Gay Old Timers?
Le Petomane
James Drury, Bob Cummings, Ty Hardin, Fred Gwynne, Edward Mulhare, and
Martin Milner are listed. I have never heard any gay rumors about any of
these people.
Confirmation anyone?
kjd
D Lewis
>Over at Is She/He Gay? Page Clint Walker, Doug McClure, Glenn Corbett,
>James Drury, Bob Cummings, Ty Hardin, Fred Gwynne, Edward Mulhare, and
>Martin Milner are listed. I have never heard any gay rumors about any of
>these people.
gay porn wasn't cool. (That is, back in the pre-VCR days, when you had to
have a reel-to-reel projector to show your stag films.)
Doug McClure -- I wish! (If I'd been a good-looking guy in Hollywood in the
1950s or 60s.) I consider Doug McClure, James Franciscus and George Peppard
to be the "unmatchable trinity of Hollywood hunks." They were unique in their
attractiveness and screen presence, and I don't think that will ever be
matched...not even by forming a "new trinity" of, say, Ben Affleck, Matt
Damon and ??? Mel Gibson? Hugh Grant? Oh, well. Sad that two of the
"unmatchable trinity" died so young of smoking-related diseases...McClure of
lung cancer and Franciscus of emphysema.
Bob Cummings -- well, he looked fantastic into his 50s...in the mid-1950s
he starred in a TV sitcom about a 40-something bachelor who hangs around
with Rosemary DeCamp and Ann B. Davis...YOU do the math!
Ty Hardin -- I recall seeing an update on Ty Hardin in one of the books in
the "Whatever Became of?" series, and it seems like he's become a born-again,
fundamentalist, Bible-believing Christian who takes great offense at the even
thought that he could have been sexually attracted to Doug McClure, James
Franciscus, or George Peppard. Supposedly word about Ty being gay started
from the theory that only a gay man could have a chest like his. (Note to
those who are *far too young* -- if you have a chance to watch "Palm Springs
Weekend," you can see Ty when his chest was at its peak.) Also, according to
the IMDb, Ty's real name was/is Orson Whipple Hungerford II -- one case in
which the studio did someone a favor by giving them a stage name. (Oops--now
I'm going to get flamed by all the Orsons, Whipples and Hungerfords in a.s.g.)
Elaine Gallant
My hubby keeps saying that Jack Webb was gay and had a crush on Kent
McChord. He could be janking my chain....
Le Petomane wrote in message <37D007...@sd.cybernex.net>...
>Over at Is She/He Gay? Page Clint Walker, Doug McClure, Glenn Corbett,
>James Drury, Bob Cummings, Ty Hardin, Fred Gwynne, Edward Mulhare, and
>Martin Milner are listed. I have never heard any gay rumors about any of
>these people.
>
>Confirmation anyone?
Le Petomane
http://www.insidetheweb.com/mbs.cgi/mb334543
You'll have to go to the 2nd or 3rd page to find this item, entitled:
"Gay on 1950's.60's T.V. Shows."
kjd wrote:
>
> URL--Please!
Le Petomane
>
> Le Petomane <peto...@sd.cybernex.net> writes:
>
> >Over at Is She/He Gay? Page Clint Walker, Doug McClure, Glenn Corbett,
> >James Drury, Bob Cummings, Ty Hardin, Fred Gwynne, Edward Mulhare, and
> >Martin Milner are listed. I have never heard any gay rumors about any of
> >these people.
>
> gay porn wasn't cool. (That is, back in the pre-VCR days, when you had to
> have a reel-to-reel projector to show your stag films.)
<snip>
Are you sure you're not thinking of Chuck Connors? Chuck did a gay porn
with a guy that looked a lot like Aldo Ray.
Stephen Arrants
Mike Cohen <mike3k@NOSPAM_apexmail.com> wrote in message
news:1dxmjmm.18c...@sdn-ar-002flflaup048.dialsprint.net...
> Le Petomane <peto...@sd.cybernex.net> wrote:
>
> >
> > Are you sure you're not thinking of Chuck Connors? Chuck did a gay porn
> > with a guy that looked a lot like Aldo Ray.
>
> used the name Touch Connors.
>
No, that was Mike Connors, of Mannix fame.
D Lewis
> My hubby keeps saying that Jack Webb was gay and had a crush on Kent
>McChord. He could be janking my chain....
Kent McCord.
D Lewis
>Are you sure you're not thinking of Chuck Connors? Chuck did a gay porn
>with a guy that looked a lot like Aldo Ray.
kaan
episode of the Dick Van Dyke murder show, but I didn't see it.
Elaine Gallant
D Lewis wrote in message <5hfcVQW....@delphi.com>...
>"Elaine Gallant" <elaine....@worldnet.att.net> writes:
>
>> My hubby keeps saying that Jack Webb was gay and had a crush on Kent
>>McChord. He could be janking my chain....
>
>Nah, I don't think he was yanking your chain...*everyone* had a crush on
>Kent McCord.
It never really occured to me until seeing him in re-runs that he was
attractive.
Elaine Gallant
kaan wrote in message <37D429FE...@pipeline.com>...
>Any idea what Kent McCord looks like today? I know that he was in an
>episode of the Dick Van Dyke murder show, but I didn't see it.
YES! I saw him in an epi of the new sci-fi, Farscape. He looks FAB.
Gael McGear Sweeney
In article <5hfcVQW....@delphi.com>
D Lewis <denl...@delphi.com> writes:
> > My hubby keeps saying that Jack Webb was gay and had a crush on Kent
> >McChord. He could be janking my chain....
>
> Nah, I don't think he was yanking your chain...*everyone* had a crush on
> Kent McCord.
Gael
Visit My Gael McGear Homepage!
Home of The Poptarts and Knickers in a Twist
http://users.aol.com/gaelmcgear/gaelpage.html
Ask about The Poptarts CD: FRESH OUT OF THE TOASTER!
*To the Toppermost of the Poppermost!*
kjd
he hid his closet deep in the cellar, and it was guarded by Brinks
and several mean Rottweilers.
Podkayne Fries
<elaine....@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
>kaan wrote in message <37D429FE...@pipeline.com>...
>>Any idea what Kent McCord looks like today? I know that he was in an
>>episode of the Dick Van Dyke murder show, but I didn't see it.
>
>
> YES! I saw him in an epi of the new sci-fi, Farscape. He looks FAB.
>
He's been in two episodes so far and looks wonderful! Skiffy repeats
their shows over and over, so check http://www.scifi.com for the
episode names and air dates. Hubba hubba!
--
Regards, Podkayne Fries
"Nothing looks as good on a girl as Navy."
- Kitty, DHARMA AND GREG
cosmo...@webtv.net
don't forget Grandpa Walton, Will Geer.
gorj...@webtv.net
years I've heard Cary Grant was gay and that
he shared a beach house with Randolph.
Also let us not forget Wally Cox.
D Lewis
>years I've heard Cary Grant was gay and that
>he shared a beach house with Randolph.
>Also let us not forget Wally Cox.
shocking... (When Cary and Randolph could have had Paul Lynde over instead.)
Michael Ritchie
I'd like to imagine that, while Grant was making
PHILADELPHIA STORY, he asked Jimmy Stewart (who
was at his sexiest at the time, or maybe it's
just that Katharine Hepburn brought something
out in him) home for an evening of randy fun
with he and Scott.
The pictures of Grant and Scott as roommates are
delightfully campy, but I actually have a hard
time thinking of them as gay. Perhaps they
indulged in the occasional "giving a hard-up
buddy a hand..."
--M.
mslinda
>
> Raymond Burr and James Daly were both old and gay when they died. And
> don't forget Grandpa Walton, Will Geer.
Looks like Dorothy/gorjeous/topprize has morphed into a new identity.
Too bad none of them can quote.
Linda C.
Michael Ritchie
I can hardly wait until she gets around to
"anti-dorothy."
--M.
Lolaheathr
their sixties. It must be that mutant WASP gene.
Le Petomane
>
> Raymond Burr and James Daly were both old and gay when they died. And
> don't forget Grandpa Walton, Will Geer.
I don't think there are more than five of you out there reading this
list that will recognize more than two of these names, but don't forget
that gay sex wasn't invented in our lifetimes:
Dame Judith Anderson, Vilma Banky, Jack Benny, Eric Blore, Louise
Brooks, Jack Buchanan, Spring Byington, Maurice Chevalier, Claudette
Colbert, Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker, Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis,
Sir John Gielgeud, The Two Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart, Sir Nigel
Hawthorne, Richard Hayden, Billie Holliday, Libby Holman, William Hopper
(Hedda's Son), Edward Everett Horton, Van Johnson, Charles Laughton,
Peter Lawford, Marjorie Main, Thomas Mitchell, Agnes Moorhead, Pola
Negri, Ramon Navorro, Edna May Oliver, Maria Ouspenskya, Franklin
Pangborn, Vincent Price, Johnnie Ray, Sir Michael Redgrave, Barbara
Stanwyck, Robert Taylor, Arthur Treacher, Rudolph Valentino, Rudy
Vallee, Conrad Veldt, Michael Wilding, Estille Winwood, Monty Wooley,
and Keenan Wynn.
D Lewis
>Dame Judith Anderson, Vilma Banky, Jack Benny, Eric Blore, Louise
disillusioning. First, I'd always heard that Jack had met Mary when she was
working the cosmetics counter at May Co. in Los Angeles, so that's why I was
so disappointed when May Co. sold their May Florida stores in Jacksonville
to Maison Blanche (which later sold to Gayfers which became Belk's). If I'd
known that Jack had really met Mary through George Burns, I wouldn't have
given a darn about May Co. pulling out of Jacksonville.
Second, A&E reported that Mary came off as rather aloof...though the
acquaintances interviewed on Biography attributed that to her feelings of
insecurity. She had such a warm voice on the clips I've heard of her on the
radio with Benny that that was another disillusionment.
>Sir John Gielgeud, The Two Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart, Sir Nigel
men in Hollywood of all time. If he's interested in a "younger" man...
Michael Ritchie
>
> I don't think there are more than five of you out there reading this
> list that will recognize more than two of these names, but don't forget
> that gay sex wasn't invented in our lifetimes:
>
> Colbert, Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker, Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis,
> (Hedda's Son), Edward Everett Horton, Van Johnson, Charles Laughton,
> Peter Lawford, Marjorie Main, Thomas Mitchell, Agnes Moorhead, Pola
> Negri, Ramon Navorro, Edna May Oliver, Maria Ouspenskya, Franklin
> Pangborn, Vincent Price, Johnnie Ray, Sir Michael Redgrave, Barbara
> Stanwyck, Robert Taylor, Arthur Treacher, Rudolph Valentino, Rudy
> Vallee, Conrad Veldt, Michael Wilding, Estille Winwood, Monty Wooley,
> and Keenan Wynn.
I know them all except William Hopper. Do I get a
prize?
--M., who wishes more Monty Wooley movies were
available on tape
MLYoung
>list that will recognize more than two of these names, but don't forget
>that gay sex wasn't invented in our lifetimes:
Recognize all and have questions about
a few:
>
>Dame Judith Anderson, Vilma Banky, Jack Benny,
What's the story there?
>Eric Blore,
Louise Brooks,
Read her bio and her autobio. She
mentions having experimented a
couple of time, but always had a
thing for men. Said something like
Madonna--that she was a gay man
in a woman's body.
Jack Buchanan, Spring Byington, Maurice Chevalier
What's the story here? He slept
his way to the top, but with the female
Mistinguette.
>Claudette Colbert
FWIW, she did deny this in Vanity
Fair a year or so before she died.
, Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker, Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis,
>Sir John Gielgeud, The Two Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart, Sir Nigel
>Hawthorne, Richard Hayden, Billie Holliday,
Libby Holman, William Hopper
>(Hedda's Son), Edward Everett Horton, Van Johnson
At least bi, there's a story about his
shaving his girlfriend's pubes in
More Havoc.
, Charles Laughton,
>Peter Lawford,
Thought he was a voracious womanizer--
reknowned sleezebag.
--margaret
Marjorie Main, Thomas Mitchell, Agnes Moorhead, Pola
>Negri, Ramon Navorro,
Edna May Oliver, Maria Ouspenskya, Franklin
>Pangborn, Vincent Price, Johnnie Ray, Sir Michael Redgrave, Barbara
>Stanwyck, Robert Taylor, Arthur Treacher, Rudolph Valentino, Rudy
>Vallee, Conrad Veldt, Michael Wilding, Estille Winwood, Monty Wooley,
>and Keenan Wynn.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Subject: Re: Gay Old Timers?
>Path:
>lobby!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!howland.erols.net!newsfe
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MLYoung
>prize?
>
>--M., who wishes more Monty Wooley movies were
>available on tape
>
He was a Yale drama professor before
incarnating as the Robert Benchley
character on Broadway in the Man
Who Came to Dinner. There's hope
for you, Michael--just grow a long beard
and sport a monacle.
--margaret
Edward Swanson
In article <37DBCB...@sd.cybernex.net>, Le Petomane
<peto...@sd.cybernex.net> wrote:
> cosmo...@webtv.net wrote:
>>
>> Raymond Burr and James Daly were both old and gay when they died. And
>> don't forget Grandpa Walton, Will Geer.
>
> I don't think there are more than five of you out there reading this
> list that will recognize more than two of these names, but don't forget
> that gay sex wasn't invented in our lifetimes:
>
> Dame Judith Anderson, Vilma Banky, Jack Benny, Eric Blore, Louise
> Brooks, Jack Buchanan, Spring Byington, Maurice Chevalier, Claudette
> Colbert,
Constance Collier,
> Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker, Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis,
> Sir John Gielgeud, The Two Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart, Sir Nigel
> Hawthorne, Richard Hayden, Billie Holliday, Libby Holman, William Hopper
> (Hedda's Son), Edward Everett Horton, Van Johnson, Charles Laughton,
> Peter Lawford, Marjorie Main, Thomas Mitchell, Agnes Moorhead, Pola
Michael Ritchie
>
> >I know them all except William Hopper. Do I get a
> >prize?
> >
> >--M., who wishes more Monty Wooley movies were
> >available on tape
>
> He was a Yale drama professor before
> incarnating as the Robert Benchley
> character
Actually, it's the Alexander Woolcott
character.
> in the Man Who Came to Dinner.
Margaret, you know how I hate to point out
error, but if you re-read my post above, you
will note that I am quite familiar with
Monty Wooley--MAN WHO CAME TO DINNER is one
of my favorite movies, even if Bette Davis is
slightly miscast (and the guy who plays her
love interest is possibly the worst actor
in a studio movie ever). So is THE BISHOP'S
WIFE, where Wooley plays a crusty old atheist
with a heart of gold. I'd like to see
THE PIED PIPER and AS YOUNG AS YOU FEEL.
The person I didn't know was William Hopper, who
is apparently Hedda Hopper's son, but I have
no idea why else he might be famous.
--M.
Michael Ritchie
>
> >I don't think there are more than five of you out there reading this
> >list that will recognize more than two of these names, but don't forget
> >that gay sex wasn't invented in our lifetimes:
>
> a few:
Actually, I think many of the names on that list
are more bisexual than flat-out gay, and in
the strictest sense of the word, very few of
them probably identified themselves as gay.
--M.
Essex9999
>The person I didn't know was William Hopper, who
>is apparently Hedda Hopper's son, but I have
>no idea why else he might be famous.
He played private dick Paul Drake on the old Perry Mason TV show (i.e. the one
from the '50's and early '60's, not the much later one where the delectable
William R. Moses played a similar role).
--Steve
Her Highness The Pink Princess
>I don't think there are more than five of you out there reading this
>list that will recognize more than two of these names, but don't forget
>that gay sex wasn't invented in our lifetimes:
>
>Dame Judith Anderson, Vilma Banky, Jack Benny, Eric Blore, Louise
>Brooks, Jack Buchanan, Spring Byington, Maurice Chevalier, Claudette
>Colbert, Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker, Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis,
>Sir John Gielgeud, The Two Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart, Sir Nigel
>Hawthorne, Richard Hayden, Billie Holliday, Libby Holman, William Hopper
>(Hedda's Son), Edward Everett Horton, Van Johnson, Charles Laughton,
>Peter Lawford, Marjorie Main, Thomas Mitchell, Agnes Moorhead, Pola
>Negri, Ramon Navorro, Edna May Oliver, Maria Ouspenskya, Franklin
>Pangborn, Vincent Price, Johnnie Ray, Sir Michael Redgrave, Barbara
>Stanwyck, Robert Taylor, Arthur Treacher, Rudolph Valentino, Rudy
>Vallee, Conrad Veldt, Michael Wilding, Estille Winwood, Monty Wooley,
>and Keenan Wynn.
>
I recognize all but 5. Do I get a prize? Is it Godiva?
Reigning and Deigning
Pink Wishes
The Princess \^*^*^/
http://www.FacemakersIncorporated.com
Glam! Bam! Thank you, Ma'am:
http://www.geocities.com/broadway/3060
Her Highness The Pink Princess
<mrit...@columbus.rr.com> writes:
>I know them all except William Hopper. Do I get a
>prize?
>
Think: Perry Mason, dahling. He was his assistant, or something. Rather tall,
built, (for the 50s), and I think dirty blonde hair.
Charles Crossman
<peto...@sd.cybernex.net> wrote:
>cosmo...@webtv.net wrote:
>>
>> Raymond Burr and James Daly were both old and gay when they died. And
>> don't forget Grandpa Walton, Will Geer.
>
>I don't think there are more than five of you out there reading this
>list that will recognize more than two of these names, but don't forget
>that gay sex wasn't invented in our lifetimes:
>
>Dame Judith Anderson, Vilma Banky, Jack Benny,
Ooh! I didn't know this before.
Eric Blore, Louise
>Brooks, Jack Buchanan, Spring Byington, Maurice Chevalier, Claudette
>Colbert, Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker,
Okay, darlings - who is Albert Dekker?
Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis,
>Sir John Gielgeud, The Two Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart, Sir Nigel
>Hawthorne, Richard Hayden, Billie Holliday, Libby Holman, William Hopper
>(Hedda's Son), Edward Everett Horton, Van Johnson, Charles Laughton,
>Peter Lawford, Marjorie Main, Thomas Mitchell, Agnes Moorhead, Pola
>Negri, Ramon Navorro, Edna May Oliver, Maria Ouspenskya, Franklin
>Pangborn, Vincent Price, Johnnie Ray, Sir Michael Redgrave, Barbara
>Stanwyck, Robert Taylor, Arthur Treacher, Rudolph Valentino, Rudy
>Vallee, Conrad Veldt, Michael Wilding, Estille Winwood, Monty Wooley,
>and Keenan Wynn.
Oh what a fabulous list!
Sending Hugs,
{{{{{LCM}}}}}
Centre of the Known Universe
"Love is a bowl of vomit,
and you, my dear, are a chunky bit."
MLYoung
>> incarnating as the Robert Benchley
>> character
>
>Actually, it's the Alexander Woolcott
>character.
Oops. You're right, of course.
>
>> in the Man Who Came to Dinner.
>
>Margaret, you know how I hate to point out
>error, but if you re-read my post above, you
>will note that I am quite familiar with
>Monty Wooley--MAN WHO CAME TO DINNER is one
>of my favorite movies, even if Bette Davis is
>slightly miscast (and the guy who plays her
>love interest is possibly the worst actor
>in a studio movie ever). So is THE
Did I say you weren't? I was simply
adding a couple of facts about
it being Woolley's breakthrough role--
on Broadway before the film.
And suggesting the addition of a
beard and a monacle to your persona.
--margaret
BISHOP'S
>WIFE, where Wooley plays a crusty old atheist
>with a heart of gold. I'd like to see
>THE PIED PIPER and AS YOUNG AS YOU FEEL.
>
>The person I didn't know was William Hopper, who
>is apparently Hedda Hopper's son, but I have
>no idea why else he might be famous.
>
>--M.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Subject: Re: Gay Old Timers?
>Path:
>lobby!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!news.compuserve.com!news
-master.compuserve.com!newsfeed.enteract.com!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!newsfe
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>Message-ID: <37DC05C9...@columbus.rr.com>
>From: Michael Ritchie mrit...@columbus.rr.com
>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win95; I)
>X-Accept-Language: en
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Newsgroups: alt.showbiz.gossip
>References:
Michael Ritchie
> I was simply
> adding a couple of facts about
> it being Woolley's breakthrough role--
> on Broadway before the film.
>
> And suggesting the addition of a
> beard and a monacle to your persona.
Yikes! What exactly do you see as my persona?
--M., who kinda has a goatee, but who
otherwise looks nothing like, and acts
very little like, Wooley
Edward Swanson
In article <37DCE924...@columbus.rr.com>, Michael Ritchie
<mrit...@columbus.rr.com> wrote:
What's an "acle", as in "monacle" (one acle)?
Vidiot
> Okay, darlings - who is Albert Dekker?
>-------------------<snip>-------------------<
He was best known as a bizarre mad scientist in the 1940 horror classic DR.
CYCLOPS. Weird bald guy with bulging eyes, and exuded a very odd attitude --
but maybe that was just for the role.
On the other hand, maybe there was more going on behind his weird portrayal.
From writer Hal Erickson's bio of Dekker on allmovie.com:
"In May of 1968, Dekker was found strangled to death in his Hollywood home.
His naked body was bound hand and foot, a hypodermic needle was jammed into
each arm, and obscenities were scrawled all over the corpse. At first, it
seemed that Dekker was a closet homosexual who had committed suicide (early
reports suggested that the writings on his body were his bad movie reviews)
or had died while having rough sex. While the kinky particulars of the case
were never officially explained, it was finally ruled that Albert Dekker had
died of accidental asphyxiation."
So there probably was something going on with Dekker after all.
Meanwhile: am I the only one who thinks there must've been some interesting
after-hours parties going on on the PERRY MASON set, between Raymond Burr and
William Hopper? Hmmmmm.
Word in the late 1960s was that Hopper drank himself to death, never able to
really come to terms with his lifestyle. Sad story.
--Vidiot
Le Petomane
>
> >I don't think there are more than five of you out there reading this
> >list that will recognize more than two of these names, but don't forget
> >that gay sex wasn't invented in our lifetimes:
>
>
> What's the story here? He slept
> his way to the top, but with the female
> Mistinguette.
He had a long-time affair with one of his servants. Can't remember
if it was his chauffeur or valet.
>
> >Claudette Colbert
>
> FWIW, she did deny this in Vanity
> Fair a year or so before she died.
That came from an article in The Advocate, 3/31/98.
> >Peter Lawford,
>
> Thought he was a voracious womanizer--
> reknowned sleezebag.
>
Until his later life, when he couldn't perform due to too much booze,
Peter Lawford was a tri-sexual. He'd try anything! He was so horny he'd
screw the crack of dawn. Among his conquests were Sal Mineo, Van
Johnson, Robert Taylor, Tyrone Power, Farley Grander, June Allison and
Lana Turner.
There's also a rumor he did Bobby Kennedy.
MLYoung
>
>> I was simply
>> adding a couple of facts about
>> it being Woolley's breakthrough role--
>> on Broadway before the film.
>>
>> And suggesting the addition of a
>> beard and a monacle to your persona.
>
>Yikes! What exactly do you see as my persona?
Gay college prof. I thought the beard
and monacle could be easily managed:
- 0~
V
There. You can go with that one for
years--it ages well.
--margaret
BlondeBBWinNJ
<snippage>
> The person I didn't know was William Hopper, who
> is apparently Hedda Hopper's son, but I have
> no idea why else he might be famous.
>
> --M.
His claim to fame was as Paul Drake - Perry Mason's private detective.
Pamela
Michael Ritchie
>
> >Yikes! What exactly do you see as my persona?
>
> Gay college prof. I thought the beard
> and monacle could be easily managed:
>
> - 0~
> V
>
> There. You can go with that one for
> years--it ages well.
Cool. I like it. But I don't think
even *I* have the panache to carry off
a monacle. Maybe I'll just get a tweed
jacket?
--M.
MLYoung
>>
>> Thought he was a voracious womanizer--
>> reknowned sleezebag.
>>
>
>Until his later life, when he couldn't perform due to too much booze,
>Peter Lawford was a tri-sexual. He'd try anything! He was so horny he'd
>screw the crack of dawn.
Ah, like Errol Flynn, then. Wasn't
it Shelley Winters who said Flynn would
screw a knothole?
Among his conquests were Sal Mineo, Van
>Johnson, Robert Taylor, Tyrone Power, Farley Grander, June Allison and
>Lana Turner.
>
>There's also a rumor he did Bobby Kennedy.
One hopes. Thanks for the details.
--margaret
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Subject: Re: Gay Old Timers?
>Path:
>lobby!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!news.compuserve.com!news
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ED!not-for-mail
>Message-ID: <37DD66...@sd.cybernex.net>
>From: Le Petomane
Gael McGear Sweeney
Michael Ritchie <mrit...@columbus.rr.com> writes:
> The person I didn't know was William Hopper, who
> is apparently Hedda Hopper's son, but I have
> no idea why else he might be famous.
Wasn't he a regular on "Perry Mason"? That must have been the gayest
set in TV until "Bewitched" came along!
Gael
Visit My Gael McGear Homepage!
Home of The Poptarts and Knickers in a Twist
http://users.aol.com/gaelmcgear/gaelpage.html
Ask about The Poptarts CD: FRESH OUT OF THE TOASTER!
*To the Toppermost of the Poppermost!*
Gael McGear Sweeney
Michael Ritchie <mrit...@columbus.rr.com> writes:
>> Dame Judith Anderson,
See Boze Hadleigh's "Hollywood Lesbians" for an hilarious interview
with Dame Judith -- she literally throws him out the door when he
starts asking "those" questions!
>>Vilma Banky,
>>Jack Benny,
Wonderful article about Jack in "Making Things Perfectly Queer" by
Alexander Doty -- great book.
>> Eric Blore, Louise Brooks, Jack Buchanan, Spring Byington, Maurice Chevalier,
>>Claudette Colbert,
Claudette left her estate to a "long time female companion" -- heck,
that's not even CODE anymore!
Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker, Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis,
> > Sir John Gielgeud, The Two Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart, Sir Nigel
> > Hawthorne, Richard Hayden, Billie Holliday, Libby Holman, William Hopper
> > (Hedda's Son), Edward Everett Horton,
>>Van Johnson,
See Ned Wynn (son of Keenan) and his book "We Have Always Lived in
Beverly Hills" for the dope on Van. Van and Keenan (see below -- I'd
have to reserve judegment on him) were best pals -- until Van ran off
with Keenan's wife and basically took over the family and left Keenan
very bitter and the Wynn boys miserable. Then, after quite a long
marriage, Edie Wynn Johnson walked in on Van and one of the chorus boys
when he was doing dinner theater somewhere! The book never hints
anything about Keenan Wynn, though. Perhaps that's why he was so upset!
>>Charles Laughton, Peter Lawford, Marjorie Main, Thomas Mitchell,
Agnes Moorhead, Pola Negri, Ramon Navorro, Edna May Oliver, Maria
Ouspenskya, Franklin Pangborn,
>>Vincent Price
And his "lovely wife, the actress Coral Browne."
>> Johnnie Ray, Sir Michael Redgrave, Barbara
>> Stanwyck, Robert Taylor, Arthur Treacher, Rudolph Valentino, Rudy
>> Vallee, Conrad Veldt, Michael Wilding,
>>Estelle Winwood,
Long-term relationship with Tallulah!
And Patsy Kelly -- off and on relationship with Tallulah!
Monty Wooley,
> > and Keenan Wynn.
You've forgotten Caesar Romero! And Cary and Randolph!
And here's one NO ONE will remember: Lilyan Tashman! Supposedly the
"most glamorous woman in Hollywood" during the late Twenties and early
Thirties -- William Haines said so!
And, of course, Billy Haines.
MLYoung
Hmmm:
###V###
# ##*## #
# ##*## #
# ##*## #
A bit sweaterlike, but ASCII has
its limitations.
--margaret
>
>--M.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Subject: Re: Gay Old Timers?
>Path:
>lobby!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!news.compuserve.com!news
-master.compuserve.com!newsfeed.enteract.com!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!newsfe
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>Message-ID: <37DDBD43...@columbus.rr.com>
Her Highness The Pink Princess
<mrit...@columbus.rr.com> writes:
>
>Cool. I like it. But I don't think
>even *I* have the panache to carry off
>a monacle. Maybe I'll just get a tweed
>jacket?
>
>--M.
It can't be very good for that delicate under eye skin, perhaps a pince-nez?
Buster Crab
wrote:
>Dame Judith Anderson,
> Vilma Banky,
Nope. She and her husband Rod La Rocque were the epitome of the long
term successful marriage of actors in Hollywood.
> Jack Benny, Eric Blore, Louise Brooks,
>Jack Buchanan, Spring Byington,
>Maurice Chevalier, Claudette Colbert,
>Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker,
>Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis, Sir John Gielgeud,
>The Two
>Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart,
Stewart Granger's real name was James Stewart and what's the dope on
him? Never heard anything myself.
> Sir Nigel Hawthorne, Richard Hayden,
>Billie Holliday, Libby Holman, William
>Hopper (Hedda's Son), Edward Everett
>Horton, Van Johnson, Charles Laughton,
>Peter Lawford, Marjorie Main
>Thomas Mitchell
Gerald O'Hara? Never!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"I should have been a pair of ragged claws
scuttling across the floors of silent seas."
--T.S. Eliot
"The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock."
See a picture of me at:
http://www.busterthecrab.com/
Michael Ritchie
>
> > Vilma Banky,
>
> Nope. She and her husband Rod La Rocque were the epitome of the long
> term successful marriage of actors in Hollywood.
Of course, so are Paul Newman and Joanne Woodward, and
someday the Cruises and Travoltas may join those
ranks. If your point is that one can't be part
of a long-term marriage and be gay (or bi) at
the same time, your in the wrong ng, baby.
--M.
Le Petomane
>
> Nope. She and her husband Rod La Rocque were the epitome of the long
> term successful marriage of actors in Hollywood.
A marriage of convenience. Rod La Rocque and first-time director Cedric
Gibbons were removed from the MGM picture"Tarzan and his Mate" after an
on-set fling in 1933. The only thing that saved their reputations was
that La Rocque was married to Banky and Gibbons was married to Delores
Del Rio. See Boze Hadleigh's "Hollywood Gays."
BTW, I I haven't heard the name, Vilma Banky, spoken since Johnny Carson
left the air.
> > Jack Benny, Eric Blore, Louise Brooks,
> >Jack Buchanan, Spring Byington,
> >Maurice Chevalier, Claudette Colbert,
> >Sir Noel Coward, Albert Dekker,
> >Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis, Sir John Gielgeud,
>
> >The Two
> >Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart,
>
> Stewart Granger's real name was James Stewart and what's the dope on
> him? Never heard anything myself.
Romantic lead, once married to Jean Simmons, was bisexual. Made it with
Michael Wilding, once married to Elizabeth Taylor.
>
> >Thomas Mitchell
>
> Gerald O'Hara? Never!
Yes, Scarlett's father was a poof. Said so himself.
- Pierre Le Petomane
MLYoung
>Gibbons were removed from the MGM picture"Tarzan and his Mate" after an
>on-set fling in 1933. The only thing that saved their reputations was
>that La Rocque was married to Banky and Gibbons was married to Delores
>Del Rio. See Boze Hadleigh's "Hollywood Gays."
According to David Niven, Del Rio and
Gibbons had separate bedrooms, one
on top of the others. When Gibbons
was interested, he'd tap from above
and climb down a ladder. In keeping
with this theme, the house was filled
with climbing plants . . . Cedric, of
course, was responsible for all those
gorgeous Paramount sets in the 1930s.
--margaret
Michael Ritchie
>
> Cedric, of
> course, was responsible for all those
> gorgeous Paramount sets in the 1930s.
You mean MGM. He worked exclusively
at the studio from 1924 into the Fifties.
His contract gave him offical credit as art
director on virtually every MGM release,
whether or not he actually supervised the
work. He was still being given credit
as late as FORBIDDEN PLANET, in 1956,
though I doubt he had anything to do
with those sets.
--M.
Buster Crab
>Buster Crab wrote:
>>Vilma Banky,
>>Nope. She and her husband Rod La
>>Rocque were the epitome of the long
>>term successful marriage of actors in
>>Hollywood.
>Of course, so are Paul Newman and
>Joanne Woodward, and someday the
>Cruises and Travoltas may join those
>ranks. If your point is that one can't be
>part of a long-term marriage and be gay
>(or bi) at the same time, your in the
>wrong ng, baby.
No, that's not my point, Mikey, I'm aware of the theory and practice of
beard marriages.
I have *knowledge* of "old Hollywood" because I was fortunate enough to
have become friends with some of the last remaining stalwarts of that
period before they passed on.
The Banky-LaRocque marriage was conventional. I believe I would have
heard if there was anything to the contrary. (It's one of my regrets
that I never managed to meet Vilma, who was alive into the early 90s)
My sources were very candid, as for example concerning Cesar Romero,
who was known as "Butch" within the Hollywood community. "Yes, Butch is
gay," said one of my late pals, who was a friend of Romero.
But thanks for your thought that I don't belong in this ng. It's rather
belated after over 2 years, but finally an ASG regular got around to
telling this old Webboon he's a misfit here. Gives me a warm feeling of
solidarity with my fellow Webbies. :)
I may take ya up on it, but I want to wait until after the Bush
landslide. I can't wait to see how JJ and Marge spin it. Guess they'll
call it fascist coup.
MLYoung
>>
>> Cedric, of
>> course, was responsible for all those
>> gorgeous Paramount sets in the 1930s.
>
>You mean MGM.
Whoa, really? Damn, I could have
sworn it was a bunch of a Paramount
movies. Oh, well. On the other hand,
I'm sure I've got some version of the
David Niven thing right.
--margaret
He worked exclusively
>at the studio from 1924 into the Fifties.
>His contract gave him offical credit as art
>director on virtually every MGM release,
>whether or not he actually supervised the
>work. He was still being given credit
>as late as FORBIDDEN PLANET, in 1956,
>though I doubt he had anything to do
>with those sets.
>
>--M.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Subject: Re: Gay Old Timers?
>Path:
>lobby!newstf02.news.aol.com!portc02.blue.aol.com!howland.erols.net!newsfe
ed.direct.ca!nntp.cs.ubc.ca!cyclone.rdc-detw.rr.com!news.mw.mediaone.net!c
yclone.columbus.rr.com!viper.POSTED!not-for-mail
>Message-ID: <37DEFF8E...@columbus.rr.com>
>From: Michael Ritchie mrit...@columbus.rr.com
>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.51 [en] (Win95; I)
>X-Accept-Language: en
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Newsgroups: alt.showbiz.gossip
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><19990914195240...@ng-fo1.aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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>Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999
Peep...@webtv.net
<<I may take ya up on it, but I want to wait until after the Bush
landslide. I can't wait to see how JJ and Marge spin it. Guess they'll
call it fascist coup.>>
Here's a preview of coming attractions to
bind tight both La Cieka's & Miss Lonelyheart's girdles:
From "The Wall Street Journal"
by Paul Gigot
Maybe Newt Gingrich wasn't wrong about impeachment helping Republicans,
just premature.
At least that's one way to explain Asa Hutchinson's thousand-dollar tie.
The lanky Arkansan, one of the most prominent and passionate of the
House impeachment managers, was supposed to be a dead incumbent walking.
But there he was recently, the main draw at a Bell County, Texas,
Republican dinner. His hosts were raising money with a five-and-dime
auction and they asked Mr. Hutchinson for something to sell.
"I said, 'Well, sure, I'm wearing the same tie I wore during the
impeachment of William Jefferson Clinton,' " says the congressman. "And
they just go bananas."
His cravat finally sold for $1,200 to a man of no other discernable
mental defect. "My wife said, 'Don't give 'em any more!' " says Mr.
Hutchinson, who also shook hands with well-wishers lined up 12-deep.
Yes, this is just an anecdote. And there's no accounting for taste in
neckwear. But the tale nicely illuminates the backlash politics of
impeachment now obvious across the land.
Republicans may have failed to remove Mr. Clinton. But six months later
their willingness to try has helped them win the battle to define his
presidency. The biggest impeachment losers to date--William Ginsburg
excepted--are Democrats who put their ethics in a blind Clinton trust.
The House managers certainly don't look worried these days. California's
Jim Rogan, the manager with the least-safe seat, has become the hottest
GOP draw not named Bush. For his May re-election announcement rally, Mr.
Rogan expected about 400 people. "We stopped counting at 1,500 RSVPs,"
he says, and 2,700 showed up.
Two years ago his campaign donor list was 3,000; now it's more than
20,000. Democrats say he's a goner, but he's banked more than $1 million
already, and the national GOP recently sent out a fund-raising letter
under his signature.
Messrs. Rogan and Hutchinson have joined South Carolina colleague
Lindsey Graham as star attractions even in the precincts of yuppie,
anything-goes Seattle.
"Talking to our district workers and even our major donors, I kind of
felt people out about whether they'd be a draw," says King County GOP
chairman Reed Davis, who invited them, "and it was Paul, George and
Ringo."
This isn't just GOP spin. A July poll by the Pew Research Center found
that support for impeachment has risen to 44% from just 35% last
December. More voters now think Monica's paramour should have resigned
(35%) than thought so in December (30%). And more voters now say their
congressman should be re-elected if he voted for impeachment (57%) than
if he voted against (52%).
All of which supports those who thought Mr. Clinton's survival in office
wasn't proof of national moral decay. Voters thought removal from office
was too politically upsetting, especially amid an economic boom. Yet
now, with impeachment past but the scoundrel present, America's
conscience is reasserting itself.
And it is taking its revenge out on his Democratic defenders, especially
the president's ethics red cap, Al Gore. Liberal pollster Celinda Lake
says the scandals have operated with a time-release political fuse.
"Democrats paid a big price," she says. "It has diminished our
credibility on morality."
One reason may be the way events of the last six months, both national
and Clintonian, have tended to ratify impeachment. Juanita Broaddrick
went public, Judge Susan Webber Wright held the president in contempt
for lying under oath (fining him $90,000) and the Cox report revealed a
White House willing to sit on spying reports for political gain.
Meanwhile, the Columbine massacre reinforced the sense of American moral
decline, along with Mr. Clinton's hilarious implausibility as a moral
leader.
In her June survey with Republican Ed Goeas, Ms. Lake found Republicans
leading Democrats by a whopping 41 percentage points, or 57%-16%, on the
issue of "restoring moral values." This values deficit is so large it
trumps the Democrats' advantage on health care, education and
entitlements.
It's even worse for poor Mr. Gore. George W. Bush and Bill Bradley are
both tagging him with the Scarlet "I" for impeachment without ever
mentioning the word. They don't have to. Mr. Bradley says, "Every little
lie erodes trust invisibly, like acid rain," while Mr. Bush promises to
"show that politics, after a time of tarnished ideals, can be higher and
better."
Jimmy Carter rarely mentioned Watergate either, but voters got the
point. And now so does Mr. Clinton, whose every public appearance has
become a personal cheerleading session for his own legacy, and for the
veep who called him the second-coming of Lincoln. He knows that if Mr.
Gore loses in 2000, he'll get (and deserve) much of the blame.
Maybe there's a larger, hopeful lesson here--namely, that politicians
can ignore the polls, do the right thing and still prosper. Democrats,
on the other hand, must feel like Al Pacino in "The Godfather III": Just
when they thought they'd be free of Mr. Clinton, he drags them back down
with him.
--
After two decades of the "Reagan Revolution", isn't it time to support a
Liberal for President?
W A R R E N B E A T T Y I N 2 0 0 0
http://beatty4president.org
http://www.beatty2000.com
----------------------------------
(-)> *peep* (-)> *peep* (-)> *muckmouth*
Buster Crab
>Whoa, really? Damn, I could have
>sworn it was a bunch of a Paramount
>movies. Oh, well. On the other hand,
>I'm sure I've got some version of the
>David Niven thing right.
Paramount's designer was the equally talented Hans Dreier.
Buster Crab
wrote:
>>>Vilma Banky,
>>Nope. She and her husband Rod La
>>Rocque were the epitome of the long
>>term successful marriage of actors in
>>Hollywood.
>A marriage of convenience.
For 42 years? And what "convenience?"
Vilma's career ended in 1930 when her think Hungarian accent impaired
her ability to project sexuality in sound films....she had been
Valentino's leading lady in three silent pictures.
La Rocque also was a stiff as a talking romantic lead, and ended up with
a minor career as a secondary character actor. So he turned,
successfully, to real estate.
There would have been no professional reason for either spouse to
perpetuate a beard marriage for 42 years (La Rocque died in 1969, Vilma
in 1991)
> Rod La Rocque and first-time director
>Cedric Gibbons were removed from the
>MGM picture"Tarzan and his Mate" after
>an on-set fling in 1933.
Cedric Gibbons was trying to make the transition to director and he was
removed for incompetence, though he remains credited as co-director.
Michael Ritchie
>
> There would have been no professional reason for either spouse to
> perpetuate a beard marriage for 42 years (La Rocque died in 1969, Vilma
> in 1991)
Unless they actually felt affection for
each other, as in the case of Charles
Laughton and Elsa Lanchester.
--M.
Buster Crab
Well, yes, but Laughton was a star up to the day he died and Lanchester
was very active in character parts and on the stage,
whereas Banky was retired for 39 years of their 42 year marriage, and La
Rocque phased out his minor sound era career in favor of real estate.
So the Laughtons did have a professional reason to maintain a facade.
I don't deny, however, that a beard marriage might also be an
affectionate one.
(Vilma once had some fun at the expense of a line of dialogue in SUNSET
BOULEVARD, where William Holden looks at Norma Desmond's pool and says
that "Vilma Banky and Rod La Rocque must have swum there." Vilma said,
"Rod and I had a good laugh at that, because I can't swim.")
MLYoung
>each other, as in the case of Charles
>Laughton and Elsa Lanchester.
>
And, it sounds, Vincent Price and
Coral Browne.
--margaret
Her Highness The Pink Princess
mly...@aol.comZAPTHIS (MLYoung) writes:
While some of these bearding situations may be purely monitary, like David and
Claudia, I think many others may be based on genuine affection, and account for
the relationship staying intact, beyond the time necessary to promote the image
of hetness. As one ages friendship, and companionship, become more important
than sex. At least I have heard so, from catty.
{{{{{LCM}}}}}
Princess) wrote:
>In article <19990916021618...@ng-fp1.aol.com>,
>mly...@aol.comZAPTHIS (MLYoung) writes:
>
>>>Unless they actually felt affection for
>>>each other, as in the case of Charles
>>>Laughton and Elsa Lanchester.
>>>
>>>--M.
>>
>>And, it sounds, Vincent Price and
>>Coral Browne.
>>
>>--margaret
>
>While some of these bearding situations may be purely monitary, like David and
>Claudia, I think many others may be based on genuine affection, and account for
>the relationship staying intact, beyond the time necessary to promote the image
>of hetness. As one ages friendship, and companionship, become more important
>than sex. At least I have heard so, from catty.
>
>Reigning and Deigning
>
>Pink Wishes
>The Princess \^*^*^/
Much more important, darling - I agree. Sex is sex, and it's something
you can pretty much do by yourself or pay for - but everything else
depends on a willing other. In a way it seems sad to think of a
pretend marriage - but if you see two people growing old happily
together, that isn't sad. That's a blessing. People find their
happiness where they can - but hopefully the days are nearly here
where true love is something *everyone* can feel proud of. Oh dear.
Listen to me. I sound like Mary Woolworth or something. Oh well,
bugger it, darling. Pour us another drink and we'll bitch another
mile.
Sending Hugs,
{{{{{LCM}}}}}
Centre of the Known Universe
"Love is a bowl of vomit,
and you, my dear, are a chunky bit."
David Migicovsky
<37e1920f...@news1.pei.sympatico.ca>...
> >While some of these bearding situations may be purely monitary, like
David and
> >Claudia, I think many others may be based on genuine affection, and
account for
> >the relationship staying intact, beyond the time necessary to promote
the image
> >of hetness. As one ages friendship, and companionship, become more
important
> >than sex. At least I have heard so, from catty.
> >
>
> Much more important, darling - I agree. Sex is sex, and it's something
> you can pretty much do by yourself or pay for - but everything else
> depends on a willing other. In a way it seems sad to think of a
> pretend marriage - but if you see two people growing old happily
> together, that isn't sad. That's a blessing.
How cruel of you to mention that to Princess. All the people she could have
grown old together with were killed during the flood.
TheWanderer
gswe...@mailbox.syr.edu (Gael McGear Sweeney) wrote:
> In article <37DBDCB3...@columbus.rr.com>
> Michael Ritchie <mrit...@columbus.rr.com> writes:
>
> >> Dame Judith Anderson,
>
> See Boze Hadleigh's "Hollywood Lesbians" for an hilarious interview
> with Dame Judith -- she literally throws him out the door when he
> starts asking "those" questions!
>
> >>Vilma Banky,
>
> >>Jack Benny,
>
> Wonderful article about Jack in "Making Things Perfectly Queer" by
> Alexander Doty -- great book.
>
Chevalier,
>
> >>Claudette Colbert,
>
> that's not even CODE anymore!
>
> Sir Noel Coward,
Another one <<barely>> in the closet...
Albert Dekker, Denholm Elliot, Kay Francis,
> > > Sir John Gielgeud, The Two Granger Boys: Farley and Stewart, Sir
Nigel
> > > Hawthorne, Richard Hayden, Billie Holliday, Libby Holman, William
Hopper
> > > (Hedda's Son), Edward Everett Horton,
>
> >>Van Johnson,
>
> See Ned Wynn (son of Keenan) and his book "We Have Always Lived in
> Beverly Hills" for the dope on Van. Van and Keenan (see below -- I'd
> have to reserve judegment on him) were best pals -- until Van ran off
> with Keenan's wife and basically took over the family and left Keenan
> very bitter and the Wynn boys miserable. Then, after quite a long
> marriage, Edie Wynn Johnson walked in on Van and one of the chorus
boys
> when he was doing dinner theater somewhere! The book never hints
> anything about Keenan Wynn, though. Perhaps that's why he was so
upset!
>
> >>Charles Laughton, Peter Lawford, Marjorie Main, Thomas Mitchell,
> Agnes Moorhead, Pola Negri, Ramon Navorro, Edna May Oliver, Maria
> Ouspenskya, Franklin Pangborn,
>
> >>Vincent Price
>
> And his "lovely wife, the actress Coral Browne."
>
> >> Johnnie Ray, Sir Michael Redgrave,
Barbara
> >> Stanwyck,
Barbara? I am not so shocked as much as I have no info -- any
references?
Robert Taylor, Arthur Treacher, Rudolph Valentino, Rudy
> >> Vallee, Conrad Veldt, Michael Wilding,
>
> >>Estelle Winwood,
>
> Long-term relationship with Tallulah!
>
> And Patsy Kelly -- off and on relationship with Tallulah!
>
> Monty Wooley,
> > > and Keenan Wynn.
>
> You've forgotten Caesar Romero! And Cary and Randolph!
>
> And here's one NO ONE will remember: Lilyan Tashman! Supposedly the
> "most glamorous woman in Hollywood" during the late Twenties and early
> Thirties -- William Haines said so!
>
> And, of course, Billy Haines.
>
> Gael
I always knew I would get some great info out of this NG one day...
----------------------------------------------------------------
TheWanderer
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
TheWanderer
peto...@sd.cybernex.net wrote:
> MLYoung wrote:
> >
(snip)
> > >Peter Lawford,
> >
> > Thought he was a voracious womanizer--
> > reknowned sleezebag.
> >
>
> Until his later life, when he couldn't perform due to too much booze,
> Peter Lawford was a tri-sexual. He'd try anything! He was so horny
he'd
> screw the crack of dawn. Among his conquests were Sal Mineo, Van
> Johnson, Robert Taylor, Tyrone Power, Farley Grander, June Allison and
> Lana Turner.
>
> There's also a rumor he did Bobby Kennedy.
>
Whatta guy! A shame that Viagra wasn't around then --
--
ra...@dis.net.au
cannot happen between gays and straights. I know several couples (some
have children) who are mixed in this way and their relationships have
been long and supportive with each aware of the other's orientation.
Razz - love knows no gender
{{{{{LCM}}}}} wrote:
>
> On 16 Sep 1999 17:00:02 GMT, princ...@aol.com (Her Highness The Pink
> Princess) wrote:
>
> >In article <19990916021618...@ng-fp1.aol.com>,
> >mly...@aol.comZAPTHIS (MLYoung) writes:
> >
> >>>Unless they actually felt affection for
> >>>each other, as in the case of Charles
> >>>Laughton and Elsa Lanchester.
> >>>
> >>>--M.
> >>
> >>And, it sounds, Vincent Price and
> >>Coral Browne.
> >>
> >>--margaret
> >
> >While some of these bearding situations may be purely monitary, like David and
> >Claudia, I think many others may be based on genuine affection, and account for
> >the relationship staying intact, beyond the time necessary to promote the image
> >of hetness. As one ages friendship, and companionship, become more important
> >than sex. At least I have heard so, from catty.
> >
> >Reigning and Deigning
> >
> >Pink Wishes
> >The Princess \^*^*^/
>
> Much more important, darling - I agree. Sex is sex, and it's something
> you can pretty much do by yourself or pay for - but everything else
> depends on a willing other. In a way it seems sad to think of a
> pretend marriage - but if you see two people growing old happily
Her Highness The Pink Princess
charles....@pei.sympatico.ca ({{{{{LCM}}}}}) writes:
>Much more important, darling - I agree. Sex is sex, and it's something
>you can pretty much do by yourself or pay for - but everything else
>depends on a willing other. In a way it seems sad to think of a
>pretend marriage - but if you see two people growing old happily
>together, that isn't sad. That's a blessing. People find their
>happiness where they can
^^^^^^^^^^PINKing shear snippage^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Let's see, *I* find my happiness in doing kind things for others, Godiva,
jewelry, and puppies, you find yours in a bottle and David finds his in a, um,
well, we all know what David's happiness lies in.
Reigning and Deigning
Pink Wishes
The Princess \^*^*^/
http://www.FacemakersIncorporated.com
Her Highness The Pink Princess
>I don't understand why people cannot believe true love and affection
>cannot happen between gays and straights. I know several couples (some
>have children) who are mixed in this way and their relationships have
>been long and supportive with each aware of the other's orientation.
>
>Razz - love knows no gender
You are right, dahling, and I blame sex. People are so indentured to the sex
act, and base so many things in their life on the finding, getting, and
securing a sex partner, that they lose sight of the *other* 23 hours and 40
minutes of a day.
Among my circle I have seen sex impede love. A man who felt that he couldn't
marry a girl, because she was "the wrong size", and a woman who found the love
of her life, but sent him away, because he was 20 years younger. Sexual
stereotypes are responsible for both these tragedies, and our societal
addiction to the idea that Love should conform to some mythalogical ideal.
Happily *I* am unfettered by the need to conform to the common herd's ideas of
right and wrong, so I have a very happy life. And, really, *that* is what
really is important, now, isn't it?
Callen Molenda
>
> I don't understand why people cannot believe true love and affection
> cannot happen between gays and straights. I know several couples (some
> have children) who are mixed in this way and their relationships have
> been long and supportive with each aware of the other's orientation.
>
> Razz - love knows no gender
Razz? Is that really you? So tender, so deep, so, not Razz. :-)
C.
>
> {{{{{LCM}}}}} wrote:
> >
> > On 16 Sep 1999 17:00:02 GMT, princ...@aol.com (Her Highness The Pink
> > Princess) wrote:
> >
> > >In article <19990916021618...@ng-fp1.aol.com>,
> > >mly...@aol.comZAPTHIS (MLYoung) writes:
> > >
> > >>>Unless they actually felt affection for
> > >>>each other, as in the case of Charles
> > >>>Laughton and Elsa Lanchester.
> > >>>
> > >>>--M.
> > >>
> > >>And, it sounds, Vincent Price and
> > >>Coral Browne.
> > >>
> > >>--margaret
> > >
> > >While some of these bearding situations may be purely monitary, like David and
> > >Claudia, I think many others may be based on genuine affection, and account for
> > >the relationship staying intact, beyond the time necessary to promote the image
> > >of hetness. As one ages friendship, and companionship, become more important
> > >than sex. At least I have heard so, from catty.
> > >
> > >Reigning and Deigning
> > >
> > >Pink Wishes
> > >The Princess \^*^*^/
> >
> > Much more important, darling - I agree. Sex is sex, and it's something
> > you can pretty much do by yourself or pay for - but everything else
> > depends on a willing other. In a way it seems sad to think of a
> > pretend marriage - but if you see two people growing old happily
> > together, that isn't sad. That's a blessing. People find their
MLYoung
>cannot happen between gays and straights. I know several couples (some
>have children) who are mixed in this way and their relationships have
>been long and supportive with each aware of the other's orientation.
>Razz - love knows no gender
Um, but does that mean we're going
to have to start saying nice things
about Tom and Nicole?
--margaret
Michael Ritchie
>
> I don't understand why people cannot believe true love and affection
> cannot happen between gays and straights. I know several couples (some
> have children) who are mixed in this way and their relationships have
> been long and supportive with each aware of the other's orientation.
But if they are still seeking out intimacy with
others, then do they really have "true love"? I
love and have affection for many women, and have
even had physical relationships with some, but
there is still that intangible *something*,
involving both emotional and physical intimacy
that I've never quite felt with a woman.
--M.
Michael Ritchie
>
> I think you're perhaps confusing love ansd sex, Michael. Intimacy is
> possible without sex. Of course, it's undeniably better when you have
> both together.
What it really comes down to is your definition of
that much-abused phrase "true love." So when you say:
> > > I don't understand why people cannot believe true love and affection
> > > cannot happen between gays and straights.
I still respond:
> > But if they are still seeking out intimacy with
> > others, then do they really have "true love"?
Whether or not that intimacy involves sex or
love.
--M.
ra...@dis.net.au
I think you're perhaps confusing love ansd sex, Michael. Intimacy is
possible without sex. Of course, it's undeniably better when you have
both together.
Razz - who's been fortunate that way
Michael Ritchie wrote:
>
> ra...@dis.net.au wrote:
> >
> > I don't understand why people cannot believe true love and affection
> > cannot happen between gays and straights. I know several couples (some
> > have children) who are mixed in this way and their relationships have
> > been long and supportive with each aware of the other's orientation.
>
> But if they are still seeking out intimacy with
ra...@dis.net.au
Possibly not, but in most cases it'll do until the real thing comes along.
Razz - who does understand the difference between a fuck and love
Michael Ritchie wrote:
>
> ra...@dis.net.au wrote:
> >
> > I think you're perhaps confusing love ansd sex, Michael. Intimacy is
> > possible without sex. Of course, it's undeniably better when you have
> > both together.
>
> What it really comes down to is your definition of
> that much-abused phrase "true love." So when you say:
>
> > > > I don't understand why people cannot believe true love and affection
> > > > cannot happen between gays and straights.
>
> I still respond:
>
> > > But if they are still seeking out intimacy with
> > > others, then do they really have "true love"?
>
David Migicovsky
<37E2A772...@columbus.rr.com>...
> ra...@dis.net.au wrote:
> >
> > I don't understand why people cannot believe true love and affection
> > have children) who are mixed in this way and their relationships have
> > been long and supportive with each aware of the other's orientation.
>
> love and have affection for many women, and have
> even had physical relationships with some, but
> there is still that intangible *something*,
> involving both emotional and physical intimacy
> that I've never quite felt with a woman.
>
I didn't take Razz' meaning as "true love," but as real love, of the sort
you were mentioning.
