for Enterprise, I could get it out of its slump in
6 months time, and have it be the most kick ass show on TV. Get rid of the
slow plot development. It worked fine on DS9 and TNG, but it stinks in
Enterprise. Get rid of the Psychology Trek, and transform Flox through
tragedy or kill him off and get a new Doctor!
"This is not about age, Time served on the earth doesn't mean you grow
in mind." - from Creed's album "weathered" from the song "signs"
Ever Thinking, Not Just Accepting,
Paradox of Borg at:
http://home.earthlink.net/~paradox3d
PS> "In this dark, when we all talk at once, some of us must learn to
whistle." Walt Kelly
PS2> "I bring order to chaos . . . . You are the contradiction. You
are in chaos Data, you are a machine who wants to be human!"
- Borg Queen from Paramount's motion picture
"Star Trek: First Contact"
Aaron
> additional regulars on, make us love them, and then kill them off in
> accidents involving this new technology and drive the audience crazy like
My first choice of killing anyone off would be Scott Bacula (spelling?) His
Captain Archer character is LAME!!!! Scott was great in QUANTUM LEAP, but in
ST:E he really sucks - to put it bluntly!
I would love to see someone like Jason Carter (Marcus Cole) from Babylon5 as
the Captain of the Enterprise!
Aaron
WickeddollŽ
"Aaron" <1aro...@e1arthlink1.net> wrote in message
news:TaKla.2706$S6....@tornadotest1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
same character, the style would be different, but he'd still be doing (Or
not doing) the things that are upsetting you
Natalie
Charles Barber
"WickeddollŽ" <wickeddoll195...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b77rpd$c47bq$1...@ID-125536.news.dfncis.de...
Shudder the thought, but could you imagine present day trek writers, writing
TOS Kirk stories? But I agree don`t blame Bakula , it isn`t his fault he
works for producers who are wimps, who are afraid of offending someone if
they made Archer a little Roguish... Seems celibacy is a quality that would
help you go far, in today's Trek world.
I liked the Klingon's (Duras) version of Archer, that he presented during
the trial. I liked the part where his version of Archer threatened to give
him the chance to meet his ancestors.
Archer can stay, but fire the writing staff.. lets return to a little more
of his bitterness over the fact the Vulcans got in the way of allowing his
father's Warp Engines a chance at a real test...
Compared with STNG, Enterprise should have more of "military" feel to it.
Look what we have to look forward to next week.. "The Ensign Meriweather
Family Soap Opera" where he gets the chance to do Ezri Dax storylines.......
Does anyone care whether or not the charatcers have personal problems? I
wanted to see a series about the early history of Earth's Deep space
exploration plans, dealing with the unknown, more of Earth and how it has
emerged from it`s recent turbulent history.
But we instead get "Enterprise: Cruise Ship"
>
>
David Johnston
>
> "Aaron" <1aro...@e1arthlink1.net> wrote in message
> news:TaKla.2706$S6....@tornadotest1.news.pas.earthlink.net..
> > > additional regulars on, make us love them, and then kill them off in
> > > accidents involving this new technology and drive the audience crazy
> like
> >
> > My first choice of killing anyone off would be Scott Bacula (spelling?)
> His
> > Captain Archer character is LAME!!!! Scott was great in QUANTUM LEAP, but
> in
> > ST:E he really sucks - to put it bluntly!
> >
> > I would love to see someone like Jason Carter (Marcus Cole) from Babylon5
> as
> > the Captain of the Enterprise!
> >
> > Aaron
> >
> >
> >
> Why blame Bakula for the way the character is written?
An actor can save a badly written character. Captain Picard, for
example, was written as pretty much a total doofus, but Patrick Stewart's
performance was so commanding in the role that people mostly didn't care
that he was pretty incompetent.
WickeddollŽ
"David Johnston" <rgo...@telusplanet.net> wrote in message
news:3E97AB...@telusplanet.net...
Well here's where we certainly differ. I thought Picard was a great
character, but I do agree that Stewart brought more to it, than say, Old
One-Note Shatner could have.
Natalie
David Johnston
> > > Why blame Bakula for the way the character is written?
> >
> > An actor can save a badly written character. Captain Picard, for
> > example, was written as pretty much a total doofus, but Patrick Stewart's
> > performance was so commanding in the role that people mostly didn't care
> > that he was pretty incompetent.
> >
>
> Well here's where we certainly differ. I thought Picard was a great
> character,
Was he a great character on paper though? He was a very poor combat commander,
he was bad at personnel management and only a moderately competent
diplomat. With a different performer, he would have been a terrible character.
But Stewart gave Picard such a feeling of gravitas, invested him with such
dignity, that nobody cared that he would never return fire until the shields
were down and the starboard power coupling was toast, and that he'd make dumbass
moves like convincing Ensign Ro to remain in Starfleet even though she'd already
demonstrated beyond doubt that she was unfit for duty and that when dealing
with a species famous for their obsessive compulsive approach to contracts
that his first move _wasn't_ to have one of his officers study the contract
in question.
WickeddollŽ
> WickeddollŽ wrote:
>
> > > > Why blame Bakula for the way the character is written?
> > >
> > > An actor can save a badly written character. Captain Picard, for
> > > example, was written as pretty much a total doofus, but Patrick
Stewart's
> > > performance was so commanding in the role that people mostly didn't
care
> > > that he was pretty incompetent.
> > >
> >
> > Well here's where we certainly differ. I thought Picard was a great
more to it, than say, Old
really irritating. I think the rest of this sentence is significant)
>
> Was he a great character on paper though? He was a very poor combat
commander,
> he was bad at personnel management and only a moderately competent
> diplomat. With a different performer, he would have been a terrible
character.
> But Stewart gave Picard such a feeling of gravitas, invested him with such
> dignity, that nobody cared that he would never return fire until the
shields
> were down and the starboard power coupling was toast, and that he'd make
dumbass
> moves like convincing Ensign Ro to remain in Starfleet even though she'd
already
> demonstrated beyond doubt that she was unfit for duty and that when
dealing
> with a species famous for their obsessive compulsive approach to contracts
> that his first move _wasn't_ to have one of his officers study the
contract
> in question.
>
I guess it's a matter of taste. I prefer a leader not of the
'shoot-first-ask-questions-later' ilk. A good example of why that doesn't
work is how the Earth/Minbari war started on another fictional piece -
Babylon 5. A new species opened their gun ports (as sign of respect in
their culture), yet that moronic captain of the Earth ship didn't even try
to ask what they were doing. If they ignore communications, take defensive,
not offensive measures, until you're fired upon. At least that's my take on
it
Natalie
David Johnston
>
> I guess it's a matter of taste. I prefer a leader not of the
> 'shoot-first-ask-questions-later' ilk. A good example of why that doesn't
> work is how the Earth/Minbari war started on another fictional piece -
> Babylon 5. A new species opened their gun ports (as sign of respect in
> their culture), yet that moronic captain of the Earth ship didn't even try
> to ask what they were doing. If they ignore communications, take defensive,
> not offensive measures, until you're fired upon.
That was not Picard's policy. Picard's policy was "Wait until your shields
are down and your starboard power coupling has been taken out...then try to
open hailing frequencies again...or maybe call a staff meeting in the ready
room."
I do not know why so many people interpret my advocacy of "Return fire when
shot at" as ""Shoot first, and ask questions later.".
John Leister
Bravo! Bravo! Bravo!
Finally someone says something I like..
Now to add my 0.002 cents worth....
For me Enterprise has felt quite uneven in parts. Every so often we
get a good episode and that is separated by long stretches of
soap opera like stories.
Yes I agree with you. It's not Scott Bakula's fault at all it's the
bloody writers who write his character. If only they would ditch
Berman and Braga and hire writers with a passion for trek.
Perhaps employing a fan who is also a proper scriptwriter would be
a start if such a person existed.
During the episodes which are like a soapy I keep thinking "The Love
Boat" really, it sometimes feels that bad.
--
John
========
Duct Tape: It's like the force with a light side
and a dark side and binds everything together.
John Leister
> WickeddollŽ wrote:
>
> >
> > I guess it's a matter of taste. I prefer a leader not of the
> > 'shoot-first-ask-questions-later' ilk. A good example of why that doesn't
> > work is how the Earth/Minbari war started on another fictional piece -
> > Babylon 5. A new species opened their gun ports (as sign of respect in
> > their culture), yet that moronic captain of the Earth ship didn't even try
> > to ask what they were doing. If they ignore communications, take defensive,
> > not offensive measures, until you're fired upon.
>
> That was not Picard's policy. Picard's policy was "Wait until your shields
> are down and your starboard power coupling has been taken out...then try to
> open hailing frequencies again...or maybe call a staff meeting in the ready
> room."
Ditto... That is one of the things that shits me off about Picard.
To me all he ever seemed to do with aliens is talk, talk, talk and
never, apart from a few occasions did he make a big decision.
Charles Barber
"John Leister" <fyrd...@senet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3E98FD4A...@senet.com.au...
> David Johnston wrote:
>
> > WickeddollŽ wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > I guess it's a matter of taste. I prefer a leader not of the
> > > 'shoot-first-ask-questions-later' ilk. A good example of why that
doesn't
> > > work is how the Earth/Minbari war started on another fictional piece -
> > > Babylon 5. A new species opened their gun ports (as sign of respect
in
> > > their culture), yet that moronic captain of the Earth ship didn't even
try
> > > to ask what they were doing. If they ignore communications, take
defensive,
> > > not offensive measures, until you're fired upon.
It is difficult, especially early in a series.. to establish a motive for
being trigger-happy. With B5 I do not recall any mention of any war, prior
to the Earth/Minbari conflict.. The type of ships that Earth had prior to
the Minbari war could of been without, quality shielding, meaning if you
didn`t get the first shot in, you were not around to talk about it later.
Yes it turned out that the gun ports were open as a sign of respect, and the
Minbari were new... As a ship's Captain would you hesitate to fire , if
previously similar events, involving other species, had all fired, after
approaching with "gun ports open"?
Do you wait to findout, just how much damage that "first shot" could do to
your ship. Everything seems a little easier in the Trek world, even though
the Enterprise is a first generation starship, it seems the ship can shield
it`s crew, to the same extent ships as in STNG/Voyager. I think they have
decided, that by the Enterprise's time.. nothing fails anymore.. Earth
builds it, it works problem free.
James Evans
wrote:
>> > > not offensive measures, until you're fired upon.
>
>
>
>It is difficult, especially early in a series.. to establish a motive for
>being trigger-happy. With B5 I do not recall any mention of any war, prior
>to the Earth/Minbari conflict..
You're forgetting the Dilgar war. Just thought I'd remind you.
David Johnston
>
> It is difficult, especially early in a series.. to establish a motive for
> being trigger-happy. With B5 I do not recall any mention of any war, prior
> to the Earth/Minbari conflict..
Actually Earth had already fought and won one war in B5 by the time they
encountered the Minbari.
>
> Do you wait to findout, just how much damage that "first shot" could do to
> your ship. Everything seems a little easier in the Trek world, even though
> the Enterprise is a first generation starship, it seems the ship can shield
> it`s crew, to the same extent ships as in STNG/Voyager. I think they have
> decided, that by the Enterprise's time.. nothing fails anymore.. Earth
> builds it, it works problem free.
Always a critical problem with Enterprise. They are just too technologically
advanced. "Plating is at 80%" my ass.
Charles Barber
"Keeper of the Purple Twilight" <n...@spam.invalid> wrote in message
news:130420030156233723%n...@spam.invalid...
> In article <DB7ma.711655$Yo4.63...@news1.calgary.shaw.ca>, Charles
> Barber <pho...@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> > It is difficult, especially early in a series.. to establish a motive
for
> > being trigger-happy. With B5 I do not recall any mention of any war,
prior
> > to the Earth/Minbari conflict..
>
> Minbari war. Earth basically did to the Dilgar what the Minbari did to
> Earth later. :)
>
> > The type of ships that Earth had prior to
> > the Minbari war could of been without, quality shielding, meaning if you
> > didn`t get the first shot in, you were not around to talk about it
later.
>
> term. Some, like the Whitestars, have 'skin' that can learn and adapt
> to weapons fire, but there are no shields in the B5verse.
>
> > Yes it turned out that the gun ports were open as a sign of respect, and
the
> > Minbari were new... As a ship's Captain would you hesitate to fire , if
> > previously similar events, involving other species, had all fired, after
> > approaching with "gun ports open"?
>
> business getting so close to the Minbari. He blundered into things
> without thinking of anything else but getting so much info on the
> Minbari that EarthForce would give him gobs of medals. That's all he
> cared about.
Other then the episode, with Micheal Yorke, having flash backs to that
event, I don`t recall much of any explaination of the military climate of
that time period.
>
> --
> ³Quite frankly, Mr. President, we can clean their chronometers.²
> - Starfleet Marine Colonel West, OStar Trek VI¹
Charles Barber
"James Evans" <wave...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3e991875...@news.mindspring.com...
Guess I missed wathing that one :)
WickeddollŽ
> WickeddollŽ wrote:
>
>
> >
> > I guess it's a matter of taste. I prefer a leader not of the
> > 'shoot-first-ask-questions-later' ilk. A good example of why that
doesn't
> > work is how the Earth/Minbari war started on another fictional piece -
> > Babylon 5. A new species opened their gun ports (as sign of respect in
> > their culture), yet that moronic captain of the Earth ship didn't even
try
> > to ask what they were doing. If they ignore communications, take
defensive,
> > not offensive measures, until you're fired upon.
>
> That was not Picard's policy. Picard's policy was "Wait until your
shields
> are down and your starboard power coupling has been taken out...then try
to
> open hailing frequencies again...or maybe call a staff meeting in the
ready
> room."
>
He was slow on the draw, but I don't remember him ever NOT firing back when
fired upon.
> I do not know why so many people interpret my advocacy of "Return fire
when
> shot at" as ""Shoot first, and ask questions later.".
>
>
He DID return fire!
Natalie
WickeddollŽ
"Charles Barber" <pho...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:DB7ma.711655$Yo4.63...@news1.calgary.shaw.ca...
I would have tried evasive maneuvers first
>
> Do you wait to findout, just how much damage that "first shot" could do to
> your ship. Everything seems a little easier in the Trek world, even though
> the Enterprise is a first generation starship, it seems the ship can
shield
> it`s crew, to the same extent ships as in STNG/Voyager. I think they have
> decided, that by the Enterprise's time.. nothing fails anymore.. Earth
> builds it, it works problem free.
>
>
No, but this earth ship didn't even TRY to communicate, that's my point
Natalie
Merrick Baldelli
wrote:
>I would love to see someone like Jason Carter (Marcus Cole) from Babylon5 as
>the Captain of the Enterprise!
I seriously don't think Jason Carter has what it takes to be
in a lead role.
--
-=-=-/ )=*=-='=-.-'-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
_( (_ , '_ * . Merrick Baldelli
(((\ \> /_1 `
(\\\\ \_/ /
-=-\ /-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
\ _/
/ /
Merrick Baldelli
wrote:
> Other then the episode, with Michael York, having flash backs to that
>event, I don`t recall much of any explaination of the military climate of
>that time period.
There are several mentions of it prior to "In the Beginning"
which covered the Earth-Minbari War. The general military climate of
the Earth Alliance was that of pride; they had come out of the Dilgar
Conflict unscathed, established the Earth Alliance as being a
formidible power with the League of Non-Alligned Worlds, and gained
the respect of the Centauri.
Numan
>
> An actor can save a badly written character. Captain Picard, for
> example, was written as pretty much a total doofus, but Patrick Stewart's
> performance was so commanding in the role that people mostly didn't care
> that he was pretty incompetent.
What! In what way was Picard incompetent?
Numan
Paolo Pizzi
news:OiZoa.5263$Ds2.53...@newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
Bad news for you Numan: neither Patrick Stewart nor Picard
can EVER possibly be republicans...
Why are you a ST fan? A fascist thug like you that - AS YOU
STATED - would beat the living crap out of anybody (especially
foreigners, better if non-whites) who dares to burn the flag, has
really no place in Gene's universe.
DeadOnArIVAL
--
If I can write haiku while skinheads beat me with tons of soap, I can
concentrate anywhere ;-)
"John Leister" <fyrd...@senet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3E98FD0D...@senet.com.au...
I was hoping for the Feel of Babylon 5's crude space travel, crude warfare
(compared to ST clean lines, and nice ships) in the Star Trek universe and
timelines. That is what I was hoping for.
DeadOnArIVAL
about this whole Temporal Cold war, lets start a dominion war, except with
some other people. DS9 was at it's best during the war, I think Enterprise
would be as well.
Lukas Louw
production.....
Lukas
Mr. StarBand
"Lukas Louw" <lo...@att.net> wrote in message
news:gsrua.145106$ja4.6...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
Brian Thorn
<sati...@starband.net> wrote:
>> Nah, just get the team who produce Stargate to take over Enterprise
>> production....
>I agree!
The first three or four seasons, anyway. The show's gone downhill
since.
Brian
TC.
instead of jokes about Trek and The Simpsons!
Really, SG1 blows Trek away.
"Brian Thorn" <btho...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:9nplbvof89gnbelj2...@4ax.com...
Paolo Pizzi
news:gsrua.145106$ja4.6...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> production.....
Like the last couple of SG-1 seasons don't have the same
problems...(lack of originality, recycled stories, writers'
fatigue etc.)
David W
like this for Seson 3 onwards, a war started by an unknown race and the
Enterprise becomes a warship (so I read). What happened to the Suliban
anyway; not that I miss them.
"DeadOnArIVAL" <deadon...@REMOVEearthlink.net> wrote in message
news:okoua.62013$4P1.5...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Skippy The Klingon
did Farscape, Ron Moore, the guy who writes all those Marrisa Picard
fanfics (no, wait, he's already on staff...)
"Mr. StarBand" <sati...@starband.net> wrote in message news:<Kptua.533984$Zo.114106@sccrnsc03>...
Brian Thorn
Klingon) wrote:
>The Stargate folks,
The good ones have left that show. The first few seasons were
excellent. Recent years, not so much. The lackluster writing is why
Michael Shanks (Daniel Jackson) left the show.
>J Micheal Strazinski,
He had one good concept, "Babylon 5", and even that ran out of good
ideas in the last season. "Crusade", "Legend of the Rangers" and
"Jeremiah" are notable flops.
>Joss Whedon,
"Firefly" was horrid. It looked like "Star Trek" on coccaine, and I'm
not convinced that's not how it originated.
>the guys who did Farscape,
They ran out of ideas a couple of seasons ago, and "Farscape" devolved
into an incomprehensible mess. It got to be like "The X Files" in
later years... if you miss one episode, you're hopelessly lost.
I thought you wanted to do *better* than "Enterprise"...
Brian
Atomic Punk
the black guy, the captain,( even though i like scott) he play a pussy on
the show. to much political correctness
the last show with the borg should have let the borg win. the
indestructable(in mine eyes)
"David W" <davidwREM...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:szEua.1070$8I3...@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk...
Skippy The Klingon
>
good cast but the lousiest excuse for a production staff. As long as
Berman and Butthead hold the reins on the franchise and insist on
maintaining everything to it's formulaic mediocrity there shall be no
hope.
Once, the fans organized a letter writing campaign to save Star Trek
from cancellation, maybe this time we need to organize one to HAVE
them cancel the series.
Merrick Baldelli
wrote:
>On 8 May 2003 19:58:22 -0700, skippy_th...@yahoo.com (Skippy The
>Klingon) wrote:
>
>>The Stargate folks,
>
>The good ones have left that show. The first few seasons were
>excellent. Recent years, not so much. The lackluster writing is why
>Michael Shanks (Daniel Jackson) left the show.
And not surprising -- the lack of job offers he thought he
would get off the show is why he's BACK.
>>J Micheal Strazinski,
>
>He had one good concept, "Babylon 5", and even that ran out of good
>ideas in the last season. "Crusade", "Legend of the Rangers" and
>"Jeremiah" are notable flops.
While I would like to agree on "Jeremiah", I heard it was
renewed for next season, no?
Crusade was doomed thanks to WB/TNT executives thinking they
knew what it would take to get their WWF folks to watch the show.
--
-=-=-/ )=*=-='=-.-'-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
_( (_ , '_ * . Merrick Baldelli
(((\ \> /_1 `
(\\\\ \_/ /
-=-\ /-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
\ _/ Home of the Evil Trek Cabal©
/ / http://groups.yahoo.com/groups/trek_cabal
Tim Martin
> On 8 May 2003 19:58:22 -0700, skippy_th...@yahoo.com (Skippy The
> Klingon) wrote:
>
> >The Stargate folks,
>
> The good ones have left that show. The first few seasons were
> excellent. Recent years, not so much. The lackluster writing is why
> Michael Shanks (Daniel Jackson) left the show.
I thought the last few seasons were quite good.
>
> >J Micheal Strazinski,
>
> He had one good concept, "Babylon 5", and even that ran out of good
> ideas in the last season. "Crusade", "Legend of the Rangers" and
> "Jeremiah" are notable flops.
Not familiar with the last one, but you are correct. He burned out writing
4th season B5, which up to and including that season was undeniably
brilliant. 5th season was horrid, except for the last 4 episodes or so.
>
> >Joss Whedon,
>
> "Firefly" was horrid. It looked like "Star Trek" on coccaine, and I'm
> not convinced that's not how it originated.
Interesting concept, but just wasn't carried out well.
>
> >the guys who did Farscape,
>
> They ran out of ideas a couple of seasons ago, and "Farscape" devolved
> into an incomprehensible mess. It got to be like "The X Files" in
> later years... if you miss one episode, you're hopelessly lost.
Totally agree! Some episodes were just painful! It used to be a fantastic
show, but it got murky, hard to follow, I totally agree.
Tim
Maria_...@hotmail.com
I agree. DS9 is my favourite spin off of Star Trek. The Dominion war
storyline was fantastically written. I think enterprise could use
more characters as well.
GMAN
>Nah, just get the team who produce Stargate to take over Enterprise
>production.....
>
>Lukas
>
>
Just great!!! We will get a bunch of canadian "Village people rejects" to
play the parts of the aliens . That is the one thing that irks me the most
about the actors who play the Jaffar (sp?) in the stargate series. They are
more than a little feminin.
ToolPackinMama
> Just great!!! We will get a bunch of canadian "Village people rejects" to
> play the parts of the aliens . That is the one thing that irks me the most
> about the actors who play the Jaffar (sp?) in the stargate series. They are
> more than a little feminin.
What are you implying? That "theater people" aren't in all cases 100%
heterosexual? :)
Terrafamilia
GMAN wrote:
> In article <gsrua.145106$ja4.6...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, "Lukas Louw" <lo...@att.net> wrote:
> >Nah, just get the team who produce Stargate to take over Enterprise
> >production.....
> >
> >Lukas
> >
> >
>
> Just great!!! We will get a bunch of canadian "Village people rejects" to
> play the parts of the aliens . That is the one thing that irks me the most
> about the actors who play the Jaffar (sp?) in the stargate series. They are
> more than a little feminin.
Well, aren't the Jaffa effectively pregnant with Goa'uld larvae. It must be the hormones.;)
Caio,
Terrafamilia
GMAN
Steve Silverwood
In article <t48obv4ntlri6adun...@4ax.com>, bthorn64
@cox.net says...
> >J Micheal Strazinski,
>
> He had one good concept, "Babylon 5", and even that ran out of good
> ideas in the last season. "Crusade", "Legend of the Rangers" and
> "Jeremiah" are notable flops.
Never saw Jeremiah. Yes, Crusade and LOTR were poorer than B5. But the
reason season 5 of B5 wasn't as good was because JMS was forced into
rushing things to closure at the end of season 4 because he wasn't going
to get a 5th season to properly do things -- fortunately it was rescued
at the last minute, from what I understand, but he still had to "close"
things out before it went over to cable. The original story arc was
supposed to span a full five seasons, no more and no less. (Or so I'm
told.)
--
-- //Steve//
Steve Silverwood, KB6OJS
Fountain Valley, CA
Email: kb6...@arrl.net
Web: http://home.earthlink.net/~kb6ojs_steve
Steve Silverwood
@hotmail.com says...
> well, to save it, i`d get rid of some of the crew.
> the black guy, the captain,( even though i like scott) he play a pussy on
> the show. to much political correctness
> the last show with the borg should have let the borg win. the
> indestructable(in mine eyes)
The crew they have now is pretty good. The writers are probably put in
a bind by the network to write episodes that they will actually AIR, and
the current climate is political correctness in the American culture.
(Or have you not been following the news? <g>)
Hopefully this new Delphic Expanse thing will prove interesting as they
explore that plot line.
Steve Silverwood
davidwREM...@hotmail.com says...
They have a lot of options to pursue, and I hope they have the
opportunity to do all of them. Things like:
- How "Memory Alpha" came about
- How the Federation was formed
- What started the Earth-Romulan war
- What honked off the Klingons (or did they adequately
answer that one already?)
- How did we become friends with the Vulcans? (There
is so much hostility between Humans and Vulcans at
this point, how did that get resolved?)
And of course there are things that the already-aired episodes of ST:E
have brought up, such as the Temporal Cold War, which need to be
resolved.
I just hope the writers have the imagination and vision to address
things that led up to TOS-time.
Grainne Gillespie
For a second there I thought you were talking about the other LOTR which is
definately NOT poorer than B5 (a lot better in fact)
Elrond is mighty fine looking IMO
Derek
in "alt.tv.star-trek.enterprise" assembled, and proclaimed:
> Never saw Jeremiah. Yes, Crusade and LOTR were poorer than B5.
> But the reason season 5 of B5 wasn't as good was because JMS was
> forced into rushing things to closure at the end of season 4
> because he wasn't going to get a 5th season to properly do
> things -- fortunately it was rescued at the last minute, from
> what I understand, but he still had to "close" things out before
> it went over to cable. The original story arc was supposed to
> span a full five seasons, no more and no less. (Or so I'm
> told.)
JMS chose to go ahead and close after 4 seasons because he didn't
want broadcast fans to miss the ending even when the 5th season was
going to show up on TNT. Not everyone gets cable.
The original arc was a 5 year story. It's a shame WB wouldn't give
him the extra year. I hate feeling "obliged" to Ted Turner.
Derek
--
"I think the oddest thing about the advanced people is that, while
they are always talking about things as problems, they have hardly
any notion of what a real problem is." - G.K. Chesterton
the wandering wastrel
kb6...@arrl.net says...
> In article <szEua.1070$8I3...@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk>,
> davidwREM...@hotmail.com says...
> > There's an article at StarTrek.com that says they are doing something
> > like this for Seson 3 onwards, a war started by an unknown race and the
> > Enterprise becomes a warship (so I read). What happened to the Suliban
> > anyway; not that I miss them.
> >
> > "DeadOnArIVAL" <deadon...@REMOVEearthlink.net> wrote in message
> > news:okoua.62013$4P1.5...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> > > I think the best way to fix enterprise is to give it an ongoing storyline
> > > about this whole Temporal Cold war, lets start a dominion war, except with
> > > some other people. DS9 was at it's best during the war, I think Enterprise
> > > would be as well.
>
> They have a lot of options to pursue, and I hope they have the
> opportunity to do all of them. Things like:
>
> - How "Memory Alpha" came about
> - How the Federation was formed
> - What started the Earth-Romulan war
> - What honked off the Klingons (or did they adequately
> answer that one already?)
> - How did we become friends with the Vulcans? (There
> is so much hostility between Humans and Vulcans at
> this point, how did that get resolved?)
Good suggestions all, but I'm afraid the producers don't see such
speculations as "sexy" enough for the demographic they seem to be aiming
for, i.e fourteen year old males.
WW
Timo S Saloniemi
>They have a lot of options to pursue, and I hope they have the
>opportunity to do all of them. Things like:
>
>- How "Memory Alpha" came about
A nice detail, if a bit obscure. One wonders if there are Memories Beta
through Omega, as well?
>- How the Federation was formed
And whether the simplistic timescale we currently believe in is truly
accurate. Perhaps there won't be a real Federation within the scope
of the series, *or* in 2161 - just a series of steps leading to what
will gradually grow to the UFP by Kirk's time.
>- What started the Earth-Romulan war
And whether it really was as big a deal as fans like to think. Perhaps
it was rather a forgettable little border skirmish, remembered only by
the likes of Stiles?
>- What honked off the Klingons (or did they adequately
> answer that one already?)
I think that still is an ongoing effort... But it seems to boil
down to "Klingons are honked off by default", which isn't all
that interesting dramatically.
>- How did we become friends with the Vulcans? (There is so much
> hostility between Humans and Vulcans at this point, how did that
> get resolved?)
And did it, really? Vulcans in TOS basically came in three variants:
Spock, those who sneered at humans a lot, and those who schemed against
humans a lot... Vulcans in DS9 came in two: those who sneered, and those
who schemed. Perhaps the relatively benevolent Vulcans of TNG and VOY
have given us misconceptions about the real relationship between humans
and Vulcans?
Timo Saloniemi
Timo S Saloniemi
>In article <bbeqsk$tjd$1...@nntp.hut.fi>, Timo S Saloniemi
><tsal...@cc.hut.fi> wrote:
>> >- How the Federation was formed
>> And whether the simplistic timescale we currently believe in is truly
>> accurate. Perhaps there won't be a real Federation within the scope
>> of the series, *or* in 2161 - just a series of steps leading to what
>> will gradually grow to the UFP by Kirk's time.
>It was nailed down very specifically: In TNG ("The Outcast") it is
>clearly stated that the Federation was formed in the year 2161. (That
>date is also on the Starfleet Academy patch, I believe.) You don't need
>to make it more complicated than that.
But I'm still allowed to. :) Saying that the Federation was founded
in 2161 could be like saying that the United States gained independence
in 1776. The "deeper truth" could be more interesting and more dramatically
appealing.
>Unless we jump forward a few years, Enterprise won't get to the
>founding of the Federation anyway (the seventh season will end in about
>2158, onscreen-wise), so they don't even need to deal with it (unless
>they save it for an Enterprise movie).
Then again, a story set in 1767-74 would be pretty weird if it
did not make some use of the independence struggle. Or at least of the
related French revolution.
Timo Saloniemi
EvilBill[AGQx]
> In article <MPG.1941d720c...@newstest2.earthlink.net> Steve
> Silverwood <kb6...@arrl.net> writes:
>
>> They have a lot of options to pursue, and I hope they have the
>> opportunity to do all of them. Things like:
>>
>> - How "Memory Alpha" came about
>
> A nice detail, if a bit obscure. One wonders if there are Memories
> Beta
> through Omega, as well?
>
Presumably there's at least a Memory Beta - no large-scale computer
system can go without a backup!
>> - How the Federation was formed
>
> And whether the simplistic timescale we currently believe in is truly
> accurate. Perhaps there won't be a real Federation within the scope
> of the series, *or* in 2161 - just a series of steps leading to what
> will gradually grow to the UFP by Kirk's time.
>
Probably a Federation formed solely of Earth and Vulcan and their
colonies, which grows over the years to include Andorians, Denobulans,
Deltans, Betazoids, Tellarites and so on.
>> - What started the Earth-Romulan war
>
> And whether it really was as big a deal as fans like to think. Perhaps
> it was rather a forgettable little border skirmish, remembered only by
> the likes of Stiles?
>
Well, it certainly had some far-reaching implications. No contact with
the Romulans for a century afterwards; a Neutral Zone that was enforced
for 215 years afterwards (until the Dominion War forced the Romulans and
Federation into alliance), etc.
>
>> - How did we become friends with the Vulcans? (There is so much
>> hostility between Humans and Vulcans at this point, how did that
>> get resolved?)
>
> And did it, really? Vulcans in TOS basically came in three variants:
> Spock, those who sneered at humans a lot, and those who schemed
> against
> humans a lot...
And Sarek, who was also a variant unto himself. <g>
> Vulcans in DS9 came in two: those who sneered, and
> those
> who schemed. Perhaps the relatively benevolent Vulcans of TNG and VOY
> have given us misconceptions about the real relationship between
> humans
> and Vulcans?
>
> Timo Saloniemi
--
--
* "We few. We happy few."
"We band of buggers."
E-mail: evilbill @ lineone . net (remove spaces to e-mail)
AIM: EvilBill1782
MSN: dev...@agqx-imperium.fsnet.co.uk (do not e-mail me here!)
Web: http://www.angelfire.com/alt/evilbill/index.html
Matriarch Kheperkare - Lvl 94 Javazon - Open
Matriarch EB-Amarice - Lvl 92 Bowazon - USWest
Grainne Gillespie
> > Spock, those who sneered at humans a lot, and those who schemed
> > against
> > humans a lot...
>
> And Sarek, who was also a variant unto himself. <g>
Hmmm, a lot of the Enterprise Vulcans wouldn't have looked out of place at
the Council of Elrond in LOTR:ROTR.
Sarek even looks a little like Elrond himself, it's the eyebrows I think