Raytheon sucks!
Kim Greenfield
Normally I wouldn't vent over here over something like this, but where
better? My husband is angry enough, so I can't really take it out on him
since it's not his fault. Well, here goes.
My husband, Mike, currently works for Raytheon (used to be Hughes) in
Fullerton. About 4 years ago when it was still Hughes, the powers that be
decided it might be a good idea to close the Fullerton site and sell the
land to a developer (just what OC needs, more houses). Anyway, rumors
were flying that had everyone moving everywhere between New York and San
Diego. They eventually decided to move some people to El Segundo (near
LAX) and the division Mike was in to Long Beach. The Long Beach deal fell
through, so they kept the Fullerton site open.
About a month ago, Raytheon decided to close the Fullerton site for good.
They were initially going to combine operations with their plant in San
Diego and move to someplace like Carlsbad or north San Diego county.
Okay, I guess I could have lived with that, but I told Mike that I didn't
want him coming home in a couple of years to tell me that they were moving
to Portsmouth, RI (where the headquarters for this particular division
is). Mike contacted some folks locally (Boeing in Anaheim, where he used
to work when it was Rockwell) and has had some promising interviews.
About 3 weeks ago, Mike called and said the San Diego move is off, and
they're moving the division to RI. We really don't want to even consider
a cross-country move since we're pretty well established where we are, and
I don't want to uproot the kids any more than I have to. Raytheon decided
that they were going to send everyone out to investigate the area
(Portsmouth and surrounding areas) to try to get as many of their
employees as possible to move with them. As luck would have it, the first
trip out is this week Thursday, so Mike and I said we would go. Besides,
they want to do this quickly, and we can't go out any time after this due
to prior weekend commitments.
Here's where we start getting angry. It's now Tuesday, and we still don't
have a clear schedule of what's going on once we get there. We know that
we will be arriving in Providence around 8 p.m. on Thursday night. On
Friday, they want to take the engineers into the Portsmouth facility for a
tour and what sounds like job interviews, even though this would be a
simple transfer from one facility to another. While this is going on, I'm
supposed to go on a van with a bunch of people I have never seen before
and go touring around the Portsmouth area. Saturday, they apparently are
going to have some real estate agents take us around to see what kind of
housing is available in what price range. We take off for home at 6 a.m.
Sunday morning. I was hoping to link up with Janet sometime in here, but
I don't know when (check your email later tonight; I may know more).
Really sounds like they don't want us to explore anything on our own.
Mike has called the person in charge of this whole trip to tell him this
was unacceptable, but he wasn't in and has not yet returned Mike's call.
I really don't want to travel all the way across the country to be
miserable (I can stay at home to do that if I want). I don't want to go
touring with people I don't know; I'm really quite shy and won't talk to
people unless I feel comfortable with them. Mike knows this, as he should
after 15 years of marriage, and would like to try to work out something
else, but he doesn't think this will be possible. I would much rather
stay in the hotel room and read than be put in the situation I described.
Actually, I was hoping we would have a car so we could check out the area
we are most interested in exploring. Besides, I need to know if there is
a good yarn shop in the area to feed my knitting obsession, but that's
beside the point. One of our main concerns is finding a synagogue where
we could be comfortable (Mike's Jewish, I'm not), and Mike has located one
in Barrington. We would like to attend Friday night services, but without
a car we're stuck, and this has become kind of important in our lives this
past year. Also, since I currently run a medical transcription service
from home I would like to scope out the area to locate hospitals and
medical office buildings to target for work.
If the whole point of this trip is to show us the area so we can decide if
we want to move there, wouldn't it make sense to let us go off on our
own? Yeah, it's nice to see the facility and the surrounding areas, but
there are other things to contemplate other than how nice the facility is
and how nice the area surrounding it is. I don't know if it's worth the
trip just for this limited view they are going to allow us to have.
Right now, I'm not willing to move out there for Raytheon, even if this
turns out to be the best place in the universe. Raytheon has done more to
piss me off in the last couple of months; don't even get me started on the
feeble medical plan they are trying to push on us. Oh, one other thing,
Raytheon is planning on moving the program Mike is on in February. Now,
last time I checked, even the kids out here on year-round schedules finish
up their current school year in June (my son's school is out in June, but
my daughter's school goes an extra month). I'll be damned if I'm going to
even remotely consider moving midyear like that. I'm not really sure we
should even take the trip, but Raytheon's paying for it.
Okay, I think I'm done. I've wasted enough of your time. You may now
return to your regularly scheduled lives.
The Other Kim (m...@deltanet.com)
JenTreloar
Good Luck Kim!
I can only tell I feel your pain. I have been irate at the accursed Navy for
our entire marriage. Six years of lost paperwork and incompetent people
screwing us out of reimbursements.
I hope that it all goes well. What an inconsiderate hard sell they are
pushing.
Now the upside is, if you move to RI, you and Janet and I can get together!
(and maybe Eva if we can drag the Innocent One away)
Jen
Pick my nits to e-mail me!
KMG123
Kim Greenfield <m...@nospam.com> wrote in article
<mjg-201098...@5399-ana512.deltanet.com>...
> Hey all.
>
> Normally I wouldn't vent over here over something like this, but where
> better? My husband is angry enough, so I can't really take it out on him
> since it's not his fault. Well, here goes.
I am sorry to hear about it. About a month ago Ratheon did the same thing
to the Lewisville (just outside of Dallas) location. I can't remember the
number of people they let go, but it was alot! Kinda puts a sour taste in
your mouth for big business. I hope everything works out.
Kevin
Liz
Kim Greenfield wrote:
<a well worded panic post>
Kim, I didn't word that to be mean, but because I have been there and
recognize your current state of emotions. We did it for Kawaski and Litton, I
did it this time last year for Advanced Bionics. Never again, but that's a
whole nother story. We got to live some cool places and meet some wonderful
people.
The short trip is usually a prelude - they show you the sights and try to talk
you into the move. After you agree, there should be a longer, more autonomous
and individual trip for house hunting and discovery of the neighborhood. There
SHOULD be I said. You may want to ask about that. We took our kids on that
one, it was usually busy, but fun.
Good luck to you, no matter what you decide to do, you can make it work. While
you are in the hotel room, get the phone book out, make your list of doctors,
hospitals etc. Take the book to the nearest copy center. Better yet, call the
phone company and ask for a book. You may also ask the hotel. Also, be sure to
get a newspaper to give you more information about the area.
Take care, and have a great trip! Liz
butting in again - sorry...
Kendrick
Never trust big businessKendrick Reed
ken...@geocities.com
My homepage is :
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/9739/
ICQ - email mne for number !
>
>Here's where we start getting angry. It's now Tuesday, and we still don't
>have a clear schedule of what's going on once we get there. We know that
>we will be arriving in Providence around 8 p.m. on Thursday night. On
>Friday, they want to take the engineers into the Portsmouth facility for a
>tour and what sounds like job interviews, even though this would be a
>simple transfer from one facility to another. While this is going on, I'm
>supposed to go on a van with a bunch of people I have never seen before
>and go touring around the Portsmouth area. Saturday, they apparently are
>going to have some real estate agents take us around to see what kind of
>housing is available in what price range. We take off for home at 6 a.m.
>Sunday morning. I was hoping to link up with Janet sometime in here, but
>I don't know when (check your email later tonight; I may know more).
>Really sounds like they don't want us to explore anything on our own.
This sounds like one of the tricks that the smart - ass Developers did
here in Australia years ago - They would get these rich Morons from
places like Sydney and Melbourne and offer tham free day trips to
Queensland - (1000 miles North) and try and sell real estate at about
4 times it's real value.
They orchestrated these trips perfectly - so as to hide the fact that
most of our city didn't have sewerage and to hide that fact that (at
the time) most of it was run down and crappy and that there were few
real job opportunities. Also by keeping them in a tour group, and
away from the locals, would also prevent them from finding out the
truth about the place. Flying ppl straight into town also avoided them
seeing the crappy road system , too. All the time that they were here
(about 5 hours) they would turn on the high pressure sales and go for
their lives. (the fact that they had accepted a free trip worth
several hundred dollars would also have made them feel obligated too)
How do I know all this ..........
I used to work with a Real Estate agent !!!!!!
A lot of people were sucked in by all of this and paid the price, by
losing their life savings etc. One of the worst examples of this was
(in 1978) a place near Brisbane called 'Russell Island" where the day
trips were timed by the tide times - Guess why ?
Yep - the "prime beachfront land" that they were selling - went
underwater at high tide !!!!!
>
>Mike has called the person in charge of this whole trip to tell him this
>was unacceptable, but he wasn't in and has not yet returned Mike's call.
>I really don't want to travel all the way across the country to be
>miserable (I can stay at home to do that if I want). I don't want to go
>touring with people I don't know; I'm really quite shy and won't talk to
>people unless I feel comfortable with them. Mike knows this, as he should
>after 15 years of marriage, and would like to try to work out something
>else, but he doesn't think this will be possible. I would much rather
>stay in the hotel room and read than be put in the situation I described.
>Actually, I was hoping we would have a car so we could check out the area
>we are most interested in exploring. Besides, I need to know if there is
>a good yarn shop in the area to feed my knitting obsession, but that's
>beside the point. One of our main concerns is finding a synagogue where
>we could be comfortable (Mike's Jewish, I'm not), and Mike has located one
>in Barrington. We would like to attend Friday night services, but without
>a car we're stuck, and this has become kind of important in our lives this
>past year. Also, since I currently run a medical transcription service
>from home I would like to scope out the area to locate hospitals and
>medical office buildings to target for work.
Hmmmm
>
>If the whole point of this trip is to show us the area so we can decide if
>we want to move there, wouldn't it make sense to let us go off on our
>own? Yeah, it's nice to see the facility and the surrounding areas, but
>there are other things to contemplate other than how nice the facility is
>and how nice the area surrounding it is. I don't know if it's worth the
>trip just for this limited view they are going to allow us to have.
I personally would still go - you never know what you will find there
:)
>
>Right now, I'm not willing to move out there for Raytheon, even if this
>turns out to be the best place in the universe. Raytheon has done more to
>piss me off in the last couple of months; don't even get me started on the
>feeble medical plan they are trying to push on us. Oh, one other thing,
>Raytheon is planning on moving the program Mike is on in February. Now,
>last time I checked, even the kids out here on year-round schedules finish
>up their current school year in June (my son's school is out in June, but
>my daughter's school goes an extra month). I'll be damned if I'm going to
>even remotely consider moving midyear like that. I'm not really sure we
>should even take the trip, but Raytheon's paying for it.
Who says that they aren't going to pull the rug out from under you
again once you move there ?
Kim Greenfield
> Kim, I didn't word that to be mean, but because I have been there and
> recognize your current state of emotions. We did it for Kawaski and Litton, I
> did it this time last year for Advanced Bionics. Never again, but that's a
> whole nother story. We got to live some cool places and meet some wonderful
> people.
>
> The short trip is usually a prelude - they show you the sights and try to talk
> you into the move. After you agree, there should be a longer, more autonomous
> and individual trip for house hunting and discovery of the neighborhood. There
> SHOULD be I said. You may want to ask about that. We took our kids on that
> one, it was usually busy, but fun.
Yeah, but I would like some time without anyone guiding us so we can see
things that are important to us, but the way they've got things scheduled
that will be almost impossible. They are allowing a week-long
househunting trip if we decide to do this. I'm really hoping Boeing comes
through so we don't have to uproot the kids in the middle of a school
year, although Mike said he could stay out here until Caitlin's year is
done in July. A week is still not enough for me to really get to know an
area. Heck, I've been in Anaheim for 12 years and still don't know half
of it.
> Good luck to you, no matter what you decide to do, you can make it work. While
> you are in the hotel room, get the phone book out, make your list of doctors,
> hospitals etc. Take the book to the nearest copy center. Better yet, call the
> phone company and ask for a book. You may also ask the hotel. Also, be sure to
> get a newspaper to give you more information about the area.
We're going to go, let Raytheon pick up the bills and make the best of
this trip. I finally saw an itinerary yesterday, and they have Friday
morning scheduled as a tour of the Raytheon facility for the employees
while us "partners", as they are calling us, go to some presentation on
employment opportunities. As I told Mike, unless they are going to locate
clients for me I really don't think they can help me on this. I also
don't like being thrown into a room of people I've never seen before and
am quite apprehensive about the whole thing. We are going to try to blow
off the sightseeing trip to Newport they have planned for Saturday
afternoon since we aren't tourists and didn't expect to be treated as
such. Besides, if we do decide to move there we'll see Newport soon
enough. Seeing that isn't going to convince me to move there since we
wouldn't be considering that area anyway.
I'm also going to let this be my "TTFN" post to you all. I'll be back on
Sunday afternoon and will try to check in then. Take care.
The Other Kim (m...@deltanet.com)
Poor Ol' Bill
wrote:
>
>Good Luck Kim!
>
>I can only tell I feel your pain. I have been irate at the accursed Navy for
>our entire marriage. Six years of lost paperwork and incompetent people
>screwing us out of reimbursements.
>
On the other hand, its a whole ot easier to quit Ratheon than it is to
quit the Navy. I did the Navy for fourteen years. I finally got so
fed up that I left. When I left, i had a wife, 3 kids and limited
prospects. Guess what! We survived (pretty nicely actually).
As for the Ratheon situation, you do have choices. Granted, they're
tough choices.
Kim, if you're pretty well settled and like living where you are, is
new employment an option? I know its hard. I've had to start over
twice (once at age 49) and it wasn't *easy* either time. But I can't
say it wasn't worth it. I believe that, if conditions where I'm
currently employed became unbearable, I could and would do it again.
I've come to realize that companies, especially the large ones, have
no conscience. They're in it for the money. The sooner working folks
understand that, the better off they'll be. *Loyal employee* should
be as much of an oxymoron as *corporate loyalty*. Employees who want
to retain their sanity had better be in it for the money too, for
their own good.
Understand, I don't think that this is necessarily *wrong*. I just
believe its the nature of the beast and that people need to be aware
of that.
Best of luck in whatever you choose to do. I don't envy you your
choices, but I think you'll be OK.
Bill
~~The best laid plans eventually degenerate into work!~~
Kim Greenfield
> As for the Ratheon situation, you do have choices. Granted, they're
> tough choices.
Well, Mike has had an interview with Boeing (formerly Rockwell, the same
location where he worked before coming over to Hughes, now Raytheon - God,
I hate defense contractor mergers) and has another interview set up with
L3 (I think that's who it is, formerly part of Bendix) which is located in
Sylmar, site of the earthquake in 1971 and in the extreme north San
Fernando Valley. If he accepts an offer from Boeing, which we believe
will be forthcoming soon, we won't have to move for this since it's in the
same city and is only about 7 miles from home. L3 would involve a move but
nowhere near as drastic (just to Santa Clarita, just north of the Valley),
and we would still have family and friends close by.
> Kim, if you're pretty well settled and like living where you are, is
> new employment an option? I know its hard. I've had to start over
> twice (once at age 49) and it wasn't *easy* either time. But I can't
> say it wasn't worth it. I believe that, if conditions where I'm
> currently employed became unbearable, I could and would do it again.
You know, we really don't like living in Southern California, but we are
pretty much established here. We both migrated here from elsewhere (me
from Wisconsin, Mike from New York) and have been here a long time (32
years for me, 23 for Mike). We both attended UCLA and are still involved
in the Alumni Band and attend football games when we can (GO BRUINS!!).
The kids are both in Scouts. We recently joined a synagogue where we feel
quite comfortable. My transcription business is finally starting to pay
off other than being able to pay for Caitlin's school. And, here's the
biggie, both my parents and my husband's parents are in So Cal, and the
kids wouldn't be able to see their grandparents on a regular basis. There
are better places in the world to raise kids, but we would be giving up a
lot to make a move of this magnitude.
What's kind of amusing (to me, at least) is that Mike is willing to make
the move for Raytheon, specifically for the program he has been working on
for the past 6-1/2 years, even though he has been complaining about his
work for most of this year. I need to be absolutely certain that he won't
want to make another move a couple years down the line. For that matter,
we better be damn sure that Raytheon doesn't decide to make another move a
couple of years down the line.
> I've come to realize that companies, especially the large ones, have
> no conscience. They're in it for the money. The sooner working folks
> understand that, the better off they'll be. *Loyal employee* should
> be as much of an oxymoron as *corporate loyalty*. Employees who want
> to retain their sanity had better be in it for the money too, for
> their own good.
Don't I know it now. The program Mike is working on will be transferred
to Portsmouth by March at the latest, and they fully expect people to move
in the middle of a school year. Yeah, right. It's bad enough that
Caitlin is in her third school in as many years. Mike has mentioned this
to his boss, and he's pretty sure something can be worked out where he
spends most of his time out here and goes to Portsmouth for a week at a
time until the end of the school year. As far as money, Raytheon better
be willing to cough up some big-time bucks. Mike would probably get a
promotion and a nice 15% (at least) pay increase if he goes back to
Boeing, plus he may be able to negotiate a sort-of "signing bonus" to
cover money he would get from Raytheon if he stayed there, things like his
results sharing bonus at the end of the year. As it is, in addition to
the pretty fair relocation package, Raytheon is willing to pay at least 12
weeks salary, up to 26 weeks depending on length of service and how badly
they want the person to move. That would be more than enough for a nice
down payment on a house. Mike would also try to get a promotion and raise
out of them as well. Heck, he's no fool.
> Understand, I don't think that this is necessarily *wrong*. I just
> believe its the nature of the beast and that people need to be aware
> of that.
Know that, too. This trip didn't change my impression of Raytheon - I
still think they suck - but it gave us things to think about. We have
gone from definitely saying "yes" to an offer from Boeing to "let's wait
until we have all our options in front of us".
> Best of luck in whatever you choose to do. I don't envy you your
> choices, but I think you'll be OK.
Thanks, Bill. It won't be easy, no matter what we choose to do. The kids
would bounce back just fine; I'm worried about me. I don't adjust well to
change, especially of the drastic nature. We did decide that if we move
to RI we would immediately, if not sooner, get the kids into Scout troops
and get involved ourselves, maybe not to the level we are right now (Mike
is an Assistant Scoutmaster with Ryan's troop, and I'm both Den Leader
Coach for Ryan's old Cub pack and co-leader of Caitlin's Brownie troop)
but to some extent. This way we would be able to meet some folks in the
area and start to make ourselves at home. The synagogue is a bit
different, since the one we visited didn't work for us, but there are 2
others we are researching. If that is the make-or-break point, Mike may
be able to get Raytheon to send him out so he can go to services on Friday
night; the HR department head said so herself. I'll let everyone know
what we decide to do. Either way, one of the first things we would have
to do is get back online 8-)
Stay tuned.
The Other Kim (m...@deltanet.com)