What's the Best Strip Joint in Rhode Island?
WayDude99
better than food. Hmmm....Well it's as good as food. Maybe I could get a lap
dance while eating pizza.
JC
The heck with pizza! What's everyone's vote on the best strip joint? Sex is
better than food. Hmmm....Well it's as good as food. Maybe I could get a lap
dance while eating pizza.
Good question my friend! Fantasies in Providence has always been my
favorite because the girls are decent looking, cover before 6PM is free and
it'a pressure free atmosphere where you don't need to spend a ton of money
to have a good time. Hell, I used to stand in the back and nurse a beer for
an hour while I watched the girls on stage. When the real hot looking girls
came on I would sit down quick to make sure I got a lap dance from her. Even
those only cost a few bucks a piece. There were times that I spent three
hours there and only spent $20 total. It's definately a good club to go to
if you are short on cash! The girls are also very friendly. They have a lot
of college girls working there who are really cute! I think this is the club
of choice for girls to work at who are putting themselves through college.
But for the BEST looking girls go to The Foxy Lady. It's one of the most
popular strip clubs in New England and 90 percent of the girls are Playboy
material! The downside is that this club will cost you an arm and a leg if
you stay to long.
So my top pick is still Fantasies.
JC
**** Posted from RemarQ - http://www.remarq.com - Discussions Start Here (tm) ****
Semper USMC
If you want the "most" for your buck! Cheaters is a fine adult dancing
club where the girls are kinda pretty and really enjoy being felt up for a
buck. It's a dollar well spent. Grab some beers before you go and the
ladies will look better. Minimum needed for a good time- $20.00
However, if you want to experience a "real" strip club, then the FOXY
Lady is the club of champions. Rhode Island's best ladies work at the
foxy's. It's truly an experience. Bring your wallet, you will need it to
have a could time. You only live once, don't die before going to the
foxy's at least once. minimum needed for a "good" time- $80.00
I of course was in the Marines for several years and have many strip
clubs under my belt. I don't hit them like I use to, but I try to make an
annual appearance. Now I spend all my money on dating!
Mr. Rhode Island,
Rich in Cranston
--
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Island/5507/
WayDude99 <wayd...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19990515100747...@ng-cg1.aol.com...
Bob Ficoturo
Semper USMC wrote:
> Cheaters!
> If you want the "most" for your buck! Cheaters is a fine adult dancing
> club where the girls are kinda pretty and really enjoy being felt up for a
> buck.
Ahem. Does this really need a response. This comment is just a bit short of
somebody else's comment that; "they are all college girls". First... any numb
nuts who believes that young attractive girls "ENJOY" getting molested by
strangers for $1.00 needs a check up from the neck up. Second. If you believe
that they are all college girls, then I have this elevator pass I'd like to sell
you...
--
Bob Ficoturo
Invest in world peace
Hug a kid today
JC
Ahem. Does this really need a response. This comment is just a bit short of
somebody else's comment that; "they are all college girls". First... any
numb nuts who believes that young attractive girls "ENJOY" getting molested
by strangers for $1.00 needs a check up from the neck up. Second. If you
believe that they are all college girls, then I have this elevator pass I'd
like to sell you...
Bob Ficoturo
--
Ahem, Hi Bob...... If you are referring to my post (which you must be
since I am the only one who mentioned college girls in this thread) then you
need to read what I wrote again. I NEVER said that they are ALL college
girls. I said they have A LOT of college girls working there. (see my
original post below) I've been there, I've spoken with them, therefore I
know this. Bob, what experience do you have with this club to back up a
different point? (I respectfully guess...NONE.) Second of all strip clubs
are NOT ABOUT anyone being molested! But...If you want to go that route Bob,
then it's more like the girls are molesting the customers. The girls are the
ones who will sit on your lap, take your head and stick your whole face in
their chest. C'mon Bob, who's molesting who??? LOL! But seriously,
it's a far cry from the crime scene that you paint it out to be. It's all
about adults having some fun, and YES many young attractive girls LOVE
everything about taking their clothes off and showing their bodies. Open up
your eyes, it's all around you. On TV, movies, magazines, websites, clubs
etc.... This is our world today BOB. Maybe you don't like it, but it's still
our world nonetheless.
JC
(My original posting)
(Fantasies)It's definately a good club to go to if you are short on cash!
The girls are also very friendly. They have a lot of college girls working
there who are really cute! I think this is the club of choice for girls to
work at who are putting themselves through college.
**** Posted from RemarQ - http://www.remarq.com - Discussions Start Here (tm) ****
Wildcat
the women..........................
Bob Ficoturo wrote in message <373FE5A9...@Wawa.com>...
>Okay... okay... I can stand it no longer!
>
>Semper USMC wrote:
>
>> Cheaters!
>> If you want the "most" for your buck! Cheaters is a fine adult
dancing
>> club where the girls are kinda pretty and really enjoy being felt up for
a
>> buck.
>
>Ahem. Does this really need a response. This comment is just a bit short
of
>somebody else's comment that; "they are all college girls". First... any
numb
>nuts who believes that young attractive girls "ENJOY" getting molested by
>strangers for $1.00 needs a check up from the neck up. Second. If you
believe
>that they are all college girls, then I have this elevator pass I'd like to
sell
>you...
>
pla
> strangers for $1.00 needs a check up from the neck up. Second. If you beli
as a fairly young college male (granted, i'm not female), i think i would
be delighted to get $1.00 for each "feel", a few hundred times a night...
we always look at situations like this and think, "aww, these poor girls
have nowhere else to go, and have to resort to psuedo-prostitution"...
i have news for you...
at least among my friends, well over half of the females would *love* to
have a job like that, but such jobs are very picky about who they hire.
- pla
BetzBet
>then it's more like the girls are molesting the customers. The girls are the
>ones who will sit on your lap, take your head and stick your whole face in
>their chest. C'mon Bob, who's molesting who??? LOL! But seriously,
>it's a far cry from the crime scene that you paint it out to be. It's all
>about adults having some fun, and YES many young attractive girls LOVE
>everything about taking their clothes off and showing their bodies. Open up
>your eyes, it's all around you. On TV, movies, magazines, websites, clubs
>etc.... This is our world today BOB. Maybe you don't like it, but it's still
>our world nonetheless.
Me thinks thou art a MORON JC, it is people like you that pollute the gene
pool. These girls are degrading themsellves and it is people like you who
support it that keep them DOWN far enough phychologically to do these things
for $$$$$
WayDude99
best strip joint is. Maybe if there are any exotic dancers out there reading
this they can tell me which club is best to work at? Also do they allow pizza
to be brought in? Most importantly if I give you a slice of pizza will you
give me a lap dance?
JC
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Topic: Re: What's the Best Strip Joint in Rhode Island?
Message: 8 of 8 (In response to JC)
From: BetzBet <bet...@aol.com>
Sent: 17 May 1999 17:46:26 GMT
Me thinks thou art a MORON JC, it is people like you that pollute the gene
pool. These girls are degrading themsellves and it is people like you who
support it that keep them DOWN far enough phychologically to do these things
for $$$$$
FACT #1. A person is not a moron because they don't agree with you.
FACT #2. You are damn right that I support it! I support free speech and
the "freedom of choice. If a woman makes the decision that she wants to work
in a strip club then that is her absolute right to do so. If you don't
beleive in that freedom that why don't you move to another country where
their belief system is more like yours? then maybe you'll be happier.
FACT #3. It is closed minded people like you who can't handle living in
todays society. Got a message for you... GET OVER IT! The world would
revolve just fine without people like you bitching all the time. If you are
so damn passionate about this issue then why are you sitting in front of a
computer? Shouldn't you be down at all the strip clubs trying to save the
lost souls? Do something useful with your passion. You complaining to me
isn't changing a damn thing. As you read this guys are getting lap dances at
this VERY MOMENT. You better run down there quick before the gene pool gets
any more polluted. :)
By the way... look at your own e-mail address. It has compulsive gambler
written all over it... BETZBET. Not only is the word BET in it once but
you've actually managed to fit the word BET in twice! Your probaly losing
all your money at Foxwoods at this very moment. But I guess that's O.K. in
your eyes. All the compulsive gamblers who are now broke, can't pay their
rent, can't feed their families and are homeless are all O.K. with you. You
see nothing wrong with gambling ruining peoples lives, right???? But you
have a problem with adult woman making a few bucks by dancing for some guys?
WOW YOU ARE WARPED! Don't make me dig up dirt on you. I hate a phony and if
I find out that you arn't as innocent as you make yourself out to be THEN
YOU ARE REALLY GOING TO HEAR IT.
JC
pla
> pool. These girls are degrading themsellves and it is people like you who
> support it that keep them DOWN far enough phychologically to do these things
> for $$$$$
although i normally have not agreed with JC on... um... anything, this
time i've got to agree. working in those clubs is a highly desired
position among females who aren't ashamed of their bodies (okay, so
that limits it quite a bit, but...).
this isn't like the seedy club scenes we have shoved down our throats by
most movies... these are clean, legal places, where the women are
*very* well protected. they do *only* what they want.
there's nothing degrading about this, or keeping women in subordinate
roles. they are in control of the situation... someone gives them trouble,
the bouncer has them out before they can blink. and it's not like
they're indentured servants, either. if they want a new job,
they're free to leave. mcdonalds is always hiring. it just pays
about 90% less (which isn't an unfounded speculation... a friend of mine
works two nights a week and makes probably twice what i do...).
- pla
Daniel Podgurski
>
> Okay... okay... I can stand it no longer!
Yes you can stand it!
*chuckle*
>
> Semper USMC wrote:
>
> > Cheaters!
> > If you want the "most" for your buck! Cheaters is a fine adult dancing
> > club where the girls are kinda pretty and really enjoy being felt up for a
> > buck.
>
> Ahem. Does this really need a response.
<Pedantic> Aren't _you_ responding? </Pedantic>
This comment is just a bit short of
> somebody else's comment that; "they are all college girls". First... any numb
> nuts who believes that young attractive girls "ENJOY" getting molested by
> strangers for $1.00 needs a check up from the neck up. Second. If you believe
> that they are all college girls, then I have this elevator pass I'd like to sell
> you...
But if you're pulling in upwards of 500 bux a *night* for 4 hours "work",
maybe you'd do it too, Bob.
And *that* is a *conservative* estimate.
No, I'm not a frequent patron of such establishments, but I know a former
stripper, and she said the money is _very_ good.
She's just given up on men, however. <big sigh>
--
Dan (I was born with the wrong body)
"The Nunavut legislature is shaped like an igloo. It'd be great if
other provincial legislatures were designed this way. You know... in
Saskatchewan it could be a grain elevator, Nova Scotia could have a
schooner, and in B.C. ... a giant bong."
- Mike Bullard
Bob Ficoturo
when you took exception to my response. So I'm responding to you, but this is mostly
meant for the other guy.
> Ahem, Hi Bob...... If you are referring to my post (which you must be
> since I am the only one who mentioned college girls in this thread) then you
> need to read what I wrote again. I NEVER said that they are ALL college
> girls. I said they have A LOT of college girls working there. (see my
> original post below) I've been there, I've spoken with them, therefore I
> know this.
Good for you. And on this basis you believe them when they say they are poor college
girls just trying to get the next tuition payment together. Sorry... that sounds just
a bit naive to me.
> Bob, what experience do you have with this club to back up a
> different point? (I respectfully guess...NONE.)
Nope... nary a visit... however... well... let me wait 'til later to discuss the
issues of experience.
> Second of all strip clubs
> are NOT ABOUT anyone being molested!
Oh no? And what experience do you base ~that~ on... having a few drinks and blushing
while you get your cheap lap dance? Again... sorry... but that sounds a bit naive to
me.
> But...If you want to go that route Bob,
> then it's more like the girls are molesting the customers.
Oh yeah... that's the ticket... stop... somebody call the police. You can't be ~that~
naive. I certainly hope that was a lame attempt at humor.
> The girls are the
> ones who will sit on your lap, take your head and stick your whole face in
> their chest. C'mon Bob, who's molesting who??? LOL!
Right.
> But seriously,
> it's a far cry from the crime scene that you paint it out to be.
Oh? did I paint a crime scene? All I did was chortle at the gullible oafs who will
believe every sad sack story these girls tell, and shake my head in disbelief at the
thought of someone actually believing these girls enjoy the groping they get for a
buck... as if they would do it for nothing if only we knew how much they enjoyed it.
It's okay to have your fantasies... but don't ask the rest of ~us~ to believe them,
okay?
> It's all
> about adults having some fun,
Which ones... they guys? The girls? You think these girls do this for fun?
> and YES many young attractive girls LOVE
> everything about taking their clothes off and showing their bodies.
Oh yes JC... pity that we don't know how anxious they are to expose themselves... we'd
save ourselves the money, find them on the street, and they'd be thrilled to do it for
us right there in Roger Williams Park.
> Open up
> your eyes, it's all around you. On TV, movies, magazines, websites, clubs
> etc.... This is our world today BOB. Maybe you don't like it, but it's still
> our world nonetheless.
Such a worldly sort you are. First, there is nothing in my comments on this subject
that could lead a reasonable person to believe that I'm being judgmental about the
women who do this or about the men who watch them. Rather, I was pointing out the
gross ignorance and gullibility of others who seem to think this is a clean business
where nice girls come to take off their clothes, act in a sexually explicit manner for
money, and enjoy being "felt up" is the phrase I think that was used.
I started my working life as a musician in the 60's and at one point, I probably had
worked every strip joint and/or burlesque theater in Atlantic City, and most of 'em in
the Philadelphia area. Those who have read my postings for a while will recall that I
refer to a teaching career early on that I gave up. I was a classically trained
musician and music teacher. And when I gave up teaching, I played full time. In fact
for those of you who are a bit older, you may remember the 500 Club in Atlantic City.
It was famous for being the place where Jerry Lewis and Dean Martin got their start,
as well as being the only club on the East coast that Sinatra would work in after he
refused to work in NY ever again. I was in the house band in that club before it
burned down.
I lay out this background in order to offer some knowledge on the subject of
strippers, exotic dancers, and bar girls. I've known dozens of them... some of them
quite well (nothing should be inferred from that comment). None of them ever enjoyed
the way they earned money. Many of them had to agree to rather bizarre circumstances
just to have the access to the stage to do what you see them doing. Don't tell me
it's not about molesting women. It happens. And just because they suffer through it
in silence, don't you make the mistake of thinking they "like it". No. They are not
nice girls, but many of them are victims of circumstance and tragedy. They work hard,
are subject to violence, and often put themselves at great risk doing what they do to
earn a living. It's very sad. So you go ahead and wrap a stinking $1 bill in some
pretty girl's G-string. Yup... you kid yourself into believing her when she tells you
how macho you are. And you go home and tell your buddies what a big shot you were.
But don't ever make the mistake of thinking that these women enjoy you groping them
for the crummy buck you tuck in.
Bob Ficoturo
pla wrote:
> this isn't like the seedy club scenes we have shoved down our throats by
> most movies... these are clean, legal places, where the women are
> *very* well protected. they do *only* what they want.
How could you possible know that? You think that because they are allowed to
operate, therefore legal, that nothing sordid, or illegal for that matter,
transpires there?
> there's nothing degrading about this, or keeping women in subordinate
> roles.
Not to you.
> they are in control of the situation... someone gives them trouble,
> the bouncer has them out before they can blink.
Yup. Those would be the stiffs drinking and drooling in the front row. What
happens when the women is told to... make a special customer happy? Does she call
the bouncer?
> and it's not like
> they're indentured servants, either. if they want a new job,
> they're free to leave. mcdonalds is always hiring. it just pays
> about 90% less (which isn't an unfounded speculation... a friend of mine
> works two nights a week and makes probably twice what i do...).
Yeah... and every woman's life is so free of complexities that they can draw their
FU money out of the bank and head for the closest McD's.
Daniel Podgurski
>
> Hi Dan
>
> Daniel Podgurski wrote:
That's
> still over $100 G's a year. So how many of them do you see living the high life?
Not many, because there aren't that many strippers.
But still, to be young, single, and to be making $500 per diem ain't bad.
*Most* college grads are lucky to be making *a third* of that when they
enter the workforce.
<snip a bunch of stuff about pimps and stereotypical bs like that>
I think your dull spot happens to be with the fact that maybe you've seen
too much of what Hollywood dishes out. Both you and I don't frequent that
side of the tracks very often, so that's basically what we have to rely on
for our opinion, isn't it?
'Cept for me, I read an article in Rhode Island Monthly a couple of years
ago about who makes what in this state, and I was _floored_ by what a
stripper makes. I asked a friend of mine who used to be a stripper (she
was managing a health food store at the time) if it was true about how much
money there is, and she said "Yup".
> So... is she living the high life with the beautiful people now that she's out of the
> business... or maybe the only business she's out of is the stripping business.
No, Bob, she's got an ordinary job now, like you, and probably making half
of what she used to make. Why doesn't she strip any more? It's physically
demanding. She had to work out *every day* to keep in top shape for those
tips. Who would tip a flabby stripper?
Also, it's emotionally demanding. It's a "public" job, like selling. Say
you're selling petrochemicals. Does the customer *care* whether or not
you've had a really crappy day? Does the customer care whether your wife
has been on your ass to finish that ceiling that you've been working on all
spring? No. You paste on that happy face and show a happy attitude and
hope like hell that your prices haven't already been beaten by a competitor
and you make that commission.
Nobody tips a stripper with a piss-poor attitude.
It's a job. That's all it is. Some people manage networks, some take off
their clothes.
--
Dan
Lee Rudolph
>It's a job. That's all it is. Some people manage networks, some take off
>their clothes.
Yeah, but the people who take off their clothes are really in the
business of selling fantasy.
Oh, wait a minute. ... Never mind.
Lee Rudolph
Bob Ficoturo
Daniel Podgurski wrote:
> > Ahem. Does this really need a response.
>
> <Pedantic> Aren't _you_ responding? </Pedantic>
That was me thinking out loud and not believing that such gullibility wasn't obvious
to all others. Sorry for typing out loud <G>.
> But if you're pulling in upwards of 500 bux a *night* for 4 hours "work",
> maybe you'd do it too, Bob.
Okay... let's do some math. $500/night at what... 6 nights a week? Let's say 4 for
argument's sake. That's $2,000/week for tips alone. Okay, let's say the owner of the
club hires these girls for just the tips and there is no other salary. let's say they
also don't make anything extra for entertaining those "special" customers. That's
still over $100 G's a year. So how many of them do you see living the high life? How
many of them do you read about being shot, dying of drug overdoses, being beaten to
death, etc. They don't make that much money. They have expenses... usually in the
form of pim... err... scratch that... agents. Sorry I seem to have a dull spot on
this subject, but I have a hard time finding humor in it.
> No, I'm not a frequent patron of such establishments, but I know a former
> stripper, and she said the money is _very_ good.
>
> She's just given up on men, however. <big sigh>
So... is she living the high life with the beautiful people now that she's out of the
business... or maybe the only business she's out of is the stripping business.
--
Semper USMC
so cheap, sometimes I don't even give them a buck. Ha-
--
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Island/5507/
Daniel Podgurski <b...@ids.net> wrote in message
news:37409D2B...@ids.net...
> Bob Ficoturo wrote:
>
> >
> > Okay... okay... I can stand it no longer!
>
> Yes you can stand it!
>
> *chuckle*
>
> >
> > Semper USMC wrote:
> >
> > > Cheaters!
> > > If you want the "most" for your buck! Cheaters is a fine adult
dancing
> > > club where the girls are kinda pretty and really enjoy being felt up
for a
> > > buck.
> >
> > Ahem. Does this really need a response.
>
> <Pedantic> Aren't _you_ responding? </Pedantic>
>
> This comment is just a bit short of
> > somebody else's comment that; "they are all college girls". First...
any numb
> > nuts who believes that young attractive girls "ENJOY" getting molested
by
> > strangers for $1.00 needs a check up from the neck up. Second. If you
believe
> > that they are all college girls, then I have this elevator pass I'd like
to sell
> > you...
>
> But if you're pulling in upwards of 500 bux a *night* for 4 hours "work",
> maybe you'd do it too, Bob.
>
> And *that* is a *conservative* estimate.
>
> No, I'm not a frequent patron of such establishments, but I know a former
> stripper, and she said the money is _very_ good.
>
> She's just given up on men, however. <big sigh>
>
> --
> Dan (I was born with the wrong body)
>
Semper USMC
ladies don't like how they are being touched, you are tossed OUT! I 've
seen the bouncers at work at Cheaters. Let's just says you get more then
the door being held for you while you leave.
As for my "felt up for a buck" comment. I was merrily trying to be
humorous. This newsgroup could use a little lightening up. --
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Island/5507/
Bob Ficoturo <Robert.J.F...@Wawa.com> wrote in message
news:3740E220...@Wawa.com...
JC
Such a worldly sort you are. First, there is nothing in my
comments on this subject that could lead a reasonable
person to believe that I'm being judgmental about the women
who do this or about the men who watch them.
Hey Bob,
You've had so much to say on this subject that
there was actually to much text to quote. So let me respond
in this way. Can stripping be degrading? my answer is YES.
Are their some strippers who are drug addicted prostitutes?
My answer is YES. Are their strippers who HATE stripping
and are just in it strictly for the money? My answer again
is YES. However every business has it's good, it's bad and
it's evil side. You have chosen to CONCENTRATE on this bad
side BOB, instead of coming to the realization that in the
year 1999 there ARE clean college aged girls who enjoy this
type of work and enjoy the quick money that it brings in.
Bad strippers are now the minority and the good ones are
the MAJORITY. Your automatic negative labeling of strippers
has shown a narrow mindeness view which is not very
realistic. It's easy to point out the negative in ANY
business. You have just chosen the Adult entertainment
industry to frown upon. People have changed a lot since
your burlesque days Bob and the Adult entertainment
business has changed in many ways as well. The clubs now
are much cleaner, safer and secure. These days it's not
uncommon for the most innocent girls to get together in a
college dorm room and decide that they want to work at the
local strip club for some easy money. If you don't think
this happens BOB, then it is YOU is very naieve. $5.50 an
hour (McDonalds) vs. $100 dollars an hour (Strip Club). For
many woman the choice is very obvious. Sometimes it's worth
losing a little dignity so that you can have a nice car,
live in a nice apartment AND still have plenty of extra
time to enjoy your cash. To young women this is an ideal
solution to lives problems. Perhaps not in your mind Bob,
but in their mind IT HONESTLY IS.) So Stop living in the
past Bob. We live in a much more open society now then we
did 30 or 40 years ago. Things that were once tabou are now
much more acceptable. Open up your mind and you will open
up a whole new world.
JC
Sent: Tue, 18 May 1999 01:03:32 -0400
As for my "felt up for a buck" comment. I was merrily
trying to be humorous. This newsgroup could use a little
lightening up. --
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Island/5507/
Trust me Rich, Your web page has proved to be very
humorous. :) I don't mean that as a put down, but I've got
to say that you seem so incredibly stuck on yourself that
it's probaly the very reason why you can't get a second
date. Self confidence is one thing, but a pompus attitude
is a TOTAL turn off. Your sound file alone had me laughing
my ass off. I was sitting in my house actually laughing out
loud because I can't beleive how arrogant you sound. Try
being a lot more modest and I'm sure that you will get a
woman without a problem. I sincerely wish you Good Luck.
Michael Smith
places and would be categorized by some as part of the problem, I have no
doubts that some of these women would rather be making money in a more
socially acceptable manner. However, I have to say that many of these girls
are in this situation because it is their lifestyle, and for whatever
reason, they choose to be in it. Don't be naive enough to think that they
love being groped for cash, but don't be naive enough to think that they
would be Mother Teresa if only they weren't being oppressed.
Michael Smith
am
> so cheap, sometimes I don't even give them a buck. Ha-
Why is it a known fact? Cause you just said it? I've got news for you,
they just tell you that so you'll stop bothering them......
pla
hey, you've just pretty well demonstrated my point.
they are there because the money's good...
regardless of if they *like* the work, they do *want* to work there rather
than mcdonalds.
"free of complexities"? what are we talking about here? i'm not dumb enough
to think that *none* of these women are there by "unusual" circumstances
or obligations, but do you really think that all, or most, or even a
significant percent, are there because their dealer vinnie sold them into
slavery or some other "complexity"? perhaps that's going overboard, but
i simply do not see what could keep them there if it's so loathesome.
- pla
pla
2 nights a week, that's about $50k a year. enough to pay for college,
have a decent apartment, and not live like crap. and in many cases, to
support a kid.
drugs, pimps, shootings? c'mon, you've accused me of living in
a fantasy world before, but real life ain't the movies. it's
not idyllic, either, and i'm sure that does happen, on occasion,
but i would say it's the exception, not the rule.
- pla
pla
on the basis that most strippers are female, and it's estimated that
close to half of all females have had "an encounter with the same gender",
then yes, that is a logical conclusion.
- pla
BetzBet
never said you WERE a moron, just that I thought of you as one.>If you don't
>beleive in that freedom that why don't you move to another country
do believe in that right>FACT #3. It is closed minded people like you who can't
handle living in
>todays society.
not at all closed minded>FACT #3. It is closed minded people like you who can't
handle living in
>todays society.
> GET OVER IT!
already over it
> bitching all the time.
one (1) posting does not constitute "bitching all the time, I have been reading
this NG for over a year
>so damn passionate about this issue
not passionate, just commented
>By the way... look at your own e-mail address. It has compulsive gambler
wow, this is grasping, I don't even buy scratch tickets.
>WOW YOU ARE WARPED!
this your opinion? shouldn't it have an "I think"
Bob Ficoturo
JC wrote:
> You've had so much to say on this subject that
> there was actually to much text to quote. So let me respond
> in this way. Can stripping be degrading? my answer is YES.
> Are their some strippers who are drug addicted prostitutes?
> My answer is YES. Are their strippers who HATE stripping
> and are just in it strictly for the money? My answer again
> is YES. However every business has it's good, it's bad and
> it's evil side. You have chosen to CONCENTRATE on this bad
> side BOB, instead of coming to the realization that in the
> year 1999 there ARE clean college aged girls who enjoy this
> type of work and enjoy the quick money that it brings in.
Oh thank you... THANK YOU JC. You have opened up my mind and now
I see that wonderful new 1999 world! Why didn't I see it before.
perhaps some of the women in this NG would like to comment on our
new world JC.
Bob Ficoturo
JC wrote:
> Trust me Rich, Your web page has proved to be very
> humorous. :) I don't mean that as a put down, but I've got
> to say that you seem so incredibly stuck on yourself that
> it's probaly the very reason why you can't get a second
> date. Self confidence is one thing, but a pompus attitude
> is a TOTAL turn off. Your sound file alone had me laughing
> my ass off. I was sitting in my house actually laughing out
> loud because I can't beleive how arrogant you sound. Try
> being a lot more modest and I'm sure that you will get a
> woman without a problem. I sincerely wish you Good Luck.
Sooo... there is a limit to ~YOUR~ open-mindedness I see.
Bob Ficoturo
pla wrote:
> hey, you've just pretty well demonstrated my point.
> they are there because the money's good...
> regardless of if they *like* the work, they do *want* to work there rather
> than mcdonalds.
Your point was that they liked what they were doing it or they wouldn't do it.
Now you say they do it because the money is good. Make up your mind.
> "free of complexities"? what are we talking about here? i'm not dumb enough
> to think that *none* of these women are there by "unusual" circumstances
> or obligations, but do you really think that all, or most, or even a
> significant percent, are there because their dealer vinnie sold them into
> slavery or some other "complexity"? perhaps that's going overboard, but
> i simply do not see what could keep them there if it's so loathesome.
Look. There are enough female teen runaways alone living on the street to support
all of the demand for hookers, strippers, and bar girls. Using them as an
example, their ability to get work is severely limited by the fact that they have
no address. Where do you think they're likely to end up? Regarding what keeps
them there. Didn't we have a similar conversation not too long ago? Wasn't it
you who was complaining bitterly about your job and your company? Didn't I ask
you what kept you there if you so disliked everything about it? perhaps you can
find some insight by looking inward.
Your problem is that I use a word like complexity, and you ascribe your own
filtered and autobiographical meaning to it. I never said that meant that they
were being sold into slavery. It's a strawman you're building.
Bob Ficoturo
pla wrote:
> 2 nights a week, that's about $50k a year. enough to pay for college,
> have a decent apartment, and not live like crap. and in many cases, to
> support a kid.
> drugs, pimps, shootings? c'mon, you've accused me of living in
> a fantasy world before, but real life ain't the movies. it's
> not idyllic, either, and i'm sure that does happen, on occasion,
> but i would say it's the exception, not the rule.
This is getting exhausting. Can't you see that I was merely asking the
"liklihood" of reality here. You are saying that it is likely that these are nice
girls going to college and earning a little pin money. I'm saying it is likely
that these nice girls of yours are telling you what you want to hear because it is
your fantasy. That it is more likely that they are subjected to drugs, and crime
than they are subjected to final exams.
Bob Ficoturo
Daniel Podgurski wrote:
> But still, to be young, single, and to be making $500 per diem ain't bad.
It appears that way on the surface doesn't it?
> *Most* college grads are lucky to be making *a third* of that when they
> enter the workforce.
Uh-huh... so much for these girls working their way through college then, eh?
> <snip a bunch of stuff about pimps and stereotypical bs like that>
>
> I think your dull spot happens to be with the fact that maybe you've seen
> too much of what Hollywood dishes out.
No. You perhaps didn't read my message concerning my misspent youth. My dull spot results
from that experience. Typical fare: A bar girl asked me who she had to do to dance in the
show. A stripper asked me if her bruises could be seen through her make up. One of the
strippers was gone for a week. I asked her what she was doing and where she was. She said
she was doing what she was told.
It's not a life for the faint of heart my friend. Perhaps it's stereotypical... on what
basis do you call it bullshit. What's your experience?
> Both you and I don't frequent that
> side of the tracks very often, so that's basically what we have to rely on
> for our opinion, isn't it?
Nope.
> 'Cept for me, I read an article in Rhode Island Monthly a couple of years
> ago about who makes what in this state, and I was _floored_ by what a
> stripper makes. I asked a friend of mine who used to be a stripper (she
> was managing a health food store at the time) if it was true about how much
> money there is, and she said "Yup".
Did you also ask her how much she got to keep? If she were keeping that much, what is she
doing managing a health food store?
[snip some physically demanding and emotionally draining stuff]
> Nobody tips a stripper with a piss-poor attitude.
Nobody tips a stripper who doesn't say what they want to hear.
> It's a job. That's all it is. Some people manage networks, some take off
> their clothes.
If you say so.
BetzBet
buisness of making fake ID's for some employees who are too young and for
illegal aliens in order for them to work in their "fine" establishments.
Wendy Zosh
believe your question warrants an answer. I'm assuming the latter. A slice of
pizza? Would you mind one day when your boss offers you a nice rump roast in
place of your salary? People work for MONEY fool.
Next, why don't you offer for girls to pick through your garbage and give you a
lap dance for any tasty morsels they find. Leftovers... that's what you're saying
you are willing to give in order to get. Again, I'm hoping you were making a joke
for if you weren't, I have now made the acquaintance of the cheapest, most
self-serving SOB alive.
Just a comment from a college "girl" who would rather dig ditches for 20 cents an
hour than degrade myself into being nothing other that eye-candy for a bunch of
slobbering fools. If I wanted to be thought of as an object exactly why would I
be in college in the first place?
WayDude99 wrote:
> Also do they allow pizza to be brought in? Most importantly if I give you a
> slice of pizza will you
> give me a lap dance?
Wendy
JC
ditches for 20 cents an hour than degrade myself into being
nothing other that eye-candy for a bunch of slobbering
fools. If I wanted to be thought of as an object exactly
why would I be in college in the first place?
Wendy
Because most college kids are broke and would actually
like to eat something besides macaroni and cheese for the
next four years until they receive their degree. You may be
a college girl who wouldn't work as a dancer. However I am
sure you realize that not ALL college aged girls feel the
same way.
Michael Zarlenga
: Why you HAVE to be kidding. Either you are making a joke or so demented as to
: believe your question warrants an answer. I'm assuming the latter. A slice of
: pizza? Would you mind one day when your boss offers you a nice rump roast in
: place of your salary?
That would depend on the rump.
--
-- Mike Zarlenga
finger zarl...@conan.ids.net for PGP public key
"Taxes are the price we pay for an uncivilized society where
politicians, law enforcement and the judiciary ignore the Bill
of Rights." A truer, 1999 version of the famous quotation
pla
i am not the one who said they liked it...
i only said they do it voluntarily, and that as jobs go, being a stripper
has no shortage of people in line for it.
as for "liking it"... well, how are we defining "like"? i realize that
usually degrades into a stupid argument about semantics, but if
they chose to do something voluntarily, doesn't that at least *imply*
they "like" doing it more than the alternative (ie, mcdonalds)?
> Look. There are enough female teen runaways alone living on the street to s
> all of the demand for hookers, strippers, and bar girls. Using them as an
> example, their ability to get work is severely limited by the fact that they
> no address. Where do you think they're likely to end up? Regarding what ke
this is getting into a whole differnt topic, but, that's a preference too.
*anything* a person does that isn't literally forced on them constitutes
a voluntary choice... it may be a choice between the lesser of two evils,
but it still expresses a preference.
further, i highly doubt a large portion of our local stip clubs are staffed
by underage runaways, although i will admit that if someone could provide
proof to the contrary i would be more than willing to listen... but it
would suprise me greatly.
> were being sold into slavery. It's a strawman you're building.
i'm not trying to make you look like the bad guy here... i simply have a
different opinion, which i thought we were discussing rationally. please
do not confuse me for others who've posted on this subject; i am very
careful to only attack ideas, not people (though i admit i am
not always entirely successful).
- pla
pla
i am not basing this on going to such places... would you believe i have
*never* even been to a strip club? i'm basing this on 2.5 friends (two
friends and an acquaintance) who are or were strippers. yeah, people
tend to glamorize their jobs a bit, but only if they like them... if
not, they complain endlessly about them. and the complaints i've heard
are *far* outweighed by the described merits.
and yes, once again i've committed the sin of havint a totally statistically
insignificant sampling... (then again, how many strippers do you suppose
there are in RI? if it's around 100, then 3% sample is pretty damn good...)
- pla
Daniel Podgurski
>
> Hi Dan
>
> Daniel Podgurski wrote:
>
> > But still, to be young, single, and to be making $500 per diem ain't bad.
>
> It appears that way on the surface doesn't it?
*I* wouldn't mind making that much.
>
> > *Most* college grads are lucky to be making *a third* of that when they
> > enter the workforce.
>
> Uh-huh... so much for these girls working their way through college then, eh?
There was a biography about a couple of years ago about a Brown student
working her way through school. It happens. Just like people work their
way through school working for Benny's.
Benny's pays a *lot* less, however.
Speaking of college and wages and stuffs. Why did I even bother suffering
through a 4 year apprenticeship and an associate's degree when a union
laborer makes as much (and sometimes more) as I do?
> No. You perhaps didn't read my message concerning my misspent youth. My dull spot results
> from that experience. Typical fare: A bar girl asked me who she had to do to dance in the
> show. A stripper asked me if her bruises could be seen through her make up. One of the
> strippers was gone for a week. I asked her what she was doing and where she was. She said
> she was doing what she was told.
>
> It's not a life for the faint of heart my friend. Perhaps it's stereotypical... on what
> basis do you call it bullshit. What's your experience?
Mine isn't as experienced as yours, whereabouts and when was this
experience of yours? Times might have changed. If you're as old as I
think you are, you've got about 10 years on me, I think.
> Nope.
At least you're not speaking from ignorance..
>
> > 'Cept for me, I read an article in Rhode Island Monthly a couple of years
> > ago about who makes what in this state, and I was _floored_ by what a
> > stripper makes. I asked a friend of mine who used to be a stripper (she
> > was managing a health food store at the time) if it was true about how much
> > money there is, and she said "Yup".
>
> Did you also ask her how much she got to keep? If she were keeping that much, what is she
> doing managing a health food store?
Because of the stuff you snipped.
:-P
Plus she wanted something more reliable.
> > Nobody tips a stripper with a piss-poor attitude.
>
> Nobody tips a stripper who doesn't say what they want to hear.
She told me all this stuff *after* she was long gone from the scene. She
wasn't telling me what I wanted to hear, just telling me what her
experience was.
> If you say so.
Well, some people can insist that it be only a job, but some consider it a
lifestyle. Therein lies the problem. Jobs are not lifestyles, and should
never be considered such.
--
Dan
WayDude99
Either you are making a joke or so demented as
>to
>believe your question warrants an answer.
I have a feeling that you are going to answer it anyway.
I'm assuming the latter.
You know what they say about assuming.
A slice
>of
>pizza? Would you mind one day when your boss offers you a nice rump roast in
>place of your salary?
Are you kidding! I would hold out for Prime Rib!
People work for MONEY fool.
Ah, I always wondered why people worked.
>
>Next, why don't you offer for girls to pick through your garbage and give you
>a
>lap dance for any tasty morsels they find. Leftovers...
Don't you know there are people starving in China that would love to have our
leftovers, especially if we had leftover Chinese food!
that's what you're
>saying
>you are willing to give in order to get. Again, I'm hoping you were making a
>joke
>for if you weren't, I have now made the acquaintance of the cheapest, most
>self-serving SOB alive.
Such hateful remarks while taking things out of context. Hmmm- sounds like you
would make a good lawyer.
>
>Just a comment from a college "girl" who would rather dig ditches for 20
>cents an
>hour than degrade myself into being nothing other that eye-candy for a bunch
>of
>slobbering fools. If I wanted to be thought of as an object exactly why
>would I
>be in college in the first place?
So your premise is since you go to college you are better than the females
working in these clubs?
Semper USMC
Somewhere lost in all of these posts was the original question: What's
Rhode Island's best Adult entertainment facility? There were two votes for
"foxy lady", one for "Fantasy's", and another for"cheaters".
And somehow we have referenced substituting a healthy roast for salary,
even a slice of pizza. The plight of poor college kids how have no means to
eat except for macaroni and cheese; who become "forced" to strip for food.
Oh yes, that one was my favorite. But it's all okay with me. You have
given me an idea. Next weekend I will personally stand outside foxy lady
with a basket of fruit, and I'll see if I can't persuade one of these poor
hungry teen runaways to give up there evil strip venture for my offerings of
fresh food. How long do you think I will last? Who would get me first, the
bouncers and the patrons?
I honestly believe these girls have excepted stripping, "CHOSE" to strip
for the easy money, and quite frankly enjoy all of the attention they get.
I'm not aware of any foreigners being held against there will, and all the
girls I've ever seen certainly look 18 to me. I've even been at Foxy's a
few times in my more youthful days and the Providence police would stake it
out for a while. I'm beginning to wonder if people responding to this
topic have EVER been to a strip club. How say you?
Rich
Also, since my first "story" went over so well, look for my next story: "How
I opened my mail"
--
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Island/5507/
WayDude99 <wayd...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19990519172237...@ng-ch1.aol.com...
Michelle A.
> >
> >Just a comment from a college "girl" who would rather dig ditches for 20
> >cents an
> >hour than degrade myself into being nothing other that eye-candy for a bunch
> >of
> >slobbering fools. If I wanted to be thought of as an object exactly why
> >would I
> >be in college in the first place?
>
> So your premise is since you go to college you are better than the females
> working in these clubs?
> >
> >
Wendy has what's called self-respect. IMHO Bob is the only one of you
men here who has a clue, the rest of you all think women enjoy being
treated like sex objects for money.
Could there be anything more demeaning? I personally feel that they're
one step away from prostitution. That's my *narrow minded* opinion.
As far as the comments about them being lesbians, I wouldn't be
surprised how could you stand to be with men after dealing with them in
that manner all day! ;-)
--
Michelle A.
mjama...@mindspring.com
Mom's Mad House: The Home Page
http://www.mindspring.com/~mjamarante
Visions
http://members.xoom.com/mjamarante
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"We are the spirit, the collective conscience, we create the pain
and the suffering and the beauty in this world..." Tracy Chapman
WayDude99
>Wendy Zosh (wd...@virginia.edu) wrote:
>: Why you HAVE to be kidding. Either you are making a joke or so demented as
>to
>: believe your question warrants an answer. I'm assuming the latter. A slice
>of
>: pizza? Would you mind one day when your boss offers you a nice rump roast
>in
>: place of your salary?
>
>
>
>
>--
>-- Mike Zarlenga
Good One, Mike! LOL
Bob Ficoturo
pla wrote:
> i am not the one who said they liked it...
> i only said they do it voluntarily, and that as jobs go, being a stripper
> has no shortage of people in line for it.
> as for "liking it"... well, how are we defining "like"? i realize that
> usually degrades into a stupid argument about semantics, but if
> they chose to do something voluntarily, doesn't that at least *imply*
> they "like" doing it more than the alternative (ie, mcdonalds)?
Ever do a job you didn't like pla???? Why did you do it? Didn't you have other
choices?
> > Look. There are enough female teen runaways alone living on the street to s
> this is getting into a whole differnt topic, but, that's a preference too.
> *anything* a person does that isn't literally forced on them constitutes
> a voluntary choice... it may be a choice between the lesser of two evils,
> but it still expresses a preference.
Sure... a preference for eating over not eating. A preference for having a roof
over your head over living in the street. Do you want to continue defining what
"like" means?
> further, i highly doubt a large portion of our local stip clubs are staffed
> by underage runaways,
Underage runaways grow up to be "of age" runaways. The world is filled with
people whose choices are severely limited.
> > were being sold into slavery. It's a strawman you're building.
>
> i'm not trying to make you look like the bad guy here...
I'm neither good nor bad... just a guy with an opinion. I am what I am... how I
"look" doesn't matter much to me.
> i simply have a
> different opinion, which i thought we were discussing rationally.
I think my position is rational... what do you think of yours <G>?
> please
> do not confuse me for others who've posted on this subject; i am very
> careful to only attack ideas, not people (though i admit i am
> not always entirely successful).
But you did ascribe to me things I did not say or even imply. Again... nowhere
did I say that women were being sold into slavery.
Bob Ficoturo
pla wrote:
> i am not basing this on going to such places... would you believe i have
> *never* even been to a strip club? i'm basing this on 2.5 friends (two
> friends and an acquaintance) who are or were strippers.
Okay... I've got to ask... these are college girls?
Bob Ficoturo
Daniel Podgurski wrote:
> There was a biography about a couple of years ago about a Brown student
> working her way through school. It happens. Just like people work their
> way through school working for Benny's.
Of course it happens... anything can happen... the question on the table is; how often? The
biography you reference is one of those man bites dog things... if it were not unusual, who would
publish it?
> Speaking of college and wages and stuffs. Why did I even bother suffering
> through a 4 year apprenticeship and an associate's degree when a union
> laborer makes as much (and sometimes more) as I do?
Because you had no interest in leaning on a shovel for the rest of your life. Because your
vision was that you could make a larger contribution. Because you were looking to do something
you had some passion for. Pick one.
> Mine isn't as experienced as yours, whereabouts and when was this
> experience of yours? Times might have changed. If you're as old as I
> think you are, you've got about 10 years on me, I think.
I'm 54 next month. In my late teens (during summer vacation) and early twenties (full time) I
worked as a musician in the Atlantic City/Philadelphia area. Certainly times have changed. But
here's what doesn't change. Women don't choose to sit at a bar and hustle drinks for a living
because they love the work. Women don't expose themselves to a room full of drunks trying to
grope them because they think of themselves as artists. And men with a testosterone rush will
always believe a woman who calls them Conan and says they only do this for the tuition money.
Hey guys... yeah... you out there... here's a pearl of wisdom for you. Every stripper worth her
salt you decide to buy a drink for will order a champagne cocktail. It will be ginger ale she's
drinking. She'll turn in either the napkin or the swizzle stick later for her commission.
> Because of the stuff you snipped.
>
> :-P
I didn't call your stuff bs <G>.
> Plus she wanted something more reliable.
Oh? What was not reliable about her job as a stripper?
> > Nobody tips a stripper who doesn't say what they want to hear.
>
> She told me all this stuff *after* she was long gone from the scene. She
> wasn't telling me what I wanted to hear, just telling me what her
> experience was.
Hmmm... Have you ever asked her if there are parts of it she leaves out?
Michael Zarlenga
: Wendy has what's called self-respect. IMHO Bob is the only one of you
: men here who has a clue, the rest of you all think women enjoy being
: treated like sex objects for money.
: Could there be anything more demeaning? I personally feel that they're
Sure. Being treated as a sex object for no money.
--
BetzBet
>: Could there be anything more demeaning? I personally feel that they're
>
>Sure. Being treated as a sex object for no money.
>
My God he has a point.... :)
Venom Soup
I've been quietly sitting in my corner, reading all of these posts and not
wanting to get in the middle of this private battle of morals...until now.
You asked how a woman felt about this...well, I think that stripping is no
better than prostitution. (OK all you other guys...you can start lighting
your matches now...I'm ready to be flamed.)
I think that any girl who is willing to take her clothes off for a buck, no
matter how hard she is trying to 'put herself through college' or 'raise a
family' or yada yada yada...has the morals of a cockroach. There have been
many, many women who have put themselves through college or have
successfully raised a family without having to degrade themselves in this
manner. (Including myself and I had the body to do it once upon a time.)
Maybe they did not drive fancy cars or wear expensive clothes and maybe they
couldn't go on fabulous vacations, but when they look back on their lives,
they can say to themselves 'I kept my self respect and I got through it'.
Everyone always uses McDonalds as the only choice available other than
stripping. Yes, you will not make as much money working 9 to 5 as you would
taking off your clothes for a bunch of drooling slobs, but I can assure all
of you, that McDonalds is not the only choice out there. Any intelligent
girl can find a 'decent' job if a little effort is put into looking.
If some had a little more education, a little less materialism, and a lot
more self esteem, (not to mention a good lesson in morals), I would bet that
a lot of strippers would leave that lifestyle. I also think that a lot of
these girls are just too young to see what they are doing to their lives.
All they can see is the money and the attention that the guys are giving
them.
And no, I am not a prude. I have done my share of wild and crazy things in
my day. Then I grew up and said 'wow, I can't believe I did that...what was
I thinking? How could I ever explain that to my kids?' These are the things
that these girls will be thinking to themselves in the future only they will
be thinking them in ALL CAPS!!!
Well, Bob. That's one woman's opinion....you asked for it!
:o)
Xtread
Bob Ficoturo <Robert.J.F...@Wawa.com> wrote in message
news:3742673B...@Wawa.com...
Wendy Zosh
Unfortunately it's hard sometimes to find humor in a topic that effects
the image of women in fundamental ways, but your humor is not lost on
me. As for your comment about my feeling better that the women who
employ themselves in this occupation I believe you are way off the
mark. I was only pointing out that I feel that college is a place to
expand your mind and be respected for your ideas not your bra size. As
for college students using this as a means to an end than by all
means... I wish I didn't have the student loans I now have. I am not a
rabid feminist, but I do feel that by objectifying women in any
situation, it makes it hard for the rest of us to be respected for our
intellect.
Sorry for being punchy, and thanks for keeping the ng on a lighter note.
Wendy
Wendy Zosh
pla
yes, i have.
why did i do it? because i preferred having money over not having
money.
so have i committed an utterly shameful, depraved act by working?
no, it's just a choice, like any other.
> Sure... a preference for eating over not eating. A preference for having a
> over your head over living in the street. Do you want to continue defining
> "like" means?
it confuses me how you always make points that seems to support what
i say, yet youre clearly disagreeing...
yes, eating is not optional, so if they choose to run away, then
they have to find a way to eat.
but they still chose to run away from home. that expressed a
preference.
> I think my position is rational... what do you think of yours <G>?
depends on how much sleep i've had. <blink blink nod snore>
> But you did ascribe to me things I did not say or even imply. Again... nowh
> did I say that women were being sold into slavery.
sorry, i was "guessing"... i had no idea what you meant by
something, so i guessed and went with it. my apologies for
guessing totally wrong.
- pla
pla
one has graduated and now lives in... um... north-something (dakota?).
the other two, yes. both RIC students, actually.
- pla
Mary (RI)
|Oh thank you... THANK YOU JC. You have opened up my mind and now
|I see that wonderful new 1999 world! Why didn't I see it before.
|perhaps some of the women in this NG would like to comment on our
|new world JC.
I'll take you up on the invitation to comment, but not to not speak about
this "new world."
I think that you, Bob, seem to be the only one looking at the whole
issue with crystal clarity and has both feet planted firmly in reality. I
often agree with you and appreciate your take on things. Even if I don't
agree, you usually present a well-thought-out opinion that shows an
understanding of people and the way the real world works. (I almost can't
believe you have to explain some of these things to people.) But there is
that chance that there are people out there who want some female input
on this, and for any of them genuinely interested I'll add my 2 cents...
hmm... maybe I'll add that often people's opinions about stripping (or lap
dancing, or even porn or prostitution) as a respectable or harmless
employment choice for "nice" girls (or anyone with a smidge of self-esteem)
changes dramatically when they seriously consider the possibility of their
mothers, sisters, wives, girlfriends, or daughters doing these things for
money.
Someone in the thread suggested he was the wrong sex or had the wrong body
for this job. I wonder how many men who view female stripping cavalierly
would consider stripping for money themselves. Even if they would consider
stripping for women, what if the customers were men? I'm going to go out on
a limb here and suggest that typical heterosexual male's reaction to or
feelings about being groped and gawked at by *other* men is pretty much the
same feeling most women have about being groped or gawked at by strange men.
I don't care how much money he gets stuffed in his g-string, the act can
erode his self-respect and self-worth. And if he feels this is the only way
you can keep a roof over his head, feed his kids, or pay for college, I feel
sorry for him and the sad situation he's in. (I have no idea how every
hetero
male would feel, of course; I'm assuming from what I know of the many males
I've known in my life that most men's skin crawls at the idea of being
lewdly
ogled by other guys.)
Are there women who enjoy stripping for strangers? Yup, I'm sure. FWIW,
I've never known a single self-respecting woman who'd do it, not even the
most sexually liberated or promiscuous or drop-dead gorgeous. I would
respect any woman's choice to do so; however, I would suspect she has really
low self-esteem and is quite desperate for money.
JMO
Mary
PS I saved this in my drafts folder to amend while somewhat awake. I had to
put carriage returns into the text because the formatting of the edited
sections looked so gaffed. This section I'm typing straight to the right
margin just to see how OE handles the line length.
JC
Topic: Re: What's the Best Strip Joint in Rhode Island?
Message: 42 of 52 (In response to WayDude99)
Sent: Wed, 19 May 1999 19:42:16 -0400
Wendy has what's called self-respect. IMHO Bob is the only
one of you men here who has a clue, the rest of you all
think women enjoy being treated like sex objects for money.
Could there be anything more demeaning? I personally feel
that they're one step away from prostitution. That's my
*narrow minded* opinion.
-- Michelle A.
mjama...@mindspring.com
Geeez, I am sure glad that you said you are narrow
minded, because I was about to say it for you. :) I notice
that a lot of women come here mouthing off about how us men
think that women enjoy being treated like sex objects for
money. I've got news for you honey. A lot of women DO enjoy
the attention that they get from men! It's also NOT UP TO
YOU to determine that strippers don't have self-respect for
themselves? It's not up to YOU to judge what self-respect
for another person even is. Self-respect is different for
each person and it's up to the invidual to determine what
self-respect means in their life. Self respect comes down
to feeling good about yourself, treating yourself well and
being happy with yourself in your day to day life. I know
that there are many dancers out there who have all those
traits. Just because you can not comprehend it, does not
mean that these girls lack self-respect whatsoever. The
only lack of self-respect going on is in your interpatation
of how you think these girls must or(should) feel.
From my experience most of the women who are against
stripping are the same ones who could never do it
themeselves. Either they are old, unnatractive, overweight
etc...... I'll almost guarantee you that if all the women
who are against stripping posted their self pics up here,
then it would become obvious WHY they don't like strippers.
It would all pretty much come down to jealously! I very
very rarely have ever seen a Hot looking girl ever say that
stripping is demeaning. Why is that? Probaly because she
could do it and she doesn't feel threatened like the
unattractive ladies do. The attractive woman generally has
a confidence and open mindeness that unattractive ladies
lack. Some people may say that's a stretch, but it has been
my observation. I've seen so many instances where a very
attractive lady will be in a room and the first thing that
happens is the unattractive ones start picking her apart.
This will be my last post on this thread because I've
more than made my point clear. This industry is not going
anywhere and it will continue to get biggER and biGGER and
BIGGER. It's supply and demand. As long as guys want it to
be around then IT WILL ALWAYS BE AROUND! :)
Eric Jaron Stieglitz
>
>this is getting into a whole differnt topic, but, that's a preference too.
>*anything* a person does that isn't literally forced on them constitutes
>a voluntary choice... it may be a choice between the lesser of two evils,
>but it still expresses a preference.
A while back, there was a TV movie based on a true story called
"Escape From Sobibor." At one point, the commandant of the concentration
camp caught 15 people trying to escape. With the rest of the camp watching,
he placed them against a wall and instructed them to chose 15 others to die
with them. If they refused, the commandant himself would choose 50 additional
people to die.
Does this fit your definition of "voluntary choice"?
(As an historical FYI, somebody who had actually been there later told me
that the movie was mostly correct but still a dramatization. The commandant
had threatened to do this if he caught people trying to escape again, but
had never actually done so.)
--
Eric Jaron Stieglitz eph...@ctr.columbia.edu
Systems Manager Civil Engineering, Columbia University
http://www.ctr.columbia.edu/people/Eric.html
Eric Jaron Stieglitz
Wendy Zosh <wd...@virginia.edu> wrote:
>I was only pointing out that I feel that college is a place to
>expand your mind and be respected for your ideas not your bra size.
Sort of like right here on Usenet. The only way you can judge somebody
is by the intelligence (or other qualities or lack thereof) of what you write.
>for college students using this as a means to an end than by all
>means... I wish I didn't have the student loans I now have.
My interest deferments just disappeared yesterday when I got handed my
diploma. Thankfully, I was in a position where I had a full time job at the
same time I was in school, so I've been able to save up for this moment.
As I write this, I've got one hand on my checkbook...
-Eric
pla
> minded, because I was about to say it for you. :) I notice
> that a lot of women come here mouthing off about how us men
> think that women enjoy being treated like sex objects for
> money. I've got news for you honey. A lot of women DO enjoy
although i agreed with your orignial point, you're starting to sound
like the stereotype you claim we've been branded with.
i think the problem we're all having on this issue is one of
generalizations.
we all have agreed that *some* women enjoy stripping, even if it's
a very small minority.
it logically follow that if one enjoys stripping, then stripping for money
is even better.
now, is it reasonable that out of around 500,000 females in RI,
the very tiny handful (i estimated around 100 before, which i
would say is within an order of magnitude of being correct) of females
who are strippers are largely composed of that small portion of women
who enjoy stripping?
that was not my point when i got into this, i only was saying that
it a good job, and that for those who do it, the perks outweigh
the downfalls. but perhaps with this, i can end all this silly
bickering.
as for getting female opinions *and then saying they're wrong*, c'mon!
that's just a waste of time. for one thing, evey woman's opinion
is her own, you can't argue with it.
and secondly, males and females think too differently. if i thought i
had a body where i could make money as a stripper, you can be sure i'd
be shakin' my booty tonight. and i wouldn't think of it as degrading,
i would consider it complimentary.
- pla
pla
well, that's a tricky one, i will admit.
i mean, on on a strictly technical level, it's still a choice and
hence a preference... 15 people is better than 50 people.
but, since the original 15 are going to die anyway, i think they are
sort of exempted from the system. like schroedinger's cat... why
doesn't it count as an observer? well, it just doesn't.
but yes, i do see your point... what is the "preferred" course of
action is not always black or white... it might be choosing between
two equally loathesome options.
but, what i was trying to get at was that, shifting the frame of reference
doesn't make it less of a preference. i would have gotten your point
if it had been choosing between a perfect home and wife, or a million
dollars... but as long as the choices are sufficiently different in
good-and-badness, the absolute frame doesn't matter.
like negative vs. positive reinforcement... they're the same thing,
in essence... one is adding a pleasureable reward, one is removing
something unpleasant as a reward.
- pla
Michelle A.
JC wrote:
>
> From: Michelle A.
> Topic: Re: What's the Best Strip Joint in Rhode Island?
> Message: 42 of 52 (In response to WayDude99)
> Sent: Wed, 19 May 1999 19:42:16 -0400
>
> Wendy has what's called self-respect. IMHO Bob is the only
> one of you men here who has a clue, the rest of you all
> think women enjoy being treated like sex objects for money.
> Could there be anything more demeaning? I personally feel
> that they're one step away from prostitution. That's my
> *narrow minded* opinion.
>
> -- Michelle A.
> mjama...@mindspring.com
>
I notice
> that a lot of women come here mouthing off about how us men
> think that women enjoy being treated like sex objects for
> money. I've got news for you honey. A lot of women DO enjoy
> the attention that they get from men!
Most women enjoy getting attention from men, but not in the way that
*some* men seem to give it. Being oggled and felt up with the eyes is
not pleasant by any means. But I wouldn't expect you to understand,
you're probably one of *them*.
> From my experience most of the women who are against
> stripping are the same ones who could never do it
> themeselves. Either they are old, unnatractive, overweight
> etc...... I'll almost guarantee you that if all the women
> who are against stripping posted their self pics up here,
> then it would become obvious WHY they don't like strippers.
> It would all pretty much come down to jealously!
Since I consider myself to be a reasonably attractive woman, I would
hardly consider myself jealous of strippers. And no I won't post a pic
or give you my measurements. Let say I'm not an old fart, I'm not fat
by any means and I have lots of self-confidence. But to strip naked in
front of a bunch of drooling fools is not my idea of a good job, no
matter how much money they make.
I very
> very rarely have ever seen a Hot looking girl ever say that
> stripping is demeaning. Why is that? Probaly because she
> could do it and she doesn't feel threatened like the
> unattractive ladies do. The attractive woman generally has
> a confidence and open mindeness that unattractive ladies
> lack. Some people may say that's a stretch, but it has been
> my observation.
I've seen so many instances where a very
> attractive lady will be in a room and the first thing that
> happens is the unattractive ones start picking her apart.
Yes true! That is women being catty. We have a tendency to do those
sort of things, don't ask why, I'm not sure, but it is annoying.
>
> This will be my last post on this thread because I've
> more than made my point clear. This industry is not going
> anywhere and it will continue to get biggER and biGGER and
> BIGGER. It's supply and demand. As long as guys want it to
> be around then IT WILL ALWAYS BE AROUND! :)
Unfortunately you're probably right about it always being around.
>
> JC
>
> **** Posted from RemarQ - http://www.remarq.com - Discussions Start Here (tm) ****
--
WayDude99
>Apology gratefully accepted and appreciated!
>Unfortunately it's hard sometimes to find humor in a topic that effects
>the image of women in fundamental ways, but your humor is not lost on
>me.
A kindred spirit.
As for your comment about my feeling better that the women who
>employ themselves in this occupation I believe you are way off the
>mark. I was only pointing out that I feel that college is a place to
>expand your mind and be respected for your ideas not your bra size.
I stand corrected.
As
>for college students using this as a means to an end than by all
>means... I wish I didn't have the student loans I now have. I am not a
>rabid feminist, but I do feel that by objectifying women in any
>situation, it makes it hard for the rest of us to be respected for our
>intellect.
Actually I have never commented on any of the messages except for yours. You
wrote with such rage that I figured I better correct your perception of me and
the meaning of my post before you hunted me down and hit me over the head with
a large tuna fish or something.
I only asked what everyone thought was the best strip joint in Rhode Island. I
got two responses. Some one took exception to one of the responses, a flame
war insued, then a discussion of the social/economics of exotic dancing, then
the morals of exotic dancers, the morals of men that go to see exotic dancers,
and now what the opposite sex thinks of the opposite sex! Geez- Ask a simple
question!
>Sorry for being punchy, and thanks for keeping the ng on a lighter note.
Thanks for the kind remarks. Your okay Wendy!!
WayDude
>
>Wendy
>
>
>
>
>
Joel_Plutchak
>as for getting female opinions *and then saying they're wrong*, c'mon!
>that's just a waste of time. for one thing, evey woman's opinion
>is her own, you can't argue with it.
Men think the world is flat.
--
Joel Plutchak
"Get a life... I think people should have well-rounded lives."
- George Lucas, on "Star Wars" mania
Michael Zarlenga
: >as for getting female opinions *and then saying they're wrong*, c'mon!
: >that's just a waste of time. for one thing, evey woman's opinion
: >is her own, you can't argue with it.
: Men think the world is flat.
Not this man; the world is an oblate spheroid.
Daniel Podgurski
>
> Hi Daniel
>
> Of course it happens... anything can happen... the question on the table is; how often? The
> biography you reference is one of those man bites dog things... if it were not unusual, who would
> publish it?
I would _imagine_ that most people wouldn't publish because of a few
issues, one of which being a social stigma still attached to this
activity. Would _you_ publish, Bob, considering the job you have?
_You_ tried to give the impression that the women who strip aren't the type
to be working their way through college. I just dragged up something that
violated your stereotype as best I could. Whatever. You seem convinced
that _all_ women who strip are either being pimped out by abusive
boyfriends, or are freelance hookers.
I say you are making a worst case scenario and setting it up as typical.
This is, at best, logical fallacy, or at worst, blinkered.
>
> > Speaking of college and wages and stuffs. Why did I even bother suffering
> > through a 4 year apprenticeship and an associate's degree when a union
> > laborer makes as much (and sometimes more) as I do?
>
> Because you had no interest in leaning on a shovel for the rest of your life. Because your
> vision was that you could make a larger contribution. Because you were looking to do something
> you had some passion for. Pick one.
Something like that. A big part of it was the Banking Crisis. I've always
liked working outside, and actually *did* work outside land surveying for 3
years. Then the Banking Crisis hit, and I was out of work for a _year_. I
decided to go back to school and learn something else. Now I deal with the
same math, but on a *much* smaller scale. Some days I _yearn_ to be
outside among the trees, and away from the pointy-haired bosses, but to go
back, I'd probably have to take a $4/hr pay cut. (had the banking crisis
not happened, I'd probably be a crew chief now, and probably working on my
PLS or PE)
Shameless Plug: Robert Curran and Associates, and Ocean State Planners.
Both Bob Curran (in East Greenwich) and Richard Bzdyra (OSP, in Cranston)
are _exceptionally_ knowledgeable in their work.
Lunar Mapping and Scituate Surveyors, though I've never worked with them,
are also good.
DuPont Engineering, on the other hand...well, let's just say I fixed some
of their work.
>
> > Mine isn't as experienced as yours, whereabouts and when was this
> > experience of yours? Times might have changed. If you're as old as I
> > think you are, you've got about 10 years on me, I think.
>
> I'm 54 next month. In my late teens (during summer vacation) and early twenties (full time) I
> worked as a musician in the Atlantic City/Philadelphia area.
This explains your misspent youth. Philly is probably even more of a dump
now than it was back _then_. Atlantic City was never any great shakes
either. You may as well have stayed in New England and worked in
Bridgeport Connecticut (CT's connection to the midwest Rust Belt). :-P
Certainly times have changed. But
> here's what doesn't change. Women don't choose to sit at a bar and hustle drinks for a living
> because they love the work.
And I don't cut metal for a living because I _love_ the work. I excel at
technical stuff, so I can make a living. Your point?
Women don't expose themselves to a room full of drunks trying to
> grope them because they think of themselves as artists. And men with a testosterone rush will
> always believe a woman who calls them Conan and says they only do this for the tuition money.
Maybe it's me, but what's so wrong about chattin' it up with the
customers? What about women bartenders? Isn't part of a bartender's _job_
to chat it up with the customers?
What about _male_ strippers?
Were I an Adonis, maybe I'd do it myself, but I'm not, and therefore I
can't. I'd certainly try to give it a go, if I could, though. Maybe this
is something that Semper should think about, no? He'd have to shave his
back, though.
Here's another point of view for you.
Conversation on the phone with 'Becca, my squeeze, in Toronto...
She's with her friend Carol in Whitby, a little one-and-a-half horse city
somewhere between Toronto and nowhere:
'Becca: "We're going to the strippers!"
Me: "The who?"
Becca: "The strippers! We're going to see male strippers tonight!"
Me: "oh, ok, cool, don't spend too much"
*****one half hour passes by******
*ring* "HEllo?"
'Becca: "This town _SUCKS!_ If I were in Toronto, I'd know where to go!
They're
all _GIRLS_ here!"
Me: stifling laughter..
>
> Hey guys... yeah... you out there... here's a pearl of wisdom for you. Every stripper worth her
> salt you decide to buy a drink for will order a champagne cocktail. It will be ginger ale she's
> drinking. She'll turn in either the napkin or the swizzle stick later for her commission.
Old trick my _mom_ taught me to be able to blend in with a crowd if they're
drinking and I didn't want to. Now that I _can't_ drink _at all_ (fucks up
my sugar level) and I'm not so worried about "blending in" I just order a
diet coke.
Your point is?
>
> > Because of the stuff you snipped.
> >
> > :-P
>
> I didn't call your stuff bs <G>.
Oh, ok, FINE then!
>
> > Plus she wanted something more reliable.
>
> Oh? What was not reliable about her job as a stripper?
I don't know, she didn't say.
:-P
>
> Hmmm... Have you ever asked her if there are parts of it she leaves out?
No, because I don't want to be an asshole. :-P
Why would I _pry_?
No, don't ask me to ask her about it again. She didn't want to talk about
it much in the first place, I think. Most gripes, however were about the
customers and their behaviour. THIS I understand. It's also one of the
reasons why I won't go back into Retail. Customers at Benny's, for the
most part, are ok, but some of the regulars, well, let's say that we had
our own special clientele. I would assume it's the same in any other job
where you deal with the general public. Some people are just _wastes of
oxygen_.
Considering some of the sorts of clueless idiots I know that frequent such
establishments, I think it would be one of the prime factors in the
"emotionally demanding" stuff mentioned earlier.
Bob Ficoturo
Daniel Podgurski wrote:
> > Of course it happens... anything can happen... the question on the table is; how often? The
> > biography you reference is one of those man bites dog things... if it were not unusual, who would
> > publish it?
>
> I would _imagine_ that most people wouldn't publish because of a few
> issues, one of which being a social stigma still attached to this
> activity. Would _you_ publish, Bob, considering the job you have?
I'm not sure what you're asking. My point is that it was published because it was unusual. If it
weren't rare, then why would anybody want to read it?
> _You_ tried to give the impression that the women who strip aren't the type
> to be working their way through college. I just dragged up something that
> violated your stereotype as best I could. Whatever. You seem convinced
> that _all_ women who strip are either being pimped out by abusive
> boyfriends, or are freelance hookers.
First, I never said all women. Second, my comments are based on my experience... not some stereotype.
Next, I've made no secret of where I got my experience and how long ago it was. That you can dig up an
exception is not surprising. Finally, I never indicated that strippers are freelance hookers... ~if~
they ~are~ hookers, and some are, they certainly don't freelance.
Here's what I did say. I said that they are certainly far more likely to be exposed to violence, the
drug culture, and abuse, than they are likely to be studying for finals.
> I say you are making a worst case scenario and setting it up as typical.
> This is, at best, logical fallacy, or at worst, blinkered.
Dan... I simply am responding to the fools who believe that women enjoy the groping they get, and oh by
the way... they're nice college girls to boot. So now who was setting up some remote scenario?
> This explains your misspent youth. Philly is probably even more of a dump
> now than it was back _then_. Atlantic City was never any great shakes
> either. You may as well have stayed in New England and worked in
> Bridgeport Connecticut (CT's connection to the midwest Rust Belt). :-P
You must have had an awful experience in Philadelphia. Why else would you say such things?
Philadelphia and it's surrounding communities have much to offer, and I find the quality of life here
to be excellent. I believe it's the 5th largest city in the country, and if you consider the tri state
area which stretches from Wilmington, DE up to Trenton, NJ it is more or equally populated than any
other large area including the tri state area of NJ, NY, CT. Phil. has sports teams in every major
sport, The Philadelphia Orchestra is arguably the world's best. The city supports 2 opera companies;
the Grand and Lyric Opera. Most other cities (including NY) have trouble keeping one Opera Co.
funded. Philadelphia is a hot bed of emerging art. It was probably politically screwed out of hosting
the Rock 'n Roll Hall of Fame. Lord knows how Cleveland was chosen in the face of all of the
contributions Philadelphia has made. Historically, Phil. ranks at least with Boston in its richness.
I could go on but I won't. These aspects of the city obviously escaped you when you were here.
Atlantic City was, and is, a function of the underworld. Because of that there is a certain sleaze
factor. None of of your comments negate my personal experience. My checkered past is what it is. <G>
> > Certainly times have changed. But
> > here's what doesn't change. Women don't choose to sit at a bar and hustle drinks for a living
> > because they love the work.
>
> And I don't cut metal for a living because I _love_ the work. I excel at
> technical stuff, so I can make a living. Your point?
What part of "they don't love the work" don't you understand? All along I've been responding to the
issues of these women enjoying what they do and how well educated they are.
> > Women don't expose themselves to a room full of drunks trying to
> > grope them because they think of themselves as artists. And men with a testosterone rush will
> > always believe a woman who calls them Conan and says they only do this for the tuition money.
>
> Maybe it's me, but what's so wrong about chattin' it up with the
> customers? What about women bartenders? Isn't part of a bartender's _job_
> to chat it up with the customers?
Where above do I say there is something wrong with it? What I'm saying is that there is something
wrong with men actually believing what these women tell them.
> What about _male_ strippers?
What about them?
> Were I an Adonis, maybe I'd do it myself, but I'm not, and therefore I
> can't. I'd certainly try to give it a go, if I could, though. Maybe this
> is something that Semper should think about, no? He'd have to shave his
> back, though.
So what's wrong with male strippers?
> 'Becca: "This town _SUCKS!_ If I were in Toronto, I'd know where to go!
> They're
> all _GIRLS_ here!"
>
> Me: stifling laughter..
And ~your~ point?
> > Hey guys... yeah... you out there... here's a pearl of wisdom for you. Every stripper worth her
> > salt you decide to buy a drink for will order a champagne cocktail. It will be ginger ale she's
> > drinking. She'll turn in either the napkin or the swizzle stick later for her commission.
>
> Old trick my _mom_ taught me to be able to blend in with a crowd if they're
> drinking and I didn't want to. Now that I _can't_ drink _at all_ (fucks up
> my sugar level) and I'm not so worried about "blending in" I just order a
> diet coke.
>
> Your point is?
Same old... same old. All that glitters is not gold. What they tell you is said in the hopes that
you'll buy another drink.
> > > Plus she wanted something more reliable.
> >
> > Oh? What was not reliable about her job as a stripper?
>
> I don't know, she didn't say.
Left that part out, eh?
> > Hmmm... Have you ever asked her if there are parts of it she leaves out?
>
> No, because I don't want to be an asshole. :-P
Stop serving up the easy ones... they're getting harder and harder to lay off of <G>.
> Why would I _pry_?
>
> No, don't ask me to ask her about it again. She didn't want to talk about
> it much in the first place, I think.
Perhaps it was painful?
Michael Smith
> working in these clubs?
OUCH!!!!!!!!!!! Wow, finally, a good rip, right in the belly. Sorry
Wendy, but you just blew all of your credibility.
Mike
Michael Smith
until I realized (brought about by this post) that NONE of you have any idea
how ridiculous this whole thing sounds. I'd like to point out a couple of
key items from the following post that I thought were interesting. The
first one starts "I think that...." and ends with "morals of a cockroach".
Morality (in general) is not black and white, it is a personal issue.
Another good one is "without having to degrade themselves" or "Any
intelligent girl can find a 'decent' job". Here is a clue for you. If she
doesn't think it is degrading, then she isn't being degraded. Wow, simple,
huh? As for the decent job comment, there are people who think stripping IS
a decent job, not to mention the fact that you blew the whole comment by
mentioning intelligence. Not all people *ARE* intelligent. Sorry, but
that's the way it is. Just because YOU don't think it is moral or decent,
so what? Who the hell are you? Everyone has the right to make mistakes
when they are young, it is part of the growing process. My favorite,
though, is definitely "If some had a little more education, a little less
materialism, and a lot more self esteem, (not to mention a good lesson in
posted, and if any of you remember my BBS, that is saying A LOT!!!
Mike
Michael Smith
> men here who has a clue, the rest of you all think women enjoy being
> treated like sex objects for money.
>
> one step away from prostitution. That's my *narrow minded* opinion.
Michelle, are you really so clueless that you can't understand that *some*
women *do* like being ogled for money? You're right when you say that it is
your *narrow minded* opinion.
It is a simple concept. If you aren't demeaned, it isn't demeaning. It can
be carried over into all sorts of things:
If you aren't embarrassed, it isn't embarrassing.
If you aren't insulted, it isn't insulting.
If you aren't humiliated, it isn't humiliating.
See? Does everone understand that the most important word in these
sentences is YOU?
Mike
Michael Smith
Unfortunately, everyone has to live with issues like this. Do you think it
is easy for some men to be lumped in with the rest? I'd like to think (even
if I am kidding myself) that I do not do most of my thinking with the wrong
head, yet in most of the posts by females in this thread, men are dealt with
as walking libidos.
Stereotypes are both good and bad, for a variety of reasons. They aren't
going away, no matter how PC the world becomes, because it is human nature
to classify. We're just going to have to get used to it.
Mike
Wendy Zosh <wd...@virginia.edu> wrote in message
news:37438919...@virginia.edu...
Michelle A.
Michael Smith wrote:
>
> > Wendy has what's called self-respect. IMHO Bob is the only one of you
> > men here who has a clue, the rest of you all think women enjoy being
> > treated like sex objects for money.
> >
> > Could there be anything more demeaning? I personally feel that they're
> > one step away from prostitution. That's my *narrow minded* opinion.
>
> Michelle, are you really so clueless that you can't understand that *some*
> women *do* like being ogled for money? You're right when you say that it is
> your *narrow minded* opinion.
It's *narrow minded* because it's not PC. It's *narrow minded* because
it's not PC to judge other people in this *new world* where everybody
does their own thing. Well sorry, I have this problem. I like to say
what I think even if it goes against the mainstream thought.
Someone asked for a woman's opinion, that's mine. And no Mike I guess I
really can't understand what they get out of it (except lots of money).
~:-O
>
> It is a simple concept. If you aren't demeaned, it isn't demeaning. It can
> be carried over into all sorts of things:
> If you aren't embarrassed, it isn't embarrassing.
> If you aren't insulted, it isn't insulting.
> If you aren't humiliated, it isn't humiliating.
>
> See? Does everone understand that the most important word in these
> sentences is YOU?
>
> Mike
Point taken. :-) But it hasn't changed my mind. Sorry!
pla
nah... it's a 4-torus with an average radius of 149 million kilometers,
centered at the sun, and a thickness of around 16000km.
- pla
Daniel Podgurski
>
> Hi Daniel
>
<snip a bunch of stuff>
Oh, alright, I give. cripes.
I'm done thinking about this topic. My brain hurts.
No, I don't have all the knowledge _you_ have with strip clubs, the seedy
side of society, and yes, you're right (sigh) that a stripper is exposed to
that kind of environment (drugs available, etc).
My point about the male strippers, though, is that the tables have turned
*ever so slightly* toward a non-seedy environment. Most modern clubs
advertise a "clean, no hustle environment". This would generally be a Good
Thing (TM) and in parts of the continent north of here, it certainly is
less seedy (by alot) (the point about 'Becca going to see the strippers was
supposed to be an example...dammit, she barely even *drinks*, let alone get
involved in something illegal. If it's got her stamp of approval, it's ok
by me).
Could someone strip and be completely professional about it? Of course.
That's one of the things I was trying to get across, but I kept getting
arguments from you about the seedy side. Maybe we can do something about
that through regulation. They close bars for drug dealing, why not strip
clubs? Maybe actual enforcement of current laws would do this.
Grandstanding by the Bud-Eye certainly isn't helping, and neither is
finger-pointing by the females of this group equating stripping with
prostitution and "subjugation of women".
True subjugation is not done at strip clubs. It's done at home.
Bob Ficoturo
Michael Smith wrote:
> that's the way it is. Just because YOU don't think it is moral or decent,
> so what? Who the hell are you? Everyone has the right to make mistakes
> when they are young, it is part of the growing process.
So in the same breath that you are chiding someone else for calling exotic
dancing immoral and indecent, you are saying that doing it is a mistake people
should be allowed to make. Soooo.... are you agreeing or disagreeing. Is it an
indecent mistake? Christ... you sound more pompous than I sound.
Bob Ficoturo
Michael Smith wrote:
> Michelle, are you really so clueless that you can't understand that *some*
> women *do* like being ogled for money? You're right when you say that it is
> your *narrow minded* opinion.
You know Michael, you sound like someone who actually ~knows~ women who enjoy
this. Care to name a few personal acquaintances who would be glad to see their
names in lights here given their propensity for exhibitionism? Or are you just
stating opinion and making it sound like you're quoting an authoritative source.
Bob Ficoturo
Daniel Podgurski wrote:
> > Perhaps it was painful?
>
> <snip a bunch of stuff>
>
> Oh, alright, I give. cripes.
>
> I'm done thinking about this topic. My brain hurts.
You have to admit... I have that wearing down effect <G>.
> My point about the male strippers, though, is that the tables have turned
> *ever so slightly* toward a non-seedy environment.
I think that male stripping and female stripping are mutually exclusive
issues. One is just not like the other.
> Most modern clubs
> advertise a "clean, no hustle environment". This would generally be a Good
> Thing (TM) and in parts of the continent north of here, it certainly is
> less seedy (by alot)
I have zero concern for what happens out front. Most women can handle the
drunken droolers all by themselves. The real sleaze results from what women
are expected to do; if they want the job, if they want to keep the job, if they
don't want to be assaulted, etc. But even at this... more laws won't help.
Laws are already broken and not enforced. And again... nowhere have I said we
ought to keep people from either stripping or watching. All I'm saying is that
it's a crummy business, and all the gullible oafs in the world will not change
that by believing they're groping college girls who enjoy being pinched,
patted, slapped and tickled for a buck.
> (the point about 'Becca going to see the strippers was
> supposed to be an example...dammit, she barely even *drinks*, let alone get
> involved in something illegal. If it's got her stamp of approval, it's ok
> by me).
Hey, when I was 19 and working in the Jockey Club in A/C my grandmother, who
was incredibly proud of her grandson, came to the show with my parents. There
was an MC, 2 singers, a comedian, and two strippers. I don't think any less of
my grandmother for attending, and I certainly don't think there is anything
illegal about it <G>.
> True subjugation is not done at strip clubs. It's done at home.
I don't know... I'd say it happens when and where it happens.
wc...@banet.net
naked babes
has been replaced by a more upscale substitute, which I believe is
called The Gold Club,
or something. I've only been there once, and it did hold promise, but
it can never approach the tacky appeal of the old Fuzzy.
Aribo wrote:
> anyone ever been to the fuzzy grape in webster, ma?
Aribo
Tony Pelliccio
says...
> anyone ever been to the fuzzy grape in webster, ma?
>
Ok, I'm kind of ashamed to admit this but I have. It was a business road
trip back in the early 80's...
--
== Tony Pelliccio, KD1S formerly KD1NR
== Trustee WE1RD
Michael Smith
have a little more class than to be posting their (or anyones)
name in the lights. But thanks for asking, now I know where you
stand. Obviously, the ARE some women who like exhibitionism,
just by playing statistics. Are you ready to tell me there
aren't? Because that is an arguement I'd really like you to try
to make. If needed (once you prove your point), I will be glad
to furnish someone who worked at the Doll House in Myrtle Beach
and then the Cyclops in Fort Lauderdale, both *big* time clubs.
Care to make any more sensless, unfounded, unthought out remarks
Bob?
Bob Ficoturo <Robert.J.F...@Wawa.com> wrote in message
news:37462A51...@Wawa.com...
Michael Smith
in which she said "I have done my share of wild and crazy things
in my day. Then I grew up and said 'wow, I can't believe I did
that...what was I thinking? How could I ever explain that to my
it doesn't matter, which was my point.
Bob Ficoturo <Robert.J.F...@Wawa.com> wrote in message
news:3746292E...@Wawa.com...
Bob Ficoturo
Michael Smith wrote:
> Not at all, Bob, I do personally know someone like this, but I
> have a little more class than to be posting their (or anyones)
> name in the lights. But thanks for asking, now I know where you
> stand.
Did I stutter? You make it sound as if my position was something I was
trying to obscure. So you say you know someone who truly enjoyed being
groped for a buck. So now since you can offer one acquaintance... what
makes your position on this issue so much more accurate than mine.
Because for every one that you can produce who enjoys being groped, I
know five that were escaping into booze and drugs just to tolerate it.
> Obviously, the ARE some women who like exhibitionism,
> just by playing statistics. Are you ready to tell me there
> aren't?
I never claimed you couldn't find one... I said they would be rare, and
I said you spoke like you knew one. In fact, what I said was (and this
is about the fourth time I've reiterated this statement) that these
women were far more likely to be exposed to violence, abuse, and drugs
then they were likely to be spending their evenings studying for finals.
Bob Ficoturo
Michael Smith wrote:
> Aha! We clash again.... The mistake referred to Venom's post,
> in which she said "I have done my share of wild and crazy things
> in my day. Then I grew up and said 'wow, I can't believe I did
> that...what was I thinking? How could I ever explain that to my
> kids?' ". So, as I am sure you see, if I believe it is a mistake
> it doesn't matter, which was my point.
Well... why don't you go out on a limb and tell us if you do think its a
mistake. Because regardless of your vague reference to someone else's
post, you framed it as your opinion. To wit:
"Just because YOU don't think it is moral or decent, so what? Who the
hell are you?
Everyone has the right to make mistakes when they are young, it is part
of the growing process."
And it matters because it was that to which I responded.
Michael Smith
Bob Ficoturo <Robert.J.F...@Wawa.com> wrote in message
> Did I stutter? You make it sound as if my position was
something I was
> trying to obscure. So you say you know someone who truly
enjoyed being
> groped for a buck. So now since you can offer one
acquaintance... what
> makes your position on this issue so much more accurate than
mine.
> Because for every one that you can produce who enjoys being
groped, I
> know five that were escaping into booze and drugs just to
tolerate it.
Actually, Bob, you didn't stutter, but you were speaking out of
your, well, ass. What I said was "that *some* women *do* like
being ogled for money". Now, what didn't you understand about
that? I never said anything about being groped
>
> > Obviously, the ARE some women who like exhibitionism,
> > just by playing statistics. Are you ready to tell me there
> > aren't?
>
> I never claimed you couldn't find one... I said they would be
rare, and
> I said you spoke like you knew one. In fact, what I said was
(and this
> is about the fourth time I've reiterated this statement) that
these
> women were far more likely to be exposed to violence, abuse,
and drugs
> then they were likely to be spending their evenings studying
for finals.
I did speak as if I knew one. Because I do. Hmmmm...... And
you don't really expect me to argue that last point, do you? I
am not into arguemental (note: fabricated word) suicide.....
--
Mike
JWhite61
>better than food. Hmmm....Well it's as good as food. Maybe I could get a
>lap
>dance while eating pizza.
></PRE></HTML>
try Fantasies. Beautiful girls , topless and great lap dances.
JC
Topic: Re: What's the Best Strip Joint in Rhode Island?
Sent: 26 May 1999 23:56:19 GMT
try Fantasies. Beautiful girls , topless and great lap
dances.
Ahhhh, finally a response to the original question! :)
I know that I said I wasn't going to post on this thread
again, however I changed my mind. It's the most interesting
topic in this group right now. Out of 81 posts in this
thread I think there are only three posts that address the
question though. Way back in the beginning I ALSO voted for
FANTASY'S. Mostly good looking girls, friendly and they
don't bother you for a buck like some clubs do. If you want
to stand in the back with a drink and just watch, nobody
pressures you into doing anything different. Good
atmosphere, no cover before 6PM. ATM on the premises as
many clubs probaly have now. Decent food too. I've been
their about 5 times. Always a pleasant experience.
There are always one or two really HOT pieces of ass on
stage when I have been there too! Those are the girls that
you tend to make a visit to the ATM for. :) BTW......
before any of you larger ladies get in a huff..... I think
some of you are HOT looking as well. This is coming from a
guy who would choose Anna Nicole Smith over Julia Roberts
any day!!! So my tastes arn't limited to thin Strip club
girls, It just happens to be the topic of conversation
right now.
So anyway.... FANTASIES "equals" A GOOD TIME. Have fun!!!!
