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Hobie 16 repair question

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Stephan

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May 27, 2002, 2:47:21 PM5/27/02
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Aloha,
 
I am looking for info on how to separate the decks from the sides of the hulls on a Hobie 16
Before somebody suggests explosives or axes I should make clear that I want to be able to put the pieces back together  ;-P
I was wondering if the decks were glued with structural glue or laminated, glassed to the sides.
So, if i take the hulls appart do I weaken the fiber structure of the boat of do I just break a glue bead ?
 
Did anyone here do this kind of thing on a Hobie?
Does anyone have a link to share or the title of a book ?
 
Thanks in advance and good winds to you
 
Stephan
 

Jack Hoying

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May 27, 2002, 10:23:23 PM5/27/02
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Stephan,
  Unless a previous owner epoxied the boat together, it should come apart fairly easily.  I took my H16 apart every winter for storage.  After you loosen and remove the trampoline, remove the 4 bolts that hold the corner castings to the hull risers.  You may need a block of wood and mallet to tap the castings up off the risers.  Sometimes twisting the hull a little will help with dissemble.
Good luck,
Jack

--

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
 
Jack Hoying
Fort Loramie, Ohio
http://www.bright.net/~jmhoying

d parker

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May 27, 2002, 11:10:20 PM5/27/02
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I have to ask the obvious question. Why do you want to do it?
 
DP

Stephan

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May 28, 2002, 2:06:11 AM5/28/02
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Because  all the methods of fixing the delamination problem are not satisfying me
I spent a few years as a boat builder and I have been building hi-tech styro/glass/divinicell/carbon/kevlar sailboards
From my experience drilling holes and injecting epoxy is OK but not the proper solution
What I want to do is open the hulls, dry them and relaminate them properly and reassemble them
I have seen people cutting big holes in them to access the inside and reglass
but this is damaging the structure of the hulls more than fixing them
The best fix I did so far on a hobie was to drill holes, inject epoxy and then put the hull under pressure with a shop compressor
It worked but it was scarry! Also It is hard to know how good it worked really. The hulls were stiffer but that's all.
no idea how good the resin spreaded etc etc.
Anyway this time I want to do crack the hullsopen and that is why I asked the question in the previous post of mine
 
Stephan
 
 
 parker" <daveparker(nospam)@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message news:3cf2f517$0$2524$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...

Stephan

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May 28, 2002, 2:07:55 AM5/28/02
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Thanks for your reply but I meant separating the decks of the hulls from the side of the hulls
Taking the lid off in other words
 
Stephan

d parker

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May 28, 2002, 5:01:58 AM5/28/02
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 O I C.... let us all know how you go.
 
DP

Douglas King

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May 28, 2002, 2:16:24 PM5/28/02
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Stephan wrote:

> Because all the methods of fixing the
> delamination problem are not satisfying meI
> spent a few years as a boat builder and I have
> been building hi-tech
> styro/glass/divinicell/carbon/kevlar

> sailboardsFrom my experience drilling holes and


> injecting epoxy is OK but not the proper

> solutionWhat I want to do is open the hulls, dry


> them and relaminate them properly and reassemble

> themI have seen people cutting big holes in them
> to access the inside and reglassbut this is


> damaging the structure of the hulls more than
> fixing them

Possibly, depends on the method used.

Taking the deck off the hulls is not impossible,
but with a boat like the Hobie where it is bonded
in place all the way around, it is difficult and
time consuming. The only way I know of to do it is
to use something like a Dremel tool and saw a
parallel cut all the way thru the hull-deck flange
all the way around. Also you will need to build a
large jig to hold the hulls rigid while apart, and
to guide the deck back on properly when you
reassemble them.

It would be cheaer and easier to either build your
own boat from scratch or to go buy a Hobie 16 in
better shape; or possibly to re-evaluate your
opinion of sawing an access hole into the hull and
then sealing it back up. It is possible to do this
retaining 100% of the structural strength and
adding very little weight.

Fresh Breezes- Doug King


Stephan

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May 28, 2002, 3:25:09 PM5/28/02
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Thanks for your reply

So it is bonded and not glassed, that's what i wanted to know
Dremel tool is too slow, my metal grinding wheel should do the job in less
than 30 minutes
Good idea to make a rigid jig, easy with a bit of wood and poly foam.
Buying a better boat is certainly a better idea but that would take the fun
out of it.
The whole idea of having a boat is to work for weeks on the damn thing,
spend a lot of money and eventualy go sail a bit, or did things change?
How do you retain the structure of the boat after you cut across the fiber?
IMO you'd have to dig down to the last layer and relaminate. Lots of ginding
and fairing !

Stephan


"Douglas King" <dou...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:3CF3C978...@bellsouth.net...

Douglas King

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May 28, 2002, 3:51:54 PM5/28/02
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Stephan wrote:

> Buying a better boat is certainly a better idea but that would take the fun
> out of it.

You might enjoy building a better boat from scratch.....

>
> How do you retain the structure of the boat after you cut across the fiber?
> IMO you'd have to dig down to the last layer and relaminate. Lots of ginding
> and fairing !

Nope. Just cut at a 45 degree slant, you will have created a scarf joint which
will (with modern adhesives) be stronger than the original fibers. Plus you put
a 4" wide layer of FG (I'd use epitaxial tape for greater strength) above and
below the rejoined cut, mated to the cloth rather than the gelcoat. This adds
only a few grams of weight and maintains the structure.

It's even better if you have the technology to cut an oval hole with such a
slant. The way there are no straight lines to disrupt the stress map. Think
outside the box!

Fresh Breezes- Doug King


Stephan

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May 28, 2002, 6:14:43 PM5/28/02
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"Douglas King" <dou...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:3CF3DFDA...@bellsouth.net...

> You might enjoy building a better boat from scratch.....

Probably but it would be more expensive and more time consuming


> Nope. Just cut at a 45 degree slant, you will have created a scarf joint
which
> will (with modern adhesives) be stronger than the original fibers. Plus
you put
> a 4" wide layer of FG (I'd use epitaxial tape for greater strength) above
and
> below the rejoined cut, mated to the cloth rather than the gelcoat. This
adds
> only a few grams of weight and maintains the structure.

From experience I can tell you that creating a stronger point in a hull
creates problems on the long run
Cracks will always appear at the beginning of that point because the flex is
interrupted
Well, yes, one should bond a new layer to an existing one. glassing on
gelcoat is like fixing a broken arm with a band-aid

> It's even better if you have the technology to cut an oval hole with such
a
> slant. The way there are no straight lines to disrupt the stress map.
Think
> outside the box!

The Oval hole is a good idea

I am thinking of making a webpage about this project, I'll send you a link
if you are interrested


> Fresh Breezes- Doug King
>
>
Same to you

Stephane


Stephan

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May 28, 2002, 6:43:12 PM5/28/02
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Oh I forgot

You seem to know about modern adhesives
I was using one that came in two parts and was mixed as it was pushed
through an enless screw in a transparent nozzle but I forgot the name of it
What brand would you recommend?

Stephan


"Stephan" <beedoo...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message

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Douglas King

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May 28, 2002, 8:34:12 PM5/28/02
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Stephan wrote:

> Oh I forgot
>
> You seem to know about modern adhesives
> I was using one that came in two parts and was mixed as it was pushed
> through an enless screw in a transparent nozzle but I forgot the name of it
> What brand would you recommend?

Well this is not very "modern" but I am quite fond of WEST System epoxies. They
have a wide variety of bonding & filling agents and couple of different
formulations, they aren't the cheapest but they are pretty easy to use and
tremendously strong. Epoxy will bond readily to polyester/fiberglass.

As for making one part stronger being possibly a bad idea, I agree, but on a
narrow heavy boat like the Hobie 16 I don't think it's a big issue. It'd be a
lot better than having the hulls twisted by putting the deck back on slightly
askew, or having the whole thing splay apart just when you're flying a hull on a
honkin' reach.... wait a minute, that actually sounds exciting....

Fresh Breezes- Doug King


Stephan

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May 28, 2002, 11:05:01 PM5/28/02
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I use only west system, simply the best stuff out there.
You're right, epoxy with some 404 should be tough enough
I would not mind having a hull desintegrate as long somebody has a camera
pointed a the boat when it happens
That would make a nice photo to show the grand-kids one day
Grand-Pa was so fast on his boat that day that the hull exploded ;-)

Stephan

"Douglas King" <dou...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message

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John Voight

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May 31, 2002, 8:01:32 AM5/31/02
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In article <ZavI8.13361$wj7.7...@twister.socal.rr.com>,
beedoo...@hawaii.rr.com says...

You don't want to do that, really.

Stephan

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May 31, 2002, 1:28:19 PM5/31/02
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Actualy I do,
I heard of a guy doing this here a few decades ago
He sanded his hulls from the inside to make his cat lighter
This team was used to carry the cat over the sand instead of dragging it on
it

Stephan


"John Voight" <e...@t.com> wrote in message
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