2-2
Maxx
Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells
> Still haven't beaten us this millenium. Always in our shadow....
Except all bar one of those at WHL has ended in a draw. Yeah, really in
your shadow!
DTW
big...@montypython.com
in truth we were outplayed and very lucky to end up with a draw.
talent without organisation
our defense at time borders on amateur and opportunities to relieve
pressure (and god forgive) counter attack are regularly missed. Its
all too predictable.
Its disappointing because we probably have the core of a top side and
really should have matched up with the arse.
Astute buying is not the answer, we need to make a few major signings
b4 next season to add some backbone to our players up front.
YID ARMY
<big...@montypython.com> wrote in message
news:sbel231mkea4ef4cq...@4ax.com...
Having been in strong positions against Arsenal, Chelsea and ManU in the
last few weeks, the tactical ineptitude seems to be the missing link. MJ
needs coaching support. He clearly struggles to motivate the side into
converting leads into wins.
After half time it was back to the same old bullshit. Sit back and absorb
pressure. The only problem was that we haven't got the talent to do so. Did
anyone doubt that Arsenal would score after the first 5 minutes of the
second half? Why is it that everyone at the ground was screaming at Jennas
for being a lazy and uncommitted? Yet we don't make substitutions early
enough. Wenger immediately spotted that Lundberg wasn't playing well and
replaced him with Fabregas - who made an instant impact - one which we
struggled to counter. Instead, we play Lennon out of position again and
replace him with Steed. Why not just switch him to the right? We replaced
our only player with any width.
Jenas scored a miracle goal - one utterly undeserved by the team, and
especially him. The scoreline didn't reflect the gulf in class between the 2
sides, and the fact that Jol now needs help. He is going into unknown waters
and tactically needs to be way more shrewd and pro-active. The second half
performance was the worst half I've seen at the Lane all season (with the
possible exception of ManU), and after their second goal the mood was just
despair at how it just seems to be that the management do not recognise that
with our leaky defence, we have to keep attacking all the time. There is a
big gulf between us and the top 4. We can compete offensively but not
defensively. Surely it doesn't take a genius to work out that we need to
score more goals than them and the only way that can happen is if we press
on and pressure them, not sit back trying to protect a fragile lead with one
of the leakiest defences in recent history.
big...@montypython.com
wrote:
well put. i wish i'd have said that.
but we now have a team with the best potential for decades. it would
be a pity if we don't galvanise it into a winning team.
the team is the sum of the parts , and there are stil a few key parts
missing.
Maxx
So you're in denial about all our other wins over you, Premiership
titles (including unbeaten), FA Cups, Doubles, CL exploits (including
Finals) etc etc.
Understandable I guess.
YID ARMY
<big...@montypython.com> wrote in message
news:r02m23troo56dcss4...@4ax.com...
I agree that we have a strong 1st team and should be capable of more. I
don;t want to see a buying spree this summer, just more output from the
existing team. We have players who work their socks off from start to
finish, and then we have a couple who just turn up.
We have had winning positions in all our recent big games, only to see them
turn to dust.
The Seville game was a prime example of tactical idiocy. To play Chimbonda
on the left was ridiculous. Lennon had no support on the right and was
irrelevant in that position as a result. Taino, a player who HAS had
experience of playing on the left was played at right-back.
Could you see Fergusson switching Giggs and Scholes because of an injury?
This is what I mean about tactical naiveté. It was obvious that they would
come out after half-time and batter us. Our response was a pathetic...so
much so that 1 minute before they scored their first goal I said to my
daughter that we were going to be stuffed.
MJ is no fool, but I just feel that he has got to a point where everything
he does is a massive learning curve. Maybe Chris Hughton needs more tactical
help as an assistant? I don't know about that, but when compared to incisive
match-changing substitutions and tactics, we just lack something that the
big 4 have in spades - the ability to 'change-up'.
On paper the team is much better than last year, but the reality is that the
number of soft goals that we concede is just not consistent with a club
aiming for the top.
The number of set-piece goals scored against us this season must be huge,
and until we have a defence capable of preventing other teams from scoring
an average of 1.5 goals per premiership game against us, we will always be
second tier.
farj
if you look at this season and the one before, its clear that as a team we
are making progress, to me it seems like arsenal tho is trailing backwards.
But seriously i dont follow arsenal at all so i wouldnt know.
I only hope we can get that 5th position, so we establish ourselves among
the big 5
"Maxx" <sc...@executivemail.co.za> skrev i meddelandet
news:1177228785....@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
Dewi Gwyn
<snip>
> Why is it that everyone at the ground was screaming at Jennas for being a
> lazy and uncommitted?
<snip>
> Jenas scored a miracle goal - one utterly undeserved by the team, and
> especially him.
<cue rant>
I thought exactly the same Yid Army. I've been watching Jenas a little more
carefully since being disappointed with his game at Goodison (another game
where he scored in the last few minutes). It was his rash challenge, mainly
because he was out of position, which gave ARSE the free kick which resulted
in their first goal. I told my son just before the free kick was taken that
I would be exceptionally annoyed with Jenas if the Arse scored.
Jenas off the ball
When Jenas doesn't have the ball he walks about aimlessly near the centre
circle watching the play pass him by. He'll let opposition midfielders and
even defenders glide by him without a challenge, probably thinking that it's
not his responsibility and that our back 4 will somehow cope. He won't even
try to intercept obvious passes only a few feet away from him. It's not a
coincidence that both Arsenal's goals were scored after Tainio was
substituted. Tainio does the work of two in our midfield because Jenas isn't
pulling his weight and without Tainio's high work rate and the additional
threat of Fabregas our midfield of Jenas, Lennon, Zokora and Malbranque was
nonexistent against the ARSE during the 2nd half. I know people here hate
the player I'm going to mention now but Jenas should take a leaf out of
Robbie Savage's book about work rate and work ethic. What Savage lacks in
talent he makes up for with sheer tenacity, what's sad is that Jenas has
much more talent than Savage but I know which type of player I'd prefer to
have in my side.
Jenas on the ball
His free kicks and corners are awful at the best of times. When Jenas does
get the ball to his feet he constantly passes the ball sideways or back when
a quick forward ball is what Berbatov, Keane and Defoe would thrive on. But
the thing that really annoys me is the fact that, instead of taking a player
on or push forward he will often offload the ball to another Spurs player
behind him, surrounded by opposition players and in a worse position than he
is. This "if he loses the ball then it isn't my fault" mentality really
pi$$e$ me off about Jenas. This "as long as it isn't my fault" ideology
seems to permeate his game - he doesn't take any responsibility for his
actions and doesn't seem to want any responsibility either.
Until Jenas picks up his work rate and takes responsiblility he'll always be
a passenger and the odd goal will not negate this fact. He had a crap game
yesterday but scored a lucky goal in the final seconds and is then labeled
as "genius Jenas" by Sky !! What total bollox !! We need to have a good look
at our midfield and start weeding. We can't have a lazy Jenas and an out of
position Lennon in the same midfield as this takes 2 players out of our
midfield giving us a midfield of 2 instead of 4. No matter how much running
the likes of Tainio and Zokora do to cover the gaps, sides like the ARSE,
Seville, Chel$cum, ManUre and Liverpool will just walk through our midfield
and pummel our back 4. Watch the replays of our cup exits if you want to see
what happens when we ask our midfield to step up to the mark and defend.
Personally I'd start by saying farewell to Murphy, Malbranque and Jenas this
summer. I'd also give our midfielding youngsters like O'Hara, Yeates, Lewis,
Maghoma, McKenna, Daniels and Hallfredsson a taste of first team action in
say the Carling Cup. Playing our first team in the league and also
proceeding much further in all cup competitions this year has definitely had
a detrimental effect on our league position. As I'm in the mood I might as
well add I'd even contemplate selling Lennon for a ludicrous amount of money
if we persist in playing him out of position and someone is stupid enough to
offer £25 million+. This money, added to our war chest and money from the
sale of Murphy, Malbranque and Jenas, would enable us to purchase a much
more balanced and hard working midfield.
Whilst I'm on a rant I've also found something negative to say about
Berbatov. His movement on and off the ball doesn't half show us how poor
some of our players are ;-)
<rant over>
COYS
jj66
"farj" <tommyw...@telia.com> wrote in message
news:bMGWh.39138$E02....@newsb.telia.net...
> Nah i dont think he is in denial, he just dosent care much about arsenal
and
> if you look at this season and the one before, its clear that as a team we
> are making progress, to me it seems like arsenal tho is trailing
backwards.
> But seriously i dont follow arsenal at all so i wouldnt know.
>
> I only hope we can get that 5th position, so we establish ourselves among
> the big 5
>
It's very possible. Next saturday both Everton and Bolton have Man Utd and
Chelsea respectively. And they are both early kick offs. I would say that by
3pm it's all in our hands. It's going to be close, especially with Reading
and Portsmouth very close to us. But all we need now is 4 wins against
opposition all below us.
pod
>
> I only hope we can get that 5th position, so we establish ourselves among
> the big 5
>
So the season draws to a close and to the fans on here who, at the start of
the season. predicted we will wins cups and get 4th in the league, its looks
like it has not materialised again.
I guess there are dreamers and realists and I don't belong to the former so,
I am not too disappointed about not winning anything but, naturally I am
about the team and management.If there are spurs fans on here who don't
like negative thing said about your team, and are easily offended then
please don't read on.
To all those who said that they would not want to buy any new players but,
would want to stick with the ones we have got, then surely they can see that
we have problems right through the team.
This rotation is not working, we can't seem to find a balanced team. With
the strikers we have got Berby, a genius, Keane, a bit above average, Defoe,
average, and Mido poor.With the rotation Defoe has only got a handful of
games so, his form is very poor but, is he overrated anyway? He's greedy,
always offside and is too light ,and too short, to throw his weight around.
Keane has formed a good partnership with Berby on his good days and the rest
of the time , he is a useless moaning twat. He is a bit overrated with spurs
fans, and against good teams ( with a good defence ) he and Defoe are
exposed for what the are. Also against good teams, they can keep Berby
fairly quiet, by hacking him down, and having him well marked.With him
quiet, that's our scoring force knackered then. What they must do during the
close season is to, off load Defoe and Mido and buy a great (tall ) striker
similar to Berby, and give Keane the option of fighting for his place.
Is it me or is young Lennon becoming boring and predictable on the left
wing? The manager is a twat, for playing him there ( there is no nice way of
saying that ) Keep him on the right, buy a left winger and that's our
forwards sorted for next season.
The defence is a joke at the moment. What about all those goals let in this
season?. We have Dawson, a world class player, who without him could easy
have had, half as many goals again, let in against us. King good player ( in
my option no Sol in his prime ) I wonder if he is going to be one of those
players who, is always going to pick up injuries and miss most of the
season?Anyway unless there is another Dawson lurking in the club we need to
buy someone to fit into the back four. For the record I also think Lee has
come on leaps and bounds this season and, look forward to seeing him there
next season.
The midfield looks a bit shaky too. I still think Jenas could get better
with time, and would like him to stay for another season at least.
Malbranque is another who could improve with time, but he wont if he is only
getting half a game most the time. So I think we need to buy at least three
new players and get rid of all the dead wood if we are to progress a little
bit farther.
As for the management, well every one says what a nice man he is. He may
well be, but I would rather have a nasty one who will win us something. What
is he thinking about when he plays all those players out of position, and
the times he has tried to sit on a one goal lead. What's with bringing back
Mido and buying Murphy, then only played him a few times.Seem like he needs
a money management course, as well as a football manger's course to me.
So there it is, we just need three new players, and maybe a new manger half
way through the new season :-)
In reality though, we will never be able to match the top four for many
years yet. To catch up, a team would have to have 4 or 5 top class £20
million players brought in to the club, have a stadium with a 50,000+
capacity to get the money coming in, and pay huge wages. Spurs cant meet
that criteria, so we are going to be a also rans trying to get into the "
not good enough for the CL cup" for many years yet. Its sad but true.
Here's hoping something good happens at the club next season
Dan
(in article <gvKdnUDHHrzA17bb...@bt.com>):
i think we have many more problems in our team apart from Jenas. Watching us
this season prooved although we aren't far from the top 4 we are still that
big step away.
Unless we can find ourselves a Gerrard, Essien, Scholes our midfield is
always going to struggle the fact is these players are the difference between
being top 4 and not yes i know chelsea have a lot of other good players and
essien isn't the one man team scholes and gerrard can be but he does do a lot
more for the team than people give him credit. Its no coinsidence that
chelsea have struggled a bit in games when essien has had to play right back
or centre back.
I think there are several players in our team that aren't good enough. Keane
for example is a instictive genius one week and moaning waste of space hte
next. He plays in midfield when he is a striker often leaving berba on his
own. Defoe brilliant if give a run of games but he never is.
I think this summer we need a left back and left winger well no change there
a central midfielder who really grabs the games by the bollocks and a striker
that wants to be a striker not a midfielder.
If anything we need an experienced head to come in a new davids that can calm
things down and motivate the players when 1 nil up or 1 nil down. We seem to
either drop our heads of give up in either of these scenarios.
Dan
(in article <4bKWh.55369$aB1....@fe3.news.blueyonder.co.uk>):
I personally would sell keane and mido before defoe and in realisty probably
sell all three of them. I think if defoe was given a run of games like when
keane was injured he would score 20 goals a season keane never will and so
isn't good enough for where we want to be.
> Is it me or is young Lennon becoming boring and predictable on the left
> wing? The manager is a twat, for playing him there ( there is no nice way of
> saying that ) Keep him on the right, buy a left winger and that's our
> forwards sorted for next season.
>
well is he doing it so he can be unpredictable. fergie when they first
bought ronaldo started playing him on the left wing so he was forced to learn
how to use his left foot. As the season has gone on lennon can now put a
decent enough cross in with both feet unlike last season so if we buy a left
winger this summer lennon on the right will be a bit more unpredictable as he
can cut in on his left or go straight down the wing.
>
> The defence is a joke at the moment. What about all those goals let in this
> season?. We have Dawson, a world class player, who without him could easy
> have had, half as many goals again, let in against us. King good player ( in
> my option no Sol in his prime ) I wonder if he is going to be one of those
> players who, is always going to pick up injuries and miss most of the
> season?Anyway unless there is another Dawson lurking in the club we need to
> buy someone to fit into the back four. For the record I also think Lee has
> come on leaps and bounds this season and, look forward to seeing him there
> next season.
>
well dervitte looked good when he came on in the cup but i would like to see
us get an experienced centre back in to teach dawson and also be a captain.
> The midfield looks a bit shaky too. I still think Jenas could get better
> with time, and would like him to stay for another season at least.
> Malbranque is another who could improve with time, but he wont if he is only
> getting half a game most the time. So I think we need to buy at least three
> new players and get rid of all the dead wood if we are to progress a little
> bit farther.
>
malbranque to me seems unfit as he used to run himself into the ground in
games at the start of the season and was a good player now he comes on and
looks tired from the off.
>
> As for the management, well every one says what a nice man he is. He may
> well be, but I would rather have a nasty one who will win us something. What
> is he thinking about when he plays all those players out of position, and
> the times he has tried to sit on a one goal lead. What's with bringing back
> Mido and buying Murphy, then only played him a few times.Seem like he needs
> a money management course, as well as a football manger's course to me.
>
i think like a lot of spurs fans you are getting confused with his job. jol
doesn't buy the players comolli will give him a list and he would pick. Its
a bit like getting a company car at work. You boss goes o.k i'll give you a
list of options he comes back with a ferrari, fiat, renault and skoda. Well
obviously you would go for the ferrari the question is what lists is comolli
drafting up as if the options when i was give the choice of central
midfielders the best choices were ghali and murphy as well as left
midfielders malbranque maybe commoli should be the one fighting for his job.
I mean even i can see they aren't good players and i'm not a professional
scout with years of experience.
> So there it is, we just need three new players, and maybe a new manger half
> way through the new season :-)
>
the thing i love about spurs is we always need a new manager. if mourinho
came in we won the league and then were out of all cups and finished 4th the
following season we would need a new manager. silly but true.
gareth...@gmail.com
> > the big 5
Finishing 5th won't do that. We have to convincingly do it.
> So the season draws to a close and to the fans on here who, at the start of
> the season. predicted we will wins cups and get 4th in the league, its looks
> like it has not materialised again.
Those fans were being extremely unrealistic. Cups are as much as a
lottery as you can get in football. Who you draw, what players you
have available at that time, the players they have available, one
referee decision can cost you progession etc. As for the League?
Arsenal & Liverpool aren't a million miles ahead but they are ahead.
> To all those who said that they would not want to buy any new players but,
> would want to stick with the ones we have got, then surely they can see that
> we have problems right through the team.
I don't think anyone seriously believes our first XI is perfect.
> This rotation is not working, we can't seem to find a balanced team. With
> the strikers we have got Berby, a genius, Keane, a bit above average, Defoe,
> average, and Mido poor.
I am no fan of Keane or Mido but that is ridiculous. Both are good
players. Whether they are good enough for top four is another
debate. Same applies to Defoe.
>With the rotation Defoe has only got a handful of
> games so, his form is very poor but, is he overrated anyway? He's greedy,
> always offside and is too light ,and too short, to throw his weight around.
Always offside seems to be a stick Spurs fans batter him with when he
doesn't get caught offside anymore than Berbatov or Keane.
> Keane has formed a good partnership with Berby on his good days and the rest
> of the time , he is a useless moaning twat. He is a bit overrated with spurs
> fans, and against good teams ( with a good defence ) he and Defoe are
> exposed for what the are. Also against good teams, they can keep Berby
> fairly quiet, by hacking him down, and having him well marked.With him
> quiet, that's our scoring force knackered then. What they must do during the
> close season is to, off load Defoe and Mido and buy a great (tall ) striker
> similar to Berby, and give Keane the option of fighting for his place.
Against quality teams, with quality defences expecting the strikers to
pull us through is crazy. They NEED service. Against weaker defences
they can fashion chances out themselves, against better teams the
service has to be provided for them.
> Is it me or is young Lennon becoming boring and predictable on the left
> wing? The manager is a twat, for playing him there ( there is no nice way of
> saying that ) Keep him on the right, buy a left winger and that's our
> forwards sorted for next season.
Lennon has "underachieved" this season no matter where he has played.
He has had a handful of good games and that is it. But it's the
unrealistic expectations fans burden him with that is frustrating.
Last year Lennon was good, but not great and yet the way some Spurs
fans were creaming themselves was down right embarrasing.
> The defence is a joke at the moment. What about all those goals let in this
> season?. We have Dawson, a world class player, who without him could easy
> have had, half as many goals again, let in against us. King good player ( in
> my option no Sol in his prime ) I wonder if he is going to be one of those
> players who, is always going to pick up injuries and miss most of the
> season?Anyway unless there is another Dawson lurking in the club we need to
> buy someone to fit into the back four. For the record I also think Lee has
> come on leaps and bounds this season and, look forward to seeing him there
> next season.
Dawson world class? lmao!! I like Dawson. He is a good old fashioned
English centre half. He'll never be good international class, but for
us he will be a talisman in the same way Gary Mabbutt was, and the way
Steve Bruce was for Man Utd (neither good enough at international
level). King is a different class to Dawson. Indeed I'd rate King as
the best English centre half for years. Whilst the likes of John "Not
international class" Terry and Rio "inconsistant" Ferdinand get the
plaudits, King quietly does the job with less fuss, less glamour but
more efficiency than either of them. As for Campbell? One of the
most over rated players in the games history, and this isn't
bitterness because I was saying so when he played for Spurs and I said
it on this very newsgroup.
> The midfield looks a bit shaky too. I still think Jenas could get better
> with time,
With time? lol! He isn't a youngster anymore. Jenas will NEVER
improve. What you see is what you get.
>and would like him to stay for another season at least.
> Malbranque is another who could improve with time, but he wont if he is only
> getting half a game most the time. So I think we need to buy at least three
> new players and get rid of all the dead wood if we are to progress a little
> bit farther.
Midfield lacks balance. Tainio I'd keep, he uses the ball well and
keeps it moving forwards and also is the best we have defensively, and
play a holding player alongside him. Lennon on the right and a new
leftie.
> As for the management, well every one says what a nice man he is. He may
> well be, but I would rather have a nasty one who will win us something. What
> is he thinking about when he plays all those players out of position, and
> the times he has tried to sit on a one goal lead. What's with bringing back
> Mido and buying Murphy, then only played him a few times.Seem like he needs
> a money management course, as well as a football manger's course to me.
Unbelievable. He gives us our best finish in years and even this year
we are fighting for 5th to four games to go. You're the sort of fan
who probably wanted Burkinshaw fired back in 1980.
> In reality though, we will never be able to match the top four for many
> years yet. To catch up, a team would have to have 4 or 5 top class £20
> million players brought in to the club, have a stadium with a 50,000+
> capacity to get the money coming in, and pay huge wages. Spurs cant meet
> that criteria, so we are going to be a also rans trying to get into the "
> not good enough for the CL cup" for many years yet. Its sad but true.
>
> Here's hoping something good happens at the club next season
We are very close. If we had Carrick this year we'd be top four.
pod
"Dan" <daniel_w...@btNOSPAMinternet.com> wrote in message
news:0001HW.C2513ED6...@news.clara.net...
Dan, Keane has not scored many in the prem but, he has scored 19 in all
this season.Some of them have been with a brillant first touch, granted
against some weak teams. Some of the clubs in the early stages of the EUFA
cup, are no better than mid table Championship teams in my opinon. I have
never been a Keane fan but, he has been playing better with Berby and seem
to be good at taking pens.
>
>
>> Is it me or is young Lennon becoming boring and predictable on the left
>> wing? The manager is a twat, for playing him there ( there is no nice way
>> of
>> saying that ) Keep him on the right, buy a left winger and that's our
>> forwards sorted for next season.
>>
>
> well is he doing it so he can be unpredictable. fergie when they first
> bought ronaldo started playing him on the left wing so he was forced to
> learn
> how to use his left foot. As the season has gone on lennon can now put a
> decent enough cross in with both feet unlike last season so if we buy a
> left
> winger this summer lennon on the right will be a bit more unpredictable as
> he
> can cut in on his left or go straight down the wing.
Lennon has got probably, the weakest shot in the prem and, needs to do
something about it. I know he has scored a handfull of goals but, in front
of the net I have seen him put in loads of weak shots.Same thing happened
for England in the world cup, missed a sitter because he put in a weak kick.
Talking of kicks, don't you think it is about time spurs had a free kick
specialist. We haven't had one for years.Imagine how many more goals would
be scored if, we had someone how could take free ficks.
I can't believe Jol has no say in , who comes to the club. Sir Alex and Jose
always seem to get their man.
>
>
>> So there it is, we just need three new players, and maybe a new manger
>> half
>> way through the new season :-)
>>
>
> the thing i love about spurs is we always need a new manager. if mourinho
> came in we won the league and then were out of all cups and finished 4th
> the
> following season we would need a new manager. silly but true.
If you were not good at your job, would your boss keep you on?
>
Dan
(in article <8bPWh.77652$ne6....@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk>):
i was thinking talking about the same thing in the pub before the seville
game is it me or was ziegler our last decent free kick taker? We have
huddlestone who has the ability to but seems to float it in rather than shoot
and jenas who 8 times out of ten puts in a poor ball.
i think he gets the final say so picks from a list. well they are bad
examples as both manage teams in the top 2 always in the champions league and
well in joses case has money to burn. They still make a lot of mistakes
though jose has bough 4 right backs since being there and they are all shit.
strikers well they only have drogba. man u just poach players from other
premiership clubs both still have bought flops though
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>> So there it is, we just need three new players, and maybe a new manger
>>> half
>>> way through the new season :-)
>>>
>>
>> the thing i love about spurs is we always need a new manager. if mourinho
>> came in we won the league and then were out of all cups and finished 4th
>> the
>> following season we would need a new manager. silly but true.
>
> If you were not good at your job, would your boss keep you on?
>
well depends if i was doing better at the job than anyone in the past ten
years had then yes. if i was plane useless then no.
ggg
Anyone else think Robinson has been poor this season aswell?
pod
<gareth...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1177272068.8...@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> > I only hope we can get that 5th position, so we establish ourselves
> > among
> > the big 5
Finishing 5th won't do that. We have to convincingly do it.
never said we would finish 5th, more like 7th
> So the season draws to a close and to the fans on here who, at the start
> of
> the season. predicted we will wins cups and get 4th in the league, its
> looks
> like it has not materialised again.
Those fans were being extremely unrealistic. Cups are as much as a
lottery as you can get in football. Who you draw, what players you
have available at that time, the players they have available, one
referee decision can cost you progession etc. As for the League?
Arsenal & Liverpool aren't a million miles ahead but they are ahead.
I agree with you on the cups being a lottery but, I recon the big four are
still a good way ahead.
> To all those who said that they would not want to buy any new players but,
> would want to stick with the ones we have got, then surely they can see
> that
> we have problems right through the team.
I don't think anyone seriously believes our first XI is perfect.
> This rotation is not working, we can't seem to find a balanced team. With
> the strikers we have got Berby, a genius, Keane, a bit above average,
> Defoe,
> average, and Mido poor.
I am no fan of Keane or Mido but that is ridiculous. Both are good
players. Whether they are good enough for top four is another
debate. Same applies to Defoe.
compared to the strikers in the top they are just average
>With the rotation Defoe has only got a handful of
> games so, his form is very poor but, is he overrated anyway? He's greedy,
> always offside and is too light ,and too short, to throw his weight
> around.
Always offside seems to be a stick Spurs fans batter him with when he
doesn't get caught offside anymore than Berbatov or Keane.
sorry but he does
> Keane has formed a good partnership with Berby on his good days and the
> rest
> of the time , he is a useless moaning twat. He is a bit overrated with
> spurs
> fans, and against good teams ( with a good defence ) he and Defoe are
> exposed for what the are. Also against good teams, they can keep Berby
> fairly quiet, by hacking him down, and having him well marked.With him
> quiet, that's our scoring force knackered then. What they must do during
> the
> close season is to, off load Defoe and Mido and buy a great (tall )
> striker
> similar to Berby, and give Keane the option of fighting for his place.
Against quality teams, with quality defences expecting the strikers to
pull us through is crazy. They NEED service. Against weaker defences
they can fashion chances out themselves, against better teams the
service has to be provided for them.
what about the scores of chances they have missed this season, that cant be
all blamed on the midfield and defence
dont know how many games you have watched this season, but it always seems
to be Dawson heading the ball out of danger and has started in 49 games. Not
bad for a good old fashion centre half
> The midfield looks a bit shaky too. I still think Jenas could get better
> with time,
With time? lol! He isn't a youngster anymore. Jenas will NEVER
improve. What you see is what you get.
He is not excatly over the hill either
>and would like him to stay for another season at least.
> Malbranque is another who could improve with time, but he wont if he is
> only
> getting half a game most the time. So I think we need to buy at least
> three
> new players and get rid of all the dead wood if we are to progress a
> little
> bit farther.
Midfield lacks balance. Tainio I'd keep, he uses the ball well and
keeps it moving forwards and also is the best we have defensively, and
play a holding player alongside him. Lennon on the right and a new
leftie.
It about opinion, I still think Dawson is the best defender
> As for the management, well every one says what a nice man he is. He may
> well be, but I would rather have a nasty one who will win us something.
> What
> is he thinking about when he plays all those players out of position, and
> the times he has tried to sit on a one goal lead. What's with bringing
> back
> Mido and buying Murphy, then only played him a few times.Seem like he
> needs
> a money management course, as well as a football manger's course to me.
Unbelievable. He gives us our best finish in years and even this year
we are fighting for 5th to four games to go. You're the sort of fan
who probably wanted Burkinshaw fired back in 1980.
5th , 6th or 7th at the end of the day it is all the same.A good team needs
a good manager Again have a look at the top four.You are the sort of fan
that settles for second best
> In reality though, we will never be able to match the top four for many
> years yet. To catch up, a team would have to have 4 or 5 top class £20
> million players brought in to the club, have a stadium with a 50,000+
> capacity to get the money coming in, and pay huge wages. Spurs cant meet
> that criteria, so we are going to be a also rans trying to get into the "
> not good enough for the CL cup" for many years yet. Its sad but true.
>
> Here's hoping something good happens at the club next season
We are very close. If we had Carrick this year we'd be top four.
That is a stupid comment. One man does not make a team and, we are not good
enough for top four
Dewi Gwyn
> Jenas will NEVER improve.
> What you see is what you get.
I couldn't agree more MK.
YID ARMY
> We are very close. If we had Carrick this year we'd be top four.
I've agreed with a lot of what you've sais....but your last sentence is just
wrong.
What has fucked us this year is defensive ineptitude and tactical naivette.
Even with Carrick, we would still have had a problem with Ledley bneing
injured. Carrick seems to be remembered with rose-coloured glasses, but I
remember him as being an influential player in no more than 1 in 3 games at
best.
We are a long way from being top 4, although we have the basis of a good 1st
team, the squad lacks real quality beyond the usual picks. Huddlestone just
looks lumbering and ungainly - why could he not have played at centre back?
He is certainly the right size, and is not mobile enough for the position he
plays in.
We need to invest in beefing up the left flank and a couple of quality
midfield players - not another Murphy etc.
A decision needs to be made about Defoe and Keane. Neither is good enough
IMHO to be a natural first choice. W have a real quality player in Berbatov,
but he won;t hang around too long if all he sees is Keane hanging back and
spending the game whining.
Jol has brought us a long way, but the leap we now need to make may be
beyond his experience. He needs help with his coaching staff on the tactical
side...and I don't mean jobs for the old boys like Clive Allen and Chris
Hughton. He needs a right hand man who has experience with Champions League
football. This will bring Jol on as well and we can take the steps needed.
YID ARMY
"ggg" <wq...@spam.com> wrote in message
news:g4jn23dbd4jghgqir...@4ax.com...
> On 22 Apr 2007 13:01:08 -0700, gareth...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>
> Anyone else think Robinson has been poor this season aswell?
Yes...the number of set pieces conceded has been a joke. He is a great
reactive shot-stopper, but he isn't the best in the Premiership this season.
>
>
YID ARMY
"Dewi Gwyn" <dewi...@CYMRUbtinternet.com> wrote in message
news:4aWdnUyxa6vhU7bb...@bt.com...
Unfortunately I've reached that conclusion as well.
>
>
gareth...@gmail.com
> <gareth.mi...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1177272068.8...@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > I only hope we can get that 5th position, so we establish ourselves
> > > among
> > > the big 5
>
> Finishing 5th won't do that. We have to convincingly do it.
>
> never said we would finish 5th, more like 7th
How will finishing 7th establish us among the top 5 then??
> I am no fan of Keane or Mido but that is ridiculous. Both are good
> players. Whether they are good enough for top four is another
> debate. Same applies to Defoe.
>
> compared to the strikers in the top they are just average
Compared to who? Baptiste? Saha? Bellamy? And outside of the top
four what strikers, at other clubs, are miles ahead? I can't think of
one.
> >With the rotation Defoe has only got a handful of
> > games so, his form is very poor but, is he overrated anyway? He's greedy,
> > always offside and is too light ,and too short, to throw his weight
> > around.
>
> Always offside seems to be a stick Spurs fans batter him with when he
> doesn't get caught offside anymore than Berbatov or Keane.
>
> sorry but he does
Statistically he doesn't. Just look how many times Berbatov was
caught offside against the Scum. It's the way we try and break the
offside trap.
> Against quality teams, with quality defences expecting the strikers to
> pull us through is crazy. They NEED service. Against weaker defences
> they can fashion chances out themselves, against better teams the
> service has to be provided for them.
>
> what about the scores of chances they have missed this season, that cant be
> all blamed on the midfield and defence
How many have they missed? If my team was a creative one I'd expect
each striker to miss one chance a game and by chance I mean where it
is easier to score than miss.
> Dawson world class? lmao!! I like Dawson. He is a good old fashioned
> English centre half. He'll never be good international class, but for
> us he will be a talisman in the same way Gary Mabbutt was, and the way
> Steve Bruce was for Man Utd (neither good enough at international
> level). King is a different class to Dawson. Indeed I'd rate King as
> the best English centre half for years. Whilst the likes of John "Not
> international class" Terry and Rio "inconsistant" Ferdinand get the
> plaudits, King quietly does the job with less fuss, less glamour but
> more efficiency than either of them. As for Campbell? One of the
> most over rated players in the games history, and this isn't
> bitterness because I was saying so when he played for Spurs and I said
> it on this very newsgroup.
>
> dont know how many games you have watched this season, but it always seems
> to be Dawson heading the ball out of danger and has started in 49 games. Not
> bad for a good old fashion centre half
I can't believe the whole 49 games thing. He is young and plays in
the least energetic outfield position on the pitch. Once he has
played 60 to 70 games in a season maybe, and just maybe, he can use
tiredness as an excuse but I don't think so. And he has had a good
season and he is good in the air defensively (at attacking set pieces
he is awful), but Bruce was brilliant in the air. Steve Bould was
also. Dean Richards was also brilliant in the air. Doesn't make them
world class.
> With time? lol! He isn't a youngster anymore. Jenas will NEVER
> improve. What you see is what you get.
>
> He is not excatly over the hill either
But, like Keane, he is at an age where improvements are unlikely.
> Midfield lacks balance. Tainio I'd keep, he uses the ball well and
> keeps it moving forwards and also is the best we have defensively, and
> play a holding player alongside him. Lennon on the right and a new
> leftie.
>
> It about opinion, I still think Dawson is the best defender
I was talking about our best defensive player in the midfield.
> Unbelievable. He gives us our best finish in years and even this year
> we are fighting for 5th to four games to go. You're the sort of fan
> who probably wanted Burkinshaw fired back in 1980.
>
> 5th , 6th or 7th at the end of the day it is all the same.A good team needs
> a good manager Again have a look at the top four.You are the sort of fan
> that settles for second best
Yes let's look. Two successive seasons Arsenal trophyless. And let's
look at Fergie's first six years in charge at Man Utd. Impressive
eh? You are the sort of fan with unrealistic expectations of what can
be achieved in the short term. Jol should be given 5 seasons to make
us a top four team. At LEAST 5 seasons.
>
> We are very close. If we had Carrick this year we'd be top four.
>
> That is a stupid comment. One man does not make a team and, we are not good
> enough for top four
Actually one man CAN make the difference and it's often proven so.
One player can make the difference between a team winning the title
and finishing second (co-incidence that the two seasons Roy Keane
suffered a bad injury that Utd lost the title? Or when Cantona was
suspended? What about Arsenal's drastic fall from title challenging
grace. Co-incidence that during the last two seasons Henry has missed
a lot of games?). One man can make the difference between a team
finishing comfortable mid-table or being relegation candidates
(remember Sheringham back in 93/94?), one man can make the difference
between a side being top six or 14th. It is a team game but every
team has influential players and if they lose one of them it costs
them pts. And even losing 10pts can make a difference. Carrick is
the best defensive holding player in the country and look how solid we
were last year when he played. Him playing may have made we didn't
concede so many sloppy goals, may have kept hold of leads in the Cup
games, may have gotten 10 more pts this season, may have beaten
Arsenal etc. We'll never know but one man CAN and often DOES make a
difference.
tailspin1
see a vast improvement in him during the last 4 games I would not want to
see his name on the teamsheet for next season. Of course, that is just my
opinion and that of several thousand fans. The board may see something
different in him to the rest of us and choose to include him with players
such as the likes of Murphy - another lazy player who rarely gets involved.
farj
"pod" <p...@theinternet.com> skrev i meddelandet
news:8bPWh.77652$ne6....@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
i dont have the same info as you guys as i am in sweden, but to m it seems
atleast on the pitch that keane seems to love playing for this club, wich it
worth alot in my humble opinion, and when he has a bad run he keeps on
fighting until he finally scores. To me it looks obvious also that defoe has
no confidence at all atm. Berby and keane as pod said has fromed a great
partnership, when defoe and berby plays, you see berb making all kinds of
gestures to defoe and almost seems irritated playing alongside him, wich is
not helping defoes confidence of course, but keane and berby works alot
better together. Keane arent a bad player, far from it, he is just deffrent
then berbatov. I think if keane would be in a team like united he would
score tons and the guy is still quite young, only 26 right?
Berby is the greates player we have and according to me the greatest we have
had in quite sometime, altho i dont think it woud be better if we had 2
berbatovs up front, i do think keane and berby is a good match, and on a
good day, they win games for us.
We do score alot, but we let in almost as many as we score, normally if you
score 3 goals you should win the match, but it isnt so for us. Why? we have
robbo, the england keeper, we have ledley who has been playing for england
and we have dawson who everyone says is already a world class player. Dawson
is still young and he do make misstakes, unlike most i dont blame ever other
defender when he do make a misstake, but the lad has the future ahead of
him.
yay i went of the subject there, as it was meant to be about keane, i just
hope we keep the guy, i dont think berby and keane has been letting us down,
we have good scorers and we have a decent defence, but our engine isnt all
that great
gareth...@gmail.com
> wrong.
> What has fucked us this year is defensive ineptitude and tactical naivette.
> Even with Carrick, we would still have had a problem with Ledley bneing
> injured. Carrick seems to be remembered with rose-coloured glasses, but I
> remember him as being an influential player in no more than 1 in 3 games at
> best.
I remember him being influential almost all the time but it totally
depended on what you expected of him as a player. The fans who
expected him to create and control midfielders were always going to be
sorely disappointed. The fans who expected him to be a Makalele style
player were delighted. I belong in the latter camp :-) Defensively
he is the best midfielder in the country now. One of the reasons we
concede so many goals is because the defence isn't protected enough by
our midfield. When Carrick played it was. The other thing that he
was also exceptional at was clearing near post corners and when he
cleared them he did so properly. Right now we put too much pressure
on ourselves but not clearing set pieces correctly. We get a head on
it and it goes up in the air or straight down the middle back to the
opposition. Carrick used to get distance and head away at an angle,
normally out for a throw.
> We are a long way from being top 4, although we have the basis of a good 1st
> team, the squad lacks real quality beyond the usual picks. Huddlestone just
> looks lumbering and ungainly - why could he not have played at centre back?
I know that a lot of fans love Huddlestone. I can't see the fuss and
never have. Yes he has a nice pass on him sometimes but he is 20,
Fabregas is 19 (and I think he is wildly over rated too) and yet the
class difference between them is huge. I don't think we're a long way
from top four. I look at Liverpool and I look at Arsenal and hand on
heart there aren't many players from either of those sides that I
think would automatically walk into our first team. We also should
have got top four last season and if it wasn't for a disasterous start
this season we would have been pushing top four again. We're knocking
on the door.
> He is certainly the right size, and is not mobile enough for the position he
> plays in.
Huddlestone defensively is poor though, hence why he'll never be a
centre half or a Carrick replacement.
> We need to invest in beefing up the left flank and a couple of quality
> midfield players - not another Murphy etc.
As I said elsewhere I think we need a leftie and also a holding
player. One massive mistake Jol made this year was letting Davids go
in favour of Huddlestone. We should've kept Davids. Had we played
him more I am certain we'd be in a better position.
> A decision needs to be made about Defoe and Keane. Neither is good enough
> IMHO to be a natural first choice. W have a real quality player in Berbatov,
> but he won;t hang around too long if all he sees is Keane hanging back and
> spending the game whining.
Berbatov has raised the bar but the guy is an exception and we have to
remember that. We aren't going to get another forward as good as
Berbatov to play alongside Berbatov and that isn't a problem. Defoe
and Keane are good enough for what we need them to do but one must be
kept in as first choice.
> Jol has brought us a long way, but the leap we now need to make may be
> beyond his experience. He needs help with his coaching staff on the tactical
> side...and I don't mean jobs for the old boys like Clive Allen and Chris
> Hughton. He needs a right hand man who has experience with Champions League
> football. This will bring Jol on as well and we can take the steps needed.
Like Mourinho had experience at Porto?? He'll get experience by
building it at Spurs. There is no panic yet and we are well on course
for qualifying for the CL in Jol's first five seasons in charge and
that is an acceptable criteria to judge him on.
Dave Gallagher
"YID ARMY" <yi...@thfc.co.uk> wrote in message
news:M7qdnXRb8azXbbfb...@bt.com...
I'm afraid I simply can't, as I have found myself saying before, accept this
facile idea that Jol is "tactically naïve", much less at the level you're
suggesting, which seems tantamount to a claim that he might conceivably be
outperformed by the average armchair fan. What tactical aspects exactly are
you saying he is naïve about?
Yes, the best form of defence often is attack, but there's absolutely no way
we could have attacked Arsenal for 90 minutes, or anywhere near it,
Saturday, whether anybody had made a "tactical decision" to do so or not.
The most obvious reason is that we weren't going to be allowed to. We might
have tried to hold a line higher up the pitch but, if we had done that, it's
not unlikely that (a) we would have tired even quicker than we did and (b)
we'd more than once have seen Adebayour put through one-on-one with
Robinson, and waltzing round him to side-foot the ball into an empty net. We
might have been more aggressive as well - I wouldn't disagree with that -
but then again, we seemed to pick up enough yellow cards as it was.
As you've suggested yourself, it's a question of talent. Our midfield aren't
good enough at holding the ball under pressure, or at winning it back once
lost, for that matter. It was a very warm day Saturday as well - there
seemed to be a few struggling with cramp if I recall correctly - and the
safest way we have of allowing our players to rest, since we aren't great at
holding the ball, is to drop back and try to play solidly in our own half.
Sadly, we're not all that great at that at the minute, either, but we did at
least manage not to concede from open play, albeit that we got very lucky
once or twice. Once Tainio picked up a knock, we were always going to
struggle to hold our own in midfield.
Arsenal, on the other hand, never let us rest. They employed the very
effective tactic of harrying Zokora and Jenas, particularly, whenever they
received possession. The predictable result was that they were usually able
to prevent them releasing the ball forwards (not that Jenas often looks for
that option, generally speaking, anyway), to keep Lennon quiet by starving
him of possession, and to win it back very quickly. And having done so, if
playing somebody in was not an immediate option, they were able to retain
possession much more effectively than us and bide their time waiting for
openings, (a) because they pass the ball a lot better than we do, and (b)
because we had more or less given up any pretence of defensive play in the
Arsenal half. This pattern, especially in the second period, can't have come
as much of a surprise to anybody who has seen both teams play this season,
but the most significant factor here has to do with the physical attributes
of our central midfield pair. Jol can't decide tactically to turn Didier
Zokora into Roy Keane.
On the question of whether it would have been more effective to use Lennon
on the right, especially after the introduction of Malbranque, well, they
did, in fact, switch sides after a while, and Lennon was hardly any more
effective on the other flank. The release of the ball to him was just as
effectively stifled, and when he did receive it, he was very quickly made
the meat in a red and white sandwich.
Personally, I think one of the things that really killed us on the day
(along with the fact that we lack personnel in midfield who can really hold
off a challenge, we're too indecisive in the final third and our final ball
in too often lacks quality) was the standard of our set-piece play, which
you've alluded to yourself. Our level of concentration when defending set
pieces was very poor - there was too much finger-pointing and ball-watching
going on and not enough thinking - and we need to learn about clearing the
ball properly. Count the number of times Dawson heads the ball out straight
to an opposing player in a central or other dangerous area. Couple that with
the all-too-familiar rank ineffectiveness of our own dead-ball work, and I'd
say it was arguably the main reason we didn't really deserve anything out of
the game. I certainly wouldn't agree that it is a question of "naïveté" on
Jol's part.
YID ARMY
"Dave Gallagher" <dga...@nothanks.msn.com> wrote in message
news:5962n8F...@mid.individual.net...
Take last Saturday:
Jenas was desperate and incredibly stayed on.
Zokora drove forward at every attempt and was subbed.
No credible link play to Berbatov left him scrapping for nothing from
Robinsons' punts.
Defoe put on with 3 minutes to play
Then giving up strong positions against Arsenal in the Carling, Chelsea in
the FA, Defensice suicide in the UEFA
>
> Yes, the best form of defence often is attack, but there's absolutely no
> way we could have attacked Arsenal for 90 minutes, or anywhere near it,
> Saturday, whether anybody had made a "tactical decision" to do so or not.
> The most obvious reason is that we weren't going to be allowed to. We
> might have tried to hold a line higher up the pitch but, if we had done
> that, it's not unlikely that (a) we would have tired even quicker than we
> did and (b) we'd more than once have seen Adebayour put through one-on-one
> with Robinson, and waltzing round him to side-foot the ball into an empty
> net. We might have been more aggressive as well - I wouldn't disagree with
> that - but then again, we seemed to pick up enough yellow cards as it was.
We sat back and let them come at us. There was not one single attampt on
goal until Arsenal had scored twice in the second half - not one.
>
> As you've suggested yourself, it's a question of talent. Our midfield
> aren't good enough at holding the ball under pressure, or at winning it
> back once lost, for that matter. It was a very warm day Saturday as well -
> there seemed to be a few struggling with cramp if I recall correctly - and
> the safest way we have of allowing our players to rest, since we aren't
> great at holding the ball, is to drop back and try to play solidly in our
> own half. Sadly, we're not all that great at that at the minute, either,
> but we did at least manage not to concede from open play, albeit that we
> got very lucky once or twice. Once Tainio picked up a knock, we were
> always going to struggle to hold our own in midfield.
Agreed....with £7 million passengers like Jenas, this is no surprise.
>
> Arsenal, on the other hand, never let us rest. They employed the very
> effective tactic of harrying Zokora and Jenas, particularly, whenever they
> received possession. The predictable result was that they were usually
> able to prevent them releasing the ball forwards (not that Jenas often
> looks for that option, generally speaking, anyway), to keep Lennon quiet
> by starving him of possession, and to win it back very quickly. And having
> done so, if playing somebody in was not an immediate option, they were
> able to retain possession much more effectively than us and bide their
> time waiting for openings, (a) because they pass the ball a lot better
> than we do, and (b) because we had more or less given up any pretence of
> defensive play in the Arsenal half. This pattern, especially in the second
> period, can't have come as much of a surprise to anybody who has seen both
> teams play this season, but the most significant factor here has to do
> with the physical attributes of our central midfield pair. Jol can't
> decide tactically to turn Didier Zokora into Roy Keane.
But what you're saying is that Wenger found a way to beta us...and we
couldn't respond....again.
This is what I mean. Jol can't seem to get the team to respond to tactical
changes. It's almost as if they go into a game expecting the opposition to
play a certain way....which they can cope with. It's when the opposition
change-up and change tactics that we are floundering. The substitutions are
generally very reactive and not nearly pro-active enough.
Don;t get me wrong, I don't want to see MJ leave, I just think that he is
lacking vital experience,which can be improved by bringing in experienced
assistants.
Tommy Harmer
>
You could put Jose Maurinho and Alex ferguson in charge of Hartlepool and
no matter what tactical nous or experience they might possess - they are
still going to get beaten by Arsenal.
MJ made decisions based on his reading of the play and what let us down was
that he was having to compete with a forward line firing on 50 % - Keane was
hopeless apart from his goal, and a midfield fuctioning at 50% - Lennon and
Jenas were having a 'mare - so Zokora and Tainio were fighting a well
controlled and efficient fighting unit - blessed with the sublime skills of
Fabregas.
Jols only mistake, in my view, is persisting with Jenas - who is as much use
as a bootlace in a flip flop at the moment - goal aside - he was inept and
anonymous. If we could have Tainio play a full 90 minutes we'd be better
off, if we had someone with passing skills and vision like Fabregas, with a
minder like Gilberto we would have spanked them. They played as well as they
did because that had a skill advantage that Jol cannot match with his
current assets.
Blaming Jol is like blaming Brad Gilbert when Andy Murray fails to beat
Nadal - unless he has the opportunity to use Federer as an alternative.
tailspin1
notice that for every match he plays, people like Lennon and Berbatov can't
get into the game as well as when he doesn't play. Jenas cannot pass the
ball efficiently enough for Lennon to make any positive runs and any through
ball to Berbatov is too far ahead/behind for it to be effective. Unless
Jenas plays in a wide position on the right he is about as useful as a
chocolate fireguard and even there he would probably still be ineffective.
Some folk argue that Hudds is not good enough to fill the holding player
role but I cannot agree less. His distribution has declined because: 1. He
is not getting enough of a run together to form any consistancy and 2. He
needs to play further forward than he has been. My guess is that when he has
played he is asked to drop far back to cover as a possible optional central
defender which is not really his game. He needs to be used more like Gerrard
and not played with Jenas.
Close season sales - Jenas, Murphy, Gardner and Zeigler (If we are not going
to use him).
Close season Purchases - Not sure!
BrianE
@btinternet.com says...
> Close season sales - Jenas, Murphy, Gardner and Zeigler (If we are not going
> to use him).
> Close season Purchases - Not sure!
Tevez?
--
thar's gold in them thar hills..
tailspin1
> --
Have a feelin', Bri, that he'll end up following his compatriot to
Liverpool. He's also a bit like Jenas in that he's a lazy player and unless
it's a gold plate, gifted chance he doesn't tend to do much. His strike
against us earlier this year was a blinder but he has done little all else
since and according to Curbs he was "...not 'appy..." with him a couple of
weeks back in the game at Manure.
BrianE
Jol is utterly outstanding. As a manager in the Prem, he's on a steep
learning curve and will only get better imho.
The football we've played this season has at times, been breathtaking
and this and the club as a whole is several country miles
from the shambolic mess of 4/5 years ago.
OK, we've won bugger all, but I for one, have been entertained massively.
It'll come, so long as we keep the management structure as it is.
Oh, and I think JJ is excellent. <blows raspberry and ducks>
Just my tuppenceworth.
big...@montypython.com
wrote:
i haven't followed the thread, but it started with agreement that we
have the best potential in decades, with only mild criticism of MJ.
But we have a general organisational problem, esp. at the back.
The arse game again showed just how brittle we are. It is
dissapointing when (for the first time in decades) we have 90% of a
top side.
I've got no problem with MJ but think we need a big signing (or two),
midfield & defense. We already have plenty of players to bring on.
BrianE
> i haven't followed the thread, but it started with agreement that we
> have the best potential in decades, with only mild criticism of MJ.
>
> But we have a general organisational problem, esp. at the back.
> The arse game again showed just how brittle we are. It is
> dissapointing when (for the first time in decades) we have 90% of a
> top side.
>
> I've got no problem with MJ but think we need a big signing (or two),
> midfield & defense. We already have plenty of players to bring on.
Pretty much spot on. I was just trying to get things into perspective
when you
consider the state the club *was* in.
Hopefully, good times ahead.
lewi...@bellsouth.net
<big...@montypython.com> wrote in message
news:9r1u23piitlbshv00...@4ax.com...
We need a midfield dynamo, someone who's skillful, works non-stop, and
possesses abundant enthusiasm which he knows how to pass on to those around
him. All great teams have had them. We once had Mackay. The scum had
Viera. United had Keane. We need someone who can shake a fist at our
players and make them go the extra mile. We haven't had it since Graham
Roberts, and he wasn't half the player Mackay was.
Never mind a left-sided defender, a left-sided midfield player. Get us an
inspirational dynamo. That's what we need more than anything else!
big...@montypython.com
yea - i was thinking more midfield.
you get the feeling that if we found such a player it would add the
missing part as you described. bosltering defense & attack
and its not puuting all your eggs in one basket as the teams good
enough to stand up once we get attitude
gareth...@gmail.com
> possesses abundant enthusiasm which he knows how to pass on to those around
> him. All great teams have had them. We once had Mackay. The scum had
> Viera. United had Keane. We need someone who can shake a fist at our
> players and make them go the extra mile. We haven't had it since Graham
> Roberts, and he wasn't half the player Mackay was.
>
> Never mind a left-sided defender, a left-sided midfield player. Get us an
> inspirational dynamo. That's what we need more than anything else!
I think the days of that sort of midfielder have gone. I don't even
think Vieira was that sort of midfielder either. I guess the closest
is Steven "Over rated" Gerrard, but I would hardly call him an
inspiration leader (as demonstrated by England) and he is often stuck
out wide right (his best position IMO).
IMO it's balance we lack. All successful teams have a holding/
defensive midfielder. A player who is disciplined, won't get ahead of
the play. It's often an unglamourous role, and a good holding player
can barely be noticed if he is doing the job right. Hamann was more
important to Liverpool than Gerrard (just look at the CL final).
Petit more important than Vieira. Keane more important than Scholes.
This isn't saying that Gerrard, Vieira and Scholes aren't very good
players or are not influential but the holding midfielder is
absolutely vital.
It's why England under Sven were so damn poor despite having so many
highly rated players. In WC2002 he stumbled up on a successfulish
midfield but only because Gerrard got injured and we played Butt in
the holding role. The main thing Francis did when he became Spurs
manager was bring Howells in as a holding player. Howells wasn't
international class but he was every bit as important in that side as
Teddy and Klinsmann, probably more so. Freund's injury probably cost
us the League Cup in 2002 (although Ferdinand would've probably just
missed more sitters had we been dominant lol!), or a place in Europe.
There is a reason why last seasons defence was one of the best in the
league and now it's so poor despite only minor personnel disruptions.
Carrick. And it's his absence that has highlighted why a holding
player is so vital. I wonder if we can get Mendes back from Pompey??