Gene Raymond FOD Blind Item in "Sweethearts"
Nelson Fan
"Sweethearts" by Sharon Rich. On page 233 it says: "Marshall Wright, a
Hollywood promoter...said that in 1938 he learned that Gene Raymond
had taken a house with a 19-year old male under contract to Universal.
(The actor in question made his successful film debut the following
year.)"
Anyone know who it is? He must still be alive as of 2001 (I read the
booksurge.com edition) because otherwise she would have named him. She
names other people (loved it) and even has Gene's arrest record.
Bea
Buster Crab
nelsone...@yahoo.com (Nelson Fan) wrote:
>Just finished reading the Nelson Eddy
>and Jeanette MacDonald biography
>"Sweethearts" by Sharon Rich. On page
>233 it says: "Marshall Wright, a
>Hollywood promoter...said that in 1938
>he learned that Gene Raymond had
>taken a house with a 19-year old male
>under contract to Universal. (The actor in
>question made his successful film debut
>the following year.)"
>Anyone know who it is? He must still be
>alive as of 2001 (I read the
>booksurge.com edition) because
>otherwise she would have named him.
I happened to know Gene Raymond throughout the last 8 years of his life
and I knew some of his oldest friends very
well, too---including the late Allan Jones.
Sharon Rich's book recycles her fantasies about Gene, Jeanette
MacDonald, and Nelson Eddy which appeared in her ealier
obscure book, "Farewell to Dreams."
She's the head of a fan club devoted
to perpetuating the fantasy that Jeanette
and Nelson's onscreen romantic pairing was a real life fact.
She therefore has to discredit Jeanette's decades-long marriage to Gene
Raymond
by portraying Gene as a closeted gay man. Why MacDonald stayed married
to a "gay" Raymond and why she and Eddy didn't drop their respective
spouses for each other is never explained by Rich.
Gene and his lawyers were well aware
of the book and chose to let it die without
giving it the publicity of legal action.
>She names other people (loved it) and
>even has Gene's arrest record.
Without any actual documentation.
Buster
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"The classic liberal response to a principled conservative argument is
to accuse Republicans of
planning a second Holocaust. No matter how inured
one becomes to liberal hate speech, the regularity with
which Republicans are compared to Nazis still astonishes."
---Ann Coulter "Slander"
"I should have been a pair of ragged claws
scuttling across the floors of silent seas."
--T.S. Eliot
"The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock."
Adopt-a-claw: http://busterthecrab.com/
Nelson Fan
> She therefore has to discredit Jeanette's decades-long marriage to Gene
> Raymond
> by portraying Gene as a closeted gay man. Why MacDonald stayed married
> to a "gay" Raymond and why she and Eddy didn't drop their respective
> spouses for each other is never explained by Rich.
I thought she did an excellent job of explaining it.
>
> Gene and his lawyers were well aware
> of the book and chose to let it die without
> giving it the publicity of legal action.
...Because he knew he had no case?
>
> >She names other people (loved it) and
> >even has Gene's arrest record.
>
> Without any actual documentation.
The documentation is reproduced in the book. Page 498. Are we talking
about the same book?
Thanks for responding, Buster. But you don't mention how you knew Gene
Raymond (business, friend) and obviously he was on record as denying
the romance. Allan Jones might have been a nice guy but he never had a
good word to say about Nelson Eddy. :(
I thought the book made its case quite well.
Bea
Buster Crab
nelsone...@yahoo.com (Nelson Fan) wrote:
>>She therefore has to discredit
>>Jeanette's decades-long marriage to
>>Gene Raymond by portraying Gene as
>>a closeted gay man. Why MacDonald
>>stayed married to a "gay" Raymond and
>>why she and Eddy didn't drop their
>>respective spouses for each other is
>>never explained by Rich.
>I thought she did an excellent job of
>explaining it.
Oh, right. Jeanette stayed married to
an alcoholic gay man because she feared
the wrath of LB Mayer and the bad publicity of a divorce. Yet her film
career
was effectively over by the mid-40s and
Mayer was ousted from MGM in 1951. Yet she stayed married to Raymond
until her death in l965. Such devotion to a bad marriage in
divorce-prone Hollywood would be one for Ripley's indeed!
>>Gene and his lawyers were well aware
>>of the book and chose to let it die
>>without giving it the publicity of legal
>>action.
>...Because he knew he had no case?
No, because it was such an absurd charge and pursuing a pipsqueak author
like Rich would simply create sales for the book.
>>>She names other people (loved it) and
>>>even has Gene's arrest record.
>>Without any actual documentation.
>The documentation is reproduced in the
>book. Page 498. Are we talking about the
>same book?
What type of documentation is it?
>Thanks for responding, Buster. But you
>don't mention how you knew Gene
>Raymond (business, friend) and
>obviously he was on record as denying
>the romance.
I knew Gene through Allan Jones.
>Allan Jones might have been a nice guy
>but he never had a good word to say
>about Nelson Eddy. :(
So what? He knew Gene and Jeanette
for decades and knew there was no truth
in Rich's book.
(No, he didnt like Eddy because Eddy sabotaged his career at MGM. he
didn't like it when the studio effectively paired Jeanette with Allan in
THE FIREFLY.
He told LB Mayer that if the studio did
that again, "you'll have trouble with me.")
Nelson Fan
> nelsone...@yahoo.com (Nelson?Fan) wrote:
>
> >>She therefore has to discredit
> >>Jeanette's decades-long marriage to
> >>Gene Raymond by portraying Gene as
> >>a closeted gay man. Why MacDonald
> >>stayed married to a "gay" Raymond and
> >>why she and Eddy didn't drop their
> >>respective spouses for each other is
> >>never explained by Rich.
>
> >I thought she did an excellent job of
> >explaining it.
>
> Oh, right. Jeanette stayed married to
> an alcoholic gay man because she feared
> the wrath of LB Mayer and the bad publicity of a divorce. Yet her film
> career
> was effectively over by the mid-40s and
> Mayer was ousted from MGM in 1951. Yet she stayed married to Raymond
> until her death in l965. Such devotion to a bad marriage in
> divorce-prone Hollywood would be one for Ripley's indeed!
>
But I don't agree with you. Lots of Hollywood marriages were like
that, it seems. Doesn't mean it was a bad marriage but each person did
his own thing. In the 1950s, why get a divorce? They had the house in
Bel Air and the New York apartment, with one person on each coast.
Just as Nelson's wife lived in LA and Nelson was on the road with his
new singing partner.
And in the 1960s, according to the book, they had two apartments. Even
if they didn't want to sleep in the same bed, there was a second
bedroom in her apartment but did Gene live in it? No, he was across
the hall in his own place.
After her death Gene had to repay A LOAN that Jeanette gave him, even
though he petitioned to the court to drop it. And why were all her
many bank and investment accounts in her name only, except for two
checking and one savings?
>
> >>>She names other people (loved it) and
> >>>even has Gene's arrest record.
>
> >>Without any actual documentation.
>
> >The documentation is reproduced in the
> >book. Page 498. Are we talking about the
> >same book?
>
> What type of documentation is it?
Photo of the LAPD arrest record from January 1938 with Gene's name on
it.
>
> >Thanks for responding, Buster. But you
> >don't mention how you knew Gene
> >Raymond (business, friend) and
> >obviously he was on record as denying
> >the romance.
>
> I knew Gene through Allan Jones.
>
> >Allan Jones might have been a nice guy
> >but he never had a good word to say
> >about Nelson Eddy. :(
>
> So what? He knew Gene and Jeanette
> for decades and knew there was no truth
> in Rich's book.
At the risk of angering you further, there is a photograph of a
handwritten letter dated 1947 in the book that contains a list of
insiders "who know" and among the names are "Allan Jones & wife." Page
529.
I'm a true blue Nelson Eddy fan but I did like Allan Jones in The
Firefly. However, Jeanette was effectively paired with other MGM
co-stars and Nelson didn't beat them up and have them thrown out. So
in 1937 Allan had to know how Nelson felt about Jeanette. And in the
1940s he apparently knew. IMHO, there wasn't really a relationship in
the 1950s and beyond, so what was there to know?
Someone else, FYI, contacted me and said the actor I was originally
asking about was Robert Stack.
Bea
Parterrebox
about was Robert Stack.
I was that "someone," but I did *not* say it was Robert Stack; rather, I said
that the facts of Stack's life were compatible with the clues given in the
blind item. In other words, it *could* very well be him, but I'm not saying it
is for sure.
Buster Crab
nelsone...@yahoo.com (Nelson Fan) wrote:
>>Oh, right. Jeanette stayed married to
>>an alcoholic gay man because she feared
>>the wrath of LB Mayer and the bad
>>publicity of a divorce. Yet her film career
>>was effectively over by the mid-40s and
>>Mayer was ousted from MGM in 1951.
>>Yet she stayed married to Raymond
>>until her death in l965. Such devotion to
>>a bad marriage in divorce-prone
>>Hollywood would be one for Ripley's
>>indeed!
>Whoa, Buster, don't jump down MY throat!
Then stop recycling Sharon Rich's
bullshit.
>But I don't agree with you. Lots of
>Hollywood marriages were like that, it
>seems. Doesn't mean it was a bad
>marriage but each person did his own
>thing. In the 1950s, why get a divorce?
Hollywood couples ~always~ divorced
frequently and for far less cause.
>They had the house in Bel Air and the
>New York apartment, with one person on
>each coast.
They did not have a NY apartment, they
were allowed to use a friend's place when
they visited NY. You can see it in their
"Person to Person" interview with Ed Murrow that's available on
videotape.
> Just as Nelson's wife lived in LA and
>Nelson was on the road with his new
>singing partner.
According to Allan, Eddy had a May-December affair with the much
younger Gale Sherwood.
>And in the 1960s, according to the book,
>they had two apartments. Even if they
>didn't want to sleep in the same bed,
>there was a second bedroom in her
>apartment but did Gene live in it? No, he
>was across the hall in his own place.
What's the source for this? After they sold Twin Gables, their Bel Air
home,
they moved to a luxury apartment building
on Wilshire and Comstock because Jeanette's heart condition made it
difficult
for her to climb stairs or run a household.
>After her death Gene had to repay A
>LOAN that Jeanette gave him, even
>though he petitioned to the court to drop
>it.
The courts are often ruthlessly legalistic
when it comes to estates.
> And why were all her many bank and
>investment accounts in her name only,
>except for two checking and one savings?
She was the big earner in the marriage
and perhaps they kept their accounts separate. Not unheard of.
>>>>>She names other people (loved it) and
>>>>>even has Gene's arrest record.
>>>>Without any actual documentation.
>>>The documentation is reproduced in the
>>>book. Page 498. Are we talking about
>>>the same book?
>>What type of documentation is it?
>Photo of the LAPD arrest record from
>January 1938 with Gene's name on it.
I recall that. I think there was something
bogus about it, but I will have to look at it again. I don't own the
book, but I can
check a friend's copy.
>At the risk of angering you further, there
>is a photograph of a handwritten letter
>dated 1947 in the book that contains a
>list of insiders "who know" and among
>the names are "Allan Jones & wife."
>Page 529.
Source of the letter?
>I'm a true blue Nelson Eddy fan but I did
>like Allan Jones in The Firefly. However,
>Jeanette was effectively paired with
>other MGM co-stars and Nelson didn't
>beat them up and have them thrown out.
She was particularly effective with Jones
in THE FIREFLY and another film was planned. Eddy shot it down. She
and
Allan were close friends and they had
an obvious on-screen rapport. While Jeanette and Nelson were also
friends,
their incompatible personalities clashed frequently.
And Allan was originally selected to do
NAUGHTY MARIETTA, but couldn't get
out of a Broadway contract with the Schubert organization in time to do
the
film. Eddy was substituted. So MGM
~always~ believed that MacDonald and Jones made a good team, and Eddy
knew that. Which is why he threw a tantrum over THE FIREFLY..
> So in 1937 Allan had to know how
>Nelson felt about Jeanette. And in the
>1940s he apparently knew. IMHO, there
>wasn't really a relationship in the 1950s
>and beyond, so what was there to know?
Nelson and Jeanette dated briefly, as unmarried Hollywood co-stars often
did, but they were a mismatch. Allan
thought the idea of Jeanette and Nelson
being seriously involved romantically was hilarious.
KT
From: Web...@webtv.net (Buster Crab)
Date: Sat, Aug 24, 2002 5:12 PM
Message-id: <12027-3D6...@storefull-2291.public.lawson.webtv.net>
Wow, it looks like you two have alot of time on your hands.
nelsone...@yahoo.com (Nelson=A0Fan) wrote:
>>>>Without any actual documentation.
Source of the letter?
Buster
---Ann Coulter "Slander"
Adopt-a-claw: http://busterthecrab.com/
>>
"What luck for the rulers that men do not think."
-- Adolf Hitler
Nelson Fan
Yes, that's right. Didn't mean to misrepresent. I went to IMDB and
read about him and you are right about his first movie and the dates.
Nelson Fan
> >Whoa, Buster, don't jump down MY throat!
>
> Then stop recycling Sharon Rich's
> bullshit.
See below.
>
> >They had the house in Bel Air and the
> >New York apartment, with one person on
> >each coast.
>
> They did not have a NY apartment, they
> were allowed to use a friend's place when
> they visited NY. You can see it in their
> "Person to Person" interview with Ed Murrow that's available on
> videotape.
888 Park Avenue
>
> > Just as Nelson's wife lived in LA and
> >Nelson was on the road with his new
> >singing partner.
>
> According to Allan, Eddy had a May-December affair with the much
> younger Gale Sherwood.
...which Sharon Rich discusses, so it isn't all bullshit, is it?
>
>
> >And in the 1960s, according to the book,
> >they had two apartments. Even if they
> >didn't want to sleep in the same bed,
> >there was a second bedroom in her
> >apartment but did Gene live in it? No, he
> >was across the hall in his own place.
>
> What's the source for this? After they sold Twin Gables, their Bel Air
> home,
> they moved to a luxury apartment building
> on Wilshire and Comstock because Jeanette's heart condition made it
> difficult
> for her to climb stairs or run a household.
Wilshire Comstock, east building, apartments 8C and 8D
>
>
>>
> >At the risk of angering you further, there
> >is a photograph of a handwritten letter
> >dated 1947 in the book that contains a
> >list of insiders "who know" and among
> >the names are "Allan Jones & wife."
> >Page 529.
>
> Source of the letter?
>
Friend of Nelson's mother, Sarah Tucker.
> >I'm a true blue Nelson Eddy fan but I did
> >like Allan Jones in The Firefly. However,
> >Jeanette was effectively paired with
> >other MGM co-stars and Nelson didn't
> >beat them up and have them thrown out.
>
>While Jeanette and Nelson were also
> friends,
> their incompatible personalities clashed frequently.
Also discussed in the book. So?
>
>
> So MGM
> ~always~ believed that MacDonald and Jones made a good team, and Eddy
> knew that. Which is why he threw a tantrum over THE FIREFLY..
Good team, but not the same chemistry that she had with Nelson on
screen.
>
>
> Allan
> thought the idea of Jeanette and Nelson
> being seriously involved romantically was hilarious.
>
> Hilarious? Because he thought Nelson was a a jerk? Or too busy with Gale Sherwood?
I've been looking around the web and at other threads and found this
quote on amazon.com from a lady in Glendale, Calif: "Maybe Jeanette
and Gene found a way to make their marriage work, since they never
divorced, but Raymond's homosexuality was well-known in contemporary
circles, plus I happen to know that he frequented that famous
Cathedral City bar, Daddy Warbucks."
I'll say again, I think the book made its case...and that the real
reason Gene Raymond didn't sue was because it was true about him.
Time to sit down and watch a Nelson video. I'd rather listen to his
glorious voice than argue.
Bea
maryanne kehoe
I need more coffee.....I thought the tag line was Gene RAYBURN (and
besides, he's been dead for 10 years!)
Buster Crab
>>Allan thought the idea of Jeanette and
>>Nelson being seriously involved
>>romantically was hilarious.
>Hilarious? Because he thought Nelson
>was a a jerk? Or too busy with Gale
>Sherwood?
He did think Eddy was a jerk, but he also
thought that his affair with Gale Sherwood made more of a human being
out of him
and Allan grew to like him more during that period.
But he knew Gene very very well (my former wife had lunch with both of
them and Gene's second wife, Nels Bentley,
at the Bel Air Country Club during one of
Allan's frequent West Coast visits.) Jones
knew Gene and Jeanette as an intimate
friend for more than 40 years and laughed and scoffed at Rich's books.
>I've been looking around the web and at
>other threads and found this quote on
>amazon.com from a lady in Glendale,
>Calif: "Maybe Jeanette and Gene found
>a way to make their marriage work,
>since they never divorced, but
>Raymond's homosexuality was
>well-known in contemporary circles,
Except those "contemporary circles"
excluded his close friends and acquaintances!
I additionally knew character actor William Bakewell, who attended the
Raymond-MacDonald wedding and was a lifelong friend. He also sneered
at the notion of Gene's homosexuality and he
was well aware of Sharon Rich's other book, "Farewell to Dreams" in
which she
first mentioned it.
And Bill was usually quite candid. When I asked him about Cesar Romero
(who was then still living and whose nickname was "Butch"). he said,
"Yep. Butch is gay."
>I'll say again, I think the book made its
>case...and that the real reason Gene
>Raymond didn't sue was because it was
>true about him.
Since Raymond was a public figure, he would have to show actual malice.
That means he would have to show that Rich
published the information with reckless
disregard for the truth.
Since she has "sources," she is
protected from a libel judgment by virtue of these hearsay sources.
Gene would
therefore never have been able to prove malice and a libel suit would
just have given the book publicity.
The book is simply a collection of Sharon
Rich's fantasies. No one but goofball
members of her fan club take it seriously.
(Do you belong to it?)
KazamaSmokers
Nelson Fan
> OHMIGOD!!!! THE HOST OF "MATCH GAME" WAS GAY????
No, no...that's Gene Rayburn you're talking about.
I'm talking about Gene RAYMOND who was married to movie star Jeanette MacDonald.
Nelson Fan
> He did think Eddy was a jerk, but he also
> thought that his affair with Gale Sherwood made more of a human being
> out of him
> and Allan grew to like him more during that period.
Again, as this is discussed in the book, it isn't one of "Sharon
Rich's fantasies," is it?
>
> The book is simply a collection of Sharon
> Rich's fantasies. No one but goofball
> members of her fan club take it seriously.
> (Do you belong to it?)
>
> Buster
(No, but I'm going to write her a fan letter today. And get me another
copy of the book since I've marked up mine underlining passages and
finding answers to your questions!)
FYI, I read another Nelson biography that quotes Gale Sherwood as
denying an affair with Nelson, so if Gale Sherwood read this thread
she would say that your claim was "a collection of Buster the Crab's
fantasies" and she'd call Allan Jones a liar too.
Bea
Buster Crab
nelsone...@yahoo.com (Nelson Fan) wrote:
>>He did think Eddy was a jerk, but he
>>also thought that his affair with Gale
>>Sherwood made more of a human
>>being out of him and Allan grew to like
>>him more during that period.
>Again, as this is discussed in the book, it
>isn't one of "Sharon Rich's fantasies," is
>it?
The basic contention of the book, that
Gene Raymond was gay and that his
marriage to Jeanette MacDonald was
a fraud and that she was in love with
Nelson Eddy---is false.
I knew Gene and two of his lifelong
friends, and am well-acquainted with the facts of the Raymond-MacDonald
relationship. I also know recent MacDonald biographer, Edward Baron
Turk. Not once have I ever heard one
shred of evidence to support Rich's
fantasies.
As for his Gene's feelings
about Jeanette---even though his second
marriage lasted longer than his marriage to MacDonald, until a year
before he died, he remained attached to Jeanette and for over 30 years
unfailingly attended the annual tribute to her that used to be held in
Beverly Hills.
Aunt Acid
"Nelson Fan" <nelsone...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:d6f03d0.02082...@posting.google.com...
> FYI, I read another Nelson biography that quotes Gale Sherwood as
> denying an affair with Nelson, so if Gale Sherwood read this thread
> she would say that your claim was "a collection of Buster the Crab's
> fantasies"
For the love of God, please don't take me there.
Aunt Acid
Art
> The basic contention of the book, that
> Gene Raymond was gay and that his
> marriage to Jeanette MacDonald was
> a fraud and that she was in love with
> Nelson Eddy---is false.
Bullshit. I met Nelson Eddy through a friend in 1965. We had dinner
together and my friend, who had business dealings with Nelson, brought
up Jeanette's name and how rough it must have been for Nelson with
the press after her death, the way they hounded him. Nelson's face
turned red and he got very emotional for a minute. He mumbled
something about Jeanette and their lives and then he said, "We married
the wrong people." Note he said WE. Not HE. Meaning, Jeanette married
the wrong person too.
> I knew Gene and two of his lifelong
> friends, and am well-acquainted with the facts of the Raymond-MacDonald
> relationship. I also know recent MacDonald biographer, Edward Baron
> Turk. Not once have I ever heard one
> shred of evidence to support Rich's
> fantasies.
>
> Buster is busted! Bea--don't waste your keystrokes arguing with this
guy. He mentions knowing Turk, who wrote a completely whitewashed
biography of Jeanette. This should give you a clue. Turk, like Buster,
simply ignores facts that he can't disprove. It is a matter of public
record (LAPD) that Gene Raymond was arrested. It is a matter of public
record (Jeanette's will and probate) that they had two apartments. A
bill for unpaid rent for both apartments was brought to court in 1966,
after Jeanette's death.
Buster never heard one shred of evidence? He's read a few shreds in
this thread and I'm sure he's heard it elsewhere. Enough living
celebrities have gone on the record, supporting the fact that there
was a relationship, whether it lasted till the day they died or not.
Art
>
>
Buster Crab
Re: Gene Raymond FOD Blind Item in "Sweethearts"
arthur...@yahoo.com (Art)
Gene Raymond was gay and that his
marriage to Jeanette MacDonald was
a fraud and that she was in love with
Nelson Eddy---is false.
>Bullshit. I met Nelson Eddy through a
>friend in 1965. We had dinner together
>and my friend, who had business
>dealings with Nelson,
What sort of business dealings?
> brought up Jeanette's name and how
>rough it must have been for Nelson with
>the press after her death, the way they
>hounded him. Nelson's face turned red
>and he got very emotional for a minute.
>He mumbled something
What did he "mumble?" You're posing as an authority, so be specific!
> about Jeanette
>and their lives and then he said, "We
>married the wrong people." Note he said
>WE. Not HE. Meaning, Jeanette married
>the wrong person too.
That may have been his opinion, but
it doesn't explain why they couldn't
have divorced their respective spouses and gotten married.
>>I knew Gene and two of his lifelong
>>friends, and am well-acquainted with
>>the facts of the Raymond-MacDonald
>>relationship. I also know recent
>>MacDonald biographer, Edward Baron
>>Turk. Not once have I ever heard one
>>shred of evidence to support Rich's
>>fantasies.
>Buster is busted! Bea--don't waste your
>keystrokes arguing with this
>guy.
Yeah, how can you argue with someone who knew Raymond and his close
friends
personally?
> He mentions knowing Turk, who wrote a
>completely whitewashed biography of
>Jeanette.
That's a lie. Gene cooperated with Ed Turk and admitted in the book
that he and
Jeanette did have some marital problems
and did talk divorce at one point.
Turk is a PhD who teaches at MIT, not
a demented celebrity-worshiper.
> This should give you a clue. Turk, like
>Buster, simply ignores facts that he can't
>disprove. It is a matter of public record
>(LAPD) that Gene Raymond was
>arrested.
The only record I've seen is the one where they spell the name "Jean
Raymond" and Rich claims that the cops really meant to write "Gene."
> It is a matter of public record (Jeanette's
>will and probate) that they had two
>apartments. A bill for unpaid rent for both
>apartments was brought to court in 1966,
>after Jeanette's death.
So they had two apartments. Does that mean that Gene had his gay lovers
over
for tea?
>Buster never heard one shred of
>evidence? He's read a few shreds in this
>thread and I'm sure he's heard it
>elsewhere.
Everyhing on this thread presented as
"evidence" of Gene's homosexuality and the long-term MacDonald/Eddy
affair
comes from her book.
> Enough living celebrities
>have gone on the record,
Name one.
> supporting the fact that there was a
>relationship, whether it lasted till the day
>they died or not.
They dated before Jeanette met Gene.
and that was the extent of their romantic
relationship. They were incompatible
personalities, Jeanette a Type A diva
and Nelson, laid back and casual. She and Gene were much more alike.
(Raymond was a colonel in the Air Force
and even flew missions in Viet Nam as
a reservist.)
(Are you a member of Sharon Rich's "Mac/Eddy" cult/club?)
Nelson Fan
> Re: Gene Raymond FOD Blind Item in "Sweethearts"
>
>
>
>
> Raymond" and Rich claims that the cops really meant to write "Gene."
>
and it is spelled GENE Raymond. You're obviously making it up about
what "Rich claims."
>
>>>
> >
> > Enough living celebrities
> >have gone on the record,
>
> Name one.
Rise Stevens: "I heard they had a romance and when I met Jeanette,
there was a slight friction there, like 'hands off, he's mine." I was
unaware of what it was at the time, just that she was nervous about
Nelson working with me."
Theodore Uppman (Metropolitan Opera Star), about Nelson: "I know that
he was unhappy with his marriage and she (Ann) was a difficult person
about things for him. He was terribly frustrated and knew that he was
not going to be able to get away from his marriage that easily. And I
knew Jeanette had been involved. I understood it was a very intense
love affair."
>
>
>
> They dated before Jeanette met Gene.
> and that was the extent of their romantic
> relationship. They were incompatible
> personalities, Jeanette a Type A diva
> and Nelson, laid back and casual.
Laid back and casual?
Did you read Shelley Winters autobiography in which she talks about
Nelson trying to rape her?
Did you read the highly acclaimed Frances Marion biography, "Without
Lying Down?" Quote: "Frances was almost fifteen years older than
Nelson, and though that didn't bother her, she had no interest in a
serious romance with a man who still lived with his mother and was
known to have a temper and a drinking problem."
Bea
Buster Crab
nelsone...@yahoo.com (Nelson Fan) wrote:
>>The only record I've seen is the one
>>where they spell the name "Jean
>>Raymond" and Rich claims that the
>>cops really meant to write "Gene."
>Not true. The record was photographed
>and reproduced in "Sweethearts" and it
>is spelled GENE Raymond. You're
>obviously making it up about what "Rich
>claims."
I'll borrow the book and look at it again.
>>> Enough living celebrities
>>>have gone on the record,
>>Name one.
>Rise Stevens: "I heard they had a
>romance and when I met Jeanette, there
>was a slight friction there, like 'hands off,
>he's mine." I was unaware of what it was
>at the time, just that she was nervous
>about Nelson working with me."
Oh, "I heard they had a romance."
That's real verification, yeah.
(and Nelson was upset when she was
teamed with Allan Jones---for professional reasons. Just as likely that
Jeanette
was "nervous" for the same reasons.)
>Theodore Uppman (Metropolitan Opera
>Star), about Nelson: "I know that he was
>unhappy with his marriage and she (Ann)
>was a difficult person about things for
>him. He was terribly frustrated and knew
>that he was not going to be able to get
>away from his marriage that easily. And I
>knew Jeanette had been involved. I
>understood it was a very intense love
>affair."
More hearsay.
My sources are people who actually
knew the Raymonds over a period of decades.
>>They dated before Jeanette met Gene.
>>and that was the extent of their
>>romantic relationship. They were
>>incompatible personalities, Jeanette a
>>Type A diva
>>and Nelson, laid back and casual.
>>Laid back and casual?
>Did you read Shelley Winters
>autobiography in which she talks about
>Nelson trying to rape her?
I was referring to his working method
which used to annoy Jeanette with its
causalness. Eddy didn't take screen
acting seriously. (Source: Philip Castanza's book on the team),
Buster
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"When arguments are premised on lies, there is no
foundation for debate."
Buster Crab
>>The only record I've seen is the one
>>where they spell the name "Jean
>>Raymond" and Rich claims that the
>>cops really meant to write "Gene."
>Not true. The record was photographed
>and reproduced in "Sweethearts" and it
>is spelled GENE Raymond. You're
>obviously making it up about what "Rich
>claims."
I talked this over with another friend of Gene's and she told me that
Rich's first
fraudulent book, "Farewell to Dream"
(of which "Sweethearts" is an upscale
version) had the police record showing
"MISS Gene Raymond." I haven't
checked the version she used in "Sweethearts" yet, but I misremembered
the original one as "Jean Raymond" and
my friend (who knew Gene and Allan Jones even better than I did) told me
it
was written as "Miss Gene Raymond."
