Re: TEZCAT RITUALS
Dagon Productions
nak...@juno.com wrote:
>OK - settle it. Douglas here of Dagon Productions claims he wrote the
>ritual for Tezcat.
>
>Walter, you claim that you and the other TOS members wrote it.
>
>SETTLE IT.
>
>For now, I'm removing it off the website with this notice. I'm sick of
>the CULT spaniels going insane because I'm at the god damned beach for
>days and NOT paying attention to their fucking frilly whinings.
>
>________________________________________________________________
>The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
>Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
>Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!
>
>
>
Now the kookisar is sending me emails.
Again kookisar, there is nothing cultish about pointing out that the
satanic
retards site contained plagiarized material. If you are going to use
particular words...
figure out what they mean first.
You are paying attention now... got you to jump and change your
website };)
I'd love to see Walter cite exactly where he picked up each turn of a
phrase in the directional calls. This should be a hoot.
-Douglas
--
**********************************************
Dagon Productions
Chaos Magick & Occult books
http://www.dagonproductions.com
in...@dagonproductions.com
Tani Jantsang
online for a few days. Had it not rained, I'd have NOT been here today -
and if it keeps up with good weather, I won't be here till possibly
Thursday.
There is MUCH cultish about your NOT noticing Walter name and TOS
affiliation for that ritual. And then screaming at me with your gang of
no-minds when I'm obviously NOT online to read it for a few days.
Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact Walter and
inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of course,
that NEVER occurred to you.
Had I known that you had ANY authorship in that material, even with
permission I'd NOT put it up there.
"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4133DFD...@earthlink.net...
Dagon Productions
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>There is MUCH cultish about screaming at me on this newsgroup when I'm NOT
>online for a few days.
>
I wasn't screaming ya nutbar... these are typed words, if I wanted to
simulate
SCREAMING!!! I would type all in uppercase.
The manner in which these forums work, one need not be present when a post
is made. I figured you were at the beach or riding your lawn mower and I
knew you would be back.
>Had it not rained, I'd have NOT been here today -
>and if it keeps up with good weather, I won't be here till possibly
>Thursday.
>
So? Who cares? If I feel like posting... the posts will wait for you...
you can
bet money on that.
>
>There is MUCH cultish about your NOT noticing Walter name and TOS
>affiliation for that ritual. And then screaming at me with your gang of
>no-minds when I'm obviously NOT online to read it for a few days.
>
Walters name and ToS affiliation were not on the "Spells" page or the
"Tezcatlipoca" page
I have taken issue with.
There is nothing "cultish" about it... keep typing the word over and
over... it will
not change the definition of the word.
>
>Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact Walter and
>inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of course,
>that NEVER occurred to you.
>
Because the plagiarism was not posted to his website but to the satanic
retards
site... pretty simple. The problem I have with plagiarism in this case,
is one...
your hypocrisy in regards to plagiarism and two that it was posted on a
public site I don't find would mirror my words well and three the work
was not up to what I feel was my best... the main reason I never made
it public to begin with.
>
>Had I known that you had ANY authorship in that material, even with
>permission I'd NOT put it up there.
>
Well, it is your responsibility to make sure there is no plagiarized
material
on your site, since it is on your site I could hold you responsible...
if you
had kept it up, I could have had geocities take the site down.
You dropped the ball... fucked up... took someones word
that you should not have.
Paint it however you like... denial isn't just a river in Egypt... it is
something you practice regularly.
I'm sure I will be laughing about this one for some time to
come... and as long as you keep reading my posts... I'm
sure I will remind you of it just to get your goat.
-Douglas
Tani Jantsang
>
> Because the plagiarism was not posted to his website but to the satanic
> retards
Its Satanic Reds Social Realists - get the name right in your drugged out
brain. That website is OUR website - OUR - meaning it is also Walter's as
far as the org goes. If he wishes to repost it on his PERSONAL website -
that's up to him.
> site... pretty simple. The problem I have with plagiarism in this case,
> is one...
> your hypocrisy in regards to plagiarism
I have no hypocricy with regards to plagiarism. That's just one more stupid
rumor you ran away with - with your cultie helpers
and two that it was posted on a
> public site I don't find would mirror my words well and three the work
> was not up to what I feel was my best... the main reason I never made
> it public to begin with.
>
> >
> >Had I known that you had ANY authorship in that material, even with
> >permission I'd NOT put it up there.
> >
>
> Well, it is your responsibility to make sure there is no plagiarized
> material
> on your site, since it is on your site I could hold you responsible...
> if you
> had kept it up, I could have had geocities take the site down.
Geocities did nothing to the site. I personally took it down. Walter did
not take it down.
> You dropped the ball... fucked up... took someones word
> that you should not have.
>
> Paint it however you like... denial isn't just a river in Egypt... it is
> something you practice regularly.
On the contrary. You are telling me that the Smoking Mirror Temple of Set
Pylon plagiarized YOUR work. That is what you are telling me. Yes, I
trusted the people in it NOT to do that. The website belongs to the org.
>
> I'm sure I will be laughing about this one for some time to
> come... and as long as you keep reading my posts... I'm
> sure I will remind you of it just to get your goat.
Sure, no, actually, none of it will matter, Douggie. Nothing gets my goat -
but I do NOT want your words on our org site. I don't care if the words are
"The weather is nice out today." They are yours, therefore they are POISON,
imo. Filth from a man that has no concept that love is nothing like lust or
hunger. Filth from a waste product that asked for sources - and got them
clearly enough, and so had his little friends have to speak up for him.
Go shoot yourself, Druggie. It's only a matter of time when One More of
your kind go crazy and we have more posts from SOMEONE exposing it all over
usenet.
--
"Having a long running interest in blood sacrifice, yes I did participate
in two rites where blood sacrifice took place..." Douglas of Dagon
Productions
>
Harry Lime
Please see inside text:
"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
news:q7UYc.3485$8d1....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> There is MUCH cultish about screaming at me on this newsgroup when I'm NOT
> online for a few days. Had it not rained, I'd have NOT been here today -
> and if it keeps up with good weather, I won't be here till possibly
> Thursday.
>
> There is MUCH cultish about your NOT noticing Walter name and TOS
> affiliation for that ritual. And then screaming at me with your gang of
> no-minds when I'm obviously NOT online to read it for a few days.
The Satanic Reds website is under your organization's control, likewise, you
are the main webmaster. Why *wouldn't* Doug ask you to remove this material
from the Satanic Red's site. So if I put your Dark Doctrines on one of the
websites I own, I'm sure you'd be jumping up and down claiming copyright
infringement in this newsgroup -- as you should IMO. Likewise, if I
registered "www.satanicreds.com" and www.darkdoctrines.com" it's axiomatic
that you'd rant and rave that I violated your creative right to your
monograph.
Why not just admit that this was a mistake on your (or the Satanic Red's
part), apologize, and move on? Making asinine denials just demonstrates
again that your using fall guys again for your own personality deficits.
>
> Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact Walter
and
> inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of course,
> that NEVER occurred to you.
If Walter Bowart is really to blame, I'm sure he can apologize in this
forum. After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum, why
wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you? I'm sure you'd
show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging them
into this latest spat of yours.
Regards,
Harry Lime
Dagon Productions
I can address you however I desire ya snivelling old kook.
-Douglas
nak...@juno.com wrote:
>I got the ritual from WALTER. I suggest you take it up with him. If he
>can show that he and other Setians wrote it, it will be BACK UP.
>
>Do NOT address me in a typically insulting manner in personal email. I
>sent you and Watler this email to RESOLVE this crap.
>
>You are the only KOOK around, Douglas - a man who has no concept that
>love is not the same thing as lust - or hunger.
>
>DO NOT email me again. Deal with Walter on this because Walter is the
>person that put forth that ritual.
Tani Jantsang
consider I was NOT ONLINE for the (apparently) DAYS that this convo went on.
That's a problem, screaming on here and everyone and their brother jumping
in, if I'm not online.
You can see what Walter posted to Douglas. He challenges Doug's authorship
and will further check it out with former AND present Temple of Set members
that wrote those things up. Had Doug simply written to Walter (who's name
IS on there), it wouldn't have been another "cultie issue for you guys."
I'm wondering just exactly "which part" is Doug claiming he wrote? I'm not
denying a thing, Harry - but Walter IS challenging it. I talked to him
about it before I posted earlier today. Finally, I just decided to remove
it until it's resolved. Now Walter posted something to Doug.
Yes, I say nasty things to Doug because he has, from day one, said nasty
things to ME. Very very simple.
I find nothing embarassing about this entire issue. Not in the least. I
don't embarass easily, Harry.
The Temple of Set heh, happily handed me more ammo against people that have
seriously messed with them than anyone else you see on here and their info
wasn't rumor mongering bs, .... except ONE other person - a COS member.
No, not Audy and not Lucinda. A member in "good standing." Heh. I'm sure
that if Aquino still had the Smoking Mirror Pylon (maybe it's still in the
TOS, I have no idea) and had material that was written by OTHER than the
people who claim to write it, he'd want to know. I didn't drag the TOS into
anything. The ritual BELONGED to a ToS Pylon for years, according to
Walter, written by them. Some of those people are still in the TOS. I'm
sure they DO want to know.
Walter will contact both current and former TOS members and find out details
about it - as he has posted on here to Doug. For all I know, he may put it
up on his personal website - it's up to him. I really don't want to be in
the MIDDLE of this crap.
Keep in mind, the only time I flame anyone is when they flame me. Don't
flame me, I don't flame them. They have serious issues with agreeing to
DISagree - as do you. They - and you - also have serious issues with ideas
that I have "control" over anyone OTHER than my own self. I know the COS
does that kind of thing - and SO DO YOU by your own admission. I know who
is "friendly" toward them, and who will attack their perceived detractors -
because I was TOLD DIRECTLY who was who when I first got online in late 1999
or 2000. Very simple. SR is not run that way - AT ALL. We DO make
information public and put links to where more can be found IF we know of
them. But some information IS sold - copyrighted, and yes, ISBN numbers,
published by Marsh in Association with Oneiros Books.
And btw, I never accused Shaw of plagiarising anything. He accused Satan
Shop of it, he accused Panpipes of it, and then, out of the blue and for no
VISIBLE reason, he accused me of it when the two drawings are obiously NOT
the same. Aside from that, Morena owns copyrights to the thing - so that's
that - and that covers ANY rendition of it. I don't even use it, or sell
it. SHE said I could make images public for public use. I did that in
order to STOP people connected to SR that have their own offshoot orgs and
sites from using the damned Lavey version. They should THANK me for that.
Apparently, the cult wants people to keep using their material so they can
whine and bitch about it. Well, it's no longer an issue anymore - the
copyright for it exists - and it overrides trademarks - especially lapsed
ones.
See inside too.
--
"My name is John Shaw. I have been a Satanist since I can remember."
Message-ID: <YzaFa.42788$Io.37...@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2003 01:33:44 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.221.39.20
- John H. Shaw, 32° Freemason, AZ Scottsdale Lodge #43
"You really are a total waste!" Ed King (real Mason), to John Shaw
--
"Having a long running interest in blood sacrifice, yes I did participate
in two rites where blood sacrifice took place..." Douglas of Dagon
Productions
"Harry Lime" <webmast...@harrylimetv.com> wrote in message
news:dWUYc.211313$8_6.4509@attbi_s04...
> Dear Tani:
>
> Please see inside text:
>
> "Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
> news:q7UYc.3485$8d1....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> > There is MUCH cultish about screaming at me on this newsgroup when I'm
NOT
> > online for a few days. Had it not rained, I'd have NOT been here
today -
> > and if it keeps up with good weather, I won't be here till possibly
> > Thursday.
> >
> > There is MUCH cultish about your NOT noticing Walter name and TOS
> > affiliation for that ritual. And then screaming at me with your gang of
> > no-minds when I'm obviously NOT online to read it for a few days.
>
> The Satanic Reds website is under your organization's control, likewise,
you
> are the main webmaster. Why *wouldn't* Doug ask you to remove this
material
> from the Satanic Red's site. So if I put your Dark Doctrines on one of the
> websites I own, I'm sure you'd be jumping up and down claiming copyright
> infringement in this newsgroup -- as you should IMO.
On this newsgroup? There are STIFF $$$ penalties for taking copyright
material - and DDocs are copyright with the government, TX number and all.
Likewise, if I
> registered "www.satanicreds.com" and www.darkdoctrines.com" it's axiomatic
> that you'd rant and rave that I violated your creative right to your
> monograph.
>
> Why not just admit that this was a mistake on your (or the Satanic Red's
> part), apologize, and move on? Making asinine denials just demonstrates
> again that your using fall guys again for your own personality deficits.
I made no denials of anything - and don' thave to apologize for a thing I
did NOT do. I contacted Walter, I posted what he said earlier, I waited a
short while for HIM to post and clear this up - I decided to remove it until
it's resolved - and now Walter posted. Simple. This has absolutely nothing
to do with my personality. It had a LOT to do with the fact that I'm NOT
online everyday and with a person that decided to just ACCUSE instead of
ASK.
>
> >
> > Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact Walter
> and
> > inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of course,
> > that NEVER occurred to you.
>
> If Walter Bowart is really to blame, I'm sure he can apologize in this
> forum.
Who? Walter Radke challenged Doug's claim. He just posted it. Go read
it.
After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum, why
> wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you?
Embarras? I don't embarras easily.
I'm sure you'd
> show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging them
> into this latest spat of yours.
It's not a spat of mine. It's a spat of Doug's - and since Walter posted -
I guess it's a spat between the RIGHT parties - leaving me out of it. I'm
responsible for myself, Harry. Not for others.
>
> Regards,
>
> Harry Lime
>
> >
> > Had I known that you had ANY authorship in that material, even with
> > permission I'd NOT put it up there.
That's the truth - even IF he said it was OK to put up there. I'd not want
it near our stuff simply because it's from his hand. Walter challenges
that. We'll see where that goes.
Tani Jantsang
this to you on the other thread. Now, if HE wants to put it on his own
personal websitge - it's up to him. He will check into it. You don't
address me. You spew and wretch.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Walter Alter" <neuron...@nospamearthlink.net>
Newsgroups: alt.satanism
Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2004 2:19 AM
Subject: Fuck You Re: Hmmm... SR plagiarism????
| Douglas, you delusional jack off. Unless your name is Bonne and you were
in
| the Smoking Mirror Pylon of the Temple of Set in 1996 in Portland, OR, you
| got an anus for a cognitive center cuz that's who wrote that ritual. The
| clue is in the step 2 Yogic breathing part cuz Bonnie was an ex-OTO member
| where they spread that Yogic and Gnosis stuff like jam on a bagel. I'll
| forward this claim de tripe to Craig Hunt, ex-Priest and founder of the
| Smoking Mirror Pylon who wrote the Ixtipli ritual, and to Priestess
| Guiniviere Webb, currently in the Temple of Set. I wrote the
| Tlacazipehualixtli ritual. The Nahuatl language incantations were taken
| from "Aztec Sorcerers in Seventeenth Century Mexico- The Treatise on
| Superstitions" by Hernando Ruiz de Alarcon 1629.
|
| If you want to claim authorship and file for copyright, be my guest. It
| will be challenged with documentation. Unless you have a copyright filed
| with the U.S. Bureau of Assholes, that's what you can kiss.
|
| Yer Pal
| Walter
|
| PSYOPS: www.fortunecity.com/victorian/mill/1189
|
|
|
|
|
| "Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
| news:412FED88...@earthlink.net...
| >
| > It seems the SRs have a rite on their website that has material
| > nicked from a rite I wrote. The SR rite:
| >
| > "The Rite of TEZCATLIPOCA and CINTEOTL "
| >
| > The intent of this rite is to evoke both TEZCATLIPOCA (Drinker of Night)
| > and CINTEOTL (God/ess of corn) to amplify the manifesting will of the
| mage.
| >
| > The design of this rite is synchronistic and spontaneous Feel free to
| > use any or all of the steps indicated in this rite for your own glorious
| > purposes.
| >
| > Ingredients:
| >
| > A smoking mirror - preferably obsidian, but a sheet of glass with one
| > side painted black will do.
| >
| > Corn husks - one for each participant
| >
| > Fireplace or pit
| >
| > Popcorn -unpopped to be later popped and eaten after the rite.
| >
| > Chocolates-
| >
| > Trance inducing noise makers -drums, pots, feet and floor, etc...
| >
| > Copal incense - traditionally used by the Aztecs and Mayaans
| >
| > Directional sigils and invocations -East South West North Horizontal
| > Axis and Vertical Axis
| >
| > Lighter or matches
| >
| > SEQUENCE:
| >
| > Step 1: Light incense and Fire.(The fire symbolizes the "Teyolia" or
| > "Divine Fire", which is the great energy/blood-access/axis point of the
| > Aztec universe.)
| >
| > Step 2: Yogic breathing (4 long and full & 7 short full) x4 - I would
| > suggest as much time as you can allow for this. The longer the time
| > spent, the deeper state of gnosis.
| >
| > Step 3: Directional Callings: Each should have a directional sigil and
| > invocation prepared from any previous ritual on pieces of paper....
| > After each of the invocations are performed, light the signalized paper
| > by lighter or match and then cast it into the fireplace or "Teyolia".
| >
| > >>> This section below was taken word for word (except for a few
| > mispellings the
| > plagiarizer made) from the rite I wrote:
| >
| > East-"We call upon the one who is Yellow as the rising Sun, Lord of
| > abundance and rising power -guard this corridor with the blinding rayss
| > of the rising Sun."
| >
| > South-"We call upon HUITZILOPOCHTLI, the hummingbird on the left, Lord
| > of war -guard this corridor with the might and ruthlessness of the
| > warrior spirit."
| >
| > West-"We call upon XIPE TOTEC, Lord of the Flayed One, Red from the
| > blood of sacrifice -guard this corridor, flaying and donning tthe skin
| > of any who enter uncalled."
| >
| > North-"We call upon the Black God of the North, Spirit of witchcraft and
| > sorcery, guard this corridor with your omnipotent powers of magic."
| >
| > Above-"We call upon he who gave his foot in battle so that we may have
| > land to walk upon, he who sacrificed his own blood to create our flesh,
| > blind folded god of stone and castigation, patron of Acatl, he who
| > inhabits the edge of the knife, accept this offering."
| >
| > Below-"TEZCATLIPOCA, Lord of the smoking mirror, possessor of the sky
| > and the earth, Jaguar in the heart of the mountain, grand trickster,
| > shaman and sorcerer, make yourself known to us. O night wind soul of the
| > world, Lord of the here and now, omnipotent ruler of the Gods, bring
| > forth your knowledge of magic and sorcery, war and strategy, wisdom and
| > might. Come to us, this is your vessel, hail TEZCATLIPOCA!"
| >
| > >>>
| >
| > Step 4: Begin TEZCATLIPOCA and CINTEOTL mantra with drums and other
| > noise makers.
| >
| > Step 5: One at a time, take something of yourself, a piece of hair, a
| > piece of nail, a picture, etc. to represent you, all the while chanting
| > "NA WA AH"(which refers to a traditional Nahuatl mantra meaning, to know
| > to feel to remember)
| >
| > Step 6:Gaze into the Smoking mirror. Transcend time and sigilize the
| > future (whatever you will) continuing the chanting.
| >
| > Step 7: Place the things of yourself onto the corn husks representing
| > CINTEOTL God/dess of nurturing fertility
| >
| > Step 8: Cast the corn husks into the fire, symbolized as the Teyolia.
| > Repeat steps 5-7 until all members have completed their offerings.
| >
| > Step 9: Close ritual by eating chocolates and by throwing some of the
| > popcorn into the fire, laugh while watching the corn explode this
working
| >
| > Into the eschaton!
| >
| >
| >
| > >>>>> Let's hear your explanation for this one tani of the
| > plagiarising satanic retards.
| >
| > -Douglas
| >
| > --
| > **********************************************
| > Dagon Productions
| > Chaos Magick & Occult books
| > http://www.dagonproductions.com
| > in...@dagonproductions.com
| >
|
|
"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
news:IXVYc.3475$w%6.1...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Dagon Productions
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:41341760...@earthlink.net...
>
>
>>Because the plagiarism was not posted to his website but to the satanic
>>retards
>>
>>
>
>Its Satanic Reds Social Realists - get the name right in your drugged out
>brain. That website is OUR website - OUR - meaning it is also Walter's as
>far as the org goes. If he wishes to repost it on his PERSONAL website -
>that's up to him.
>
>
And with your and others behaviors... the proof is in the pudding...
satanic retards it is.
Let him repost it... his web host will receive a dated copy of my rite,
showing they
plagiarized it. This is so fucking funny!!!!
>
>
>>site... pretty simple. The problem I have with plagiarism in this case,
>>is one...
>>your hypocrisy in regards to plagiarism
>>
>>
>
>I have no hypocricy with regards to plagiarism. That's just one more stupid
>rumor you ran away with - with your cultie helpers
>
Yes, you do... you decry it in others but don't realize when it is under
your own nose.
>
>and two that it was posted on a
>
>
>>public site I don't find would mirror my words well and three the work
>>was not up to what I feel was my best... the main reason I never made
>>it public to begin with.
>>
>>
>>
>>>Had I known that you had ANY authorship in that material, even with
>>>permission I'd NOT put it up there.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>Well, it is your responsibility to make sure there is no plagiarized
>>material
>>on your site, since it is on your site I could hold you responsible...
>>if you
>>had kept it up, I could have had geocities take the site down.
>>
>>
>
>Geocities did nothing to the site. I personally took it down. Walter did
>not take it down.
>
>
Can't you read ya damn kook... I COULD HAVE... I've not done so yet...
I'm watching you
dumbasses squirm... and look forward to when you swallow their bullshit
and repost it... than
I'll have your ass.
>
>
>>You dropped the ball... fucked up... took someones word
>>that you should not have.
>>
>>Paint it however you like... denial isn't just a river in Egypt... it is
>>something you practice regularly.
>>
>>
>
>On the contrary. You are telling me that the Smoking Mirror Temple of Set
>Pylon plagiarized YOUR work. That is what you are telling me. Yes, I
>trusted the people in it NOT to do that. The website belongs to the org.
>
And you and the org fucked up.. .trusted the wrong people... I've got
the dated file.
>
>
>>I'm sure I will be laughing about this one for some time to
>>come... and as long as you keep reading my posts... I'm
>>sure I will remind you of it just to get your goat.
>>
>>
>
>Sure, no, actually, none of it will matter, Douggie. Nothing gets my goat -
>but I do NOT want your words on our org site. I don't care if the words are
>"The weather is nice out today." They are yours, therefore they are POISON,
>imo. Filth from a man that has no concept that love is nothing like lust or
>hunger. Filth from a waste product that asked for sources - and got them
>clearly enough, and so had his little friends have to speak up for him.
>
>
Filling in the blanks again... I know full well what love is and you
don't have a clue what
I have experienced now or in the past... but you make up shit and think
it gets you
anywhere but looking like a frustrated sexual loon.
>Go shoot yourself, Druggie. It's only a matter of time when One More of
>your kind go crazy and we have more posts from SOMEONE exposing it all over
>usenet.
>
>
>
Heh! you are closer to their kind then I am... who was a magistra????
Not me.
I'm independent.
Try again tani... your response is weak and impotent... yes impotent...
I know it
is hard for a tauranian to hear such... but it is true.
Dagon Productions
Harry Lime wrote:
>Dear Tani:
>
>Please see inside text:
>
>"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
>news:q7UYc.3485$8d1....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
>
>>There is MUCH cultish about screaming at me on this newsgroup when I'm NOT
>>online for a few days. Had it not rained, I'd have NOT been here today -
>>and if it keeps up with good weather, I won't be here till possibly
>>Thursday.
>>
>>There is MUCH cultish about your NOT noticing Walter name and TOS
>>affiliation for that ritual. And then screaming at me with your gang of
>>no-minds when I'm obviously NOT online to read it for a few days.
>>
>>
>
>The Satanic Reds website is under your organization's control, likewise, you
>are the main webmaster. Why *wouldn't* Doug ask you to remove this material
>from the Satanic Red's site. So if I put your Dark Doctrines on one of the
>websites I own, I'm sure you'd be jumping up and down claiming copyright
>infringement in this newsgroup -- as you should IMO. Likewise, if I
>registered "www.satanicreds.com" and www.darkdoctrines.com" it's axiomatic
>that you'd rant and rave that I violated your creative right to your
>monograph.
>
>Why not just admit that this was a mistake on your (or the Satanic Red's
>part), apologize, and move on? Making asinine denials just demonstrates
>again that your using fall guys again for your own personality deficits.
>
>
Heh... I know I'm forcing the hand of chance in hoping as much but if
they want to
bluster and lie... I'm going to milk it for as many laughs as I can get
out of it.
>
>
>>Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact Walter
>>
>>
>and
>
>
>>inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of course,
>>that NEVER occurred to you.
>>
>>
>
>If Walter Bowart is really to blame, I'm sure he can apologize in this
>forum. After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum, why
>wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you? I'm sure you'd
>show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging them
>into this latest spat of yours.
>
>Regards,
>
>Harry Lime
>
>
I'd drop it for an apology... but I doubt it will be forthcoming.
-Douglas
Dagon Productions
You are so damn deluded that you think you can tell me what to do...
why don't you curse me and make me stop???? Bwaahahahahahahhaha...
Impotent little pancaked gap toothed bitch you are... and I got you and
your satanic retards by the balls.
-Douglas
Dagon Productions
me.. I'll post
them all here.
Have bonnie provide a dated file that shows it wrote it before I did.
They can't.
Which makes this such a blast... I can touch any web hosting site that
posts my
work... my proof is incontrovertable... it shows creation date... I
win... you
lose... and the ToS and the satanic retards get to eat crow.
And no, geocities errors on the part of keeping themselves safe... not
idiots like youself... they need to protect their best interest... which
means
they axe anything that could possibly cause them problems... dumbass
people that don't know how the net works... laughing some more!!!!!!
I've been in some flame wars before, but I've not been in one that is
so in the bag.
Laughing all the way,
-Douglas
nak...@juno.com wrote:
> From Walter
>
> The deal is that he can probably file a copyright with the govt. for
> $20, if he's got the energy, at which point I'll challenge it and get
> Craig and Bonnie (the author) into the deal if I can locate Bonnie.
> I'm not sure how to prove authorship and date of creation with digital
> media, but I don't think he can touch you or the site or your
> provider. Call your provider if they give a phone number and see what
> their criteria for responding to copyright infringement is. Then put
> the ritual back up there and tell him to fuck himself.
>
> Walter
>
> He challenged your claim and will check with the authors.
> On Mon, 30 Aug 2004 23:50:26 -0700 Dagon Productions
> <da...@earthlink.net <mailto:da...@earthlink.net>> writes:
> > Go ahead, put it back up and then you can wait and see what happens.
> >
> > I can address you however I desire ya snivelling old kook.
> >
> > -Douglas
> >
> > nak...@juno.com <mailto:nak...@juno.com> wrote:
> >
> > >I got the ritual from WALTER. I suggest you take it up with him.
> > If he
> > >can show that he and other Setians wrote it, it will be BACK UP.
> > >
> > >Do NOT address me in a typically insulting manner in personal
> > email. I
> > >sent you and Watler this email to RESOLVE this crap.
> > >
> > >You are the only KOOK around, Douglas - a man who has no concept
> > that
> > >love is not the same thing as lust - or hunger.
> > >
> > >DO NOT email me again. Deal with Walter on this because Walter is
> > the
> > >person that put forth that ritual.
> > >
> > >On Mon, 30 Aug 2004 19:17:57 -0700 Dagon Productions
> > ><da...@earthlink.net <mailto:da...@earthlink.net>> writes:
> > >
> > >
> > >>nak...@juno.com <mailto:nak...@juno.com> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>OK - settle it. Douglas here of Dagon Productions claims he
> > wrote
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>the
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>ritual for Tezcat.
> > >>>
> > >>>Walter, you claim that you and the other TOS members wrote it.
> > >>>
> > >>>SETTLE IT.
> > >>>
> > >>>For now, I'm removing it off the website with this notice. I'm
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>sick of
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>the CULT spaniels going insane because I'm at the god damned
> > beach
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>for
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>days and NOT paying attention to their fucking frilly whinings.
> >
> > >>>
> > >>>________________________________________________________________
> > >>>The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
> > >>>Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
> > >>>Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com <http://www.juno.com/> to
> sign up today!
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>Now the kookisar is sending me emails.
> > >>
> > >>Again kookisar, there is nothing cultish about pointing out that
> > the
> > >>
> > >>satanic
> > >>retards site contained plagiarized material. If you are going to
> > >>use
> > >>particular words...
> > >>figure out what they mean first.
> > >>
> > >>You are paying attention now... got you to jump and change your
> > >>website };)
> > >>
> > >>I'd love to see Walter cite exactly where he picked up each turn
> > of
> > >>a
> > >>phrase in the directional calls. This should be a hoot.
> > >>
> > >>-Douglas
> > >>
> > >>--
> > >>**********************************************
> > >>Dagon Productions
> > >>Chaos Magick & Occult books
> > >>http://www.dagonproductions.com
> > >>in...@dagonproductions.com <mailto:in...@dagonproductions.com>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >________________________________________________________________
> > >The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
> > >Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
> > >Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com <http://www.juno.com/> to
> sign up today!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > **********************************************
> > Dagon Productions
> > Chaos Magick & Occult books
> > http://www.dagonproductions.com
> > in...@dagonproductions.com <mailto:in...@dagonproductions.com>
Dagon Productions
Kori Houghton
> nak...@juno.com wrote:
>
> >OK - settle it. Douglas here of Dagon Productions claims he wrote the
> >ritual for Tezcat.
> >
> >Walter, you claim that you and the other TOS members wrote it.
> >
> >SETTLE IT.
> >
> >For now, I'm removing it off the website with this notice. I'm sick of
> >the CULT spaniels going insane because I'm at the god damned beach for
> >days and NOT paying attention to their fucking frilly whinings.
> >
> >________________________________________________________________
> >The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
> >Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
> >Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!
Did she really say ***frilly***? Douglas, Harry -- do you wear
frills? I avoid them myself. Being petite and so elderly, ruffles
tend to overwhelm.
Uh, Commissar....can you please enlighten us all with which cult
precisely we are "spaniels" of?
And, no, I didn't realize that you were at the beach literally "for
days", sleeping rough on the sand and everything. I imagine it took
you hours to clean yourself up on Monday morning. No wonder you sound
so grumpy. I understand, really. I do.
Luv,
Kori
Dagon Productions
Kori Houghton wrote:
>Dagon Productions <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<4133DFD...@earthlink.net>...
>
>
>
>>nak...@juno.com wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>OK - settle it. Douglas here of Dagon Productions claims he wrote the
>>>ritual for Tezcat.
>>>
>>>Walter, you claim that you and the other TOS members wrote it.
>>>
>>>SETTLE IT.
>>>
>>>For now, I'm removing it off the website with this notice. I'm sick of
>>>the CULT spaniels going insane because I'm at the god damned beach for
>>>days and NOT paying attention to their fucking frilly whinings.
>>>
>>>________________________________________________________________
>>>The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
>>>Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
>>>Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!
>>>
>>>
>
>Did she really say ***frilly***? Douglas, Harry -- do you wear
>frills? I avoid them myself. Being petite and so elderly, ruffles
>tend to overwhelm.
>
Nah... not my style.
>
>Uh, Commissar....can you please enlighten us all with which cult
>precisely we are "spaniels" of?
>
The hilarious thing is that her calling us part of a cult is very cult
like in itself...
typically cults tend to lop everyone outside of their realm of influence
together.
-Douglas
>
>And, no, I didn't realize that you were at the beach literally "for
>days", sleeping rough on the sand and everything. I imagine it took
>you hours to clean yourself up on Monday morning. No wonder you sound
>so grumpy. I understand, really. I do.
>
>Luv,
>Kori
>
>
>
>
>
>>Now the kookisar is sending me emails.
>>
>>Again kookisar, there is nothing cultish about pointing out that the
>>satanic
>>retards site contained plagiarized material. If you are going to use
>>particular words...
>>figure out what they mean first.
>>
>>You are paying attention now... got you to jump and change your
>>website };)
>>
>>I'd love to see Walter cite exactly where he picked up each turn of a
>>phrase in the directional calls. This should be a hoot.
>>
>>-Douglas
>>
>>
--
Dagon Productions
Maybe I will file with the gov't... for shits and giggles. I'm sure my
evidence will
sit fine with them.
Challenge it. Unless you can prove that my file, the cdrs produced a
decade ago
which contain my rite have been altered... you will lose.
Geocities is easy... they do not put up with copyright infringment
whatsover... I've
seen them yank whole sites for one page infringements.
Put the site back up... I dare ya. Go ahead and take legal advice from a
dimwit.
-Douglas
nak...@juno.com wrote:
> > >>nak...@juno.com <mailto:nak...@juno.com> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>OK - settle it. Douglas here of Dagon Productions claims he
> > wrote
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>the
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>ritual for Tezcat.
> > >>>
> > >>>Walter, you claim that you and the other TOS members wrote it.
> > >>>
> > >>>SETTLE IT.
> > >>>
> > >>>For now, I'm removing it off the website with this notice. I'm
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>sick of
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>the CULT spaniels going insane because I'm at the god damned
> > beach
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>for
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>>days and NOT paying attention to their fucking frilly whinings.
> >
> > >>>
> > >>>________________________________________________________________
> > >>>The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
> > >>>Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
> > >>>Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com <http://www.juno.com/> to
> sign up today!
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>Now the kookisar is sending me emails.
> > >>
> > >>Again kookisar, there is nothing cultish about pointing out that
> > the
> > >>
> > >>satanic
> > >>retards site contained plagiarized material. If you are going to
> > >>use
> > >>particular words...
> > >>figure out what they mean first.
> > >>
> > >>You are paying attention now... got you to jump and change your
> > >>website };)
> > >>
> > >>I'd love to see Walter cite exactly where he picked up each turn
> > of
> > >>a
> > >>phrase in the directional calls. This should be a hoot.
> > >>
> > >>-Douglas
> > >>
> > >>--
> > >>**********************************************
> > >>Dagon Productions
> > >>Chaos Magick & Occult books
> > >>http://www.dagonproductions.com
> > >>in...@dagonproductions.com <mailto:in...@dagonproductions.com>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >________________________________________________________________
> > >The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
> > >Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
> > >Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com <http://www.juno.com/> to
> sign up today!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > **********************************************
> > Dagon Productions
> > Chaos Magick & Occult books
> > http://www.dagonproductions.com
> > in...@dagonproductions.com <mailto:in...@dagonproductions.com>
Harry Lime
Please see inside text:
"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
news:IXVYc.3475$w%6.1...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Harry, well, a decent email. I DID take it down, but for shit's sakes -
> consider I was NOT ONLINE for the (apparently) DAYS that this convo went
on.
> That's a problem, screaming on here and everyone and their brother jumping
> in, if I'm not online.
>
> You can see what Walter posted to Douglas. He challenges Doug's
authorship
> and will further check it out with former AND present Temple of Set
members
> that wrote those things up. Had Doug simply written to Walter (who's name
> IS on there), it wouldn't have been another "cultie issue for you guys."
Walter hasn't posted here regularly since we discussed the Frankfurter
weenie roast. You might be well served by just admitting that this was in
error, apologize, and take the contentious material off your site. Funny,
this is what you ended up doing anyway. Given the fact that you did get it
from Walter via the ToS is not salient to the argument considering it was on
your site. As I've discussed below, if I happened to take pieces of your
monograph, put them on one of my websites, I'm sure you'd have an issue with
this. If the Dark Doctrines material I had on my website was from a third
party, I'd still be culpable for a copyright violation.
>
> I'm wondering just exactly "which part" is Doug claiming he wrote? I'm
not
> denying a thing, Harry - but Walter IS challenging it. I talked to him
> about it before I posted earlier today. Finally, I just decided to remove
> it until it's resolved. Now Walter posted something to Doug.
I doubt that Doug would take the risk of making himself a total idiot in
alt.satanism by making the claim of copyright violation sans any legitimate
evidence. He sells books so I'd have to figure he knows how serious these
allegations can be. Unfortunately, in my life I've done battles with a
company that used a device I helped design without paying me adequately for
my efforts. After several years of paying lawyers, I finally got this
organization to make a out-of-court settlement with me. As my attorney
suggested, this company would have been better served by just paying me
rather than creating legal obstacles in the hope that I'd drop my lawsuit.
In retrospect, had I been Walter, I'd just claim to get this material from a
third party, apologize, and not make any more fuss. It doesn't serve you or
Walter to make slurs against Doug. Had it been me, I'd probably resolve to
take this to the next step. We all handle things differently I guess.
>
> Yes, I say nasty things to Doug because he has, from day one, said nasty
> things to ME. Very very simple.
>
> I find nothing embarassing about this entire issue. Not in the least. I
> don't embarass easily, Harry.
Yes, I've gathered this.
>
> The Temple of Set heh, happily handed me more ammo against people that
have
> seriously messed with them than anyone else you see on here and their info
> wasn't rumor mongering bs, .... except ONE other person - a COS member.
> No, not Audy and not Lucinda. A member in "good standing." Heh. I'm
sure
> that if Aquino still had the Smoking Mirror Pylon (maybe it's still in the
> TOS, I have no idea) and had material that was written by OTHER than the
> people who claim to write it, he'd want to know. I didn't drag the TOS
into
> anything. The ritual BELONGED to a ToS Pylon for years, according to
> Walter, written by them. Some of those people are still in the TOS. I'm
> sure they DO want to know.
>
> Walter will contact both current and former TOS members and find out
details
> about it - as he has posted on here to Doug. For all I know, he may put
it
> up on his personal website - it's up to him. I really don't want to be in
> the MIDDLE of this crap.
Well, can't blame you there. I just hope Walter follows through.
>
> Keep in mind, the only time I flame anyone is when they flame me. Don't
> flame me, I don't flame them. They have serious issues with agreeing to
> DISagree - as do you. They - and you - also have serious issues with
ideas
> that I have "control" over anyone OTHER than my own self. I know the COS
> does that kind of thing - and SO DO YOU by your own admission. I know who
> is "friendly" toward them, and who will attack their perceived
detractors -
> because I was TOLD DIRECTLY who was who when I first got online in late
1999
> or 2000. Very simple. SR is not run that way - AT ALL. We DO make
> information public and put links to where more can be found IF we know of
> them. But some information IS sold - copyrighted, and yes, ISBN numbers,
> published by Marsh in Association with Oneiros Books.
It eludes me what this has to do with the potential copyright violation
suggested by Doug.
>
> And btw, I never accused Shaw of plagiarising anything. He accused Satan
> Shop of it, he accused Panpipes of it, and then, out of the blue and for
no
> VISIBLE reason, he accused me of it when the two drawings are obiously NOT
> the same. Aside from that, Morena owns copyrights to the thing - so
that's
> that - and that covers ANY rendition of it.
I'd disagree that "Morena" owns a general copyright to the Baphomet, but
that's another thread.
> I don't even use it, or sell
> it. SHE said I could make images public for public use. I did that in
> order to STOP people connected to SR that have their own offshoot orgs and
> sites from using the damned Lavey version. They should THANK me for that.
> Apparently, the cult wants people to keep using their material so they can
> whine and bitch about it. Well, it's no longer an issue anymore - the
> copyright for it exists - and it overrides trademarks - especially lapsed
> ones.
I think the court is still out on whether it's no longer an issue anymore,
but time will tell.
Yeah, but it works both ways. Doug would have to make a pretty good case
that he lost income if he can prove that the material on the SR site was
indeed his. I think he enjoys making you squirm, frankly.
>
> Likewise, if I
> > registered "www.satanicreds.com" and www.darkdoctrines.com" it's
axiomatic
> > that you'd rant and rave that I violated your creative right to your
> > monograph.
> >
> > Why not just admit that this was a mistake on your (or the Satanic Red's
> > part), apologize, and move on? Making asinine denials just demonstrates
> > again that your using fall guys again for your own personality deficits.
>
> I made no denials of anything - and don' thave to apologize for a thing I
> did NOT do. I contacted Walter, I posted what he said earlier, I waited a
> short while for HIM to post and clear this up - I decided to remove it
until
> it's resolved - and now Walter posted. Simple. This has absolutely
nothing
> to do with my personality. It had a LOT to do with the fact that I'm NOT
> online everyday and with a person that decided to just ACCUSE instead of
> ASK.
It's not the end result that has to do with your personality, it's the
manner in which you react to the accusation. The SR is your organization,
and as far as I know you are primarily the one responsible for the updating
of the site, ergo, it's your responsibility. If Doug, for example, had an
employee give him 100 copies of a book called "Dark Eastern Philosophy" by
Dale Seago (that was more or less a copy of your monograph), it'd be Doug as
the responsible party if you wanted a legal remedy. This is pretty much the
same thing as you publishing the material if it is Doug's.
> >
> > >
> > > Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact
Walter
> > and
> > > inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of
course,
> > > that NEVER occurred to you.
> >
> > If Walter Bowart is really to blame, I'm sure he can apologize in this
> > forum.
>
> Who? Walter Radke challenged Doug's claim. He just posted it. Go read
> it.
You can call Walter whatever name you want and I'll do the same. I read his
post and I was as about as impressed with this missive as I was with his
arguments regarding the Frankfurt School (sorry, couldn't help myself). Doug
makes a serious claim, by Walter Bowart making silly references to Doug's
past substance abuse detracts from his claim that Doug didn't write the
material in question. We all have skeletons in our closet, I'm sure Walter
might have a spare scapula or femur lying around somewhere.
>
> After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum, why
> > wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you?
>
> Embarras? I don't embarras easily.
>
> I'm sure you'd
> > show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging
them
> > into this latest spat of yours.
>
> It's not a spat of mine. It's a spat of Doug's - and since Walter
posted -
> I guess it's a spat between the RIGHT parties - leaving me out of it. I'm
> responsible for myself, Harry. Not for others.
Sometime I hope you do a bit of self-examination and question why
controversy follows you in this newsgroup.
Regards,
Harry Lime
Harry Lime
Please see inside text:
"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:413433F9...@earthlink.net...
Yeah, it is funny I must admit.
>
> >
> >
> >>Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact Walter
> >>
> >>
> >and
> >
> >
> >>inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of course,
> >>that NEVER occurred to you.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >If Walter Bowart is really to blame, I'm sure he can apologize in this
> >forum. After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum,
why
> >wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you? I'm sure you'd
> >show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging them
> >into this latest spat of yours.
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Harry Lime
> >
> >
>
> I'd drop it for an apology... but I doubt it will be forthcoming.
Well, I'd like to think they have the maturity to just bite the bullet and
apologize, but I doubt this'll happen. Funny, both Tani and Walter are
authors and I think they'd just do this for professional courtesy. Just from
a purely financial point-of-view, I'm surprised Jantsang wouldn't want to
make "nice, nice" with you so she could peddle her stuff other than at Satan
Shop or from her P.O. Box.
Regards,
Harry Lime
Harry Lime
Please see inside text:
>
> > nak...@juno.com wrote:
> >
> > >OK - settle it. Douglas here of Dagon Productions claims he wrote the
> > >ritual for Tezcat.
> > >
> > >Walter, you claim that you and the other TOS members wrote it.
> > >
> > >SETTLE IT.
> > >
> > >For now, I'm removing it off the website with this notice. I'm sick of
> > >the CULT spaniels going insane because I'm at the god damned beach for
> > >days and NOT paying attention to their fucking frilly whinings.
> > >
> > >________________________________________________________________
> > >The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand!
> > >Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER!
> > >Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today!
>
> Did she really say ***frilly***? Douglas, Harry -- do you wear
> frills? I avoid them myself. Being petite and so elderly, ruffles
> tend to overwhelm.
Oh I'm quite "frilly," I'd venture to guess some might call me "frou frou"
especially when I attend one of Walter Bowart's Mind Control Conspiracy
Lectures camoflauged in my best Bessie The Fatlady Shocking Lime Organza
Mumu Gowns with my "I Luv The Frankfurt School" button right above my
exposed midrift smoking Virginia Slims 120s! Hotchacha! Thank the
"thatness" that you're not stacked like some in this forum as your
mammallian protrubrances would be dangling somewhere near your liver-spotted
ankles -- Gawd knows my manboobs do. (Mostly due to all of the cannabis I
smoked as a youth.)
>
> Uh, Commissar....can you please enlighten us all with which cult
> precisely we are "spaniels" of?
>
> And, no, I didn't realize that you were at the beach literally "for
> days", sleeping rough on the sand and everything. I imagine it took
> you hours to clean yourself up on Monday morning. No wonder you sound
> so grumpy. I understand, really. I do.
LOL!
Regards,
Harry LIme
Dagon Productions
Harry Lime wrote:
>Dear Tani:
>
>Please see inside text:
>
>"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
>news:IXVYc.3475$w%6.1...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
>
>>Harry, well, a decent email. I DID take it down, but for shit's sakes -
>>consider I was NOT ONLINE for the (apparently) DAYS that this convo went
>>
>>
>on.
>
>
>>That's a problem, screaming on here and everyone and their brother jumping
>>in, if I'm not online.
>>
>>You can see what Walter posted to Douglas. He challenges Doug's
>>
>>
>authorship
>
>
>>and will further check it out with former AND present Temple of Set
>>
>>
>members
>
>
>>that wrote those things up. Had Doug simply written to Walter (who's name
>>IS on there), it wouldn't have been another "cultie issue for you guys."
>>
>>
>
>Walter hasn't posted here regularly since we discussed the Frankfurter
>weenie roast. You might be well served by just admitting that this was in
>error, apologize, and take the contentious material off your site. Funny,
>this is what you ended up doing anyway.
>
Sans apology.
>Given the fact that you did get it
>from Walter via the ToS is not salient to the argument considering it was on
>your site. As I've discussed below, if I happened to take pieces of your
>monograph, put them on one of my websites, I'm sure you'd have an issue with
>this. If the Dark Doctrines material I had on my website was from a third
>party, I'd still be culpable for a copyright violation.
>
That is correct.
>
>
>
>>I'm wondering just exactly "which part" is Doug claiming he wrote? I'm
>>
>>
>not
>
>
>>denying a thing, Harry - but Walter IS challenging it. I talked to him
>>about it before I posted earlier today. Finally, I just decided to remove
>>it until it's resolved. Now Walter posted something to Doug.
>>
>>
>
>I doubt that Doug would take the risk of making himself a total idiot in
>alt.satanism by making the claim of copyright violation sans any legitimate
>evidence. He sells books so I'd have to figure he knows how serious these
>allegations can be.
>
That is correct. I was actually surprised when I came acros the
plagiarism... had to go
double check my work and the relevant files, cdrs, etc.
Why would I be so damn stupid to shoot myself in the foot by making a
false claim... I would not... I bet on sure things... and this was surely
a slam dunk.
>Unfortunately, in my life I've done battles with a
>company that used a device I helped design without paying me adequately for
>my efforts. After several years of paying lawyers, I finally got this
>organization to make a out-of-court settlement with me. As my attorney
>suggested, this company would have been better served by just paying me
>rather than creating legal obstacles in the hope that I'd drop my lawsuit.
>In retrospect, had I been Walter, I'd just claim to get this material from a
>third party, apologize, and not make any more fuss. It doesn't serve you or
>Walter to make slurs against Doug. Had it been me, I'd probably resolve to
>take this to the next step. We all handle things differently I guess.
>
Well, tani and walter are both stubborn and now walter has the srs as
well as
the ToSs reputations on the line. I'm sure he will attempt whatever he
can to
clear himself... but he is fighting a lost cause. So I will amuse
myself as
they game gets played out.
Well, you trusted tossers... should have known better considering the
antics of it's
founder, so you are in the middle of this crap. tani doesn't have the
brain power
to comprehend how she is responsible for my work being posted publically
to her
site when I desired it not to.
>
>
>
>>Keep in mind, the only time I flame anyone is when they flame me. Don't
>>flame me, I don't flame them. They have serious issues with agreeing to
>>DISagree - as do you. They - and you - also have serious issues with
>>
>>
>ideas
>
>
>>that I have "control" over anyone OTHER than my own self. I know the COS
>>does that kind of thing - and SO DO YOU by your own admission. I know who
>>is "friendly" toward them, and who will attack their perceived
>>
>>
>detractors -
>
>
>>because I was TOLD DIRECTLY who was who when I first got online in late
>>
>>
>1999
>
>
>>or 2000. Very simple. SR is not run that way - AT ALL. We DO make
>>information public and put links to where more can be found IF we know of
>>them. But some information IS sold - copyrighted, and yes, ISBN numbers,
>>published by Marsh in Association with Oneiros Books.
>>
>>
>
>It eludes me what this has to do with the potential copyright violation
>suggested by Doug.
>
>
tani likes to bring in subjects that are completely irrelevant to the
discussion at hand...
she thinks this is normal.
I know how easy it is to get a free site removed due to even the
allegation of
copyright infringement.
I'm doing a service to the internet and the world by wacking tani with a
Zen
stick... maybe she will learn... but it's hard for an old dog, and I
mean that
literally, to learn new tricks. };)
That is correct. Hell there was a artist that had a couple drawings in a
book I
republished... the artist found out I republished the book and wrote me
emails
telling me I owed him money for republishing his artwork... fortunately I
was smart enough to know this could happen... so I took out his art.
In publishing it is best to get signed releases for anything one
reprints...
not a bad idea for websites IMHO.
>
>
>
>>>>Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact
>>>>
>>>>
>Walter
>
>
>>>and
>>>
>>>
>>>>inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of
>>>>
>>>>
>course,
>
>
>>>>that NEVER occurred to you.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>If Walter Bowart is really to blame, I'm sure he can apologize in this
>>>forum.
>>>
>>>
>>Who? Walter Radke challenged Doug's claim. He just posted it. Go read
>>it.
>>
>>
>
>You can call Walter whatever name you want and I'll do the same. I read his
>post and I was as about as impressed with this missive as I was with his
>arguments regarding the Frankfurt School (sorry, couldn't help myself). Doug
>makes a serious claim, by Walter Bowart making silly references to Doug's
>past substance abuse detracts from his claim that Doug didn't write the
>material in question. We all have skeletons in our closet, I'm sure Walter
>might have a spare scapula or femur lying around somewhere.
>
I'm not ashamed of my skeletons... they are the sort of experiences I
wouldn't
wish on my worst enemy... yet I wouldn't trade them for anything in the
world
now. What doesn't kill me, makes me stronger.
>
>
>
>>After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum, why
>>
>>
>>>wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you?
>>>
>>>
>>Embarras? I don't embarras easily.
>>
>>I'm sure you'd
>>
>>
>>>show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging
>>>
>>>
>them
>
>
>>>into this latest spat of yours.
>>>
>>>
>>It's not a spat of mine. It's a spat of Doug's - and since Walter
>>
>>
>posted -
>
>
>>I guess it's a spat between the RIGHT parties - leaving me out of it. I'm
>>responsible for myself, Harry. Not for others.
>>
>>
>
>Sometime I hope you do a bit of self-examination and question why
>controversy follows you in this newsgroup.
>
>
I doubt she is capable.
-Douglas
>Regards,
>
>Harry Lime
>
>
>
>>>Regards,
>>>
>>>Harry Lime
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Had I known that you had ANY authorship in that material, even with
>>>>permission I'd NOT put it up there.
>>>>
>>>>
>>That's the truth - even IF he said it was OK to put up there. I'd not
>>
>>
>want
>
>
>>it near our stuff simply because it's from his hand. Walter challenges
>>that. We'll see where that goes.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
--
Dagon Productions
Harry Lime wrote:
Harry,
Yes it is... damn when I realized that it was my words on the sr website...
I just died laughing... I had not even reread the rite of mine for many
years... but the wording was put forth in a manner that I
never really cared for... which again is why I never published the
work on the net. But it has served a useful purpose providing me
with a goldmine of hilarity.
>
>
>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Had you done what a normal human being would have done - contact Walter
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>and
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>inquire decently about it - things would have gone smoother. Of course,
>>>>that NEVER occurred to you.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>If Walter Bowart is really to blame, I'm sure he can apologize in this
>>>forum. After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum,
>>>
>>>
>why
>
>
>>>wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you? I'm sure you'd
>>>show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging them
>>>into this latest spat of yours.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>
>>>Harry Lime
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>I'd drop it for an apology... but I doubt it will be forthcoming.
>>
>>
>
>Well, I'd like to think they have the maturity to just bite the bullet and
>apologize, but I doubt this'll happen. Funny, both Tani and Walter are
>authors and I think they'd just do this for professional courtesy. Just from
>a purely financial point-of-view, I'm surprised Jantsang wouldn't want to
>make "nice, nice" with you so she could peddle her stuff other than at Satan
>Shop or from her P.O. Box.
>
>Regards,
>
>Harry Lime
>
I generally do business with people I trust or respect in some manner...
I'd have
a hard time finding such with tani.
Hell... she could have just admitted her mistake... but now she is
siding with
the plagiarists... so she has made her bed and gets to lie in the middle
of it };)
Best,
Harry Lime
Please see inside text:
"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:413544F3...@earthlink.net...
>
>
> Harry Lime wrote:
>
> >Dear Tani:
> >
> >Please see inside text:
> >
> >"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
> >news:IXVYc.3475$w%6.1...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> >
> >
> >>Harry, well, a decent email. I DID take it down, but for shit's sakes -
> >>consider I was NOT ONLINE for the (apparently) DAYS that this convo went
> >>
> >>
> >on.
> >
> >
> >>That's a problem, screaming on here and everyone and their brother
jumping
> >>in, if I'm not online.
> >>
> >>You can see what Walter posted to Douglas. He challenges Doug's
> >>
> >>
> >authorship
> >
> >
> >>and will further check it out with former AND present Temple of Set
> >>
> >>
> >members
> >
> >
> >>that wrote those things up. Had Doug simply written to Walter (who's
name
> >>IS on there), it wouldn't have been another "cultie issue for you guys."
> >>
> >>
> >
> >Walter hasn't posted here regularly since we discussed the Frankfurter
> >weenie roast. You might be well served by just admitting that this was
in
> >error, apologize, and take the contentious material off your site. Funny,
> >this is what you ended up doing anyway.
> >
>
> Sans apology.
Well if they were smart, they'd just apologize and go on.
Yes, I do the same thing too.
>
> >Unfortunately, in my life I've done battles with a
> >company that used a device I helped design without paying me adequately
for
> >my efforts. After several years of paying lawyers, I finally got this
> >organization to make a out-of-court settlement with me. As my attorney
> >suggested, this company would have been better served by just paying me
> >rather than creating legal obstacles in the hope that I'd drop my
lawsuit.
> >In retrospect, had I been Walter, I'd just claim to get this material
from a
> >third party, apologize, and not make any more fuss. It doesn't serve you
or
> >Walter to make slurs against Doug. Had it been me, I'd probably resolve
to
> >take this to the next step. We all handle things differently I guess.
> >
>
> Well, tani and walter are both stubborn and now walter has the srs as
> well as
> the ToSs reputations on the line. I'm sure he will attempt whatever he
> can to
> clear himself... but he is fighting a lost cause. So I will amuse
> myself as
> they game gets played out.
And why not? Some people take this newsgroup far too seriously.
In my few dealings with Aquino, he's always been very pleasant. I've never
been a member of the ToS so as to how he treats people in his organization,
I don't know and I haven't had any sort of interactions with ToS members
either. Hard for me to make a value judgement here.
tani doesn't have the
> brain power
> to comprehend how she is responsible for my work being posted publically
> to her
> site when I desired it not to.
Oh, I'd give her a bit of a break. Despite all the yammering she did take
the page down. Hard to say if this was out of fear or something resembling
ethics. I'll let you be your own judge, I'm sure you know where my
prejudices lie.
>
> >
> >
> >
> >>Keep in mind, the only time I flame anyone is when they flame me. Don't
> >>flame me, I don't flame them. They have serious issues with agreeing to
> >>DISagree - as do you. They - and you - also have serious issues with
> >>
> >>
> >ideas
> >
> >
> >>that I have "control" over anyone OTHER than my own self. I know the
COS
> >>does that kind of thing - and SO DO YOU by your own admission. I know
who
> >>is "friendly" toward them, and who will attack their perceived
> >>
> >>
> >detractors -
> >
> >
> >>because I was TOLD DIRECTLY who was who when I first got online in late
> >>
> >>
> >1999
> >
> >
> >>or 2000. Very simple. SR is not run that way - AT ALL. We DO make
> >>information public and put links to where more can be found IF we know
of
> >>them. But some information IS sold - copyrighted, and yes, ISBN
numbers,
> >>published by Marsh in Association with Oneiros Books.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >It eludes me what this has to do with the potential copyright violation
> >suggested by Doug.
> >
> >
>
> tani likes to bring in subjects that are completely irrelevant to the
> discussion at hand...
> she thinks this is normal.
I'd agree with you here.
I doubt she's capable of learning this.
I always get releases in my little video productions. Several times this has
saved my fat arse. I've got a friend that used to feature his girlfriend in
some of his adult flicks without her signing a release. After their breakup,
she decided to sue. Not a pretty picture.
I dunno Doug, I'd have to argue that from my own experience, chiva doesn't
make anybody stronger. I can recall many times watching junkies being
administered naloxone too late. Fentanyl was always my drug of choice, btw,
as it doesn't show up in those pesky ua's.
>
> >
> >
> >
> >>After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum, why
> >>
> >>
> >>>wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>Embarras? I don't embarras easily.
> >>
> >>I'm sure you'd
> >>
> >>
> >>>show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging
> >>>
> >>>
> >them
> >
> >
> >>>into this latest spat of yours.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>It's not a spat of mine. It's a spat of Doug's - and since Walter
> >>
> >>
> >posted -
> >
> >
> >>I guess it's a spat between the RIGHT parties - leaving me out of it.
I'm
> >>responsible for myself, Harry. Not for others.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >Sometime I hope you do a bit of self-examination and question why
> >controversy follows you in this newsgroup.
> >
> >
>
> I doubt she is capable.
Sadly, I think you're right here.
Regards,
Harry Lime
Dagon Productions
See inside:
Harry Lime wrote:
That is asking quite a bit considering their past behavior. But it
would have
taken most of the fire out of a situation that is burning them.
That is what is amazing... it's like they keep walking into a wall over
and over again.
I've had a few dealings with Aquino and witnessed his outings of Lupo
here years
ago. So my view of him has been sullied. His justifications for outing
Lupo and
insisting that he make his FAQ a propaganda tool of the ToS just
didn't cut the mustard for any man of integrity.
> tani doesn't have the
>
>
>>brain power
>>to comprehend how she is responsible for my work being posted publically
>> to her
>>site when I desired it not to.
>>
>>
>
>Oh, I'd give her a bit of a break. Despite all the yammering she did take
>the page down. Hard to say if this was out of fear or something resembling
>ethics. I'll let you be your own judge, I'm sure you know where my
>prejudices lie.
>
>
I see it as one of the few smart moves tani has made... geocities would
most likely
have taken the page down and quite possibly taken the whole site down.
I imagine not.
I wasn't your typical junkie... highly fuctional... kept my job, didn't
steal, etc.
Considering the high recidivism rate for heroin addicts, overcoming the
addiction shows a high level of persistance and determination... not falling
into typical addict behavior such as stealing from family, friends,
employers,
etc is even less likely. I held a high level of integrity for a heroin
addict... even
William Burroughs respected my journey and found my situation odd and
out of character for a
junkie.
Heroin use is an excellent analogy for "one pointedness of mind"...
which at least
for occultists is a valued technique to master. Addicts have this
mastered hands down... getting
their next fix is their only goal... though driven by chemical need...
remove the chemical
need and put into its place the item of ones choice and voila... I
created a record label,
a publishing company, a graphic arts venture, seminar and live music
promotion, etc...
all unrealized prior to this. I've worked with authors, bands (the list
is long including Crash
Worship, Sublime, US Bombs, Stitches, Muslimgauze, Merzbow, Skullflower
and on and on.)
The extreme change shocked many that knew me... which actually created a
sense of
awe and trust... and further opportunity. Heroin use like LSD or any
chemognostic
drug use opens neural pathways that can be kept open w/o further drug
use... Heroin
has a propensity for being useful in Lucid Dreaming, relaxation,
incredible visions, etc.
To indulge gives one a gateway that others may not come to without
considerable
practice.
Like I said... it is not something I would wish on my worst enemy... it
is an
experience I wouldn't trade now for anything in the world... it opened
my eyes...
going from a live fast die young punk rocker to a productive contributor to
music, art and occult culture in a very short period of time and a
successful one at that.
Admittedly most do not fare as well as I did... one of the reasons
I don't recommend my route of illumination.
>
>
>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum, why
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Embarras? I don't embarras easily.
>>>>
>>>>I'm sure you'd
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>them
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>into this latest spat of yours.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>It's not a spat of mine. It's a spat of Doug's - and since Walter
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>posted -
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I guess it's a spat between the RIGHT parties - leaving me out of it.
>>>>
>>>>
>I'm
>
>
>>>>responsible for myself, Harry. Not for others.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>Sometime I hope you do a bit of self-examination and question why
>>>controversy follows you in this newsgroup.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>I doubt she is capable.
>>
>>
>
>Sadly, I think you're right here.
>
>Regards,
>
>Harry Lime
>
>
It's pretty obvious. Her silence is deafening... I imagine her chomping
at the
bit hoping she doesn't get dirty in this whole fiasco, but alas too late.
-Douglas
Harry Lime
Please see inside text:
"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:41358816...@earthlink.net...
Their lack of being able to think strategically (sp?) never ceases to make
me chuckle. I've found it interesting how so many in the occult/Satanism
(not just the SRs) perceive themselves to be experts in human nature, but
are pretty much incapable of dealing with others either face-to-face or in a
newsgroup with any elan.
True.
Well I'll give you this one.
>
> > tani doesn't have the
> >
> >
> >>brain power
> >>to comprehend how she is responsible for my work being posted publically
> >> to her
> >>site when I desired it not to.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >Oh, I'd give her a bit of a break. Despite all the yammering she did take
> >the page down. Hard to say if this was out of fear or something
resembling
> >ethics. I'll let you be your own judge, I'm sure you know where my
> >prejudices lie.
> >
> >
>
> I see it as one of the few smart moves tani has made... geocities would
> most likely
> have taken the page down and quite possibly taken the whole site down.
Wonder if this would've forced her to actually pay for a domain and set up a
website? It escapes me why she doesn't pay the $10 per month for a domain
and a legit presence on the web. Had I been in her place, I would've done
this years ago -- especially considering all of the enemies she claims are
out to "get" her. LOL!
He'd of been in a better situation if he just married her and separated the
biz after they divorced. Hindsight is always 20/20 I guess.
This is the exception rather than the rule. As an aside, I think the public
would be shocked to know how many professionals (specifically doctors and
lawyers) are closet addicts. Mostly its cannabis (which I think should be
legalized and not necessarily and addiction) but there's a lot of gas
passers (anesthesiologists) and "pain management specialists" that get
hooked.
Interesting. If you don't mind me asking, what do you think separated you
from the addict that's compelled to use until they literally die and
yourself? If this is too personal, I understand.
>
> >
> >
> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>After the nasty things you've written about Doug in this forum, why
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>wouldn't he take pleasure in publically embarrassing you?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>Embarras? I don't embarras easily.
> >>>>
> >>>>I'm sure you'd
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>show him the same courtesy. Perhaps the ToS will enjoy you dragging
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>them
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>into this latest spat of yours.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>It's not a spat of mine. It's a spat of Doug's - and since Walter
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>posted -
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>I guess it's a spat between the RIGHT parties - leaving me out of it.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >I'm
> >
> >
> >>>>responsible for myself, Harry. Not for others.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>Sometime I hope you do a bit of self-examination and question why
> >>>controversy follows you in this newsgroup.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>I doubt she is capable.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >Sadly, I think you're right here.
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Harry Lime
> >
> >
>
>
> It's pretty obvious. Her silence is deafening... I imagine her chomping
> at the
> bit hoping she doesn't get dirty in this whole fiasco, but alas too late.
If I were her, I'd be a bit suspicious of Walter Bowart and his "sources" --
but that's just me.
Regards,
Harry Lime
Tani Jantsang
>
>
Douglas, this is my LAST word on this issue - and keep in mind that I did
take it DOWN - but here you are, CONTINUING.
Quote
--------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "Walter Alter" <neu
To:
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 08:34:39 -0700
That ritual was on the TOS website, accessable only to members, since
shortly after we did the ritual in 1996. He must have ripped it from your
site.
Walter
UNQUOTE
Leave me out of it. Cease and desist making a whining idiot of yourself. I
took it down days ago.
Tani Jantsang
> Dear Tani:
>
> Please see inside text:
>
> this is what you ended up doing anyway.
Yes, I did as soon as it took too long for Walter to get back on it. I took
it down. So then, WHAT is all this further discussion about? It's belly
aching, whining, bitching for the sake of bitching by what I consider a man
with NO EROS in him. Nuff said.
Given the fact that you did get it
> from Walter via the ToS is not salient to the argument considering it was
on
> your site.
Indeed it is. The DDocs have NO rituals involved with them, SR had NO
rituals on the site at all. If anything, the actual view from DDoc people
is that rituals are not necessary behavior - and other pretty negative
things said of it. People in the org that disagreed with that view and who
did rituals wanted them and finally, quite recently some were put up.
Walter gave us the TOS rituals. He has his own set of proofs with regard to
these too - namely that he saw the Setian writing it with his own eyes and
so did others.
As I've discussed below, if I happened to take pieces of your
> monograph, put them on one of my websites, I'm sure you'd have an issue
with
> this. If the Dark Doctrines material I had on my website was from a third
> party, I'd still be culpable for a copyright violation.
True - however I TOOK IT DOWN. So what's all the belly aching about? The
issue as it stands now is between Walter and Douglas. I just posted what
Walter said - and Douglas will simply have to give him time to track down
the people involved in this. I don't know most of them. I have nothing to
do with most of them. So this whole further discussion is just whining on
his part. Bellyaching - because he just LOVES to bellyache.
>
> >
> > I'm wondering just exactly "which part" is Doug claiming he wrote? I'm
> not
> > denying a thing, Harry - but Walter IS challenging it. I talked to him
> > about it before I posted earlier today. Finally, I just decided to
remove
> > it until it's resolved. Now Walter posted something to Doug.
>
> I doubt that Doug would take the risk of making himself a total idiot in
> alt.satanism by making the claim of copyright violation sans any
legitimate
> evidence.
I doubt the same for the Temple of Set people involved in writing it. Why
are you even talking to me further about this? I TOOK IT DOWN. End of
story. As in - THE END?
> > I find nothing embarassing about this entire issue. Not in the least.
I
> > don't embarass easily, Harry.
>
> Yes, I've gathered this.
Sure thing. I'm walking on ice and I slip and fall. Embarassed? Hell, I'd
laugh my ass off so hard I couldn't even get up. It's FUNNY.
>
>
> Well, can't blame you there. I just hope Walter follows through.
He will, given enough time. Things like this take time. 1996 is a long
time ago - and well, I just posted what he said to Doug about it. Can he
prove what he's saying? Sure he can. But leave ME out of it.
I have rituals up there written by Sean Haile. I take it on good faith that
Sean WROTE them. Some others given to me were not written by the comrades -
and I refused to put them up there. So I wrote some. I don't DO rituals,
Harry. I don't usually associate with anyone who DOES, either. Ritualistic
behavior is - well - ritualistic behavior. If I had to take part in one,
I'd bust out laughing.
>
> I'd disagree that "Morena" owns a general copyright to the Baphomet, but
> that's another thread.
She actually does - I've seen the paperwork. Audy will probably make it
public given enough time. They just moved into a huger store and are BUSY
PEOPLE. Too busy to fuss with this shit.
>
> >
> > On this newsgroup? There are STIFF $$$ penalties for taking copyright
> > material - and DDocs are copyright with the government, TX number and
all.
>
> Yeah, but it works both ways. Doug would have to make a pretty good case
> that he lost income if he can prove that the material on the SR site was
> indeed his. I think he enjoys making you squirm, frankly.
He's not making ME do anything since I do not OWN the website. Aside from
which, I just posted what Walter had to say about it.
>
> >
> > I made no denials of anything - and don' thave to apologize for a thing
I
> > did NOT do. I contacted Walter, I posted what he said earlier, I waited
a
> > short while for HIM to post and clear this up - I decided to remove it
> until
> > it's resolved - and now Walter posted. Simple. This has absolutely
> nothing
> > to do with my personality. It had a LOT to do with the fact that I'm
NOT
> > online everyday and with a person that decided to just ACCUSE instead of
> > ASK.
>
> It's not the end result that has to do with your personality, it's the
> manner in which you react to the accusation.
No, it's the end result of how I react to a trash-mouthing bastard screaming
at me when I'm not even online. It's the fact that he MADE an accusation
instead of asking WHERE it came from and HOW it came to be on the SR
website. Fact is, Brendan put it up there at the time, as Webmaster.
> > > > Had I known that you had ANY authorship in that material, even with
> > > > permission I'd NOT put it up there.
> >
> > That's the truth - even IF he said it was OK to put up there. I'd not
> want
> > it near our stuff simply because it's from his hand. Walter challenges
> > that. We'll see where that goes.
> >
> >
I also said that.
Tani Jantsang
>
>
> Well, tani and walter are both stubborn and now walter has the srs as
> well as
> the ToSs reputations on the line. I'm sure he will attempt whatever he
> can to
> clear himself... but he is fighting a lost cause. So I will amuse
> myself as
> they game gets played out.
No, I am not stubborn. I asked about it on the DAY I saw your missive. It
took too long to get more details and so I took it down on the SAME DAY.
That is not stubborn. That's pretty easy going.
Btw - ftr - BRENDAN was the webmaster that actually made that site and put
things up on it at the time. FYI.
>
>
> Well, you trusted tossers... should have known better considering the
> antics of it's
> founder, so you are in the middle of this crap. tani doesn't have the
> brain power
> to comprehend how she is responsible for my work being posted publically
> to her
> site when I desired it not to.
I have the brain power to know that BRENDAN is responsible for putting that
and other rituals up there on OUR site. Not MY site. But here you are -
CONTINUING.
Continue on - the subject is over as far as I'm concerned. The ritual is
GONE. As far as Walter is concerend, you ripped it off. That's an issue
between the two of you.
Now - kindly buzz off.
Tani Jantsang
>
> Well if they were smart, they'd just apologize and go on.
They? I have nothing to apologize for. Walter gave it to the webmaster and
it got put up in good faith. The webmaster was not me. End of story - as I
said.
>
>
> In my few dealings with Aquino, he's always been very pleasant. I've
never
> been a member of the ToS so as to how he treats people in his
organization,
> I don't know and I haven't had any sort of interactions with ToS members
> either. Hard for me to make a value judgement here.
In my quite a few dealings with TOS members, offline and online, I've found
them to be 100% honest people offline - and I've found Aquino able to back
up whatever he had to say.
>
>
> Oh, I'd give her a bit of a break. Despite all the yammering she did take
> the page down. Hard to say if this was out of fear or something resembling
> ethics. I'll let you be your own judge, I'm sure you know where my
> prejudices lie.
For one, I'm not responsible for Brendan the webmaster putting up what an
honest comrade gave him from the Temple of Set. Yes, I took the page down
after it just took too long to get info Walter had. Hard to way why I took
it down? I already said why. For me, these are spiritual reasons. I do
not want something from the hand of the enemy on a site that represents our
stuff. That simple. I would not put it back up there is Douglas said it
was OK to do it. I said that 5 times thus far. I also took down an
excellent essay Brendan put up - that Craig Hunt wrote and SAID WE COULD put
up there. *I* took it down. I don't imagine you or Doug would fathom my
motives there. I'd not bother to explain them. Fear has nothing to do with
it. Ethics? I'm not sure ethics falls into that category. I do not eat,
break bread, drink water, soda or anything else or share with people who
have no flame. THAT is my motive. That is my bottom line.
>
> > >
> > >It eludes me what this has to do with the potential copyright violation
> > >suggested by Doug.
It has everything to do with what goes on, on alt.satanism. Everything.
Tani Jantsang
have yet to see proof from EITHER of you. I'm patient.
I'm 100% honest when it comes to business - and ftr, I have quite ENOUGH as
it stands considering I hardly even advertise the DDocs anywhere. I could.
I can produce TX number and isbn numbers. I'm patient about "who really
wrote" that ritual. Walter saw Bonne write it. Others also saw it - but
those others are certainly NOT friends of the SR and/or are people I don't
know at all.
But you just continue - and you don't realize how funny YOU are with this.
I took it down, Douglas - and I said what I had to say up there in its
place. That should have been the end of the story until you and Walter can
come up with proof as to who wrote what.
Exactly WHAT are you claiming is yours - if thus far what Walter mentioned
is NOT what you are claiming is yours?
Fyi boy, I didn't even READ the ritual - not to mention that I was not
webmaster who put it up there.
I have absolutely nothing to "apologize" for. I DID nothing - except take
the damned thing DOWN.
"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:413546E1...@earthlink.net...
>
>
Dagon Productions
Reply below:
Harry Lime wrote:
>Dear Doug:
>
>Please see inside text:
>
>"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:41358816...@earthlink.net...
>
>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>Walter hasn't posted here regularly since we discussed the Frankfurter
>>>>>weenie roast. You might be well served by just admitting that this was
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>in
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>error, apologize, and take the contentious material off your site.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>Funny,
>
>
>>>>>this is what you ended up doing anyway.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Sans apology.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>Well if they were smart, they'd just apologize and go on.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>That is asking quite a bit considering their past behavior. But it
>>would have
>>taken most of the fire out of a situation that is burning them.
>>
>>
>
>Their lack of being able to think strategically (sp?) never ceases to make
>me chuckle. I've found it interesting how so many in the occult/Satanism
>(not just the SRs) perceive themselves to be experts in human nature, but
>are pretty much incapable of dealing with others either face-to-face or in a
>newsgroup with any elan.
>
>
You are correct there... alt.magick proves it well.
I'd say about 99% of occultists annoy me. Many often end up dressing
occult, talking about
nothing but the occult, constantly talking about occult activities,
occult occult occult... this ends
up boring me to no end. There is so much more to life. Occult
practices are useful to me to
enhance my life not become my life.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>In my few dealings with Aquino, he's always been very pleasant. I've
>>>
>>>
>never
>
>
>>>been a member of the ToS so as to how he treats people in his
>>>
>>>
>organization,
>
>
>>>I don't know and I haven't had any sort of interactions with ToS members
>>>either. Hard for me to make a value judgement here.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>I've had a few dealings with Aquino and witnessed his outings of Lupo
>>here years
>>ago. So my view of him has been sullied. His justifications for outing
>>Lupo and
>>insisting that he make his FAQ a propaganda tool of the ToS just
>>didn't cut the mustard for any man of integrity.
>>
>>
>
>Well I'll give you this one.
>
>
The interesting thing is that much like tani and others... they have a
problem
admitting they made a mistake. Aquinos justifications even years later for
outing Lupos IRL info was just sad and just had no rational basis
considering that Aquinos argument hinged on a flimsy accusation
of Lupos FAQ harming people. A FAQ harm people... c'mon.
>
>
>>>tani doesn't have the
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>brain power
>>>>to comprehend how she is responsible for my work being posted publically
>>>>to her
>>>>site when I desired it not to.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>Oh, I'd give her a bit of a break. Despite all the yammering she did take
>>>the page down. Hard to say if this was out of fear or something
>>>
>>>
>resembling
>
>
>>>ethics. I'll let you be your own judge, I'm sure you know where my
>>>prejudices lie.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>I see it as one of the few smart moves tani has made... geocities would
>>most likely
>>have taken the page down and quite possibly taken the whole site down.
>>
>>
>
>Wonder if this would've forced her to actually pay for a domain and set up a
>website? It escapes me why she doesn't pay the $10 per month for a domain
>and a legit presence on the web. Had I been in her place, I would've done
>this years ago -- especially considering all of the enemies she claims are
>out to "get" her. LOL!
>
>
In the back of my mind, if tani had left up the plagiarized work, having
her website pulled
would have forced her to make this move... kind of like me doing a favor
for her to get
her to realize how odd her decision to use geocities has been. A paying
site is less
likely to be pulled without a more solid complaint.
I am sure they would be... I knew a 3rd year UCLA med student that went
awol on his schooling due to addiction.
A high level of personal integrity is what it came down to. I watched a
few friends
go down the ugly road of stealing everything they could from family,
friends, employers, etc.
When my addiction reached a level higher than what my income was...
which at 20 y/o
was substantial enough to feed my habit, up until that time, for 3.5
years. I started
looking at items around my workplace... and that was just going to
far... checked
myself into rehab two days later and moved forward from there.
Admittedly my
run was not that long compared to many. The baggage attached to being a
junkie was not for me... esp. everything that came down to "get the next
fix at whatever cost." My integrity was more important than the drug.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>I'm
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>responsible for myself, Harry. Not for others.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>Sometime I hope you do a bit of self-examination and question why
>>>>>controversy follows you in this newsgroup.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>I doubt she is capable.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>Sadly, I think you're right here.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>
>>>Harry Lime
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>It's pretty obvious. Her silence is deafening... I imagine her chomping
>>at the
>>bit hoping she doesn't get dirty in this whole fiasco, but alas too late.
>>
>>
>
>If I were her, I'd be a bit suspicious of Walter Bowart and his "sources" --
>but that's just me.
>
>Regards,
>
>Harry Lime
>
>
Yes, I would be too... esp. considering my writings predate them by quite
a bit of time... maybe that Bonne read my rite and wrote it down in front
of walter at a later date... this seeming to be the most plausible
situation
at the moment.
Best,
-Douglas
Harry Lime
Please see inside text:
"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
news:LKsZc.4906$w%6.2...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> >
> ake the contentious material off your site. Funny,
> > this is what you ended up doing anyway.
>
> Yes, I did as soon as it took too long for Walter to get back on it. I
took
> it down. So then, WHAT is all this further discussion about? It's belly
> aching, whining, bitching for the sake of bitching by what I consider a
man
> with NO EROS in him. Nuff said.
Whether Doug has any "eros" in him, I'm not the judge. At the very least,
what I find disturbing is any time anyone questions a decision you make you
immediately attack that person without looking into the issue first. In an
earlier part of the thread, I suggested that you'd have suffered less if you
just told Doug you'd look into the issue and take the material down until
you found out what the "truth" was. Oftentimes, I don't think you realize
that many people in here trifle with you just to be amused by your
reactions. I'll take front and center and admit I've done this and I'm sure
others would too, but I can't answer for them.
>
> Given the fact that you did get it
> > from Walter via the ToS is not salient to the argument considering it
was
> on
> > your site.
>
> Indeed it is. The DDocs have NO rituals involved with them, SR had NO
> rituals on the site at all. If anything, the actual view from DDoc people
> is that rituals are not necessary behavior - and other pretty negative
> things said of it. People in the org that disagreed with that view and
who
> did rituals wanted them and finally, quite recently some were put up.
> Walter gave us the TOS rituals. He has his own set of proofs with regard
to
> these too - namely that he saw the Setian writing it with his own eyes and
> so did others.
Let me say this: I don't know Doug or have ever spoken to him either in
public or private, via the phone or by email.
What I have discerned from his behavior is that he doesn't make rash
accusations. He owns a business that sells books and probably deals with
some of the same people you do in the Lovecraft fanzine set. Given these
facts, I doubt that he'd accuse the SR website of publishing his material
without solid evidence in his favor. He'd lose the respect of some in the
occult field, possibly lose a distributor, and perhaps even a customer or
two. So unless I'm missing something, what would his raison d'etre for
making such an outrageous claim and risk losing business? Doesn't make sense
to me.
>
> As I've discussed below, if I happened to take pieces of your
> > monograph, put them on one of my websites, I'm sure you'd have an issue
> with
> > this. If the Dark Doctrines material I had on my website was from a
third
> > party, I'd still be culpable for a copyright violation.
>
> True - however I TOOK IT DOWN. So what's all the belly aching about? The
> issue as it stands now is between Walter and Douglas. I just posted what
> Walter said - and Douglas will simply have to give him time to track down
> the people involved in this. I don't know most of them. I have nothing
to
> do with most of them. So this whole further discussion is just whining on
> his part. Bellyaching - because he just LOVES to bellyache.
Had the tables been turned, I'm sure you'd be doing the same thing. I know I
would.
I'm sure if he were successful in getting the Geocities site taken down
you'd rant and rave for a long time in this newsgroup -- whether you "own"
it or not.
> >
> > >
> > > I made no denials of anything - and don' thave to apologize for a
thing
> I
> > > did NOT do. I contacted Walter, I posted what he said earlier, I
waited
> a
> > > short while for HIM to post and clear this up - I decided to remove it
> > until
> > > it's resolved - and now Walter posted. Simple. This has absolutely
> > nothing
> > > to do with my personality. It had a LOT to do with the fact that I'm
> NOT
> > > online everyday and with a person that decided to just ACCUSE instead
of
> > > ASK.
> >
> > It's not the end result that has to do with your personality, it's the
> > manner in which you react to the accusation.
>
> No, it's the end result of how I react to a trash-mouthing bastard
screaming
> at me when I'm not even online. It's the fact that he MADE an accusation
> instead of asking WHERE it came from and HOW it came to be on the SR
> website. Fact is, Brendan put it up there at the time, as Webmaster.
Hmm, so it's Brendan's fault now? Who knew? I dunno Tani, you've had a
history of bring Brendan into the mix when stuff gets difficult.
Regards,
Harry Lime
Dagon Productions
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:41343380...@earthlink.net...
>
>
>>
>>
>Douglas, this is my LAST word on this issue - and keep in mind that I did
>take it DOWN - but here you are, CONTINUING.
>
Sure it is... bwahahaha... I'll be counting each post that follows
this... since they
are many.
You sure don't get how this game works do you tin-foil tani?
>
>Quote
>--------- Forwarded message ----------
>From: "Walter Alter" <neu
>To:
>Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 08:34:39 -0700
>
>That ritual was on the TOS website, accessable only to members, since
>shortly after we did the ritual in 1996. He must have ripped it from your
>site.
>
>Walter
>
>UNQUOTE
>
>Leave me out of it. Cease and desist making a whining idiot of yourself. I
>took it down days ago.
>
>
>
>
I've got a printout of the site... I've got to dig it up, but I don't
recall the material of
mine was in there at the time I rec'd my copy which was around 1995.
When you
are one of the top dogs in an occult org... it isn't difficult to get
material from other orgs.
You if anyone should realize this. At least I don't go whining
contantly about the org I
was involved with unlike yourself, insinuating it into any topic being
discussed you
possibly can... can you say obsessed?
The IOT performed my rite quite a bit of time before 1996.
Whining? Like you are doing with John Shaw???
This is supposedly your last reply number 1.
Dagon Productions
Here we are with post number 2 after the last post.
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>"Harry Lime" <webmast...@harrylimetv.com> wrote in message
>news:OZaZc.94633$Fg5.15686@attbi_s53...
>
>
>>Dear Tani:
>>
>>Please see inside text:
>>
>>
>>
>ake the contentious material off your site. Funny,
>
>
>>this is what you ended up doing anyway.
>>
>>
>
>Yes, I did as soon as it took too long for Walter to get back on it. I took
>it down. So then, WHAT is all this further discussion about? It's belly
>aching, whining, bitching for the sake of bitching by what I consider a man
>with NO EROS in him. Nuff said.
>
There will be "Nuff said" when I say there will be enough said, you
hyper control freak bitch.
Quit replying and I might drop it... I've told you this before... but you
can't get it through that thich jersy/tuaranian skull of yours.
>
> Given the fact that you did get it
>
>
>>from Walter via the ToS is not salient to the argument considering it was
>>
>>
>on
>
>
>>your site.
>>
>>
>
>Indeed it is. The DDocs have NO rituals involved with them, SR had NO
>rituals on the site at all. If anything, the actual view from DDoc people
>is that rituals are not necessary behavior - and other pretty negative
>things said of it. People in the org that disagreed with that view and who
>did rituals wanted them and finally, quite recently some were put up.
>Walter gave us the TOS rituals. He has his own set of proofs with regard to
>these too - namely that he saw the Setian writing it with his own eyes and
>so did others.
>
Ritualistic behavior is part and parcel of human life. Performing some
rite evoking some godform might not be what you are doing... but
living out any philosophy includes some sort of ritualistic behavior in
one form or another... IMHO of course.
walters proofs will fall flat on their face... thus far my work precedes
his
by a considerable amount of time. Yes, he may have seen a setian writing
my words at a later time then I wrote them... probably because they
read them before.
>
>As I've discussed below, if I happened to take pieces of your
>
>
>>monograph, put them on one of my websites, I'm sure you'd have an issue
>>
>>
>with
>
>
>>this. If the Dark Doctrines material I had on my website was from a third
>>party, I'd still be culpable for a copyright violation.
>>
>>
>
>True - however I TOOK IT DOWN. So what's all the belly aching about? The
>issue as it stands now is between Walter and Douglas. I just posted what
>Walter said - and Douglas will simply have to give him time to track down
>the people involved in this. I don't know most of them. I have nothing to
>do with most of them. So this whole further discussion is just whining on
>his part. Bellyaching - because he just LOVES to bellyache.
>
Think of me as a gadfly tani... look into your philosophy books and see
what that
is.
You bellyache constantly about John Shaw, the CoS, etc... your a damn
broken record on these topics, ya damn hypocrite.
I'll be curious to see if walter brings Craig into this. I'd probably
give him a
heads up as to what I have and the timeline... I'd be surprised if he
didn't
distance himself from walter at that point.
>
>
>>>I'm wondering just exactly "which part" is Doug claiming he wrote? I'm
>>>
>>>
>>not
>>
>>
>>>denying a thing, Harry - but Walter IS challenging it. I talked to him
>>>about it before I posted earlier today. Finally, I just decided to
>>>
>>>
>remove
>
>
>>>it until it's resolved. Now Walter posted something to Doug.
>>>
>>>
>>I doubt that Doug would take the risk of making himself a total idiot in
>>alt.satanism by making the claim of copyright violation sans any
>>
>>
>legitimate
>
>
>>evidence.
>>
>>
>
>I doubt the same for the Temple of Set people involved in writing it. Why
>are you even talking to me further about this? I TOOK IT DOWN. End of
>story. As in - THE END?
>
Because you keep replying dumbass. The kookisar still doesn't get these
simple dynamics.
No not end of story... it's not over until I say its over kookisar.
>
>
>
>>>I find nothing embarassing about this entire issue. Not in the least.
>>>
>>>
>I
>
>
>>>don't embarass easily, Harry.
>>>
>>>
>>Yes, I've gathered this.
>>
>>
>
>Sure thing. I'm walking on ice and I slip and fall. Embarassed? Hell, I'd
>laugh my ass off so hard I couldn't even get up. It's FUNNY.
>
>
>>Well, can't blame you there. I just hope Walter follows through.
>>
>>
>
>He will, given enough time. Things like this take time. 1996 is a long
>time ago - and well, I just posted what he said to Doug about it. Can he
>prove what he's saying? Sure he can. But leave ME out of it.
>I have rituals up there written by Sean Haile. I take it on good faith that
>Sean WROTE them. Some others given to me were not written by the comrades -
>and I refused to put them up there. So I wrote some. I don't DO rituals,
>Harry. I don't usually associate with anyone who DOES, either. Ritualistic
>behavior is - well - ritualistic behavior. If I had to take part in one,
>I'd bust out laughing.
>
>
I got time... yes, 1996 is a long time ago... fortunately what I wrote
goes back much
further... published in IOT newsletters, IOT cdroms, etc.
Well, you take plagiarists on good faith... shows how good your power of
intuition and perception are... crap from the looks of it.
I'm not screaming tani... if anyone types like they are screaming it is
you.
I can do what I want when an org, such as the satanic retards, posts
material
of mine to their website. You just don't get it do you dumbass?
>
>
>>>>>Had I known that you had ANY authorship in that material, even with
>>>>>permission I'd NOT put it up there.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>That's the truth - even IF he said it was OK to put up there. I'd not
>>>
>>>
>>want
>>
>>
>>>it near our stuff simply because it's from his hand. Walter challenges
>>>that. We'll see where that goes.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>I also said that.
>
>
>
>
So what would you do if someone you used as a source for the ddocs
was sent your material...disagreed with it and posted here... would
they become your enemy... would you revise the ddocs????
Inquiring minds want to know };)
Dagon Productions
topic... here we go with post number 3... bwahahahaha.
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:413544F3...@earthlink.net...
>
>
>>Well, tani and walter are both stubborn and now walter has the srs as
>>well as
>>the ToSs reputations on the line. I'm sure he will attempt whatever he
>>can to
>>clear himself... but he is fighting a lost cause. So I will amuse
>>myself as
>>they game gets played out.
>>
>>
>
>No, I am not stubborn. I asked about it on the DAY I saw your missive. It
>took too long to get more details and so I took it down on the SAME DAY.
>That is not stubborn. That's pretty easy going.
>
Yeah, right... you are as stubborn as a mule. You won't take rational
advice, you stick with
a free website server even though this makes your org look like cheap
ass no money dorks
and people keep telling your that but you don't listen... people bait
you and you reply to
every post rather then ignore it which would make them go away from
quicker, etc.
>
>Btw - ftr - BRENDAN was the webmaster that actually made that site and put
>things up on it at the time. FYI.
>
You are the one responsible for content today.
tani and her ignorance defense... bwahahaha.
>
>
>>Well, you trusted tossers... should have known better considering the
>>antics of it's
>>founder, so you are in the middle of this crap. tani doesn't have the
>>brain power
>>to comprehend how she is responsible for my work being posted publically
>> to her
>>site when I desired it not to.
>>
>>
>
>I have the brain power to know that BRENDAN is responsible for putting that
>and other rituals up there on OUR site. Not MY site. But here you are -
>CONTINUING.
>
tani you are the most public satanic retard there is on the net.. you
are the webmaster for
their site now... whether you like it or not you are a spokesperson for
the sr. Thus you
are responsible for everything on the site period.
>
>Continue on - the subject is over as far as I'm concerned. The ritual is
>GONE. As far as Walter is concerend, you ripped it off. That's an issue
>between the two of you.
>
>Now - kindly buzz off.
>
>
>
>
>
No I won't buzz off satanic retard.. you gonna make me... put one of those
curses on me (and she supposedly doesn't not do rituals) and make me
go away? Ha!
walter is wrong.. repost the rite and see what happens... I bet you are
chicken...
because something tells you I may be right... you just are not sure yet.
-Douglas
Kori Houghton
> Quote
> --------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: "Walter Alter" <neu
> To:
> Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 08:34:39 -0700
>
> That ritual was on the TOS website, accessable only to members, since
> shortly after we did the ritual in 1996. He must have ripped it from your
> site.
>
> Walter
>
> UNQUOTE
Pfffffttt!!!! Or, maybe it's copied from a privately printed book,
circa 1860? IIRC, Douglas mentioned that the IOT version pre-dates
1996 and was in circulation among his associates before that time.
(sniffs the air appreciatively) Ahhhh, do I detect the pungent odor of
spontaneously combusting trou?
>
> Leave me out of it.
Excuse me? Leave you *out* of what, exactly? Leave you out of
alt.religion.wicca where you posted these messages earlier this week:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
From: "Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com>
Newsgroups: alt.religion.wicca
References: <413107D8...@earthlink.net>
<9be81c07fb6e45af...@tatooine.homelinux.net>
<6db9a636.04082...@posting.google.com>
<41318A03...@earthlink.net>
<4ef1c107.04082...@posting.google.com>
<6db9a636.04082...@posting.google.com>
<4ef1c107.04082...@posting.google.com>
<4132E2EA...@earthlink.net>
<jHIYc.2733$w%6.2...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net>
<3dc2bc99.04083...@posting.google.com>
<4133D77A...@earthlink.net>
<gIUYc.3514$8d1....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>
Subject: Druggie Ubu Dagon blood sacrifices
Lines: 42
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441
Message-ID: <EKUYc.3409$w%6.1...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 06:18:12 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 69.34.8.39
X-Complaints-To: ab...@earthlink.net
X-Trace: newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net 1093933092 69.34.8.39 (Mon,
30 Aug 2004 23:18:12 PDT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 23:18:12 PDT
Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net
And if anyone hosting SR website had known that Druggie wrote even ONE
SENTENCE of ritual in question, we'd not have put it up. Tezcat
rituals
were all gotten from Temple of Set Smoking Mirror Pylon - as stated up
top
of each one.
"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
news:gIUYc.3514$8d1....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> Holy shit. LOL.
>
> "Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:4133D77A...@earthlink.net...
> >
> >
> > Having a long running interest in blood sacrifice, yes I did participate
> > in two rites
> > where blood sacrifice took place... the main effect was that the dog in
> > our house
> > which never barked from then on barked regularly. Finding this not to
be
a
> > sufficient reason to continue such work, I stopped. There is so much
> > rhetoric and extreme views on this subject... I felt the best way to
find
> > out was by doing it myself. If people do not want to associate with
> > me due to this... that is their business.
> >
> > -Douglas
> >
> > --
> > **********************************************
> > Dagon Productions
> > Chaos Magick & Occult books
> > http://www.dagonproductions.com
> > in...@dagonproductions.com
> >
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ AND
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
From: "Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com>
Newsgroups: alt.religion.wicca
References: <413107D8...@earthlink.net>
<9be81c07fb6e45af...@tatooine.homelinux.net>
<6db9a636.04082...@posting.google.com>
<41318A03...@earthlink.net>
<4ef1c107.04082...@posting.google.com>
<6db9a636.04082...@posting.google.com>
<4ef1c107.04082...@posting.google.com>
<4132E2EA...@earthlink.net>
<jHIYc.2733$w%6.2...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net>
<3dc2bc99.04083...@posting.google.com>
<4133D77A...@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: Hmmm... SR plagiarism???? Yep, that is what it is!!!!
SR=Thieves
Lines: 30
X-Priority: 3
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Message-ID: <gIUYc.3514$8d1....@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 06:15:40 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 69.34.8.39
X-Complaints-To: ab...@earthlink.net
X-Trace: newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net 1093932940 69.34.8.39 (Mon,
30 Aug 2004 23:15:40 PDT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 23:15:40 PDT
Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net
Holy shit. LOL.
"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4133D77A...@earthlink.net...
>
>
> Having a long running interest in blood sacrifice, yes I did participate
> in two rites
> where blood sacrifice took place... the main effect was that the dog in
> our house
> which never barked from then on barked regularly. Finding this not to be
a
> sufficient reason to continue such work, I stopped. There is so much
> rhetoric and extreme views on this subject... I felt the best way to find
> out was by doing it myself. If people do not want to associate with
> me due to this... that is their business.
>
> -Douglas
>
> --
> **********************************************
> Dagon Productions
> Chaos Magick & Occult books
> http://www.dagonproductions.com
> in...@dagonproductions.com
>
>
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
So, how does posting these messages, out of context, on
alt.religion.wicca 'leaving you out of it' and dropping the matter? I
do have to say that the folks on alt.religion.wicca have had the sense
to ignore your posts. Nice try though, Durga, to re-capture your
standing as usenet's LAMEST LOSER (Hellenic all caps and everything).
> Cease and desist making a whining idiot of yourself. I
> took it down days ago.
Yup. And you did that 'cause you know that Douglas's claim has merit,
whatever Bowart sez.
Luv,
Kori
Dagon Productions
response number 4... and we are still counting... can you say liar???
I knew that you could.
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>"Harry Lime" <webmast...@harrylimetv.com> wrote in message
>news:YccZc.80039$9d6.54645@attbi_s54...
>
>
>>Well if they were smart, they'd just apologize and go on.
>>
>>
>
>They? I have nothing to apologize for. Walter gave it to the webmaster and
>it got put up in good faith. The webmaster was not me. End of story - as I
>said.
>
The org, the satanic retards, of which you are the most prolific poster
and representative
of posted a plagiarized words of mine... you would do better to
apologize... lest you
make more of an ass of yourself. You are the webmaster now.. .thus you are
responsible for everything on the site.
>
>
>>In my few dealings with Aquino, he's always been very pleasant. I've
>>
>>
>never
>
>
>>been a member of the ToS so as to how he treats people in his
>>
>>
>organization,
>
>
>>I don't know and I haven't had any sort of interactions with ToS members
>>either. Hard for me to make a value judgement here.
>>
>>
>
>In my quite a few dealings with TOS members, offline and online, I've found
>them to be 100% honest people offline - and I've found Aquino able to back
>up whatever he had to say.
>
So you felt that aquino was justified in telling Lupo not to put other
Satanic orgs in
his FAQ and that you condone aquinos outing of Lupos IRL employment info?
>
>
>>Oh, I'd give her a bit of a break. Despite all the yammering she did take
>>the page down. Hard to say if this was out of fear or something resembling
>>ethics. I'll let you be your own judge, I'm sure you know where my
>>prejudices lie.
>>
>>
>
>For one, I'm not responsible for Brendan the webmaster putting up what an
>honest comrade gave him from the Temple of Set.
>
You are responsible for it being up there under your time as
webmaster... you are
also responsible for lieing that the rite was attributed to walter and
the tos... when
you have been proven wrong by my posting the html code to your site
which was
verified by the wayback machine archives.
Your comrade was not as honest or smart as you thought as he either
willingly
offered it to you or trusted someone he should not have who is a
plagiarist.
>Yes, I took the page down
>after it just took too long to get info Walter had. Hard to way why I took
>it down? I already said why. For me, these are spiritual reasons. I do
>not want something from the hand of the enemy on a site that represents our
>stuff.
>
Oh, I've made it to enemy status... whoohoo! Someone is taking usenet
a bit
too seriously.
>That simple. I would not put it back up there is Douglas said it
>was OK to do it. I said that 5 times thus far. I also took down an
>excellent essay Brendan put up - that Craig Hunt wrote and SAID WE COULD put
>up there. *I* took it down. I don't imagine you or Doug would fathom my
>motives there. I'd not bother to explain them. Fear has nothing to do with
>it. Ethics? I'm not sure ethics falls into that category. I do not eat,
>break bread, drink water, soda or anything else or share with people who
>have no flame. THAT is my motive. That is my bottom line.
>
You don't know me IRL... so you are filling in the blanks regarding
"flames" and "eros."
If you are not fearful that I can get your whole site pulled down...
flaunt it and
repost my work to your website. You won't because you are all talk and no
action.
>
>
>>>>It eludes me what this has to do with the potential copyright violation
>>>>suggested by Doug.
>>>>
>>>>
>
>It has everything to do with what goes on, on alt.satanism. Everything.
>
>
>
>
Everything has to do with everything to the kookisar... thus she can
bring in
any unrelated CoS tirade, etc. into any exchange... some convoluted logic
that dumbass has going on there.
-Douglas
Dagon Productions
post on
this topic.
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>I'm not siding with plagiarists or you. I have NO IDEA who wrote it. I
>have yet to see proof from EITHER of you. I'm patient.
>
Good... it will surprise you when you find out I am correct... what will
you have to
say then?
>
>I'm 100% honest when it comes to business - and ftr, I have quite ENOUGH as
>it stands considering I hardly even advertise the DDocs anywhere. I could.
>
>I can produce TX number and isbn numbers. I'm patient about "who really
>wrote" that ritual. Walter saw Bonne write it. Others also saw it - but
>those others are certainly NOT friends of the SR and/or are people I don't
>know at all.
>
Yes, probably Bonne writing down something she read elsewhere.
walter is a satanic retard, any rite on the satanic retard site can than be
considered a satanic retard rite... otherwise why would you post them
there... makes no sense.
>
>But you just continue - and you don't realize how funny YOU are with this.
>I took it down, Douglas - and I said what I had to say up there in its
>place. That should have been the end of the story until you and Walter can
>come up with proof as to who wrote what.
>
The end of story comes when you apologize for the sr's posting my
writings without permission... and not until then.
>
>Exactly WHAT are you claiming is yours - if thus far what Walter mentioned
>is NOT what you are claiming is yours?
>
As I have stated many times previously... the directional calls to the
East, South, West and
North... are my words.
>
>Fyi boy, I didn't even READ the ritual - not to mention that I was not
>webmaster who put it up there.
>
You think I care? In the end you were the webmaster when I discovered
that the
satanic retards have posted plagiarized material... thus you and the
satanic retards
are responsible.
>
>I have absolutely nothing to "apologize" for. I DID nothing - except take
>the damned thing DOWN.
>
Well, tani... considering that letters written to you can be
considered copyrighted material... the person receiving the
letter, from what I recall, doesn't have a write to republish it..
but you do in the CoS files often.
How do you explain that?
Tani Jantsang
Yeah, I figure the wiccans know the loser and well, they DO like to laugh
and had great comedy lines.
Like hell they didn't reply. They remember Drouggie and how they kicked his
butt last time around.
And what is it again that you are DOing in some business about Walter and
the Smoking Mirror Pylon's ritual and Druggie, er, Douglas of Dagon
Production's ritual? You are also forgetting - I'm the person that TOOK IT
DOWN. I'm not the person that handed it over, or performed it, (I never
even read it.....) - or put it up anywhere. I'm the one who TOOK IT DOWN.
And so just exactly what are you DOing other than being ...... a BITCH on
the rag?
"Kori Houghton" <koriho...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:6db9a636.04090...@posting.google.com...
Dagon Productions
again... didn't
she realize it didn't work before... that these people don't want to be
associated
with such a kook whatsoever.
tani the hypocrite once again.
-Douglas
Dagon Productions
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>Well, Xori, you must be lackey of Ubu-druggie.
>
>Yeah, I figure the wiccans know the loser and well, they DO like to laugh
>and had great comedy lines.
>
>Like hell they didn't reply. They remember Drouggie and how they kicked his
>butt last time around.
>
Kicked my butt with lame ad hominem attacks... not quite... the arw
trolls are
well known on most occult newsgroups as being a waste of time and with
little
intelligence to boot. They can post until the cows come home... I
ignore them...
they are a waste of time.
>
>And what is it again that you are DOing in some business about Walter and
>the Smoking Mirror Pylon's ritual and Druggie, er, Douglas of Dagon
>Production's ritual? You are also forgetting - I'm the person that TOOK IT
>DOWN. I'm not the person that handed it over, or performed it, (I never
>even read it.....) - or put it up anywhere. I'm the one who TOOK IT DOWN.
>
You are the person that stated here on alt.satanism that you had posted
on this topic for
the last time... and here you are going on post number 7.
Explain that one dumbass liar?
>
>And so just exactly what are you DOing other than being ...... a BITCH on
>the rag?
>
Takes one to know one... but at your age, I'm sure you got all the hosed
out ya gap toothed
pancaked face from hell moron.
-Douglas
Tani Jantsang
> Dear Tani:
>
> Please see inside text:
Ah, MORE? Look, I wrote what I had to write to that whining PEST Douglas
(and looky looky at the CHORUS out there, LOL - yeah, it's funny, Harry. I
put the posts I made in response to his CONTINUED whining in drafts. I hit
send, one by one - and they go out. That's IT. What order they go out in
(time stamp?) don't know - or care. I think, from what I see, they went out
in the wrong order. And this is something someone with NO LIFE makes a BIG
issue out of. Uh huh. OK. Carry on.
The ToS Pylon had it. Who wrote it I do not know - YOU do not know, BEN
does not know, heh, binLaden does not know (LOL) - NO ONE knows until it can
be proven, one way or the other. I did not even READ the ritual. It's
generally known that I do not DO rituals or even understand the need some
folks have for such things. I mean, I really DO NOT understand it. (none
are in the DDocs at all). It was handed to SR webmaster, B, at the time
exclusively B, by Walter from his ToS Pylon. It got put up there with a
bunch of other stuff. ONE of the things put up there was by Craig and I
personally took it OFF the site - I'm not even sure B knew I did that
because he'd have seen that as "too many hands in the website." Point is,
NO ONE involved in making the website did a thing wrong. Uh - regarding
the ritual at issue now - I'm the person who TOOK IT DOWN. Is there an
objection? I hear a HEAP of whining. About what?
I'm the one who took the ritual down. Is there an OBJECTION in your
sandbox? Do I hear an objection? Yes? No? Go ahead, see inside for more
worthless chatter
>
> "Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
> news:LKsZc.4906$w%6.2...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
> Whether Doug has any "eros" in him, I'm not the judge.
He has no clue what the difference is between love and lust. That IS the
final statement on it.
At the very least,
> what I find disturbing is any time anyone questions a decision you make
you
> immediately attack that person without looking into the issue first.
That is not quite what happened. Reread what the boy wro..er, SPEWED at me.
I made NO decisiion except the one I made yesterday to NOT wait for anyone's
proof - and just take the thing DOWN. I did that. Is there an OBJECTION?
IS THERE?
In an
> earlier part of the thread, I suggested that you'd have suffered less if
you
> just told Doug you'd look into the issue and take the material down until
> you found out what the "truth" was.
Oh, I did say that to him in the same "tone" ahem as his accusations that
RETARDS stole his shit. And he called Walter a retard with Kori Houghton
(Eve?) joining in the chorus. He did not make a request. He SPEWED his
vomit. I answered him and said I WOULD CHECK INTO IT - in the same tone he
dished out to me. I chose and decided to NOT wait to check anything out,
NOT wait for any proof one way or the other. I chose and DECIDED - I tore
it off. THAT was MY decision. Definitive. It's GONE. IS THERE AN
OBJECTION? I hear the lackeys doing their act on here, as usual. The
chorus all out of tune, like some disjointed karyoki.
Oftentimes, I don't think you realize
> that many people in here trifle with you just to be amused by your
> reactions.
I thnink you don't realize how many people that DO NOT post here but DO
email and go to egroups notice the chorus line on here - "you guys." And
trust me, they see it all for exactly what it is! They see what happened -
VERY objectively. They see the whining persisting - they see Douglas
bitching and moaning and making tons of postings when I TOOK IT DOWN.
Still, he's spewing at me as if I actually stole it. Sorry buster. IF he
wrote it and IF it was stolen - it was stolen by Temple of Set members in a
Pylon created and led by Craig Hunt. THOSE are the facts, bare and naked
facts. I never even read the ritual, Harry. I certainly did NOT make an
IMPOSSIBLE template on a website and put the thing up there. Heh, no.....I
TOOK IT DOWN. OBJECTIONS?
I'll take front and center and admit I've done this and I'm sure
> others would too, but I can't answer for them.
>
> >
> > Given the fact that you did get it
> > > from Walter via the ToS is not salient to the argument considering it
> was
> > on
> > > your site.
> >
> > Indeed it is. The DDocs have NO rituals involved with them, SR had NO
> > rituals on the site at all. If anything, the actual view from DDoc
people
> > is that rituals are not necessary behavior - and other pretty negative
> > things said of it. People in the org that disagreed with that view and
> who
> > did rituals wanted them and finally, quite recently some were put up.
> > Walter gave us the TOS rituals. He has his own set of proofs with
regard
> to
> > these too - namely that he saw the Setian writing it with his own eyes
and
> > so did others.
>
> Let me say this: I don't know Doug or have ever spoken to him either in
> public or private, via the phone or by email.
>
> What I have discerned from his behavior is that he doesn't make rash
> accusations.
COUGH. What objective readers can see is that he most definitely likes to
get into fights over absolutely nothing (that is one reason why my wiccan
pals get a real kick out of anything from the fool whose ass they splattered
all over usenet with the best comedy lines I ever saw on here). What
objective readers can see is that the boy is STILL whining and bitching -
over nothing. What any objective reader can see is that he consistently
SPEWS VOMIT my way - and at our SR org. Yet he is not in it, knows nothning
of it and couldn't understand it even if he wanted to - he doesn't even know
the difference between love and lust - and pretty much ADMITTED IT. He
can't just have HIS org or business - and let others have theirs. He has
issues agreeing to DISagree. That says all I need to know.
He owns a business that sells books and probably deals with
> some of the same people you do in the Lovecraft fanzine set. Given these
> facts, I doubt that he'd accuse the SR website of publishing his material
> without solid evidence in his favor. He'd lose the respect of some in the
> occult field, possibly lose a distributor, and perhaps even a customer or
> two. So unless I'm missing something, what would his raison d'etre for
> making such an outrageous claim and risk losing business? Doesn't make
sense
> to me.
Doesn't make sense to me that Setians would sit down and, in front of others
present, write out a ritual and at the same time, all the while, be stealing
it from Douglas. I don't know Bonne. I never heard of Bonne. I don't
know most of the Setians that were in that Pylon. I strongly doubt that
Aquino would tolerate taking rituals from someone hostile to the ToS and
using them.
Now, through all this NOISE and CLUTTER on here - I get the idea that there
are only a few lines in that ritual that Doug is claiming to be his. OK.
WHICH ONES? Exactly which ones? That he isn't even man enough to just SAY
exactly which portions he's claiming to be his - is noted by anyone
objectively reading this. If I had been in his place, I'd have simply
HIGHLIGHTED the portions that he claims to have written, and SHOW THAT - and
make clear which portions he did NOT write. That would have been
REASONABLE, RATIONAL, and NORMAL. That is NOT what he did. He went - heh,
ballistic and he is STILL going ballistic now that I took it down.
Irrational behavior on his part - and anyone unbiased and objective can
clearly see that.
>
> >
> > As I've discussed below, if I happened to take pieces of your
> > > monograph, put them on one of my websites, I'm sure you'd have an
issue
> > with
> > > this. If the Dark Doctrines material I had on my website was from a
> third
> > > party, I'd still be culpable for a copyright violation.
> >
> > True - however I TOOK IT DOWN. So what's all the belly aching about?
The
> > issue as it stands now is between Walter and Douglas. I just posted
what
> > Walter said - and Douglas will simply have to give him time to track
down
> > the people involved in this. I don't know most of them. I have nothing
> to
> > do with most of them. So this whole further discussion is just whining
on
> > his part. Bellyaching - because he just LOVES to bellyache.
>
> Had the tables been turned, I'm sure you'd be doing the same thing. I know
I
> would.
I've had my stuff (website stuff) put on sites where their organization was
just taking it. I contacted them and asked them to remove it - and showed
them proof of it. I didn't post about it 100 times on alt.sataniksm and
then whine and bitch when they took it down! In fact, only once did I ever
resort to alt.satanism - and that was on "behalf" of Tim when Nancy took his
stuff. Why? Because Tim asked me to, claiming he didn't know HOW to.
(Scratch my head on that one). When geocities was involved in it - I showed
them actual copyright papers - not just claims. They won't take claims.
Even with a photo that was up on a site without permission - geocities would
not take a claim that it was my photo. They wanted PROOF - the entire
photo, something like that. I only did that when - heh - there was NO
website owner or org leader to be found anywhere. Apparently, someone made
a website for an org - but never made the org or the rest of the website.
Now, a music group in one of the Scandi countries took words from my website
and had permission to use them in a metal song IF he gave credit and
royalties. No credit or royalties came of that! And he's overseas. Now, I
do NOT have copyright TX number gov papers for that material - it's on our
website. Nothing I can do about it! I DO have TX gov number for the DDocs.
AND isbn numbers in association with Oneiros Books. TX number (gov issue
copyright) makes the difference.
He can't get the site taken down. His material is OFF there. What I see is
very clear and objective - and anyone objective sees it too. He - and now
YOU for him by proxy? - and a few others in his little chorus are bitching
and moaning at the person who TOOK IT DOWN. That makes absolutely NO sense,
Harry. If someone gave you a photo, claiming it was themselves, and you put
it on your site - and it turned out to be me - I'd simply email you if I
could find your email from that website - and prove it was me on there and
ask you to remove it. Really simple. When I discovered, a year later, that
a photo of me was done damage to by one of the xganon people - I contacted
fortune city and had it taken down. But due to killfiling all the anon
posters - that shit was up there almost a year before I even saw it. YOU
mentioned it in the middle of a flame war and behold - I went and looked and
saw it. You said you wondered why I didn't say anything when it was first
posted. Heh - NO MORE killfiling the anons - that's for sure. I can't turn
my fucking back and have peace without the SPEWERS on here trying to start
trouble. That's their LIFE - and that they DO this - tells me everything
about them I need to know. You and I know that in person, offline, such
messing with people would end up with murder. We both know this.
He made the website. He made the template, all of it. I know html now, but
not THAT kind of html. I always was the webmaster of Guardians of Darkness;
that is where I learned the html that you can see on there, my first website
(where I am webmaster, not the site OWNER) - that is NOT my site at all - I
am the webmaster for it nonetheless. Brendan did SR - he did that template
thing. That kind of thing well, I don't know how to do it. I have a hard
time even changing articles on there due to the template - it STICKS or it's
frozen, or showhow has to be done all over to change something. I'd not
have made the site that way if I did it. But yes, Proletariat is KNOWN to
be the webmaster of that site.
My stuff is not difficult. I'm the one who took it down. No matter how you
look at this, it was GIVEN to the SR by a Temple of Set Pylon member whose
Pylon had that ritual as their own for years. The issue is between THEM -
and Douglas. Not me at all. Not the Sr at all. It was given to the SR in
good faith. I took it down. Douglas did NOT do the normal thing and simply
ASK ME - or ASK WALTER. No, not at all - and any objective reader can SEE
exactly what he DID do - and is STILL doing.
But here I see that's not the end of it. It's a bitch fest for bitches.
Let them bitch on then.
Dagon Productions
you would not
post on this topic any longer.
tani whine whine whines.
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>"Harry Lime" <webmast...@harrylimetv.com> wrote in message
>news:wawZc.274224$eM2.113474@attbi_s51...
>
>
>>Dear Tani:
>>
>>Please see inside text:
>>
>>
>
>Ah, MORE? Look, I wrote what I had to write to that whining PEST Douglas
>(and looky looky at the CHORUS out there, LOL - yeah, it's funny, Harry. I
>put the posts I made in response to his CONTINUED whining in drafts. I hit
>send, one by one - and they go out. That's IT. What order they go out in
>(time stamp?) don't know - or care. I think, from what I see, they went out
>in the wrong order. And this is something someone with NO LIFE makes a BIG
>issue out of. Uh huh. OK. Carry on.
>
tani whining about how usenet and the internet works.
>
>The ToS Pylon had it. Who wrote it I do not know - YOU do not know, BEN
>does not know, heh, binLaden does not know (LOL) - NO ONE knows until it can
>be proven, one way or the other. I did not even READ the ritual. It's
>generally known that I do not DO rituals or even understand the need some
>folks have for such things. I mean, I really DO NOT understand it. (none
>are in the DDocs at all). It was handed to SR webmaster, B, at the time
>exclusively B, by Walter from his ToS Pylon. It got put up there with a
>bunch of other stuff. ONE of the things put up there was by Craig and I
>personally took it OFF the site - I'm not even sure B knew I did that
>because he'd have seen that as "too many hands in the website." Point is,
>NO ONE involved in making the website did a thing wrong. Uh - regarding
>the ritual at issue now - I'm the person who TOOK IT DOWN. Is there an
>objection? I hear a HEAP of whining. About what?
>
>
You did a wrong thing... your group posted plagiarized material of mine
to your website...
you and all your members are responsible for allowing this to happen.
The satanic retards
would be held legally responsible period.
>I'm the one who took the ritual down. Is there an OBJECTION in your
>sandbox? Do I hear an objection? Yes? No? Go ahead, see inside for more
>worthless chatter
>
No I offer you a challenge... repost the rite and see what happens.
>
>
>>"Tani Jantsang" <tjs...@SPAMpost.com> wrote in message
>>news:LKsZc.4906$w%6.2...@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>>
>>Whether Doug has any "eros" in him, I'm not the judge.
>>
>>
>
>He has no clue what the difference is between love and lust. That IS the
>final statement on it.
>
Not at all... I know perfectly well the difference... I love my fiance,
I lust after
my mistress... actually I lust after both };) (and that is with my
fiances full
knowledge};)
>
>At the very least,
>
>
>>what I find disturbing is any time anyone questions a decision you make
>>
>>
>you
>
>
>>immediately attack that person without looking into the issue first.
>>
>>
>
>That is not quite what happened. Reread what the boy wro..er, SPEWED at me.
>I made NO decisiion except the one I made yesterday to NOT wait for anyone's
>proof - and just take the thing DOWN. I did that. Is there an OBJECTION?
>IS THERE?
>
Yes, I object to your endless replies on this topic when you have stated
you would not
reply any further.
>
> In an
>
>
>>earlier part of the thread, I suggested that you'd have suffered less if
>>
>>
>you
>
>
>>just told Doug you'd look into the issue and take the material down until
>>you found out what the "truth" was.
>>
>>
>
>Oh, I did say that to him in the same "tone" ahem as his accusations that
>RETARDS stole his shit. And he called Walter a retard with Kori Houghton
>(Eve?) joining in the chorus. He did not make a request. He SPEWED his
>vomit. I answered him and said I WOULD CHECK INTO IT - in the same tone he
>dished out to me. I chose and decided to NOT wait to check anything out,
>NOT wait for any proof one way or the other. I chose and DECIDED - I tore
>it off. THAT was MY decision. Definitive. It's GONE. IS THERE AN
>OBJECTION? I hear the lackeys doing their act on here, as usual. The
>chorus all out of tune, like some disjointed karyoki.
>
>
That is your decision... so you are responsible for the satanic retard
websites content...
thus you are responsible for any posted that is plagiarized... where's
my apology????
>Oftentimes, I don't think you realize
>
>
>>that many people in here trifle with you just to be amused by your
>>reactions.
>>
>>
>
>I thnink you don't realize how many people that DO NOT post here but DO
>email and go to egroups notice the chorus line on here - "you guys."
>
How many nutbars does it take to make an egroup or post an email?
Egroups full of suckasses to tani and the satanic retards I'm sure.
>And
>trust me, they see it all for exactly what it is! They see what happened -
>VERY objectively. They see the whining persisting - they see Douglas
>bitching and moaning and making tons of postings when I TOOK IT DOWN.
>Still, he's spewing at me as if I actually stole it. Sorry buster. IF he
>wrote it and IF it was stolen - it was stolen by Temple of Set members in a
>Pylon created and led by Craig Hunt. THOSE are the facts, bare and naked
>facts. I never even read the ritual, Harry. I certainly did NOT make an
>IMPOSSIBLE template on a website and put the thing up there. Heh, no.....I
>TOOK IT DOWN. OBJECTIONS?
>
And when it is proven you will be guilty of hosting plagiarized material
on the
satanic retard website.... it's pretty simple... most any lawyer would
understand
this simplicity.
I've never admitted not knowing the difference... care to post a google
url liar?
Your wiccan pals... you admit a gang of well known occult group trolls
are your
pals?
You seem to have issues with me... you can agree to disagree and shut up
and quit posting like you stated you would on this subject.
>
>He owns a business that sells books and probably deals with
>
>
>>some of the same people you do in the Lovecraft fanzine set. Given these
>>facts, I doubt that he'd accuse the SR website of publishing his material
>>without solid evidence in his favor. He'd lose the respect of some in the
>>occult field, possibly lose a distributor, and perhaps even a customer or
>>two. So unless I'm missing something, what would his raison d'etre for
>>making such an outrageous claim and risk losing business? Doesn't make
>>
>>
>sense
>
>
>>to me.
>>
>>
>
>Doesn't make sense to me that Setians would sit down and, in front of others
>present, write out a ritual and at the same time, all the while, be stealing
>it from Douglas. I don't know Bonne. I never heard of Bonne. I don't
>know most of the Setians that were in that Pylon. I strongly doubt that
>Aquino would tolerate taking rituals from someone hostile to the ToS and
>using them.
>
Believe me... I'll get a kick out of sticking this to the ToS and
Aquino... some high
standards they have there.
>
>Now, through all this NOISE and CLUTTER on here - I get the idea that there
>are only a few lines in that ritual that Doug is claiming to be his. OK.
>WHICH ONES? Exactly which ones?
>
Ya dumbass... I posted them in my original post... I've also stated a
few times the
plagiarized section is the directional calls section... East, South,
West and North.
>That he isn't even man enough to just SAY
>exactly which portions he's claiming to be his - is noted by anyone
>objectively reading this.
>
Yes, I did... you can't read obviously... it's in the first post I made
on this topic.
Anyone that can objectively read will know you are a dunce here.
>If I had been in his place, I'd have simply
>HIGHLIGHTED the portions that he claims to have written, and SHOW THAT - and
>make clear which portions he did NOT write. That would have been
>REASONABLE, RATIONAL, and NORMAL. That is NOT what he did.
>
No, that is exactly what I did... seperated the plagiarized section from
the rest...
put on your glasses and read again dumbass.
>He went - heh,
>ballistic and he is STILL going ballistic now that I took it down.
>Irrational behavior on his part - and anyone unbiased and objective can
>clearly see that.
>
No, I was actually quite calm and my original post would have only put
forth that
I was laughing like a hyena while writing it... nothing ballistic...
though you seem to
be going quite ballistic here.
blah blah, whine whine
rant rant whine whine
I did what I wanted... I posted the complaint here to watch you and the
satanic
retards make asses of themselves... which you have done in spades.
>But here I see that's not the end of it. It's a bitch fest for bitches.
>Let them bitch on then.
>
>
>
>
tani, you have been bitching for close to ten posts here after you stated
you were not posting on this topic any longer.
Quite your bitchin' bitch.
Kori Houghton
> Well, Xori, you must be lackey of Ubu-druggie.
Well, Sy-Phillis, you must believe that calling me a 'lackey' makes me
one -- or even makes me care what you say about me.
> Yeah, I figure the wiccans know the loser and well, they DO like to laugh
> and had great comedy lines.
Not as great in total comedy as anything written by the Sa Tani Tards.
> Like hell they didn't reply. They remember Drouggie and how they kicked his
> butt last time around.
I didn't read thru all that trash from 'last time'. What I did see
looked like Douglas got a lot of fruitloops to waste a lot of time
responding to him, making fools of themselves all the while. You
know, kinda like what he's got you doing right now.
> And what is it again that you are DOing in some business about Walter and
> the Smoking Mirror Pylon's ritual and Druggie, er, Douglas of Dagon
> Production's ritual?
Can't you read? I am like totally tickled and amused that Douglas's
claim suggests there is contact between members of the TOS and the
IOT. Didn't you see the post where I quoted Don Webb's blather to the
contrary from Radio Free Setian? Douglas has done a nifty thing here:
he has made the drones of more than one goofy org look ridiculous.
Gosh, I never knew Walter had such a foul mouth behind his keyboard!
All that cussin' and ad hominem! He sounds about like you, dear.
Guess that's what happens to a person when the flame-goes-whoosh?
> You are also forgetting - I'm the person that TOOK IT
> DOWN. I'm not the person that handed it over, or performed it, (I never
> even read it.....) - or put it up anywhere. I'm the one who TOOK IT DOWN.
TOOK IT DOWN....TOOK IT DOWN...TOOK IT ALL THE WAY DOWN!!! Just don't
bend over once you've taken it down, k00kissar!
> And so just exactly what are you DOing other than being ...... a BITCH on
> the rag?
Fantasizing about my bodily functions again? Naughty, naughty.
Luv,
Kori
Tani Jantsang
Walter. And righto, I didn't even read thru it. I just forwarded it,
called him up and asked him about it. As you can see, you did not ASK me
about it. You ACCUSED and spewed vomit. I have NO wish to take your
material from you. I said 6 times now, if you gave permission to put it up,
I'd not put your stuff up. Same reason why I took Craig Hunt's excellent
essay down after B put it up and when Hunt said it was OK to put up there.
I posted to him on here that it was up when B did it. I got the OK again.
Then I saw the spew. I personally took it down. I don't care if he said
OK, I don't care how good the essay is. Let Walt put it up on HIS site if
he wants it. But it's NOT gonna be on OUR main site. Having a free site is
consistent with the tenants of SR. Why pay for what you can have for free.
Mind your own business. Take your silly challenges and shove them up your
ass. Oh, heh, btw - if a PUBLISHER of a book publishes material UNKNOWINGLY
submitted by a person that is plagiarized - the PUBLISHER, who can prove
they did NOT know it was copyrighted - is NOT at fault. TX number please?
QUOTE FIRST POST.
It seems the SRs have a rite on their website that has material
nicked from a rite I wrote. The SR rite:
"The Rite of TEZCATLIPOCA and CINTEOTL "
The intent of this rite is to evoke both TEZCATLIPOCA (Drinker of Night)
and CINTEOTL (God/ess of corn) to amplify the manifesting will of the mage.
The design of this rite is synchronistic and spontaneous Feel free to
use any or all of the steps indicated in this rite for your own glorious
purposes.
Ingredients:
A smoking mirror - preferably obsidian, but a sheet of glass with one
side painted black will do.
Corn husks - one for each participant
Fireplace or pit
Popcorn -unpopped to be later popped and eaten after the rite.
Chocolates-
Trance inducing noise makers -drums, pots, feet and floor, etc...
Copal incense - traditionally used by the Aztecs and Mayaans
Directional sigils and invocations -East South West North Horizontal
Axis and Vertical Axis
Lighter or matches
SEQUENCE:
Step 1: Light incense and Fire.(The fire symbolizes the "Teyolia" or
"Divine Fire", which is the great energy/blood-access/axis point of the
Aztec universe.)
Step 2: Yogic breathing (4 long and full & 7 short full) x4 - I would
suggest as much time as you can allow for this. The longer the time
spent, the deeper state of gnosis.
Step 3: Directional Callings: Each should have a directional sigil and
invocation prepared from any previous ritual on pieces of paper....
After each of the invocations are performed, light the signalized paper
by lighter or match and then cast it into the fireplace or "Teyolia".
>>> This section below was taken word for word (except for a few
mispellings the
plagiarizer made) from the rite I wrote:
East-"We call upon the one who is Yellow as the rising Sun, Lord of
abundance and rising power -guard this corridor with the blinding rayss
of the rising Sun."
South-"We call upon HUITZILOPOCHTLI, the hummingbird on the left, Lord
of war -guard this corridor with the might and ruthlessness of the
warrior spirit."
West-"We call upon XIPE TOTEC, Lord of the Flayed One, Red from the
blood of sacrifice -guard this corridor, flaying and donning tthe skin
of any who enter uncalled."
North-"We call upon the Black God of the North, Spirit of witchcraft and
sorcery, guard this corridor with your omnipotent powers of magic."
Above-"We call upon he who gave his foot in battle so that we may have
land to walk upon, he who sacrificed his own blood to create our flesh,
blind folded god of stone and castigation, patron of Acatl, he who
inhabits the edge of the knife, accept this offering."
Below-"TEZCATLIPOCA, Lord of the smoking mirror, possessor of the sky
and the earth, Jaguar in the heart of the mountain, grand trickster,
shaman and sorcerer, make yourself known to us. O night wind soul of the
world, Lord of the here and now, omnipotent ruler of the Gods, bring
forth your knowledge of magic and sorcery, war and strategy, wisdom and
might. Come to us, this is your vessel, hail TEZCATLIPOCA!"
>>>
Step 4: Begin TEZCATLIPOCA and CINTEOTL mantra with drums and other
noise makers.
Step 5: One at a time, take something of yourself, a piece of hair, a
piece of nail, a picture, etc. to represent you, all the while chanting
"NA WA AH"(which refers to a traditional Nahuatl mantra meaning, to know
to feel to remember)
Step 6:Gaze into the Smoking mirror. Transcend time and sigilize the
future (whatever you will) continuing the chanting.
Step 7: Place the things of yourself onto the corn husks representing
CINTEOTL God/dess of nurturing fertility
Step 8: Cast the corn husks into the fire, symbolized as the Teyolia.
Repeat steps 5-7 until all members have completed their offerings.
Step 9: Close ritual by eating chocolates and by throwing some of the
popcorn into the fire, laugh while watching the corn explode this working
Into the eschaton!
>>>>> Let's hear your explanation for this one tani of the
plagiarising satanic retards.
-Douglas
--
**********************************************
Dagon Productions
Chaos Magick & Occult books
http://www.dagonproductions.com
in...@dagonproductions.com
END QUOTE
Dagon Productions
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>Last time:
>
You said it was the last time over 10 times ago... I stopped counting
after 7.
It only goes to prove your word isn't worth a damn.
>This is the first post you wrote - and the one I forwarded to
>Walter. And righto, I didn't even read thru it. I just forwarded it,
>called him up and asked him about it. As you can see, you did not ASK me
>about it. You ACCUSED and spewed vomit.
>
The sr site had material that I wrote... so it was an on target
accusation... you still haven't
explained how there is no attribution to walter or the ToS at the
beginning of the rite when
it was up on your site. I proved this by posting the html code copied
from your site the
day before you posted as well as the link to the wayback machines
archive of that
page. You outright lied.
>I have NO wish to take your
>material from you. I said 6 times now, if you gave permission to put it up,
>I'd not put your stuff up. Same reason why I took Craig Hunt's excellent
>essay down after B put it up and when Hunt said it was OK to put up there.
>I posted to him on here that it was up when B did it. I got the OK again.
>Then I saw the spew. I personally took it down. I don't care if he said
>OK, I don't care how good the essay is. Let Walt put it up on HIS site if
>he wants it. But it's NOT gonna be on OUR main site.
>
Blather blather rant rant whine whine. I think I feel any loss that you
wouldn't post
my rite to your site? What a laugh you are kookisar.
>Having a free site is
>consistent with the tenants of SR. Why pay for what you can have for free.
>
The satanic retards tenants??? Are the satanic retards slumlords to?
But I'm sure the sr tenets do include being cheap ass motherfuckers.
>Mind your own business. Take your silly challenges and shove them up your
>ass. Oh, heh, btw - if a PUBLISHER of a book publishes material UNKNOWINGLY
>submitted by a person that is plagiarized - the PUBLISHER, who can prove
>they did NOT know it was copyrighted - is NOT at fault. TX number please?
>
I never planned on that particular piece of my work to be published
publically... so why
go to the bother... as well as I don't have any plans to take legal
action other than having
my work removed from the net.
Go ahead tani whine some more about how innocent your are liar when you
have
been proven to lie already.
>
>QUOTE FIRST POST.
>It seems the SRs have a rite on their website that has material
>nicked from a rite I wrote.
>
That is some mean spew I wrote there. };)
And this is even meaner spew and vomit... bwahahaha... tani you
are well known for your obscene rampages that last pages long...
get over it.
Tani Jantsang
"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4137D2F6...@earthlink.net...
>
> Tani Jantsang wrote:
>
> >Last time:
>
> You said it was the last time over 10 times ago... I stopped counting
> after 7.
> It only goes to prove your word isn't worth a damn.
Yah, I wrote a few posts, put them in "drafts" and on the last one, wrote
'end of convo." And? Hit "send" in a differnt order. Trivialities are
your speciality, I see. Petty boy. I'm discussing it now - you fail to
reason that when I discuss, it's on my terms. Not yours.
>
> >This is the first post you wrote - and the one I forwarded to
> >Walter. And righto, I didn't even read thru it. I just forwarded it,
> >called him up and asked him about it. As you can see, you did not ASK me
> >about it. You ACCUSED and spewed vomit.
> >
>
> The sr site had material that I wrote... so it was an on target
> accusation... you still haven't
> explained
What I copy/pasted on here showing metatags and etc., is directly from my
file IN my computer, for that page. The only explanation I have is that
what was on there had errors, missing things, and never got updated. Odd
since ALL the others had it on there. No matter. I dont have to explain
anything to you. You don't quite realize that. There is no possible way
on the planet that anyone in SR could KNOW that anyone other than whoWalter
said, wrote it, no way on the planet to know that you wr.......uh....
Please provide the gov copyright TX number for your ritual. Thank you.
I don't "OWE" you any explanations. TX number please?
> >Mind your own business. Take your silly challenges and shove them up
your
> >ass. Oh, heh, btw - if a PUBLISHER of a book publishes material
UNKNOWINGLY
> >submitted by a person that is plagiarized - the PUBLISHER, who can prove
> >they did NOT know it was copyrighted - is NOT at fault. TX number
please?
> >
>
> I never planned on that particular piece of my work to be published
> publically... so why
> go to the bother... as well as I don't have any plans to take legal
> action other than having
> my work removed from the net.
LOL, so you posted it all on usenet, the whole text? LOL. But you managed
to get it put back up on the net - but it's not on any site I run. Oh, you
also managed to archive it - the entire text - and lookly look - it looks
like it's STILL on the SR site. Wow - how very smart! Dumbass.
>
> Go ahead tani whine some more about how innocent your are liar when you
> have
> been proven to lie already.
And I care if you think I'm lying? LMAO. I know what I have in my computer
file for it. It's what I pasted here.
But stop whining for a minute, Dougy... You tell me - tell us all - HOW
would anyone possibly be able to know YOU wrote that? HOW? It would be
possible to know that the TOS Pylon wrote it, or had it, and performed it
simply on the say so of the entire Pylon.
And - the reason I treated you like a total asshole - is because you simply
accused without using LOGIC. Proving you fail at logic. HOW could anyone
know you wrote it? HEH? Tell us all.
> And this is even meaner spew and vomit... bwahahaha... tani you
> are well known for your obscene rampages that last pages long...
> get over it.
Ah, but you are on a rampage and obscene even when you don't know you are
doing it. At least I'm giggling if I write something like that - and I do
know what it sounds like to anyone reading it. ("I hope your kids get
SHOT." That was my latest best rant. Heh, compared to Brendan, Walter and
Casey, MY flames are quite tame...) Obviously, I don't give a shit about
it, right? Obvious? You just made the whole ritual as public as ever on
usenet. You just insured that it would be archived - and you did that
yourself, DUMBASS. I guess you want it public - and it's associated with SR
in your own archive thing. LMAO. Yet if anyone goes to SR they aren't
gonna find it there. It's gone.
I suggest YOU get over it, if you can. I really don't care about it other
than I DO care to take stuff that's copyright with no permission, or stuff
that belongs to enemies OFF my site. Can't you tell? I don't care what you
FEEL about the non-issue at all. And it IS a non-issue, Doug - at least for
me it is. The subject title of your post was the spew. The accusation that
Sr STOLE it from YOU was spew. And just HOW did the SRs do that, Doug?
Did SRs sneak into your freaking house and take it? You never made it
public - how on earth would SRs GET it? EH? Hack into your computer?
Break into your house? HOW? You DUMBASS. You didn't THINK before you
spewed The chorus chiming in compounded it (yer pals) - ah yes, the
everpresent chorus of twitlings sniping at my heels.
So much for your spewing efforts. I doubt that any of what has happened
would have happened HAD you been a Human Being over it and used some reason
or even wonder, "HOW did the SRs get this?" That would have required a
decent QUESTION "How did you get that ritual?" But no, heh. Walter tracked
down Bonne and awaits that info. He also awaits Craig. But you were a rabid
dog about it. I see it. Walter saw it. Too late now. Go go, boy, embroil
yourself in legal shit. Go for it. You get treated like a rabid dog.
You know, heh, there are a few S. American Comrades in SR, one of them has
the nick Tezcat - his other nick IS Smoking Mirror. He asked us if we had
anything like that. We did NOT - but the TOS surely did - and Walter had
it - and that was primarily put up there at the request of Tez. The problem
is that NONE of the others speak English well enough to read that except Dan
(Tezcat) - the result is that almost NO ONE read it. Lemme look.
Heh, less than 45 people viewed that page at ANY time - that would include
Brendan as he was putting it up there and I guess you and your chorus of heh
heh --- castrati - LOL. Heh. Compare to "Destruction Ob" ritual - 21,450
people viewed that page in one MONTH. Ooo, heh, that's funny! They typed
in "destruction ritual" to get there, LMAO. Oh boy.
Now you do have a nice day, son...
OH - almost forgot.
Now you go wanky wanky deal with Big Bad Walter Alter
http://www.geocities.com/yollopoliuhqui/cinteotl
Dagon Productions
Tani Jantsang wrote:
>Douglas,
>
>"Dagon Productions" <da...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:4137D2F6...@earthlink.net...
>
>
>>Tani Jantsang wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Last time:
>>>
>>>
>>You said it was the last time over 10 times ago... I stopped counting
>>after 7.
>>It only goes to prove your word isn't worth a damn.
>>
>>
>
>Yah, I wrote a few posts, put them in "drafts" and on the last one, wrote
>'end of convo." And? Hit "send" in a differnt order. Trivialities are
>your speciality, I see. Petty boy. I'm discussing it now - you fail to
>reason that when I discuss, it's on my terms. Not yours.
>
Well, again you are posting on a topic you said you had stopped doing
so... lying again.
You set the terms not me dumbass.
>
>
>>>This is the first post you wrote - and the one I forwarded to
>>>Walter. And righto, I didn't even read thru it. I just forwarded it,
>>>called him up and asked him about it. As you can see, you did not ASK me
>>>about it. You ACCUSED and spewed vomit.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>The sr site had material that I wrote... so it was an on target
>>accusation... you still haven't
>>explained
>>
>>
>
>What I copy/pasted on here showing metatags and etc., is directly from my
>file IN my computer, for that page. The only explanation I have is that
>what was on there had errors, missing things, and never got updated. Odd
>since ALL the others had it on there. No matter. I dont have to explain
>anything to you. You don't quite realize that. There is no possible way
>on the planet that anyone in SR could KNOW that anyone other than whoWalter
>said, wrote it, no way on the planet to know that you wr.......uh....
>
>
So you were wrong... you update files but don't update your site with
them... I'd
say you are a pretty lousy webmaster.
satanic retards are not the only people that read a website available
to the
public... why can't you wrap your warped mind around such simple
concepts???
No you don't have to explain anything to me... you don't even have to
reply but you always do... against advice to do otherwise.
>Please provide the gov copyright TX number for your ritual. Thank you.
>
>I don't "OWE" you any explanations. TX number please?
>
I don't need one. Many copyright infringement suits have been won
without them.
>
>
>
>>>Mind your own business. Take your silly challenges and shove them up
>>>
>>>
>your
>
>
>>>ass. Oh, heh, btw - if a PUBLISHER of a book publishes material
>>>
>>>
>UNKNOWINGLY
>
>
>>>submitted by a person that is plagiarized - the PUBLISHER, who can prove
>>>they did NOT know it was copyrighted - is NOT at fault. TX number
>>>
>>>
>please?
>
>
>>I never planned on that particular piece of my work to be published
>>publically... so why
>>go to the bother... as well as I don't have any plans to take legal
>>action other than having
>>my work removed from the net.
>>
>>
>
>LOL, so you posted it all on usenet, the whole text? LOL. But you managed
>to get it put back up on the net - but it's not on any site I run. Oh, you
>also managed to archive it - the entire text - and lookly look - it looks
>like it's STILL on the SR site. Wow - how very smart! Dumbass.
>
I did not post my rite to the usenet dumbass. I posted a rite from the
satanic retards site
that contained copyrighted text of my own.
What are you talking about you raving looney... I copied the sr pages
html code the
day before you changed it and it's not still there... it now contains
your changes and
my work has been removed.
>
>
>>Go ahead tani whine some more about how innocent your are liar when you
>>have
>>been proven to lie already.
>>
>>
>
>And I care if you think I'm lying? LMAO. I know what I have in my computer
>file for it. It's what I pasted here.
>
As you admitted previously... you may not have updated the sr site with the
changes. My posting of the html code and the wayback machine archive
prove my points... you have proven nothing. What is on your computer
means nothing... it's what is on the website ya kook.
>
>But stop whining for a minute, Dougy... You tell me - tell us all - HOW
>would anyone possibly be able to know YOU wrote that? HOW? It would be
>possible to know that the TOS Pylon wrote it, or had it, and performed it
>simply on the say so of the entire Pylon.
>
>And - the reason I treated you like a total asshole - is because you simply
>accused without using LOGIC. Proving you fail at logic. HOW could anyone
>know you wrote it? HEH? Tell us all.
>
>
Well, people know I wrote it now, many in the IOT knew what I wrote over a
decade ago, people in the Golden Dawn knew I wrote it, people in the OTO,
and even a lone ToS member knows that it was performed in a IOT meeting
years before
the ToS performed it or wrote it. You have often not followed logic so
quit attempting
to tell anyone about it since you fall on your face logically regularly.
>
>
>>And this is even meaner spew and vomit... bwahahaha... tani you
>>are well known for your obscene rampages that last pages long...
>>get over it.
>>
>>
>
>Ah, but you are on a rampage and obscene even when you don't know you are
>doing it. At least I'm giggling if I write something like that - and I do
>know what it sounds like to anyone reading it. ("I hope your kids get
>SHOT." That was my latest best rant. Heh, compared to Brendan, Walter and
>Casey, MY flames are quite tame...) Obviously, I don't give a shit about
>it, right? Obvious? You just made the whole ritual as public as ever on
>usenet. You just insured that it would be archived - and you did that
>yourself, DUMBASS. I guess you want it public - and it's associated with SR
>in your own archive thing. LMAO. Yet if anyone goes to SR they aren't
>gonna find it there. It's gone.
>
>
A portion will be archived forever... I can live with that... no big
deal... it was worth
every laugh I got at your expense.
It's not gone from the satanic retard site on the wayback machine
archive dumbass.
Forever you will be associated with plagiarizing my work.
>I suggest YOU get over it, if you can. I really don't care about it other
>than I DO care to take stuff that's copyright with no permission, or stuff
>that belongs to enemies OFF my site. Can't you tell? I don't care what you
>FEEL about the non-issue at all. And it IS a non-issue, Doug - at least for
>me it is. The subject title of your post was the spew. The accusation that
>Sr STOLE it from YOU was spew. And just HOW did the SRs do that, Doug?
>Did SRs sneak into your freaking house and take it? You never made it
>public - how on earth would SRs GET it? EH? Hack into your computer?
>Break into your house? HOW? You DUMBASS. You didn't THINK before you
>spewed The chorus chiming in compounded it (yer pals) - ah yes, the
>everpresent chorus of twitlings sniping at my heels.
>
One takes a risk when giving anyone that one has created... some people
don't
keep their oaths, some people belong to multiple orgs and share material
they
technically should not... happens all the time... I took the risk... I
can live with
it... no skin off my back in the long run... just censoring what I care
to make
available to the world at large.
Uh, my pals... says the one that calls the alt.religion.wicca
trolls her pals. Troll lists have been made by multiple usenet groups
regarding
these nimrods.
>
>So much for your spewing efforts. I doubt that any of what has happened
>would have happened HAD you been a Human Being over it and used some reason
>or even wonder, "HOW did the SRs get this?" That would have required a
>decent QUESTION "How did you get that ritual?" But no, heh. Walter tracked
>down Bonne and awaits that info. He also awaits Craig. But you were a rabid
>dog about it. I see it. Walter saw it. Too late now. Go go, boy, embroil
>yourself in legal shit. Go for it. You get treated like a rabid dog.
>
>
Why should I be nice to you... I've watched you be an asshole for years
now... so you should
be the last person that expects anyone to be nice to them on alt.satanism.
>You know, heh, there are a few S. American Comrades in SR, one of them has
>the nick Tezcat - his other nick IS Smoking Mirror. He asked us if we had
>anything like that. We did NOT - but the TOS surely did - and Walter had
>it - and that was primarily put up there at the request of Tez. The problem
>is that NONE of the others speak English well enough to read that except Dan
>(Tezcat) - the result is that almost NO ONE read it. Lemme look.
>
>
More backpeddling.
>Heh, less than 45 people viewed that page at ANY time - that would include
>Brendan as he was putting it up there and I guess you and your chorus of heh
>heh --- castrati - LOL. Heh. Compare to "Destruction Ob" ritual - 21,450
>people viewed that page in one MONTH. Ooo, heh, that's funny! They typed
>in "destruction ritual" to get there, LMAO. Oh boy.
>
>Now you do have a nice day, son...
>
>OH - almost forgot.
>Now you go wanky wanky deal with Big Bad Walter Alter
>http://www.geocities.com/yollopoliuhqui/cinteotl
>
walter thought I would waste my time searching for this... but dumbass
tani hands it to me on a silver platter.
I'm getting ready for an art opening tomorrow night, but I will have a
package of info for geocities soon... we shall see what happens.
I've got to stop laughing or I won't get to sleep tonight.