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managment equals what?
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shannanigan
Oct 6, 2012, 10:07:12 AM10/6/12
to
The Sox hired Valentine for this year to try a regain control of the Red
Sox. He was a bit more hard nosed than Francona. The stories and comments
coming from the players (Pedroia, Gonzalez, Aceves, Youkilus etc.) Seem to
stem around control. Who's the boss? Last I checked managers are supposed
to be the boss. Comments like "We have each other's backs" in terms of
being reprimanded for mistakes makes me SICK!!! It seems that being
vindictive may have lead to some lackluster play in 2012 for the Red Sox
played a part (not entirely). Francona's hands off approached worked
early on. Then things though got out of hand and the player's themselves
became the spoiled employees that in the end had no leadership, no respect
for authority. How do we put things back to the way they are supposed to
be? Do the players call the shots on the other teams especially the winning
teams? I need to know why we even have managers and coaches if the players
are going to rule what goes down on the field.
Sick of this bullshit really.
Sox. He was a bit more hard nosed than Francona. The stories and comments
coming from the players (Pedroia, Gonzalez, Aceves, Youkilus etc.) Seem to
stem around control. Who's the boss? Last I checked managers are supposed
to be the boss. Comments like "We have each other's backs" in terms of
being reprimanded for mistakes makes me SICK!!! It seems that being
vindictive may have lead to some lackluster play in 2012 for the Red Sox
played a part (not entirely). Francona's hands off approached worked
early on. Then things though got out of hand and the player's themselves
became the spoiled employees that in the end had no leadership, no respect
for authority. How do we put things back to the way they are supposed to
be? Do the players call the shots on the other teams especially the winning
teams? I need to know why we even have managers and coaches if the players
are going to rule what goes down on the field.
Sick of this bullshit really.
Dano
Oct 6, 2012, 11:50:45 AM10/6/12
to
"shannanigan" wrote in message
news:KuGdnUsCgIqQpu3N...@neonova.net...
=========================================
I think you misinterpret that message of "having each other's backs"
terribly. It means not publicly (or even privately) blaming one another for
mistakes or misplays. It's about helping one another to overcome those and
come out on top. One guy screws up...and another covers that with a good
play. Everyone messes up at times. Play as a TEAM...not a collection of
individuals...only interested in their own stats and contracts. A TEAM with
the ultimate goal of WINNING. The last thing you want is a bunch of guys
pointing fingers and assessing blame. Play together or lose together.
Nothing good comes of all this looking to blame others. They all need to
look in the mirror. This is what comes of trying to assemble a team of
"stars" and forgetting about the character of the individuals and chemistry.
And YES...there are such intangibles. Every team needs leaders and quality
guys who understand that.
news:KuGdnUsCgIqQpu3N...@neonova.net...
I think you misinterpret that message of "having each other's backs"
terribly. It means not publicly (or even privately) blaming one another for
mistakes or misplays. It's about helping one another to overcome those and
come out on top. One guy screws up...and another covers that with a good
play. Everyone messes up at times. Play as a TEAM...not a collection of
individuals...only interested in their own stats and contracts. A TEAM with
the ultimate goal of WINNING. The last thing you want is a bunch of guys
pointing fingers and assessing blame. Play together or lose together.
Nothing good comes of all this looking to blame others. They all need to
look in the mirror. This is what comes of trying to assemble a team of
"stars" and forgetting about the character of the individuals and chemistry.
And YES...there are such intangibles. Every team needs leaders and quality
guys who understand that.
Tristan daCunha
Oct 6, 2012, 12:40:01 PM10/6/12
to
Hey Dano; W F'n TEAM?
shannanigan
Oct 6, 2012, 3:18:17 PM10/6/12
to
"Dano" wrote in message news:k4pk0p$dfd$1...@dont-email.me...
from an article
"
Kevin Youkilis lashed back after Valentine said he wasn’t as “into the game”
as before and Dustin Pedroia came to his teammate’s defense, saying, “That’s
not the way we go about our stuff around here.”
“He’ll figure that out. The whole team is behind Youk. We have each other’s
backs here,” Pedroia said. “Maybe that works in Japan.”
and here's the link to the article
http://www.baxterbulletin.com/viewart/20121005/SPORTS/310050038/Red-Sox-fire-Valentine-after-tumultuous-season
Don't get me wrong I like Pedrioa ..... This is just an example of how the
players have undermined the manager's authority. The Red Sox let this
happen and fester... No the problem goes beyond replacing Francona and his
style..... The players it seems are very determined to keep their
solidarity even if it means laying down just to be spiteful. THAT is my
point!!!!
John W Gintell
Oct 6, 2012, 4:27:45 PM10/6/12
to
complaining about. Did BV talk to Youk about his impressions and work with him
to help him to figure out what he should do to be better? We have absolutely no
idea of what really happened other than BV's one sentence and Pedroia's comment
that gets quoted many times.
I used to be a manager of software engineers building and maintaining a product-
some of great talent, big egos, some with personality defects and other personal
issues that affected how they worked with other people and how they performed.
And my group was a team - they had to work together and rely on each other to do
their part. I didn't announce problems to the department or to the customers. I
worked with the individual to help him/her deal with the problem and be a more
effective worker and team member. If talking, setting goals, and reassignments
didn't work out the person would be fired or encouraged to get another job
before being fired. Of course people didn't have multi-year contracts but you
still had to follow lots of corporate guidelines to fire a person with a history
of evaluations etc. and it took time to do it.
I think the same approach applies to baseball management and how they deal with
players who aren't playing as well as they should. Talent, experience, work
habits, attitude, personality, personal issues all go together to yield results
- good or bad. Team spirit is an important factor. We really know very little
of how Bobby approached this - you can't go by sound bites. We do know that
Francona was very successful for a few years and then last year somehow
everything fell apart. Again we really know very little of what happened to
change the team's playing so rapidly last September.
Dano
Oct 6, 2012, 4:42:13 PM10/6/12
to
"shannanigan" wrote in message
news:6dGdnZApdYhhHu3N...@neonova.net...
==============================================
I happen to agree completely with Pedroia's sentiment...in spite of the fact
he should have gone about it differently...just as Bobby should have. That
was a bullshit way to talk about your own player. No matter who it was.
The manager is supposed to be a leader of men. In fact...that's basically
his primary function. If he had some "feeling" about how Youk was going
about his game...well there IS a fucking door on his office I'm sure. You
take the player in there and speak PRIVATELY. Pretty freaking basic. You
don't need a degree in psychology to figure that.
news:6dGdnZApdYhhHu3N...@neonova.net...
I happen to agree completely with Pedroia's sentiment...in spite of the fact
he should have gone about it differently...just as Bobby should have. That
was a bullshit way to talk about your own player. No matter who it was.
The manager is supposed to be a leader of men. In fact...that's basically
his primary function. If he had some "feeling" about how Youk was going
about his game...well there IS a fucking door on his office I'm sure. You
take the player in there and speak PRIVATELY. Pretty freaking basic. You
don't need a degree in psychology to figure that.
Dano
Oct 6, 2012, 4:42:13 PM10/6/12
to
"shannanigan" wrote in message
news:6dGdnZApdYhhHu3N...@neonova.net...
news:6dGdnZApdYhhHu3N...@neonova.net...
Dano
Oct 6, 2012, 4:58:10 PM10/6/12
to
"shannanigan" wrote in message
news:6dGdnZApdYhhHu3N...@neonova.net...
Don't get me wrong I like Pedrioa ..... This is just an example of how the
players have undermined the manager's authority. The Red Sox let this
happen and fester... No the problem goes beyond replacing Francona and his
style..... The players it seems are very determined to keep their
solidarity even if it means laying down just to be spiteful. THAT is my
point!!!!
================================================
One other thing. I think you're nuts if you think these guys were "laying
down" out of spite. These guys to a man are playing for their
careers...their futures...their families if nothing else. I don't think
there are many (if any) players in pro sports that WANT to lose. Losing is
just as contagious as winning. Attitudes are tricky things. Once a group
like this goes sour you're in trouble. No one consciously tries to lose.
Some guys doubtless try TOO hard...which can be just as bad.
Bottom line is the pitchers were awful. Not on purpose. They just weren't
good. They also traded off their best hitter and lost their new power
hitter who replaced Youk to injury. Players DO also have bad seasons for
reasons other than "quitting".
It's wrong to blame any one individual. Blame is shared here...just as
victory would be.
news:6dGdnZApdYhhHu3N...@neonova.net...
Don't get me wrong I like Pedrioa ..... This is just an example of how the
players have undermined the manager's authority. The Red Sox let this
happen and fester... No the problem goes beyond replacing Francona and his
style..... The players it seems are very determined to keep their
solidarity even if it means laying down just to be spiteful. THAT is my
point!!!!
One other thing. I think you're nuts if you think these guys were "laying
down" out of spite. These guys to a man are playing for their
careers...their futures...their families if nothing else. I don't think
there are many (if any) players in pro sports that WANT to lose. Losing is
just as contagious as winning. Attitudes are tricky things. Once a group
like this goes sour you're in trouble. No one consciously tries to lose.
Some guys doubtless try TOO hard...which can be just as bad.
Bottom line is the pitchers were awful. Not on purpose. They just weren't
good. They also traded off their best hitter and lost their new power
hitter who replaced Youk to injury. Players DO also have bad seasons for
reasons other than "quitting".
It's wrong to blame any one individual. Blame is shared here...just as
victory would be.
Alan E. Seelbach
Oct 6, 2012, 7:10:32 PM10/6/12
to
"Dano" <janea...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:k4qaa5$mc1$2...@dont-email.me...
shannanigan
Oct 6, 2012, 7:25:33 PM10/6/12
to
I....said
the link to the article
http://www.baxterbulletin.com/viewart/20121005/SPORTS/310050038/Red-Sox-fire-Valentine-after-tumultuous-season
Don't get me wrong I like Pedrioa ..... This is just an example of how the
players have undermined the manager's authority. The Red Sox let this
happen and fester... No the problem goes beyond replacing Francona and his
style..... The players it seems are very determined to keep their
solidarity even if it means laying down just to be spiteful. THAT is my
point!!!!
==============================================
dano...said
I disagree with Pedroia....It was a show solidarity against the manager
whether or not BV was wrong in his tactics by saying "we don't do that here
yaddeeya." Diplomacy on the behalf of the players may have defused this. I
agree that BV should not have publicly humiliated Youk. Pedrioa should
have stated that instead of what he said. The situation is still where we
left off after last year's debacle. Players are flexing too much muscle in
terms of running the clubhouse and not enough muscle on the field. Players
are injuring themselves constantly. They are not following the advice of
their trainers. Thus poor pitching performances. It's out of control.
It's like a classroom full of adolescent teens and the teacher has zero
backbone. Chaos!
the link to the article
http://www.baxterbulletin.com/viewart/20121005/SPORTS/310050038/Red-Sox-fire-Valentine-after-tumultuous-season
Don't get me wrong I like Pedrioa ..... This is just an example of how the
players have undermined the manager's authority. The Red Sox let this
happen and fester... No the problem goes beyond replacing Francona and his
style..... The players it seems are very determined to keep their
solidarity even if it means laying down just to be spiteful. THAT is my
point!!!!
==============================================
>>>>>>>>>>>>>I happen to agree completely with Pedroia's sentiment...in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>spite of the fact
he should have gone about it differently...just as Bobby should have. That
was a bullshit way to talk about your own player. No matter who it was.
The manager is supposed to be a leader of men. In fact...that's basically
his primary function. If he had some "feeling" about how Youk was going
about his game...well there IS a fucking door on his office I'm sure. You
take the player in there and speak PRIVATELY. Pretty freaking basic. You
don't need a degree in psychology to figure that.<<<<
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>>>>>>>>>>>spite of the fact
he should have gone about it differently...just as Bobby should have. That
was a bullshit way to talk about your own player. No matter who it was.
The manager is supposed to be a leader of men. In fact...that's basically
his primary function. If he had some "feeling" about how Youk was going
about his game...well there IS a fucking door on his office I'm sure. You
take the player in there and speak PRIVATELY. Pretty freaking basic. You
don't need a degree in psychology to figure that.<<<<
I disagree with Pedroia....It was a show solidarity against the manager
whether or not BV was wrong in his tactics by saying "we don't do that here
yaddeeya." Diplomacy on the behalf of the players may have defused this. I
agree that BV should not have publicly humiliated Youk. Pedrioa should
have stated that instead of what he said. The situation is still where we
left off after last year's debacle. Players are flexing too much muscle in
terms of running the clubhouse and not enough muscle on the field. Players
are injuring themselves constantly. They are not following the advice of
their trainers. Thus poor pitching performances. It's out of control.
It's like a classroom full of adolescent teens and the teacher has zero
backbone. Chaos!
mario in victoria
Oct 6, 2012, 7:49:48 PM10/6/12
to
happened. If Pedroia really felt that way, then he should have followed
"the way (we) do things here" and not mouthed off to the press.
I love the guy, but he did exactly what Valentine did: not keep it
in-house, which is shameful.
Perhaps it was an off the cuff remark or uttered out of spite or
disdain, but if we give him that rope then we have to give Valentine the
same.
To be honest, Youkilis wasn't playing well at the time. Injury? I don't
know. All I could 'see' was that he wasn't the Youkilis I'd come to love
watch play.
>
> and here's the link to the article
>
> http://www.baxterbulletin.com/viewart/20121005/SPORTS/310050038/Red-Sox-fire-Valentine-after-tumultuous-season
>
>
> Don't get me wrong I like Pedrioa ..... This is just an example of how the
> players have undermined the manager's authority. The Red Sox let this
> happen and fester... No the problem goes beyond replacing Francona and his
> style..... The players it seems are very determined to keep their
> solidarity even if it means laying down just to be spiteful. THAT is my
> point!!!!
>
> ==============================================
>
> I happen to agree completely with Pedroia's sentiment...in spite of the
> fact he should have gone about it differently...just as Bobby should
> have. That was a bullshit way to talk about your own player. No matter
> who it was. The manager is supposed to be a leader of men. In
> fact...that's basically his primary function. If he had some "feeling"
> about how Youk was going about his game...well there IS a fucking door
> on his office I'm sure. You take the player in there and speak
> PRIVATELY. Pretty freaking basic. You don't need a degree in
> psychology to figure that.
for being a dolt and Pedroia for not being smart enough to 'do it right.'
mario in victoria
--
two shameful utterances
Tristan daCunha
Oct 6, 2012, 8:17:55 PM10/6/12
to
Another case of the Nicaraguan inmates running the asylum!
Pretty soon they'll be wearing doo rags on their heads....ala Manroid!
What a sad commentary on MLB.
Pretty soon they'll be wearing doo rags on their heads....ala Manroid!
What a sad commentary on MLB.
BTT
Oct 6, 2012, 8:32:20 PM10/6/12
to
On Saturday, October 6, 2012 7:25:41 PM UTC-4, shannanigan wrote:
> I....said
>
>
>
>
>
> the link to the article
>
>
>
> http://www.baxterbulletin.com/viewart/20121005/SPORTS/310050038/Red-Sox-fire-Valentine-after-tumultuous-season
>
.
> I....said
>
>
>
>
>
> the link to the article
>
>
>
> http://www.baxterbulletin.com/viewart/20121005/SPORTS/310050038/Red-Sox-fire-Valentine-after-tumultuous-season
>
>
> (snip)
>
> I disagree with Pedroia....It was a show solidarity against the manager
>
> whether or not BV was wrong in his tactics by saying "we don't do that here
>
> yaddeeya." Diplomacy on the behalf of the players may have defused this. I
>
> agree that BV should not have publicly humiliated Youk. Pedrioa should
>
> have stated that instead of what he said. The situation is still where we
>
> left off after last year's debacle. Players are flexing too much muscle in
>
> terms of running the clubhouse and not enough muscle on the field. Players
>
> are injuring themselves constantly. They are not following the advice of
>
> their trainers. Thus poor pitching performances. It's out of control.
>
> It's like a classroom full of adolescent teens and the teacher has zero
>
> backbone. Chaos!
What documentation do you have for the statement that the
> I disagree with Pedroia....It was a show solidarity against the manager
>
> whether or not BV was wrong in his tactics by saying "we don't do that here
>
> yaddeeya." Diplomacy on the behalf of the players may have defused this. I
>
> agree that BV should not have publicly humiliated Youk. Pedrioa should
>
> have stated that instead of what he said. The situation is still where we
>
> left off after last year's debacle. Players are flexing too much muscle in
>
> terms of running the clubhouse and not enough muscle on the field. Players
>
> are injuring themselves constantly. They are not following the advice of
>
> their trainers. Thus poor pitching performances. It's out of control.
>
> It's like a classroom full of adolescent teens and the teacher has zero
>
> backbone. Chaos!
players were injuring themselves by "not following the
advice of their trainers"? It
seems like the players have injured thwmselves following
the advice of their trainers, as when Pedey was told that
he wouldn't hurt his damaged ankle any further by playing.
That lasted 1 or 2 games and he stopped. And Ells was
cleared to play with fractured ribs, reinjuring them.
BTT
shannanigan
Oct 7, 2012, 9:24:30 AM10/7/12
to
They are not following the advice of
>
> their trainers. Thus poor pitching performances. It's out of control.
>
> It's like a classroom full of adolescent teens and the teacher has zero
>
> backbone. Chaos!
What documentation do you have for the statement that the
players were injuring themselves by "not following the
advice of their trainers"? It
seems like the players have injured thwmselves following
the advice of their trainers, as when Pedey was told that
he wouldn't hurt his damaged ankle any further by playing.
That lasted 1 or 2 games and he stopped. And Ells was
cleared to play with fractured ribs, reinjuring them.
BTT
I have no documentation as neither do you to your claim. Just the fact that
they eat FRIED CHICKEN and drank beer
and god knows what else That to me is an obvious indication that they are
not following healthy guidelines to a healthy life style. They are supposed
professional athletes being paid ludicrous amounts of money to perform.
Josh Beckett plays golf two days before his already scheduled missed start?
I am sure the trainers wanted him to do that. I agree that trainers may
have assessed health problems wrong. In the case of Ells I don't think he
is the problem in terms of not following trainers advice... He wanted to
play and kept pushing the issue. he wasn't forced to play.
Dano
Oct 7, 2012, 12:03:18 PM10/7/12
to
"shannanigan" wrote in message
news:X7SdnZscc_R2IO3N...@neonova.net...
I
I disagree with Pedroia....It was a show solidarity against the manager
whether or not BV was wrong in his tactics by saying "we don't do that here
yaddeeya." Diplomacy on the behalf of the players may have defused this. I
agree that BV should not have publicly humiliated Youk. Pedrioa should
have stated that instead of what he said. The situation is still where we
left off after last year's debacle. Players are flexing too much muscle in
terms of running the clubhouse and not enough muscle on the field. Players
are injuring themselves constantly. They are not following the advice of
their trainers. Thus poor pitching performances. It's out of control.
It's like a classroom full of adolescent teens and the teacher has zero
backbone. Chaos!
================================================
Well then fine. Blame the "students" if you wish. But the teacher has the
responsibility to be the person in charge.
Valentine failed by ANY measure. Is that fair? Life isn't fair.
If Pedroia was at fault...he should have been dealt with. That he wasn't
demonstrates that even BV knew he had badly mishandled the situation.
news:X7SdnZscc_R2IO3N...@neonova.net...
I
I disagree with Pedroia....It was a show solidarity against the manager
whether or not BV was wrong in his tactics by saying "we don't do that here
yaddeeya." Diplomacy on the behalf of the players may have defused this. I
agree that BV should not have publicly humiliated Youk. Pedrioa should
have stated that instead of what he said. The situation is still where we
left off after last year's debacle. Players are flexing too much muscle in
terms of running the clubhouse and not enough muscle on the field. Players
are injuring themselves constantly. They are not following the advice of
their trainers. Thus poor pitching performances. It's out of control.
It's like a classroom full of adolescent teens and the teacher has zero
backbone. Chaos!
Well then fine. Blame the "students" if you wish. But the teacher has the
responsibility to be the person in charge.
Valentine failed by ANY measure. Is that fair? Life isn't fair.
If Pedroia was at fault...he should have been dealt with. That he wasn't
demonstrates that even BV knew he had badly mishandled the situation.
Dano
Oct 7, 2012, 12:14:26 PM10/7/12
to
"mario in victoria" wrote in message
news:vs3cs.3058$2h5...@newsfe20.iad...
I personally was more disappointed with Pedroia than Valentine when this
happened. If Pedroia really felt that way, then he should have followed
"the way (we) do things here" and not mouthed off to the press.
I love the guy, but he did exactly what Valentine did: not keep it
in-house, which is shameful.
Perhaps it was an off the cuff remark or uttered out of spite or
disdain, but if we give him that rope then we have to give Valentine the
same.
To be honest, Youkilis wasn't playing well at the time. Injury? I don't
know. All I could 'see' was that he wasn't the Youkilis I'd come to love
watch play.
============================================
Pedroia is essentially a kid. Alright...he's 28. As a privileged athlete
he's essentially still a spoiled youngster like most jocks. Valentine is
supposed to be the wiser, old leader...NOT his equal.
I expect more from my manager.
As for Youk. Yes. He has slipped. Perhaps it's a natural decline. Maybe
he had an off year. I never thought he was "dogging it" myself. This is a
guy who was criticized by teammates and media types for his outbursts in the
past. Maybe he was trying to tone it down...or simply maturing at 33.
Whatever. It was foolish to pick on him PUBLICLY for no good reason. A 62
year old former player and veteran manager ought to know better.
news:vs3cs.3058$2h5...@newsfe20.iad...
I personally was more disappointed with Pedroia than Valentine when this
happened. If Pedroia really felt that way, then he should have followed
"the way (we) do things here" and not mouthed off to the press.
I love the guy, but he did exactly what Valentine did: not keep it
in-house, which is shameful.
Perhaps it was an off the cuff remark or uttered out of spite or
disdain, but if we give him that rope then we have to give Valentine the
same.
To be honest, Youkilis wasn't playing well at the time. Injury? I don't
know. All I could 'see' was that he wasn't the Youkilis I'd come to love
watch play.
Pedroia is essentially a kid. Alright...he's 28. As a privileged athlete
he's essentially still a spoiled youngster like most jocks. Valentine is
supposed to be the wiser, old leader...NOT his equal.
I expect more from my manager.
As for Youk. Yes. He has slipped. Perhaps it's a natural decline. Maybe
he had an off year. I never thought he was "dogging it" myself. This is a
guy who was criticized by teammates and media types for his outbursts in the
past. Maybe he was trying to tone it down...or simply maturing at 33.
Whatever. It was foolish to pick on him PUBLICLY for no good reason. A 62
year old former player and veteran manager ought to know better.
Dano
Oct 7, 2012, 12:33:56 PM10/7/12
to
"mario in victoria" wrote in message
news:vs3cs.3058$2h5...@newsfe20.iad...
news:vs3cs.3058$2h5...@newsfe20.iad...
More or less how I feel, but I fix the blame on both of them. Valentine
for being a dolt and Pedroia for not being smart enough to 'do it right.'
==============================================
for being a dolt and Pedroia for not being smart enough to 'do it right.'
Baseball players generally ARE dolts. They aren't paid for their brains.
The manager hopefully IS smarter and wiser.
One last thing. The idea that only the manager is being held accountable
here is clearly incorrect. I'm not saying that's your position Mario...just
furthering the discussion. The players HAVE been put on notice. The
brass...for as bad as THEIR part in this has been...have rid the team of
Youk...Crawford...and their biggest and costliest star, Gonzalez. Nearly
every player on that team is now living with the insecurity of not knowing
where they'll be playing next year...where their family will be
living...their kids have no idea where they'll be going to school or if they
must make all new friends. As a father and a husband I have an idea of how
that can impact a family. If you think that's of little consequence...well
you aren't thinking it through. I'm certain stuff like that also affects a
team's play as well. And not in a good way...especially after losing about
half of the team's offensive production mid-season with virtually no
appropriate replacements close to the previous level.
I don't understand what many in this group...who THINK they know a thing
about this game...expected after getting rid of the players they jettisoned
for prospects.
I guess players aren't the only ones who are generally dolts. Again...no
offense Mario.
mario in victoria
Oct 7, 2012, 4:27:01 PM10/7/12
to
Pedroia's gaffe to Valentine's. Both were wrong, and Valentine moreso,
since he is 'assumed' to be the one with the smarts.
I also think that the house-cleaning was done for several reasons. I
honestly don't think they 'wanted' to get rid of Gonzalez, but to
package him with Punto et al to get rid of Beckett's attitude and
Crawford's contract made it easier.
To be honest, the BEST I expected was for the team to approach .500
ball. In my more optimistic moments (of which there are few) I thought
they might hit .500. I was disappointed, not surprised.
There are two HUGE Red Sox at the hotel, and we trade quips and bitches
all season long. All three of us kept expecting the pitching to come
back, but by the ASG we were pretty resigned. Only a miracle would have
helped.
I remember Casey the Chef saying at some point "If they can sweep XX and
XXX this week, they've got a shot. But the playoffs are going to be a
lot tougher than ever." I agreed with him, and held out little hope for
the desired sweeps. Ah, well.
mario in victoria
--
brookly (wait till next year)
schwarzenegger (i'll be back!)
mario in victoria
Oct 7, 2012, 5:46:05 PM10/7/12
to
On 10/7/2012 1:27 PM, mario in victoria wrote:
<snip>
>
> There are two HUGE Red Sox at the hotel, and we trade quips and bitches
> all season long. All three of us kept expecting the pitching to come
> back, but by the ASG we were pretty resigned. Only a miracle would have
> helped.
<snip>
FANS. I meant "There are two HUGE Red Sox FANS at the hotel..."
Sorry.
mario in victoria
--
fingers still asleep
mind gone
<snip>
>
> There are two HUGE Red Sox at the hotel, and we trade quips and bitches
> all season long. All three of us kept expecting the pitching to come
> back, but by the ASG we were pretty resigned. Only a miracle would have
> helped.
FANS. I meant "There are two HUGE Red Sox FANS at the hotel..."
Sorry.
mario in victoria
--
fingers still asleep
mind gone
shannanigan
Oct 7, 2012, 9:25:13 PM10/7/12
to
"Dano" wrote in message news:k4s947$ei5$1...@dont-email.me...
I agree ... but The players were first "spoiled" by Francona.... .BV never
had a chance to gain control... Francona's style was great at first.
Eventually it festered into what it is/was in September 2011... I agree
whole heartily that BV should have kept all the drama under wraps. It was
his undoing. The media in Boston are unrelenting and had a field day with
all of that soap opera-ish garbage. I swear that the Boston media works
for TEE or some other evil outfit in NY.
Dano
Oct 8, 2012, 2:39:57 AM10/8/12
to
"shannanigan" wrote in message
news:nM2dnbpE5pHgtu_N...@neonova.net...
================================
They were "spoiled" by winning two championships under Tito's supposedly
"lax discipline".
I'll tell you this...in years to come when we look back at this team under
Tito what is it that YOU suppose will be remembered?
Now. What will be said for Bobby?
news:nM2dnbpE5pHgtu_N...@neonova.net...
They were "spoiled" by winning two championships under Tito's supposedly
"lax discipline".
I'll tell you this...in years to come when we look back at this team under
Tito what is it that YOU suppose will be remembered?
Now. What will be said for Bobby?
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