Brodeur Stevens Crosby
Roger Sherman
Crosby Ovechkin, with the point being who would you most like to have
if you were going to have one player to start a team around. I think
in that one Crosby is the only one you can even consider.
So, in typical Rog fashion, I took their decent idea, and turned it
into a great one. And a much more difficult one, I think. Who is the
one player you'd want to build a team around, if your choices were
Brodeur, Stevens, and Crosby.
After much hand wringing, and gnashing of teeth, I'm going with
Stevens.
peace,
Rog
Rckwy5
Stevens.
Defensemen like him simply do not grow on trees. Guys that can do
everything. Lead, score, hit, imtimidate, respect from everyone he
plays against, plays 20 mins a game, kills penalties, matches up
against the other teams top lines.
IMO, you build with defense, goaltending, forwards in that order. It's
just becoming too hard to find a defenseman that can do it all
compared to a forward or goaltender.
Keith
I have to go with Goaltending in both cases. Lundqvist has proven that
he's pretty damn good. Crosby is great, but if you build a team for
scoring and have a minor leaguer in net, you're going to have to win a
lot of games 6-5.
Same argument I have to make for the 3 choices you gave, although
Stevens is definitely one you can build a team around, I'd still go with
the Goaltender.
--
****************************************
Just a geek with a web site
http://www.justanotherwebsite.com
The Viceroy of New Arenas
I dunno how to answer that one. Maybe Brodvens. It's like choosing
between your heart and your lungs.
Roger Sherman
<ke...@spamsux.reversethelast2.com.justanotherwebsite> wrote:
>
>
>Roger Sherman wrote:
>> Over in the Rangers NG, they have a thread going, entitled Lundqvist
>> Crosby Ovechkin, with the point being who would you most like to have
>> if you were going to have one player to start a team around. I think
>> in that one Crosby is the only one you can even consider.
>>
>> So, in typical Rog fashion, I took their decent idea, and turned it
>> into a great one. And a much more difficult one, I think. Who is the
>> one player you'd want to build a team around, if your choices were
>> Brodeur, Stevens, and Crosby.
>>
>> After much hand wringing, and gnashing of teeth, I'm going with
>> Stevens.
>>
>> peace,
>>
>> Rog
>
>I have to go with Goaltending in both cases. Lundqvist has proven that
>he's pretty damn good. Crosby is great, but if you build a team for
>scoring and have a minor leaguer in net, you're going to have to win a
>lot of games 6-5.
I so disagree...Lundqvist is good, but do you really think he's going
to be an all time great? Crosby clearly is. You don't have to build
your team solely for scoring, just because you have Crosby...look at
the 91-92 Pens - they could beat you any way you wanted to play.
>
>Same argument I have to make for the 3 choices you gave, although
>Stevens is definitely one you can build a team around, I'd still go with
>the Goaltender.
peace,
Rog
news to me
"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:fa0ij3d96thmqsapj...@4ax.com...
Michael Ventolo
Hmm. In their initial forms, since we don't have a prime for Crosby yet?
Crosby first, Stevens close second, then Brodeur. Nothing against Marty,
but Crosby is Crosby and hasn't even matured yet, and Stevens had a full
skill-set for a defenseman.
> Rog
R.J.
I assume we're talking about these players in their primes. Like if
Brodeur and Stevens were both 27, and Crosby is, well... he still
looks like he's 12.
Hall of Fame defensemen are very hard to find and develop. Especially
now, since there is seemingly a dearth of truly elite caliber d-men
around the league. There are a lot of guys who are being paid as
elite defenders, that simply are not. Chara, McCabe, Souray, these
guys are not only a notch below players like Stevens, Bourque,
MacInnis, they're way below. Currently, you've got Lidstrom,
Niedermayer, and Pronger and that's really it.
A lot of teams have won Cups with goaltending that was just good
enough to win or with netminders that have suddenly gotten hot. Guys
like Osgood, Barrasso in the past, Cam Ward and Nikolai Khabibulin
more recently. None of these guys strike me as the type to wind up in
the Hall of Fame one day. J.S. Giguere, Mike Vernon, Mike Richter
(though Richter would've been greater had he not exploded his knees
and remained on a godawful Rangers team), to name a few more.
So it can be done.
Would the Devils have won their Cups without Brodeur? I think the
Devils *might've* won a Cup or two with someone else in net, certainly
not Patrick Lalime like some detractors would claim, but maybe someone
else. Maybe. Probably not. Brodeur is my favorite all-time NJ Devil
so don't think I'm diminishing his importance to this franchise. He's
going to have 500 wins all with one team, so they're not only 500
Martin Brodeur wins, they're also 500 New Jersey Devil wins.
But I know without a doubt they wouldn't have won shit without Scott
Stevens. If Stevens did not come back after getting his skull caved
in by Pavel Kubina in 2003, there still would only be two Stanley Cup
banners hanging from the rafters. Had the Devils accepted Curtis
Joseph and Rod Brind'amour instead of demanding him, there would be
zero.
I don't think Crosby should be considered here. He's likely to have a
great career, but he may not. Something could happen to him. He
could wind up like Lindros, someone who started out headed for the
Hall, but turned into simply an okay player that wasn't good enough to
shoulder a club to a championship.
Signed,
R.J.
Keith
R.J. wrote:
> On Nov 12, 5:46 pm, Roger Sherman <slammingroo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Over in the Rangers NG, they have a thread going, entitled Lundqvist
>> Crosby Ovechkin, with the point being who would you most like to have
>> if you were going to have one player to start a team around. I think
>> in that one Crosby is the only one you can even consider.
>>
>> So, in typical Rog fashion, I took their decent idea, and turned it
>> into a great one. And a much more difficult one, I think. Who is the
>> one player you'd want to build a team around, if your choices were
>> Brodeur, Stevens, and Crosby.
>>
>> After much hand wringing, and gnashing of teeth, I'm going with
>> Stevens.
>>
>> peace,
>>
>> Rog
>
> I assume we're talking about these players in their primes. Like if
> Brodeur and Stevens were both 27, and Crosby is, well... he still
> looks like he's 12.
Stevens prime was in his late 30s in NJ, not 27. Unless you mean his
prime time prize-fighting years. He was already 30 when he lead the
Devils in scoring in 1994, prior to 3 Cups.
--
R.J.
<ke...@spamsux.reversethelast2.com.justanotherwebsite> wrote:
> R.J. wrote:
> > On Nov 12, 5:46 pm, Roger Sherman <slammingroo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Over in the Rangers NG, they have a thread going, entitled Lundqvist
> >> Crosby Ovechkin, with the point being who would you most like to have
> >> if you were going to have one player to start a team around. I think
> >> in that one Crosby is the only one you can even consider.
>
> >> So, in typical Rog fashion, I took their decent idea, and turned it
> >> into a great one. And a much more difficult one, I think. Who is the
> >> one player you'd want to build a team around, if your choices were
> >> Brodeur, Stevens, and Crosby.
>
> >> After much hand wringing, and gnashing of teeth, I'm going with
> >> Stevens.
>
> >> peace,
>
> >> Rog
>
> > I assume we're talking about these players in their primes. Like if
> > Brodeur and Stevens were both 27, and Crosby is, well... he still
> > looks like he's 12.
>
> Stevens prime was in his late 30s in NJ, not 27. Unless you mean his
> prime time prize-fighting years. He was already 30 when he lead the
> Devils in scoring in 1994, prior to 3 Cups.
>
>
>
No need to argue semantics here. 27... 30... his "prime" began around
then and lasted for a decade.
Signed,
R.J.
Keith
Not arguing semantics, just making sure you're talking about the same
time period. 3 years makes a difference.
Iain Turnbull
>
> I dunno how to answer that one. Maybe Brodvens. It's like choosing
> between your heart and your lungs.
^^^^^^
This.
If I was a team-owner, though, then probably Crosby, simply because he's
the most likely to put arses on seats.
--
Iain Turnbull
Your home may be at risk if you set fire to it
Terms and conditions apply
Michael Ventolo
"R.J." <Devil...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1194951278....@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
IMO, he just junked part of his game to take it to the next level with the
rest of
it.
That's why I put him above Brodeur and right next to Crosby. Stevens was
really moldable, before he sacrificed some of his game, he could have been
any kind of defenseman you wanted him to be.
> Signed,
> R.J.
>
Roger Sherman
<iaintu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>The Viceroy of New Arenas wrote:
>>
>> I dunno how to answer that one. Maybe Brodvens. It's like choosing
>> between your heart and your lungs.
>
>^^^^^^
>This.
>
>If I was a team-owner, though, then probably Crosby, simply because he's
>the most likely to put arses on seats.
Interesting point.
peace,
Rog
news to me
"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:023kj3ht6bd36nhqm...@4ax.com...
Roger Sherman
<stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>but.... that's not what the root of the question you posed was about.
>
Nonetheless...
>
>"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:023kj3ht6bd36nhqm...@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 17:37:35 +0000, Iain Turnbull
>> <iaintu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>The Viceroy of New Arenas wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I dunno how to answer that one. Maybe Brodvens. It's like choosing
>>>> between your heart and your lungs.
>>>
>>>^^^^^^
>>>This.
>>>
>>>If I was a team-owner, though, then probably Crosby, simply because he's
>>>the most likely to put arses on seats.
>>
>> Interesting point.
>>
>> peace,
>>
>> Rog
>
peace,
Rog
news to me
that many ppl in seats - Brodeur and Crybaby will - If Brodeur was marketed
correctly he might have even put more in than any goalie ever.
"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1aimj3tbspb4d3f6s...@4ax.com...
Roger Sherman
<stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>That changes the whole picture though doesn't it? Stevens is NOT gonna put
>that many ppl in seats - Brodeur and Crybaby will - If Brodeur was marketed
>correctly he might have even put more in than any goalie ever.
Hey, everybody has a reason for why they would draft a player. I would
draft Stevens because of what he brings on the ice. Iain is
approaching it from the standpoint of a businessman who wants to make
money.
>
>
>"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1aimj3tbspb4d3f6s...@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 22:51:10 GMT, "news to me"
>> <stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>>
>>>but.... that's not what the root of the question you posed was about.
>>>
>>
>> Nonetheless...
>>
>>
>>>
>>>"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>news:023kj3ht6bd36nhqm...@4ax.com...
>>>> On Tue, 13 Nov 2007 17:37:35 +0000, Iain Turnbull
>>>> <iaintu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>The Viceroy of New Arenas wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I dunno how to answer that one. Maybe Brodvens. It's like choosing
>>>>>> between your heart and your lungs.
>>>>>
>>>>>^^^^^^
>>>>>This.
>>>>>
>>>>>If I was a team-owner, though, then probably Crosby, simply because he's
>>>>>the most likely to put arses on seats.
>>>>
>>>> Interesting point.
>>>>
>>>> peace,
>>>>
>>>> Rog
>>>
>>
>> peace,
>>
>> Rog
>
peace,
Rog
news to me
one you posed - I would venture a guess that most people's answers would
change based on this new criteria.
"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:i4kmj39j9qs6bnu1m...@4ax.com...
Roger Sherman
<stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>But there again - that changes the aspect of the question
Not at all - my original question was which player would you build
your team around. It didn't give any parameters for WHY you would
build around this player.
peace,
Rog
Iain Turnbull
> On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 19:30:15 GMT, "news to me"
> <stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
>> That changes the whole picture though doesn't it? Stevens is NOT gonna put
>> that many ppl in seats - Brodeur and Crybaby will - If Brodeur was marketed
>> correctly he might have even put more in than any goalie ever.
>
> Hey, everybody has a reason for why they would draft a player. I would
> draft Stevens because of what he brings on the ice. Iain is
> approaching it from the standpoint of a businessman who wants to make
> money.
Sad but true - I thought that was probably the closest reflection on how
most (if not all) NHL teams are actually run...
news to me
"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:jknmj3lqj3eaeh7m2...@4ax.com...
Roger Sherman
<stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>build your TEAM - not your franchise - two very different things
Ah, I see. You are telling me what I meant. Thanks!
peace,
Rog
Rckwy5
> On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 21:35:56 GMT, "news to me"
>
> >build your TEAM - not your franchise - two very different things
>
> Ah, I see. You are telling me what I meant. Thanks!
Well, i was told i was negative trying to be objective with the Devils
stick breaking/losing/dropping. Oh, and Elias. Try to find the
positives in either/or.
news to me
"Roger Sherman" <slammin...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:2hsmj3h48jml897qu...@4ax.com...
news to me
embarrassment i will not bother anymore
"Rckwy5" <Rck...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:1195079176....@57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com...
Michael Ventolo
"news to me" <stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:b1I_i.22952$if6....@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> That changes the whole picture though doesn't it? Stevens is NOT gonna
> put that many ppl in seats - Brodeur and Crybaby will - If Brodeur was
> marketed correctly he might have even put more in than any goalie ever.
I think Stevens could put asses in the seats. I don't know that a goalie
really can, unless he's the greatest ever and carrying a team of buffoons
with awesome performance after awesome performance.
You could market Stevens correctly too. People like violence and
trainwrecks.
It's part of the reason the 'new NHL' is hurting.
news to me
"Michael Ventolo" <now...@oblivion.ca> wrote in message
news:ELP_i.6891$TR5....@nlpi061.nbdc.sbc.com...
Roger Sherman
<stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>not what you meant - but what you said
Incorrect. You assigned a definition to the word team. Does everyone
have to be as precise with their words as you?
peace,
Rog
news to me
Roger Sherman
<stra...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>yes ;)
By that, you mean maybe.
peace,
Rog