Winona Ryder can't act....
Chris Peek
or nasty?
grem...@aol.com (Gremmie 99) wrote:
>Does anyone else out there agree that Winona Ryder (Noni Horowitz to all
>of us who went to school with her) can't act her way out of a paper bag?
>I mean she was descent in Beeltejuice and Heathers (light comedy, dark
>comdey...whatever) but as far as those Period pieces...she sucks.
>E-mail me at Grem...@aol.com
Sybarite
>
> Does anyone else out there agree that Winona Ryder (Noni Horowitz to all
> of us who went to school with her) can't act her way out of a paper bag?
> I mean she was descent in Beeltejuice and Heathers (light comedy, dark
> comdey...whatever) but as far as those Period pieces...she sucks.
>
> E-mail me at Grem...@aol.com
I always have to get used to that 's' sound she adds to every
word...just like a spoiled high school girl. Once I do (about half-way
through the movie), then I'm okay with her acting.
I think EVERYONE was stiff in "Age of Innocence".
Robert Basil
> Sybarite <syba...@primenet.com> writes:
>
> >I think EVERYONE was stiff in "Age of Innocence".
>
> :
> :
> I thought she was great in 'Age of Innocence'. She wasn't playing a Valley
> girl. She was playing an upper class 19th century NYC matron. She was
> beautiful, yet a steel butterfly. I also like her in 'An American Quilt.'
I've seen "The Age of Innocence" ten or so times, first because I loved the
novel, then
because I'm always amazed by Michele Pfeiffer -- that woman has as much
range
as she has beauty, in my opinion. The last couple of times I focused on
Winona Ryder
--I found her to be astonishing. She has to play a woman who only appears
to be
relatively dim, though in fact her character is the only one in the
movie/book who
knows everything that's going on, and she is the film's most masterful, and
most
genial, manipulator.
That said, she has a particular style of acting -- it is kind of mannered,
like Jennifer
Jason Leigh's. It's not transparent, and it's not the kind of method
acting
the Tilly sisters do so well, but she always conveys so much about her
character,
even though you know that *she* is *not* the character. Hope that
makes sense.
Bob
Pamela Smith
>
>Does anyone else out there agree that Winona Ryder (Noni Horowitz to all
>of us who went to school with her) can't act her way out of a paper bag?
>I mean she was descent in Beeltejuice and Heathers (light comedy, dark
>comdey...whatever) but as far as those Period pieces...she sucks.
>
>E-mail me at Grem...@aol.com
I agree - her *performance* with keanu in 'Bram Stoker's Dracula' was laughable.
I'll probably set off a storm of controversy here from Keanu supporters,
but he and Winona sounded just like Charles and Di.
Their *British* accents seemed to come from the Sloan St School of Elocution
for Actors Who Should Know Better.
Snacker
writes:
>Gremmie 99 wrote:
>>
>> Does anyone else out there agree that Winona Ryder (Noni Horowitz to
all
>> of us who went to school with her) can't act her way out of a paper
bag?
>> I mean she was descent in Beeltejuice and Heathers (light comedy,
dark
>> comdey...whatever) but as far as those Period pieces...she sucks.
>>
>> E-mail me at Grem...@aol.com
>
>word...just like a spoiled high school girl. Once I do (about
half-way
>through the movie), then I'm okay with her acting.
>
UGH! I hated "Age of Innocence". Tho' I don't think Winona will ever
rise to the levels of someone like Meryl Streep, I do think she has
appeal and really liked her in "Little Women", and besides, there are
other young actresses out there who are FAR worse than her.
jrsi...@email.unc.edu
I know that Noni had back problems (hey if you weighed 100 lbs and half
of that was chest, you would have back problems too) because I believe my
cousin in Petaluma treated her for chronic back pain.
I think she was supposed to be perfectly nice. She certainly got
involved with the family of the kidnapped child from that area, doing
PSA's and raising money.
Jenny
Kanga
(Pamela Smith) wrote:
::In article <4cmmmc$1...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, grem...@aol.com
(Gremmie 99) says:
::>
::>Does anyone else out there agree that Winona Ryder (Noni Horowitz to all
::>of us who went to school with her) can't act her way out of a paper bag?
::>I mean she was descent in Beeltejuice and Heathers (light comedy, dark
::>comdey...whatever) but as far as those Period pieces...she sucks.
::>
::>E-mail me at Grem...@aol.com
::
::
::I agree - her *performance* with keanu in 'Bram Stoker's Dracula' was
laughable.
::I'll probably set off a storm of controversy here from Keanu supporters,
::but he and Winona sounded just like Charles and Di.
Proof that bad acting is contagious and hazardous to a good actress'
career! Keanu has got to be the most popular, _worst_ young actor
now...and he's dragging everyone else down with him! Poor Winona...tsk,
tsk, tsk.
Cheers,
Kanga
-------
~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~
"Real solemn history, I cannot be interested in. The quarrels
of popes and kings, with wars and pestilences in every page;
the men so good for nothing,and hardly any women at all."
-= Jane Austen =-
-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-^-~-
Favorite Celebrity To Pick On This Week: Pierce Brosnan
Why? He fights tooth and nail for 13 years to become the next James Bond, then complains of fans who ask him to say, "Bond. James Bond."
*-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-*
PopWheelie
Excrutiating to watch in Dracula and Age of Innocence.
mystere
>In article <4cmmmc$1...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, grem...@aol.com (Gremmie 99) says:
>
>I agree - her *performance* with keanu in 'Bram Stoker's Dracula' was laughable.
>I'll probably set off a storm of controversy here from Keanu supporters,
>but he and Winona sounded just like Charles and Di.
>
>for Actors Who Should Know Better.
>
actors who don't know much.
Trish Greig
Pamela Smith <pam...@wantree.com.au> wrote:
>In article <4cmmmc$1...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, grem...@aol.com (Gremmie 99) says:
>>
>I agree - her *performance* with keanu in 'Bram Stoker's Dracula' was laughable.
>I'll probably set off a storm of controversy here from Keanu supporters,
>but he and Winona sounded just like Charles and Di.
>
>Their *British* accents seemed to come from the Sloan St School of Elocution
>for Actors Who Should Know Better.
Without question, the best review of Coppola's 'Bram Stoker's Dracula' sits
on the 'Internet Movie Database'. Its author is Mr. Jason Corley, and it
begins, " It's 1460. ("I'll attack any Church for $14.60!") Constantinople
(not Istanbul). A guy that looks about as much like a 15th Century
Romanian warlord as Bella Abzug (Ryan interjects: "Well, he did look a
lot like Bella Abzug later in the movie") has a tearful farewell with
Winona Ryder (Ryder rents movie services!) and the audience is
bewildered. Are we supposed to care? Anyway, he rides out past a bunch
of silhouettes that then start running each other through with cardboard
poles and pretending to be killed in a sort of mime show. The only
thing missing is the guy pretending to be in a shrinking box. Then
after killing about 500,000 people singlehandedly, Bella Abzug kisses
this big-ass medallion it looks like he stole from L. L. Cool J., and
that's supposed to impress the audience and make it all better. So he
goes back to the model of the castle, but first they have to push a
dressmaker's dummy with Winona's wig on out of a window and watch it
fall really stiffly into a matte painting of a chasm. I'm surprised
they didn't show it break apart on the rocks. So he gets there and lo
and behold it's a miracle, she's fallen fifty miles and there isn't a
scratch on her except she smeared her lipstick, but she should have
known better than to try to put it on on the way down. He picks up a
letter that says he may already have won, screams, "I hate Ed McMahon!"
and discusses religion with these grey-haired Ewoks for a while. Then
he stabs his sword into the middle of this wood cross for no apparent
reason and ketchup starts squirting out of it, along with cherry Jell-O
mix and water with red food coloring in it. (A lot of it, Ryan says,
real mess.) So he goes up and starts swilling it down. Now the only
thing I'm thinking here is, "Cholesterol. He's gonna have such clogged
arteries," and WHAMMO! We're four centuries in the future and all of
those carefully crafted and individualized characters are dead except
for Dracula.
"Ryan turns to me (in the theatre) and says, "So we're about half
an hour through this one, right?" and I say, "No, man, that was just
the prologue," and he says, "Aaaah.""
This review, available in its entirety on the page devoted to
this movie, has been partially reprinted without permission, but it's
quoted here with love and gratitude. Mr. Corley, wherever you are,
your comments are priceless.
"Who the gods wish to destroy they first make a mini-series for." -J. Burchill
NANCY LOPEZ
>gr...@bnr.ca (Trish Greig) wrote:
>
>Tell us more about the Internet Movie Database. Where is it
>available, and is the rest of it as choice as this review?
>
>Craig
>
By Web:
http://www.msstate.edu/movies
They also have an e-mail service.
If you have a Web Browser, be prepared to spent a lot of time at their
Web Site ;-)
--
/\_____/\
/ o o \
( == ^ == )
) - ( http://www.rt66.com/~nlopez/
( )
( ( ) ( ) )
(__(__)___(__)__) *nancy*
Leslie Ayers
>From: NANCY LOPEZ <nlo...@mci.newscorp.com>
>Subject: Internet Movie Data Base (was Re: ... but Winona Ryder inspired somebody)
>Date: 11 Jan 1996 03:15:56 GMT
An absolutely amazing site. I've entered some pretty obscure names and gotten
listings for them so in my books this is a godlike resource.
Leslie
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Leslie...@mindlink.bc.ca
"It appears to me impossible that I shall cease to exist,
or that this active, restless spirit, equally alive to joy and
sorrow, should only be organized dust. Surely something
resides in this heart that is not perishable -- and life is
more than a dream." (Mary Wollstonecraft)
Gremmie 99
Dracula is an example of her over-acting. Heathers is ok and so was
Beetlejuice. She needs to learn how to do a proper accent...not this
over-dramatized bullshit that she normally does.
Keanu isn't the greatest (he did ok in Dracula considering how terrible
the screenplay was.) Noni was the one who brought the screenplay to
Coppola. I think they should have called it Mina instead of Dracula,
seeing as that was about all we got to see.
Jen
PopWheelie
movie.
This is what amazes me... That top-notch directors like Coppola and
Scorcese actually end up casting Winona and Keanu... Must be some things
about Hollywood I don't understand.
user...@law.harvard.edu
(PopWheelie) wrote:
Finally, the truth is out! The girl (as she will forever be) has exactly
one facial expression which she is forced to use over and over again.
Fortunately for her, she is usually cast in the same type role so that
versatility is not required. But surely she serves some social function,
at least as a role model for teens who want to find out how they should
next cut their hair.
Sonya
Craig Smith
> >But surely she serves some social function,
> >at least as a role model for teens who want to find out how they should
> >next cut their hair.
>
> Aside from hair cuts, she's a bad role model. In magazines she may say
> that she has never been drunk or done drugs....bullshit. My friend's
> sister has a picture of her getting stoned and I went to a kegger at her
> house.
Heavens to Betsy! Run her out of town on a rail! BEER???!!! The
horror, the horror.
> Those are just a few things she has done.
But what could possibly be worse?
Craig
who's shocked, just shocked!
Gremmie 99
>at least as a role model for teens who want to find out how they should
>next cut their hair.
Aside from hair cuts, she's a bad role model. In magazines she may say
that she has never been drunk or done drugs....bullshit. My friend's
sister has a picture of her getting stoned and I went to a kegger at her
house. Those are just a few things she has done.
Jen
Gremmie 99
She is addicted to speed and sleeping pills.
Jen
Barbara MacRae
>>But what could possibly be worse?
>
>She is addicted to speed and sleeping pills.
My goodness, someone tell that girl to switch to the socially condoned
uppers and downers - espresso and melatonin! But please, please - don't
tell us she SMOKES POT!!!
-Barb
Jeff Kirk
Of course she smokes pot! She dates Dave Pirner, an outspoken advocate for
pot legalization. I'd be amazed if she *didn't* take bong hits on a daily
basis...
--
NEW!!! Check out my beer page!!!
http://www.onr.com/user/kirker/beer.html
Home page coming soon...
Jeff Kirk
>
>>But what could possibly be worse?
>
>She is addicted to speed and sleeping pills.
And you know this...how?
Jeff
Gremmie 99
>>at least as a role model for teens who want to find out how they should
>>next cut their hair.
>
>Aside from hair cuts, she's a bad role model. In magazines she may say
>that she has never been drunk or done drugs....bullshit. My friend's
>sister has a picture of her getting stoned and I went to a kegger at her
>house. Those are just a few things she has done.
:Of course she smokes pot! She dates Dave Pirner, an outspoken advocate
for
:pot legalization. I'd be amazed if she *didn't* take bong hits on a
daily
:basis...
She did smoke pot in high school (I haven't seen her do it recently, so I
can't say for sure she still does.) She also does lots of speed.
Jennifer
Emma
> She did smoke pot in high school (I haven't seen her do it recently, so I
> can't say for sure she still does.) She also does lots of speed.
>
> Jennifer
>
>
>>>> Jennifer, I wonder if you were one of the students Winona went to
school with who she says continually put her down and made her school
years miserable. I bet you were. I bet it's just killing you that she's a
famous millionaire movie star with a gorgeous rock star boyfriend. She's
pften called one of the world's most beautiful women. That must really get you.
You certainly seem obsessed with her. Do you think your scorn on
this newsgroup is really going to have any effect on her career or the high regard
many have for her. It just makes you look like a petty jealous little bitch.
Pot, speed - undoubtedly many of us have been there, done that and come
through just fine. But at least she's not going deliberately out of her way
to be mean to other people. I've never heard any reports of her being
a prima donna. In fact, my sister was in front of her in line for the dressing
rooms in Barney's. The clerk offered to give her the next room, but Winona
declined to cut in front of the others who had been waiting.
Emma
Does anyone else think it's curious that when Jennifer/Gremmie's first
critical Winona post first appeared she suddenly had support from
several AOL'ers no one has heard of before or since?
EvaW
>Emma
>Does anyone else think it's curious that when Jennifer/Gremmie's first
>critical Winona post first appeared she suddenly had support from
>several AOL'ers no one has heard of before or since?
>
>
I promise, I am not now, nor have I ever been, Gremmie.
Eva @ BFD.com
EvaW
99) writes:
> If you can't live with that then why
>don't you grow up and move to the big city and see what real life is all
>about.
Petaluma, California? Hmmmmm. Big City. OK.
CheshCat21
From: kir...@onr.com (Jeff Kirk)
Date: 5 Feb 1996 08:06:12 GMT
Message-ID: <4f4dpk$a...@mari.onr.com>
In article <4epiih$d...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, grem...@aol.com says...
>
>
>She did smoke pot in high school (I haven't seen her do it recently, so I
>can't say for sure she still does.) She also does lots of speed.
:You say this as if it's a big deal. I've got news for you, honey...LOTS
of
:"gen Xers", myself included, have no problem using "soft-core"
recreational
:drugs, and that includes just about all of Hollywood. This is ESPECIALLY
:true about pot, which - if you had a life - you would know is almost as
:prevalent as booze these days. So who fucking cares if Winona uses pot
and
:crank? If she's shooting up heroin or smoking crack in her trailer
between
:takes...now there's another story.
:Jeff
Since when is speed (or any methanphetamine) considered a "soft core"
drug. It is highly addictive with major side effects. Promoting drug
abuse is not something you should be proud of. Things do tend to be ok in
MODERATION, but when you are addicted to a drug it can ruin your life. It
is just as bad as shotting heroin or smoking crack.
Her acting abilities are another thing. She lacks talent and keeps
getting the same kind of roles over and over again. I must admit that
movies like Heathers and Beetlejuice are amusing, but Little Women and
some of her more recent films are just plain bad.
Chesh
Jeff Kirk
to defend another AOLer...
In article <4f6l7l$1...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, chesh...@aol.com says...
>
>Subject: Re: Winona Ryder can't act....
>From: kir...@onr.com (Jeff Kirk)
>Date: 5 Feb 1996 08:06:12 GMT
>Message-ID: <4f4dpk$a...@mari.onr.com>
>
>In article <4epiih$d...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, grem...@aol.com says...
>>
>>
>>She did smoke pot in high school (I haven't seen her do it recently, so I
>>can't say for sure she still does.) She also does lots of speed.
>
>:You say this as if it's a big deal. I've got news for you, honey...LOTS
>of
>:"gen Xers", myself included, have no problem using "soft-core"
>recreational
>:drugs, and that includes just about all of Hollywood. This is ESPECIALLY
>
>:true about pot, which - if you had a life - you would know is almost as
>:prevalent as booze these days. So who fucking cares if Winona uses pot
>and
>:crank? If she's shooting up heroin or smoking crack in her trailer
>between
>:takes...now there's another story.
>
>:Jeff
>
>Since when is speed (or any methanphetamine) considered a "soft core"
>drug. It is highly addictive with major side effects.
So's booze. You don't see Bill Bennett rallying against *it*! And sorry,
but speed is "soft core" compared to narcotic substances.
>Promoting drug abuse is not something you should be proud of.
Where in that paragraph do I promote drug *abuse*? Drug USE does not equal
drug ABUSE. One can use drugs and not be addicted to them...or did you grow
up believing all of Nancy Reagan's "Just Say No" bullshit?
>Things do tend to be ok in MODERATION, but when you are addicted to a drug
>it can ruin your life. It is just as bad as shotting heroin or smoking
>crack.
I agree totally. I don't condone drug ABUSE, but I see nothing wrong with
drug USE, *IF* you can control it. I also don't condone alcohol ABUSE, but I
see nothing wrong with alcohol USE, *IF* you can control it.
Jeff
EvaW
>How curious...yet ANOTHER never-before-seen AOLer crawls out of the
woodwork
>to defend another AOLer...
>
Yet another instance of domainism. Why is it that the very people who
argue on and on and on and ... about the unacceptability of homophobia &
racism are the first to judge and condemn for merely having a service
different than their own? I have offerered to remove myself from aol if
someone could give me a viable alternative, but no takers. AOL wasn't a
lifestyle *choice* for me. It was biologically determined. Don't you
think if I could *choose* another provider to avoid public ridicule, I
would? I had no choice! Don't you see that?
Feel free to flame me for anything I have said that you don't agree with,
but please don't flame me simply for having aol at the end of my name.
oh yeah, and by the way, fuck off.
(there, now you have some real flame-bait)
CAndrew756
>I think you nedd to do some more reading Jeff.
>Speed(methanphetamine) is considered a narcotic.
>I have been prescribed Ritalin, which is a form of
amethanphetamine...(deleted)
Ritalin? Now we're getting somewhere......
Gremmie 99
What precisely do you mean by that? I was just using that as an example
of how speed is considered a narctoic.
Jennifer
Jeff Kirk
>
>On Feb.8, 1996gr...@aol.com(Gremmie 99) writes:
>>I think you nedd to do some more reading Jeff.
>>Speed(methanphetamine) is considered a narcotic.
>>I have been prescribed Ritalin, which is a form of
>amethanphetamine...(deleted)
>
>Ritalin? Now we're getting somewhere......
Agreed. To quote the Foo Fighters, "Ritalin is good." :-)
Jeff
P.S. In response to Jennifer's claim that speed is a narcotic (this post
didn't show up on my server), it isn't. Though numerous drugs are commonly
labeled as "narcotic", there are in actuality very few drugs that are
"narcotic" in the pharmaceutical sense, cocaine being one of them.
P.P.S. Jennifer, mind sending me some of your Ritalin? It's so hard to get
in Texas these days. ;-)
The Hodge's
> On Feb.8, 1996gr...@aol.com(Gremmie 99) writes:
> >I think you nedd to do some more reading Jeff.
> >Speed(methanphetamine) is considered a narcotic.
> >I have been prescribed Ritalin, which is a form of
> amethanphetamine...(deleted)
>
> Ritalin? Now we're getting somewhere......
When Ritalin is used in theraputic doses it has the opposite effect - my
son is so calm on the stuff it is amazing. Without it he acts like he is
on speed. If you use recreational amounts, it is a form of Speed. This
would explain why the pharmacists are so careful to correlate the dosage
ordered with the amount used over a certain amount of time.
Anyway, where the hell were we?
Avril...
Jeff Kirk
>
>Like I said I really couldn't care less about her smoking pot, speed is
>much worse it has ruined quite a few lives in case you didn't know that.
Yes, I knew that. So has pot. So has booze. So have cigarettes. What's
your point?
>Anyway, what really annoys me is the fact that she has publicly stated
>that she has never drank or done drugs, which I know is untrue. She
>portrays this holy image and it makes me sick.
Well, if this is the case (and I'd be curious to know where she stated this),
then I agree with you.
Jeff
Jeff Kirk
says...
Um, yeah, I think that was the point of CAndrew756's posts. Its speed-like
effects are well-known...in the right circles, that is. :)
Jeff
----------------
NEW!!! Check out my home page...
http://www.onr.com/user/kirker/index.html
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http://www.onr.com/user/kirker/beer.html
Benjamin Schoenberg
>Like I said I partied with her. I was in the same group of people as her.
> One of my ex-boyfriends was like a "big brother" to her. Not everyone up
>here treated her like shit. I never claimed to be one of her friends,
>just an acquaintence with friends who know her quite well. In fact I know
>a few people who dated her.
>What I dislike is her holier than thou image that she never drank or did
>drugs when I know for a fact that is a blatent lie.
Winona has talked in interviews about experimenting with drinking, so
your impression of her is a little off. I don't remember if she's said
anything about experimenting with marijuana, except for a quote like, "my
body wouldn't handle drugs, I'm too little." Are you certain that she's
said she never smoked pot in school? Because otherwise, there's no
reason to call her a liar.
>Or the fact she tried to gain publicity of the tragic death of a little
>girl (Polly Klaas.)
You would have to be tremendously biased or cynical to come up with this
interpretation, I think. Polly Klaas's family seemed to genuinely like
Winona and welcomed her efforts to help Polly and the foundation
established in Polly's name. The fact that magazine writers like to talk
about this isn't Winona's fault.
>You need to get a life. I am stating my opinion and if you don't like it,
>then you don't have to respond to it.
Just as you don't have to respond to responses. But the internet is
basically text, and while it's easy to let spoken words roll off one's back,
the finality of print just demands that each of us get the last word and
defend his or her good name. (Or the names of people and things they like.)
I'm as guilty of it as anyone.
>I have valid reasons not to like her and her treatment of people she
>once called her friends (no one likes to see their friends mistreated.)
I'm curious what you think she's done to her former friends, because I
don't think you've given any examples. The anecdotes about refusing
autographs and cutting in movie lines don't sound firsthand, while we
have heard a firsthand account of her refusing to cut in a changing room
line. And if she has refused to give autographs, there are many contexts
where it would make sense (preoccupied by problems at that moment,
disturbed by unwanted contact with fans in the past, etc.)
What did she do to your friends?
I hate to jump to conclusions, but tell me if this is accurate:
some people very close to you feel hurt or wronged by Winona Ryder. The
attitude of your peer group towards her is resentful, and you have
adopted those feelings despite having only a little contact with her
personally in the past. So where are your friends getting these
feelings, and how do you know Winona's at fault? There are a million
ways resentment builds unknowingly, through miscommunication,
misinterpretation, gossip, etc.
What you read in interviews is an edited version of a transcript of a copy
of what the subject happened to say that day of the top of his or her
head. If Winona "says" something about her past, try not to take it
personally.
-Ben
--
Ben Schoenberg <b...@teleport.com> rio ggli Tel/Fax:1-800-JUGGLE-0 <-zero
Serious Juggling e u n P.O. Box 55276
the worldwide juggling catalog S J s g Portland, OR 97238
Gremmie 99
her.
> One of my ex-boyfriends was like a "big brother" to her. Not everyone
up
>here treated her like shit. I never claimed to be one of her friends,
>just an acquaintence with friends who know her quite well. In fact I know
>a few people who dated her.
>What I dislike is her holier than thou image that she never drank or did
>drugs when I know for a fact that is a blatent lie.
:Winona has talked in interviews about experimenting with drinking, so
:your impression of her is a little off. I don't remember if she's said
:anything about experimenting with marijuana, except for a quote like, "my
:said she never smoked pot in school? Because otherwise, there's no
:reason to call her a liar.
I read an article in a magazine towards the end of 94 in which she said
she has never drank or did drugs. I wish I could remember which mag it
was, but it wasn't a Hollywood movie gossip mag. I am just calling her a
liar for what she said in that interview. If she is being honest now,
then that is good.
>Or the fact she tried to gain publicity of the tragic death of a little
>girl (Polly Klaas.)
:You would have to be tremendously biased or cynical to come up with this
:interpretation, I think. Polly Klaas's family seemed to genuinely like
:Winona and welcomed her efforts to help Polly and the foundation
:established in Polly's name. The fact that magazine writers like to talk
:about this isn't Winona's fault.
Yes, the family welcomed the help. Wouldn't anyone welcome help to find
their kidnapped child. You'd have to be from here, I guess, to see how it
seems so insincere. You would have to know of other instances and what
happened then. I don't quite feel like getting into that right now.
>You need to get a life. I am stating my opinion and if you don't like
it,
>then you don't have to respond to it.
:Just as you don't have to respond to responses. But the internet is
:basically text, and while it's easy to let spoken words roll off one's
back,
:the finality of print just demands that each of us get the last word and
:defend his or her good name. (Or the names of people and things they
like.)
:I'm as guilty of it as anyone.
Touche!!
>I have valid reasons not to like her and her treatment of people she
>once called her friends (no one likes to see their friends mistreated.)
:I don't think you've given any examples. The anecdotes about refusing
:have heard a firsthand account of her refusing to cut in a changing room
:line. And if she has refused to give autographs, there are many contexts
:where it would make sense (preoccupied by problems at that moment,
:What did she do to your friends?
I will give one really good example. One of her best friends, Helene (she
has talked about this girl in magazine articles before as being one of her
best friends)'s
brother asked to do an interview with her for a term paper for a senior
project (which was to interview someone in the profession of your choice).
I find it quite rude that she wouldn't grant a short interview to her
best friend's brother. I can go into more stories, if you would like me
too, but I have to go to school soon and I don't have much time right now.
Jennifer
Judith Rogow
reiterates yet *again* her distain for her "friend I don't know all
that well" Wynonia Ryder.
Umm, I think we *got* your point
Slander Fu
99) wrote:
> >reiterates yet *again* her distain for her "friend I don't know all
> >that well" Wynonia Ryder.
>
> >Umm, I think we *got* your point
>
> I never said she was my friend. She was friends with my friends, which
> put us in the same group of people. She was an acquaintence of mine, that
> is all. Anyway, I think we have lost the point of this post, which has to
> do with the fact that she is a horrible actress. What does everyone think
> on that subject?
She is a lousy actress. I am a trained actor and I've seen her in enough
films to judge her fairly, and out-of-type she is screamingly awful.
In-type (vulnerable, misunderstood young waif) she does alright. If she
does not learn to act at least a little bit, her career will be dead in
another ten years.
She *is* sanctimonious about not using drugs. She has definitely made
judgemental criticisms of drug use that would be hypocritical if she was
lying about refraining. Sure, most of what she says is along the lines of
"gee, I'm just not into that stuff," but not always.
Nevertheless, Gremmie my friend, your comments sound a little strained.
Dailytel
>that well" Wynonia Ryder.
>Umm, I think we *got* your point
I never said she was my friend. She was friends with my friends, which
put us in the same group of people. She was an acquaintence of mine, that
is all. Anyway, I think we have lost the point of this post, which has to
do with the fact that she is a horrible actress. What does everyone think
on that subject?
Jen
************************
Actually, Gremlin, the point of this post appears to be some strange
vendetta you're conducting against Ms. Ryder. Whattsa matter? Did she
turn you down for an 8"X10" glossy autograph??? Has she slapped a
restraining order on ya??? Come on, share....
Um, on second thought, don't...
CiCi
(who just *loooooves* Winona...)
Snacker
sland...@feebus.net (Slander Fu) writes:
>She is a lousy actress. I am a trained actor and I've seen her in
enough
>films to judge her fairly, and out-of-type she is screamingly awful.
>In-type (vulnerable, misunderstood young waif) she does alright. If
she
>does not learn to act at least a little bit, her career will be dead
in
>another ten years.
>
So because you've taken acting classes, you're this big expert on
acting????? Acting is more than just technique. It's also the ability
to move an audience, to have them identify with your character. There
are a lot of "technically" good actors, but many of them bore me. While
I'm not saying Winona is the greatest actress in the world, I have
enjoyed some of her performances and find her appealing.
squ...@interserv.com
> > >reiterates yet *again* her distain for her "friend I don't know all
> > >that well" Wynonia Ryder.
> >
> > >Umm, I think we *got* your point
> >
> > I never said she was my friend. She was friends with my friends, which
> > put us in the same group of people. She was an acquaintence of mine, that
> > is all. Anyway, I think we have lost the point of this post, which has to
> > do with the fact that she is a horrible actress. What does everyone think
> > on that subject?
>
> films to judge her fairly, and out-of-type she is screamingly awful.
> In-type (vulnerable, misunderstood young waif) she does alright. If she
> does not learn to act at least a little bit, her career will be dead in
> another ten years.
>
> judgemental criticisms of drug use that would be hypocritical if she was
> lying about refraining. Sure, most of what she says is along the lines of
> "gee, I'm just not into that stuff," but not always.
>
> Nevertheless, Gremmie my friend, your comments sound a little strained.
>
>>>>
every time. I heard she used to be into drugs, also. I don't know if she is still using them, but seein as
who she is going out with I would venture to guess that she is.
Slander Fu
(Snacker ) wrote:
> In <slander-fu-16...@sac5-149.calweb.com>
> sland...@feebus.net (Slander Fu) writes:
>
> >She is a lousy actress. I am a trained actor and I've seen her in
> enough
> >films to judge her fairly, and out-of-type she is screamingly awful.
> >In-type (vulnerable, misunderstood young waif) she does alright. If
> she
> >does not learn to act at least a little bit, her career will be dead
> in
> >another ten years.
> >
>
> So because you've taken acting classes, you're this big expert on
> acting????? Acting is more than just technique.
Ugh, no, you don't know what the hell you're talking about. When trained
actors talk shop--and it ain't all that often, of course--they talk
craft. Acting is a craft. We value each other by our craft, our
technique. What casting directors think is a totally different matter.
Yes, I am a trained expert on acting, stage directing, and playwriting.
But the credential, in the matter of judging actors, is my
success-to-failure ratio in casting, and it seems to be pretty good.
Anyone in the theatre/film biz knows how critical casting is.
When I was in grad school, I cast this awkward, vulnerable young actress
as the young sister in _Glass Menagerie_. She was brilliant, but in
subsequent out-of-type roles she was pretty average. This is exactly what
happened with Winona Ryder, although on a much greater scale. See her in
that Jim Jarmusch film (_Night on Earth_?) where she plays opposite the
very good, very pro Sylvia Miles. Ryder was so amateur she was pitiful.
She was "acting".
You know, I like her too, but I'm beginning to resent her for not
developing a rudimentary sense of the craft. Elizabeth Taylor, whose
looks and career are so much like Ryder's it's eerie, never could act for
beans, but oh boy did she try like hell. She might not have been Uta
Hagen, but she did her damnedest to play up to her material. It's not all
that hard to learn to be a decent actor. Tons of Hollywood ingenues and
hunks have done it. To not try is to have little regard for the art in
your movies, such as it is, but more importantly for the other actors with
whom you work who are trying to respect the craft and do well by the
project and the medium.
> It's also the ability
> to move an audience, to have them identify with your character.
Nonsense, that's the effect of the work upon you, not the work the actor
did. The technical aspects of film can be a huge crutch to the
performers. You simply do not need to act at all in order to be part of a
film that moves people to openly weep. Human puppetry is not acting,
although it may be great directing or scriptwriting.
> There
> are a lot of "technically" good actors, but many of them bore me.
Phffft, big deal. You're idea of haute cuisine is probably Spam on Wonder
Bread. You can like what you like, but that doesn't make it worthwhile.
> While I'm not saying Winona is the greatest actress in the world, I have
> enjoyed some of her performances and find her appealing.
So what, who the hell are you? Nobody, that's who. If pluralism was our
benchmark of aesthetics, LeRoy Nieman would be judged a greater painter
than Pablo Picasso.
Judith Rogow
>
>>reiterates yet *again* her distain for her "friend I don't know all
>>that well" Wynonia Ryder.
>
>>Umm, I think we *got* your point
>
>I never said she was my friend. She was friends with my friends, which
>put us in the same group of people. She was an acquaintence of mine, that
>is all. Anyway, I think we have lost the point of this post, which has to
>do with the fact that she is a horrible actress. What does everyone think
>on that subject?
Ummm, that *you* have a big problem???
ka...@delphi.com
>Yes, I am a trained expert on acting, stage directing, and playwriting.
Good Lord, what the hell does that mean? I know people with Ph.D.'s in
music who wouldn't know talent if they heard it. Who trained you? What
celestial heights have you reached that you can consider yourself an
"expert" in an art form? (I'll leave stage direction out of it - to
my untrained eye it would seem to be something one could master). I
can't for the life of me think of an "expert" in writing. Even
the sublimely talented generally concede that art is too nebulous
to be "mastered" by anyone.
.
>> It's also the ability
>> to move an audience, to have them identify with your character.
>
>Nonsense, that's the effect of the work upon you, not the work the actor
>did. The technical aspects of film can be a huge crutch to the
>performers. You simply do not need to act at all in order to be part of a
>film that moves people to openly weep. Human puppetry is not acting,
>although it may be great directing or scriptwriting.
What planet are you living on? Evidently one on which actors are
interchangeable (defeating your previous statement that casting is
all important). I think the career of Julia Roberts, while
possibly beneath your contempt, belies your last statement. She is a
star because somthing about her (in snacker's words - God help me,
I'm quoting snacker! - )
.
>> It's also the ability
>> to move an audience, to have them identify with your character.
>
>Nonsense, that's the effect of the work upon you, not the work the actor
>did. The technical aspects of film can be a huge crutch to the
>performers. You simply do not need to act at all in order to be part of a
>film that moves people to openly weep. Human puppetry is not acting,
>although it may be great directing or scriptwriting.
Would you say that it is Roberts' great choice of
projects/directors/screenplaysand the magnificent technical aspects of her
films that have made her a star?
I wouldn't call her an Actress with a capital A, but the masses of people
who ARE moved by her aren't being moved because it's great art, they are
responding to whatever it is that she manages to project. It may be lost
on us, but who is to say that technique is superior to playing to type?
.
>> While I'm not saying Winona is the greatest actress in the world, I have
>> enjoyed some of her performances and find her appealing.
>
>So what, who the hell are you? Nobody, that's who. If pluralism was our
>benchmark of aesthetics, LeRoy Nieman would be judged a greater painter
>than Pablo Picasso.
I think we're all starting to wonder just who YOU are. Nobody has said that
Winona Ryder threatens Meryl Streep or even Michelle Pfeiffer for acting
ability. But we have yet to see anything that should make us accept
YOUR word as anything more than self-aggrandizement (and anonymous
self-aggrandizement, to boot!)
.
kassa (hey - used self-aggrandizement and to boot in the same sentence!)
Cluster User
> In <slander-fu-16...@sac5-149.calweb.com>
> sland...@feebus.net (Slander Fu) writes:
>
> >She is a lousy actress. I am a trained actor and I've seen her in
> enough
> >films to judge her fairly, and out-of-type she is screamingly awful.
> >In-type (vulnerable, misunderstood young waif) she does alright. If
> she
> >does not learn to act at least a little bit, her career will be dead
> in
> >another ten years.
> >
>
> So because you've taken acting classes, you're this big expert on
> acting????? Acting is more than just technique.
Ugh, no, you don't know what the hell you're talking about. When trained
actors talk shop--and it ain't all that often, of course--they talk
craft. Acting is a craft. We value each other by our craft, our
technique. What casting directors think is a totally different matter.
Yes, I am a trained expert on acting, stage directing, and playwriting.
But the credential, in the matter of judging actors, is my
success-to-failure ratio in casting, and it seems to be pretty good.
Anyone in the theatre/film biz knows how critical casting is.
When I was in grad school, I cast this awkward, vulnerable young actress
as the young sister in _Glass Menagerie_. She was brilliant, but in
subsequent out-of-type roles she was pretty average. This is exactly what
happened with Winona Ryder, although on a much greater scale. See her in
that Jim Jarmusch film (_Night on Earth_?) where she plays opposite the
very good, very pro Sylvia Miles. Ryder was so amateur she was pitiful.
She was "acting".
You know, I like her too, but I'm beginning to resent her for not
developing a rudimentary sense of the craft. Elizabeth Taylor, whose
looks and career are so much like Ryder's it's eerie, never could act for
beans, but oh boy did she try like hell. She might not have been Uta
Hagen...
ARE YOU FUCKING NUTS???? UTA HAGEN IS ONE OF THE MOST ATTROCIOUS OVERACTING
SHITS THE WORLD HAS EVER SEEN!
Yet Another Steve
sland...@feebus.net (Slander Fu) wrote:
[much deletia]
> > While I'm not saying Winona is the greatest actress in the world, I have
> > enjoyed some of her performances and find her appealing.
>
> So what, who the hell are you? Nobody, that's who. If pluralism was our
> benchmark of aesthetics, LeRoy Nieman would be judged a greater painter
> than Pablo Picasso.
So, who the hell are YOU? A search of the internet movie database turns
up no mention of the illustrious "Slander Fu".
Oh, you're really Stanley Kubrick? OK, I can now reveal that I'm actually
Robert de Niro.
Steve
(actually, there's only ONE person who is TRULY the 'benchmark of
aesthetics', and that's me, so the rest of you can go home now. Just
call me if you want to know if anything's rilly, rilly good or not.)
Anne E. Skove
: You know, I like her too, but I'm beginning to resent her for not
: developing a rudimentary sense of the craft. Elizabeth Taylor, whose
: looks and career are so much like Ryder's it's eerie, never could act for
Are you talking about the Elizabeth Taylor who sells perfume & is friends
with MJ, & the Winona Ryder who used to go out w/Johnny Depp, or some
other ET & WR? "cause I don't see the resemblance at all, except for
they both started young (but ET much younger, I think?)
aes
Susan Trinh
> >reiterates yet *again* her distain for her "friend I don't know all
> >that well" Wynonia Ryder.
>
> >Umm, I think we *got* your point
>
> I never said she was my friend. She was friends with my friends, which
> put us in the same group of people. She was an acquaintence of mine, that
> is all. Anyway, I think we have lost the point of this post, which has to
> do with the fact that she is a horrible actress. What does everyone think
> on that subject?
>
> Jen
>
I think Winona's a great actress. She might not be a Meryl Streep right
now, but she will be.
That's my 2 cents worth.
O
... /\, o/
___o __@ __@ . __o .... -|~(*) |
_'\ <_ _-\<,-\<, .._\<, (*) _'\ _'
..(_)/ (_)..(*)/---/(*)... O/ O.....................(_)/ (_)....
Susan Trinh
tr...@cs.uregina.ca
http://www.cs.uregina.ca/~trinh
Lisa McElroy
>
[snip]
> Yes, I am a trained expert on acting, stage directing, and playwriting.
> But the credential, in the matter of judging actors, is my
> success-to-failure ratio in casting, and it seems to be pretty good.
> Anyone in the theatre/film biz knows how critical casting is.
>
> When I was in grad school, I cast this awkward, vulnerable young actress
> as the young sister in _Glass Menagerie_. She was brilliant, but in
> subsequent out-of-type roles she was pretty average. This is exactly what
> happened with Winona Ryder, although on a much greater scale. See her in
> that Jim Jarmusch film (_Night on Earth_?) where she plays opposite the
> very good, very pro Sylvia Miles. Ryder was so amateur she was pitiful.
> She was "acting".
If you mean her taxi-driving role; Winona played opposite Gena
Rowlands, not Sylvia Miles. In interviews she expressed awe at
working with the great Gena and I thought Jarmusch put that segment
in first, in honor of his two *stars*, even though it was the
weakest bit in the film. Winona was indeed, terrible, but you
should get your facts straight before you berate someone in such an
exaggerated, snot-nosed manner. YOU are acting.
--lmm
Gremmie 99
> >that well" Wynonia Ryder.
>
> >Umm, I think we *got* your point
>
> I never said she was my friend. She was friends with my friends, which
> put us in the same group of people. She was an acquaintence of mine,
that
> is all. Anyway, I think we have lost the point of this post, which has
to
> do with the fact that she is a horrible actress. What does everyone
think
> on that subject?
>
> Jen
>
<I think Winona's a great actress. She might not be a Meryl Streep right
<now, but she will be.
<That's my 2 cents worth.
I don't know about great, but I will agree that some of her roles are
watchable. I did like Beetlejuice, Heathers, and Mermaids. I personally
think she should stick to those kinds of roles.
Jennifer
Harry Rags
performance in every film she makes.
Harry Rags
ps But she is nice to look at.
Anne E. Skove
: Slander Fu <sland...@feebus.net> writes:
:
: >Yes, I am a trained expert on acting, stage directing, and playwriting.
:
: .
: Good Lord, what the hell does that mean? I know people with Ph.D.'s in
: music who wouldn't know talent if they heard it. Who trained you? What
: celestial heights have you reached that you can consider yourself an
: "expert" in an art form? (I'll leave stage direction out of it - to
: my untrained eye it would seem to be something one could master). I
: can't for the life of me think of an "expert" in writing. Even
: the sublimely talented generally concede that art is too nebulous
: to be "mastered" by anyone.
Hey, if you can train sea monkeys to do tricks, you can train a human to
be an expert in acting, directing, & playwriting! There are 1,000
monkeys hooked up to a.s.g., & they come up with great stuff every damn
day!
aes
KerJac
feeling like acting she just flutters her eyelashes and gets all doe-eyed.
Something to that effect. Now I can't watch a movie with her in it
without noticing that that's ALL she does. I think she's awful.
Kerin
Tym 110448
nite on earth(nite in taxi-cab hell)has got to be the best demonstration
of her Acting(ha !) ability.it could quite possibly be the MOST boring,
MOST noxious, dragging, crap acting film i have ever had the misfortune of
watching.little women
was wonderful in spite of her awful appearance.
Timoteo
Snacker
sland...@feebus.net (Slander Fu) writes:
>
>In article <4g4oo4$i...@reader2.ix.netcom.com>, sna...@ix.netcom.com
>(Snacker ) wrote:
>
{much snipped}
> Elizabeth Taylor, whose looks and career are so much like Ryder's
>it's eerie, never could act for
>beans, but oh boy did she try like hell. She might not have been Uta
>Hagen, but she did her damnedest to play up to her material.
WHAT??????? Oh yeah, sitting through "Edward Scissorhands", all I could
think of was "damn, this girl looks like Liz Taylor".......
>> It's also the ability
>> to move an audience, to have them identify with your character.
>
>Nonsense, that's the effect of the work upon you, not the work the
actor
>did. The technical aspects of film can be a huge crutch to the
>performers. You simply do not need to act at all in order to be part
of a
>film that moves people to openly weep. Human puppetry is not acting,
>although it may be great directing or scriptwriting.
>
Then explain while there have been many productions of "The Glass
Menagerie", only one version moved me. If it's the work, as you say,
and not the actors, then why didn't every version move me?????
>> There are a lot of "technically" good actors, but many of them bore
>>me.
>
>Phffft, big deal. You're idea of haute cuisine is probably Spam on
Wonder
>Bread. You can like what you like, but that doesn't make it
worthwhile.
Well, I am a "trained" film buff, so I guess I know what I'm talking
about!!!
>> While I'm not saying Winona is the greatest actress in the world, I
have
>> enjoyed some of her performances and find her appealing.
>
>So what, who the hell are you? Nobody, that's who. If pluralism was
our
>benchmark of aesthetics, LeRoy Nieman would be judged a greater
painter
>than Pablo Picasso.
Who the hell am I? I am a paying moviegoer; someone who keeps Winona
from collecting unemployment and keeps you waiting on tables.....
KerJac
water by Claire Danes. And she even had a pretty minor role. Even the
girl who played Amy (the younger one, I didn't care for Samantha Mathis as
the older Amy AT ALL) gave a better performance. (I can't for the life of
me remember little Amy's name. Yet WINONA RYDER was nominated for an
oscar?? PLEASE! I saw Night on Earth, too. How hunched over that damned
steering wheel could she get, anyway?
Kerin
squ...@interserv.com
> In article <4g0hjc$7...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, grem...@aol.com says...
> >
> >>that well" Wynonia Ryder.
> >
> >>Umm, I think we *got* your point
> >
> >I never said she was my friend. She was friends with my friends, which
> >put us in the same group of people. She was an acquaintence of mine, that
> >is all. Anyway, I think we have lost the point of this post, which has to
> >do with the fact that she is a horrible actress. What does everyone think
> >on that subject?
>
>
>
>
>>>>
Susan Line
If anyone should have been nominated for that movie, it should have
been Claire Daines. It is a shame that Winona keeps getting cast
along side talented actors.
JaneAnne Peterson
> >water by Claire Danes. And she even had a pretty minor >role. Even the
> >girl who played Amy (the younger one, I didn't care for >Samantha Mathis as
> >the older Amy AT ALL) gave a better performance. (I >can't for the life of
> >me remember little Amy's name. Yet WINONA RYDER was >nominated for an
> >oscar?? PLEASE! I saw Night on Earth, too. How >hunched over that damned
> >steering wheel could she get, anyway?
> >Kerin
Little Amy was played by Kirsten Dunst, who should have received an Oscar
for playing the little girl in Interview with the Vampire.
Unfortunately, they had already given a kiddie Oscar to the little girl
from The Piano the year before.
JaneAnne