Masterguard smoke and heat detectors
Steve
representative of Masterguard hosted it. Videos on fire safety were
shown. Lots of statistics were presented. All of it is to prepare
you to have to have the presenter visit your home for a free home
survey. The survey included a quote for a "Full Protection" system,
which for my home listed at $3720!!! The system included 4 mechanical
heat detectors, 8 photoelectric smoke detectors, one CO detector and 2
2.5# extinguishers.
Though their equipment was represented to be the best available, no
objective data was given to supports the claims. Does anyone out
there know of any such data? Data that compares Masterguard
photoelectric detectors to the much less expensive ones available in
many home centers. First Alert's Double Sensor, which has both
photoelectric and ionization detectors, for example. Any others that
should be considered?
Another thing that bothers me about their system is that it is not
connected. Each detector is standalone. It seems to me that a
connected system would be preferable, as it would alert you no matter
where a fire may start and give you the best chance of getting out
early. The representative said that he would rather know where the
fire is. Am I missing something in my thinking?
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Steve
Jeff Jonas
>representative of Masterguard hosted it.
Looking at their web site
http://www.masterguard.com/fire-extinguishers.html
I'm pleased to see the fire extinguishers they sell are Coast Guard approved
since that's a high standard. But no mfgr name is given
and you can buy such fire extinguishers from many manufacturers.
Sadly, the really good Halon fire extinguishers are no longer available.
Halon does not cause any further damage,
unlike the chemical extinguishers that Masterguard's selling.
That was important to me when an engine belt caught fire
(no further damage to the engine, which ran fine after cooling)
and why I keep Halon units in my kitchen.
Fireboy and other mfgrs used to have booths at boat shows
demonstrating their self activating fire suppression systems.
I share your concern that nothing's integrated.
It's all stuff you can buy yourself.
I'd like to see more self-activating units so fires are suppressed
even if you're not home.
They're a "National Fire Protection Assoc" member,
but I see no endorsements from fire departments.
> and 2 2.5# extinguishers.
That seems small. I have larger ones in my apartment.
--
Jeffrey Jonas
jeffj@panix(dot)com
The original Dr. JCL and Mr .hide
Robert L Bass
For the quoted price you could buy a professionally installed security and
fire alarm that would protect every window and door in a 3-4,000 sf home,
including motion detection, magnetic contacts, glass breaks, smoke
detectors, etc.
Also note that (1) the mechanical heat detectors are literally
spring-loaded, *wind-up* devices. They are prohibited from being labeled or
used as Life Safety devices as they are incapable of rendering early warning
against smoke -- the primary cause of death in residential fires. They are
also *not* interconnected. Each one is a stand alone, mechanical mechanism.
They are no louder than a wind up alarm clock. When one goes off at the far
end of the house sleeping family members will be unlikely to hear it.
The company making and selling these systems has been sued by the US
government for their deceptive sales tactics, by state attorneys general in
several places, etc.
They are under a mandatory order to stop holding these useless wind-up toys
as fire alarms.
Ummm, other than that they make great door stops.
"Steve" <dadd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2319c424.0204...@posting.google.com...
Doug Salisbury
Depot or Lowe's.
Robert L Bass
selling for a ridiculous amount of money is incapable of protecting your
home and family. It is not a UL Listed *Life Safety* (note those last two
words are absolutely critical here) device. It is illegal to represent it
as a fire alarm product or accessory.
This is not a matter of one brand vs. another. This is a USDA inspected
Grade A rip-off. They throw in a few cheap smoke detectors and a couple of
$6 fire extinguishers too small to put out anything more than a trash can
fire to make it sound like a "comprehensive" alarm system.
Also, for what they are charging you can get a full scale burglar and fire
alarm to properly protect a very large home.
"Doug Salisbury" <dssal...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:JYLq8.14022$nt1.1...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
m..leuck
"Robert L Bass" <rober...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:sXMq8.404406$uv5.34...@bin6.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
Robert L Bass
What was the name of that crook who uses Patton's e-mail and claims to be
someone else?
"m..leuck" <m.l....@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:x4Nq8.218421$q2.19451@sccrnsc01...
Steve
"junk" at an inflated price. No one has given any suggestions as to
where to find objective test data for Masterguard or any other smoke
detectors. Or sources for quality detectors at a reasonable price.
How do I find a reputable alarm company to supply and/or install a
system? I would like hard data. Where can I get it?
TIA,
Steve
dadd...@hotmail.com (Steve) wrote in message news:<2319c424.0204...@posting.google.com>...
<snip>
>
> Though their equipment was represented to be the best available, no
> objective data was given to supports the claims. Does anyone out
> there know of any such data? Data that compares Masterguard
> photoelectric detectors to the much less expensive ones available in
> many home centers. First Alert's Double Sensor, which has both
> photoelectric and ionization detectors, for example. Any others that
> should be considered?
>
<snip>
>
> Thanks,
> Steve
Stanley Cline
>survey. The survey included a quote for a "Full Protection" system,
>which for my home listed at $3720!!! The system included 4 mechanical
>heat detectors, 8 photoelectric smoke detectors, one CO detector and 2
>2.5# extinguishers.
### Ripoff... ###
Mechanical heat detectors -- never heard of those.
Photo smoke detectors -- photo-only detectors are fairly hard to find.
First Alert's Double System "two-way" detector (see below) are $20-30
apiece.
CO detectors -- Nighthawk (made by Kidde) is highly rated; ~$45 for
their "best" battery-backed-up plug-in model (I have one.)
Extinguishers -- $20-50 apiece for common brands sold in home centers,
etc.; somewhat more for those (usually larger and rechargeable) sold
by "sprinkler people".
One thing that really bothers me is the total lack of a traditional
ionization detector in the package (I guess they assume you already
have one or more.) Ionization are best for flaming fires, photo are
best for smouldering ones.
For nearly $4k you could get an entire *burglar alarm system* with
interconnected detectors and much, much more...
>Though their equipment was represented to be the best available, no
>objective data was given to supports the claims. Does anyone out
>there know of any such data? Data that compares Masterguard
Consumer Reports has rated the usual brands of detectors at least
twice in the past (IIRC, the differences among regular smoke detectors
were fairly minor; CO detectors had significantly more variation) --
but I've never seen anything comparing Masterguard with the regular
brands.
>many home centers. First Alert's Double Sensor, which has both
>photoelectric and ionization detectors, for example. Any others that
>should be considered?
For smoke detectors: none that I can think of.
For CO: Nighthawk (see above)
-SC
--
Stanley Cline -- sc1 at roamer1 dot org -- http://www.roamer1.org/
...
"Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today. There might
be a law against it by that time." -/usr/games/fortune
Jimmy Dale Reeves
illegal in Arkansas.
"Stanley Cline" <s...@roamer1.org> wrote in message
news:bsnnaucv1n1jmgcst...@news.local.roamer1.org...
Robert L Bass
listed smoke detectors. They are not permitted to be used as life safety
devices. Plain and simple. They are junk. It's a scam.
As to other conventional detectors, there are several major brands that are
popular among mainstream alarm service companies. Edwards (div of SPX),
System Sensor and ESL (div of Interlogix) are several well respected brands.
For retail prices on detectors, you might start at (sorry for the plug) my
web site. I have retail prices on a variety of brands of smoke detectors
and other fire alarm components.
Regards,
Robert L Bass
=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
The Online DIY Alarm Store
http://www.Bass-Home.com
2291 Pine View Circle
Sarasota, FL 34231
877-722-8900 Sales & Tech Support
941-925-9747 Fax
rober...@comcast.net
=============================>
"Steve" <dadd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2319c424.02040...@posting.google.com...
Brad Lemon
supermarket) since we have five kids. One in every bedroom (4) and one in
the living area, and one in the hallway outside the laundry door. We have
very few false alarms - usually if I try to cook....
We had a house fire when our dishwasher malfunctioned, and I couldn't hear
myself think when all six were going off - the noise is enough to wake up
the neighbours in the next town! Since the fire, we've also installed two
small dry chemical fire extinguishers. One in the kitchen (not to be used on
fat fires!) and one in the master bedroom. The logic behind the one in the
bedroom is that it's a handy location if we have a fire at night. Also a
good weapon.... Simply spray at intruder, then hit him over the head while
his confused!
Of course, we have the mandatory fire blanket near the stove. Buy a big
one - you can also use them to wrap around people if their clothes catch
fire, or a television/computer monitor. Can also be worn to a Toga party...
A dry chemical extinguisher makes a BIG mess, and is also mildly corrosive,
so if you use one, clean up the mess immediately.
I think most firefighters would agree that this setup is adaquate, if not
over-kill for domestic purposes. Don't forget to put a dry chemical
extinguisher in the car.
Once you've bought all this - use the money you've saved for a night on the
town...
Keep safe, Brad.
"Doug Salisbury" <dssal...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:JYLq8.14022$nt1.1...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Alarminex
dadd...@hotmail.com (Steve) writes:
>Subject: Re: Masterguard smoke and heat detectors
>From: dadd...@hotmail.com (Steve)
>Date: 3 Apr 2002 20:52:43 -0800
>
>So far all of the responses have been that Masterguard is selling
>"junk" at an inflated price. No one has given any suggestions as to
>where to find objective test data for Masterguard or any other smoke
>detectors. Or sources for quality detectors at a reasonable price.
>How do I find a reputable alarm company to supply and/or install a
>system? I would like hard data. Where can I get it?
>
I remember that some one had located a website that outlined a law suit or a
recall on the wind up heat detectors. Anyone remember where it's located?
I'm sure if you did a Google search in this Newsgroup going back about 2 years
you'd find a lot of information that was available back then.
As far as finding a local company, I can only suggest that you use the most
popular way and that is ask people in your area who they have used, how long
and are they satisfied. Call in three or more, get estimates, educate your
self. If you have any questions on what anyone is telling you, get back to us
and we'll try to clairify it.
>
>
Jim
Remove the Qzapp to email
After you reach a certain age,
there's nothing left to learn the hard way.
VSS DOUG
found when running a search on Google (not groups) using "mg-50 heat detector
recall" as the search string.
Doug L
Jim wrote
Thomas D. Horne
Every time I point out the holes in the mastergaurd sales pitch they
threaten to sue me in order to try to intimidate me into silence. So
bring on your threats because here I go again.
Steve
The money mastergaurd wants for one of their "systems" will pay for a
complete automatic home fire alarm system that meets NFPA 72, National
Fire Alarm Code. Such systems will not only warn all occupants of the
alarm condition, even if they are two floors away and singing in the
shower, they will also tell you if any part of the system is out of
service. Real fire alarm systems can be connected via land line and
cellular telephone to a central station to summon help while you
concentrate on getting every one in your home out safely. It is my
belief that the mechanical heat detectors sold under the mastergaurd
logo are terribly overpriced. I also believe that they are a very poor
substitute for complete automatic home fire alarm installations. If you
can afford the 3700 dollar price tag for the mastergaurd offering you
and your family will be far safer if you install complete automatic fire
alarm system and you will save money.
--
Firefighter/Rescuer Thomas D. Horne
speaking for myself alone.
Well, we Aren't no thin blue heroes
and yet we aren't no blackguards too.
Just working men and women most remarkable like you.
Tom
Brad Bilger
> representative of Masterguard hosted it.
I once had a masterguard salesman tell me that one of their "Windup" heat
detectors would activate LONG before the smoke detector would.. I told him
Bull ****. We had a kid one time playing with a lighter in his room.
Caught the mattress on fire. The $12.00 smoke detector in the OTHER END of
the house went off and alerted momma before the Masterguard heat detector
went off.. and the heat detector was mounted on the wall directly above the
mattress that was burning. (the heat detector never went off. ) if you
look on a heat detector that is used as part of a TRUE alarm system, you
will see a label that says that "THIS IS NOT A LIFE SAFETY DEVICE". Heat
detectors have their place, but not as a replacement for a good smoke
detector. I work part-time installing fire alarm systems. I put heat
detectors in Water heater closets or anyplace that has a high concentration
of dust/smoke. Otherwise it is strictly Photoelectric smokes.
Just like sprinkler systems.. (Which I love and this is not intended as a
slam to them..)
Smoke detectors save lives....
Sprinkler systems save property.......
Masterguard heat detectors cost $$$$$
Steve
heat detectors. Which few regard as having much value.
What about the photoelectric smoke detectors? Since my first posting
I have learned that they are made by Gentex Corporation. Anyone have
any words of wisdom on the company or the their smoke detectors?
"Brad Bilger" <bradb...@attbi.com> wrote in message news:<gnor8.174350$Yv2.59170@rwcrnsc54>...
J. Stevens
--
Jack Stevens
alarman2...@yahoo.com
remove NOSPAM to reply
"Steve" <dadd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2319c424.02040...@posting.google.com...
Robert L Bass
available for about $40-60 apiece, depending on the model.
--
Brad Bilger
> Most of the responses have been regarding the Masterguard mechanical
> heat detectors. Which few regard as having much value.
>
> What about the photoelectric smoke detectors? Since my first posting
> I have learned that they are made by Gentex Corporation. Anyone have
> any words of wisdom on the company or the their smoke detectors?
>
I work Part time as a Fire alarm Tech. Gentex makes some good stuff and I
have no problems with them. Their horn/Strobes are loud and bright. I've
done some work with them and their detectors and have been satisfied with
their stuff. Mostly what I use are on Full Systems. System Sensor Smokes
and Horn/strobes are my first choice, but I don't know if System Sensor
makes a battery only device.
Doug Salisbury
alarm companies, check the yellow pages then the Better Business Bureau.
"Steve" <dadd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2319c424.02040...@posting.google.com...
stns...@gmail.com
Richard
anyone who washes a smoke detector in a washing machine, gets what they
deserve..
--
from the desk of:
*Richard Phillips, FAR-601
T.P.E.Security
Kentucky Security
Providence - Madisonville - Nortonville
* (age before beauty, that means I go first)
nap...@gmail.com
You attended an infomercial. They paid for your free food and you listened and then agreed to have a salesman come into your home who quoted you an astronomical price. In other words, you got maybe a $10 meal so they could get your address to sell/bill you $3720.00 for an inflated gizmo. Steve, there is no free meal in life, you either have to pay for it or you have to go farm it out of the ground. This behavior will lead you to paths of no return...and the salesman/company will actually get the 'free meal'.
All the objections that you raise are excellent, all that the 'representative'/low-life ex-used-car-salesman said are for his benefit only.
As per the other responsible folks in this forum, let wisdom reign and get yourself a professional security/wholehouse interconnected fire system for the protection of your household. And since it will be a monitored fire-system, get an insurance certificate from the installing company and then insist on all your discounts with the usually-deceiving insurance agent. Your discount directly affects your insurance agent's commissions.
On a calmer note, I hear that the next upgrade of the Masterguard mechanical wind-up heat detector has a pop-up Obama-figure-head with actual recorded words of "Let me be clear, and make no mistake, here's the deal, it will not be easy, we will win the future, and be greater together, with shared sacrifice... so get the heck out now!