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sputtering butane lighters
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J Burns
Dec 16, 2011, 2:26:09 AM12/16/11
to
If my butane pipe lighter sputters, warming it in my shirt pocket will
cure it. I believe the culprits are pentanes, whose boiling points are
from 9 to 36C at standard pressure.
According to the Gas Processors Association, what's sold as butane can
include up to 5% isobutane, propane, and pentane. Suppose the can
contains 1% pentane. If it's cool, perhaps some will condense.
Droplets could enter your lighter when you invert the can to fill. If
you end up with 2% pentane in your lighter, that might increase the
tendency to sputter.
I get a better fill if the lighter is cooler than the can. I put my
lighter in the refrigerator a few minutes before filling and try not to
warm it with my hands. Warming the can to about body temperature should
help the fill and reduce the possibility of getting a disproportionate
amount of pentane in the lighter.
cure it. I believe the culprits are pentanes, whose boiling points are
from 9 to 36C at standard pressure.
According to the Gas Processors Association, what's sold as butane can
include up to 5% isobutane, propane, and pentane. Suppose the can
contains 1% pentane. If it's cool, perhaps some will condense.
Droplets could enter your lighter when you invert the can to fill. If
you end up with 2% pentane in your lighter, that might increase the
tendency to sputter.
I get a better fill if the lighter is cooler than the can. I put my
lighter in the refrigerator a few minutes before filling and try not to
warm it with my hands. Warming the can to about body temperature should
help the fill and reduce the possibility of getting a disproportionate
amount of pentane in the lighter.
Allen Lloyd
Dec 16, 2011, 4:44:39 AM12/16/11
to
On Fri, 16 Dec 2011 02:26:09 -0500, J Burns <bur...@nowhere.com>
wrote:
When my Old Boy doesn't behave for any reason, I wipe down the nozzle,
cap, and flint wheel with Everclear. Removes all the soot and other
debris and the lighters attitude is adjusted.
AL ...
wrote:
cap, and flint wheel with Everclear. Removes all the soot and other
debris and the lighters attitude is adjusted.
AL ...
Tim D
Dec 16, 2011, 6:32:16 AM12/16/11
to
On Dec 16, 1:44 am, Allen Lloyd <al...@ohiovalleycollect.com> wrote:
>
> When my Old Boy doesn't behave for any reason, I wipe down the nozzle,
> cap, and flint wheel with Everclear. Removes all the soot and other
> debris and the lighters attitude is adjusted.
>
> AL ...
Thanks for the advice, AL. I'll try that. May your pipes be ever
>
> When my Old Boy doesn't behave for any reason, I wipe down the nozzle,
> cap, and flint wheel with Everclear. Removes all the soot and other
> debris and the lighters attitude is adjusted.
>
> AL ...
sweet. Tim in Pacifica.
JtN©
Dec 16, 2011, 8:27:16 AM12/16/11
to
purged lighter taken from a freezer after being in there for 5 or 10
minutes will always take a tremendously better fill.
Also all this pentene, propane and isoputang you mention ... just what
in the hell type of fuel are you using? I would suggest you use at
least a triple or quad or quint refined fuel and most of those
impurities will be gone. Most times when a lighter sputters and spits
like a cheap Thursday night date its because of either pocket lint in
the flame/jet area or because its a little out of adjustment. Each
time ya fill a lighter you usually need to readjust it and with some
you need to keep adjusting as it empties to keep a good consistent
flame or at least that is what I have found to be the culprits of
sputtery and spittery lighters.
JtN ©2011
Mickey
Dec 16, 2011, 10:59:19 AM12/16/11
to
my freezer for 1/2 hour or so before filling it makes a huge
difference in the fill. I seem to get a lot more butane in the lighter
that way.
J Burns
Dec 16, 2011, 5:09:36 PM12/16/11
to
On 12/16/11 8:27 AM, JtNŠ wrote:
> Also all this pentene, propane and isoputang you mention ... just what
> in the hell type of fuel are you using? I would suggest you use at
> least a triple or quad or quint refined fuel and most of those
> impurities will be gone. Most times when a lighter sputters and spits
> like a cheap Thursday night date its because of either pocket lint in
> the flame/jet area or because its a little out of adjustment. Each
> time ya fill a lighter you usually need to readjust it and with some
> you need to keep adjusting as it empties to keep a good consistent
> flame or at least that is what I have found to be the culprits of
> sputtery and spittery lighters.
>
> JtN Š2011
> Also all this pentene, propane and isoputang you mention ... just what
> in the hell type of fuel are you using? I would suggest you use at
> least a triple or quad or quint refined fuel and most of those
> impurities will be gone. Most times when a lighter sputters and spits
> like a cheap Thursday night date its because of either pocket lint in
> the flame/jet area or because its a little out of adjustment. Each
> time ya fill a lighter you usually need to readjust it and with some
> you need to keep adjusting as it empties to keep a good consistent
> flame or at least that is what I have found to be the culprits of
> sputtery and spittery lighters.
>
You're onto something! It's Ronson Ultra Butane Fuel. (After seeing
Charles Ronson in "Noon Till Three," I knew it had to be good.)
Well, the MSDS says it's 100% isobutane. That's normally a refrigerant!
Tom S.
Dec 17, 2011, 10:37:58 PM12/17/11
to
"Mickey" <Mic...@NOSPAMFatHounds.com> wrote in message
news:hjqme7hhijbneh497...@4ax.com...
Mickey
Dec 17, 2011, 11:48:33 PM12/17/11
to
David Griffith
Dec 18, 2011, 4:34:02 AM12/18/11
to
Mickey <Mic...@nospamfathounds.com> wrote:
in London keeping a gas table lamp minus the shade on at all times for
customers to light their pipes and cigars.
--
David Griffith
davidmy...@acm.org <--- Put my last name where it belongs
> "Tom S." <tms...@cox.com> wrote:
>>> I found recently (on advice I read here) that chilling my lighter in
>>> my freezer for 1/2 hour or so before filling it makes a huge
>>> difference in the fill. I seem to get a lot more butane in the lighter
>>> that way.
>>
>>Attaching it to one of thoe BBQ grill propane tanks works well, too.
> Maybe I should just run a gas line into my office?
I seem to remember an antecdote about many a Victorian era tobacconist
>>> I found recently (on advice I read here) that chilling my lighter in
>>> my freezer for 1/2 hour or so before filling it makes a huge
>>> difference in the fill. I seem to get a lot more butane in the lighter
>>> that way.
>>
>>Attaching it to one of thoe BBQ grill propane tanks works well, too.
> Maybe I should just run a gas line into my office?
in London keeping a gas table lamp minus the shade on at all times for
customers to light their pipes and cigars.
--
David Griffith
davidmy...@acm.org <--- Put my last name where it belongs
Tom S.
Dec 19, 2011, 12:22:17 AM12/19/11
to
"Mickey" <Mic...@NOSPAMFatHounds.com> wrote in message
>>
>
> Maybe I should just run a gas line into my office?
Yes, that way you could BBQ AND smoke while you work.
>
> Maybe I should just run a gas line into my office?
Tom S.
Dec 19, 2011, 12:23:57 AM12/19/11
to
"David Griffith" <davidmy...@acm.org> wrote in message
news:jckc29$rsn$1...@frotz.eternal-september.org...
> Mickey <Mic...@nospamfathounds.com> wrote:
>> "Tom S." <tms...@cox.com> wrote:
>
>>>> I found recently (on advice I read here) that chilling my lighter in
>>>> my freezer for 1/2 hour or so before filling it makes a huge
>>>> difference in the fill. I seem to get a lot more butane in the lighter
>>>> that way.
>>>
>>>Attaching it to one of thoe BBQ grill propane tanks works well, too.
>
>> Maybe I should just run a gas line into my office?
>
> I seem to remember an antecdote about many a Victorian era tobacconist
> in London keeping a gas table lamp minus the shade on at all times for
> customers to light their pipes and cigars.
>
Or be a mad scientist and keep a Bunsen burner going (Note: Young
>> "Tom S." <tms...@cox.com> wrote:
>
>>>> I found recently (on advice I read here) that chilling my lighter in
>>>> my freezer for 1/2 hour or so before filling it makes a huge
>>>> difference in the fill. I seem to get a lot more butane in the lighter
>>>> that way.
>>>
>>>Attaching it to one of thoe BBQ grill propane tanks works well, too.
>
>> Maybe I should just run a gas line into my office?
>
> I seem to remember an antecdote about many a Victorian era tobacconist
> in London keeping a gas table lamp minus the shade on at all times for
> customers to light their pipes and cigars.
>
Fran-ken-stein)
Dick Floyd
Dec 19, 2011, 2:53:04 AM12/19/11
to
In article <jckc29$rsn$1...@frotz.eternal-september.org>,
Drucquer's in Berkeley in the 60s & 70s had a simple narrow pipe
sticking up at the counter with a perpetual gas flame (Greg Pease could
tell us more about that). I have a vaguer memory of seeing that kind of
setup in other tobacconists around the country.
-dick
ps: I have had a couple of IMCO pipe lighters for about 10 years that
can't go more than a day without sputtering, spitting out jets of flame,
etc no matter how much I clean them in "approved ways" & other desperate
attempts at a solution. They started this behavior very soon after I
bought them. They ain't my everyday lighter...
davidmy...@acm.org (David Griffith) wrote:
> Mickey <Mic...@nospamfathounds.com> wrote:
> > "Tom S." <tms...@cox.com> wrote:
>
> >>> I found recently (on advice I read here) that chilling my lighter in
> >>> my freezer for 1/2 hour or so before filling it makes a huge
> >>> difference in the fill. I seem to get a lot more butane in the lighter
> >>> that way.
> >>
> >>Attaching it to one of thoe BBQ grill propane tanks works well, too.
>
> > Maybe I should just run a gas line into my office?
>
> I seem to remember an antecdote about many a Victorian era tobacconist
> in London keeping a gas table lamp minus the shade on at all times for
> customers to light their pipes and cigars.
That may have been common in the US in earlier days: I'm pretty certain
> Mickey <Mic...@nospamfathounds.com> wrote:
> > "Tom S." <tms...@cox.com> wrote:
>
> >>> I found recently (on advice I read here) that chilling my lighter in
> >>> my freezer for 1/2 hour or so before filling it makes a huge
> >>> difference in the fill. I seem to get a lot more butane in the lighter
> >>> that way.
> >>
> >>Attaching it to one of thoe BBQ grill propane tanks works well, too.
>
> > Maybe I should just run a gas line into my office?
>
> I seem to remember an antecdote about many a Victorian era tobacconist
> in London keeping a gas table lamp minus the shade on at all times for
> customers to light their pipes and cigars.
Drucquer's in Berkeley in the 60s & 70s had a simple narrow pipe
sticking up at the counter with a perpetual gas flame (Greg Pease could
tell us more about that). I have a vaguer memory of seeing that kind of
setup in other tobacconists around the country.
-dick
ps: I have had a couple of IMCO pipe lighters for about 10 years that
can't go more than a day without sputtering, spitting out jets of flame,
etc no matter how much I clean them in "approved ways" & other desperate
attempts at a solution. They started this behavior very soon after I
bought them. They ain't my everyday lighter...
Grousemoor
Dec 19, 2011, 2:40:25 PM12/19/11
to
My Old Boy never sputters. My IMCO's always sputter.
I fill both with the same fuel (after purging). I clean the nozzles
of both with a small brush dipped in lighter fluid (and sometimes with
a pin into the nozzle).
Not sure why.... one of the sweet mysteries of life?
I fill both with the same fuel (after purging). I clean the nozzles
of both with a small brush dipped in lighter fluid (and sometimes with
a pin into the nozzle).
Not sure why.... one of the sweet mysteries of life?
J Burns
Dec 19, 2011, 2:42:17 PM12/19/11
to
On 12/19/11 2:53 AM, Dick Floyd wrote:
>
> ps: I have had a couple of IMCO pipe lighters for about 10 years that
> can't go more than a day without sputtering, spitting out jets of flame,
> etc no matter how much I clean them in "approved ways"& other desperate
> attempts at a solution. They started this behavior very soon after I
> bought them. They ain't my everyday lighter...
Me too! I see David Griffith had one that he filled new with Vector
>
> ps: I have had a couple of IMCO pipe lighters for about 10 years that
> can't go more than a day without sputtering, spitting out jets of flame,
> etc no matter how much I clean them in "approved ways"& other desperate
> attempts at a solution. They started this behavior very soon after I
> bought them. They ain't my everyday lighter...
butane, and it sputtered. T-boy said he'd kept one in his jeans for two
years without a problem.
I'm back to blaming pentane. The MSDS for my Ronson butane says it's
isobutane. That should be better than butane because it has a lower
boiling point and higher vapor pressure. I'm suspicious because it's
labeled butane except for one tiny word, and it's unlikely that it's
100% pure anything.
Officially, butane can be 5% other hydrocarbons because it's hard to
remove them completely. One kind of pentane boils at 82F. Another
boils at 97F. The third boils at 49F. By comparison, butane boils at
30F and isobutane at 11F.
When you press the valve, the temperature of the expanding gas is
probably well below 82F and could be below 49F. I think pentane can
condense between the valve and the nozzle, and this can cause
sputtering. Perhaps the design of the IMCO makes it especially vulnerable.
The warmth of my shirt pocket may help pentane droplets to evaporate.
As a liquid, pentane is 4% heavier than butane. I suppose they could
separate in a butane can. Then, when you invert the can to fill the
lighter, you could get disproportionate pentane in the lighter.
Shaking a butane can before refilling might reduce the chance of
sputtering. Warming a lighter before purging might keep pentane from
remaining as a liquid in the lighter.
Mouse
Dec 19, 2011, 9:38:28 PM12/19/11
to
shake it before filling the lighter....
--
<:3 )~
David Griffith
Dec 19, 2011, 10:33:25 PM12/19/11
to
J Burns <bur...@nowhere.com> wrote:
> On 12/19/11 2:53 AM, Dick Floyd wrote:
>> ps: I have had a couple of IMCO pipe lighters for about 10 years that
>> can't go more than a day without sputtering, spitting out jets of flame,
>> etc no matter how much I clean them in "approved ways"& other desperate
>> attempts at a solution. They started this behavior very soon after I
>> bought them. They ain't my everyday lighter...
> Me too! I see David Griffith had one that he filled new with Vector
> butane, and it sputtered. T-boy said he'd kept one in his jeans for two
> years without a problem.
I kept fiddling with that one and now it works fine, though I seem to
> On 12/19/11 2:53 AM, Dick Floyd wrote:
>> ps: I have had a couple of IMCO pipe lighters for about 10 years that
>> can't go more than a day without sputtering, spitting out jets of flame,
>> etc no matter how much I clean them in "approved ways"& other desperate
>> attempts at a solution. They started this behavior very soon after I
>> bought them. They ain't my everyday lighter...
> Me too! I see David Griffith had one that he filled new with Vector
> butane, and it sputtered. T-boy said he'd kept one in his jeans for two
> years without a problem.
find myself constantly readjusting the flame height.
J Burns
Dec 20, 2011, 11:34:06 PM12/20/11
to
isobutane. It has 1 atmosphere above room pressure at 46F, 2 at 68F, 3
at 86F, and 4 at body temperature. If the lighter is at body
temperature, the flame could be twice as big as it would be if it had
been sitting on a desk.
If some lighter butane is really butane, it's worse: 1 atmosphere at 68,
2 at 86, and 3 at body temperature. If the ligher is at body
temperature, the flame could be three times as big as it would be if it
had been sitting on a desk.
Since I began keeping my lighter in my shirt pocket, the size of the
flame has been more consistent.
I imagine another factor. If butane fuel contains more than one kind of
hydrocarbon, the one with the lower boiling point and higher vapor
pressure will tend to exit the nozzle first. As you use up the fuel,
the concentration of the stuff with the lower pressure will increase.
Pressure in the lighter will gradually decrease and the flame will
gradually get smaller.
Bob Ramstad
Dec 21, 2011, 9:41:59 PM12/21/11
to
On Dec 16, 2:09 pm, J Burns <bur...@nowhere.com> wrote:
Use Lava, or Vector. Much better fuel.
> On 12/16/11 8:27 AM, JtN© wrote:
>
> > Also all this pentene, propane and isoputang you mention ... just what
> > in the hell type of fuel are you using? I would suggest you use at
> > least a triple or quad or quint refined fuel and most of those
> > impurities will be gone. Most times when a lighter sputters and spits
> > like a cheap Thursday night date its because of either pocket lint in
> > the flame/jet area or because its a little out of adjustment. Each
> > time ya fill a lighter you usually need to readjust it and with some
> > you need to keep adjusting as it empties to keep a good consistent
> > flame or at least that is what I have found to be the culprits of
> > sputtery and spittery lighters.
>
> > JtN ©2011
>
> > Also all this pentene, propane and isoputang you mention ... just what
> > in the hell type of fuel are you using? I would suggest you use at
> > least a triple or quad or quint refined fuel and most of those
> > impurities will be gone. Most times when a lighter sputters and spits
> > like a cheap Thursday night date its because of either pocket lint in
> > the flame/jet area or because its a little out of adjustment. Each
> > time ya fill a lighter you usually need to readjust it and with some
> > you need to keep adjusting as it empties to keep a good consistent
> > flame or at least that is what I have found to be the culprits of
> > sputtery and spittery lighters.
>
>
> You're onto something! It's Ronson Ultra Butane Fuel. (After seeing
> Charles Ronson in "Noon Till Three," I knew it had to be good.)
>
> Well, the MSDS says it's 100% isobutane. That's normally a refrigerant!
Ronson absolutely sucks.
> You're onto something! It's Ronson Ultra Butane Fuel. (After seeing
> Charles Ronson in "Noon Till Three," I knew it had to be good.)
>
> Well, the MSDS says it's 100% isobutane. That's normally a refrigerant!
Use Lava, or Vector. Much better fuel.
Pacosito
Dec 22, 2011, 7:04:34 PM12/22/11
to
On Dec 21, 8:41 pm, Bob Ramstad <rrams...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ronson absolutely sucks.
>
> Use Lava, or Vector. Much better fuel.
True dat. In another life I represented the Ronson company (among
> Ronson absolutely sucks.
>
> Use Lava, or Vector. Much better fuel.
others). It is of the suck.
J Burns
Dec 22, 2011, 10:33:32 PM12/22/11
to
with Vector.
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