Chernaski....Another Wasted Draft Pick!
Danny Clark
Stefan Cherneski. 6'0 and 185lbs
This is a quote from the hockey news on "big" Stefan.
"....cautioned that his size and the fact he doesn't play big may work
against him, as would his lack of commitment to defensive hockey. If he
can't play on your top two lines ....he can't play.
Sound familiar? I think that we are loaded with 'em.
I am getting sick and tired of this team drafting small soft players.
That's all we need, another player that can't grind and drive to the net.
Maybe if we draft all players over 6'4 and 200 pounds a couple might pan
out. We have enough Dube's and Ferraro's floating around with loads of
skill and the size of Danny Devito.
What makes it even more painful is that Mike Brown was drafted next by the
Panthers. Mike is a player that has the potential to be the heavyweight
champ of the league and has above average skill. Another Probert without
the drugs? The guy is 6'5 and a center to boot. With Lindros in the
division for years to come....would he have been a better gamble? Wanna bet
Brown becomes a more effective NHL player than Cherneski?
....and we picked up Pelusso for the Plau signing by St. Louis. Why not
Twist? I do think Pelusso is a good pick up because of his banging....but
he is not a top ten fighter, let alone the league champ like the Twister.
We know the Rangers aint gonna get him now....holy shit, I'm having an
anxiety attack.
Another wasted draft pick and a failure to get the twister. Very good
maneuvering mr. Smith. You draft like shit. If it wasn't for the Edmonton
garage sale and the corporate money you'd of been fired many years ago.
Mike Stewart, the Ferraro's, Jeff Brown. You gotta be kidding. Draft some
freakin talented grit for god's sake.
Danny Clark
mrp...@earthlink.net
noone
i agreeDanny Clark wrote:
>
> Stefan Cherneski. 6'0 and 185lbs
>
> This is a quote from the hockey news on "big" Stefan.
>
> "....cautioned that his size and the fact he doesn't play big may work
> against him, as would his lack of commitment to defensive hockey. If he
> can't play on your top two lines ....he can't play.
>
> Sound familiar? I think that we are loaded with 'em.
>
> I am getting sick and tired of this team drafting small soft players.
> That's all we need, another player that can't grind and drive to the net.
> Maybe if we draft all players over 6'4 and 200 pounds a couple might pan
> out. We have enough Dube's and Ferraro's floating around with loads of
> skill and the size of Danny Devito.
>
> What makes it even more painful is that Mike Brown was drafted next by the
> Panthers. Mike is a player that has the potential to be the heavyweight
> champ of the league and has above average skill. Another Probert without
> the drugs? The guy is 6'5 and a center to boot. With Lindros in the
> division for years to come....would he have been a better gamble? Wanna bet
> Brown becomes a more effective NHL player than Cherneski?
> garage sale and the corporate money you'd of been fired many years ago.
> freakin talented grit for god's sake.
>
> Danny Clark
> mrp...@earthlink.net
i agree 100% cherniski is a little finesse player that would only be good in the west
where they are all small. the thing to do is to fire neil smith and get a real GM. They
need to trade the moldy oldie peluso for draft picks they don't have to first round but
just some youth for gods sake!
--
this ends my e-mail message. please visit me at
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Alley/4352
Ira Jasser
neal smith you bum,
mike brown would been our joel otto to counter
eric lindros, and he is also a great fighter
i guess we can look forward to more of the same: aging stars ,limited
size grit and youth
mike peluso is another retread.
boring
Doug Thompson
Danny Clark wrote:
> Stefan Cherneski. 6'0 and 185lbs
>
> I am getting sick and tired of this team drafting small soft players.
> That's all we need, another player that can't grind and drive to the
> net.
> Maybe if we draft all players over 6'4 and 200 pounds a couple might
> pan
> out. We have enough Dube's and Ferraro's floating around with loads of
>
> skill and the size of Danny Devito.
Let us not start to write off a player who has not attempted to make the
team. Let us look at some facts. An often over looked point of argument
is the fact that players from the Western Hockey League are usually,
because of the Western game, good skaters, strong on the boards, and
committed to winning.
noone
team
Steve Zipser (Sunshine Stereo, Inc.)
noone wrote:
>
> Ira Jasser wrote:
> >
> > neal smith you bum,
> > mike brown would been our joel otto to counter
> > eric lindros, and he is also a great fighter
> > i guess we can look forward to more of the same: aging stars ,limited
> > size grit and youth
> > mike peluso is another retread.
> > boringi agree and i will not watch hockey for a while till the rangers get a
> team
> --
Mike Brown & Paul Laus - quite a 1-2 PUNCH!
Keith D. Goldberg
In article <AFD1AAFE...@1cust112.max17.new-york.ny.ms.uu.net>,
mrp...@earthlink.net (Danny Clark) wrote:
> Stefan Cherneski. 6'0 and 185lbs
>
> This is a quote from the hockey news on "big" Stefan.
>
> "....cautioned that his size and the fact he doesn't play big may work
> against him, as would his lack of commitment to defensive hockey. If he
> can't play on your top two lines ....he can't play.
>
> Sound familiar? I think that we are loaded with 'em.
>
> I am getting sick and tired of this team drafting small soft players.
> That's all we need, another player that can't grind and drive to the net.
> Maybe if we draft all players over 6'4 and 200 pounds a couple might pan
> out. We have enough Dube's and Ferraro's floating around with loads of
> skill and the size of Danny Devito.
>
> What makes it even more painful is that Mike Brown was drafted next by the
> Panthers. Mike is a player that has the potential to be the heavyweight
> champ of the league and has above average skill. Another Probert without
> the drugs? The guy is 6'5 and a center to boot. With Lindros in the
> division for years to come....would he have been a better gamble? Wanna bet
> Brown becomes a more effective NHL player than Cherneski?
>
> ....and we picked up Pelusso for the Plau signing by St. Louis. Why not
> Twist? I do think Pelusso is a good pick up because of his banging....but
> he is not a top ten fighter, let alone the league champ like the Twister.
> We know the Rangers aint gonna get him now....holy shit, I'm having an
> anxiety attack.
>
> Another wasted draft pick and a failure to get the twister. Very good
> maneuvering mr. Smith. You draft like shit. If it wasn't for the Edmonton
> garage sale and the corporate money you'd of been fired many years ago.
> Mike Stewart, the Ferraro's, Jeff Brown. You gotta be kidding. Draft some
> freakin talented grit for god's sake.
>
> Danny Clark
> mrp...@earthlink.net
Don't be that quick to judge. Remember, this is the NHL draft, and you're
dealing with 18-year olds, so it's mostly a crapshoot. Also, the Rangers
were picking 19th, not 3rd or 4th. However, I think they addressed their
need, a high-scoring winger, which Cherneski is. Neil Smith says he thinks
Cherneski could develop into a John LeClair-type player. Of course, that's
just speculation. I respect Bob McKenzie and the THN's evalutaions highly,
but you should also look at the NHL's Central Scouting Bureau evaluations.
They Cherneski is an excellent two-way player, and very good on special
teams. They also say that he has tremendous character and is a very intense
player. The point is, you can't evaluate drafts until 3-5 years afterward.
However, Danny, you should be happy about their 2nd pick. THN likes Wes
Jarvis very much, he's 6-4, 203, and is only 18!
As for Peluso, I think it was a good pickup, a much better pickup than
Twist. Twist may be the best fighter, but Peluso is a good fighter, and he
also is more skilled than Twist. He really did some good things in New
Jersey. Also, he's another character guy, I've heard both St. Louis fans
and writers say that Peluso had a better attitude and was more of a team
player than Twist.
--
KDG
kdg...@is5.nyu.edu
"Jesus saves...but Gretzky scores on the rebound!"
Danny Clark
In article <kdg201-ya02408000...@news.supernews.com>,
kdg...@is5.nyu.edu (Keith D. Goldberg) wrote:
snip
>The point is, yes he might have been a good pick, but he is
>a natural center, and the Rangers have a greater need for scoring wings,
>which is why they drafted Cherneski. Besides, you get most of your grinders
>and checkers in the later rounds of drafts.
The Rangers need a big physical center more than they need another soft
scoring wing without size for down the road. They could use a scoring wing
*right now*.... and a natural center *when* Messier and Wayne retire in a
few. You said yourself that it takes a few years. Brown could be ready in a
few......
I agree that the draft is a crapshoot, however Smith's track record has not
been to good.... and in Brown they passed on a 6'5, above average skilled
player that can really fight and has more of a shot in the NHL than a
player that "might" score 30 goals. We *do* have Lindros in this division.
30 goal scorers can be bought or signed. Hull is a 60 goal man available
next year.
and speaking of soft goal scorers....
Ed Olcyck was a soft 40 goal scorer that we traded a goon and a forechecker
with character for. He ended up on the bench as we won the cup. Most fans
would never make that trade again. I cried when King and Domi were traded
for this very soft goal scorer. Think Pierre Turgeon is highly skilled? I'd
rather have Darren McCarty and so would a lot of GM's. Pierre is also a
soft player.
Kieth....check out Smiths drafting record since he took over. Kovalov is
his best and he is always on the trading rumour mill.
I also liked Ty Jones in the draft but he was taken by Chicago. These are
the guys that "might" turn into the Brad Mays and Rick Tochetts and maybe
even a Cam Neely. Cherneski might turn into a slightly larger Ferraro and
score some goals in the NHL. Becoming a LeClaire is a longshot, being he's
about 5 inches shorter.
Danny Clark
mrp...@earthlink.net
SV206
Right on Danny boy!!!!!
Keith D. Goldberg
In article <AFD4A954...@1cust101.max66.new-york.ny.ms.uu.net>,
mrp...@earthlink.net (Danny Clark) wrote:
As I said before, I think you can get the majority of your checkers and
grinders in the later rounds. A perfect example is Daniel Goneau, who the
Rangers grabbed in the second round. He could develop into a really solid
third-liner, or a possible second-liner. He's got good size, drives to the
net, and isn't afraid to take the body. The Rangers had to address a need,
and right now, it's wingers, which is why I think they drafetd Cherneski.
Wait three or four years in order to determine if it was a good pick or
not. Was Kris King or Tie Domi a first round pick?
Danny Clark
In article <33b3c662...@news.atl.mindspring.com>,
sher...@bluemtn.com (Michael H. Sherrane) wrote:
>mrp...@earthlink.net (Danny Clark) wrote:
>
>(snip)
>>
>>I agree that the draft is a crapshoot, however Smith's track record has not
>>been to good.... and in Brown they passed on a 6'5, above average skilled
>>player that can really fight and has more of a shot in the NHL than a
>>player that "might" score 30 goals. We *do* have Lindros in this division.
>
>Danny, you an I have a difference of opinion here. The Red Wings
>showed the league how to beat the size of the Flyers... with excellent
>speed and solid defensive play. The Rangers tried to get physical
>with Philadelphia and lost because the Flyers were bigger. Also, guys
>like Lindros, LeClair, and Renberg have good speed for big men. If we
>tried to match up size for size, it would be likely that Philly would
>be faster than us, which would still give them an advantage.
I agree that the Rangers need more speed _as much_ as they need to develop
a large skilled, physical type center. Messier and Wayne are gonna be
retired in a few more years. Dube and Eastwood are not the answer to our
1-2 center ice posistions. While I agree that the Flyers were beaten by a
quicker Red Wing team, they were also the victim of some serious
forechecking by the Wing fowards, in particular a Darren McCarty. The
Rangers lacked a good forecheck as well as finishers on the wing. Having a
quick team is useless if you can't score. I also felt that the Flyers
looked worn out and tired in the finals....a small chance the physical play
of the Rangers had an effect on the Flyers.
>Wasn't Courtnall one of the most effective Rangers vs. the Flyers?
>Was this because he could deliver "punnishing checks" or because he
>could just flat out beat them down the ice with his speed. Also, Dube
>was invisible during the regular season, but I noticed him on the ice
>vs. the Flyers. If CC played him regularly in the series, he could
>have made a difference. I also believe that if we had Kovalev and
>Sundstrom healthy, we would have won the series, or at least force a
>seventh game.
Courtnall was effective on the rush, however he had his usual scoring
problems. I hear a lot of people complain about us acquiring a Mogilny.
Why? He has speed and a scoring touch. Playing with Wayne he might score 60
goals.
>The point to this was that you are suggesting building a team to
>attack the Flyers strength. I'm suggesting we build a team that
>attacks the Flyers weakness. Put the pressure on them by getting
>_fast_ players. The Flyers cannot forecheck effectively against a
>fast team because they will give up too many odd man rushes. Make
>them defend their weakness to take them off of their game. If you
>analyze the series, the Rangers played just as physical as the Flyers.
>However, the Flyers forechecked effectively because they knew the
>Rangers couldn't beat them through the neutral zone on turnovers.
I don't think we need to build a team to get past the Flyers, yet. I do
think we will need a large center down the road to go against Lindros. The
Panthers thought that too. A Dube will not be able to go head up against
Eric and Otto. Too small. Eastwood is to soft. Messier is about finished as
was his shoddy performance in the playoffs. Wayne surprised me by lasting
against the physical play. Mike Brown could of been a future 2nd line
center with the size to neutralize Eric. Speed does kill ....if the whole
team is built around it. However a fast big man will be more effective
against a fast small man. The Wings won with a team commitment to defense
as the Rangers did throughout the playoffs. They had the speed to counter
in the nuetral zone. We did not....but it was still a closer series than
the five games dictate. We could of won any number of the losses we had. I
absolutely agree with your statement that the Flyers were not afraid of the
Rangers counter attack through the neutral zone. This was rather funny to
witness, as the Rangers have always been a fast quick countering team since
the arrival of Messier. We do need more team speed *and* a large young
center with size.
>>30 goal scorers can be bought or signed. Hull is a 60 goal man available
>>next year.
>>
>Although I could be wrong, I heard that Cheraski was an excellent
>skater and good hands. This is the type of player that could give a
>team like the Flyers fits. We do need some size, but I also believe
>we are more slow than small. We had four forwards last season who
>could skate (Messier, Kovalev, Courtnall, and Dube), but we have quite
>a few big defenceman. Out of our "fast" players, Messier has a few
>years left and Courtnall may not be re-signed. We need more speed in
>our lineup.
I'm no fortune teller, but going on past picks that the Rangers have made,
I'd gather that we blew this one too. I like team speedsters but we need a
big center for the future as much and there was one available. Cheraski
could become a 50 goal scorer ....who knows, but Brown could become a Joel
Otto that can fight as a top ten goon. We need both.
>>and speaking of soft goal scorers....
>>Ed Olcyck was a soft 40 goal scorer that we traded a goon and a forechecker
>>with character for. He ended up on the bench as we won the cup. Most fans
>>would never make that trade again. I cried when King and Domi were traded
>>for this very soft goal scorer. Think Pierre Turgeon is highly skilled? I'd
>>rather have Darren McCarty and so would a lot of GM's. Pierre is also a
>>soft player.
>>
>>Kieth....check out Smiths drafting record since he took over. Kovalov is
>>his best and he is always on the trading rumour mill.
>
>He's always involved with trade rumors because he is the only true
>"trade bait" the Rangers have. He is young, talented, and inexpensive
>enough for other teams to _want_ him.
>
>However, I will agree that the Rangers draft record is pretty awful.
>This could also indicate problems with the coaching in the minors....
>the players are not getting developed. It could also indicate a
>problem with the scouting department (maybe St. Louis taking Pleau is
>a blessing).
I was thinking the same thing with Pleau. Maybe he sabotaged our draft
being he was going to an opponent ;-) What's your thoughts on Peluso and
where he will fit in?
>Mike Sherrane
Danny Clark
mrp...@earthlink.net
Danny Clark
In article <33b4ac2d...@news.atl.mindspring.com>,
sher...@bluemtn.com (Michael H. Sherrane) wrote:
snip
>I think Peluso is an upgrade from Langdon or Berg. I would not be
>surprised to see a Peluso -- Eastwood -- Sundstrom line next year.
Larry Brooks from the Post suggested Peluso riding shotgun for Wayne.
That's a thought. Mike aint to bad of a hockey player and he does scrap
frequently enough to carry a decent reputation. All we'll need is that 50
goal scorer on the other side and that line might work.
I'm curious on the future of Robataille. If Kovalov plays on Messier's line
(assuming he re-signs) with Graves, and Dube gets a shot on the second line
with his speed and Peluso takes the powerfoward/cop wing on this
line....where would that leave the slow and soft 25 goal scorer? Hopefully
traded for a draft pick or a prospect. I can see Sundstom moving to the
third line with no problem, due to his fantastic defensive play. And he is
still young and learning.......
I'd still like the Rangers to make a serious offer for Skrudland. I was
reading somewhere that he want's to stay in Florida. Maybe if we can unload
Luc we can overpay for his services and let the money lure him. He would
help out Messier on the face offs tremendously. Hell, Messier might even be
effective come playoff time. This is assuming we re-sign the captain. A
third line of Sundstom/Skrudland/Tikk has potential.
If Dube pans out and Kovalov emerges as a scoring threat we might be set
with enough scoring. Both these guys could be the key to our offense next
year. Both however, are big question marks. Kovalov has never had that
breakout season and he is coming off serious knee surgery. Dube is a small
skilled player that will be a hit or miss. Which brings me up to Brett
Hull.
Brett is a unrestricted free agent after next year. The Blues might lose
him if they keep him. At best he would cost a fortune to keep. They just
might be inclined to trade him if the right offer came along. If we can
somehow unload Robataille and his salary, Brett might be affordable and
look good on our powerplay playing with Wayne once again. I realize he aint
the greatest defensive forward in the game but we need a scorer for these
two great centers....plain and simple. And we need that player next
year_if_ we would like to have a legit shot at the cup before the painful
rebuilding starts.
Of course if we put Peluso on the second line that would free up a goon
posistion on the fourth line for a top ten heavy to replace Langdon's mid
ranking.....maybe Twist included in my proposed Hull deal. I'm not giving
up on us acquiring him....although it is now doubtful to happen.
Kris King is also a free agent this year. He is a character player although
is probably to old to resign as a Ranger. Darren McCarty reminded me of
King although Darren is a bit bigger and younger. King and Domi really gave
the Rangers a physical presence back then. A Churla, Peluso combo could do
the same.... although I think Churla will be dealt as soon as he heals. And
of course little Domi was a top ten fighter despite his size. He has
slipped into the top 20 last year IMO and might be on that decline every
fighter experiences during his career. This is probably why his name was on
the trading block so much last year. You don't trade your most popular
player unless you have reason to. Same goes for Twist. They love him in St
Louis. Funny how the fighters become so recognized and popular.
Free agents the Rangers should acquire......
1....Brian Skrudland (see above post)
2....Luke Richardson (a much better defensive defenseman than Buek and
Cairns takes care of the fisticuffs)
Players the Rangers should resign......
1....Mark Messier (If he is reasonable at 4 million a year for two years.
Lure him with a couching job at the end of his contract)
2....Esa Tikkanen (If nothing else but for the playoffs. Alter his playing
with Berg for rest)
Players the Rangers should not resign.....
1....Glen Healy (save some money and use a less expensive back up)
2....Courtnall ( unless his demands are small I can't see him scoring on
the first two lines even with all that speed)
Players the Rangers should attempt to unload......
1....Luc Robitaille (Time for Dube or a bona fide _speedster_ that can
score)
2....LUC ROBITAILLE (in case you didn't hear me the first time)
3....Bruce Driver (eat his contract to get through that no trade bullshit)
Trade bait the Rangers should dangle......
1....Buekeboom (*If* we sign Richardson and Cairns is ready. We still need
size back there)
2....The Ferraro's (someone please take these drafted midgits. pleeze!)
3....Adam Graves (sorry!....but it is time to at least listen to offers)
Some players the Rangers should look to acquire through trade......
1....Brett Hull (especially if we lose Messier)
2....Shayne Corson (if we can't sign Skrudland how does Graves for Corson
sound?)
3.... Tony Twist (hey now.....you didn't think I'd given up on the twister)
4....Alexander Mogilney (If we can lure Quinn without to much given up I
think he would help out)
5....Brad May (big power forward that was on the block. Can be had for the
right price.)
6....Owan Nolan (another power foward with a lot more scoring touch. would
cost a lot but would be perfect on the top two lines)
Wow! To think that this short post started off on a Mike Sherrane snip.
Guess I'm excited about tonights Holyfield/Tyson brawl. " The Sound and the
Fury"
Danny Clark
mrp...@earthlink.net
Mark Dodd
You won't be able to unload Driver. The whole reason he came over to
the Rangers is the no trade clause....that he didn't want to relocate
his family.
Greg Stritmater
In article <33B77F...@earthlink.net>, Mark Dodd wrote:
>
>As a Devs fan, I still like Mike Peluso...and no question he will help
>beef up the Rangers. I give Smith credit in obtaining him. I have
>learned that when Larry Brooks has an idea you don't walk, but run from
>it. What is Gretsky going to do when he sets up office behind the net
>and is looking for a finisher? He needs two go-to guys not one.
>Peluso is a great character player but as several in the Ranger
>newsgroup have noted, he is expected to score about the same number of
>goals as St. Louis's new GM. Peluso will be more at home on a line of
>grinders and bangers, which if successful, may be able to put a few
>pucks of their own in the net...a la Crash Line.
I agree with you. I don't see Peluso playing too much with Gretz
(though with Soupy, you never know) I imagine he'll fit in nicely on the
third line with a combo of Eastwood, Flatley (if still here) and Berg. The
Eastwood, Flatley, Berg line was one of the most productive lines in the
early rounds of the playoffs. Adding Peluso to that line should only make
it better.
Greg
Mark Dodd
REMEMBER THE DAY THE COUNTRY DIED wrote:
>
> mrp...@earthlink.net (Danny Clark) allegedly of free mind and
>
> >Larry Brooks from the Post suggested Peluso riding shotgun for
> >Wayne. That's a thought. Mike aint to bad of a hockey player and
> >he does scrap frequently enough to carry a decent reputation. All
> >we'll need is that 50 goal scorer on the other side and that line
> >might work.
>
> don't think Peluso is what we need, but he can be used and worked in
> effectively...Now who to throw next to Wayne on the other wing if
> that happened... Still would like to see Kovalev working with Gretz > too,'cos Gretz is, well, the great one.