Angels on my shoulder, Devil (rays) in my pocket
Robert Glenn Plotner
Events such as 'faith day' at Dodger Stadium signal the Christianization of
pro sports.
By Tom Krattenmaker
August 18, 2007
On Sunday, Christian baseball fans will stream into Dodger Stadium for what
is becoming more common fare at professional ballparks across the country --
"faith day."
Following the Dodgers vs. Rockies game, fans with special tickets will
gather in a corner of the parking lot for a concert by the Christian rock
band Hawk Nelson, an appearance by characters from the "Veggie Tales"
Christian television program and testimonials by several devout Dodgers. The
purpose, according to event organizer Brent High, is to promote the Gospel
of Jesus.
High and his Christian events-promotion company, Third Coast Sports, have
been organizing faith days and faith nights around minor league baseball for
years. They reached the major leagues last season with three events at
Turner Field, home of the Atlanta Braves, and will be in 10 major league
cities this season. The event at Dodger Stadium will be the first in L.A.
These events, which blend religion and commerce, are the product of a
partnership between High's company and host teams. Third Coast undertakes
energetic outreach to evangelical churches, getting baseball-loving church
members (and, more important, their unconverted invitees) to turn out for
the game and a special religious program. Believers nourish their faith and
perhaps extend it to others, and teams welcome the typical surge in ticket
sales and action at the merchandise and food sands. The result, according to
High, "is happy teams, happy churches."
more....
***********************************************************************
Found this interesting, but I really don't have a problem with it. Myriad
groups market with the teams. As long as they aren't holding altar calls
between innings or inserting RNC chips into their brains in the name of God,
then why sweat it?
Robert
Jolly Rogers
> Should God go to the ballgame?
> Events such as 'faith day' at Dodger Stadium signal the Christianization
> of pro sports.
Getting a little bit of Jesus during the game is better than a
knife-wielding urban juvenile delinquent murdering a fan before he is able
to catch the next MARTA home to the suburbs.
--
Jolly Rogers
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Colin William
> Should God go to the ballgame?
> Events such as 'faith day' at Dodger Stadium signal the Christianization
> of pro sports.
This can't be true. There's a war on Christianity, didn't you hear?
> These events, which blend religion and commerce
I think this should read, "which exploit religion for commerce".
Colin
Ben B
your point is well taken, and must be borne in mind. and i have not
been to one of these ballgames, so i'm not pretending to speak with
authority.
but from what i've heard, these people are closer to exploiting
baseball for "religious" purposes than the opposite. it's like
inviting your kids' friends to church with the offer, "would you like
to join us on Sunday? we go to church at 11:00, and then go out to
dinner."
--
Ben
Hutcheson, Sam
Sneaky little Christians and they're promises of false idols.
Dinner? Dinner??? What the hell happened to fasting in a hole in the
desert for 40 days? St. Jerome's gonna kick your dinner eatin' asses
just as soon as we get him a saline drip.
s/
Colin William
> your point is well taken, and must be borne in mind. and i have not
> been to one of these ballgames, so i'm not pretending to speak with
> authority.
> but from what i've heard, these people are closer to exploiting
> baseball for "religious" purposes than the opposite. it's like
> inviting your kids' friends to church with the offer, "would you like
> to join us on Sunday? we go to church at 11:00, and then go out to
> dinner."
I'd be interested to know what goes on there/ I didn't imagine it could
serve any recruiting or evangelizing purpose; rather, it just seemed
like a bunch of religious folk hanging out together at a place with
expensive beer, with a postgame show where all the rest of thte crowd
takes off and leaves them there to do their thing (seems like that's how
the one in Atlanta worked?)
Colin
Lance Freezeland
<colint...@hotmail.com> gave us:
>Ben B wrote:
I hate to take this thing off on a tangent, mainly because I don't
want to offend people like Ben and Ziggy, but the whole
Christian Family Day thing is starting to rub me a bit raw. Not
because of the intermingling of Christianity and baseball, though.
Rather, it's because some teams seem to have confused Christianity
with a small subset thereof -- what could be called "evangelical
Christianity".
Here's a story about this year's Christian Family Day at Busch Stadium
in St. Louis, which was held in June (a game I attended):
A few excerpts to make my point:
"Cardinals first baseman Albert Pujols, one of Christian Family Day's
biggest supporters, scoffs at the idea that evangelism at Busch might
be inappropriate. 'I don't think we're offending anybody," he said.
"We're bringing our Christian testimony to people who need to hear it.
What better place for that than a ballpark?'"
and
"On Saturday the Cardinals allowed Christian Family Day organizers to
hand out 100,000 "testimony cards" — baseball cards with the images of
the Cardinals' Christian players and the story of their faith. "I've
heard kids say they want to be just like Albert Pujols when they grow
up," reads the back of Pujols' testimony card. "They should know I
want to be just like Jesus." Organizers also handed out invitations
asking all fans to stay after the game Saturday."
and
"After the players told the stories of their conversions, popular
young evangelist Tony Nolan spoke to the crowd, ultimately asking
those who were not yet evangelical Christians to pray for a personal
relationship with Christ.
"From this moment on, I'm going to live for you," Nolan asked the
crowd to pray. He asked those who "really mean it" to raise their
hands, then to stand up and "publicly declare what you said in your
private prayer." Several hundred stood, some with their hands raised
to the sky as the rain sprinkled down into the stadium."
========
Now, I don't begrudge these evangelical Christians their faith.
They're welcome to it. And although it's not something to which I
subscribe, I have some good friends who would fall under that title.
And I wasn't "offended" by them at the ballpark on that Saturday.
What bugs me is that, increasingly, the public face of Christianity
are people like this. This is true in terms of politics and
entertainment as well. When I'm watching some television show or
movie, or watching the news, and they're talking about "Christians", I
just know that it's going to be either some fundamentalist church or
evangelical church group, and there they are as the public face of
Christianity. And I know better -- there are millions and millions of
Christians who don't subscribe to the beliefs of the sort of people
that we see each June at "Christian Family Day" at the ballpark.
--
Lance
"I believe in the Church of Baseball" Annie Savoy
Hutcheson, Sam
> Now, I don't begrudge these evangelical Christians their faith.
I do. Bible-thumping fruits.
> What bugs me is that, increasingly, the public face of Christianity
> are people like this.
What you need is some sort of organization, some means or representing
this alleged "silent majority" of Christians or something. Oh wait, I
think that name is taken, or some version of it. Probably enough to
get a cease and desist order.
On the other hand, if the nutjobs have taken over the public face of
your religion, who the hell's fault is that really? I assure you it
ain't mine.
s/
zig zigalo
but we'll just go ahead and blame you anyhoo. mmkay?
--
zig zigalo
"...you can't get any older than dead." Ron puts things in perspective
in a.s.b.a-b
Lance Freezeland
<sa...@bellsouth.net> gave us:
>> Now, I don't begrudge these evangelical Christians their faith.
>I do. Bible-thumping fruits.
>> What bugs me is that, increasingly, the public face of Christianity
>> are people like this.
>What you need is some sort of organization, some means or representing
>this alleged "silent majority" of Christians or something.
See, that's the thing. I don't have any such desire. It's a
doctrinal thing, I suppose. Evangelicals evangelize. We don't.
> Oh wait, I
>think that name is taken, or some version of it. Probably enough to
>get a cease and desist order.
>On the other hand, if the nutjobs have taken over the public face of
>your religion, who the hell's fault is that really? I assure you it
>ain't mine.
Actually, it probably is. It's guys with belief systems like you
running newsrooms and programming sitcoms and deciding what a
"Christian" looks like. And y'all are giving us Ned Flanders.
--
Lance
"You have to have a catcher or you'll have all passed balls."
-- Casey Stengel
Hutcheson, Sam
<freezelandlaw.nos...@consolidated.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 08:11:12 -0700, "Hutcheson, Sam"
>
> >> Now, I don't begrudge these evangelical Christians their faith.
> >I do. Bible-thumping fruits.
> >> What bugs me is that, increasingly, the public face of Christianity
> >> are people like this.
> >What you need is some sort of organization, some means or representing
> >this alleged "silent majority" of Christians or something.
>
> See, that's the thing. I don't have any such desire. It's a
> doctrinal thing, I suppose. Evangelicals evangelize. We don't.
>
> > Oh wait, I
> >think that name is taken, or some version of it. Probably enough to
> >get a cease and desist order.
> >On the other hand, if the nutjobs have taken over the public face of
> >your religion, who the hell's fault is that really? I assure you it
> >ain't mine.
>
> Actually, it probably is. It's guys with belief systems like you
> running newsrooms and programming sitcoms and deciding what a
> "Christian" looks like. And y'all are giving us Ned Flanders.
Oh puh-fucking-lease. Ned Flanders is to "Christian" what Homer
Simpson is to "dad." There wasn't a big convention of liberal
tastemakers that got together and said "Christians look and act like
those weirdos from Focus on the Family." It was the weirdos
themselves that stood up and said "we define what it means to be
Christian" and for some reason, either political convenience or sheer
apathy, the rest of Christendom sort of went "meh, okay." Don't blame
the rest of us.
s/
Colin William
> What bugs me is that, increasingly, the public face of Christianity
> are people like this. This is true in terms of politics and
> entertainment as well. When I'm watching some television show or
> movie, or watching the news, and they're talking about "Christians", I
> just know that it's going to be either some fundamentalist church or
> evangelical church group, and there they are as the public face of
> Christianity. And I know better -- there are millions and millions of
> Christians who don't subscribe to the beliefs of the sort of people
> that we see each June at "Christian Family Day" at the ballpark.
Then why aren't these millions stepping forward and either repudiating
these evangelicals, or at least standing up for their own thing?
I see it as parallel to the GA state flag debate. Maybe for some folks
the flag really did represent states' rights. But they spent years
tanding by letting racists appropriate it as a symbol. Similarly,
non-evangelical Christians have allowed people like Dobson and Falwell
to be their public face for years (and in more recent years, the
President and various similarly-minded Santorum types).
This is part of the basis upon which I've been arguing for years against
things like school prayer. It may seem fine to a lot of Christians in
the abstract, but if it ever happens they might realize that one
denomination wants their prayer, and another wants theirs, etc, suddenly
they might remember why it was kept out all those years.
Colin
Colin William
> On the other hand, if the nutjobs have taken over the public face of
> your religion, who the hell's fault is that really? I assure you it
> ain't mine.
I'm sure some folks would blame the liberal media for trying to make
religious folks look bad by propelling the careers of the likes of Pat
Robertson all these years.
It's always the liberal media's fault. Do get your talking points in order.
Colin
Colin William
>>On the other hand, if the nutjobs have taken over the public face of
>>your religion, who the hell's fault is that really? I assure you it
>>ain't mine.
>
> Actually, it probably is. It's guys with belief systems like you
> running newsrooms and programming sitcoms and deciding what a
> "Christian" looks like. And y'all are giving us Ned Flanders.
You know, I posted my "blame the liberal media" bit largely as a joke. I
forgot you people actually do believe this stuff.
Colin
Lance Freezeland
<colint...@hotmail.com> gave us:
>Lance Freezeland wrote:
Well, it's a combination of factors, Colin. As I thought I made clear
in my initial post on this subject, the evangelicals are seemingly
more than willing to step front and center and claim the title of
"Christian", thereby (in my eyes) co-opting the debate. But it's also
commie atheists like Sam who are far too often content to run with the
stereotype that we're talking about here.
--
Lance
"There are three-hundred thousand sportswriters
and they're all against me. Every one of them."
-- Joaquin Andujar
Ben B
> What bugs me is that, increasingly, the public face of Christianity
> are people like this. This is true in terms of politics and
> entertainment as well. When I'm watching some television show or
> movie, or watching the news, and they're talking about "Christians", I
> just know that it's going to be either some fundamentalist church or
> evangelical church group, and there they are as the public face of
> Christianity. And I know better -- there are millions and millions of
> Christians who don't subscribe to the beliefs of the sort of people
> that we see each June at "Christian Family Day" at the ballpark.
"Some are preaching out of jealousy and rivalry. But others preach
about Christ with pure motives. .... Those others do not have pure
motives as they preach about Christ. They preach with selfish
ambition, not sincerely ... But whether or not their motives are pure,
the fact remains that the message about Christ is being preached, so I
rejoice. (Philippians 1:15-18)
--
Ben
Ben B
> This is part of the basis upon which I've been arguing for years against
> things like school prayer. It may seem fine to a lot of Christians in
> the abstract, but if it ever happens they might realize that one
> denomination wants their prayer, and another wants theirs, etc, suddenly
> they might remember why it was kept out all those years.
which is fine as long as you're really talking about school-sponsored
prayers. but somehow the slippery slope that started with "let's not
have the teachers lead the class in prayer anymore" ended up with "any
kid who prays aloud in school will serve detention."
--
Ben
Colin William
Colin William
>>You know, I posted my "blame the liberal media" bit largely as a joke. I
>>forgot you people actually do believe this stuff.
>
> Well, it's a combination of factors, Colin. As I thought I made clear
> in my initial post on this subject, the evangelicals are seemingly
> more than willing to step front and center and claim the title of
> "Christian", thereby (in my eyes) co-opting the debate. But it's also
> commie atheists like Sam who are far too often content to run with the
> stereotype that we're talking about here.
But if non-nutjob Christians won't take responsibility for how their faith
is projected, then it seems to me a huge copout to blame liberals and
atheists. If Christians think that the public faces of Christianity are
problematic, then it is first and foremost their responsibility to do
something about it.
I'm sure that for years you've thought that African-Americans needed to take
responsibility for fronting a better public face than the likes of Al
Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. Well, it's time for American Christians to do
same. The old guard of Falwell and Robertson are dying off, and guys like
Dobson and Reed have discredited themselves via showing more interest in
power and politics than in faith. So, who will be your next generation of
public faces of Christianity? Instead of going the copout
blame-liberal-media route, maybe it's time to focus more on solving the
problem yourselves so that ersatz-politician demagogues don't grab the mike
for another generation.
Colin
Jolly Rogers
> Well, it's a combination of factors, Colin. As I thought I made clear
> in my initial post on this subject, the evangelicals are seemingly
> more than willing to step front and center and claim the title of
> "Christian", thereby (in my eyes) co-opting the debate. But it's also
> commie atheists like Sam who are far too often content to run with the
> stereotype that we're talking about here.
That just cannot be, Lance. Sam doesn't believe in stereotypes. ;-)
--
Jolly Rogers
Ben B
> "Ben B" <bblan...@hotmail.com> wrote ...
> > which is fine as long as you're really talking about school-sponsored
> > prayers. but somehow the slippery slope that started with "let's not
> > have the teachers lead the class in prayer anymore" ended up with
> > "any kid who prays aloud in school will serve detention."
>
> Is this remotely true? Where?
i don't have the cites, but i've seen that sort of thing in the paper
from time to time. and some people have even fought the requirement
for a moment of silence.
--
Ben
Lance Freezeland
<colint...@hotmail.com> gave us:
>"Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote
>>>You know, I posted my "blame the liberal media" bit largely as a joke. I
>>>forgot you people actually do believe this stuff.
>> Well, it's a combination of factors, Colin. As I thought I made clear
>> in my initial post on this subject, the evangelicals are seemingly
>> more than willing to step front and center and claim the title of
>> "Christian", thereby (in my eyes) co-opting the debate. But it's also
>> commie atheists like Sam who are far too often content to run with the
>> stereotype that we're talking about here.
>But if non-nutjob Christians won't take responsibility for how their faith
>is projected, then it seems to me a huge copout to blame liberals and
>atheists. If Christians think that the public faces of Christianity are
>problematic, then it is first and foremost their responsibility to do
>something about it.
>I'm sure that for years you've thought that African-Americans needed to take
>responsibility for fronting a better public face than the likes of Al
>Sharpton and Jesse Jackson. Well, it's time for American Christians to do
>same. The old guard of Falwell
Southern Baptist
>and Robertson
Southern Baptist
> are dying off, and guys like
>Dobson
Church of the Nazarene
> and Reed
Assembly of God
See what I mean?
>have discredited themselves via showing more interest in
>power and politics than in faith. So, who will be your next generation of
>public faces of Christianity? Instead of going the copout
>blame-liberal-media route, maybe it's time to focus more on solving the
>problem yourselves so that ersatz-politician demagogues don't grab the mike
>for another generation.
But some churches don't seek to evangelize, and don't seek to actively
recruit members away from other denominations. It's not in their
mission statement, so to speak. You're just not going to get Lutheran
or Catholic or Orthodox clergy who are going to rise to the level of
fame of those you've mentioned. All I'm asking is for the culture at
large to recognize that Robertson / Falwell / Dobson / Reed / Swaggart
/ Bakker et al. are only one segment of Christianity.
--
Lance
"Some of the things I've seen here I haven't seen anywhere else I've
managed."
-- Lou Piniella articulates what it means to be initiated into Cubdom
6/2/07
zig zigalo
i see your point. it's tough to get publicity when you're saying, "come to
our church...or not."
Lance Freezeland
gave us:
>i see your point. it's tough to get publicity when you're saying, "come to
>our church...or not."
To quote a police report I just read the other day: "Shout up and be
quit."
--
Lance
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
-- Connie Mack
Colin William
> But some churches don't seek to evangelize, and don't seek to actively
> recruit members away from other denominations. It's not in their
> mission statement, so to speak. You're just not going to get Lutheran
> or Catholic or Orthodox clergy who are going to rise to the level of
> fame of those you've mentioned. All I'm asking is for the culture at
> large to recognize that Robertson / Falwell / Dobson / Reed / Swaggart
> / Bakker et al. are only one segment of Christianity.
Nobody (especially not me) is asking them to evangelize or to recruit
members from other denominations. All I'm asking is for someone other than
the current crop of loudmouths to step up and present an alternative voice.
If people within other denominational faiths don't like what they see, then
they have to speak up themselves to say so. If they're not taking
responsibility for how Christianity is presented, that's their problem.
Colin
bgs
news:f1jmc3li55n89m98q...@4ax.com...
: On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 16:23:34 -0400, "zig zigalo" <zigg...@gmail.com>
: gave us:
:
: >i see your point. it's tough to get publicity when you're saying, "come
to
: >our church...or not."
:
: To quote a police report I just read the other day: "Shout up and be
: quit."
:
: --
: Lance
That's funny - I wonder if Dr. Freud would have anything to add.
--
Marcus Mongolia
Colin William
>> Is this remotely true? Where?
>
> i don't have the cites, but i've seen that sort of thing in the paper
> from time to time. and some people have even fought the requirement
> for a moment of silence.
I'd like to see some documentation on the former.
The latter I've heard about. But, you have to understand that even the
slightest opening will be abused. As I've mentioned before a few times, my
rural north GA school featured an English teacher who had the class pray, a
required baccalaureate service that was functionally Christian (if you
didn't attend, you didn't get to go to graduation), overtly Christian prayer
at graduation, and various other non-veiled Christian references in the
classroom. It is not the least bit of a stretch to me to think that this
stuff goes on across the country.
It's for that reason that things like the moment of silence laws get
challenged. Not because the moment of silence itself is inherently
problematic, but because it will be abused.
And really, why are any of these things needed? Why does the state of
Indiana need "In God We Trust" license plates (for free, as opposed to teh
$15 charge for any other specialty plate)? Mostly these things are pushed
through as political power plays, an evangelical humping of the liberal leg.
Colin
Dirk
> "any
> kid who prays aloud in school will serve detention."
Ben, do you have any actual cases of a child who was punished for
praying aloud in a public school?
Jolly Rogers
> Nobody (especially not me) is asking them to evangelize or to recruit
> members from other denominations. All I'm asking is for someone other than
> the current crop of loudmouths to step up and present an alternative
> voice. If people within other denominational faiths don't like what they
> see, then they have to speak up themselves to say so. If they're not
> taking responsibility for how Christianity is presented, that's their
> problem.
Instead of worrying about who is "not taking responsibility for how
Christianity is presented," I'd rather see society focused on the issues of
controlling violent crime, reducing illegitimacy rates, and reversing the
loss of western civilization as we know it.
The truth is that a babbling evangelist on television isn't a direct threat
to anyone. On the other hand, a welfare mom on crack with six illegitimate
kiddies, each with a different deadbeat father, is. So is a knife to one's
back in "da 'hood".
In other words, it would be nice if the Left would focus a little more on
helping to prevent tangible, undesirable outcomes from transpiring rather
fretting over the freedom of religion.
--
Jolly Rogers
Lance Freezeland
<jolly...@nospam.com> gave us:
>"Colin William" <colint...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Nobody (especially not me) is asking them to evangelize or to recruit
>> members from other denominations. All I'm asking is for someone other than
>> the current crop of loudmouths to step up and present an alternative
>> voice. If people within other denominational faiths don't like what they
>> see, then they have to speak up themselves to say so. If they're not
>> taking responsibility for how Christianity is presented, that's their
>> problem.
>Instead of worrying about who is "not taking responsibility for how
>Christianity is presented," I'd rather see society focused on the issues of
>controlling violent crime, reducing illegitimacy rates, and reversing the
>loss of western civilization as we know it.
Gee, you don't say? Thanks for letting us know that, Joey.
--
Lance
"Not true at all. Vaseline is manufactured right here
in the United States." - Don Sutton, about the rumors
that he uses a foreign substance on the ball
Lance Freezeland
>"Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote in message
>news:f1jmc3li55n89m98q...@4ax.com...
>: On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 16:23:34 -0400, "zig zigalo" <zigg...@gmail.com>
>: gave us:
>: >i see your point. it's tough to get publicity when you're saying, "come
>to
>: >our church...or not."
>: To quote a police report I just read the other day: "Shout up and be
>: quit."
>That's funny - I wonder if Dr. Freud would have anything to add.
It only got better from there. After the above line, he told the
suspect that he wouldn't give him "the police chef's noomber".
Previously, upon confronting the suspect, wanted for a burglary of
"the Dary Qyne", he told him to "Drop that nif on the flood!"
Oh, and the entire line above was "Shout up and be quit, I no my jod."
--
Lance
"I believe in the Church of Baseball" Annie Savoy
----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
Jolly Rogers
>>Instead of worrying about who is "not taking responsibility for how
>>Christianity is presented," I'd rather see society focused on the issues
>>of
>>controlling violent crime, reducing illegitimacy rates, and reversing the
>>loss of western civilization as we know it.
>
> Gee, you don't say? Thanks for letting us know that, Joey.
One can mock the obvious, but those on the Left will never heed the primary
message.
--
Jolly Rogers
Lance Freezeland
<jolly...@nospam.com> gave us:
>"Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote:
>>>Instead of worrying about who is "not taking responsibility for how
>>>Christianity is presented," I'd rather see society focused on the issues
>>>of
>>>controlling violent crime, reducing illegitimacy rates, and reversing the
>>>loss of western civilization as we know it.
>> Gee, you don't say? Thanks for letting us know that, Joey.
>One can mock the obvious, but those on the Left will never heed the primary
>message.
You're begging to be mocked by attempting to turn every single thread,
no matter the topic, back to your views on these issues.
--
Lance
"I had relations with a board, and I'm proud of it."
-- Steve Bosell
Jolly Rogers
>>One can mock the obvious, but those on the Left will never heed the
>>primary
>>message.
>
> You're begging to be mocked by attempting to turn every single thread,
> no matter the topic, back to your views on these issues.
Well, we're a society out of control, Lance. People are worried about mole
hills while there are very serious problems ruining our society. I know
you're not suggesting that we all bury our heads in the sand and keep
pretending, right?
--
Jolly Rogers
Lance Freezeland
<jolly...@nospam.com> gave us:
>"Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote:
>>>One can mock the obvious, but those on the Left will never heed the
>>>primary
>>>message.
>> You're begging to be mocked by attempting to turn every single thread,
>> no matter the topic, back to your views on these issues.
>Well, we're a society out of control, Lance. People are worried about mole
>hills while there are very serious problems ruining our society. I know
>you're not suggesting that we all bury our heads in the sand and keep
>pretending, right?
So that's the only topic we should be discussing, right?
Tomorrow, if Scott posts a thread about his favorite type of white
bread or pasta, I suppose that you'll respond that you're more worried
about "controlling violent crime, reducing illegitimacy rates, and
reversing the loss of western civilization as we know it."
--
Lance
"If you live in a mobile home, Satan is your lord whether you
know it or not." Bob Green
Jolly Rogers
> So that's the only topic we should be discussing, right?
>
> Tomorrow, if Scott posts a thread about his favorite type of white
> bread or pasta, I suppose that you'll respond that you're more worried
> about "controlling violent crime, reducing illegitimacy rates, and
> reversing the loss of western civilization as we know it."
Funny.
I sometimes post interesting [to me] non-political topics and attempt to
start non-political threads. No one cares. It's a fact.
This group is almost pure politics, Lance. Heck, you know that.
--
Jolly Rogers
Lance Freezeland
<jolly...@nospam.com> gave us:
>"Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote:
>> So that's the only topic we should be discussing, right?
>> Tomorrow, if Scott posts a thread about his favorite type of white
>> bread or pasta, I suppose that you'll respond that you're more worried
>> about "controlling violent crime, reducing illegitimacy rates, and
>> reversing the loss of western civilization as we know it."
>Funny.
Accurate.
>I sometimes post interesting [to me] non-political topics and attempt to
>start non-political threads. No one cares. It's a fact.
You're forgetting the fact that many of the regulars here claim to
have you killfiled.
>This group is almost pure politics, Lance. Heck, you know that.
Perhaps, but that doesn't justify your attempt to turn every single
thread into a rehash of your manifesto.
--
Lance
"If I'm going to die for a word, my word is 'poontang'."
R.C. Collins
Jolly Rogers
>>I sometimes post interesting [to me] non-political topics and attempt to
>>start non-political threads. No one cares. It's a fact.
>
> You're forgetting the fact that many of the regulars here claim to
> have you killfiled.
I didn't forget. I'm well aware that I'm not a popular figure here. However,
I believe that having strong convictions about one's beliefs should not be
compromised based on popularity, especially in a newsgroup that is dominated
by Liberals and those who lean decidedly to the Left. It's certainly no
secret that a.s.b.a-b.c is comprised of primarily moderates and Liberals.
Frankly, I haven't seen much ability from the Liberals in this newsgroup of
mounting any solid counter-arguments to the primary points I've presented
regarding crime and the social decline of the United States and western
civilization in general. From my perspective, I have repeatedly presented
logical arguments, but few have countered them because they cannot.
Consequently, I have been conveniently killfilled by some. Despite this, I
have no regrets. The truth sometimes doesn't win many friends; a fact I've
known for a long time.
>>This group is almost pure politics, Lance. Heck, you know that.
>
> Perhaps, but that doesn't justify your attempt to turn every single
> thread into a rehash of your manifesto.
I discuss issues that I believe are important to my country, as well as
society in general. I make no attempt to mask or deny that.
I think the events that are reported in the daily news, as well as various
comments over the past six to twelve months by relatively popular western
leaders, have served as a modest affirmation of my views.
As I've offered before, if a majority of regulars vote for me to permanently
leave a.s.b.a-b.c, I will. I'm not here to spread misery and make the group
intolerable for others. I believe I have been a respectful, measured poster
who does not force himself on others. That's all. My offer to leave is
sincere and stands. (The first time I offered this, there was no response).
I will entrust the honorable Doc Sidbury to collect the tally, if there is
to be one. I will yield to the collective will of the group, if I am called
upon to do so.
--
Jolly Rogers
bgs
Would you consider some middle ground - just leaving race and attacks on
Liberals out?
--
SB
Jolly Rogers
> Would you consider some middle ground - just leaving race and attacks on
> Liberals out?
No, for two reasons. One, I do not want to proceed if I am bound by some
type of posting rules that force me to respond unnaturally and illogically
to any stimuli offered. That should be reserved for the so-called "vanilla
world" beyond cyberspace, where everyone smiles unnaturally and portrays a
false image of respectful tolerance in order to semi-peacefully coexist.
Usenet is on a different plane where ideas can and should flow more freely,
openly, and honestly (which is not to suggest that such dialog should be
disrespectful to fellow posters).
Secondly, none of those with strongly opposing views would be held to the
same standards of containment and restraint. The Leftists here have no
qualms about voicing their opinionated views. Why should anyone else? We
should discuss freely and honestly, or not at all. That's one of the reasons
why I suggested creating this newsgroup and then attempted to do so through
official channels (although Ziggy actually founded the group by simply
posting a message here, IIRC).
Dale Hicks
freezeland...@consolidated.net says...
It doesn't have to be.
--
Cranial Crusader dgh 1138 at bell south point net
Jolly Rogers
>> >This group is almost pure politics, Lance. Heck, you know that.
>
> It doesn't have to be.
Hey, I agree. What would you like to discuss?
--
Jolly Rogers
bgs
news:1187747...@sp12lax.superfeed.net...
: "bgs" <b...@mindless.com> wrote:
:
: > Would you consider some middle ground - just leaving race and attacks on
: > Liberals out?
:
: No, for two reasons. One, I do not want to proceed if I am bound by some
: type of posting rules that force me to respond unnaturally and illogically
: to any stimuli offered. That should be reserved for the so-called "vanilla
: world" beyond cyberspace, where everyone smiles unnaturally and portrays a
: false image of respectful tolerance in order to semi-peacefully coexist.
: Usenet is on a different plane where ideas can and should flow more
freely,
: openly, and honestly (which is not to suggest that such dialog should be
: disrespectful to fellow posters).
:
: Secondly, none of those with strongly opposing views would be held to the
: same standards of containment and restraint. The Leftists here have no
: qualms about voicing their opinionated views. Why should anyone else? We
: should discuss freely and honestly, or not at all. That's one of the
reasons
: why I suggested creating this newsgroup and then attempted to do so
through
: official channels (although Ziggy actually founded the group by simply
: posting a message here, IIRC).
:
: --
: Jolly Rogers
Okay, what about just leaving the race stuff out?
--
SB
zig zigalo
and actually it took a bit (not much) more than posting a message here. i
posted it to control.newgroup with a specific syntax and the lot of you
people requested that it be carried on your servers.
i forget exactly what the post contained, other than what is on topic and
what is off topic, along with an email address for confirmation. easy
stuff, and anybody can do it. some groups actually do get created by
posting a message to a potential group, but it is up to the posting server
to send to that group, thereby creating it, but it is considered a rogue
group and few if any other servers would carry it. newsreader.com is one
such server that will do that and thus has 15,000,000 groups or so. i may
be off some, but you get the drift.
--
zig zigalo
"MaY i uSE yOuR BatHroOM?" -Torgo. MST3K #508
bgs
I believe I recall your posting the steps you had to take then and then more
recently, didn't you outline them for someone else who was wanting to start
a group?
--
SB
taylor
> On Aug 21, 11:06 am, Lance Freezeland
>
> > What bugs me is that, increasingly, the public face of Christianity
> > are people like this. This is true in terms of politics and
> > entertainment as well. When I'm watching some television show or
> > movie, or watching the news, and they're talking about "Christians", I
> > just know that it's going to be either some fundamentalist church or
> > evangelical church group, and there they are as the public face of
> > Christianity. And I know better -- there are millions and millions of
> > Christians who don't subscribe to the beliefs of the sort of people
> > that we see each June at "Christian Family Day" at the ballpark.
>
> "Some are preaching out of jealousy and rivalry. But others preach
> about Christ with pure motives. .... Those others do not have pure
> motives as they preach about Christ. They preach with selfish
> ambition, not sincerely ... But whether or not their motives are pure,
> the fact remains that the message about Christ is being preached, so I
> rejoice. (Philippians 1:15-18)
>
really? so the ends justify the means? that doesn't seem like an
opinion jesus would endorse. apologies for not being familiar with
philippians, but who is the speaker in that passage?
Colin William
> Okay, what about just leaving the race stuff out?
I don't think there's necessarily a problem with that; I don't like
Jolly's opinions, but if that's what he wants to post in here, then so
be it. It's an OT group and that's his topic. It'd be nice if he
wouldn't try to hijack so many threads with his myopic view of the
world, but nobody forces people to respond.
I wouldn't vote for Jolly to leave, nor anyone else, and I wouldn't ask
him to stop discussing certain topics. He is what he is, a single-issue
guy.
Doesn't matter to me, ultimately, because I killfiled his posts, though
I do see these responses.
Colin
Lance Freezeland
<jolly...@nospam.com> gave us:
>"Dale Hicks" <dgh...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> >This group is almost pure politics, Lance. Heck, you know that.
>> It doesn't have to be.
>Hey, I agree. What would you like to discuss?
What difference does it make? Your response is going to turn it back
to executing people.
--
Lance
Go St. Louis Cardinals!
2006 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS
National League Central Division Champions
1996, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2005, 2006
Lance Freezeland
<jolly...@nospam.com> gave us:
>As I've offered before, if a majority of regulars vote for me to permanently
>leave a.s.b.a-b.c, I will. I'm not here to spread misery and make the group
>intolerable for others. I believe I have been a respectful, measured poster
>who does not force himself on others. That's all. My offer to leave is
>sincere and stands. (The first time I offered this, there was no response).
>I will entrust the honorable Doc Sidbury to collect the tally, if there is
>to be one. I will yield to the collective will of the group, if I am called
>upon to do so.
I don't want you to leave, Joey. I just wish you'd stay on topic.
--
Lance
"Some of the things I've seen here I haven't seen anywhere else I've
managed."
-- Lou Piniella articulates what it means to be initiated into Cubdom
6/2/07
Dick Sidbury
Lance Freezeland <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 21 Aug 2007 20:09:22 -0500, "Jolly Rogers"
> <jolly...@nospam.com> gave us:
>
> >As I've offered before, if a majority of regulars vote for me to permanently
> >leave a.s.b.a-b.c, I will. I'm not here to spread misery and make the group
> >intolerable for others. I believe I have been a respectful, measured poster
> >who does not force himself on others. That's all. My offer to leave is
> >sincere and stands. (The first time I offered this, there was no response).
>
> >I will entrust the honorable Doc Sidbury to collect the tally, if there is
> >to be one. I will yield to the collective will of the group, if I am called
> >upon to do so.
>
> I don't want you to leave, Joey. I just wish you'd stay on topic.
>
I won't vote to expel you and I wont tally the votes. However you
should be aware that I read your posts but as soon as you start talking
about race and crime I skip the rest of the post. That's why I didn't
know I was being suggested to count the vote.
dick
-- the more you do this the less likely your message is to spread. If
that's what you want then you're doing a good job.
bgs
Like you and Lance, I would never vote for him to leave because I know the
little bastard would just change his name and come right back in.
--
SB
Dick Sidbury
wrote:
wow! This doesn't sound like you at all scott.
dick
-- unless it was humor that passed over my head.
zig zigalo
i concur. FWIW, i have joey killfiled, but don't enjoy it at all. i like
joey. there are just so many times that i can read "blacks = criminals,
whites = crime victims" and liberals are doormats. and i don't think joey
would ever change his name. just my 2 cents. every once in a while i clear
the killfile, but 10 minutes later it's back up.
>
> dick
> -- unless it was humor that passed over my head.
there is that possibility...and it went way over mine too.
--
zig zigalo
"...you can't get any older than dead." Ron puts things in perspective
in a.s.b.a-b
zig zigalo
> then more recently, didn't you outline them for someone else who was
> wanting to start a group?
yeah, i'm pretty sure i did. it involves using xnews to send the control
message, worded exactly right, to control.newgroup, copy it to alt.config (i
think), and have everybody wishing to participate, request their server add
the group. there are instructions posted often in alt.config
zig zigalo
> I believe I recall your posting the steps you had to take then and
> then more recently, didn't you outline them for someone else who was
> wanting to start a group?
yeah, and here is where the charter can be found:
ftp://ftp.isc.org/pub/usenet/control/alt/alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop.gz
along with several attempts to rmgroup (remove group).
zig zigalo
> bgs wrote:
>> I believe I recall your posting the steps you had to take then and
>> then more recently, didn't you outline them for someone else who was
>> wanting to start a group?
>
> yeah, and here is where the charter can be found:
> ftp://ftp.isc.org/pub/usenet/control/alt/alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop.gz
> along with several attempts to rmgroup (remove group).
just for fun, here's the text of it...
From usenet Tue Oct 12 13:00:02 2004
Path:
shelby.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-08!sn-xit-14!supernews.com!feed4.newsreader.com!newsreader.com!newsh.newsreader.com!image.newsreader.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: alt.config
Subject: cmsg newgroup alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop
From: ziggy <zigg...@gmail.com>
Date: 12 Oct 2004 12:59:19 GMT
Organization: absolutely none
Message-ID: <Xns95805B62A6FE9...@38.144.126.109>
User-Agent: Xnews/5.04.25
Control: newgroup alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop
Approved: zigg...@gmail.com
X-Trace: image.newsreader.com
,gMl29QylTJ7FY,acb98lkLEJcLSfJUFDQsDAw8_m+hawtb7
Lines: 12
Xref: shelby.stanford.edu control.newgroup:219076
For your newsgroups file: Braves fans talk
Charter:
alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop is for general Braves fans
talk, not specifically related to the Atlanta Braves Major League baseball
team.
Unmarked off-topic materials, binaries (except PGP-type signatures),
advertising (spam), excessive posting, cancel attacks, and abusive cross
postings are prohibited.
All posts (messages) must be in plain text only and be human-readable.
From usenet Tue Oct 12 13:30:04 2004
From: hamste...@xs4all.nl
Control: rmgroup alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop
Newsgroups: alt.config
Approved: mu...@mumke.com
Subject: cmsg rmgroup alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop
Followup-To: alt.config
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 15:27:33 +0200
Summary: Every rmgroup deserves at least one repetition
Reply-To: mu...@mumke.com
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548
X-No-Archive: yes
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
NNTP-Posting-Host: mumkenews.mumke.com
Message-ID: <416bdc49$1...@mumkenews.mumke.com>
Lines: 63
X-Complaints: mu...@mumke.com
Path:
shelby.stanford.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!syros.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!colt.net!pop-news-1.colt-telecom.nl!newsgate.cistron.nl!news.wiretrip.org!mumkenews.mumke.com!not-for-mail
Xref: shelby.stanford.edu control.rmgroup:111053
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
This rmgroup is being issued because:=20
faulty newsgroupline
resembles alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves
no justification =3D a citation of evidence showing adequate interest
in the group
christinA eijkhout
Newsgroups: alt.config
Subject: cmsg newgroup alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop
=46rom: ziggy <zigg...@gmail.com>
Date: 12 Oct 2004 12:59:19 GMT
Organization: absolutely none
Message-ID: <Xns95805B62A6FE9...@38.144.126.109>
User-Agent: Xnews/5.04.25
Control: newgroup alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop
Approved: zigg...@gmail.com
X-Trace: image.newsreader.com
,gMl29QylTJ7FY,acb98lkLEJcLSfJUFDQsDAw8_m+hawtb7
Lines: 12
Path:
nl-news.euro.net!snickers.news.uhro.net!humbolt.nl.linux.org!news.nl.l
inux.org!transit.news.xs4all.nl!news.tele.dk!bofh.vszbr.cz!news.radio.
cz!195.85.130.72!feeder1.essentkabel.com!news.moat.net!green.octanews.
net!news-out.octanews.net!indigo.octanews.net!feed4.newsreader.com!new
sreader.com!newsh.newsreader.com!image.newsreader.com!not-for-mail
Xref: nl-news.euro.net control.newgroup:3112
=46or your newsgroups file: Braves fans talk=20
Charter:
alt.sports.baseball.atlanta-braves.coffeeshop is for general Braves
fans=20
talk, not specifically related to the Atlanta Braves Major League
baseball=20
team.
Unmarked off-topic materials, binaries (except PGP-type signatures),
advertising (spam), excessive posting, cancel attacks, and abusive
cross
postings are prohibited.
All posts (messages) must be in plain text only and be
human-readable.
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Version: PGP 8.0.3 - not licensed for commercial use: www.pgp.com
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--=20
rmgroups are meaningless. Obsessing over them is like watching=20
Capt.Hook wanking.=7F-Brian Mailman, alt.config 6-3-2002-
"The alt.config FAQ is still very current, just ugly as a bowling
shoe." -- Q Tip, alt.config (4 September 2002)
Any idiot can SEND a control message for any reason, or for no reason
Newgroups don't create newsgroups; rmgroups don't remove newsgroups
-- Adam Kerman with courtesy to -=3DHawk=3D-, alt. config(17 April 2003)
bgs
Actually, I was going for humor. Well, except for the voting part - I was
serious about that. I'm also being serious when I say that I'd really like
to find a resolution to all of this.
--
SB
bgs
Wow, you too? I really *did* miss my mark.
--
SB
bgs
news:2m1zi.78277$Xr3....@fe174.usenetserver.com...
Well, I see that somebody should have informed a few of us about excessive
posting. And me in particular that the posts had to be readable by humans.
-- and who is this hamste...@xs4all.nl guy?
SB
Colin William
"bgs" <b...@mindless.com> wrote
> Actually, I was going for humor. Well, except for the voting part - I was
> serious about that. I'm also being serious when I say that I'd really
> like
> to find a resolution to all of this.
There's no resolution to seek, and no reason to seek it. If he keeps
hijacking, so be it. If people keep responding to the hijacks, then so be
it. If people don't, so be it.
Colin
Lance Freezeland
<colint...@hotmail.com> gave us:
>"bgs" <b...@mindless.com> wrote
--
Lance
"There's no resolution to seek, and no reason to seek it. If he keeps
hijacking, so be it. If people keep responding to the hijacks, then so
be it. If people don't, so be it." -- Colin reveals that he's a closet
Doris Day fan 8/22/07
zig zigalo
my skull has tended to be thick lately, so y'know...
--
zig zigalo
"D'oh!...I filled my pants, sir...In fact, I think I filled yours
too." -Mike MST3K #902
bgs
I hadn't noticed you, but mine is rather think today since my day started at
4:45. I used to do that routinely, but I just can't do that any longer
without consequences. The 105.5 high temp today didn't help either.
--
Scott
zig zigalo
> started at 4:45. I used to do that routinely, but I just can't do
> that any longer without consequences. The 105.5 high temp today
> didn't help either.
rather think... :)
i like it.
105.5? yikes! that's hot! and that's not a paris hilton thing.
--
zig zigalo
"...some problems are only solved one funeral at a time." (dirk shares his
optimism in the coffeeshop)
Hutcheson, Sam
> bgs wrote:
> > zig zigalo wrote:
> >>> bgs wrote:
> >>>> zig zigalo wrote:
> >>>>>> Dick Sidbury wrote:
Go to weather.com and look up Atlanta. They've replaced the "happy
sun with occasional grey clouds" and the "happy sun without clouds"
icons and replaced them with a boiling red thermometer. That's the
weather in Atlanta. "Hot. Damn hot." It's not "sunny", it's not
"clear with a chance of thunderstorms later in the afternoon." It's
"just fucking hot."
Makes a guy feel slightly guilty for having to wear the long sleeves
to dinner on the Baltic...
Oh, wait. Nevermind.
s/
Ron Johnson
I remember mentioning the temperature during the winter. I'm happy
to report there is an up-side. I've been wearing a sweater the
last couple of days.
Colin William
"Ron Johnson" <joh...@ccrs.nrcan.gc.ca> wrote
> I remember mentioning the temperature during the winter. I'm happy
> to report there is an up-side. I've been wearing a sweater the
> last couple of days.
I've had bad from both worlds - shoveling my car out of feet of snow in the
winter with subzero temps, and 90+ with high humidity for much of the last
month. Grrrr.
Colin
Lance Freezeland
<colint...@hotmail.com> gave us:
>"Ron Johnson" <joh...@ccrs.nrcan.gc.ca> wrote
Welcome to the Midwest, my friend.
BTW the Archangel Michelle wanted me to ask you a question about
hybrid cars. Is the savings in gasoline offset by the electric bill
caused by having to plug the thing in at night?
--
Lance
"I believe in the Church of Baseball" Annie Savoy
bgs
:
: Welcome to the Midwest, my friend.
:
: BTW the Archangel Michelle wanted me to ask you a question about
: hybrid cars. Is the savings in gasoline offset by the electric bill
: caused by having to plug the thing in at night?
:
: --
: Lance
I'd just like to take a moment and ask the official record keeper to be sure
and note how I laid off this one.
--
SB
Ben B
that's the apostle Paul. and no, in context, i don't think his point
is the end justifies the means. his point, i think, is that it is a
good thing for the gospel to be preached. if his enemies thought they
could hurt his feelings by preaching the gospel and winning away
converts from *his* church, they were wrong. he wasn't trying to build
his own little empire; he was trying to spread the word.
--
Ben
zig zigalo
> "Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote in
> message
>>
>> Welcome to the Midwest, my friend.
>>
>> BTW the Archangel Michelle wanted me to ask you a question about
>> hybrid cars. Is the savings in gasoline offset by the electric bill
>> caused by having to plug the thing in at night?
>>
>
> be sure and note how I laid off this one.
that was a hard one...
(and so was that, i'm sure)
Colin William
> Welcome to the Midwest, my friend.
You'd think I'd be used to it after a decade in Ohio and Indiana.
> BTW the Archangel Michelle wanted me to ask you a question about
> hybrid cars. Is the savings in gasoline offset by the electric bill
> caused by having to plug the thing in at night?
I'm going to assume this is a joke; however, I'll also answer it straight,
in case anyone else doesn't know. You don't plug in a hybrid. It charges its
battery by
taking advantage of regeneration that takes place during driving, braking
and slowing down, etc.
I never provided a one year summary of owning the car, so I'll do so here.
Afterr a year or so of owning one, my summary would be this - if you want to
get great mileage, you can, but you have to really learn to drive it right.
If you just want to drive without thinking about it too much, you can get
very good mileage, but the premium isn't as great as you'd probably hope.
Over the last year I can get 50+ mpg when the weather is mild, and I can
usually get a good 52-54 when driving between here and Indy and back (which
is nice - I pay $6 in gas and the college reimburses me $48). When the
weather is hot and I have to run the AC it drops to around 48. In the
winter, when it has to run the engine more to warm up teh battery to peak
efficiency, it's dropped to around 44. Overall I'd say I average about 47
year-round.
But, my wife averages quite a bit less, probably in the low 40s, because she
just drives the car as she would any other car. And that's still fine - it's
about 50% better than we were doing in our old Accord. And given how much of
our mileage is in town, it's still a lot better than the city rate we'd get
in a comparable-sized car. But it's not the kind of mileage that'd knock
your socks off.
Different hybrids will reward you more for attentive driving, and in some it
doesn't matter. I get the feeling the Honda hybrids are more consistent than
the Prius. My Prius has more upside for me, but I imagine the Civic would
work better for my wife.
So, just my two cents there.
Colin
bgs
>>
>> Different hybrids will reward you more for attentive driving, and in
>> some it doesn't matter. I get the feeling the Honda hybrids are more
>> consistent than the Prius. My Prius has more upside for me, but I
>> imagine the Civic would work better for my wife.
>>
>> So, just my two cents there.
>>
>> Colin
I don't want to hijack this, because I thought Lance was being serious.
But, I'm real glad you posted this performance data. I shoud've guessed you
were tracking things so closely, but didn't - otherwise I would have
inquired.
I'm still looking for a new car and would still prefer a hybrid. Of late, I
seem to be spending more time looking at the Highlander. Nothing seems to
have everything I want though. I'm hooked on Bluetooth and really really
need a nav system so I don't get lost going to Publix and the Post Office.
But mostly, and to tie back in to Lance's question, I am intrigued by the
plug it in at night Chevy Volt even though I know I've got two or three
lumbars that would go ballistic if I told what I was thinking.
--
Scott
Lance Freezeland
<colint...@hotmail.com> gave us:
>"Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote
>> BTW the Archangel Michelle wanted me to ask you a question about
>> hybrid cars. Is the savings in gasoline offset by the electric bill
>> caused by having to plug the thing in at night?
>I'm going to assume this is a joke; however, I'll also answer it straight,
>in case anyone else doesn't know. You don't plug in a hybrid. It charges its
>battery by
>taking advantage of regeneration that takes place during driving, braking
>and slowing down, etc.
Doesn't Chevy have a plug in hybrid?
--
Lance
Go St. Louis Cardinals!
2006 WORLD SERIES CHAMPIONS
National League Central Division Champions
1996, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2005, 2006
Colin William
> I don't want to hijack this, because I thought Lance was being serious.
> But, I'm real glad you posted this performance data. I shoud've guessed
> you
> were tracking things so closely, but didn't - otherwise I would have
> inquired.
I'm not following it exactly via a spreadsheet or anything, but I've kept a
decent track of things.
> I'm still looking for a new car and would still prefer a hybrid. Of late,
> I
> seem to be spending more time looking at the Highlander. Nothing seems to
> have everything I want though. I'm hooked on Bluetooth and really really
> need a nav system so I don't get lost going to Publix and the Post Office.
> But mostly, and to tie back in to Lance's question, I am intrigued by the
> plug it in at night Chevy Volt even though I know I've got two or three
> lumbars that would go ballistic if I told what I was thinking.
And the Volt is still vaporware for another few years. And the plug-in Prius
keeps getting pushed back too. GM seems to have a better shot at getting a
plug-in into production. From what I've read, the Li-ion batteries they were
hoping to use for the Prius were deemed too risky, whereas the ones GM is
looking to use are not prone to the same problems. I haven't looked at it in
depth, but I think that's what's delaying Toyota.
GM, of course, had already done a lot of research into electric cars in the
90s, so that may yet help them moving forward.If the battery technology has
moved forward by now, then they could really make a move here.
We'd like to hold on a few years before getting another car. Currently we
have our 2001 Prius and our 1995 Isuzu Rodeo. We want to run the Rodeo until
it dies and then see what's available. In addition to the hybrids, I might
also look at the Honda Fit, which seems to have a good degree of flexibility
to its small interior.
Colin
Colin William
>>I'm going to assume this is a joke; however, I'll also answer it straight,
>>in case anyone else doesn't know. You don't plug in a hybrid. It charges
>>its
>>battery by
>>taking advantage of regeneration that takes place during driving, braking
>>and slowing down, etc.
>
> Doesn't Chevy have a plug in hybrid?
Nope, not yet. It's under development, but it's still a few years away:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Volt
At this point I think they're trying to figure out if the battery tech will
be affordable, or if they'll have to lease the batteries to keep the overall
car price down.
Chevy's site:
http://www.chevrolet.com/electriccar/
And apologies if your question wasn't a joke. it wasn't completely clear to
me, so with you I always tend to assume it is :-)
Colin
Lance Freezeland
<colint...@hotmail.com> gave us:
>"Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote
To be truthful, I hadn't given it any thought. I was simply relaying
Michelle's bonafide question.
--
Lance
Created in 1926 by the Marching Illini, there is no
more stirring and dignified tradition on any college
campus than the Three In One. The symbol of Chief Illiniwek
embodies spirit, pride, and loyalty to this great university
in the most exciting four minutes in all of college athletics.
Here is the incomparable Three in One: http://tinyurl.com/3awuja
bgs
I see you are right. Janet and I both thought we had seen or read something
recently that suggested GM might have it available far sooner than expected.
Since the only thing I can find suggests they may start testing early next
year with their Li battery and production in 2010, that was clearly on our
part. Oh well, my back wouldn't handle it anyway. To Segway and beyond
then...
--
SB
Colin William
"Lance Freezeland" <freezeland...@consolidated.net> wrote
>>And apologies if your question wasn't a joke. it wasn't completely clear
>>to
>>me, so with you I always tend to assume it is :-)
>
> To be truthful, I hadn't given it any thought. I was simply relaying
> Michelle's bonafide question.
No problem. Like I said, you don't have to plug in a hybrid; the battery
gets charged by thihngs like coasting to a stop, applying brakes, and
excells torque being used at speed that would otherwise go unused.
Colin
Dick Sidbury
wrote:
>
> I'm still looking for a new car and would still prefer a hybrid. Of late, I
> seem to be spending more time looking at the Highlander. Nothing seems to
> have everything I want though. I'm hooked on Bluetooth and really really
> need a nav system so I don't get lost going to Publix and the Post Office.
You can buy a GPS equipped with bluetooth for a reasonable amount of
money. I got a new Garmin nuvi 350 (no bluetooth but then again I don't
even have a cell phone) which works fine as a GPS and you can carry it
around when you're walking (or in your case seguing[or whatever they
call it]).
dick
bgs
We've got a TomTom that has bluetooth, but between it and the rearview
mirror, it blocks a fair amount of viewing area (particularly with my
eyesight) and well has been held hostage by Janet since Christmas. Does
that sound plausible as a reason to get a new car?
As for Segueing (?) around, we've just got the first cell phones small
enough for me to consider carrying around in my pocket. Up until three
weeks ago, I had a *car* phone. When I wasn't in it driving, I wasn't
reachable.
--
SB
Colin William
> As for Segueing (?) around, we've just got the first cell phones small
> enough for me to consider carrying around in my pocket. Up until three
> weeks ago, I had a *car* phone. When I wasn't in it driving, I wasn't
> reachable.
We generally go with prepaids, which we hardly ever use. I've only just
started carrying one around again in case we have something unexpected that
affects who picks up Aidan from preschool.
I've also had bad luck with prepaids this year - my Beyond Wireless account
disappeared (they were reselling the old AT&T TDMA network, which is getting
shut down); and I fear for my current XE Mobile (Cingular reseller)
account - their site has every phone sold out and I can't reach their
customer service, which suggests they might be ready to go belly up. I'd
thought about jumping to Amp'd Mobile (they'd been reselling Verizon network
access), but they went belly up too.
If XE goes under, not sure what I'll do. Might try t-mobile, but I suspect
their network isn't so hot around here. But whatever I do, it's unlikely
I'll sign a contract. It ticks me off to no end to end up paying about $37 a
month for a $29.99 plan.
Colin
bgs
news:5j8317F...@mid.individual.net...
: "bgs" <b...@mindless.com> wrote
Agreed. Some of that is annoying taxes and some are just fees named to
appear as taxes.
-- You've got a young one though and we've got an elderly one.
SB
Colin William
> : If XE goes under, not sure what I'll do. Might try t-mobile, but I
> suspect
> : their network isn't so hot around here. But whatever I do, it's unlikely
> : I'll sign a contract. It ticks me off to no end to end up paying about
> $37
> a
> : month for a $29.99 plan.
>
> appear as taxes.
Yup. And just try to pin them down in advance of getting your first bill on
what the thing will actually cost. It's impossible. They just won't tell
you.
> -- You've got a young one though and we've got an elderly one.
Exactly. If not for Aidan I'm not sure we'd have a cellphone at all.
Instead, I have a few unlocked GSM phones, one with the aforementioned XE
SIM and the other with a cingular/AT&T non-contract SIM. Plus a few
european SIM cards kicking aroundd from the prepaid accounts we use over
there.
Colin
Lance Freezeland
>-- You've got a young one though and we've got an elderly one.
Yeah, you are getting up there.
--
Lance
"The one constant through all the years, Ray, has been
baseball. America has rolled by like an army of steamrollers.
It has been erased like a blackboard, rebuilt and erased again.
But baseball has marked the time. This field, this game: it's
a part of our past, Ray. It reminds of us of all that once was
good and it could be again." -- Terrence Mann
bgs
>> On Fri, 24 Aug 2007 08:03:36 -0500, "bgs" <b...@mindless.com> gave us:
>>
>>> -- You've got a young one though and we've got an elderly one.
>>
>> Yeah, you are getting up there.
>>
>> --
>> Lance
Yeah, that's what yo momma told me last nite!
--
Marcus Mongolia
(I probably should drop MM with all that's going on)
Lance Freezeland
us:
And you think that's what these people are doing?
--
Lance
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball."
-- Connie Mack
Lance Freezeland
<colint...@hotmail.com> gave us:
>"Ben B" <bbla...@hotmail.com> wrote
>>> Is this remotely true? Where?
>> i don't have the cites, but i've seen that sort of thing in the paper
>> from time to time. and some people have even fought the requirement
>> for a moment of silence.
>I'd like to see some documentation on the former.
>The latter I've heard about. But, you have to understand that even the
>slightest opening will be abused. As I've mentioned before a few times, my
>rural north GA school featured an English teacher who had the class pray, a
>required baccalaureate service that was functionally Christian (if you
>didn't attend, you didn't get to go to graduation), overtly Christian prayer
>at graduation, and various other non-veiled Christian references in the
>classroom. It is not the least bit of a stretch to me to think that this
>stuff goes on across the country.
Here's an interesting story:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,295432,00.html
--
Lance
"Here's Rolen. He could give the Cardinals the lead.
The pitch to him. Swing! And get up, baby! Get up!
Get up! Get up! Get up! HOME RUN! Rolen has just given
the Cardinals a 4-2 lead. He smoked it. ... Listen,
LIS-TEN to Cardinal Nation!"
- Mike Shannon, NLCS Game Seven 10/21/04
Colin William
I can't decide which I think is sillier, the alleged response of the school
threatening withholding of the diploma, the fact that this will end up in
court, or the part about there being 15 frickin' valedictorians. Good grief,
just grow a pair and pick one.
Colin
Dick Sidbury
"Colin William" <colint...@hotmail.com> wrote:
well if Jolly were here he'd explain to you that we don't want students
to feel bad. I'm surprised that everyone wasn't a valedictorian.
dick
-- fillin in when necessary
Colin William
"Dick Sidbury" <DrJames...@hotmail.com> wrote
> well if Jolly were here he'd explain to you that we don't want students
> to feel bad. I'm surprised that everyone wasn't a valedictorian.
Jolly would probably argue that obviously a minority was #15 in the class,
so they extended valedictorian honors far enough to do so. He'd also
furtherr argue that said minority probably should be in prison on death row,
after which the body should be deported, as validated by FBI crime
statistics.
Colin
Ben B
> On Thu, 23 Aug 2007 11:35:41 -0700, Ben B <bblan...@hotmail.com>
> >good thing for the gospel to be preached. if his enemies thought they
> >could hurt his feelings by preaching the gospel and winning away
> >converts from *his* church, they were wrong. he wasn't trying to
> >build his own little empire; he was trying to spread the word.
>
> And you think that's what these people are doing?
assuming "these people" are the folks who put together "faith at the
ballpark day" or whatever it's called, yes, i think that's exactly
what they're doing.
--
Ben
Lance Freezeland
us:
This guy too:
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/laworder/story/BD894ECCE07345E48625734D007026E4?OpenDocument
I'm betting he's a Baptist. ;)
--
Lance
"We don't rent pigs. Uva Uvam Vivendo Varia Fit."
Captain Augustus McCrae
Dale Hicks
freezeland...@consolidated.net says...
>
> This guy too:
> http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/stories.nsf/laworder/story/BD894ECCE07345E48625734D007026E4?OpenDocument
>
> I'm betting he's a Baptist. ;)
Spare the bible and spoil the victim.
A bible has to make for a pretty unweildy weapon, no?
I can't see it being worth the while unless it's one of those giant-
size grandma bibles.
--
Cranial Crusader dgh 1138 at bell south point net