Nitrous kits for scoots!
Geoff
Ive been digging, and digging, and digging....finally got some info.
Holley Carbs has now come out with a nitrous kit for 100cc and under 2
stroke engines!!!
I emailed thier tech support, inquiring about it. I told them I have a
2002 Derbi Atlantis 50cc (air-cooled) kitted to 65cc (70cc,
whatever)....expansion pipe exhaust and 19mm carb......they sent me
back an email saying they had just developed a kit (03200-OZ) that
retails for $582.
I couldn't find that part number on thier website, maybe too new. But
I did find part #03200-02NOS. I assume it's fairly similar. Don't know
for sure.
http://www.holley.com/HiOctn/NewsInfo/NewsRels/NR060302.html
I contacted a local NOS dealer here, who said he could get me the kit
cheaper than $582. Said he could do about 530 or so...big deal.
I asked him for some details....he explained that he sells approx 1-2
Harley Davidson kits a week, (which ARE different) and said assembly
was pretty easy. I explained that this was a 2 stroke. He said
shouldnt be too much different, that he would have to look at the kit,
but felt the NOS was a dry system (meaning: shooting the NOS into the
airbox). He had never done a scooter, imagine that, and does mostly
Nitrous work on cars. So I'm alittle wary of letting him hook it up,
but may use his brain a little. I called my local scooter mechanics,
they've never done a system either, but can't wait to try. BTW-it's
gonna void any warranty on the engine.
I'm curious about alot of things:
1) Do I need to go to a bigger main jet? (The nitrous will only be hit
WOT)
2) I haven't looked at the kit,obviously, but I 'assume' there's a
separate fuel pump so I don't run lean. Should i worry if there isn't?
Can the nitrous be used in small amounts without enriching the
mixture?
The guy here, said it's a 10 oz. bottle of NOS (costs about 5 bucks to
refill), about 30-40 secs of continuous blast and he thought the
nitrous is shot into the airbox, he said if I use the smallest NOS jet
they have, to pump it into there, I should be ok with out changing the
mixture. I advised him this is a 2 stroke, and the only lube Ive got
is coming from my carb. He didn't think it would hurt in 3-4 second
blasts. But he wanted to wait on the kit......All speculation at this
point. But Holley said this was a kit desgined for scooters. The one
on the above webpage does have a separate fuel pump, which makes
sense. Im assuming part no. 03200-OZ will too.........I should have
the kit, assembly, and testing done by the middle/end of this month,
email me if you're interested in the outcome, or definitely if you
have experience or some warnings!
P.S. I also re-emailed Holley on the part numbers, just to make sure
they didn't send me a typo.....
Will post updates as I go along.
Jack
done NOS on a snowmobile? They are 2 stroke, and would have to
address the oiling and mixture concerns too.
geoff11...@yahoo.com (Geoff) wrote in message news:<bb0c7193.02092...@posting.google.com>...
Justin
The first space traveller was a monkey, right???
:) lol
> Holley Carbs has now come out with a nitrous kit for 100cc and under 2
> stroke engines!!!
<snip>
Arne Reil
engine used in a pulling tractor. The pull is 200 feet, so the nitrous would
be used for 6-8 seconds.. I 'think' he knew what he was doing, and was
constantly trying to get the jetting right (he ran at full throttle for the
whole run, and the nitrous was on wot).... so, he spent a lot of time
fiddling and finally gave it up.. He got it to work, but not well enough for
the trouble....
Keep in mind, this was kind of ground-breaking experimentation, at least
with him.. I'm sure if Holley has a kit, it would be well thought out...
but, I'd be concerned about lubrication.
If I can get any information of value, I'll pass it along.
Arne, CT, USA
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Mark
I converted a few 2-strokes over to methanol, added about a 30% increase in
power across the entire RPM range - ALL THE TIME - not just for a few
seconds.
This was about 20 years ago, so I'm foggy on the details, but am going to
try it again - on a scooter.
I modified both a Kawasaki Motocross bike as well as a Honda Enduro.
The modification involves, you guessed it, larger jets. I do believe that I
actually put a larger card on at one point. That is the approach that I am
going to take with this project.
Benefits:
A hell of a lot cheaper.
A hell of a lot more powerful
30% increases in POWER - ALL THE TIME
Mark
and not just for a few seconds
"Arne Reil" <there...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:CJAl9.43431$IL6.2...@news2.east.cox.net...
Jack
change-over is more than changing jets. Methanol eats the gas
resisitant rubber in carbs, so you need to go to silicone or treated
paper for gaskets and "O" rings. Re-jetting is way different than
gas, as methanol engines will use roughly three times the fuel volume
of gas engines, so a methanol engine will need a much bigger carb, yet
will have to be resrtricted to get the air speed back up (the drill is
to take a carb meant for a 125 and adapt it with a spacer with the
same size hole you have on the 50cc carb now). Then there is the
issue of oil, as not all 2 stroke oils are compatible with
methanol(klotz is, the red stinky slimy stuff). Next comes the issue
of fuel lines and the tank and fuel pump and all gas lines and
filters, as again, the pump must not have black synthetic rubber or
neoprene lines or internal seals, they have to withstand methanol,
and they must be able to pass way more volume to feed it. Last but
not least will be the fact that methanol engines cannot be shut off
and left to stand like we do with gas jobs, as the fuel attracts water
and then corrodes the internals of engines when it chemically creates
acids that eat aluminum and rust steel. to deal with this issue,
alcohol engines must be unhooked from the fuel supply after each day's
running, and rinsed or run on a burst of after-run fluid (I used WD-40
squirted into the fuel line to the carb, as engines will run on the
kerosene base, and dispoerse the water and leave an oil film) or they
rust up the bearings while sitting even a few days. I did the above
with chainsaww sized engines from 23 to 56cc that powered giant scale
R/C planes, and ran anywhere from 12,000 to 16,000 rpms, but required
about a 1:1 maintenance to running ratio at best. In other words,
just like a race car, you work on the engine at least as much as you
run it.
This is a major commitment and one that will forever take your
scooter engine into another realm, not a realm that can be easily
returned from, and one where engine reliability and lifespan is
severely limited. Besides, the fuel is not readily available, you
will need to have a facitlities to store it and it cannot be kept long
once opened or it gathers water, and it costs a fortune to operate, to
the tune of at least 3 bucks a gallon to mix your own, with economy of
perhaps 15 mpg, and commercial fuels run 8 bucks a gallon, plus hefty
hazmat shipping charges. You'd do better with running a lincoln town
car on airplane gas for economy.
BY far, for occassional short-lived giggles, and the bragging rights
at the local starbucks, nitrous is a lesser of the two evils.
"Mark" <msa...@charter.net> wrote in message news:<upduda6...@corp.supernews.com>...
Arne Reil
with NO..
And the nitrous bottle can be seen and appreciated and pointed at.... Harder
to brag about a tank full of juice.
Arne, CT, USA
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"Jack" <adiron...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:5aad6b5.02092...@posting.google.com...
Geoff
Holley has emailed me the installation instructions for the
kit...seems like a no brainer...basically you run a separate fuel line
to a pump, then pump to a 'fogger' nozzle, run nitrous to solenoid,
solenoid to same fogger nozzle....this nozzle mixes the N2o and fuel
together and sprays into intake side of carb, via airbox....looks
pretty simple....can't wait til it comes in...the instructions look
pretty easy to follow, good pictures, although the pictures show it
being installed on a 22cc blade scooter and says meant for 50cc's and
smaller....should work the same without any problems....they verified
the part number as 03200-OZ....if anyone is interested in looking at
the plans for it...lemme know, I'll email them to ya....
geoff11...@yahoo.com (Geoff) wrote in message news:<bb0c7193.02092...@posting.google.com>...