What a morning so far ...

[JtN©]

What a morning so far now onto who knows what. I signed in to peruse
the ramblings on ASP and read all then new posts from this week and
now I need to try and figure out what to do with the other 38 seconds
of this minute ... oh boy I ate up that minute typing this.

I guess I'll fill up a pipe and enjoy it and contemplate that lighting
the pipe will take more time then to read the latest happenings on
ASP. Ya know I would comment on that ASP Facebook place but why ...
it's turned into a commercial posting site of all the pipe buddies the
administrator tried to stroke over in getting freebie type deals from
them telling them about the great ASP Facebook and all the business
they can get from it but instead its the same as ASP Usenet with only
about a 1/2 dozen or so people posting something with nothing of
interest at all. It says allot when not even his handpicked moderators/
co-administrators are even around anymore. They saw the light and
bailed on him as well.

JtN ©2013

[random]

On 05/14/2013 06:30 AM, JtN� wrote:
> [facebook]... it's turned into a commercial posting site of all the pipe buddies the

> administrator tried to stroke over in getting freebie type deals from
> them

I avoid FarceBork, but some might find it comfortable.

As far as usenet ASP goes, I like seeing ADs posted. Sadly, I've not
seen much mention of any new carvers since returning here.

As far as cronyism goes... the pipe industry does seem to have a
tendency toward it, toward doing everything as it's always been done,
not rocking the boat, keeping the tricks within the family so to speak.

Economics is an ugly master.

[Jeffrey Horn]

On Wednesday, May 15, 2013 6:11:41 AM UTC-4, random wrote:
> As far as cronyism goes... the pipe industry does seem to have a
> tendency toward it, toward doing everything as it's always been done,
> not rocking the boat, keeping the tricks within the family so to speak.
>
> Economics is an ugly master.

You sound like an Austrian, random.

[JtN©]

Random ... new carvers are going to hang at places where they can get
business from. ASP has for a long long very long time been a place
where everyone will give a fantastic computer screen review and tell
everyone how awesome the pipe looks and how great it should smoke and
how great the person is at making pipes but when it comes to actually
buying the pipe ... well do I need to explain it anymore ... well yeah
I do or else you wont understand why. Pipemakers don't hang out and be
part of ASP because nobody on ASP will spend the money to buy what
they are making. They go where the benefit of return on there time
invested is better.

JtN ©2013

[random]

Oh, how does an Austrian sound?

[random]

On 05/17/2013 12:32 PM, JtN� wrote:
> On May 15, 6:11 am, random <ran...@nomail.invalid> wrote:
>> On 05/14/2013 06:30 AM, JtN wrote:
>>
>>> [facebook]... it's turned into a commercial posting site of all the pipe buddies the
>>> administrator tried to stroke over in getting freebie type deals from
>>> them
>>
>> I avoid FarceBork, but some might find it comfortable.
>>
>> As far as usenet ASP goes, I like seeing ADs posted. Sadly, I've not
>> seen much mention of any new carvers since returning here.
>>
>> As far as cronyism goes... the pipe industry does seem to have a
>> tendency toward it, toward doing everything as it's always been done,
>> not rocking the boat, keeping the tricks within the family so to speak.
>>
>> Economics is an ugly master.
>
> Random ... new carvers are going to hang at places where they can get
> business from.

I suppose the opposite would be self-defeating, right? New carvers have
to spend /some/ time at places where they can get business from, or
they're not going to get any business at all, eh? Nobody's going to go
looking for work from somebody they never heard of, unless they have a
crystal ball and can guess the name of whoever it is they should go
looking for.

The question seems more to be whether they spend their time hanging out
like other folks, or whether they're "purely commercial". And there are
times and situations where the ugly master Economics will push you to be
more "purely commercial" than you would otherwise be. I'd say there's
no easy test, and that time will eventually clear things up.

> ASP has for a long long very long time been a place
> where everyone will give a fantastic computer screen review and tell
> everyone how awesome the pipe looks and how great it should smoke and
> how great the person is at making pipes

How awesome a pipe looks is usually pretty obvious from a picture.

How great a pipe *should* smoke doesn't mean a thing when it comes down
to how it *does* smoke.

How great the person is at making pipes is pretty much irrelevant, isn't
it, if you get a great pipe from somebody who sucks at making them but
managed to get it all right one time on the pipe you bought, or somebody
who's good at making them but managed to screw the pooch on your pipe?

What I (personally) find kind of offensive is when people make a lot of
oooh'ing and ahh'ing over some carver's pipe because (a) they want to
get a good deal from the guy, or (b) they're pals with the guy, and what
they say about the pipe isn't really based on anything else except
self-interest or cronyism.

> but when it comes to actually
> buying the pipe ... well do I need to explain it anymore ... well yeah
> I do or else you wont understand why. Pipemakers don't hang out and be
> part of ASP because nobody on ASP will spend the money to buy what
> they are making.

Maybe the Cheap Pipe Club philosophy has taken over, or maybe economic
times are hard, but that wasn't always the case. Nor need it be the
case in the future.

> They go where the benefit of return on there time
> invested is better.

Everybody does that. You're recognizing some benefit from the time you
spend posting here, or you'd be elsewhere. I'm getting some benefit
from ASP because talking with other pipe smokers is interesting, and it
keeps me from feeling like I'm the only guy around who smokes a pipe.

[Jeffrey Horn]

On Saturday, May 18, 2013 5:06:51 AM UTC-4, random wrote:
> Oh, how does an Austrian sound?

Like Mises. Or Hayek.

[random]

WHUT?

[Jim Beard]

If you consider political economy one of your areas of erudition,
and you are not familiar with the works of these two authors, you
are ignorant, stupid, or a fool, or more likely two or more of
the three.

Both are Austrians.

Cheers!

jim b.

--
UNIX is not user unfriendly; it merely
expects users to be computer-friendly.

[Jeffrey Horn]

On Tuesday, May 21, 2013 9:55:31 AM UTC-4, Jim Beard wrote:
> If you consider political economy one of your areas of erudition,
> and you are not familiar with the works of these two authors, you
> are ignorant, stupid, or a fool, or more likely two or more of
> the three.

Ouch, Jim!

Half expected JtN to Google that for random.

[random]

On 05/21/2013 07:55 AM, Jim Beard wrote:
> On 05/21/2013 03:29 AM, random wrote:
>> On 05/20/2013 08:20 PM, Jeffrey Horn wrote:
>>> On Saturday, May 18, 2013 5:06:51 AM UTC-4, random wrote:
>>>> Oh, how does an Austrian sound?
>>>
>>> Like Mises. Or Hayek.
>>>
>> WHUT?
>
> If you consider political economy one of your areas of erudition,

What makes you think that I "consider political economy" at all?

I have some views on politics, which imo amounts to the shenanigans
people go through to have things their way regardless of the cost to
others [1]. I have some opinions about economics, which imo amounts to
a shell game intended to make sure the money goes up your own sleeve. I
have some limited understanding of microeconomics which is a combination
of goal-achievement and resource-minimization.

But "political economy"? It's a contradiction of terms and imo has
little meaning, and none that is actually useful. Here's what wikipedia
has to say about "political economy":


"Political economy was the original term used for studying production,
buying, and selling, and their relations with law, custom, and
government, as well as with the distribution of national income and
wealth. Political economy originated in moral philosophy. It was
developed in the 18th century as the study of the economies of states,
or polities, hence the term political economy."


I don't have much use for the concepts of custom, artificial law,
government, nations, or externally imposed morality; I have a great deal
of use for natural law, which I would define as the principle of
cause-and-effect manifest according to the properties of the material
universe. Although the latter is often indistinguishable from the
former, they are quite different ways of viewing reality.

> and you are not familiar with the works of these two authors,

It is my observation that those who consider themselves "erudite"
because they have read a lot of books by politically [1] successful
people who believed themselves to be erudite, those folks generally have
spent so much of their time being indoctrinated by the concepts of their
erudite predecessors that they've never learned to think for themselves.
Of course there are usually exceptions to everything, mostly.

> you are ignorant, stupid, or a fool, or more likely two or
> more of the three.

You seem to have a propensity toward unprovoked egregious insults nearly
sufficient to lead one to the conclusion that you are an irredeemable
asshole. That phenomenon can result from the writer's frustration at
being unable to express himself, which in turn can result from moldy
dust-covered cognitive facilities, which in turn can be a result of
undergoing the process of becoming erudite. I'm not a big fan of
erudition, though a bit of expertise here and there can often prove useful.

> Both are Austrians.

Arnold Schwarzenegger was born an Austrian.
Adolph Hitler was born an Austrian.
So what?

> Cheers!
>
> jim b.
>

Have fun storming the castle!

[Jim Beard]

Your question was "WHUT?"

I provided an answer.

If you are only interested in answers you like, I can only
suggest you do not present them to me, or where I might consider
them addressed possibly to me as part of the group.

No cheers.

[JtN©]

Welcome to "Randoms World" ... you have figured out just how he is.

JtN ©2013

[random]

Awwww, "no cheers", that means you didn't like my answer; you asked for
it, you got it, if you don't like it, tough noogies, deal with it.

Have a nice day salving your ego.

[random]

It is true that I sometimes respond to rudeness with the shocking truth.

[JtN©]

That is just a nice way of saying that sometimes your just an asshole.

JtN 2013

[Jim Beard]

True, I did not like your answer. But that is no big thing. My
ego is robust, my skin thick, and my head hard.

Besides, if all your answers were exactly what I like, you would
be exactly like me, and I can see no point in mankind having two
of me. One should be enough.

Separately, thanks to quotation in a reply (yes, I have JtN
killfiled), I found:

Welcome to "Randoms World" ... you have figured out just how he

is. -- JtN ©2013

I do not claim to have much figured out, particularly based on
the limited sample appearing on this newsgroup, but you strike me
as a superb engine firing on maybe 3 of 6 cylinders. Some of
your contributions are spot on, sterling, pick your accolade.
Others, otherwise.

You deal with your problems. I deal with mine. The killfile is
always available, if either decides the other is not worth paying
attention to.

Cheers!

[random]

I don't remember making any claims to the contrary.

[random]

Some consider that a good thing, others think less highly of the ego.

> my skin thick, and my head hard.

Basic pre-requisites for participating in usenet or any other
unmoderated discussion group. <g>

> Besides, if all your answers were exactly what I like, you would be
> exactly like me, and I can see no point in mankind having two of me.
> One should be enough.

I don't know about you, but I find me somewhat boring because I've grown
quite used to me, and almost anything different is at least somewhat
interesting.

> Separately, thanks to quotation in a reply (yes, I have JtN killfiled),
> I found:
>
> Welcome to "Randoms World" ... you have figured out just how he is. --
> JtN �2013
>
> I do not claim to have much figured out, particularly based on the
> limited sample appearing on this newsgroup,

That you have JtN killfiled seems likely to be indicative of
something... what, that's another question.

> but you strike me as a
> superb engine firing on maybe 3 of 6 cylinders. Some of your
> contributions are spot on, sterling, pick your accolade. Others, otherwise.

Oddly enough my car has 3 cylinders. I've never been good at
"submission to authority" and there are a couple other cylinders that
were likewise discarded as contra-productive. Years ago, decades now I
suppose, I found out that 3-cylinder engines can run quite smoothly...
in fact any number of cylinders can run quite smoothly, the necessity
for an even division into 360 is an artificial one mostly based on
convention. It's extra cylinders firing in opposition to the rest that
seem to hinder smoothness.

> You deal with your problems. I deal with mine. The killfile is always
> available, if either decides the other is not worth paying attention to.
>
> Cheers!
>
> jim b.
>

Granted the killfile is cheap and easy, but those attributes don't
always equate to useful-in-all-respects. These days I'm using
Thunderbird, which has an "ignore subthread" function that I find handy,
in fact one can set it so that when a post from someone incredibly
boring or trollish is encountered, it will mark that post as having been
read and in addition ignore the subthread it spawns.

[Jim Beard]

On 05/23/2013 05:05 AM, random wrote:
> That you have JtN killfiled seems likely to be indicative of
> something... what, that's another question.

It is indicative that JtN became highly insulting of someone who
IMNSHO clearly did not deserve it, and into the killfile he went.

If such interests you (does not interest me enough to do what I
next suggest), search Google Advanced Groups for JtN, jim b., and
killfile. Then look plus or minus the most recent date other
than the past few days for anything posted by JtN and you will
likely find and recognize the problem.

As I can no longer remember exactly who it was that was insulted,
or what the insult was, it may be time to delete him from the file.

>> but you strike me as a
>> superb engine firing on maybe 3 of 6 cylinders. Some of your
>> contributions are spot on, sterling, pick your accolade.
>> Others, otherwise.
>
> Oddly enough my car has 3 cylinders. I've never been good at
> "submission to authority" and there are a couple other cylinders
> that were likewise discarded as contra-productive. Years ago,
> decades now I suppose, I found out that 3-cylinder engines can
> run quite smoothly... in fact any number of cylinders can run
> quite smoothly, the necessity for an even division into 360 is an
> artificial one mostly based on convention. It's extra cylinders
> firing in opposition to the rest that seem to hinder smoothness.

Your disinclination to "submit to authority" just because it is
authority is one of your better qualities. More of that is
needed in the population at large.

Most cars have 3 cylinders, and usually more. An odd number of
cylinders can run smoothly, but engineering, set-up, and tune all
have to be right for that to happen. Even a little out of timing
or balance (uneven fuel-air mixtures, etc) can generate
roughness. Much easier when there is less opportunity for working
at cross-purposes internally.

> Granted the killfile is cheap and easy, but those attributes
> don't always equate to useful-in-all-respects. These days I'm
> using Thunderbird, which has an "ignore subthread" function that
> I find handy, in fact one can set it so that when a post from
> someone incredibly boring or trollish is encountered, it will
> mark that post as having been read and in addition ignore the
> subthread it spawns.

Hmmm. I'll have to check for that feature. Sounds useful.