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ASSTR & ASSLR
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sfmaster
Jan 30, 2023, 7:36:40 AM1/30/23
to
I've had a very fascinating time for the last two weeks engaging in amateur Net sleuthing regarding the reappearance of asstr.org. Unfortunately, we are no closer to knowing who is running the site or why, and who is paying for it.
As I've written, I think it's it's a DOJ ruse to get incest/pedo authors; and I'm not posting there and I advise others not to either. But that hasn't stopped everyone. There was a lot of incest/pedo fiction in the last two weeks, but now there seems to be more regular erotica.
Attn Some Dude: It's been months since we last heard from you. With the reappearance of asstr are you still going ahead with asslr?
With all of the issues that have been posted here by both me & Santayana your vaguely worded post on asslr must be specified: Are you going to forbid incest/pedo: a simple yes or no will do.
Given everything that has happened politically; and the Mind Control Archive purging their content, I think this is right thing to do.
sfmaster (at) att.net
As I've written, I think it's it's a DOJ ruse to get incest/pedo authors; and I'm not posting there and I advise others not to either. But that hasn't stopped everyone. There was a lot of incest/pedo fiction in the last two weeks, but now there seems to be more regular erotica.
Attn Some Dude: It's been months since we last heard from you. With the reappearance of asstr are you still going ahead with asslr?
With all of the issues that have been posted here by both me & Santayana your vaguely worded post on asslr must be specified: Are you going to forbid incest/pedo: a simple yes or no will do.
Given everything that has happened politically; and the Mind Control Archive purging their content, I think this is right thing to do.
sfmaster (at) att.net
Santayana
Jan 30, 2023, 5:07:09 PM1/30/23
to
On Mon, 30 Jan 2023 04:36:36 -0800 (PST), sfmaster <adult...@gmail.com>
said in Message-ID: <dab347df-ed1d-423c...@googlegroups.com>:
> I've had a very fascinating time for the last two weeks engaging in
> amateur Net sleuthing regarding the reappearance of asstr.org.
> Unfortunately, we are no closer to knowing who is running the site or why,
> and who is paying for it.
I don't think that is going to change anytime soon.
> As I've written, I think it's it's a DOJ ruse to get incest/pedo authors;
> and I'm not posting there and I advise others not to either. But that
> hasn't stopped everyone. There was a lot of incest/pedo fiction in the
> last two weeks, but now there seems to be more regular erotica.
Somehow, I'm not really surprised that no one listened. The level of denial
in here is literally off the charts. No one is listening to either of us,
and that's ok -- people have the right NOT to listen, just as we have the
right to speak out and warn people.
All we can do is watch and wait to see if anything happens. I've done my
level best to see that there aren't any more Frank McCoys and Thomas Arthurs.
If people wish to continue to dwell in a world of fantasy where underage
fiction is covered by the First Amendment, despite decades of court precedent,
to the contrary; and further, that somehow they will somehow not be singled-
out for prosecution, that is their right to do so.
> Attn Some Dude: It's been months since we last heard from you. With the
> reappearance of asstr are you still going ahead with asslr?
He has already put some significant work into this, so I would be surprised
if he chose to abandon it at this stage.
> With all of the issues that have been posted here by both me & Santayana
> your vaguely worded post on asslr must be specified: Are you going to
> forbid incest/pedo: a simple yes or no will do.
He is on the horns of a dilemma here -- my impression is that he is rather
reluctant to do so, because as a number of people have pointed out, ASSLR
would then be little different than other, already-existing archive sites.
Furthermore, some posters, like Admiral Cartwright, have stated point-blank,
that they will boycott any site that censors in any way.
Regardless of which decision he makes, ASSLR will still very likely be a
target for law-enforcement in any case.
> Given everything that has happened politically; and the Mind Control
> Archive purging their content, I think this is right thing to do.
Perhaps so. It would be interesting to find out, on just what basis the
decision was made to purge their content. One has to wonder if this was
based on legal advice they received?
That is a decision that he is going to have to make for himself, as running
a site is now a higher risk-proposition than it might have been prior to the
McCoy-Arthur convictions. Even strict adherence to an attorney's advice is
not, in any way, a guarantee that one will not be investigated/prosecuted
regardless.
> sfmaster (at) att.net
Santayana
said in Message-ID: <dab347df-ed1d-423c...@googlegroups.com>:
> I've had a very fascinating time for the last two weeks engaging in
> amateur Net sleuthing regarding the reappearance of asstr.org.
> Unfortunately, we are no closer to knowing who is running the site or why,
> and who is paying for it.
> As I've written, I think it's it's a DOJ ruse to get incest/pedo authors;
> and I'm not posting there and I advise others not to either. But that
> hasn't stopped everyone. There was a lot of incest/pedo fiction in the
> last two weeks, but now there seems to be more regular erotica.
in here is literally off the charts. No one is listening to either of us,
and that's ok -- people have the right NOT to listen, just as we have the
right to speak out and warn people.
All we can do is watch and wait to see if anything happens. I've done my
level best to see that there aren't any more Frank McCoys and Thomas Arthurs.
If people wish to continue to dwell in a world of fantasy where underage
fiction is covered by the First Amendment, despite decades of court precedent,
to the contrary; and further, that somehow they will somehow not be singled-
out for prosecution, that is their right to do so.
> Attn Some Dude: It's been months since we last heard from you. With the
> reappearance of asstr are you still going ahead with asslr?
if he chose to abandon it at this stage.
> With all of the issues that have been posted here by both me & Santayana
> your vaguely worded post on asslr must be specified: Are you going to
> forbid incest/pedo: a simple yes or no will do.
reluctant to do so, because as a number of people have pointed out, ASSLR
would then be little different than other, already-existing archive sites.
Furthermore, some posters, like Admiral Cartwright, have stated point-blank,
that they will boycott any site that censors in any way.
Regardless of which decision he makes, ASSLR will still very likely be a
target for law-enforcement in any case.
> Given everything that has happened politically; and the Mind Control
> Archive purging their content, I think this is right thing to do.
decision was made to purge their content. One has to wonder if this was
based on legal advice they received?
That is a decision that he is going to have to make for himself, as running
a site is now a higher risk-proposition than it might have been prior to the
McCoy-Arthur convictions. Even strict adherence to an attorney's advice is
not, in any way, a guarantee that one will not be investigated/prosecuted
regardless.
> sfmaster (at) att.net
Santayana
sfmaster
Jan 31, 2023, 6:20:32 AM1/31/23
to
I thought (wrongly) that the PC Revolution would lead to greater knowledge and learning.
Instead, it gave the perfect tool to every crackpot group to meet, trade conspiracy theories, leading us to where we are today.
(Sigh) :(
What separates me from most of the folks writing online porn has been my letter writing for the men's magazines back in the 1980s. I had to deal with editors, conform to guidelines, and accept that sometimes they would do a little rewriting. It was nice to receive a check, and then a free copy of the magazine a few months later.
My parents ran a Stationary Store from 1957 to 1972; and sold men's magazines. They would return porn paperbacks to the magazine distributor (Sigh); and sell Playboy, Penthouse, etc. And my Mom was a free speech advocate.
Growing up, I was forbidden to read comics since they had "ruined my older brother"; so I quickly graduated to first spy novels (I did a book report on "Casino Royale" in 7th grade); and then Science Fiction in May 1973.
Once, on my best day, when I got a total of $150. in checks, my Mom said "OK Hemingway, now you can take me to lunch." :)
I would come home from my IT job, eat dinner, attend to the home front, and then go upstairs and bang out letters on my Royal Manual. I even had a postal scale so I didn't have to go to the Post Office. I would buy two spare ribbons at a time.
I was following a path that many SF authors had done before me. Read the essay "How I Became a Pornographer" by Robert Silverberg.
sfmaster
Jan 31, 2023, 2:38:44 PM1/31/23
to
IMHO he is "defending the indefensible."
Santayana
Feb 4, 2023, 10:23:01 AM2/4/23
to
On Tue, 31 Jan 2023 03:20:27 -0800 (PST), sfmaster <adult...@gmail.com>
said in Message-ID: <1fd87ed0-f083-4f6c...@googlegroups.com>:
> Sadly, Denialism is everywhere these days. Election, Holocaust, 9/11; the
> Moon Landing; UFOs; Smoking; Covid; the list is endless. When I bought my
> first PC and went online back in 1996 I said to myself "We don't have the
> Starship Enterprise, but we do have the Library Computer", and I could be
> active in SF Forums; write Erotica, and have knowledge instantly available.
>
> I thought (wrongly) that the PC Revolution would lead to greater knowledge
> and learning.
I had the same thoughts as well. I remember when the Cypherpunks were formed
in the early 1990s, and the heady sense of optimism that crypto-anarchy was
just around the corner. I didn't buy into all of it, by any means, but I'd
really thought that perhaps we were about to enter a golden age of privacy.
> Instead, it gave the perfect tool to every crackpot group to meet, trade
> conspiracy theories, leading us to where we are today.
> (Sigh)
Indeed. It's not these people I'm worried about, frankly -- it's government.
Rather than a golden age of privacy, we're now experiencing a golden age of
surveillance. Like someone said: "We're /all/ East Germans, now."
Over in the European Union (EU), the most alarming thing is the so-called
'chatcontrol' proposal:
July 6, 2021
Brussels, 06/07/2021 – Today, the European Parliament approved the
ePrivacy Derogation, allowing providers of e-mail and messaging
services to automatically search all personal messages of each
citizen for presumed suspect content and report suspected cases to
the police. The European Pirates Delegation in the Greens/EFA group
strongly condemns this automated mass surveillance, which effectively
means the end of privacy in digital correspondence. Pirate Party MEPs
plan to take legal action.
In today’s vote, 537 Members of the European Parliament approved
Chatcontrol, with 133 voting against and 20 abstentions.[1] According
to police data, in the vast majority of cases, innocent citizens come
under suspicion of having committed an offence due to unreliable
processes. In a recent representative poll, 72% of EU citizens opposed
general monitoring of their messages.[2] While providers will initially
have a choice to search or not to search communications, follow-up
legislation, expected in autumn, is to oblige all communications service
providers to indiscriminate screening.
[1][2] https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/poll-72-of-citizens-oppose-eu-plans-to-search-all-private-messages-for-allegedly-illegal-material-and-report-to-the-police/
The vote on /mandatory/ surveillance of communications is coming up in the
next few months (May?). This is why I use the techniques that I do, to make
sure that my communications are not being surveilled.
> What separates me from most of the folks writing online porn has been my
> letter writing for the men's magazines back in the 1980s. I had to deal
> with editors, conform to guidelines, and accept that sometimes they would
> do a little rewriting. It was nice to receive a check, and then a free
> copy of the magazine a few months later.
>
> My parents ran a Stationary Store from 1957 to 1972; and sold men's magazines.
> They would return porn paperbacks to the magazine distributor (Sigh); and
> sell Playboy, Penthouse, etc. And my Mom was a free speech advocate.
Unfortunately, many 'free speech' advocates draw the line at what they like.
> Growing up, I was forbidden to read comics since they had "ruined my older
> brother"; so I quickly graduated to first spy novels (I did a book report
> on "Casino Royale" in 7th grade); and then Science Fiction in May 1973.
I was never forbidden to read comics, we just couldn't afford them. (I well-
remember when the price doubled from 6¢ to 12¢ -- we were scandalized!)
So, I used to go to friends' houses to read their comics -- some of them had
collections that were a metre high, if piled together. Thinking back now,
what strikes me most are the ads that were in the back of the comics. There
were /so/ many ads for bodybuilding courses, equipment, and naturally, self-
defense. It occurs to me now that a very high percentage of the kids who
read comics were bullied, likely at school.
> Once, on my best day, when I got a total of $150. in checks, my Mom said
> "OK Hemingway, now you can take me to lunch."
Better she did that, than frown on your efforts. If I had done something
like that, I would never have heard the end of it. She likely would have
referred to it as 'dirty money'. (She wouldn't allow such magazines in the
house -- it was like growing up under the watchful eye of the Stasi.)
> I would come home from my IT job, eat dinner, attend to the home front, and
> then go upstairs and bang out letters on my Royal Manual. I even had a
> postal scale so I didn't have to go to the Post Office. I would buy two
> spare ribbons at a time.
>
> I was following a path that many SF authors had done before me. Read the
> essay "How I Became a Pornographer" by Robert Silverberg.
Both Silverberg and yourself apparently lived in far more liberal households
than the one I grew up in.
Santayana
--
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it"
-- Santayana
"The United States is a nation of laws: badly written and randomly enforced."
-- Frank Zappa
"Obscenity laws belong in the dustbin of history along with hoop-skirts,
celluloid collars and buggy-whips. I find it incredible that in the 21st
Century, we are _still_ trying to enforce morality laws drafted in the
19th Century!" -- Baal
PGP Keys:
RSA - https://keys.openpgp.org/vks/v1/by-fingerprint/A0F4EFD84216E884290ECE5ACA09B23284F3DA0E
ECC - https://keys.openpgp.org/vks/v1/by-fingerprint/8F13BB9AEE9B9D5CDB12B3FFADA1AB7816F39273
said in Message-ID: <1fd87ed0-f083-4f6c...@googlegroups.com>:
> Sadly, Denialism is everywhere these days. Election, Holocaust, 9/11; the
> Moon Landing; UFOs; Smoking; Covid; the list is endless. When I bought my
> first PC and went online back in 1996 I said to myself "We don't have the
> Starship Enterprise, but we do have the Library Computer", and I could be
> active in SF Forums; write Erotica, and have knowledge instantly available.
>
> I thought (wrongly) that the PC Revolution would lead to greater knowledge
> and learning.
in the early 1990s, and the heady sense of optimism that crypto-anarchy was
just around the corner. I didn't buy into all of it, by any means, but I'd
really thought that perhaps we were about to enter a golden age of privacy.
> Instead, it gave the perfect tool to every crackpot group to meet, trade
> conspiracy theories, leading us to where we are today.
> (Sigh)
Rather than a golden age of privacy, we're now experiencing a golden age of
surveillance. Like someone said: "We're /all/ East Germans, now."
Over in the European Union (EU), the most alarming thing is the so-called
'chatcontrol' proposal:
July 6, 2021
Brussels, 06/07/2021 – Today, the European Parliament approved the
ePrivacy Derogation, allowing providers of e-mail and messaging
services to automatically search all personal messages of each
citizen for presumed suspect content and report suspected cases to
the police. The European Pirates Delegation in the Greens/EFA group
strongly condemns this automated mass surveillance, which effectively
means the end of privacy in digital correspondence. Pirate Party MEPs
plan to take legal action.
In today’s vote, 537 Members of the European Parliament approved
Chatcontrol, with 133 voting against and 20 abstentions.[1] According
to police data, in the vast majority of cases, innocent citizens come
under suspicion of having committed an offence due to unreliable
processes. In a recent representative poll, 72% of EU citizens opposed
general monitoring of their messages.[2] While providers will initially
have a choice to search or not to search communications, follow-up
legislation, expected in autumn, is to oblige all communications service
providers to indiscriminate screening.
[1][2] https://www.patrick-breyer.de/en/poll-72-of-citizens-oppose-eu-plans-to-search-all-private-messages-for-allegedly-illegal-material-and-report-to-the-police/
The vote on /mandatory/ surveillance of communications is coming up in the
next few months (May?). This is why I use the techniques that I do, to make
sure that my communications are not being surveilled.
> What separates me from most of the folks writing online porn has been my
> letter writing for the men's magazines back in the 1980s. I had to deal
> with editors, conform to guidelines, and accept that sometimes they would
> do a little rewriting. It was nice to receive a check, and then a free
> copy of the magazine a few months later.
>
> My parents ran a Stationary Store from 1957 to 1972; and sold men's magazines.
> They would return porn paperbacks to the magazine distributor (Sigh); and
> sell Playboy, Penthouse, etc. And my Mom was a free speech advocate.
> Growing up, I was forbidden to read comics since they had "ruined my older
> brother"; so I quickly graduated to first spy novels (I did a book report
> on "Casino Royale" in 7th grade); and then Science Fiction in May 1973.
remember when the price doubled from 6¢ to 12¢ -- we were scandalized!)
So, I used to go to friends' houses to read their comics -- some of them had
collections that were a metre high, if piled together. Thinking back now,
what strikes me most are the ads that were in the back of the comics. There
were /so/ many ads for bodybuilding courses, equipment, and naturally, self-
defense. It occurs to me now that a very high percentage of the kids who
read comics were bullied, likely at school.
> Once, on my best day, when I got a total of $150. in checks, my Mom said
> "OK Hemingway, now you can take me to lunch."
like that, I would never have heard the end of it. She likely would have
referred to it as 'dirty money'. (She wouldn't allow such magazines in the
house -- it was like growing up under the watchful eye of the Stasi.)
> I would come home from my IT job, eat dinner, attend to the home front, and
> then go upstairs and bang out letters on my Royal Manual. I even had a
> postal scale so I didn't have to go to the Post Office. I would buy two
> spare ribbons at a time.
>
> I was following a path that many SF authors had done before me. Read the
> essay "How I Became a Pornographer" by Robert Silverberg.
than the one I grew up in.
Santayana
--
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it"
-- Santayana
"The United States is a nation of laws: badly written and randomly enforced."
-- Frank Zappa
"Obscenity laws belong in the dustbin of history along with hoop-skirts,
celluloid collars and buggy-whips. I find it incredible that in the 21st
Century, we are _still_ trying to enforce morality laws drafted in the
19th Century!" -- Baal
PGP Keys:
RSA - https://keys.openpgp.org/vks/v1/by-fingerprint/A0F4EFD84216E884290ECE5ACA09B23284F3DA0E
ECC - https://keys.openpgp.org/vks/v1/by-fingerprint/8F13BB9AEE9B9D5CDB12B3FFADA1AB7816F39273
sfmaster
Feb 4, 2023, 6:19:55 PM2/4/23
to
Any extra money was welcome - whether it was from working overtime at the computer center, or banging out letters to the men's magazines. Since my parents had sold plenty of copies of the men's magazines in the store, writing fiction for them was no big deal.
Many times I'd come home from work and Mom would have bought me a ream of typing paper, manila envelopes, carbon paper, liquid paper, and postage stamps - which would generate income. (Hard to buy things when I would work until midnight)
Saturday morning, after breakfast and a few cartoons, I would take Mom out shopping (she didn't drive). Then, after lunch, I would go up to my bedroom, and the sound of typewriter keys meant money.
Now that's discipline!
sfmaster(at) att.net
Santayana
Feb 4, 2023, 8:48:25 PM2/4/23
to
<2023020415225...@fleegle.mixmin.net> <e73f76df-1768-412e...@googlegroups.com>
On Sat, 4 Feb 2023 15:19:52 -0800 (PST), sfmaster <adult...@gmail.com> said
in Message-ID: <e73f76df-1768-412e...@googlegroups.com>:
>>> Once, on my best day, when I got a total of $150. in checks, my Mom
>>> said "OK Hemingway, now you can take me to lunch."
>>
> Any extra money was welcome - whether it was from working overtime at the
> computer center, or banging out letters to the men's magazines. Since my
> parents had sold plenty of copies of the men's magazines in the store,
> writing fiction for them was no big deal.
You have to understand that I come from an ethnic background that is
staunchly religious; my mother was, to be painfully blunt, brainwashed by
the Church. Her loyalty to the Church over-rode literally everything else.
(I left the Church at 16, and have not set foot in there for decades.)
I'm telling you this, because based on your reply, I wonder if I may have
come across as somewhat negative to what you were doing; if that was the
case, please accept my apology -- it was not my intent. You did not have to
justify what you were doing, or why. Given my background, if I had tried to
do something similar to what you did, I would have been booted-out, without
any hesitation whatsoever.
> Many times I'd come home from work and Mom would have bought me a ream of
> typing paper, manila envelopes, carbon paper, liquid paper, and postage
> stamps - which would generate income. (Hard to buy things when I would
> work until midnight)
>
> Saturday morning, after breakfast and a few cartoons, I would take Mom out
> shopping (she didn't drive). Then, after lunch, I would go up to my
> bedroom, and the sound of typewriter keys meant money.
>
> Now that's discipline!
You got a great start!
> sfmaster(at) att.net
On Sat, 4 Feb 2023 15:19:52 -0800 (PST), sfmaster <adult...@gmail.com> said
in Message-ID: <e73f76df-1768-412e...@googlegroups.com>:
>>> Once, on my best day, when I got a total of $150. in checks, my Mom
>>> said "OK Hemingway, now you can take me to lunch."
>>
>> Better she did that, than frown on your efforts. If I had done something
>> like that, I would never have heard the end of it. She likely would have
>> referred to it as 'dirty money'. (She wouldn't allow such magazines in
>> the house -- it was like growing up under the watchful eye of the
>> Stasi.)
>
>> like that, I would never have heard the end of it. She likely would have
>> referred to it as 'dirty money'. (She wouldn't allow such magazines in
>> the house -- it was like growing up under the watchful eye of the
>> Stasi.)
>
> In 1972 my parents closed the stationary store when it became unprofitable
> and too much trouble to stay in business. In 1975 my Dad died of heart
> disease. From 1975 to 1981 our main goal in life was to keep the house
> and put me through college (We did both). After I got out of school and
> started working we sat down twice a month to do the household bills and I
> made my contribution - and put money away at the same time.
That was rough; my upbringing was somewhat similar.
> and too much trouble to stay in business. In 1975 my Dad died of heart
> disease. From 1975 to 1981 our main goal in life was to keep the house
> and put me through college (We did both). After I got out of school and
> started working we sat down twice a month to do the household bills and I
> made my contribution - and put money away at the same time.
> Any extra money was welcome - whether it was from working overtime at the
> computer center, or banging out letters to the men's magazines. Since my
> parents had sold plenty of copies of the men's magazines in the store,
> writing fiction for them was no big deal.
staunchly religious; my mother was, to be painfully blunt, brainwashed by
the Church. Her loyalty to the Church over-rode literally everything else.
(I left the Church at 16, and have not set foot in there for decades.)
I'm telling you this, because based on your reply, I wonder if I may have
come across as somewhat negative to what you were doing; if that was the
case, please accept my apology -- it was not my intent. You did not have to
justify what you were doing, or why. Given my background, if I had tried to
do something similar to what you did, I would have been booted-out, without
any hesitation whatsoever.
> Many times I'd come home from work and Mom would have bought me a ream of
> typing paper, manila envelopes, carbon paper, liquid paper, and postage
> stamps - which would generate income. (Hard to buy things when I would
> work until midnight)
>
> Saturday morning, after breakfast and a few cartoons, I would take Mom out
> shopping (she didn't drive). Then, after lunch, I would go up to my
> bedroom, and the sound of typewriter keys meant money.
>
> Now that's discipline!
> sfmaster(at) att.net
Joseph Young
Feb 7, 2023, 5:32:30 PM2/7/23
to
If there is a crackdown on sites with pedo stories, why has Nifty never gone down as far as I am aware. I don't check it regularly, but I have never had an issue when I go there
sfmaster
Feb 17, 2023, 6:53:41 PM2/17/23
to
On Tuesday, February 7, 2023 at 5:32:30 PM UTC-5, Joseph Young wrote:
> If there is a crackdown on sites with pedo stories, why has Nifty never gone down as far as I am aware. I don't check it regularly, but I have never had an issue when I go there
I cannot speak for NIFTY, and I have my two Janet novels posted there.
> If there is a crackdown on sites with pedo stories, why has Nifty never gone down as far as I am aware. I don't check it regularly, but I have never had an issue when I go there
But I'll bet with all of the political activity going on, he will purge the site same as The Mind Control Archive.
sfmaster (at) att.net
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