Ormiston surname
Jeff Palmer
search for a clan tartan, but no luck. I have found out the the Roxburgh
District tartan is available for the Ormiston family.
Jeff
Anne Burgess
You are one of the majority of people of Scots descent whose forebears had
no clan affiliation.
The surname Ormiston is of two origins, according to G F Black's "Surnames
of Scotland"; (1) From the place called Ormiston in East Lothian and (2)
from the place called Ormiston in Roxburghshire. Older forms are Wormyston
or Wurmyston, pronounced Wurmston. This is an uncompromisingly
Lowland/Border name, has absolutely nothing to do with any Highland clan,
and consequently would not have had an ancient tartan.
Orm is probably an ancient forename, so Ormiston would mean 'Orm's farm'.
The forename Orm may be associated with the word 'worm', which in south-east
Scotland and north-east England also meant a dragon or similar mythical
monster. There is a folk tale about the 'Laidly Worm' which crops up in
various guises all over the place.
As far as a tartan is concerned, never mind all the nonsense talked about
tartan. Most modern tartans are less than 200 years old. By all means use
the Roxburgh district tartan - but if you don't like it just pick one you do
like and enjoy wearing it.
Anne
Allan Connochie
"Jeff Palmer" <twi...@pldi.net> wrote in message
news:uv72r7l...@corp.supernews.com...
> Looking for any Ormistons, my grandmother was an Ormiston and tried to
> search for a clan tartan, but no luck. I have found out the the Roxburgh
> District tartan is available for the Ormiston family.
Ormiston does seem to be a Border name right enough! There is a farm
called Ormiston just west of Kelso, Roxburghshire! The place is supposedly
named after an Anglian or Danish land holder. [ie Orme's toun] There is a
village called Ormiston in East Lothian which is supposedly named after
another Borderer called Orm the Priest of Houm [ie Hume which is in
Berwickshire just north of Kelso] So I suppose the surname could have
evolved from either or both of these places.
One interesting episode is when the northern English Earls rebelled against
Queen Elizabeth of England in 1569. Northumberland and Westmorland fled
into Scotland after the rebellion was defeated and sought refuge amongst the
Liddesdale reivers. They came under the protection of Black Ormiston and
some of his Armstrong allies. Ormiston was supposedly involved in the
murder of Darnley and some identify him with the Laird of Ormiston. A force
was sent by the Regent Moray with mixed bribes and threats of feud [the
Scots were anxious not to offend the English Queen] so Ormiston relented and
sent the Earls into the Debateable Land out of his protection. This episode
is briefly mentioned in the Steel Bonnets by George Macdonald Fraser.
Black's Surnames of Scotland also mentions the fact that Ormiston of the Ilk
was at feud with Ker of Cessford in 1564.
Here's a wee local landmark with Ormiston connections
http://www.eckfordparish.fsnet.co.uk/Bridge.htm
cheers
Allan
>
> Jeff
>
>
aa
Allan Connochie
"aa" <rae...@shaw.ca> wrote in message news:3DF8FBC0...@shaw.ca...
Roughly, what % of people with Scottish descent have clan affiliations.
Anne Burgess wrote:
> Looking for any Ormistons, my grandmother was an Ormiston and tried to
> search for a clan tartan, but no luck. I have found out the the Roxburgh
> District tartan is available for the Ormiston family.
> Jeff
You are one of the majority of people of Scots descent whose forebears had
no clan affiliation.The surname Ormiston is of two origins, according to G F Black's "Surnames
of Scotland"; (1) From the place called Ormiston in East Lothian and (2)
from the place called Ormiston in Roxburghshire. Older forms are Wormyston
or Wurmyston, pronounced Wurmston. This is an uncompromisingly
Lowland/Border name, has absolutely nothing to do with any Highland clan,
[Perhaps we should differentiate between "Clan" and "Highland Clan" though Anne. Sure I don't think anyone would suggest that Ormiston in itself was a Clan however there are surname groupings in the Lowlands, and especially in the Borders, which have long been regarded as clans. Likewise many of these Clans have tartans too. I don't think the original poster mentioned Highland Clans they were only looking for a tartan:-)
cheers
Allan]
Anne Burgess
> [Perhaps we should differentiate between "Clan" and "Highland Clan"
though Anne.
> Sure I don't think anyone would suggest that Ormiston in itself was a Clan
however there > are surname groupings in the Lowlands, and especially in the
Borders, which have long > been regarded as clans. Likewise many of these
Clans have tartans too. I don't think
> the original poster mentioned Highland Clans they were only looking for a
tartan:-)
Fair point Allan. I was indeed referring to Highland clans, because I
believe that the use of 'clan' in relation to non-Highland families is a
*relatively* modern development. There seem to be people of Scots descent
all over the world who have been deluded by the "Brigadoon Industry" into
imagining that the entire population of Scotland is still organised in
"clans" and that everyone has a tartan.
My own mother's maiden name is Scott, but I do not regard that as making me
a member of a "clan", though I am well aware that there is a Scott clan
association which I could join if I wished. I occasionally wear Green Scott
tartan because I happen to like it. I also use Ancient Lindsay, both Red and
Green Leslie, Dress MacNab, Gordon, MacNaughton, MacBeth and Ruthven,
although I do not have even the remotest link with any of the last five.
Anne
Allan Connochie
"Anne Burgess" <anne.b...@NOSPAMbtinternet.com> wrote in message
news:atceab$m7b$1...@sparta.btinternet.com...
>
> > [Perhaps we should differentiate between "Clan" and "Highland Clan"
> though Anne.
> > Sure I don't think anyone would suggest that Ormiston in itself was a
Clan
> however there > are surname groupings in the Lowlands, and especially in
the
> Borders, which have long > been regarded as clans. Likewise many of these
> Clans have tartans too. I don't think
> > the original poster mentioned Highland Clans they were only looking for
a
> tartan:-)
>
> Fair point Allan. I was indeed referring to Highland clans, because I
> believe that the use of 'clan' in relation to non-Highland families is a
> *relatively* modern development. There seem to be people of Scots descent
> all over the world who have been deluded by the "Brigadoon Industry" into
> imagining that the entire population of Scotland is still organised in
> "clans" and that everyone has a tartan.
>
> My own mother's maiden name is Scott, but I do not regard that as making
me
> a member of a "clan", though I am well aware that there is a Scott clan
> association which I could join if I wished.
But family groupings from the Borders like the Scotts though in particular
Armstrongs, Grahams, Elliots etc [that is surname groupings who acted as a
unit more often than not outwith the law] were regarded as being clans
certainly as far back as the 16thC and possibly much longer. The word may
have been used in an almost derogatory manner but it was used to describe
them all the same. Although they had chiefs etc I know that they were not
the same social structure as Highland Clans but they were clans all the
same.
In 1517 a respite was granted to all the "King's lieges of the Clannis and
Surnaimis of Armstrang and Tailzour and others of the clannis of
Liddesdale". In 1591 pledges were made for "gude reule of all the hale clan
of the Trumblis". As late as 1604 the third Earl of Cumberland observed of
the Borderers "this people stands altogether upon Clanes and surnames" In
1592 a complaint was made about James Ker of Greenhead near Kelso who had
committed a theft "he is a Borderair and clannit man in the cuntrey, aganis
quhome the ordinar forme of the law can not have execution" All these
examples are taken from Border Family History In Earlier Days by Michael
Robson.
The term clan for surname groupings had also spread into the England to
describe the Dalesmen of the English reiving counties. "Since the early
16thC the Celticism 'clan' had become normal usage, but which was not
adopted by the Highlanders themselves until the advent of the
Stuarts.......The Rise and Fall of the English Highlands Clans by Ralph
Robson" The same book gives this example from Gray's Chorographia of 1649.
"These highlanders run together in Clangs as they term it, or surnames"
cheers
Allan
>
>
Ruiseart agus Ceit
I find it quite amazing, that no matter how many times the above is
mentioned, there are still people who refuse to believe that there were
Lowland clans and insist that those that exist now are recently "invented".
Whether they were different to the Highland clans or not, the fact remains
that they existed and their descendants have as much right to honour this as
do those of Highland descent. If they wish to add tartan to this, great!
Just my thoughts,
Beannachdan oirbh,
Ruiseart.
--
"Mist Covered Mountains" new CD from RavensWing available now
http://www.amitar.com.au/~druid1/RavensWing.html
Iain
"Ruiseart agus Ceit" wrote:
>
> I find it quite amazing, that no matter how many times the above is
> mentioned, there are still people who refuse to believe that there were
> Lowland clans and insist that those that exist now are recently
"invented".
> Whether they were different to the Highland clans or not, the fact remains
> that they existed and their descendants have as much right to honour this
as
> do those of Highland descent. If they wish to add tartan to this, great!
>
> Just my thoughts,
>
> Beannachdan oirbh,
>
> Ruiseart.
I think you will find that the people when talking of the Clans of the
Highlands are referencing the system of affiliation with each other in the
unit... Yes there are families that have been called clans in the Lowlands
for years, but certainly a different style of clan... I have ancestors from
both the Highlands and the Lowlands... I am proud of the heritage of both...
But to think that they have the same heritage is simply not correct... The
families that lived in the lowlands experienced a different system of
overruling and convivial life...
The explanation for people squabbling over the clan identity is they don't
wish to diminish the oneness of their culture. They are demanding to
maintain the personal heritage... they don't want their legacy to be clumped
into one meaningless co-op... Many people feel it is larceny of their
culture... You come across the same obsessions when mooting society's
particular clan and or family...
Iain...