Attendance Data
Al Giglio
attendance, a subject that is used to irritate us by fans of other
teams, and because I have WAY to much time on my hands right now, I did
a little research and analysis of the past years attendance figures and
found a few interesting factoids (all number reflect tickets sold and
not fannies in seats):
1. The Devils averaged 16,542 tickets sold per game which was up 3% from
the previous year.
2. The average tickets sold for the NHL was 16,585 which is only 43
tickets per game more than the Devils.
3. The original six teams had an average tickets sold of 17,998 and all
of the teams except the Rangers are playing in new arenas. The worst
teams by far were the Blackhawks at 14,997 (off 8%)and the Bruins at
15,433 (off 5%). The Bruins have to be the joke of the original six
because they have no NHL competition for hundreds of miles and only 4
major league teams in the market AND a new arena in a major metropolitan
area and only averages 15,433. Compare this with the Devils who have an
old arean, are in the shadow of an original six team and have 4 NHL
teams within 110 miles along with a total of 9 major league teams and
competition for the sport entertainment dollar and 16,542 looks pretty
good.
5. The rest of the league minus the original six attendance figure
averaged 16,231 which makes the Devils above average in this category.
The next time anyone hassels you about Devils attendance through these
numbers at them. BTW, I'll email a WordPerfect table to anyone who
wants it.
As if is wasn't already obvious, I'm going crazy without any hockey!!!!
Al G.
NEGross
would play to more than 87% capacity.
Also keep in mind that all those other NHL teams in the vicinity help Devils
attendance on several nights during the season.
Bob
"NEGross" <neg...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010723165848...@ng-mk1.aol.com...
> Interesting, although one would hope that the defending Stanley Cup
champs
> would play to more than 87% capacity.
>
> Also keep in mind that all those other NHL teams in the vicinity help
Devils
> attendance on several nights during the season.
Also keep in mind no other team has to compete for the sports dollar like
the Devils do. 3 MLB teams, 3 NBA teams,3 NFL teams, and 3 other NHL teams
which is 13 major league sports franchises competing for the same dollar in
our area with the Devils being the 13th team in to the fray.No other team in
sports except the Nets have to deal with that. I can afford to maybe make 3
or 4 sports games a year and since I like the Devils, Yankees, Giants and
Nets (though Ive never been to a Nets game) I spread my money around a bit
but mostly go to Devils games over the others.
jody
Al Giglio wrote:
> Because I've been having an on going discussion about Devil's
> attendance, a subject that is used to irritate us by fans of other
> teams, and because I have WAY to much time on my hands right now, I did
> a little research and analysis of the past years attendance figures and
> found a few interesting factoids (all number reflect tickets sold and
> not fannies in seats):
>
> 1. The Devils averaged 16,542 tickets sold per game which was up 3% from
> the previous year.
>
OK. Not great, considering that we won the cup the year earlier.
>
> 2. The average tickets sold for the NHL was 16,585 which is only 43
> tickets per game more than the Devils.
ok.
>
>
> 3. The original six teams had an average tickets sold of 17,998 and all
> of the teams except the Rangers are playing in new arenas. The worst
> teams by far were the Blackhawks at 14,997 (off 8%)and the Bruins at
> 15,433 (off 5%). The Bruins have to be the joke of the original six
> because they have no NHL competition for hundreds of miles and only 4
> major league teams in the market AND a new arena in a major metropolitan
> area and only averages 15,433. Compare this with the Devils who have an
> old arean, are in the shadow of an original six team and have 4 NHL
> teams within 110 miles along with a total of 9 major league teams and
> competition for the sport entertainment dollar and 16,542 looks pretty
> good.
>
Sorry, I don't buy it. I'm a season ticket holder, love the devs, but here's
some reality:
Our main competition for attendance dollars are the Rangers. We have a much
better team; in fact, we have a perrenial SC contender. The Rangers are now
one of the weaker teams in the NHL, and even a few years ago, were a little
better than average. Yet, I believe the Rangers sell out every night. We
rarely do. In fact, the place looks pretty empty an awful lot. For a typical
midweek game, if we're playing someone like Chi, Bos, TB, Car, etc, the
place is no more than 2/3 full.
It's a friggin' disgrace.
AnT716
>better team; in fact, we have a perrenial SC contender. The Rangers are now
>one of the weaker teams in the NHL, and even a few years ago, were a little
>better than average. Yet, I believe the Rangers sell out every night. We
>rarely do. In fact, the place looks pretty empty an awful lot. For a typical
>midweek game, if we're playing someone like Chi, Bos, TB, Car, etc, the
>place is no more than 2/3 full.
>
>It's a friggin' disgrace.
>
>
>
>
>
Also take into consideration the location of MSG compared to that of
Continental Airlines, and also the population of New York compared to NJ.
Bob
"AnT716" <ant...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010724010134...@ng-fc1.aol.com...
And if you watch the Ranger games there are plenty of empty seats since most
of the lower level is bought by corporations to give out as perks every year
but are not always used ( why bring a client to a game where the home team
sucks at the moment) They also dont want to lose those seats for future use
when the rangers rebound and they can wine and dine clients in a playoff run
in the future. Most corporations are also in NYC not NJ and the Garden has
very easy access by public transpotation where CAA is out of the way no
matter where you live. Along with that the Devils came here in 1982 so
anyone about 25 years old or older probably liked either the Rangers,
Islanders or Flyers before the Devils came to town and dont switch teams
easily. Even if the Devils were able to fill all the seats for every game
last year we as fans would still hear it from Ranger and Flyer fans that
Devil fans are nothing but a bunch of band wagon jumpers. I think the
attendance figures show this is not the case and at the same time does show
growth in the Devils fan base.
JCaramagna
>rarely do.
But the Rangers attendance is irrelevent. MSG is in the heart of Manhatten, the
Rangers would sell out of they finished in last place every year because of
their location first and foremost. Most of the tickets are owned by
corporations, and the seats are filled with clients, employees, etc. who can
shoot over to the game via subway right from work. Not many teams can say the
same. The Devils are not the property of any one city, and the arena is not
located in the heart of a business district, so a commute from work to a game
is much more difficult. Besides, there is also a big tourist market. People
wnat to travel to New York and watch a game in MSG regardless of the team's
record or who is even playing - they just want to take in a game in the world's
most famous arena. It's an entirely different situation. The Rangers don't need
success to fill their building - location and history are enough.
And theer is criticism that the CAA looks empty an awful lot. Put 17,000 people
in MSG, and 17,000 people at CAA, and guess which building looks more empty?
That's right, CAA, because it holds more people. It isn't a fair comparison.
For an arena that doesn't have much public transportation support, is located
in a swamp outside of any business areas, and has only been in existence for 20
years, the arena does very well.
Joey
Joey
<a href="http://martycubic.itgo.com">The Official Marty Cubic Site
(www.martycubic.itgo.com)</a>
Al Giglio
depends wholly on the size of the arena. If an arena hold 17,000 and
the team draws 16,000 their % is 94%. If an arena hold 19,000 and draws
17,000 their % is 89%. Which would you rather have?
Al G.
Al Giglio
I disagree with your statement about who the Devils compete with for
ticket sales. Typically, every year the Devils do not draw big crowds
during football season. Attendance picks up after the Jets and Giants
are eliminated from the playoffs. (In the Jets case, that's
mid-October.) Knowing that, however, management does NOTHING to promote
ticket sales, such and family nights, day of game discounts for seniors
and students, etc. Its really not rocket science. Hold your biggest
promotions when the Devils are playest the least desirable (from a sales
stand point) opponents. Maybe, just maybe they would entice someone who
has never seen a hockey game to attend and become a Devils fan.
One last comment, Jody. The Rangers sell their tickets but there are
lots of empty seats at every game because the corporate pukes don't care
about the Rangers unless they are winning. You can go to MSG on any
night and either scalp a ticket or buy one from the box office.
Al G.
Brad
> Its a disgrace that lies not with the fans but with management. First,
> I disagree with your statement about who the Devils compete with for
> ticket sales. Typically, every year the Devils do not draw big crowds
> during football season. Attendance picks up after the Jets and Giants
> are eliminated from the playoffs. (In the Jets case, that's
> mid-October.) Knowing that, however, management does NOTHING to promote
> ticket sales, such and family nights, day of game discounts for seniors
> and students, etc. Its really not rocket science. Hold your biggest
> promotions when the Devils are playest the least desirable (from a sales
> stand point) opponents. Maybe, just maybe they would entice someone who
> has never seen a hockey game to attend and become a Devils fan.
>
> One last comment, Jody. The Rangers sell their tickets but there are
> lots of empty seats at every game because the corporate pukes don't care
> about the Rangers unless they are winning. You can go to MSG on any
> night and either scalp a ticket or buy one from the box office.
If they sell all of their tickets, how are there some available at the
box office on game night?
Al Giglio
in unused seats and receive a partial rebate on the cost of the ticket
if that ticket is resold. So, each night they make available seats from
turned in tickets.
Al G.
jody
Al Giglio wrote:
> Its a disgrace that lies not with the fans but with management. First,
> I disagree with your statement about who the Devils compete with for
> ticket sales. Typically, every year the Devils do not draw big crowds
> during football season. Attendance picks up after the Jets and Giants
> are eliminated from the playoffs.
This would have some relevance for a Sunday game. Why would a Sunday football game
effect a Devs game on a Tues night???
> (In the Jets case, that's
> mid-October.)
Hey, I'm a Jet season tix holder, too! :)
> Knowing that, however, management does NOTHING to promote
> ticket sales, such and family nights, day of game discounts for seniors
> and students, etc.
This is certainly true.
> Its really not rocket science. Hold your biggest
> promotions when the Devils are playest the least desirable (from a sales
> stand point) opponents. Maybe, just maybe they would entice someone who
> has never seen a hockey game to attend and become a Devils fan.
>
I agree. Why don't we have promotions? (although I did get a Devs/Fox sports cap
at one game last year)
>
> One last comment, Jody. The Rangers sell their tickets but there are
> lots of empty seats at every game because the corporate pukes don't care
> about the Rangers unless they are winning. You can go to MSG on any
> night and either scalp a ticket or buy one from the box office.
>
This is true. The fact is, I don't watch the putrid Rangers (unless we are playing
them), so I really don't know how many people show up. I just think with such a
terrific team, we should draw better. In a way, I'm not complaining. Unlike Jet
games, it usually takes me about 15 minutes to get home after a Devs game (I live
in Bergen County).
Flying Frog
I may not have enough to spare for a hockey game until the next month.
Frank
Bob
it usually takes me about 15 minutes to get home after a Devs game (I live
> in Bergen County).
15 minutes???? takes me a minimum of an hour and a half and a pocket full of
change to get home (Ocean County) Now you see why I cant make more than a
handfull of games a year.
Brad
said...
>
> Al Giglio wrote:
>
> > Its a disgrace that lies not with the fans but with management. First,
> > I disagree with your statement about who the Devils compete with for
> > ticket sales. Typically, every year the Devils do not draw big crowds
> > during football season. Attendance picks up after the Jets and Giants
> > are eliminated from the playoffs.
>
> This would have some relevance for a Sunday game. Why would a Sunday football game
> effect a Devs game on a Tues night???
Most people don't want to drive to the Meadowlands twice in three days.
I'll only do it for the playoffs.
Flying Frog
that long just to get out of the parking lot :-)
Frank
AnT716
>Unless you live on Paterson Plank Road - not possible - takes at LEAST
>that long just to get out of the parking lot :-)
Not at all......I live in Essex county and if I get out of the arena as soon as
the game is over and make a sprint to the car, I can get home in about 20.
elektronic
probably more like $5
elektronic(from monmouth county)
"Bob" <prog...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wlo77.22426$4v6.1...@e420r-atl3.usenetserver.com...
JCaramagna
>as
>the game is over and make a sprint to the car, I can get home in about 20.
20 minutes? I live in Bergen County and after 20 minutes, I'm still in the
parking lot. They need to do something to make it easier for fans to leave,
it's terrible. When I get tickets and go to a game, I dread leaving. Maybe if
they had a better system, you wouldn't see so many fans leaving early.
AnT716
>>as
>>the game is over and make a sprint to the car, I can get home in about 20.
>
>20 minutes? I live in Bergen County and after 20 minutes, I'm still in the
>parking lot. They need to do something to make it easier for fans to leave,
>it's terrible. When I get tickets and go to a game, I dread leaving. Maybe if
>they had a better system, you wouldn't see so many fans leaving early.
Park right near an exit.......
MVentolo
>
>Unless you live on Paterson Plank Road - not possible - takes at LEAST
>that long just to get out of the parking lot :-)
LOL... not if you know where to park. Barring the Cup Finals, I can get right
out of that lot. Takes me about 6-7 minutes to get home. :) Gotta love
being able to leave for a 7:35 start at 7:20 and still get into your seat
before they drop the puck.
Mark Dodd
Flying Frog
Frank
JCaramagna
What a great idea, Ant! I don't think anyone thought of that one! Haha
Yes, that was sarcasm, haha. I'm kidding though, I usually do try to park near
an exit, but between all of those people leaving early, and those tools with
the air traffic control sticks, there is already a logjam at the exit by the
time I get to my car.
JCaramagna
Ugh. Don't say the N-word!
Besides, that isn't for a few more years, right? What do we do until then?
AnT716
>>Park right near an exit.......
>
>What a great idea, Ant! I don't think anyone thought of that one! Haha
>
>Yes, that was sarcasm, haha. I'm kidding though, I usually do try to park
>near
>an exit, but between all of those people leaving early, and those tools with
>the air traffic control sticks, there is already a logjam at the exit by the
>time I get to my car.
If you run outta there as soon as the horn goes off you should make it. Or if
the game is not close and the last minute will be insignificant, then I guess
it would be ok to get a little early start on the sprint.
Al Giglio
Al G.
AnT716
>the meadowlands, you're nuts!
>
I was thinking the same thing. They want to make it more accessible to
everyone. They really don't care how long it takes you to get out there, as
long as you buy a ticket....
AnT716
>long as you buy a ticket....
>
Out of there*
Flying Frog
seconds after the game is over, sometimes even before, and don't miss a
second.
Frank
JCaramagna
>if
>the game is not close and the last minute will be insignificant, then I guess
>it would be ok to get a little early start on the sprint.
Leave early?? That's heresy!
JCaramagna
>seconds after the game is over, sometimes even before, and don't miss a
>second.
>
>Frank
Well I usually do watch it on TV. I think the major problem with attendance in
New Jersey is that it is much more enjoyable watching on TV than being at the
game. LOL
AnT716
Not if you watch the last minute or so of the game on one of the monitors right
near a door......
JCaramagna
>right
>near a door......
"But if the Devils fans are so good, why does the building always look half
empty on TV?"
-what you are suggesting is the root cause of this extreme exaggeration that is
thrown around whenever a Toronto fan gets bitter about losing to NJ and needs
to dig for something to criticize.
Gary Williams
> Because I've been having an on going discussion about Devil's
> attendance, a subject that is used to irritate us by fans of other
> teams, and because I have WAY to much time on my hands right now, I did
> a little research and analysis of the past years attendance figures and
> found a few interesting factoids (all number reflect tickets sold and
> not fannies in seats):
<snip>
> The Bruins have to be the joke of the original six
> because they have no NHL competition for hundreds of miles and only 4
> major league teams in the market AND a new arena in a major metropolitan
> area and only averages 15,433.
Not to stray too OT here, but the Bruins' problem with fan apathy is
largely due to owner Jeremy Jacobs. He's a carpetbagger (he
lives/works in Buffalo), has allowed Harry Sinden to run the team as
if it were still the 1960's, and generally fails to reinvest properly.
A series of questionable acquisitions hasn't helped either (signing
Paul Coffey as a FA, trading for Bill Guerin, ongoing salary squabbles
with Bryan Dafoe, Jason Allison, et al).
I have no love for the Black & Gold, but I bet they'd sell out every
home game if they could turn those things around.
As for the Devils, if LL would just let them market their own players
it might increase their visibility. It's disgraceful the way this
club is ignored by major media in the NJ/NY metro area market.
GW
Al Giglio
Al G.