Brad Benson Hyundai waterboarding ads on WFAN???

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Phil

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May 29, 2009, 8:33:46 PM5/29/09
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Way to trivialize torture, Brad! I'm sure going to think of you for my
next car purchase!

Benjamin Bootstrap

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May 29, 2009, 9:59:33 PM5/29/09
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On Fri, 29 May 2009 20:33:46 -0400, Phil <ph...@nomail.com> wrote:

>Way to trivialize torture, Brad! I'm sure going to think of you for my
>next car purchase!

Go read about his dealership on www.dealerrater.com

His dealership is nothing but dirtbags and fraud tactics. I was in
the market for a Hyundai Genesis and was thinking about his dealership
because of his ads on WFAN. However, I'm so glad I did some research
first.

Chris ®

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May 29, 2009, 10:47:04 PM5/29/09
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>Way to trivialize torture, Brad!

He's been doing these topical ads for more than a year. Obama, Hillary,
McCain, they've all been featured. As for the waterboarding ad, it's not
that bad. Not everyone considers this waterboarding stuff as actual
torture. Some do. If it truly offends you that much, buy your new car
elsewhere.

-
"Sometimes, there just aren't enough rocks" - Forrest Gump

O'Bob

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May 29, 2009, 11:38:59 PM5/29/09
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On Fri, 29 May 2009 22:47:04 -0400, headban...@webtv.net (Chris
�) wrote:

>>Way to trivialize torture, Brad!
>
>He's been doing these topical ads for more than a year. Obama, Hillary,
>McCain, they've all been featured. As for the waterboarding ad, it's not
>that bad. Not everyone considers this waterboarding stuff as actual
>torture. Some do.

Everyone who has been subjected seems to think it's torture, including
Navy Seals who have been waterboarded as part of their training. And
a brave (but not so wise) media personality or two. "Waterboarding"
probably sounded like such fun:

http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/Mancow-Takes-on-Waterboarding-and-Loses.html

Apparently, even though you know it's controlled and you aren't going
to die, it sets off a deep panic reaction; your brain is convinced
that you're drowning.

> If it truly offends you that much, buy your new car elsewhere.

FWIW, I'm glad Phil posted that. I've grown numb to the onslaught of
weird ads on WFAN ("...25 pounds of spackle caked in the colon.."
Nice!). Good point about that ad though. Sometimes it needs to be
said.

Bill

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May 30, 2009, 12:10:44 AM5/30/09
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On 5/29/2009 11:38 PM, O'Bob wrote:
> FWIW, I'm glad Phil posted that. I've grown numb to the onslaught of
> weird ads on WFAN ("...25 pounds of spackle caked in the colon.."
> Nice!). Good point about that ad though. Sometimes it needs to be
> said.

I'm getting fed up with the Joe Beningo ads for the golf course
in Carmel, NY (Putnam County). He makes it claim like he's going
to be there all the time. Yeah, right -- doesn't he live in
Jersey? Maybe he'll be there when the station has an event or
they pay him to be there.

Bill

Phil

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May 30, 2009, 8:15:11 AM5/30/09
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On 2009-05-29 22:47:04 -0400, headban...@webtv.net (Chris �) said:

>> Way to trivialize torture, Brad!
>
> He's been doing these topical ads for more than a year. Obama, Hillary,
> McCain, they've all been featured. As for the waterboarding ad, it's not
> that bad. Not everyone considers this waterboarding stuff as actual
> torture. Some do.

Funny how no one who has actually experienced it seems to be coming
forward with that view. Mancow was ready to confess to complicity in
9/11 in under six seconds, I hear. Which is odd, since the average is
14 seconds, and he was perfectly prepared to do anything, including
lie, to make it stop. He no longer says it's not torture (although he
has since once again recanted; maybe the six-second hard case would
like to try it again?), and more accurate, useful intelligence was
achieved with a handful of sugar-free cookies.

And regardless of where one falls on this issue, it's simply not funny
-- no way, nohow. Yeah, he's featured topical issues and names, but you
have to wonder where he'd draw the line if this wasn't crossing one.
What would he not say to sell a car? Buy this Hyundai or we'll gas
these Kurds? Funny, funny stuff, eh?

> If it truly offends you that much, buy your new car
> elsewhere.

Don't you just love the free market?

Benjamin Bootstrap

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May 30, 2009, 9:48:42 AM5/30/09
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On Sat, 30 May 2009 08:15:11 -0400, Phil <ph...@nomail.com> wrote:

First off this is a sports forum, move on dude or go to another forum.

Second, water boarding is only performed on 3 of the highest Al Qaeda
prisoners, and it was only done after all other methods failed. So
stop writing as if this is done all the time and the first and only
option.

Ok, I'm done with this topic in the METS group, go somewhere else with
this please.

Phil

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May 30, 2009, 10:28:14 AM5/30/09
to

This is something anyone listening to the Mets on the radio is
constantly exposed to. You can ignore it or enjoy it, as you choose,
but what you can't do is make it go away. And I agree that it's not
something I'd like to deal with on a sports NG, but the fact that WFAN
considers it topical, and the fact that IT IS BEING USED TO SELL
FUCKING CARS, vastly override this fact, dude. And while this could
easily be about the issue of torture, a question some people here seem
remarkably sensitive about discussing in spite of the fact that they
seem to be pretty cool with it conceptually. It's about the propriety
of using the imagery -- and it could be any of several sensitive topics
-- as A) a joke, and B) a joke to sell cars.

> Second, water boarding is only performed on 3 of the highest Al Qaeda
> prisoners, and it was only done after all other methods failed. So
> stop writing as if this is done all the time and the first and only
> option.

It failed, too. Sugar-free cookies somehow succeeded. But make up your
mind. Is it a terrible infamy, or are you cool with it? I have very
mixed feelings about it myself... except WHERE IT IS BEING JOKED ABOUT
ON FUCKING CAR COMMERCIALS.

> Ok, I'm done with this topic in the METS group, go somewhere else with
> this please.

When the Mets broadcasting venues stop taking advertising of this sort,
I'd be more than happy to shelve this topic. Until then, it's Mets news.

Uncle Abogado�

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May 30, 2009, 11:54:02 AM5/30/09
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On Fri, 29 May 2009 22:47:04 -0400, headban...@webtv.net (Chris
�) wrote:

>>Way to trivialize torture, Brad!
>
>He's been doing these topical ads for more than a year. Obama, Hillary,
>McCain, they've all been featured. As for the waterboarding ad, it's not
>that bad.

Well, not if you think torture is a fitting subject for parody,
anyway. I think it's in horrendous taste, but that's just me.

> Not everyone considers this waterboarding stuff as actual
>torture. Some do.

Seems like everyone who's actually been through it does.

>If it truly offends you that much, buy your new car
>elsewhere.

Well, if their horrendous customer reviews weren't enough to convince
people to shop elsewhere, this should do the trick nicely.

-- Uncle A�


26*!! 26*!! 26*!!

Chris ®

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May 30, 2009, 12:03:26 PM5/30/09
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>Funny how no one who has actually
>experienced it seems to be coming
>forward with that view.

Of course not, since actually undergoing the process would taint your
viewpoint considerably.

Chris ®

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May 30, 2009, 11:02:20 AM5/30/09
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>Everyone who has been subjected seems
>to think it's torture,

I'm sure they do. That only means it's really, REALLY unpleasant. And
that's the point.

Chris ®

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May 30, 2009, 12:07:07 PM5/30/09
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>Well, not if you think torture is a fitting
>subject for parody, anyway.   I think it's in
>horrendous taste, but that's just me.

It would be if everyone shared the opinion that it was torture. What
John McCain endured was torture. The Bataan Death March was torture. The
Spanish Inquision was torture.

I recognize your viewpoint, and it's validity. I am stating that I and
millions of Americans do not share it. It's a free country, so I'd
suggest your side learn how to co-exist with people who disagree with
you.

Uncle Abogado�

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May 30, 2009, 12:18:41 PM5/30/09
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Did I miss the memo where you were appointed moderator
of this newsgroup? Off-topic posts are a fact of life on Usenet,
"dude." If you can't deal with that, then you'd best move on or
find yourself a moderated group.

>Second, water boarding is only performed on 3 of the highest Al Qaeda
>prisoners,

That's the three that the CIA will admit to. As to how many were
actually waterboarded during this covert operation, there's no way of
knowing. Arguing that we only tortured three people, however, is
akin to arguing that OJ Simpson only killed two.

>and it was only done after all other methods failed.

Again, only if you believe the CIA's report. But if that were really
true, then why waterboard the same suspect again after the first 182
attempts failed?

> So stop writing as if this is done all the time and the first and only
>option.

Some detainees were subjected to it hundreds of times. Stop writing
as though this was some isolated or rare occurrence. It wasn't.

>Ok, I'm done with this topic in the METS group, go somewhere else with
>this please.

Ah, so you get to have your say and then pronounce the subject closed?
Sorry, buddy, but it doesn't work that way. It ain't your newsgroup.

Uncle Abogado�

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May 30, 2009, 12:50:01 PM5/30/09
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On Sat, 30 May 2009 12:07:07 -0400, headban...@webtv.net (Chris
�) wrote:

>>Well, not if you think torture is a fitting
>>subject for parody, anyway. � I think it's in
>>horrendous taste, but that's just me.
>
>It would be if everyone shared the opinion that it was torture.

So something has to offend 100% of the population in order to be in
bad taste?

>What John McCain endured was torture. The Bataan Death March was torture. The
>Spanish Inquision was torture.

Yes, and waterboarding is also torture. It's considered torture by
legal experts, politicians, war veterans, medical experts in the
treatment of torture victims, intelligence officials, military judges,
human rights organizations, the Geneva convention, and by our own
court system, which has prosecuted people for the offense.

I do recognize that waterboarding is not considered torture by such
"experts" as Dick Cheney, John Yoo and Sean Hannity.

>I recognize your viewpoint, and it's validity. I am stating that I and
>millions of Americans do not share it.

Millions of Americans also believe that Adam and Eve rode around
on the backs of dinosaurs. I respect their right to believe as they
choose, but that doesn't make the beliefs themselves valid or worthy
of respect.

>It's a free country,

I haven't noticed anybody stopping you from expressing your opinion,
Chris. In a free country, however, I'm every bit as entitled to
voice my disagreement with your opinion as you are to post it in the
first place.

>so I'd suggest your side learn how to co-exist with
>people who disagree with you.

Considering the frequency with which right-wingers brand those who
disagree with them as un-American, terrorist-loving traitors, I find
it laughable to hear guys like you whining about "our side."

Clean up the shit in your own backyard, Chris.

Uncle Abogado�

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May 30, 2009, 12:57:13 PM5/30/09
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On Sat, 30 May 2009 12:03:26 -0400, headban...@webtv.net (Chris
�) wrote:

>>Funny how no one who has actually
>>experienced it seems to be coming
>>forward with that view.
>
>Of course not, since actually undergoing the process would taint your
>viewpoint considerably.

Of course. Heaven forbid that a person have his viewpoint tainted by
actual firsthand experience with being tortured. After all, the last
people we'd want to hear from on this subject are those who actually
know what the hell they're talking about.

O'Bob

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May 30, 2009, 3:41:23 PM5/30/09
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On Sat, 30 May 2009 09:48:42 -0400, Benjamin Bootstrap
<b...@comcast.com> wrote:

>First off this is a sports forum, move on dude or go to another forum.
>
>Second, water boarding is only performed on 3 of the highest Al Qaeda
>prisoners, and it was only done after all other methods failed.

IOW, Phil should stop talking, but you want to talk about it. You're
hear for 3 minutes and you're telling newsgroup regulars how it's
going to go down? I think you're in for a surprise.

>Ok, I'm done with this topic in the METS group, go somewhere else with
>this please.

At least he said please.

In case it hasn't registered, the issue has a lot to do with
perception of the USA. I bet Al Queda is in favor of the US's
previous policies re waterboarding and other dubious techniques that
they can use as leverage. In the eyes of many in the middle east, it
muddies the waters in regard to who the good guys are.

This doesn't have to be a Republicans vs Democrats thing either. There
are many Republicans that share the views that waterboarding violates
the Geneva Convention treaties. Article 1 of the third convention in
regard to torture: "No physical or mental torture, nor any other form
of coercion".

The fact that it's now common knowledge that this has been violated by
the USA is bad enough, but there are people still arguing that it's a
reasonable thing to do? As Jesse Ventura said, "If Cheney were
waterboarded, he'd confess to the Sharon Tate murders." It's not an
effective way of getting information. A lot more harm than good.

Phil

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May 31, 2009, 8:59:15 AM5/31/09
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On 2009-05-30 12:03:26 -0400, headban...@webtv.net (Chris �) said:

>> Funny how no one who has actually
>> experienced it seems to be coming
>> forward with that view.
>
> Of course not, since actually undergoing the process would taint your
> viewpoint considerably.

I respectfully submit that we may have a very strong candidate for
Quote of the Year material here.

Travis

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May 31, 2009, 7:11:06 PM5/31/09
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On Sat, May 30, 2009, 9:48am b...@comcast.com (Benjamin Bootstrap)
wrote:


>First off this is a sports forum, move on dude or
> go to another forum.

>Second, water boarding is only performed on 3
> of the highest Al Qaeda prisoners, and it was

> only done after all other methods failed. So


> stop writing as if this is done all the time and>
> the first and only option.

>Ok, I'm done with this topic in the METS group,


> go somewhere else with this please.

Hmmm, I smell a dingleberry!

T.

Matthew Hersh

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Jun 23, 2009, 4:00:10 PM6/23/09
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On May 29, 8:33 pm, Phil <p...@nomail.com> wrote:
> Way to trivialize torture, Brad! I'm sure going to think of you for my
> next car purchase!

Agreed. That ad is particularly weird, uncomfortable, and disturbing
-- all at once!

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