Why do you guys hate pirates so much?
Gactimus
that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
for free?
Guardian Pegasus
wrote:
>It's not our fault that we don't wanna pay 50 bucks for a copy of a game
>that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
>for free?
I don't like their outfits, and they have poor hygiene.
Jim Vieira
won't fall for such an obvious and blatant troll. Please people...
Ignore it.
"Gactimus" <gact...@xrs.net> wrote in message
news:cipu4l$agk$1...@news1.usf.edu...
Desert Rat
Maxis thousands of hours of development, and time to make.
===
Diplomacy is being able to say "Nice Doggie..." until you can find a Rock.
"Gactimus" <gact...@xrs.net> wrote in message
news:cipu4l$agk$1...@news1.usf.edu...
Daniel Kolle
Communist.
--
-Daniel "Mr. Brevity" Kolle; 16 A.A. #2035
Koji Kondo, Yo-Yo Ma, Gustav Mahler, Krzysztof Penderecki, and Geirr Tveitt are my Gods.
Head of EAC Denial Department and Madly Insane Scientist.
John Lemings
> It's not our fault that we don't wanna pay 50 bucks for a copy of a game
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
Pirates are one of the reasons why games cost $50 to begin with.
Pirates are lazy. They want the best, but don't want to put in the work
(money) to get it.
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Bob Perez
> It's not our fault that we don't wanna pay 50 bucks for a copy of a game
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
Interesting. I've become used to seeing your name associated with messages
promoting Bush and slamming Kerry, and now this post comes along and reveals
a new (at least, to me) side of you: you're not only a thief, but one who
asks "and what's wrong with that"? LOL what a piece of work, thanks for
today's laugh. Your riends, family and political party must all be very
proud of you.
--
Bob Perez
"Men do not quit playing because they grow old; they grow old because they
quit playing."
- Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes
Bugman
bucket of blood and the rum drinking though. Eye patches and earrings are
pretty cool. And who wouldn't want to be called LongJohn, if you know what I
mean.
"Gactimus" <gact...@xrs.net> wrote in message
news:cipu4l$agk$1...@news1.usf.edu...
BlahBlah
other ships.
And I don't.
That's why I hate pirates.
Just Another Mook
It doesn't cost them only 5 cents a copy. Did you ever take into
account the thousands of hours of programming, at usually $80-$100 an
hour per person with usually donzens of programmers per game, the
marketing costs for advertising, the packaging costs, the CD replication
costs (usually at least 30 cents up to a dollar each, depending on the
packaging and quantity that they order. Then there's the cost for
technical support staff, sales staff, etc.... and believe me, when you
go and buy a copy for $50 from Gamestop or Software Boutique, the
company who produced the game doesn't get anywhere near that amount for
it. They usually take at least a 40% hit off of the suggested retail
price. In some places the manufacturer has to buy shelf space. This
can run $30k to $50k per retail chain. And that's whether they sell any
copies or not. Then there's the distributor, who also takes a cut.
That's usually 12 to 18%, depending on what kind of track record you
have with them.
I used to own a software company so I know what I'm talking about here.
I didn't really produce or sell that many games and what we did were
niche products, but I can tell you from first hand experience that the
costs involved to produce, market, and sell this stuff is outrageous.
Everyone and his brother want their grubby hands in the pie that you
produce. So on top of all this, you have people who, just because they
bought a computer, think that everyone who produces software, owes them
a free copy. You get enough of them stealing your product and you can
be out millions of dollars.
Chris Fowler
Don't forget about marketing expenses. A 1 page add in a
gaming magazine can cost at least $25K. That is just the space
you still have to pay people to create the ad.
Grackle
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
Then you should at least pay 5 cents you cheap bastard.
Vidar Olavesen
news:cipu4l$agk$1...@news1.usf.edu...
> It's not our fault that we don't wanna pay 50 bucks for a copy of a game
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
If nobody buys, nobody makes. And prices could be dropped (doubt the
companies would) if sales were better. I wouldn't want to cheat for example
Dave Mustaine (Megadeth), cause I love his work.
Jim Vieira
was blatantly obvious it was a troll, and no matter how witty
your responses, you are giving him what he wanted.
Come on people, WTF? I can't believe so many of you
bit on this.
Tommy Stenberg
"Jim Vieira" <Whipl...@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> wrote in message
news:_H24d.33473$B51....@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
Sometimes I wonder if the trolls have some kind of a special deal with their
ISP. Like "you get 1 dollar worth of webspace for every reply you get on a
newsgroup" or something. I mean, there has to be SOME reason these trolls
continue to lure people into pointless replies and such?
Tommy
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.766 / Virus Database: 513 - Release Date: 18.09.2004
jeffc
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
Not a very convincing troll, are you?
massivegrooves
Pirate=Thief, simple as that.
Bob Perez
"Jim Vieira" <Whipl...@wiDOT.rrDOT.com> wrote in message
news:_H24d.33473$B51....@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
Because on balance it's more fun to take the opportunity to revel in his
idiocy than to ignore him.
Grackle
news:_H24d.33473$B51....@twister.rdc-kc.rr.com...
But if we kill file the troll we'll l miss out on thought-provoking
discussions, such as piracy.
Westman
"Just Another Mook" <lma...@qwest.net> schreef in bericht
news:MC14d.205$ei4....@news.uswest.net...
Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
> Pirates are one of the reasons why games cost $50 to begin with.
Counterpoint: Games for pirate-free platforms (like cartridge
consoles) are traditionally higher than on pirate-infested platforms.
Jeremy Burks
reason people who actually pay for the friggin game get stuck with
copy-protected disks... especially considering how The Sims 2's game disc
spins around in my DVD-ROM for about 5 minutes before I can even play the
goddamn game! So go screw yourself and die of the clap.
"Gactimus" <gact...@xrs.net> wrote in message
news:cipu4l$agk$1...@news1.usf.edu...
Richard Edwards
I'm a programmer. You're a thief.
Later,
Richard
K&D
Dianna
On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 19:07:01 +0000 (UTC), Gactimus <gact...@xrs.net>
wrote:
> It's not our fault that we don't wanna pay 50 bucks for a copy of a game
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
Andrew
>--
>Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
Do you send emails with Opera's "revolutionary" Usenet client?
--
Andrew, contact via interpleb.blogspot.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.
Brian Siano
You're saying that the cost to make a game is the same as the price of
printing a CD?
Jordan Lund
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
"I don't have the money." isn't a legitimate excuse. If gaming is too
expensive for you then you need to find a new hobby.
- Jordan
Bruce the Shark
> You are the worst troll I have ever seen. I hope that people
> won't fall for such an obvious and blatant troll. Please people...
> Ignore it.
Why? You didn't.
Planet of the Normals
news:o5r1l0ds61u1pdt7b...@4ax.com:
> A thousand monkeys banging on keyboards posted the following under the
> name Grant Anderson <gpsan...@hotmail.com>:
>
>> Gactimus wrote:
>>
>>> It's not our fault that we don't wanna pay 50 bucks for a copy of a
>>> game that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can
>>> get it for free?
>>
>> Politics trolls not working for you any more?
>
> Only amateurs use politics or political hotbutton (abortion, gun
> control, creationism, etc) topics for trolling anyways. No self
> respecting good troll would lower themselves to using that.
>
> This post had all the artistry and talent of a monkey bashing a brick
> over a piano. Original poster obviously not very intelligent or
> experienced at this, probably learned trolling watching over someone's
> shoulder.
The evidence doesn't support your claims, considering the volumes of replies
to the original post.
Planet of the Normals
news:0jf2l0hnubq8ohf37...@4ax.com:
> On Wed, 22 Sep 2004 08:21:05 GMT, "Ohmikeghod"
> <ohmik...@mirthlink.net> wrote:
>
>> Because you're thieves. That's why.
>>
>> "It's not my fault" ... Then whose is it? YOU are the one that makes
>> the decision to steal, not anyone else.
>
> Out of curiosity, since you seem to think the world is completely
> black and white... how would you characterize the countries that are
> copying AIDS and HIV drugs and selling them cheaper because they can't
> afford them? Are they thieves, Mike?
Of course they are thieves. A thief is someone who steals the property of
another without permission. The ends don't justify the means. I know you
liberals have a hard time with that simple truth. But I guess you liberals
were never good with absolute truth.
Adnan
>
> It's not our fault that we don't wanna pay 50 bucks for a copy of a game
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
Because if you enjoy the game then you would like to reward those that
put the effort to make it.
Adnan
Ben Sisson
You're just bitter you got suckered by him and then tried a weakass
political troll yourself. Noob.
--
Irate Customer: "You don't have very good customer service!"
The Gord: "I'm a reflection of that I'm forced to deal with. You aren't a very good customer."
SilveryBlue
"Ben Sisson" <ilkhanik...@yahoo.ca> wrote in message
news:5rh4l05n03v5pt2jk...@4ax.com...
I love your sig line...........it's sooooo true too, lol.
Ben Sisson
>"Ben Sisson" <ilkhanik...@yahoo.ca> wrote in message
>news:5rh4l05n03v5pt2jk...@4ax.com...
>> Irate Customer: "You don't have very good customer service!"
>> The Gord: "I'm a reflection of that I'm forced to deal with. You aren't a
>very good customer."
>
>I love your sig line...........it's sooooo true too, lol.
Then it would be poor of me not to supply you with the source:
http://www.actsofgord.com/index.html
Recommended reading for anyone who has worked in retail, customer
service, or pretty much anywhere where they might have to talk to a
customer at some point. Consider it a balm for the soul.
Doug Jacobs
Counter-counterpoint - cartridges cost more to produce than a CD or DVD.
Not that cartridges are pirate-proof - look at the GB/GBA for instance.
SilveryBlue
Thanks..............I work with customers all day as a cashier at Walmart.
This is gonna be fun to read I am sure, lol.
Mark
> Pirates are one of the reasons why games cost $50 to begin with.
You don't honestly, really, actually think that if there was no piracy
and games companies therefore had a captive market, they'd then _cut_
their prices, do you?
Mark
Brian Siano
Then you're saying that piracy is a futile exercise, at least as far as
affecting game prices.
Hank the Rapper
> Then it would be poor of me not to supply you with the source:
>
> http://www.actsofgord.com/index.html
>
> Recommended reading for anyone who has worked in retail, customer
> service, or pretty much anywhere where they might have to talk to a
> customer at some point. Consider it a balm for the soul.
I like this one because it deals with the topic started.
http://www.actsofgord.com/Wrath/chapter01.html
Aaron J. Bossig
news:q66dnVP9da2...@giganews.com:
Also, look up the "Vinegar Boy" story, posted on many sites,
such as customerssuck.com.
--
Aaron J. Bossig
FunkyDevil
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
http://www.airamericaradio.com/
http://www.outfoxed.org/OutfoxedSummary.php
Florida is coming up on it's fourth hurricane , don't vote Bush or
next time it might be twenty hurricanes and an earthquake or two.
Wasn't there a lot of tornados in Texas when Bush was governor ?
I'm just saying...
stePH
> A thousand monkeys banging on keyboards posted the following under the
> name "SilveryBlue" <silver...@comcast.net>:
>
>>I love your sig line...........it's sooooo true too, lol.
>
>
> Then it would be poor of me not to supply you with the source:
>
> http://www.actsofgord.com/index.html
>
> Recommended reading for anyone who has worked in retail, customer
> service, or pretty much anywhere where they might have to talk to a
> customer at some point. Consider it a balm for the soul.
I'm long acquainted with the site in question. My personal favorite:
http://www.actsofgord.com/Chronicles/chapter27.html
aka "Gord's Babysitting Service"
stePH
--
"A lion will exert himself to the utmost, even when entering the tiger's
den to throw baby rabbits off a cliff!" -- Moroboshi Ataru
Mark
> Then you're saying that piracy is a futile exercise, at least as far as
> affecting game prices.
No, I'm saying that, if anything, piracy means they have to sell games
for less... sure, they wouldn't be selling many games for $1000 if
there were no pirates, but I suspect it would be a lot longer before
they were in the bargain bins for $10 (which is where I buy most of my
games... few are worth much more than that to me).
Mark
Sarah
>No, I'm saying that, if anything, piracy means they have to sell games
>for less... sure, they wouldn't be selling many games for $1000 if
>there were no pirates, but I suspect it would be a lot longer before
>they were in the bargain bins for $10 (which is where I buy most of my
>games... few are worth much more than that to me).
>
> Mark
Ps2 games shouldn't be $49, dvd flicks aren't $49. Dvd's are alot
cheaper now but the price of ps2 games hasn't dropped.
btw, they were still $49 before mod chips came out. Why pay $49 for a
game that you only play an hour & can't take back cause you opened it?
zack_b...@email.com
I like butter.
SilveryBlue
"Sarah" <Sar...@trip.net> wrote in message
news:kai8l05h7dam7s5gi...@4ax.com...
At most respectible places, if you have your reciept you can take it back
and I know for a fact that at Electronics Boutique you can even trade it in
for another game. If you don't have your receipt then how do you prove you
got them at that store?
Piracy, theft, whatever you want to call it, occurs offline too.
Also, why are you complaining, sounds like you would be happy that the games
have NOT gone up with inflation :)
Nils Tanner
<silver...@comcast.net> got it all completely wrong and wrote:
>At most respectible places, if you have your reciept you can take it back
>and I know for a fact that at Electronics Boutique you can even trade it in
>for another game. If you don't have your receipt then how do you prove you
>got them at that store?
Which might be the case in the US (and the UK) but not in other parts
of Europe, at least certainly not over here. They'd laugh in your
face...
Which is still no reason to pirate, as there are things like demos and
reviews...
massivegrooves
Sarah wrote:
>>No, I'm saying that, if anything, piracy means they have to sell games
>>for less... sure, they wouldn't be selling many games for $1000 if
>>there were no pirates, but I suspect it would be a lot longer before
>>they were in the bargain bins for $10 (which is where I buy most of my
>>games... few are worth much more than that to me).
>>
>> Mark
>
>
> Ps2 games shouldn't be $49, dvd flicks aren't $49. Dvd's are alot
> cheaper now but the price of ps2 games hasn't dropped.
Not even the same thing, can't believe someone can't figure this one out
on thier own. Movies (DVD's) have other income sources, as in the box
office recipts, monies from pay channels like HBO/SHOWTIME/etc.. and
also the pay for view tv channels. They have alot more income sources so
they can sell the DVD's for much less than you could a game. A game only
has one main source of income to recoup expenses and to make a profit
and that is sales of the game itself. They don't have the extra sources
so the cost is going to be higher than a DVD.
> btw, they were still $49 before mod chips came out. Why pay $49 for a
> game that you only play an hour & can't take back cause you opened it?
Read reviews and do some homework and generally there are not many
instances where you would even need to do that. If there was a major
flaw in the game then generally you can return them and get another one.
Bugman
<zack_b...@email.com> wrote in message
news:f3c08532.04092...@posting.google.com...
My cats breath smells like catfood.
Bugman
My doctor told me I wouldn't get so many nosebleeds if I kept my finger out
of there.
Bugman
If you're drinking Homerhal, I'll have a swig!
Hank the Rapper
> I'm long acquainted with the site in question. My personal favorite:
>
> http://www.actsofgord.com/Chronicles/chapter27.html
> aka "Gord's Babysitting Service"
ROLF
I can't believe the nerve of some people. I was assembling artificial trees
at Lowe's two week ago. I got yelled at by three people because it was only
November. One customer asked, "Aren't you ashamed of putting trees up
already." I said, "I make $30 a tree and they each only take an hour to do.
No, I'm happy as a kid on Christmas."
Doug Jacobs
> No, I'm saying that, if anything, piracy means they have to sell games
> for less... sure, they wouldn't be selling many games for $1000 if
> there were no pirates, but I suspect it would be a lot longer before
> they were in the bargain bins for $10 (which is where I buy most of my
> games... few are worth much more than that to me).
Normal market forces still apply even if there is no piracy. You still
have to find the minimum price that maximizes profit.
One of the effects of piracy is that it creates a situation where the
companies cannot compete due to the price. After all, why pay $10, much
less $50, when you can buy a pirated copy for $3. Even at $3, the pirate
is easily making over 40% profit - again, something the legitimate
companies can't compete with.
I am not sure what would happen to prices if piracy were to suddenly stop.
My guess is that - like you - most folks don't feel most games are worth
paying $50 for, and would wait for the prices to drop. If anything, I
think the lack of piracy would drive game prices down faster - not
slower. This would apply to both the price of new games, as well as how
fast they fall into the bargin bin.
Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
> Ps2 games shouldn't be $49, dvd flicks aren't $49. Dvd's are alot
> cheaper now but the price of ps2 games hasn't dropped.
PS2 games does not have an initial run in theaters before released on
DVD. PS2 games, with very few exceptions, do not have a secondary
market of toys, posters and the like. Comparison... failed.
drax
"Hank the Rapper" <fake...@coldmail.com> wrote in message
news:LcednQh9NOy...@giganews.com...
How are things in the future?
drax
walter mitty
>
> Thanks..............I work with customers all day as a cashier at Walmart.
> This is gonna be fun to read I am sure, lol.
>
in Walmart?
walter mitty
> It's not our fault that we don't wanna pay 50 bucks for a copy of a game
> that only costs Maxis like 5 cents per copy. Why pay when you can get it
> for free?
I didn't even know Pirates had PCs - thought it was all cabin boys and
parrots.
Trevor
Wrong. Gamecubes are virtually free of pirates, yet thier games are
the same price as the heavily pirated xbox and PS2. Please explain
this and I will let you get away with the comment above.
Thoth
news:3ae896c3.04100...@posting.google.com...
Nintendo prices according to what the market will bear. Market influences,
including piracy, have worked to establish ~$50 as the going rate.
Lars Haugseth
If the marked will bear $50 per game, why would they price the games
significantly lower than that if there were no piracy?
--
Lars Haugseth
Thoth
news:m3ekkd3...@bender.eiendomsnett.no...
Piracy is one of the market forces. Remove piracy from the market and MS
and Sony would presumably sell more units. If they sold more units they
could realize the same profit with a reduced retail price. Retail prices
influence market share. If all the major console makers could turn a profit
with lower retail prices, the manufacturer with the smallest market share
would be tempted to market its product based on a lower price point. Once
one lowered the price the others would feel the market pressure to follow.
Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
> If they sold more units they could realize the same profit with a
> reduced retail price.
Or they could realize even more profit at the same retail price! Or
even higher!
XBox and PS2 games rarely compete for the same customers.
> Retail prices influence market share.
No, but profits do. I do not think shareholders would welcome a
NON-INCREASE in profits when the alternative is an INCREASE.
> If all the major console makers could turn a profit with lower
> retail prices, the manufacturer with the smallest market share would
> be tempted to market its product based on a lower price point. Once
> one lowered the price the others would feel the market pressure to
> follow.
You have a charming naļivetč regarding the "free market". Gamecube
games are more expensive than PS2 games because they sell at that
higher price point, regardless of what Sony does. Remember: For all
practical purposes, games do not compete between the platforms - only
the consoles do.
Clogar
>
[snip]
Drugs are bad. VERY bad. :/
> > Retail prices influence market share.
>
> No, but profits do. I do not think shareholders would welcome a
> NON-INCREASE in profits when the alternative is an INCREASE.
OK, now I know you're just trolling. :)
Thoth
news:4162F5...@nospam.com...
> Tor Iver Wilhelmsen wrote:
> >
> [snip]
> > XBox and PS2 games rarely compete for the same customers.
>
> Drugs are bad. VERY bad. :/
Some drugs are bad. Others are very bad. And still others are fairly
benign and quite entertaining. That said, MS and Sony compete for game
customers at every level.
>
> > > Retail prices influence market share.
> >
> > No, but profits do. I do not think shareholders would welcome a
> > NON-INCREASE in profits when the alternative is an INCREASE.
>
> OK, now I know you're just trolling. :)
He thought I was talking about *stock* market share. LOL! Whoosh! I guess
he missed the fact that the mighty Nintendo has tried to bolster the GC's
market share by undercutting the competition's console suggested retail
price.
console-stuff
If there was less pirating I have my doubts it would lower the prices. Most
people who pirate a game do it because either they can or because they can't
afford it. They would never buy if they could not pirate it. There the
makers are claiming to monies they would never have got anyway.
"Thoth" <th...@notlisted.net> wrote in message
news:83D8d.291763$4o.291717@fed1read01...
Ted
console-stuff wrote:
>
> I think there is so much pirating because the game prices are unrealistic.
> If there was less pirating I have my doubts it would lower the prices. Most
> people who pirate a game do it because either they can or because they can't
> afford it. They would never buy if they could not pirate it. There the
> makers are claiming to monies they would never have got anyway.
Except of course people rewrite what they're willing to buy when they
can steal it with impunity.
cHi
the more games are pirated, the less that actually are sold. therefore, in
order to make a profit, the prices of the games must be higher. Once you
actually make a full-fledged game, spend the money on the man-hours and
equipment to make, produce, and distribute this game - then you can properly
assess how much money a game should cost.
"console-stuff" <consol...@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:4165...@news.comindico.com.au...
Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
> the more games are pirated, the less that actually are sold.
Only if every pirated game replaces a sale. If the person pirating
would have had no intent to actually buy the game, it's no more a
"lost sale" than someone seeing the game on a shelf and choosing not
to buy it.
> therefore, in order to make a profit, the prices of the games must
> be higher.
Higher prices usually reflect a higher demand. If prices are higher
because of - as you indicate - a lower demand, market forces are out
of whack.
Normal business sense dictates that a high price _discourages_ buying,
except in the case of luxury goods - and games are not that.
Andrew
<tor.iver....@broadpark.no> wrote:
>Normal business sense dictates that a high price _discourages_ buying,
>except in the case of luxury goods - and games are not that.
Games are essential to life are they?
--
Andrew, contact via interpleb.blogspot.com
Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text.
Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question.
Thoth
"Tor Iver Wilhelmsen" <tor.iver....@broadpark.no> wrote in message
news:usm8oz...@broadpark.no...
> "cHi" <fakea...@dontsendmeanything.co.uk> writes:
>
> > the more games are pirated, the less that actually are sold.
>
> Only if every pirated game replaces a sale. If the person pirating
> would have had no intent to actually buy the game, it's no more a
> "lost sale" than someone seeing the game on a shelf and choosing not
> to buy it.
People obviously don't just pirate games that they wouldn't ordinarily buy.
I can't believe you're this obtuse.
> > therefore, in order to make a profit, the prices of the games must
> > be higher.
>
> Higher prices usually reflect a higher demand. If prices are higher
> because of - as you indicate - a lower demand, market forces are out
> of whack.
Market price isn't set by demand alone. Demand for a product merely
influences market price.
Perhaps you just have to be a troll or a pirate not to get it.
Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
> People obviously don't just pirate games that they wouldn't ordinarily buy.
> I can't believe you're this obtuse.
Gee, wonderful argument you've got there, picked up from a dumpster?
No matter what games people pirate, they represent a zero
*contribution* to the publisher's income, *not* an actual *loss* to
the company any more than someone walking into a store and deciding to
buy two DVDs instead of the game.
If the company estimate selling 50,000 boxes of a game, but only sells
20,000, that's a difference between estimated and actual income. Those
30,000 unsold boxes still exist, and may be written off and destroyed,
or sold at a discount or whatever. It's still not a loss in the sense
of someone shoplifting a sweater.
Buying a computer game is NOT really buying a product but a license to
use a product. Pirates playing games are using the product without
paying for that license, so they are leeching on the paying customers.
> Market price isn't set by demand alone. Demand for a product merely
> influences market price.
Sure, but in his case that influence seemed lacking.
> Perhaps you just have to be a troll or a pirate not to get it.
I am neither.
Chromallly
> except in the case of luxury goods - and games are not that.
Piracy is rampant in Asian countries because the price of software is
obscenely high. Software companies fail to realize they need to
adjust the price of their product based on the countries' cost of
living. A good example is the Big Mac. Big Mac in Japan cost a lot
more than a Big Mac in China. If you make $2000 a month, $50 for a
game is affordable. If you only make $250 a month, $50 for a game is
NOT affordable. Joe has to find an alternative to get his game and
he'll just go to the store across the block to buy a pirated version.
Joe will endure the lack of manual, messing with the latest cracks
just to be able to install the latest patch, and most of the time
unable to play the game online. If they lower the price to $20 or
something reasonable, Joe will more likely buy the game. Even if the
software company earns just a buck or two from him, it's a positive
step forward. I went to a mall in Asia a while back and I saw the
games they have available cost a lot more than Bestbuy or CompUSA.
It's because the game has to be imported. The games cost an average
of $10 to $15 MORE than in the US. It's ridiculous.
Andrew
wrote:
>step forward. I went to a mall in Asia a while back and I saw the
>games they have available cost a lot more than Bestbuy or CompUSA.
>It's because the game has to be imported. The games cost an average
>of $10 to $15 MORE than in the US. It's ridiculous.
The prices in Asia can be strange, I went to a mall in Thailand
looking for a cheap pair of Nike's and they cost about the same as
they do in the UK despite the fact they are probably produced in a
local sweatshop.
Tor Iver Wilhelmsen
> Piracy is rampant in Asian countries because the price of software
> is obscenely high. Software companies fail to realize they need to
> adjust the price of their product based on the countries' cost of
> living.
Microsoft tries: Witness the useless "light" Windows they try to push
in those markets.
> A good example is the Big Mac. Big Mac in Japan cost a lot more than
> a Big Mac in China.
Keep in mind Japan is one of the countries with the highest costs of
living (up there with Norway and Bermuda). Nearly everything there is
expensive.
Ted
So you're saying the price of items in places where piracy is worse are
higher than places where piracy isn't as rampant...
Chromallly
> > a Big Mac in China.
>
> Keep in mind Japan is one of the countries with the highest costs of
> living (up there with Norway and Bermuda). Nearly everything there is
> expensive.
But when we're talking about poor ass countries like Vietnam and
Philippines where a college grad only earns an average of $200 a
month, who would buy Doom 3 for $60? The price should be adjusted
accordingly.
What software companies should do is to contract the local publishers
in these regions to locally print the CDs and manuals and distribute
it from there, to keep cost down. Even if you only get a dollar or
two per software you sell, it's still something. It also get people
to accept and get used to owning originals.
Ted
Throw them in prison for bootlegging and they'll get used to owning
originals or acting in other ways that are not bootlegging as well.
walter mitty
> I think there is so much pirating because the game prices are unrealistic.
> If there was less pirating I have my doubts it would lower the prices. Most
> people who pirate a game do it because either they can or because they can't
> afford it. They would never buy if they could not pirate it. There the
> makers are claiming to monies they would never have got anyway.
>
Yeah, sure. Whatever. So, how many have you pirated?
Chromallly
> originals or acting in other ways that are not bootlegging as well.
Is that working right now? We can't even control piracy in the US,
how can you expect to enforce it on other countries? Throw every 13
year old girls in jail for having mp3 files on their computer. Yeah,
that would work alright.....
Chromallly
> higher than places where piracy isn't as rampant...
The prices of goods should be based on income levels for that
particular region. It's nothing new. Cars, motorcycles, computers,
and etc. are not all priced the same all over the world. Some are
cheaper than others. I don't see any reason why they wouldn't do the
same with software. Supply and demand isn't the only price factor,
income level and demographics plays a huge part as well.
If you don't like that solution, what do you propose Ted? You seem to
bitch a lot but never offer a solution. Putting them in jail is a
suggestion only a 12 year old would make. I'll assume you're just
kidding. You know it won't happen. Some Vietnamese president won't
put their kids in jail for playing illegal copy of Doom just to
satisfy an American company. Heck, even Americans won't even do that.
Skeatsan''co
"Chromallly" <chrom...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6b7b556.04101...@posting.google.com...
I'd rather pay the going price myself. It makes things so much easier when
I need help on the technical side or if there are further expansions of the
game.
Also solves any virus problems associated with warez which can become very
expensive to repair.
Just my opinion
Skeats
sandtiger
>
> Chromallly wrote:
>>What software companies should do is to contract the local publishers
>>in these regions to locally print the CDs and manuals and distribute
>>it from there, to keep cost down. Even if you only get a dollar or
>>two per software you sell, it's still something. It also get people
>>to accept and get used to owning originals.
>
>
> Throw them in prison for bootlegging and they'll get used to owning
> originals or acting in other ways that are not bootlegging as well.
Yeah, because tossing people in jail over ridiculous issues has been
demonstrated to be a cheap, effective way to not only deter this
horrible, society ruining crime, but cut down on requests for conjugal
visits by the real criminals who're locked up for stuff like murder.
As an alternative, why not just carve a big letter "P" (or whatever the
first character for the word "pirate" is in their language) into their
faces and set them back on the street? Or sterilize them? How about
killing the bootlegger and anyone who shares 50% of his genes, just in
case piracy is genetic? Can't take any chances that one of these
horrible people will breed!
Do you work for SPA, RIAA or the MPAA, by any chance?
Ted
Jail is perfectly reasonable, altho it should likely be limited in
application. Makers of large quantities of bootlegs should face 30 years
in prison and millions of dollars in fines. Anyone selling pirate copies
should spend six months in jail and be fined to the extent that they'll
be paying half their wages for at least five years for the first offense
(much longer if they don't make much money). Second offense (following
first conviction) would be 5 years in prison and 20 years of wage
garnishment. Uploaders should be fined $10,000.
They don't care about the rights of others; why should anyone care about them?
Skeatsan''co
Ted
sandtiger wrote:
>
> Ted wrote:
> >
> > Chromallly wrote:
>
> >>What software companies should do is to contract the local publishers
> >>in these regions to locally print the CDs and manuals and distribute
> >>it from there, to keep cost down. Even if you only get a dollar or
> >>two per software you sell, it's still something. It also get people
> >>to accept and get used to owning originals.
> >
> >
> > Throw them in prison for bootlegging and they'll get used to owning
> > originals or acting in other ways that are not bootlegging as well.
>
> Yeah, because tossing people in jail over ridiculous issues has been
> demonstrated to be a cheap, effective way to not only deter this
> horrible, society ruining crime, but cut down on requests for conjugal
> visits by the real criminals who're locked up for stuff like murder.
Piracy is a crime that affects people other than the pirates. The
argument that "well, they may never have bought it anyway" is full of
the stench of a false counterfactual. Some pirates pirate when they
would buy legitimately if they had no pirate choice, and hide behind the
lie that they would never have bought it if it wasn't approximately
free. And then more people fall in line with the pirates. THey claim
they wouldn't have bought it otherwise. Because of course now they're
buying other things with the money they would have used for the legit
product. And so There's less money to be made in making IP, so we get
less or lower quality IP. Which means every time someone pirates
something, the entertainment we all get goes down in quality a little
bit, or else everyone who buys the legit product has to pay a little
more.
>
> As an alternative, why not just carve a big letter "P" (or whatever the
> first character for the word "pirate" is in their language) into their
> faces and set them back on the street? Or sterilize them? How about
> killing the bootlegger and anyone who shares 50% of his genes, just in
> case piracy is genetic? Can't take any chances that one of these
> horrible people will breed!
They are scum who don't care about the work others have put into
products. Throwing them in prison will help in keeping them out of the
gene pool and serve as a lesson to others that society will not allow
the rights of others to be trampled on.
>
> Do you work for SPA, RIAA or the MPAA, by any chance?
Nope. I resent fake communist fuckers who want a free ride at,
ultimately, my expense.
f r e e
> Nope. I resent fake communist fuckers who want a free ride at,
> ultimately, my expense.
Capitalists fuck eachother also, and a lot!!!!
sandtiger
>
> sandtiger wrote:
>
>>Ted wrote:
>>
>>>Chromallly wrote:
>>
>>>>What software companies should do is to contract the local publishers
>>>>in these regions to locally print the CDs and manuals and distribute
>>>>it from there, to keep cost down. Even if you only get a dollar or
>>>>two per software you sell, it's still something. It also get people
>>>>to accept and get used to owning originals.
>>>
>>>
>>>Throw them in prison for bootlegging and they'll get used to owning
>>>originals or acting in other ways that are not bootlegging as well.
>>
>>Yeah, because tossing people in jail over ridiculous issues has been
>>demonstrated to be a cheap, effective way to not only deter this
>>horrible, society ruining crime, but cut down on requests for conjugal
>>visits by the real criminals who're locked up for stuff like murder.
>
>
> Piracy is a crime that affects people other than the pirates. The
> argument that "well, they may never have bought it anyway" is full of
> the stench of a false counterfactual.
Who made that argument just now? Did I just make that argument, or are
you assuming I would?
> And so There's less money to be made in making IP, so we get
> less or lower quality IP. Which means every time someone pirates
> something, the entertainment we all get goes down in quality a little
> bit, or else everyone who buys the legit product has to pay a little
> more.
People have always produced both high and low quality IP regardless of
compensation. I don't buy your argument here.
I won't argue relative quality - that's purely a subjective opinion -
but I'm willing to bet that I can point out 2 examples of astonishingly
low-quality IP making piles of cash for its creator for each single
example of high-quality IP making zilch for its creator.
>>As an alternative, why not just carve a big letter "P" (or whatever the
>>first character for the word "pirate" is in their language) into their
>>faces and set them back on the street? Or sterilize them? How about
>>killing the bootlegger and anyone who shares 50% of his genes, just in
>>case piracy is genetic? Can't take any chances that one of these
>>horrible people will breed!
>
>
> They are scum who don't care about the work others have put into
> products. Throwing them in prison will help in keeping them out of the
> gene pool and serve as a lesson to others that society will not allow
> the rights of others to be trampled on.
Yes - instead it'll wind up costing everyone, even people who don't use
whatever the people pirated, taxes. Way to go! Spread the cost around!
You seem to have this odd notion that not caring about someone else's IP
justifies the staggering punishment of imprisonment and what goes along
with it.
And, in fact, disproportionate punishment for a transgression does
exactly the opposite of what you seem to think it will: it proves that,
indeed, people *will* tolerate the rights of others being trampled.
>>Do you work for SPA, RIAA or the MPAA, by any chance?
>
>
> Nope. I resent fake communist fuckers who want a free ride at,
> ultimately, my expense.
I'll gladly take fake communist fuckers over idiot facists who don't
grok the repercussions of their "solutions" any day. Fake communists
grow out of it eventually, but idiot facists tend to wind up in politics.
Chromallly
> I need help on the technical side or if there are further expansions of the
> game.
I don't think you get what I'm trying to say. You & I have no problem
paying for original games because we can afford them. Piracy is a
huge problem in 3rd world countries because the price for these
software is unreachable even for the middle class. It's because they
price these products based on income levels as if you're a US resident
plus another $10 because they are imported items, making these
products cost even more than if you buy it from the US. Software
companies are losing sales to pirates. They have 2 choices, keep
their prices steep like they're doing right now and pretend the
problem doesn't exists and lose out majority of their sales to pirates
OR they can slash their prices considerably in order to give consumers
less reason to buy pirated materials. When a new game comes out in
the US, you can immediately find them at Bestbuy or CompUSA on sale
for $35. When a new game comes out in Vietnam or Philippines, that
same game cost $60. If you're making $200 a month, you're not going
to pay $60 for a game. Slash that price to $30 and you'll start
seeing profits. Unfortunately, it is greed that prevent software
companies to try this solution.
> Also solves any virus problems associated with warez which can become very
> expensive to repair.
The pirated software you buy on the street are virus free.
xTenn
> Piracy is a
> huge problem in 3rd world countries because the price for these
> software is unreachable even for the middle class.
>
Stated like that, it makes one wonder how they can afford the Video Console,
the TV and the power to play it with...
Doug Jacobs
> "John Lemings" <lm...@msn.com> writes:
> > Pirates are one of the reasons why games cost $50 to begin with.
> Counterpoint: Games for pirate-free platforms (like cartridge
> consoles) are traditionally higher than on pirate-infested platforms.
Correction, there is no such thing as a pirate-free platform. Never has
been, and never will be one.
There were cartridge pirates since the days of the 2600. A friend of mine
had a pirated 2600 cartridge of Space Invaders even though he had no Atari
to play it on.
And even now, how hard is it to get a EPROM kit and download images from
the net?
Paul Heslop
--
Paul (she dreams in color, she dreams in red)
------------------------------------------------------
Stop and Look
http://www.geocities.com/dreamst8me/
Memnoch
wrote:
>I hate them because they're usually played by lousy actors... ahaaaar
"Pirates" with Walter Mathau. What a great film.
Paul Heslop
Pyrates with kevin Bacon... er, as one person put it
"Not as bad as I thought it would be"
redTed
>>I hate them because they're usually played by lousy actors... ahaaaar
>
> "Pirates" with Walter Mathau. What a great film.
Garrrrrr.
(Steve the pirate, in Dodgeball.)
Paul Heslop
or the sea captain from The Simpsons
Daniel
> redTed wrote:
>>>> I hate them because they're usually played by lousy actors... ahaaaar
>>> "Pirates" with Walter Mathau. What a great film.
>> Garrrrrr.
>>
>> (Steve the pirate, in Dodgeball.)
>
> or the sea captain from The Simpsons
Pirates by Emerson, Lake and Palmer, album "Works Vol 1", side four,
track two. Brilliant.
Daniel
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Paul Heslop
Have we mentioned johnny Depp?
Homer J. Simpson
>> consoles) are traditionally higher than on pirate-infested platforms.
>
> Correction, there is no such thing as a pirate-free platform. Never has
> been, and never will be one.
You're much more likely to find pirated PC games than console games when a
console has to be modded in order to play burned media. Thus, it only makes
sense that publishers can get away with charging more for console games.
JustBoo
<paul....@blueyonder.co.uk> wrote:
>
>Have we mentioned johnny Depp?
Arrrg, matey. That scurvey dog has been suggested. He's a better
software pirate than a flouncy "real" pirate. Arrrggh, I tells ya'.
"When I have understanding of computers I shall be the Supreme Being!"
- Evil, Time Bandits
Paul Heslop
'e be, 'e be. An' then of course we 'ave Jason Isaacs.
"You, sir, are a codfish!"