Irma Grese-A German Heroine
Fafner13
"Irma Grese was only 21 years old when she became a defendant at the
infamous Belsen Trial. Few would have imagined that the young and
beautiful
Grese was capable of committing the crimes of which she was accused.
The testimony from the Belsen Trial indicates that Miss Grese was an SS
"Aufseherin", or Overseer, who was assigned duties along with seven other
women to guard over tens of thousands of inmates, most of them Hungarian
Jewesses detained at Auschwitz. Indeed, it was more for her tenure of
service at Auschwitz, rather than Belsen, for which she was charged and
convicted.
In the case of Irma Grese, one should simply reflect on the fact that it
is
an herculean task to manage that many inmates. Auschwitz was a detention
center where criminals were freely interspersed among those simply being
held in investigative custody or interned because they posed a security
threat as members of a group hostile to the war effort.
It is only common sense to assume that as a guard among so many prisoners,
Miss Grese, being of rather slight stature, took measures to safeguard her
own safety. Thus, it has been reported that she carried a stick with her
and was often escorted by a dog.
In correctional facilities all over the world, such measures are
commonplace among staff members justifiably concerned with their own
safety. Guards at Auschwitz had every legal right to take measures to
ensure their own safety and to maintain order - as guards of prisoners
have
done everywhere since times immemorial.
Grese joined the SS in 1942, against the wishes of her father, and was
stationed for a time at Ravensbrueck, a camp for women. In 1943 she was
transferred to Auschwitz and stationed in Birkenau.
How she actually came to be a member of the SS is unclear. According to
her testimony, she was sent to work in the camps by the German Labour
Exchange. Obviously the recruiting and acceptance criteria for female
members of the SS was different from that of males, although I have been
unable to uncover any guidelines. At any rate, Grese remained at Auschwitz
until January, 1945, after which time she was sent on to Belsen at her own
request. If she had been sent to any other camp, we most likely would
never
have even heard of her.
Grese's duties at Auschwitz varied. Most of her work was rather benign,
such as sorting through parcels and overseeing construction projects.
However, from May until December, 1944, Grese was appointed senior
"Aufseherin" for Compound C which turned out to be the eventual cause of
her undoing.
There, as stated above, she had to oversee tens of thousands of interned
Hungarian Jewesses. The huge influx of detainees created problems which
were addressed with difficulty by the relatively young and inexperienced
Grese.
As head Aufseherin, Grese was also responsible for conducting roll call.
Often prisoners were compelled to stand for hours until the roll call was
verified as correct. This is common procedure at any institution.
Most of the problems centered around the distribution of food. The
overcrowding also led to sanitation problems, which Grese was scarcely
capable of handling. The detainees themselves helped to create many of the
problem situations, as at Belsen, where they urinated and defecated
whenever and wherever the urge struck them. They also filled the latrines
and compound with trash and filth, so much so that the latrines eventually
ceased to function. This would explain the pervasive stench around
Auschwitz and another reason why it was referred to as Anus Mundi.
Grese was accused of beating prisoners herself or ordering them to be
beaten. Grese herself admitted that she sometimes struck prisoners with a
cellophane whip and gave orders that anyone caught stealing from the
kitchens was to be beaten. While this seems harsh, one should bear in mind
that the prisoners who stole food from the kitchens were actually stealing
the food right out of the mouths of fellow prisoners at a time when food
was very scarce for everybody.
Grese was accused of administering vicious beatings. (T)he accusations
were
never proven. At Belsen, she was too horrified at the condition of the
sick
inmates to even approach them.
Grese's comments about the alleged gas chambers at Auschwitz are most
interesting. She never saw a gas chamber, but remarked that she heard
about
them from prisoners. Other SS staff also seemed to know nothing about them
save what the prisoners rumored.
There is no doubt that Miss Grese struck prisoners, but there is also no
doubt that the prisoners deliberately exaggerated their alleged
mistreatment. Much ado was made over the accusation that Grese was always
accompanied by a fierce dog, which she set upon the prisoners for
amusement.
Grese denied ever having had a dog. In fact, the matter could have been
cleared up by asking the other "Aufseherin" who worked with her, but
neither the prosecution nor the defense ever pursued this line of
questioning as they should have.
Though the prosecutor tried his best, (h)e was unable to connect her to
any
alleged gassings, as well as any individual cases of murder. The curious
thing about the accusations is that the victims were all anonymous. Not
one
alleged victim of murder was ever mentioned by name by any of the
accusers.
Summing up, it is clear that Irma Grese did not deserve the death penalty,
as the prosecution failed to live up to the burden of proof which would be
required in any impartial court today. Clearly Miss Grese was guilty of
striking prisoners on occasion, but this was usually for some offense or
infraction of one sort or another - which the prisoners knew carried the
penalty of corporal punishment such as caning, still practiced in
Singapore
and custom in Canada until the 1960s, where prisoners were given lashes
with leather belts. As usual, the professional witnesses and survivors
failed to get their stories straight and their testimony differed
considerably from their written affidavits.
It was hardly necessary for an Allied court to try Miss Grese on charges
of
mistreating prisoners in a detention camp, which was legally instituted by
the legitimate government of Germany. Such offenses as beating prisoners
were, in fact, effectively handled by the German authorities themselves
and
punished if unjustified.
However, the Allied conquerors found it necessary that examples of "Nazi
brutality" be made in 1945-46. Thus, Miss Grese was convicted and
sentenced to death. Neither her youth nor the truth saved her life from
being terminated by some hypocritical representative of the British Empire
faithfully fulfilling the orders and expectations of his own victorious
government whose hands were hardly clean.
Under the guise of legality, Irma Grese was lynched.
In his memoirs, the English hangman Albert Pierrepoint described Irma
Grese's last hours on earth with an admiration for her beauty, her
courage,
and her dignity he could barely conceal. He referred to her as a "bonnie
lassie" and said she spent the night before her execution singing "Nazi
songs" with her fellow inmates.
She was hanged the next morning along with two other German women, nurses
Elisabeth Volkenrath and Juana Bormann.
Irma Grese was led to the gallows first, and Pierrepoint wrote that as he
slipped the noose around her neck and pulled the hood down over her face
she gave him an "enigmatic smile" which haunted him for the rest of his
life.
"She was the bravest prisoner, man or woman, whom I ever hanged," he
concluded.
Daniel Keren
"I usually used to beat them on the shoulders, but
there were times when, because of the numbers involved,
they were beaten on any part of the body that happened
to be easiest".
Irma Grese, on how she used to beat Auschwitz inmates
with a stick; "The Belsen Trial", p. 713.
No wonder Bellinger admires her.
-Danny Keren.
Mark Van Alstine
In article <19970603021...@ladder02.news.aol.com>,
fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
> Reply: Are you accusing me of beating people with sticks, Dan? What Dan
> left out is that Grese was in charge of thousands of inmates and as a
> slight woman, sometimes had difficulty maintaining order, as many of them
> were hostile and disobedient and would prey on weaker inmate, stealing
> their food and shoes....
Another BALSNARE(tm).*
<begin quote>
Grese's tenure at the Auschwitz complex coincided with the largest
wholesale slaughter at the killing factory. Fanactically devoted to her
mission to eliminate those deterimined to be subhuman ,,_Dreck_, "she was
on the job promptly at 7:00 a.m., usually every day of the week. With her
hair perfectly coiffured, her makeup meticulously applied, and her own
strikgly natural beauty, Irma Grese raomed about Birkenau and spread both
ohysical and psychological terror capricously throughout the camp. "Making
sport" was an extension of the aginizing roll-call routine, and prisoners
knew to keep as far away from her as possible. Indeed, Rene'e Firestone
(ne'e Rene'e Weinfeld), a Birkenau prisoner who had the good fortune to be
shipped out to work as a slave laborer in the West, told me that she had
seen Grese on occasions from a distance, but knew always to keep it that
way. A Czech inmate, Klara Lebowitz, also testified that she observed Dr.
Mengele and Overseer Grese making selectins together for slave labor
shipments to the West and when Grese saw a mother and daughter, or a
sister with another sister, attempting to stay together for such
transports, she would "beat them until they were unconscious and leave
them lying on the ground."
While Irma Grese's terroristic abuse of the prisoners was occasionally
restrained by her male superiors, Auschwitz Commandant Rudolf Ho"ß, acting
on orders from _Reichsfu"hrer-SS Himmler himslef, made Grese administer
the last two of the customary twenty-five lashes to an _SS-Aufsehrin_ who
had been accused of being too lenient on prisoners. For her "splendid
work" in exterminating inmates, the SS rewarded Grese with a medal for
"merotorious war service."
<end quote>
Source: Brown, _The Beautiful Beast_, pp.50-52.
>... What a putz.
What a anti-Semitic lying scumbag Nazi apologist.
For those interested in proof of Mr. Bellinger's increasingly irrelevant
Nazi apologia, Holocaust denial, intellectual dishonesty, anti-Semitism,
and outright lies, please peruse DejaNews and visit the Nizkor Project at:
http://www.dejanews.com/
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/lies
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/1996/blackmore.0996
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/1996/blackmore.1096
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/1996/blackmore.1196
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/1996/blackmore.1296
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/1997/blackmore.0197
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/1996/tutu101.1296
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/1997/fafner13.0197
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/bellinger.joseph/1996/anyone-out-there-12-14
Mark
*Bellinger Anti-Semitic Lying Scumbag Nazi Apologist Retarded Excuse.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes
not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties--but
right through every human heart--and all human hearts."
-- Alexander Solzhenitsyn, "The Gulag Archipelago"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ChuckF2323
Irma Grese was an SS Bitch. The SS only took bitches, whores, female
criminals into their ranks. There were no decent women in the SS...not a
single one.
How many did you see?
I saw many, and they were all over-weight slutty looking bitches.
Chuck Ferree
LET ANY DOUBTER,
IN ALL THE GENERATIONS TO COME,
CONTEMPLATE WHAT IT WOULD BE LIKE
TO LIVE IN A WORLD DOMINATED BY HITLER,
THE JAPANESE WARLORDS,
OR ANY OTHER CRUEL DICTATOR OR DESPOT.
Ira C. Eaker Commanding General,
United States Air Force
Michael
On Tue, 03 Jun 1997 23:29:12 -0700, mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van
Alstine) wrote:
<Drivel deleted>
>*Bellinger Anti-Semitic Lying Scumbag Nazi Apologist Retarded Excuse.
Of course you did not mean to slur the mentally challenged? Or did
you, by your use of the term 'retarded'?
<Solzhenitsyn's quote snipped. The eminent Soviet writer wasn't
received very well by the press After he publicly denounced the
citizens of America about our twisted views and shallow understanding
of freedom>
natio...@juno.com
Michael
"http://www.natall.com"
National Vanguard Books
P.O. Box 330
Hillsboro, WV 24946
"No man has come to true greatness who has not felt
in some degree that his life belongs to his race."
----Phillips Brooks
Mike Curtis
fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
This is old stuff that has been addressed in the past. Ms. Grese's
testimony is available on Nizkor in the HWEB project. The "discussion
between Bellinger and myself is available on Nizkor or from the other
Usenet archives. I'd rather add something new from Tom Boyer's _Blind
Eye To Murder_ which really goes a long way in refuting the claims
made by many in this group concerning the revenge motivations. From
page 225-226:
"Critical reports began appearing in Russian and American newspapers
in the third week of the trial. In cross-examining the survivors who
appeared as witnesses, the defense tried to dispute their accounts of
horrors of the camps. Witnesses testifying that they had seen someone
beaten to the ground were unable to prove to the defense's
satisfaction that the victims had actually died of the wounds. They
were unable to give dates and times for the assaults. Their
explanation, namely, that there was no sense of time in a
concentration camp, did not seem to be understood. When they added
facts which were not included in their original affidavits or omitted
to repeat what they had written months before, the lawyers seemed to
regard that as something important, which discredited them.
Contradictions in the evidence--for example, one witness alledged that
a murder had been committed by shooting in the head and another
testified it had been in the stomach--or uncertainty as to whether the
victim was a man or a woman were seized upon as proof that witnesses
were concocting stories. When witnesses explained that sexual
differences were not easy to distinguish when someone was emaciated
and their head was shaven, it did not seem to carry much weight.
Criticism of the trial began to intensify when the defense opened its
case. Kramer's lawyer, Major T. C. M. Winwood, and his colleagues for
the defense began mysteriously referring to House of Lords decisions
on the international law about shipwrecks, a fishing dispute in
Scotland and the decision of an American court over the validity of a
treaty. It emerged that the British officers were actually arguing
that concentration camps were legal in Germany and that therefore
those who worked in them could not be punished for obeying orders.
They were suggesting that murder in a concentration camp was not a war
crime.
As weeks wore on and the audience . . . [thinned] . . . , stories
about 'British softness' and lack of sympathy for the victims were
suddenly overtaken by reports of Winwood's closing speech. According
to Winwood, the roll-calls, which sometimes continued for twelve hours
while inmates died of exposure, exhaustion or systematic beatings,
were 'a part of concentration camp life and it was the only way of
being able to make out a strength return for rations.' The beatings,
Winwood said, were only necessary when food became scarce. 'The
internees had to be restrained.'
[ . . .]
Major . . . Cranfield, defending Irma Grese, who whipped her
unfortunate victims in Auschwitz to death and who continued to do the
same in Belsen, described his client as not the beast but the
scapegoat of Belsen. He told the court that cororal punishment, . . .
, was acceptable in prison because it was a 'reasonable conduct in the
circumstances.' The continual use of the word 'prison' seemed to imply
that there were justifiable legal grounds for the inmates'
confinement.
[ . . .]
But it was one of Sterling's closing remarks which brought the
criticism to a crescendo, because it seemed to confirm the worst
suspicions of British lack of commitment. 'The court,' said Sterling,
'would have to be satisfied that a person on the staff of Auschwitz or
Belsen concentration camp was guilty of deliberately committing a war
crime; just being a member of the staff itself was not enough to
justify conviction.'
[In the end 30 were convicted out of 45. So 15 were acquitted. Eleven
of the 30 were sentenced to death. They must have been committing war
crimes. Grese was one of those. One received life and the remainder
received terms from 1 to 15 years. It seems that most of those
equitted or given low senteces were not SS but Kapos. --MSC]
Mike Curtis
E-mail mcu...@inetport.com
Nizkor Web: http://www.nizkor.org/
Mike Curtis
fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
>Reply: I would like to address the comments below:
>
>Major . . . Cranfield, defending Irma Grese, who whipped her
>unfortunate victims in Auschwitz to death and who continued to do the
>same in Belsen, described his client as not the beast but the
>scapegoat of Belsen.
>
>
>Reply: Knowledge can be a powerful weapon. People: READ all you can
>about the Holocaust. Saying this, I will remark that Irma Grese was never
>convicted of whipping people to death at either Belsen or Auschwitz. This
>is a falsehood.
She was found guilty at the Belsen Trial and hung. So it isn't a
falsehood.
>And, unless the above is taken out of context, it was Kramer, and not
>Grese who was referred to in the press (Of course) as "the beast of
>Belsen.
> If you can't believe the messengers......If the author of the
>above quoted book made such egregious errors as in the above, what are we
>to think of the rest of the book?
Boyer's source is the United Nations War Crimes Commision, Law Reports
of War Criminals, vol 2, page 83. Since it appears to have happened
during a speech her defence attorney may have been making an analogy.
So it is sourced, Joe, check it out. Frankly, I was surprised by it
but I didn't have these reports available. However, this is hardly an
egregious error, Joe, when you consider this:
From _The Beautiful Beast: The Life and Crimes of SS-Aufseherin Irma
Grese_, Daniel Patrick Brown, Golden West Historical Publications,
1996, page 68:
"When a Frenchman yelled at Grese, 'Why did you do these things?" the
former SS-woman flung back emphatically, 'It was our duty to
exterminate anti-social elements, so that Germany's future would be
assured!' This act of contemptuousness, stony defiance, coupled with
the numerous reports of Grese inflicting wanton beatings on helpless
inmates, led the foreign press to pick up on the story. Already
infatuated by her physical appearance, the print media began to refer
to Grese as 'The Beautiful Beast.'
So Cranfield's statement makes a bit more sense now does it not?
> He told the court that cororal punishment, . . .
>, was acceptable in prison because it was a 'reasonable conduct in the
>circumstances.' The continual use of the word 'prison' seemed to imply
>that there were justifiable legal grounds for the inmates'
>confinement.
>
>Reply: Is the author suggesting that there were no convicted criminals in
>these camps?
>
No he is commenting on the method used by the defense. You are
complaining about the author and his description of what the defense
did. Rather odd switch of aim on your part. This camp was a transit
camp used to hold hostages that could be transported out after ransoms
or political deals were made. It later became a sick camp and then a
deat camp wen it became over populated by transfers from the east.
Very few of these tranfers were criminals in the sense we understand
criminals to be.
>But it was one of Sterling's closing remarks which brought the
>criticism to a crescendo, because it seemed to confirm the worst
>suspicions of British lack of commitment. 'The court,' said Sterling,
>'would have to be satisfied that a person on the staff of Auschwitz or
>Belsen concentration camp was guilty of deliberately committing a war
>crime; just being a member of the staff itself was not enough to
>justify conviction.'
>
>[In the end 30 were convicted out of 45. So 15 were acquitted. Eleven
>of the 30 were sentenced to death. They must have been committing war
>crimes. Grese was one of those. One received life and the remainder
>received terms from 1 to 15 years. It seems that most of those
>equitted or given low senteces were not SS but Kapos. --MSC]
>
>Reply: The above is surely tragic, as it was the Kapos who were most
>responsible for beatings, injuries, and deaths in the camps and not the
>SS. It seems as though justice was blind, simply because the brutal Kapos
>wore the garb of inmates. I have read the evidence presented in the
>Belsen trial and I do nopt believe that justice played any major role in
>the handing down of the sentences.
>
From _The Beautiful Beast: The Life and Crimes of SS-Aufseherin Irma
Grese_, Daniel Patrick Brown, Golden West Historical Publications,
1996, page 73-74:
"In addition to attempting to refute or lessen the impact of the
eye-witness testimony against his client, defense council tried to
emeliorate a potentially damning mistake Irma Grese made after her
arrest -- namely, her intial confession and two subsequent and
progressivey more self-incriminating statements. To make matters worse
for Cranfield, under English law in 1945 there were no such defendant
self-incrimination safeguards . . . , and Grese's affidavits were
declared admissable as evidence. Join these admissions of guilt with
the statements of survivors and then add Grese's own arrogant,
contemptuous attitude in court and one can readily see that Cranfield
had a herculean task in trying to provide some measure of damage
control for his client. In truth, Irma Grese herself at times became
the star witness for the prosecution and she would eventually elp
convict her co-defendants."
ChuckF2323
Irma Grese was a SS tramp, former whore, criminal, just like all SS women.
See Hoess, he says so.
Anthony Sabatini
ChuckF2323 <chuck...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19970606053...@ladder02.news.aol.com>...
> Irma Grese was a female SS guard. The SS did not accept females into their
> organization unless they were: criminals, whores, sluts, and or worse. Any
> woman of any nationality who served the SS had to be bad, evil, and a
> bitch.
Yet another incredulous and nonsensical post from Chuck Ferree, troll
extraordinaire. I'd say this was a 'classic' except that it's pretty low-key
compared to some of Chuck's previous messages.
> Even Hoess said so in his hand written book, before the Poles
> hanged him.
What did he say, exactly?
[silly .sig snipped]
Fafner13
To Van Alstine:
I am going to call your bluff on this one. I ask you to post the original
document in GERMAN which you referred to in claiming that Ms. Greses was
issued a reward for abusing inmates. So, when will you post it? Or is it
like every other deceitful promise you have made when a request was given
to you for evidence? Your comments were lies, as were the comments of
your "eye-witnesses" whom I have exposed over and over again as
incorrigible liars. Would you care to post ALL affadavits and testimony
given by the witnesses you included in your response. TO THE BROWSER:
Follow this thread closely and see for yourselves what brazen liars and
phonies these Nizkooks be. If you can't believe the messengers, how can
you believe the message?
Roger Hughes
In message <mvanalst-100...@rbi143.rbi.com> - :56 -0700
writes:
:>
:>Survivors Isabella Leitner and Olga Lengyel have documented Grese's
:>bisexual escapades, the latter noting that "Grese" often had homosexual
:>affairs with prisoners - which was a _major_ violation of the Race and
:>Resettlement Act ( a matter of _Rassenschande_) - and then had the
:>potential incriminating participants killed. Dr. Gisella Perl observed
:>that "Grese" relished whipping well-deloped young woman and the breasts,
:>which eventually became infected. Once this occurred, Perl, the inmate
:>doctor, would be ordered to operate and Grese would become sexually
:>aroused just watching the woman's suffering. No anesthetic was used and
:>the victim would scream in agony throughout the procedure. Equally
:>sickening testimony was also presented at the Lu"neberg Trial. In laying
:>out its case, the prosecution gave the court eye-witness testimony that
:>"this 100-pound German girl invented new methods of torture. One of them:
:>she waited until a pregnant woman was ready to give birth, then tied her
:>legs together and watched the agony.
Do you people ever give-up? Maybe such "National Tattler" style make
interesting reading for some with low tastes, but this is a bit
ridiculous. I realize all the titillating elements are there: a
beautiful, bisexual Nazi women who sadistically tortures other women.
Didn't he Jews made a C-grade movie about this. Maybe this is Mark Van
"Allstink"'s secret fantasy?
Well, I guess the same people who will deny that Bolshevik Jews murdered
millions, since we don't have a videotape of each individual murder,
will readily accept any outrageous story about the Germans.
**********************************************************
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**********************************************************
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ChuckF2323
SAMUELS.....
STICK IT IN YOUR EAR!
WHEN THE NAZIS INVADED HUNGARY IN 1944
THEY SENT THE ENTIRE JEWISH POPULATION
TO AUSCHWITZ. THE SS GASSED AND CREMATED
400,000. LET THE DENIERS HAVE THEIR SAY. THEY LIE!
R. Samuels
ChuckF666 wrote:
>
> SAMUELS.....
>
> STICK IT IN YOUR EAR!
Chuck.........STICK IT UP YOUR ASS!
> WHEN THE NAZIS INVADED HUNGARY IN 1944
> THEY SENT THE ENTIRE JEWISH POPULATION
> TO AUSCHWITZ........IN OTHERWORDS LIES!
Fafner13
To Mr. Hughes: I just read your response to Mark Van ALstine's post
regarding Irma Grese. Olga was a liar, of course, and I have dealt with
portions of her "eyewitness" nonsense before. Indeed, the stories
attributed by Mark's witnesses were considered SO outrageous that a sexual
exploitation "film" was made entitled: Ilse, She Wolf of the SS." It is
really sad to see Holocaust defenders resort to this sort of trash
journalism in a desperate attempt to "prove a point." Curiously, they Do
prove a point, but not the one they had intended. Fania Fenelon gave
another description of Irma Grese as a concerned human being, who begged
her to hold on to life when she was seriously ill with typhus. `The
nonsense about Ms. Grese tying pregnant women's legs together is
absurd--the product of a sick mind, which is why Van Alstine posted it. It
fits in with his own disposition. One could read similar trash from
publications in the 50's such as "Men's Adventures", "Men's Life,"
"argosy", etc., and the covers were all illustrated with the appropriately
shocking - sick fantasies. We even offer some of these now out of print
magazines for sale at Belling's Books. When it comes to the Holocaust, no
story is too sick or depraved. Mengele, according to other "survivors"
would rip open the abdomen of pregnant women to see what the infant looked
like inside.....or, my favorite: Mengele had his entire office decorated
with human eyeballs nailed to the walls! Give them enough rope and they
will always succeed in hanging themselves.
ChuckF2323
To Mr. Bellinger,
Stick with idiots like Hughs. You think you'll learn the truth from
bastids like him?
Chuck
WHEN THE NAZIS INVADED HUNGARY IN 1944
THEY SENT THE ENTIRE JEWISH POPULATION
Mark Van Alstine
> ChuckF666 wrote:
> >
> > SAMUELS.....
> >
> > STICK IT IN YOUR EAR!
>
> Chuck.........STICK IT UP YOUR ASS!
Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must be
the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
Mark
Brian Smith
mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must be
>the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
You would know Mark: you are the master of sticking things up your
ass, and discussing it in detail later!
http://www.kaiwan.com/~ihrgreg/ Greg Raven's Website
http://www.webcom.com/~ezundel/english/welcome.html Zundelsite
http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~lpauling/ Student Revisionist Resource Site
http://www.webcom.com/ezundel/english/LEUCHTER/leuchtertoc.html
http://www.codoh.com/irving/irving.html David Irving
http://www.codoh.com/ Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust
http://pubweb.acns.nwu.edu/~abutz/ Arthur R. Butz
http://www.air-photo.com/ Air Photo Evidence (John Ball)
http://www.adam.com.au/~fredadin/adins.html Adelaide Institute
http://www.codoh.com/rudolf/rudreport/rudreport.html
Brian Smith
http://www.natall.com
"A civilization which tolerates the existence of Kaplan and his filthy
business should be burned to the ground." I said. "We should make
a bonfire of the whole thing and then start over fresh "
_The Turner Diaries_. p. 85
>-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
\|/ Towards a New Consciousness. \|/
| A New Future. |
A New People.
>.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Daniel Keren
"I usually used to beat them on the shoulders, but
there were times when, because of the numbers involved,
they were beaten on any part of the body that happened
to be easiest".
Irma Grese, on how she used to beat Auschwitz inmates
-Danny Keren.
Chuck Ferree
R. Samuels wrote:
>
> Mark Van Alstine wrote:
> >
> > In article <339F76...@hotmail.com>, rsam...@hotmail.com wrote:
> >
> > > ChuckF666 wrote:
> > > >
> > > > SAMUELS.....
> > > >
> > > > STICK IT IN YOUR EAR!
> > >
> > > Chuck.........STICK IT UP YOUR ASS!
> >
CHUCK:>>> Samuels, you silly bastid! Even at my age I could whip your
skinny little ass. With a baseball bat too. Read this, you dumbshit:
Subject:
Re: Irma Grese-A German Heroine
Date:
12 Jun 1997 19:24:30 GMT
From:
chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF2323)
Organization:
AOL http://www.aol.com
Newsgroups:
alt.revisionism
References:
1
(Next to Samuels) Rog is slightly dumber!
Rog,
Irma Grese was a female SS guard. The SS did not take any decent women
into their ranks. All the female SS were, sluts, whores and or
criminals.
As a matter of fact if you would like to learn about the SS as an
organization read: The Theory and Practice of Hell by Eugene Kogon.
He proves that the entire SS, from Himmler on down to Irma Grese, were
corrupt, stole from everybody, including each other. Several SS men
were
executed for ripping off the SS. Too bad they didn't all turn on each
other like the mad dogs they really were.
Chuck Ferree
WHEN THE NAZIS INVADED HUNGARY IN 1944
THEY SENT THE ENTIRE JEWISH POPULATION
TO AUSCHWITZ. THE SS GASSED AND CREMATED
400,000. LET THE DENIERS HAVE THEIR SAY. THEY LIE!
> >
Chuck Ferree
Mark Van Alstine
In article <EBpB2...@world.std.com>, dke...@world.std.com (Daniel Keren)
wrote:
<begin quote>
Another "accessory" used by Irma Grese to torment prisoners was a "huge
dog." A Russian inmate named Luba Triszinska (who was also known as
Charlotte Klein) provided the Lu"neberg court with a written deposition
which stated that Grese used to ride a bicycle accompanied by a big hound.
Triszinska reported that when women were to weak to keep up with the main
column on the sixteen kilometer trek to work, _SS-Aufseherin_ Grese
ordered her dog to attack these unfortunate creatures. As one might
suspect, many of the victims of Grese's viscious attacks did not survive
the ordeal.
<end quote>
Source: Brown, _The Beautiful Beast_, p.50.
Mark
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes
not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties--but
right through every human heart--and all human hearts."
-- Alexander Solzhenitsyn, "The Gulag Archipelago"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ChuckF2323
Two whackos, Brian Smith and what's his name Samuels. Always sticking
stuff up each others ass. Boy I'm glad I quit that habit.
U-no-who
Roger Hughes
In message <5nr527$b55$1...@news01a.micron.net> - sbr...@micron.net (Brian
Smith) writes:
:>
:>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
:>
:>>Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must be
:>>the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
:>You would know Mark: you are the master of sticking things up your
:>ass, and discussing it in detail later!
Boy, this Van "All-Stink" is a real case.
I supect he's probably a real butt-kisser at work, and not for
promotions or raises, but just so he can always be near his favorite
object of interest.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Towards a New Consciousness; a New Order; a New People
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The National Alliance is the foremost racial separatist
organization for White men and women. Hear the NA's
Internet broadcasts at:
http://www.natall.com
http://www.natvan.com
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Roger Hughes' Page http://www.usaor.net/users/ipm/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Abusive emails will be posted to the Usenet and ridiculed.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Roger Hughes
In message <EBpB2...@world.std.com> - dke...@world.std.com (Daniel
Keren) writes:
:>
:> "I usually used to beat them on the shoulders, but
:> there were times when, because of the numbers involved,
:> they were beaten on any part of the body that happened
:> to be easiest".
:>
:>Irma Grese, on how she used to beat Auschwitz inmates
:>with a stick. Quoted from "The Belsen Trial".
Ho hum...... And that proves what? The same answer could be legitimently
given by any prison guard today to a variety of questions.
Roger Hughes
In message <19970613212...@ladder02.news.aol.com> -
chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF2323) writes:
:>
:>Two whackos, Brian Smith and what's his name Samuels. Always sticking
:>stuff up each others ass. Boy I'm glad I quit that habit.
See, I told you. These people are crazy degenerates. Here we have a
faggot alledged war veteran coming out. At least we can speculate with
some certainty what happened: Chuck got his brain damaged from one too
many blanket parties while in the Army for trying to stick something
somewhere it didn't belong.
Liberalism, holocaustmania, communism, anti-White hate, homosexuality.
It all goes together like peanut butter and jelly.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Towards a New Consciousness; a New Order; a New People
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The National Alliance is the foremost racial separatist
organization for White men and women. Hear the NA's
Internet broadcasts at:
http://www.natall.com
http://www.natvan.com
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Roger Hughes' Page http://www.usaor.net/users/ipm/
Keep It White Because You Know It's Right!
Anthony Sabatini
Mark Van Alstine <mvan...@rbi.com> wrote in article
<mvanalst-130...@rbi143.rbi.com>...
> In article <5nr527$b55$1...@news01a.micron.net>, sbr...@micron.net (Brian
> Smith) wrote:
>
> > mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
> >
> > >Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must be
> > >the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
> >
> > You would know Mark: you are the master of sticking things up your
> > ass, and discussing it in detail later!
>
> _quite_ fond of the ol' rectal "thermometer"!
This is grand! Mark Van Alstine, Lord and Master of Anal-related Remarks,
accuses someone else of the same! ROTFLOL! Interested persons may peruse Deja
News for evidence of Markie-pooh's anal and penile fixation, wherein it is
proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.
[slander and .sig snipped]
Mark Van Alstine (allegedly one Stuart Pidley) is, as far as I can tell, a
virulent spewer of mistruths, a slanderous serpent and has a most peculiar
interest for building demolition procedures, something which most honest
citizens do not share. His ranting, mewling and temper tantrums, along with
his foul verbiage and assorted excrement, can be found regularly in
alt.revisionism, one of his favorite haunts.
For more information on this inbred mule, please see:
http://search.dejanews.com/profile.xp?author=van%20alstine%20mark
http://ftp.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi?people/v/van-alstine.mark
rsam...@hotmail.com
In article <33A12F...@rio.com>,
> > >
> > > In article <339F76...@hotmail.com>, rsam...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > >
> > > > ChuckF666 wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > SAMUELS.....
> > > > >
> > > > > STICK IT IN YOUR EAR!
> > > >
> > > > Chuck.........STICK IT UP YOUR ASS!
> > >
suggested he stick it up his ass. He's old and is used to it from the
nurses who tend to him]
>
> CHUCK:>>> Samuels, you silly bastid! [The dumb cunt can't even spell
correct. The word is BASTARD! You know what your mother called you when
you were born. That little liaison she had with the WETBACK field worker.
Disgusting bitch!] Even at my age I could whip your skinny little ass.
[More bravado huh half-breed? Well, I'm not skinny and I'm not little. I
love to see you say that to my face dogshit! I'll see ya on the beach and
I'll kick sand in your eyes.] With a baseball bat too. [With the one your
mommy gave you? Is it real wood Chuckie or is it one of those hollow
plastic ones?] Read this, [its total] bullshit: [I agree oldman so what's
your point? Ah, you promote bullshit! Right, got it!]
>
> Subject:
> Re: Irma Grese-A German Heroine
> Date:
> 12 Jun 1997 19:24:30 GMT
> From:
> chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF666)
> Organization:
> AOL http://www.aol.com
> Newsgroups:
> alt.revisionism
> References:
> [Chuck Faggots opinions irrelevant and useless thus I deleted them. Sorry
Chuck we have better things to do with our time rather than listen to a
ranting and raving old prick!]
>
> Chuck "the loudmouthed and stupid schmuck" Ferree
>
> WHEN THE NAZIS INVADED HUNGARY IN 1944
> THEY SENT THE ENTIRE JEWISH POPULATION
> TO AUSCHWITZ....BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH...
> ANYONE WANT ANY VIOLIN MUSIC SO YOU CAN
> LISTEN TO THE LIES?
>
> > >
> > > Mark "MY FRIENDS CALL ME STINKY" Alswine
> > >
> > >
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > "Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil
passes
> > > not through states, nor between classes, nor between political
parties--but
> > > right through every human heart--and all human hearts."
> > >
> > > -- Alexander Solzhenitsyn, "The Gulag Archipelago"
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Brian Smith
chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF2323) wrote:
>For Roger Hughs, the dumbest denier around the 'net!
This is "Nizkook" for "I have more problems refuting Roger than anyone
else! Gee, I wish he'd stop posting and trouncing my favorite
holohoax."
By the way, Chuck, my friend's name is spelled "Hughes." I'm not
trying to be hypercritical here: that kind of garbage is for Annie
and her fellow Nizkooks who have to use anything they can get their
hands on (including spelling and syntax errors) because their
arguments are so lacking in merit.
Brian Smith
i...@usaor.net (Roger Hughes) wrote:
>In message <19970613212...@ladder02.news.aol.com> -
>chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF2323) writes:
>:>Two whackos, Brian Smith and what's his name Samuels. Always sticking
>:>stuff up each others ass. Boy I'm glad I quit that habit.
>See, I told you. These people are crazy degenerates. Here we have a
>faggot alledged war veteran coming out. At least we can speculate with
>some certainty what happened: Chuck got his brain damaged from one too
>many blanket parties while in the Army for trying to stick something
>somewhere it didn't belong.
>Liberalism, holocaustmania, communism, anti-White hate, homosexuality.
>It all goes together like peanut butter and jelly.
Or like flies on shit, if you'll pardon the expression. :)
Brian Smith
i...@usaor.net (Roger Hughes) wrote:
>sbr...@micron.net (Brian Smith) writes:
>:>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>:>>Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must be
>:>>the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
>:>You would know Mark: you are the master of sticking things up your
>:>ass, and discussing it in detail later!
>Boy, this Van "All-Stink" is a real case.
>I supect he's probably a real butt-kisser at work, and not for
>promotions or raises, but just so he can always be near his favorite
>object of interest.
Alas, Mark did not earn his cognomen "Vain All-Stink" for nothing.
Roger Hughes
In message <5nuoj4$g7t$1...@news01a.micron.net> - sbr...@micron.net (Brian
Smith) writes:
:>
:>i...@usaor.net (Roger Hughes) wrote:
:>>Liberalism, holocaustmania, communism, anti-White hate, homosexuality.
:>
:>>It all goes together like peanut butter and jelly.
:>
:>Or like flies on shit, if you'll pardon the expression. :)
Yes, thanks for the correction.
:>http://www.kaiwan.com/~ihrgreg/ Greg Raven's Website
:>http://www.webcom.com/~ezundel/english/welcome.html Zundelsite
:>http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~lpauling/ Student Revisionist Resource Site
:>http://www.webcom.com/ezundel/english/LEUCHTER/leuchtertoc.html
:>http://www.codoh.com/irving/irving.html David Irving
:>http://www.codoh.com/ Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust
:>http://pubweb.acns.nwu.edu/~abutz/ Arthur R. Butz
:>http://www.air-photo.com/ Air Photo Evidence (John Ball)
:>http://www.adam.com.au/~fredadin/adins.html Adelaide Institute
:>http://www.codoh.com/rudolf/rudreport/rudreport.html
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Mark Van Alstine
In article <5nuomn$g8f$1...@news01a.micron.net>, sbr...@micron.net (Brian
Smith) wrote:
> i...@usaor.net (Roger Hughes) wrote:
>
> >sbr...@micron.net (Brian Smith) writes:
>
> >:>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>
> >:>>Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must be
> >:>>the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
>
> >:>You would know Mark: you are the master of sticking things up your
> >:>ass, and discussing it in detail later!
>
> >Boy, this Van "All-Stink" is a real case.
>
> >I supect he's probably a real butt-kisser at work, and not for
> >promotions or raises, but just so he can always be near his favorite
> >object of interest.
>
> Alas, Mark did not earn his cognomen "Vain All-Stink" for nothing.
Indeed! Through diligent and tireless effort, I have embarrassed Mr. Smith
by showing him to be an anti-Semitic lying scubag Nazi apologist so many
times; demolished his stupid lies and Nazi propaganda; and exposed him for
ingorant and vile person he is that Mr. Smith has been reduced to a
quivering Nazi puddle of jello only capable of making 2nd grade schoolyard
taunts!
So, yes, I _do_ think I've earned it. And proud of it too. Maybe _now_
I'll get the ZOG condo in Maui for a weekend....
For those interested in proof of National Alliance member Mr. Smith's
rabid anti-Semitism, pathological Nazi apologia, lies, and utter hypocrisy
-and that he possses an IQ of a fence post (not to mention a sewer mouth)
please peruse DejaNews and visit the Nizkor Project at:
http://www.dejanews.com/
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/s/smith.brian.r
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/s/stele.kurt
Mark
ChuckF2323
Roger and Brian...together...swishing down tha street...holding hands.
Ain't that sweet. Giwer has pictures for sale too.
WHEN THE NAZIS INVADED HUNGARY IN 1944
THEY SENT THE ENTIRE JEWISH POPULATION
ChuckF2323
We all know what Irma Grese was:
An SS slut, a whore, and a criminal. Now she's a dead slut, whore and
criminal
Chuck Ferree
Chuck Ferree wrote:
Yeah, but Matt Giwer is going around talking about you two guys and he
even says he has film of real nasty goings on.
Brian and Roger...they make a real cute couple, swishing down the
street, arm in arm, Brian carries tha purse. They really shouldn't
swap spit in public like that. Get it on film, Matt!
R. Samuels
Roger Hughes wrote:
>
> In message <19970613212...@ladder02.news.aol.com> -
> chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF2323) writes:
> :>
> :>Two whackos, Brian Smith and what's his name Samuels. Always sticking
> :>stuff up each others ass. Boy I'm glad I quit that habit.
>
> See, I told you. These people are crazy degenerates. Here we have a
> faggot alledged war veteran coming out. At least we can speculate with
> some certainty what happened: Chuck got his brain damaged from one too
> many blanket parties while in the Army for trying to stick something
> somewhere it didn't belong.
>
> It all goes together like peanut butter and jelly.
>
> Towards a New Consciousness; a New Order; a New People
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> The National Alliance is the foremost racial separatist
> organization for White men and women. Hear the NA's
> Internet broadcasts at:
>
> http://www.natall.com
> http://www.natvan.com
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> Roger Hughes' Page http://www.usaor.net/users/ipm/
> Keep It White Because You Know It's Right!
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> Abusive emails will be posted to the Usenet and ridiculed.
> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Roger,
Ya, Chuck Fairy and Mark Stinky seem to like words and ideas associated
with anal fantasies. You know Chucks got his head so far up his master's
asses its totally natural for him. I suspect the same for Mark.
Alledgedly, is a good word for Chuck's "I WAS THERE" so-called service.
He just gets up on a rooftop and babbles his exploits and expects people
to believe him without and evidence; what a schmuck! Anyways, the loser
offered be SO-CALLED EVIDENCE of remember.org. When I saw it I just
laughed.
I think Chuck doesn't like it when I address him personally so he had to
get his lovers to assist him. That's love you know! They're probably
together all the time now because the goy seem to be attacking back.
Richard Samuels
Herman ten Klooster
Fafner13 wrote:
>
> Danny Wrote:
>
> "Irma Grese, on how she used to beat Auschwitz inmates with a stick."
>
>
> JEWISH SETTLER BEATS PALESTINIAN CHILD TO DEATH
>
< S N I P >
> end of article
What does this say about Irma Grese? She was a sadistic lowlife and the
world is a better place without people (people?) like her.
You wil have to come up with better things, bellinger.
--
*** reality is a figment of the imagination caused by a lack of drink ***
To reply to this message remove '.nospam' from my e-mail address.
I hate automatic junk-mail generators.
Brian Smith
Herman ten Klooster <herm...@pi.net.nospam> wrote:
>What does this say about Irma Grese? She was a sadistic lowlife and the
>world is a better place without people (people?) like her.
Irma was framed by the Allies with more sensationalized holohoax
testimony. Hell, who wasn't framed by the pro-Soviet Allies, the
same people who framed Germans for executing 15,000 Polish troops by
shooting them all in the back of the head -- the signature execution
of the Soviets? Of course, now we know the Soviets did them all. All
it took to frame anyone in 1945 Europe was a simple accusation by any
Jew, no matter how idiotic, false, or ridiculous. Irma was one of the
most gentle and beautiful creatures who ever lived. Simply another
martyr of Jewish Talmudic hatred, nothing more.
>You wil have to come up with better things, bellinger.
You'll have to come up with better testimony than that which framed
Irma.
Archive THIS, Nizkook!
( )( )
\ | | /
MOONING the Nizkor Camera
http://www.kaiwan.com/~ihrgreg/ Greg Raven's Website
http://www.webcom.com/~ezundel/english/welcome.html Zundelsite
http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~lpauling/ Student Revisionist Resource Site
http://www.webcom.com/ezundel/english/LEUCHTER/leuchtertoc.html
http://www.codoh.com/irving/irving.html David Irving
http://www.codoh.com/ Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust
http://pubweb.acns.nwu.edu/~abutz/ Arthur R. Butz
http://www.air-photo.com/ Air Photo Evidence (John Ball)
http://www.adam.com.au/~fredadin/adins.html Adelaide Institute
http://www.codoh.com/rudolf/rudreport/rudreport.html
Brian Smith
P. Bishop
i...@usaor.net (Roger Hughes) writes:
> In message <mvanalst-100...@rbi143.rbi.com> - :56 -0700
> writes:
> :>
> :>Survivors Isabella Leitner and Olga Lengyel have documented Grese's
> :>bisexual escapades, the latter noting that "Grese" often had homosexual
> :>affairs with prisoners - which was a _major_ violation of the Race and
> :>Resettlement Act ( a matter of _Rassenschande_) - and then had the
> :>potential incriminating participants killed. Dr. Gisella Perl observed
> :>that "Grese" relished whipping well-deloped young woman and the breasts,
> :>which eventually became infected. Once this occurred, Perl, the inmate
> :>doctor, would be ordered to operate and Grese would become sexually
> :>aroused just watching the woman's suffering. No anesthetic was used and
> :>the victim would scream in agony throughout the procedure. Equally
> :>sickening testimony was also presented at the Lu"neberg Trial. In laying
> :>out its case, the prosecution gave the court eye-witness testimony that
> :>"this 100-pound German girl invented new methods of torture. One of them:
> :>she waited until a pregnant woman was ready to give birth, then tied her
> :>legs together and watched the agony.
>
> Do you people ever give-up? Maybe such "National Tattler" style make
> interesting reading for some with low tastes, but this is a bit
> ridiculous. I realize all the titillating elements are there: a
> beautiful, bisexual Nazi women who sadistically tortures other women.
That sounds bizarre. That wasn't really used in any kind of trial, without
witnesses that could be cross-examined, was it?
> Didn't he Jews made a C-grade movie about this. Maybe this is Mark Van
> "Allstink"'s secret fantasy?
Who's this "Mark Van Allstink?" Some TV trash-talk show host? (I don't have
cable TV)
Sincerely,
PB
Mark Van Alstine
In article <5nvv0d$su3$1...@news01a.micron.net>, sbr...@micron.net (Brian
Smith) wrote:
> Herman ten Klooster <herm...@pi.net.nospam> wrote:
>
> >What does this say about Irma Grese? She was a sadistic lowlife and the
> >world is a better place without people (people?) like her.
>
> Irma was framed by the Allies with more sensationalized holohoax
> testimony.
Grese basically convicted herself.
> Hell, who wasn't framed by the pro-Soviet Allies,
Who was framed? Please cite these framed people. Who were "pro-Soviet Allies"?
However, Mr. Smith's mendacious ranting about "framed" Nazi war criminals
aside, to answer the question: all the Nazi war criminals convicted in
West German Courts.
> the same people who framed Germans for executing 15,000 Polish troops by
> shooting them all in the back of the head -- the signature execution
> of the Soviets?
And what about the German ammunition casings found in the graves? One can
esily suppose they were planted. However, one could just as easily suppose
that the Nazis imitated the Soviet execution style. The fact is that the
evidence at the time was circumstantial with just enough "anamolies" to
implicate either the Germans or the Russians.
> Of course, now we know the Soviets did them all.
Indeed we do. Didn't the Russians _admit_ they did it -some fifty years
later? And it was _suspected_ at Nuremberg that the Russians did too,
which is why the Soviet indictment against the defendants for Katyn was
left unresolved:
<begin quote>
...At the time there was no clear proof that the Soviets rather than the
Germans were to blame , but many thought so, and the Tribunal was handed
another hot potato. Wisely, the Tribunal allowed both the Russians and the
Germans to testify, but made no mention of the Kaytn massacres in their
opinions.
<end quote>
Source: Taylor, _The Anatomy of the Nuremberg Trials_, p.639.
> All it took to frame anyone in 1945 Europe was a simple accusation by any
> Jew, no matter how idiotic, false, or ridiculous.
Mr. Smith's anti-Semitic Nazi apologia aside, Grese _admitted_ to
brutalizing prisoners etc.
> Irma was one of the most gentle and beautiful creatures who ever lived.
Grese beat, set dogs on, brutalized, and helped select prisoners to be the
gas chammbers. It's all in the transcripts of the Belsen Trial.
[Mr. Smith's pathetic Nazi whining snipped]
Michael
On Sat, 14 Jun 1997 19:01:19 GMT, sbr...@micron.net (Brian Smith)
wrote:
>i...@usaor.net (Roger Hughes) wrote:
>
>>sbr...@micron.net (Brian Smith) writes:
>
>>:>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>
>>:>>Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must be
>>:>>the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
>
>>:>You would know Mark: you are the master of sticking things up your
>>:>ass, and discussing it in detail later!
>
>>Boy, this Van "All-Stink" is a real case.
>
>>I supect he's probably a real butt-kisser at work, and not for
>>promotions or raises, but just so he can always be near his favorite
>>object of interest.
>
>Alas, Mark did not earn his cognomen "Vain All-Stink" for nothing.
Brian: I understood Vain All-Stink is claiming to be the worlds first
lay doctor in proctology.
>http://www.kaiwan.com/~ihrgreg/ Greg Raven's Website
>http://www.webcom.com/~ezundel/english/welcome.html Zundelsite
>http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~lpauling/ Student Revisionist Resource Site
>http://www.webcom.com/ezundel/english/LEUCHTER/leuchtertoc.html
>http://www.codoh.com/irving/irving.html David Irving
>http://www.codoh.com/ Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust
>http://pubweb.acns.nwu.edu/~abutz/ Arthur R. Butz
>http://www.air-photo.com/ Air Photo Evidence (John Ball)
>http://www.adam.com.au/~fredadin/adins.html Adelaide Institute
>http://www.codoh.com/rudolf/rudreport/rudreport.html
>
>Brian Smith
>http://www.natall.com
>
>"A civilization which tolerates the existence of Kaplan and his filthy
>business should be burned to the ground." I said. "We should make
>a bonfire of the whole thing and then start over fresh "
>
>_The Turner Diaries_. p. 85
>
>>-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
> \|/ Towards a New Consciousness. \|/
> | A New Future. |
> A New People.
>>.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
>
natio...@juno.com
Michael
"http://www.natall.com"
National Vanguard Books
P.O. Box 330
Hillsboro, WV 24946
"No man has come to true greatness who has not felt
in some degree that his life belongs to his race."
----Phillips Brooks
Chuck Ferree
Chuck wrote: (for Michael the un-cherry)
Brian and Roger want you to join them, sweety. A three-some! Matt be
sure to get some video of this action.
Michael wrote:
>
> On Sat, 14 Jun 1997 19:01:19 GMT, sbr...@micron.net (Brian Smith)
> wrote:
>
> >i...@usaor.net (Roger Hughes) wrote:
CHUCK:>>>> Oh, Lordy, Lordy, what's this world coming to. The Old Army
was never like this. Guys & guys, guys & female soldiers, female
soldiers & other female soldiers, more guys & guys. In the "Old Army"
we had a Military Law...called Section Eight of the Military Code of
Rules. Any hanky-panky of any nature, natural or un-natural got you a
Section Eight discharge, which was not Honorable nor dis-Honorable,
just for the sickos and whackos. Brian, Michael and Roger definatley
would qualify, Samuels too probably.
Roger Hughes
In message <33A2B2...@rio.com> - Chuck Ferree <chu...@rio.com>
writes:
:>
:>Chuck Ferree wrote:
:>
:>
:>Yeah, but Matt Giwer is going around talking about you two guys and he
:>even says he has film of real nasty goings on.
:>
:>Brian and Roger...they make a real cute couple, swishing down the
blah, blah, blah
And this nonsense comes from somebody who admitted that he had a habit
of putting things up his you-know-what. In other words, Chucklehead is a
self-admitted pervert.
MOONING THE NIZKOOKS
( )( )
\ || /
ARCHIVE THIS NIZKOR!
Yours Truly,
Roger Hughes
Gord McFee
On 14 Jun 1997 00:27:01 GMT, Fafner13 wrote:
:>Danny Wrote:
:>
:>"Irma Grese, on how she used to beat Auschwitz inmates with a stick."
:>
:>Reply: How about this one?:
:>
:>JEWISH SETTLER BEATS PALESTINIAN CHILD TO DEATH
Which has precisely what to do with Irma Grese beating Auschwitz
inmates with a stick?
--
Gord McFee
I'll write no line before its time
Anthony Sabatini
Mark Van Alstine <mvan...@rbi.com> brayed in article
<mvanalst-140...@rbi143.rbi.com>...
> In article <5nuomn$g8f$1...@news01a.micron.net>, sbr...@micron.net (Brian
> >
> > >:>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
> >
> > >:>>Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must
be
> > >:>>the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
> >
> > >:>You would know Mark: you are the master of sticking things up your
> > >:>ass, and discussing it in detail later!
> >
> > >Boy, this Van "All-Stink" is a real case.
> >
> > >I supect he's probably a real butt-kisser at work, and not for
> > >promotions or raises, but just so he can always be near his favorite
> > >object of interest.
> >
> > Alas, Mark did not earn his cognomen "Vain All-Stink" for nothing.
>
> by showing him to be an anti-Semitic lying scubag Nazi apologist so many
> times; demolished his stupid lies and Nazi propaganda; and exposed him for
> ingorant and vile person he is that Mr. Smith has been reduced to a
> quivering Nazi puddle of jello only capable of making 2nd grade schoolyard
> taunts!
Um, no... You've earned the, er, privilege of the title with your continuing
penchant for making anal- and penile-related remarks. Are you dim-witted that
you didn't realize that?
> So, yes, I _do_ think I've earned it.
You have indeed earned it, but for the reason stated above.
> And proud of it too.
Are you sure?
> Maybe _now_
> I'll get the ZOG condo in Maui for a weekend....
Unlikely.
[same old slander and silly .sig snipped]
Mark Van Alstine (allegedly one Stuart Pidley) is, as far as I can tell, a
virulent spewer of mistruths, a slanderous serpent and has a most peculiar
interest for building demolition procedures, something which most honest
citizens do not share. His ranting, mewling and temper tantrums, along with
his foul verbiage and assorted excrement, can be found regularly in
alt.revisionism, one of his favorite haunts.
For more information on this misbegotten jackal-spawn, please see:
http://search.dejanews.com/profile.xp?author=van%20alstine%20mark
http://ftp.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi?people/v/van-alstine.mark
R. Samuels
Mark Van Alstine wrote:
>
> In article <5nuomn$g8f$1...@news01a.micron.net>, sbr...@micron.net (Brian
> Smith) wrote:
>
> > i...@usaor.net (Roger Hughes) wrote:
> >
> > >sbr...@micron.net (Brian Smith) writes:
> >
> > >:>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
> >
> > >:>>Obviously Mr. Samuels has a fetish for sticking things up his ass. Must be
> > >:>>the "in" thing for Nazis these days....
> >
> > >:>You would know Mark: you are the master of sticking things up your
> > >:>ass, and discussing it in detail later!
> >
> > >Boy, this Van "All-Stink" is a real case.
> >
> > >I supect he's probably a real butt-kisser at work, and not for
> > >promotions or raises, but just so he can always be near his favorite
> > >object of interest.
> >
> > Alas, Mark did not earn his cognomen "Vain All-Stink" for nothing.
>
> Indeed! Through diligent and tireless effort, I have embarrassed Mr. Smith
> by showing him to be an anti-Semitic lying scubag Nazi apologist so many
> times; demolished his stupid lies and Nazi propaganda; and exposed him for
> ingorant and vile person he is that Mr. Smith has been reduced to a
> quivering Nazi puddle of jello only capable of making 2nd grade schoolyard
>
> So, yes, I _do_ think I've earned it. And proud of it too. Maybe _now_
> I'll get the ZOG condo in Maui for a weekend....[Good, are you meeting your boyfriend?]
>
>
> please peruse DejaNews and visit the Holohugger Project at:
R. Samuels
Chuck "whiteman wannabe" Ferree wrote:
>
> R. Samuels wrote:
> >
> > > In article <339F76...@hotmail.com>, rsam...@hotmail.com wrote:
> > >
> > > > ChuckF666 "the beast" wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > SAMUELS.....
> > > > >
> > > > > STICK IT IN YOUR EAR!
> > > >
> > > > Chuck.........STICK IT UP YOUR ASS!
> > >
>
> skinny little ass. With a baseball bat too. Read this, you highly intelligent person:
>
> Subject:
> Re: Irma Grese-A German Heroine
> Date:
> 12 Jun 1997 19:24:30 GMT
> From:
> <irrelevant, commie shit erased>
> Chuck "the loudmouthed schmuck" Ferree
>
> THEY SENT THE ENTIRE JEWISH POPULATION
> POOL! SOME VACATION THEY HAD CHUCK WAS THERE
> PLAYING THE VIOLIN. [violin music anyone?]
>
> > >
> > > Mark "my friends just call me stinky" Alswine
Laura Finsten
On Sun, 15 Jun 1997, Brian Smith wrote:
> Archive THIS, Nizkook!
>
> ( )( )
> \ | | /
>
> MOONING the Nizkor Camera
You really ought to get help for this little, well, problem, Bri. Must be
painful. Maybe that's why you're so cranky.
Fafner13
He also might want to rent: Ise: She Wolf of the SS. Sounds like
Leitner and Olga wrote the script. Don't forget "Night Porter" as well,
along with those salacious scenes from Swindler's List.
Fafner13
Right Mark, the Soviets never tortured anyone. So what do you have to say
about what happened to your hero--Raoul Wallenberg? Hypocrite.
Fafner13
This is grand! Mark Van Alstine, Lord and Master of Anal-related Remarks,
accuses someone else of the same! ROTFLOL! Interested persons may peruse
Deja
News for evidence of Markie-pooh's anal and penile fixation, wherein it is
proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.
Comment: I heard that Mark graduated from the thermometer to enema tubes
a long time ago, and the excess keeps trickling out onto AR.
Fafner13
>JEWISH SETTLER BEATS PALESTINIAN CHILD TO DEATH
Which has precisely what to do with Irma Grese beating Auschwitz
inmates with a stick?
--The former is true and the latter is false, or at least misrepresented.
Fafner13
Mark should simply refer to "Man's Adventures" magazine, which is replete
with similar stories, along with nudie pics. He also might wish to reb
Mike Curtis
fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
>Mark should simply refer to "Man's Adventures" magazine, which is replete
>with similar stories, along with nudie pics. He also might wish to reb
And this refutes what Mark and I are posting in exactly what way,
Bellinger?
Mike Curtis
Nizkor (USA) - An Electronic Holocaust Educational Resource
Anonymous ftp: http://ftp.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/
European mirror: http://www1.de.nizkor.org/~nizkor/
Nizkor Web: http://www.nizkor.org/ (Under construction - permanently!)
Mike Curtis
fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
This does what for historical discussion, Bellinger? Is it easier to
argue ad hominem rather than with substance?
I hear that childish wail, Well, he does it too! Wrong answer.
ChuckF2323
The question re, the USS Liberty has been answered, check out Dja News.
And, Michael, get a life.
WHEN THE NAZIS INVADED HUNGARY IN 1944
THEY SENT THE ENTIRE JEWISH POPULATION
Anthony Sabatini
Mike Curtis <mi...@aimetering.com> wrote in article
<33a77733....@news.zilker.net>...
> fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
>
> >This is grand! Mark Van Alstine, Lord and Master of Anal-related Remarks,
> >accuses someone else of the same! ROTFLOL! Interested persons may peruse
> >Deja
> >News for evidence of Markie-pooh's anal and penile fixation, wherein it is
> >proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.
> >
> >
> >Comment: I heard that Mark graduated from the thermometer to enema tubes
> >a long time ago, and the excess keeps trickling out onto AR.
>
> This does what for historical discussion, Bellinger? Is it easier to
> argue ad hominem rather than with substance?
>
> I hear that childish wail, Well, he does it too! Wrong answer.
Oh shut up, you sanctimonious hypocrite! When have we ever seen you castigate
Van Alstine, for example, for his various 'romps' around this newsgroup? You
are quick to pounce of revisionists with haughty airs, but nary a word escapes
your keyboard when one of your fellow travelers goes on a rampage.
Hypocrite.
[.sig snipped]
Mike Curtis
fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
She admitted doing this, Bellinger, or did you forget?
Mike Curtis
E-mail mcu...@inetport.com
Nizkor Web: http://www.nizkor.org/
Mark Van Alstine
In article
<Pine.SOL.3.96.970615...@mcmail.CIS.McMaster.CA>, Laura
Finsten <fin...@mcmail.CIS.McMaster.CA> wrote:
Indeed. Mr. Smith's should see his physician about his undescended
testicles. Unless, of course, given Mr. Smith's ball-less behavior, he is
a eunuch....
For those interested in proof of National Alliance member Mr. Smith's
rabid anti-Semitism, pathological Nazi apologia, lies, and utter hypocrisy
-and that he possses an IQ of a fence post (not to mention a sewer mouth)
please peruse DejaNews and visit the Nizkor Project at:
http://www.dejanews.com/
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/s/smith.brian.r
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/s/stele.kurt
Mark
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Gradually it was disclosed to me that the line separating good and evil passes
not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties--but
right through every human heart--and all human hearts."
-- Alexander Solzhenitsyn, "The Gulag Archipelago"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Fafner13
To Mr. Curtis: Yes, she did admit striking people, but not beating them
to death. Or did you forget? I doubt whether such blows from a 100 lb
woman using a cellophane whip could compare to Israeli police using
baseball bats on captured Palestinians. You also neglected to include WHY
she struck prisoners on occasion, and her replies were, I believe:
1. To maintain order among hunfreds of unruly inmates in problem
situations
2. When a thief was discovered who bullied other inmates or stole their
food rations, boots or clothing.
This is why I stated it was misrepresented.
Fafner13
Looks like I need to brush up on my typing skills--"hunfreds?"
R. Samuels
Chuck Ferree wrote:
>
> Chuck wrote: (for Michael the un-cherry)
>
> Brian and Roger want you to join them, sweety. A three-some! Matt be
> sure to get some video of this action.
>
> Michael wrote:
> >
> was never like this. Guys & guys, guys & female soldiers, female
> soldiers & other female soldiers, more guys & guys. In the "Old Army"
> we had a Military Law...called Section Eight of the Military Code of
> Rules. Any hanky-panky of any nature, natural or un-natural got you a
> Section Eight discharge, which was not Honorable nor dis-Honorable,
> would qualify, {most of my friends} too probably.
[Chuck should know, he got a section 8. I guess you're a sicko and a
whacko, huh Chuck?
Thanks for coming out of the closet Chuck! Now, go to a homo newsgroup
where you'll be right at home.]
Mike Curtis
fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
Let's consider her statements wich were admitted as evidence.
page 711 of _The Belsen Trial_:
I have never beaten or kicked any prisoners.
[Later she said:]
I. I have said in a previous statement that I have never beaten or
ill-treated prisoners. I have thought it over and now wish to confess
that I have done so and to tell the truth.
[ . . .]
3. While at Auschwitz I struck female prisoners on the face with my
hand for using Dixies as latrine buckets. . . . I myself did not
strike prisoners often, but quite frequently when they did something I
didn't like.
[ . . .]
5. I have been sown photograph B.U. 3746, showing a woman with bad
scars on her face which I believe to have been caused by beating with
a stick. I have never seen such a thing happen at Belsen, but I have
definately seen Unterscharführer Tauber beat people in this way at
Auschwitz. He did it with a stick.
6. I have again reflected and I wish to add that I have, in fact,
beaten prisoners other than with my hand as already described. This
was at Auschwitz, when for at least a week several of us S.S. women
had short whips made in the camp workshops, wit one of which I several
times struck prisoners before these whips were taken away from us as
authorized. Arms are never carried or possessed by any S.S. women.
[ . . .]
9. I know about the gas chamber at Auschwitz because prisoners who
worked in it told us about it. I only saw it myself from a distance,
but I have no doubt that many were gassed there.
[ . . .]
[Later she testified:]
1. On further reflection I wish to say that in three respects the
statements I made in my previous deposition were not accurate. First
of all I previously stated that I never carried arms. In fact
Aufseherinnen at Auschwitz did carry pistols, I among them. . . .
Second, when I stated that the only time I used a weapon to beat
prisoners was when I had a whip for a week; this was untrue. I did, in
fact, always have a wip which I used consistently whenever necessary.
Third, I admit that there was also a walking-stick which we kept in
the Lagerältester's room and which, although it was unauthorized, we
frequently used to beat prisoners. I usually used to beat them on the
shoulders, but there were times when, because of the numbers involved,
they were beaten on any part of the body that happened to be easiest.
. . . .
<end quotes>
Her further reflections occurred during her trial testimony.
Gord McFee
In message <33a6d5f...@news.inetport.com> - mcu...@inetport.com
(Mike Curtis) writes:
:>
:>fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
:>
:>>>JEWISH SETTLER BEATS PALESTINIAN CHILD TO DEATH
:>>
:>>Which has precisely what to do with Irma Grese beating Auschwitz
:>>inmates with a stick?
:>>
:>>
:>>--The former is true and the latter is false, or at least misrepresented.
:>
:>She admitted doing this, Bellinger, or did you forget?
No, he didn't forget. Next he will claim that she was tortured by
Russians who crushed her testicles. When someone explains that that is
somewhat difficult to believe, he will post a one-liner such as "I
disagree".
Fafner13
To Gord McFee, who mumbled something about one-liners and offered to reply
for me:
Have you read any of your own posts lately, Gord. They might qualifiy as
half-liners.
Mike Curtis
"Anthony Sabatini" <anth...@infobahnos.com> wrote:
>Mike Curtis <mi...@aimetering.com> wrote in article
><33a77733....@news.zilker.net>...
>> fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
>>
>> >This is grand! Mark Van Alstine, Lord and Master of Anal-related Remarks,
>> >accuses someone else of the same! ROTFLOL! Interested persons may peruse
>> >Deja
>> >News for evidence of Markie-pooh's anal and penile fixation, wherein it is
>> >proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.
>> >
>> >
>> >Comment: I heard that Mark graduated from the thermometer to enema tubes
>> >a long time ago, and the excess keeps trickling out onto AR.
>>
>> This does what for historical discussion, Bellinger? Is it easier to
>> argue ad hominem rather than with substance?
>>
>> I hear that childish wail, Well, he does it too! Wrong answer.
>
>Oh shut up, you sanctimonious hypocrite!
Ewww, Sabatini _is_ getting all worked up protecting Bellinger.
> When have we ever seen you castigate
>Van Alstine, for example, for his various 'romps' around this newsgroup?
Mark can verify this also but he and I spoke face to face about his
tactics. We agreed that his tactics are not my tactics. Fortunately we
are all individuals and really have no control over what each of us
says in this group. I've told you the latter before.
> You
>are quick to pounce of revisionists with haughty airs, but nary a word escapes
>your keyboard when one of your fellow travelers goes on a rampage.
Actually before you wrote this I've written emails to Gord and Chuck.
I have come to the conclusion that though we disagree they are their
own persons. I have no control over what they do, Sabatini. But I
rarely feel the need to air my disappointments with them on the board.
I can't do that in email and they'll respond back. I can't really do
that with you guys because I'll get answers back just like what you
posted here. Maybe you should take care of your house for yourself and
I'll take care of mine.
>Hypocrite.
Prove it.
Mark Van Alstine
> "Anthony Sabatini" <anth...@infobahnos.com> wrote:
>
> >Mike Curtis <mi...@aimetering.com> wrote in article
> ><33a77733....@news.zilker.net>...
> >> fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
> >>
> >> >This is grand! Mark Van Alstine, Lord and Master of Anal-related Remarks,
> >> >accuses someone else of the same! ROTFLOL! Interested persons may peruse
> >> >Deja
> >> >News for evidence of Markie-pooh's anal and penile fixation, wherein it is
> >> >proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >Comment: I heard that Mark graduated from the thermometer to enema tubes
> >> >a long time ago, and the excess keeps trickling out onto AR.
> >>
> >> This does what for historical discussion, Bellinger? Is it easier to
> >> argue ad hominem rather than with substance?
> >>
> >> I hear that childish wail, Well, he does it too! Wrong answer.
> >
> >Oh shut up, you sanctimonious hypocrite!
>
> Ewww, Sabatini _is_ getting all worked up protecting Bellinger.
It's dirty job, but somebody has to do it....
> > When have we ever seen you castigate
> >Van Alstine, for example, for his various 'romps' around this newsgroup?
>
> Mark can verify this also but he and I spoke face to face about his
> tactics. We agreed that his tactics are not my tactics.
Yup. Mr. Curtis is a far more tactful person than I when it comes to
addressing anti-Semitic lying scumbag Nazi apologists.
> Fortunately we are all individuals and really have no control over what each
> of us says in this group. I've told you the latter before.
Obviously then the concepts of individualism and free speech sends the two
overworked neurons between "Mr. Sabatini's" ears into fibrallations.
> > You are quick to pounce of revisionists with haughty airs, but nary a word
> > escapes your keyboard when one of your fellow travelers goes on a rampage.
>
> Actually before you wrote this I've written emails to Gord and Chuck.
> I have come to the conclusion that though we disagree they are their
> own persons. I have no control over what they do, Sabatini. But I
> rarely feel the need to air my disappointments with them on the board.
> I can't do that in email and they'll respond back. I can't really do
> that with you guys because I'll get answers back just like what you
> posted here. Maybe you should take care of your house for yourself and
> I'll take care of mine.
>
> >Hypocrite.
>
> Prove it.
Mike Curtis
chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF2323) wrote:
>Mike, thanks and I do respect you and your style.
>
>Watch me on alt. re. & see if I do better. If I do say so, if I don't say
>so too.
>
Right now I have Sabatini claiming that I don't comment on what others
"in my circle" are doing. Gee ask Gordon if I haven't done this quite
often. I think I finally got tired of all the name-calling.
Roger Hughes
In message <19970619045...@ladder01.news.aol.com> -
chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF2323) writes:
:>
:>Mike, thanks and I do respect you and your style.
:>Watch me on alt. re. & see if I do better. If I do say so, if I don't say
:>so too.
What's the matter, Chucklehead, did some of your Nizkook buddies
criticize you for your homosexual trolling on AR?
MOONING THE NIZKOOKS
( )( )
\ || /
ARCHIVE THIS!
Regards,
Roger Hughes
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Towards a New Consciousness; a New Order; a New People
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
http://www.natall.com
http://www.natvan.com
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Roger's Page http://www.usaor.net/users/ipm/
Keep It White Because You Know It's Right!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Abusive emails will be posted to the Usenet and ridiculed.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
ChuckF2323
Mike, thanks and I do respect you and your style.
Watch me on alt. re. & see if I do better. If I do say so, if I don't say
so too.
Best,
Chuck Ferree
Mike Curtis
mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
Sabatini:
>> >Oh shut up, you sanctimonious hypocrite!
>>
Mike Curtis:
>> Ewww, Sabatini _is_ getting all worked up protecting Bellinger.
>
Mark:
>It's dirty job, but somebody has to do it....
I'm waiting for Sabatini to read that Sabatini Calls Me A liar thread.
He seems so darn quiet. Maybe he broke a blood vessel pounding so hard
on the keyboard?
Sabatini:
>> > When have we ever seen you castigate
>> >Van Alstine, for example, for his various 'romps' around this newsgroup?
>>
Mike Curtis:
>> Mark can verify this also but he and I spoke face to face about his
>> tactics. We agreed that his tactics are not my tactics.
Mark:
>Yup. Mr. Curtis is a far more tactful person than I when it comes to
>addressing anti-Semitic lying scumbag Nazi apologists.
LOL! Say, Mark, do you have the phrase "anti-Semitic lying scumbag
Nazi apologists" hot-keyed?
>> Fortunately we are all individuals and really have no control over what each
>> of us says in this group. I've told you the latter before.
>
>Obviously then the concepts of individualism and free speech sends the two
>overworked neurons between "Mr. Sabatini's" ears into fibrallations.
Don't forget that they actually think folks who disagree with them are
ZOG or something so powerful they can't comprehend it.
Brian Smith
mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
><begin quote>
>During the "selections," the "blonde Angel of Belsen," as she was later
>called by the press, made liberal use of her whip. She slashed wherever
>she wished, and we endured as well as we could. Our shrielfs of pain and
>our spurts of blood made her smile. What faultless, pearly teeth she had!
"Oi vey! Vat a great script this will be! Spielboig vill love it!"
[holohoax snipped]
Archive THIS, Nizkook!
( )( )
\ | | /
MOONING the Nizkor Camera!
http://www.kaiwan.com/~ihrgreg/ Greg Raven's Website
http://www.webcom.com/~ezundel/english/welcome.html Zundelsite
http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~lpauling/ Student Revisionist Resource Site
http://www.webcom.com/ezundel/english/LEUCHTER/leuchtertoc.html
http://www.codoh.com/irving/irving.html David Irving
http://www.codoh.com/ Committee for Open Debate on the Holocaust
http://pubweb.acns.nwu.edu/~abutz/ Arthur R. Butz
http://www.air-photo.com/ Air Photo Evidence (John Ball)
http://www.adam.com.au/~fredadin/adins.html Adelaide Institute
http://www.codoh.com/rudolf/rudreport/rudreport.html
Brian Smith
http://www.natall.com
"A civilization which tolerates the existence of Kaplan and his filthy
business should be burned to the ground." I said. "We should make
a bonfire of the whole thing and then start over fresh "
_The Turner Diaries_. p. 85
>-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
\|/ Towards a New Consciousness. \|/
| A New Future. |
A New People.
>.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Fafner13
Mr. Curtis, I believe I have always been courteous to you in e-mail
correspondence. Undoubtedly Mr. Sabatini jumped in on the post simply
because it was the decent thing to do.
Mark Van Alstine
> mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>
>
> Sabatini:
> >> >Oh shut up, you sanctimonious hypocrite!
> >>
>
> Mike Curtis:
> >> Ewww, Sabatini _is_ getting all worked up protecting Bellinger.
> >
>
> Mark:
> >It's dirty job, but somebody has to do it....
>
> I'm waiting for Sabatini to read that Sabatini Calls Me A liar thread.
> He seems so darn quiet. Maybe he broke a blood vessel pounding so hard
> on the keyboard?
More like a bruised forehead from banging his head against a wall in
frustration due to his incompetance.
> Sabatini:
> >> > When have we ever seen you castigate
> >> >Van Alstine, for example, for his various 'romps' around this newsgroup?
> >>
>
> Mike Curtis:
> >> Mark can verify this also but he and I spoke face to face about his
> >> tactics. We agreed that his tactics are not my tactics.
>
> Mark:
> >Yup. Mr. Curtis is a far more tactful person than I when it comes to
> >addressing anti-Semitic lying scumbag Nazi apologists.
>
> LOL! Say, Mark, do you have the phrase "anti-Semitic lying scumbag
> Nazi apologists" hot-keyed?
You betcha! };->
> >> Fortunately we are all individuals and really have no control over what
> >> each of us says in this group. I've told you the latter before.
> >
> >Obviously then the concepts of individualism and free speech sends the two
> >overworked neurons between "Mr. Sabatini's" ears into fibrallations.
>
> Don't forget that they actually think folks who disagree with them are
> ZOG or something so powerful they can't comprehend it.
That hardly come as a suprise from folks who are dumb-struck with trying
to their shoeslaces together.
Brian Smith
Blah blah, blah! Two idiotic Nizkooks babbling to each other.
[crap snipped]
Michael
On Thu, 19 Jun 1997 22:55:35 GMT, mcu...@inetport.com (Mike Curtis)
wrote:
>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
<snip>
Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
Cute!
natio...@juno.com
Michael
"http://www.natall.com"
National Vanguard Books
P.O. Box 330
Hillsboro, WV 24946
"No man has come to true greatness who has not felt
in some degree that his life belongs to his race."
----Phillips Brooks
Gord McFee
In <33b81ace...@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
>On Thu, 19 Jun 1997 22:55:35 GMT, mcu...@inetport.com (Mike Curtis)
>wrote:
>>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
><snip>
>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
>Cute!
At least they provide some added value.
--
Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net>
Mark Van Alstine
> In <33b81ace...@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
> at 12:06 AM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
>
> >On Thu, 19 Jun 1997 22:55:35 GMT, mcu...@inetport.com (Mike Curtis)
> >wrote:
>
> >>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
> ><snip>
>
> >Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
> >Cute!
>
> At least they provide some added value.
Indeed. Like from the deposition of Helena Kopper:
<begin quote>
...Whilst Grese was in charge of the working partiy she alsways carried a
rubber truncheon. She was repsonsible for at least 30 deaths a day,
resulting from her orders to cross the wire, but many more on occasions.
It was always my job, ordered by Grese, to count the dead, and I, together
with some other women, used to load the bodies into one of the railway
wagons after working hours. The bodies were subsequently removed by
ambulance. I know of two women who helped me on occasions; there names are
Canina Stasicka and Karola Mikot. I saw them last on 8th June, 1945, in
Belsen Camp. Both are Polish Aryans. Their Auschwitz numbers tatooed on
their arms are 18.565 and 18.566. I do not know which of them had which
number. Both had lived at Cracow. I know the name of one internee who was
shot by a guard when ordered to cross the wire. It was Anna Gutterwiess of
Czecrowies, near Cracow. In fact, I wrote to her son to tell him that his
mother had died. It is possible that the orders to cross the wire were not
in every case given by Grese, because the Kapos used to try it, but it is
alsmost certain that Grese was responsible in almost every case.
<end quote>
Source: Phillips, _The Belsen Trial_, p.706.
Michael
On Sat, 21 Jun 97 11:00:44, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
>In <33b81ace...@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
> at 12:06 AM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
>>On Thu, 19 Jun 1997 22:55:35 GMT, mcu...@inetport.com (Mike Curtis)
>>wrote:
>>>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>><snip>
>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
>>Cute!
>At least they provide some added value.
>Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net>
>I'll write no line before its time
It would be consistent with the effeminate nature of Nizkooks to
consider their frolicking both "cute" and of "value".
Mike Curtis
Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
>In <33b81ace...@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
> at 12:06 AM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
>
>>On Thu, 19 Jun 1997 22:55:35 GMT, mcu...@inetport.com (Mike Curtis)
>>wrote:
>
>>>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>><snip>
>
>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
>>Cute!
>
>At least they provide some added value.
Is Michael still here? My killfile seems to be working well. :-)
Michael
On Sat, 21 Jun 1997 10:01:52 -0700, mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van
Alstine) wrote:
<snipped entire Holocaust(tm) apology>
Sources like War Crime Trials don't always wash Van Alstink. It may be
part of your hypnotic trance to believe every deposition ever made
that supports your passion (the Holocaust(tm) ) but the conditions
and rules of evidence of the Court is the authenticating standard. Try
applying a 'reasonable' standard like the criminal courts had up until
and after the War Crime trials and you can throw away probably around
95% of your sources.
"Archive" THIS, Nizkook!
( )( )
\ || /
MOONING the Nizkor Camera!
Gord McFee
In <33a91d48...@news.zilker.net>, on 06/19/97
at 11:53 AM, mi...@aimetering.com (Mike Curtis) said:
>chuck...@aol.com (ChuckF2323) wrote:
>>Mike, thanks and I do respect you and your style.
>>
>>Watch me on alt. re. & see if I do better. If I do say so, if I don't say
>>so too.
>>
>Right now I have Sabatini claiming that I don't comment on what others
>"in my circle" are doing. Gee ask Gordon if I haven't done this quite
>often. I think I finally got tired of all the name-calling.
Err... I think it would be safe to say that you have done exactly that.
The problem, Mike, is that those guys are ordered to say the same thing
and repeat the same lines. The concept of discussion, even civil
disagreement, is foreign to them. That is why your plea for something
bordering on discussion of *history* goes virtually ignored.
--
Gord McFee
Gord McFee
In <33ac269...@news.inetport.com>, on 06/21/97
at 07:08 PM, mcu...@inetport.com (Mike Curtis) said:
:>Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
:>>In <33b81ace...@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
:>> at 12:06 AM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
:>>
:>>>On Thu, 19 Jun 1997 22:55:35 GMT, mcu...@inetport.com (Mike Curtis)
:>>>wrote:
:>>
:>>>>mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
:>>><snip>
:>>
:>>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
:>>>Cute!
:>>
:>>At least they provide some added value.
:>Is Michael still here? My killfile seems to be working well. :-)
He was talking about Mike Stein. I hope you don't have *him* in your
killfile. :-)
Mark Van Alstine
In article <5oacef$mro$1...@news01a.micron.net>, sbr...@micron.net (Brian
Smith) wrote:
> mvan...@rbi.com (Mark Van Alstine) wrote:
>
> ><begin quote>
>
> >During the "selections," the "blonde Angel of Belsen," as she was later
> >called by the press, made liberal use of her whip. She slashed wherever
> >she wished, and we endured as well as we could. Our shrielfs of pain and
> >our spurts of blood made her smile. What faultless, pearly teeth she had!
>
> "Oi vey! Vat a great script this will be! Spielboig vill love it!"
Indeed. Such clearly highlights the sadism of Nazis like Grese. Murderous
sadism by Grese as reported in the following by Helena Kopper:
<begin quote>
...I was also in the punishment company and, during the time that Grese
was in charge when working outside, we were employed outside the camp in
the sand-pit. There were 700-800 women working in this company, some of
them were detailed to dig sand and fill iron trucks with sand, and others
had to push these trucks along a narrow guage railway. The place in which
we worked was surrounded by a strand of wire about three to four feet high
and we were not aloowied to go outside this wire boundry. There were
twelve guards placed at intervals around the wire. It was the practice of
Grese to pick out cerain of the Jewish women prisoners and order them to
get something from the other side of the wire. She always worked with
interpreters. When the prisoners approached the wire they were challenged
by the guard, but as Grese picked out non-Germans, they did not understand
the order and walked on and were shot....
<end quote>
Source: Phillips, _The Belsen Trial_, pp.705-706.
[Mr. Smith's Nazi-doodles sniopped]
For those interested in proof of National Alliance member Mr. Smith's
rabid anti-Semitism, pathological Nazi apologia, lies, and utter hypocrisy
-and that he possses an IQ of a fence post (not to mention a sewer mouth)
please peruse DejaNews and visit the Nizkor Project at:
http://www.dejanews.com/
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/s/smith.brian.r
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/s/stele.kurt
ChuckF2323
Irma Grese was a female SS Nazi camp guard, who brutalized innocent women
and children. She was a whore, a slut and a criminal. Those were the only
type of women allowed to become SS guards.
She was executed for war crimes.
Gord McFee
In <33ad07d1....@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
at 05:00 PM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
:>On Sat, 21 Jun 97 11:00:44, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
[deleted]
:>>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
:>>>Cute!
:>>At least they provide some added value.
:>It would be consistent with the effeminate nature of Nizkooks to
:>consider their frolicking both "cute" and of "value".
Well, first of all, it wasn't one of us who said "cute". It was one of
yours. Way to start off, "Mikey", wrong again.
In addition, a bunch of guys who run around drawing pictures of their bums
and posting them to Usenet, are hardly in a position to call anyone else
"effeminate".
Why *are* you advertising your bum all over Usenet, "Mikey"?
Mark Van Alstine
> In <33ad07d1....@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
> at 05:00 PM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
>
> :>On Sat, 21 Jun 97 11:00:44, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
>
> [deleted]
>
> :>>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
> :>>>Cute!
>
> :>>At least they provide some added value.
>
>
> :>It would be consistent with the effeminate nature of Nizkooks to
> :>consider their frolicking both "cute" and of "value".
>
> Well, first of all, it wasn't one of us who said "cute". It was one of
> yours. Way to start off, "Mikey", wrong again.
>
> In addition, a bunch of guys who run around drawing pictures of their bums
> and posting them to Usenet, are hardly in a position to call anyone else
> "effeminate".
Especially when they are bent over and grabbing their ankles....
> Why *are* you advertising your bum all over Usenet, "Mikey"?
Probably for the same reason dogs lick their crotch.
Hilary Ostrov
On Wed, 25 Jun 97 18:57:21, in <33b1d...@news2.ibm.net>, Gord McFee
<gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
>In <33ad07d1....@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
> at 05:00 PM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
>
[snip]
>In addition, a bunch of guys who run around drawing pictures of their bums
>and posting them to Usenet, are hardly in a position to call anyone else
>"effeminate".
>
>Why *are* you advertising your bum all over Usenet, "Mikey"?
Gee, Gord, maybe the poor sod is just compelled to march to a
different bummer.
But you knew that - or at least you would, if you hadn't lost your
decoder ring - again ;>)
hro
=====================
Hilary Ostrov
E-mail: hos...@uniserve.com
WWW: http://users.uniserve.com/~hostrov/
The Nizkor Project http://www.nizkor.org/
Gord McFee
In <33b36fb8...@news.uniserve.com>, on 06/27/97
at 09:10 AM, hos...@uniserve.com (Hilary Ostrov) said:
:>On Wed, 25 Jun 97 18:57:21, in <33b1d...@news2.ibm.net>, Gord McFee
:><gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
:>>In <33ad07d1....@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
:>> at 05:00 PM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
:>>
:>[snip]
:>>In addition, a bunch of guys who run around drawing pictures of their bums
:>>and posting them to Usenet, are hardly in a position to call anyone else
:>>"effeminate".
:>>
:>>Why *are* you advertising your bum all over Usenet, "Mikey"?
:>Gee, Gord, maybe the poor sod is just compelled to march to a different
:>bummer.
ROTFL!
:>But you knew that - or at least you would, if you hadn't lost your
:>decoder ring - again ;>)
Yeah. Every time I think I have it figured out, the damn thing
disappears.
Gord McFee
In <33ac4c20....@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
at 09:54 PM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
:>Sources like War Crime Trials don't always wash Van Alstink. It may be
:>part of your hypnotic trance to believe every deposition ever made that
:>supports your passion (the Holocaust(tm) ) but the conditions and rules
:>of evidence of the Court is the authenticating standard. Try applying a
:>'reasonable' standard like the criminal courts had up until and after
:>the War Crime trials and you can throw away probably around 95% of your
:>sources.
Based on what, "Mikey"? Simply the fact that you say so? Perhaps you
should rad up on standards of admissibility of evidence and authentication
of evidence, rather than simply parroting the Nazi line you are ordered to
parrot.
Mark Van Alstine
Speaking of depositions, here's another one. From the deposition of Edith
Treiger:
<begin quote>
...In August, 1944, I saw this women Grese at Auschwitz shoot a Hungarian
Jewiss who was aged about 30 years. I saw this incident from my block. At
this time a transport of prisoners was arriving at the camp by train, and
when prisoners arrived all prisoners in the camp were confined to their
blocks. The Hungarian woman stood outside the block watching the transport
arrive, when Grese approached the woman on her bicycle. She stopped, got
off her bicycle, about five neters away from the woman, and shouted to the
woman, "Get in your block." Then, without giving the woman an opportunity
to go to her blkock, Grese produced a revolver from a holster she was
carrying, aimed at the woman and fired. The woman fell to the ground and
stayed there unconscious. Grese rode away on her bicycle, leaving the
woman there. I saw all this occur from a distance of about 50 meters.
After about a quarter of an hour the transport passed by and Grese
dissapeared from view. I then went to the woman who had been and found
that she had a bullet-hole through the left breast. I pulled her clothes
open and saw the hole where the bullet had penetrated and left the body.
There was a pool of blood on the ground and the woman's clothing was
soaked in blood. The woman was dead. I am quite certain of this, as I put
a mirror to the woman's mouth to test whether she was breathing and it did
not cloud over. After satisfying myself that the woman was actually dead I
returned to my block. No one else came to see the body at that time as we
were still confined to out blocks. The body lay in the road for another
hour and then other prisoners came out and carried the body away to a spot
behind a hut and covered it with a blanket. I did not see the body after
that.
<end quote>
Source: Phillips, _The Belsen Trial_, p.689-690.
Fafner13
Your "witness" is a liar. Who was this woman? What was her name? And
where is the document which proves that Irma Grese, a lowly Aufseherin,
was empowered to arbitrarily shoot people to death without having to
answer to legitimate German authorities, both within the camp itself as
well as to authorities in Berlin. The FACT is, permission had to be
obtained from Berlin in WRITING to simply apply corporal punishment upon
an inmate, and this had to proceed through proper channels fromthe office
of the commandant, and this woman is telling us that one person of lowly
rank could shoot people to death on a whim? She is a liar, and you are
worse than a liar if you seriously expect people to believe this nonsense.
Michael
On Wed, 25 Jun 97 18:57:21, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
In <33ad07d1....@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
at 05:00 PM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
>:>On Sat, 21 Jun 97 11:00:44, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
>[deleted]
>:>>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
>:>>>Cute!
>:>>At least they provide some added value.
>:>It would be consistent with the effeminate nature of Nizkooks to
>:>consider their frolicking both "cute" and of "value".
>Well, first of all, it wasn't one of us who said "cute". It was one of
>yours. Way to start off, "Mikey", wrong again.
And tell us oh Enlightened Maggot where I attributed 'cute' to one of
you.
>In addition, a bunch of guys who run around drawing pictures of their bums
>and posting them to Usenet, are hardly in a position to call anyone else
>"effeminate".
Mooning neanderthals such as you and the Nizkooks is an appropriate
and traditional expression of derision. You deserve worse, but it will
do.
>Why *are* you advertising your bum all over Usenet, "Mikey"?
One would thing that with your anal fixations you would appreciate the
Mooning the Nizkooks art. Just how long does it take you to break away
from your hypnotic fixation everytime you see this particular form of
giving you the finger?
>Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net>
>I'll write no line before its time
The whiner of Nizkook online
Gord McFee
In <33c20190...@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/29/97
at 06:39 AM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
:>On Wed, 25 Jun 97 18:57:21, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
:>In <33ad07d1....@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
:> at 05:00 PM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
:>>:>On Sat, 21 Jun 97 11:00:44, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
:>>[deleted]
:>>:>>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
:>>:>>>Cute!
:>>:>>At least they provide some added value.
:>>:>It would be consistent with the effeminate nature of Nizkooks to
:>>:>consider their frolicking both "cute" and of "value".
:>>Well, first of all, it wasn't one of us who said "cute". It was one of
:>>yours. Way to start off, "Mikey", wrong again.
:>And tell us oh Enlightened Maggot where I attributed 'cute' to one of
:>you.
How would I know, "Mikey"? *You* used the word, not me. I can only
deduce that it has something to do with you and "Roger" advertising your
bums all over the newsgroup. I hate to break it to you, but Mark and I
are not your type. We happen to be straight.
:>>In addition, a bunch of guys who run around drawing pictures of their bums
:>>and posting them to Usenet, are hardly in a position to call anyone else
:>>"effeminate".
:>Mooning neanderthals such as you and the Nizkooks is an appropriate and
:>traditional expression of derision. You deserve worse, but it will do.
Tough talk from a guy who shows his bum to all the world.
:>>Why *are* you advertising your bum all over Usenet, "Mikey"?
:>One would thing that with your anal fixations you would appreciate the
:>Mooning the Nizkooks art. Just how long does it take you to break away
:>from your hypnotic fixation everytime you see this particular form of
:>giving you the finger?
How long does it take you to recognize how stupid you look calling other
people gay, while all the time advertising your ass all over the Usenet,
"Mikey"?
God, you guys are losers.
--
Michael
On Sun, 29 Jun 97 21:37:09, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
In <33c20190...@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/29/97
at 06:39 AM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
On Wed, 25 Jun 97 18:57:21, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
In <33ad07d1....@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/21/97
at 05:00 PM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
On Sat, 21 Jun 97 11:00:44, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
>:>>[deleted]
>:>>:>>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
>:>>:>>>Cute!
>:>>:>>At least they provide some added value.
>:>>:>It would be consistent with the effeminate nature of Nizkooks to
>:>>:>consider their frolicking both "cute" and of "value".
>:>>Well, first of all, it wasn't one of us who said "cute". It was one of
>:>>yours. Way to start off, "Mikey", wrong again.
>:>And tell us oh Enlightened Maggot where I attributed 'cute' to one of
>:>you.
>How would I know, "Mikey"? *You* used the word, not me. I can only
>deduce that it has something to do with you and "Roger" advertising your
>bums all over the newsgroup. I hate to break it to you, but Mark and I
>are not your type. We happen to be straight.
Straight what, Gordo McWee Wee?
>:>>In addition, a bunch of guys who run around drawing pictures of their bums
>:>>and posting them to Usenet, are hardly in a position to call anyone else
>:>>"effeminate".
>:>Mooning neanderthals such as you and the Nizkooks is an appropriate and
>:>traditional expression of derision. You deserve worse, but it will do.
>Tough talk from a guy who shows his bum to all the world.
"Tough talk"? I'll bet you love it when Markey talks dirty to you.
>:>>Why *are* you advertising your bum all over Usenet, "Mikey"?
You are confused (hah, what's new?) between a symbol and the real
thing.
>:>One would thing that with your anal fixations you would appreciate the
>:>Mooning the Nizkooks art. Just how long does it take you to break away
>:>from your hypnotic fixation everytime you see this particular form of
>:>giving you the finger?
>How long does it take you to recognize how stupid you look calling other
>people gay, while all the time advertising your ass all over the Usenet,
>"Mikey"?
You are so pathetic, Gordo. I'll bet you are the type who watches TV
and forgets yourself and your surroundings because you are so easily
hypnotized and sucked into the trash coming from the boob tube.
You are equally ridiculous in confusing symbols of reality with
reality itself.
>God, you guys are losers.
Take all the consolation you need in that thought, McWee Wee.
<play on words from an old TV commercial snipped>
Jason Alexander McTavish
On 17 Jun 1997 18:34:42 GMT, fafn...@aol.com (Fafner13) wrote:
>Looks like I need to brush up on my typing skills--"hunfreds?"
Irma Grese was one hot, sexy vixen. I actually get turned on seriously
every time I see her picture- her standing confidently in her jack
boots. I give Lady McTavish a ride for her life after gazing upon
Irma. Sometimes Lady McTavish will vear her jack boots and gently whip
me with her riding crop. Lady McTavish really starts my engine when
she starts barking "Mach Schnell" in a voice that sounds like Gretchen
Krause on the old Benson TV show. I have attached Irma's picture below
for all to embrace. I have to go now I'm beginning to get over
stimulated! :-)
begin 644 grese.jpg
<uuencoded_portion_removed>
(XIK?>R,U_]EP
`
end
Gord McFee
In <33c55ba4...@news.hollinet.com>, on 06/30/97
at 07:20 AM, natio...@juno.com (Michael) said:
:>On Sun, 29 Jun 97 21:37:09, Gord McFee <gmc...@ibm.net> wrote:
:>>:>>[deleted]
:>>:>>:>>>Markey and Mikey frolicking on a.r.
:>>:>>:>>>Cute!
:>>:>>:>>At least they provide some added value.
:>>:>>:>It would be consistent with the effeminate nature of Nizkooks to
:>>:>>:>consider their frolicking both "cute" and of "value".
:>>:>>Well, first of all, it wasn't one of us who said "cute". It was one of
:>>:>>yours. Way to start off, "Mikey", wrong again.
:>>:>And tell us oh Enlightened Maggot where I attributed 'cute' to one of
:>>:>you.
:>>How would I know, "Mikey"? *You* used the word, not me. I can only
:>>deduce that it has something to do with you and "Roger" advertising your
:>>bums all over the newsgroup. I hate to break it to you, but Mark and I
:>>are not your type. We happen to be straight.
:>Straight what, Gordo McWee Wee?
I didn't think *you* would understand "straight".
Mark Van Alstine
In article <33B71B...@itsa.ucsf.edu>, Brian Harmon
<bra...@itsa.ucsf.edu> wrote:
> Fafner13 wrote:
> >
> > Your "witness" is a liar.
>
> Ah yes. haven't we heard this before?
>
> Next comes the demands for every little detail on the source:
>
> > Who was this woman? What was her name? And
> [etc. etc. so on.]
>
> > The FACT is, permission had to be
> > obtained from Berlin in WRITING to simply apply corporal punishment upon
> > an inmate, and this had to proceed through proper channels fromthe office
> > of the commandant, and this woman is telling us that one person of lowly
> > rank could shoot people to death on a whim?
>
> Quite a few people _testified_ about maltreatment of prisoners at a
> number of camps, not just the guards who confessed to it.
People like Edith Treiger who, in her deposition at the Belsen Trial, said:
<begin quote>
I saw many selection in Camp C at Auschwitz and Grese was invariably
present. At the smaller ones I have seen Grese sort out the weaker women
and send them off for removal to the gas chamber. I have also seen Grese
beating women prisoners at the camp every day, sometimes with her hands,
sometimes with a rubber stick and sometimes kicking them.
<end quote>
Source: Phillips, _The Belsen Trial_, p.690.
> I assume you have a citation that you can _quote_ for us documenting
> your claim that one must receive written permission from Berlin to
> strike an inmate?
>
> (Sounds a bit odd eh? excuse me, this prisoner is trying to escape.
> quick! send a letter to berlin asking if we can hit him! )
Indeed! Perhaps Mr. Bellinger would then explain the following:
<begin quote>
July 6 [1940]
Polish prisoner Tadeusz Weijowski, born May 4, 1914, in Kolaczyce near
Kracow, escapes from the camp. This is the first escape from Auschwitz.
The escape is discovered during the evening roll call. A punishment roll
call is ordered that last from 6:00 in the evening of July 6 until 2:00 in
the afternoon on July 7- 20 hours. The entire time, SS men walk around
among the standing prisoners, hitting them with sticks or kicking them.
The escapee is not caught.
Sixty prisoners newly arrived in a transport from the police prison at
SOnowitz and marked with Nos. 1283-1342 also take part in the punishment
roll call occasioned by the escape of Tadeusz Weijowski.
During the first punishment roll call, the first public flogging on the
stand made in the camp caprpentry shop, takes place. Flogging is
administered to prisoners interrogated by the SS functionaries of the
Political Section on suspicion of helping Tadeusz Weijowski escape and
maintaining contacts with the cicilian workers employed in the camp.
FLogging is carried out by Roll Call Leader, Gerhard Palitzsch,* with a
stick four centimeters in diameter.
[...]
*Formally, a flogging consists of 25 blows, but this rule is not followed.
The whipped prisoner has to count the blows himself aloud in German. If he
makes a mistake, the punishment is repeated from the beginning.
<end quote>
Source: Czech, _Auschwitz Chronicle_, p.17.
Interesting, is it not, that there is no mention of having to get wriiten
permission from Berlin before corporal punishment could be administered to
prisoners? But that should hardly come as a suprise given that SS
Oberfu"hrer Eicke, when he was commandant of Dachau in 1933, wrote in the
"Disciplinary and Penal Code for the Prison Camp," that:
<begin quote>
Executive disicplinary powers are vested inthe Commandant, who is
personally responsible to the Chief of Political Police for carrying out
the proscribed regulations.
<end quote>
Source: Distel and Jakusch, _Concentration Camp Dachau 1933-1945_, p.72.
> > She is a liar, and you are
> > worse than a liar if you seriously expect people to believe this nonsense.
>
> Yes, well, i find your 'letter from berlin' claim a bit weird.
>
> Care to back it up?
If Mr. Bellinger chooses to attempt so, he would do well to keep in mind
the following by Ho"ss:
<begin quote>
I also have to mention here the Summary Court and the killing of the
hostages, since this affected only the Polish prisoners.
Most of the hostages had been in the camp for quite some time. Neither
they nor the camp administration knew they were hostages. Suddenly a
telegram would arrive from the Gestapo or from Himmler stating, "The
following prisoners are to be shot or hanged as haostages." Compliance
with this order had to be reported within a few hours. Those prisoners
concerned were taken away from their work areas or pulled out during roll
call and brought to the detention block [Block 11]. Those who had been
imprisoned for quite some time knew what this meant; at least they had an
idea of what was in store for them. In the detention block they were
informed of the order to execute them. At first, in 1940 and the early
part of 1941, they were shot in the back of the neck. The bedridden
patients in the hospital infirmary [Block 10] were killed by injection
[phenol injection directly to the heart].
The Summary Court in Katowice generally came to Auschwitz every four to
six weeks and met in Block 11. Most of the prisoners who had been
imprisoned there, including those who were brought in shortly before, were
led before the presiding tribunal and questioned through interpreters
about their testimony and confessions. The prisoners who I had witnessed
there freely, openly, and firmly admitted what they had done. SOme of the
women bravely pleaded there cases. In most cases the death sentance was
pronounced and carried out immeduately. All of them went to their death
proudly. They were as calm as the hostages. They were convinced that they
were sacrificing themselves for their country. I often saw in them a
fanaticism which reminded me of the Jehovah's Witnesses and the way they
died.
But the criminals sentanced by the Summary COurt, the men who had
committed robberies or gang theft died in a completely different manner.
They were either numb or totally hardened even toward the very end, or, on
the other hand, they whined, cried, and begged for mercy. We could see
here the same picture and behaviour as during the executions in
Sachsenhausen. Those dying for their ideals were brave, upright, and
strong, the asocials were dull or struglling and trying to resist their
fate.
<end quote>
Source: Ho"ss, _Death Dealer_, pp.129-130.
Mr. Bellinger should also consider the following by Broad:
<begin quote>
Once or twice a month the "Police Summary Court" of the State Police
Office in Kattowitz held its sessions in the Auschwitz concnetration camp.
The omnipotent ruler of Upper Silesia, _SS Obersturmbannfu"hrer_ and State
Councillor Dr Mildner would put in his appearance. That man was one of the
most blood-thirsty butchers that existed in the Third Reich. He looked
like the emodiment of depotism. His mighty skull was most impressive and
so were his ice-cold, cruel eyes with their searching look. He stood at
the head of the Kattowitz Police and was chairman of the Summary Court.
The sentances alsways took lace in the Auschwitz concnetration camp, as
the sentences could immediately be carried out there. The Reich Security
Head Office had issued a order to the _Gestapo_ to carry out sentences
within the concnetration camps, with the exception of executions which
were to be publically performed to in order to intimidate the population.
The Summary Court passed sentences on Poles and _Volksdeutche_ (people who
had signed German nationality lists), who were guilty of "political crimes
and offenses". A political "offense" was, for example, to listen to the
enemy's radio programmes and to talk about them, to be suspected of being
a member of the Polish Resistance Movement, of having served as a courier
of the resistance movement or having helped it with money. Criminal
transgressors were, among others, those accused of black marketeering. But
even the most drastic punishments did not succeed in supressing the black
market. Poles got at most only half the German food rations and could not
survive on them.
The task of the Criminal Court secretary Kauz, who also belonged to the
Kattowitz _Gestapo_, was to organize and prepare the sessins of the
Summary Court. Kauz wore and _SD_ uniform. It woukld have been impossible
to guess from the looks of that rather insignificant, clerkly man with his
harmless looking thick glasses that such a special task had been confided
to him. The victims of the Summary COurt were taken in lorries from
prisons, particularly from the court prison at Myslowitz, to Auschwitz.
Their emaciated, morbidly pale faces testified to their prolonged stay in
prison and to their tortures during interrogation. They wore civilian
clothes and in spite of their pitiful physical condition were, all of
them, heavily handcuffed. During some transports the _SS_ men who brought
htem to the common cells of Block 11, were warned to avoid contagion.
Prisoners ill with typhus were quite common among those detained by the
Summary Court and as a rule typhus and other epidemics were rampant both
in prisons and in concentration camps. On the whole, the detained men and
women, who were to stand trial before the Summary Court, had already been
interrogated and had given "their evidence". From time to time, however,
Auschwitz was visited by commissions which had the task of conducting
inquiries on behalf of the _Gestapo_. The persons they wanted to
interrogate had been brought directly to Auschwitz after their arrest and
were imprisoned in the camp as police prisoners. Before every session of
the SUmmary COurt Kauz used to bring a list of peole who were already
detined in camp as custody prisoners and even hooped to escape death. They
had then to be transferred from their work squads and were put into prison
Block 11. Every prisoner had to be prepared to become either the victim of
Grabner's arbitrariness or that of the Summary Court. One mention of the
prisoner's name at another interrogation, a vague suspicion or some other
accident could easily seal his fate.
In the middle of the year 1943 a stranged procession could be observed
every morning in the Auschwitz concentration camp. The procession moved
from the gate above which large letters proclaiming that "_Arbeit macht
frei_", towards the former post office barrack which was then used as the
place where defendants were interrogated. AT the head of the procession
you could see eight prisoners who carried two mysterious wooden
structures, somewhat like hurdles. 50 or 80 police prisoners followed
them. They were barely able to walk to the barracks, some where supported
by their fellow-sufferers. A considerable number of _Gestapo_ officers had
riding-whips at their belts, some had dried and specially prepared
bull-hide whips, so widely known in concentration camps. Their equipment
was further completed by typewriters and thick briefcases. Guards with
automatic pistols escorted the prisoners, though the later were too weak
to offer any resistance. The _Gestapo_ officers entered the barrack where
the wooden structure were also brought in. The prisoners who were first to
be interrogated followed. The rest had to wait outside, guarded byt he
sentinels. Soon after, a bellowing of the interrogating _Gestapo_ men was
heard, together with of overturned chairs and the noise of blows. The
horrihble cries of the cruelly tortured men were heard from afar. All of
them met the most cruel treatment of they were not immediately ready to
confess their "guilt", or if they were suspected to have some knowledge as
to the hiding-places of weapons or as to the names of the "members of the
bands". Not many knew what purpose the wodden structure served. Those
initiated knew that they were "swings", as those implements of the
Inquisition were cynically called. One _Gestapo_ officer was responsible
for the idea of constructing the "swings" at Auschwitz. He had come from
some State Police Office to interrogate a prisoner at Auschwitz. A queer,
subued groaning was suddenly heard from the room which had been put at his
disposal. WHen the concentration camp officers entered the room they saw a
spectacle which suprised them, though as they were. Two tables had been
placed side by side with a gap of 1 meter between them. The victim had to
sit down on the floor and cross his hands in front of his drawn up kness
[sic]. His wrists were then bound. A thick bar was put between his elbows
and knees. The ends of the bar lay on both tables. He was helplessly
swinging between the tables, his head downwards. Then his posterior and
naked feet soles were flogged with a bull-hide whip. The blows were so
violent that the tortured man rotated wheel-wise. Every time his posterior
came into a conveinant position, a powerful blow was dealt with all
strength. When his cries grew too piercing, the fiendish _Gestapo_ man
smothered them by puttinf a gas-mask on the victim's head. The mask was
taken off from time to time and the tortured man would be asked whether he
was ready to confess. He was accused to have had arms, having probably
fallen victim to an unscroupulous informer. After some 15 minutes the
convulsive movements of the tortured man were no longer observable. He was
unable to speak and only shook his head weakly when the gas-mask had been
removed and he was told to make his confession. His trousers were a dark
red colour and blood was dripping on the floor. His head finally hung down
motionless, he had fainted. But the _Gestapo_ officer was not moved by
that spectacle. With a knowiong look he took out of his pocket a small
bottle of sharply smelling liquid and held it to the prisoner's nose, who
in fact became conscious again after a few minutes. His buttocks were in
such a state that further flogging hardly have increased the pain and so
the inquisitor had a better idea. He dripped hot water into the victim's
nose. The burning pain must have been indescribable. The inquisitor got
what he wanted. AFter another question, sneeringly asked with full
certainty of victory over the fiendishly maltreated man, the latter nodded
that he would confess. The bar was then taken from the tables and was
upended on the floor so that the mancled man slid down. After pulling the
bar away, it ws only with some difficulty that they succeeded in taking
off the handcuffs from the purplish, thickly swollen wrists of the
maltreated man who lay as if lifeless on the floor. Since he did not react
when they shouted at him to come to the table and sign the "confession",
he was flogged with the bull-hide whip. The blows fell indiscriminately on
his head and back; he was kicked too. Finally, he painfully managed to
straighten himself up and sign his "confession". The shakey handwriting
and the perspiration stain, where his hand had rested on the record, made
it clear to an expert that the interrogation was conduxted on the lines of
the third degree methods. They called it in offical papers: "an
interrogation conducted with the help of all available means", or " a
pressing questioning". That method of questioning became popular in
Auschwitz. But the device with the two tables, between which the iron bar
kept sliding and finally fell to the floor together with the victim, was
found to be too primitive. The prisoners who were working in the building
section workshops were therefore instructed to make two wooden frames with
a moveable steel bar. Thus the torments could be augmented because the
tortured person was made to turn a complete circle.
The interrogations in the post office barrack were then conducted with
those means. The _Gestapo_ Commission carried on their nefarious business
for two or three weeks. It was a special action. 600 persons of both
sexes, Poles and those who had signed the German nationality lists
(_Volksdeutsche_) were suddenly arrested, accused of "activities
endangering the Reich". As te court prison in Myslowitz had been closed
due to typhus epidemics and overcrowding, the detainees were brought
straight to Auschwitz. The first floor of Block 2, which consisted of one
large hall without any partition walls, was supplied with straw-pallets
and served to accomodate that crowd. It was thought undesireable that the
Summary Court priosners should come into contact with the camp inmates.
For weeks all the 600 people had to lie on their bellies in that large
hall. They were obliged to eat without changing thier position. Guards
with machine pistols were instructed to shoot as soon as one should dare
to talk or straighten himself up. The sufferings they had already gone
through and those that were still awaiting them, the certain death that
was threatening so many of them, had induced a rigid apathy with the
majority of the victims. There were pregnant women among them. The guards
fulfilled their duties most unwillingly. They were bored for one thing and
besides, the first floor was full of creeping and jumping insects. The day
finally came when 210 from among those prisoners were to appear before the
Summary Court. As a result of preparatory investigations the rest were to
remain in camp as custody prisoners. The candidtaes forhte Summary Court
trial were led to a room in Block 11. A large room opposite was made ready
for the court. A long tanle with water glasses on it and a row of chairs
behind it, with the chairman's seat for Mildner in the middle, was the
main feature of that room. Himmler and Hitler were graciously looking down
from the walls. Through both barred windows, which were not boarded up, as
was the case with the rest of the windows in the block, one had a direct
view upon the tall barbed wire fences. A concrete wall closed the rest of
the camp from one's view. The light-blue Opel Admiral car finally drove up
to Block 11 and Mildner got out. With his upraised hand he pompously
greeted the respectfully standing _SS_ men, ascended the stone steps and
entered the Block. He also greeted Grabner and Aumeier who were allowed to
participate in the session. Kauz laboriously carried up the dossiers.
"_Geheime Staatpolizei_ Kattowitz" was the formidible legend on their
covers. Mildner took his seat. _Sturmbannfu"hrer_ Dr Eisenschmidt sat next
to him. The rest of those present exchanged gay greetings and reminiscent
anecdotes and also took their seats at the table. There was some shop
talk, some boasting about the last successes, some critical remarks as to
the activities of absent colleagues and then everybody froze into an
attitude of utmost hardness and importance - Mildner had opened the
proceedings. With a self-satisfied smile he congratulated the Summary
Court on its two hundreth session. Then he gave the _SS_ guard at the door
a sign to bring in the defendants.
Kauz called the first name. The _SS_ guard repeated the name to the clerk
who was standing in the other room with the defendants. From among the
softly murmuring crowd of people who, after long, unspeakable torments,
were waiting for their death sentance, a weak voice called: "_Heir_", and
one of the sunken-eyed creatures came reeling forward. The clerk helped
him to the door of the court-room. The clerk was a prisoner himself and a
similar fate might soon be in store for him too. The delinquent had to
stand near the door. Mildner read the substantiation of the sentance. "As
the result of investigations of the State Police the Pole...had been found
guilty of acting against the laws of the German Reich by...". this was the
usual beginning and it ended with the sentence, pronounced in a monotomous
and unfeeling voice, "The Police and Summary Court of the State Police in
Kattowitz pronounces the death sentance." With an expression on his face
which broked no criticism, the despot so brave in killing others, looked
rtight and left and accepted the consenting nods of his associates as a
matter of course. The sentenced man was not permoitted to say a word. Each
case took up one minute at the most. Kauz had often a hard task to be
sufficiently quick in finding the dossier among the heap. He perspired whe
Mildner showed his impatience by a discontented glance and a drumming of
his fingers on the table. If the defendant called to the court-room did
not report immediately, the other prisoners would impatiently repeat the
name. They were no longer eager to delay their end by unnecessary minutes.
A youth of sixteen was led into the room. Unbearable hunger had driven him
to steal some food from a shop, he therefore fell into the catagory of the
"criminal" cases/. After having read the death sentance, Mildner slowly
put the paper on the table and directed his penetrating glance upon the
poorly-clad, pale, small boy, standing there at the door. Slowly stressing
every word he asked, :Have you a mother?" - The boy lowered his eyes and
replied in a small voice, almost smothered by tears, "Yes" - "are you
afraid to die?" - pursued that bull-necked butcher and he seemed to derive
a sadistic plesure from the suffering of his victim. The youth was silent,
but his body trembled slightly. "You shall be shot today," - said Mildner,
trying to give his voice the full fatefull significance. - "You would be
hanged anyway, some day. You will be dead in an hour!' - Mildner sometimes
liked to "discourse" in that way with the people he had sentanced to
death. He could not hide the satisfication he felt in having supreme power
to decide on life or death of everyone. His sadistic tendancies were
particularly blatant when he had to do so with women. He would tell them
in the most drastic manner about their imminent deaths by shooting.
<end quote>
Source: Bezwinska and Czech, _KL Auschwitz Seen by the SS_, pp.151-158.
Interesting, is it not, that neither Ho"ss nor Broad mention having to get
written permission from Berlin before corporal punishment could be
administered to a prisoner? Not to mention that, according Broad, the
Reich Security Head Office issued a blanket a order "to carry out
sentences within the concnetration camps." As both Ho"ss and Broad attest,
the Summary Court dilligently handed down numerable _death_ sentance-
after "confessions" were gained by barbaric torture -which were carried
out without further ado. Or permmission from Berlin.
Fafner13
Subject: Re: Irma Grese-A German Heroine
From: Brian Harmon <bra...@itsa.ucsf.edu>
Date: Sun, 29 Jun 1997 19:33:59 -0700
Message-ID: <33B71B...@itsa.ucsf.edu>
Fafner13 wrote:
>
> Your "witness" is a liar.
Ah yes. haven't we heard this before?
REPLY: Yes, usually from your side of the tracks.
Next comes the demands for every little detail on the source:
REPLY: Sure, right. A victim's identity is unnecessary in a homicide
case.
> Who was this woman? What was her name? And
[etc. etc. so on.]
> The FACT is, permission had to be
> obtained from Berlin in WRITING to simply apply corporal punishment upon
> an inmate, and this had to proceed through proper channels fromthe
office
> of the commandant, and this woman is telling us that one person of lowly
> rank could shoot people to death on a whim?
Quite a few people _testified_ about maltreatment of prisoners at a
number
of camps, not just the guards who confessed to it.
REPLY: I am NOT asking about mistreatment. I am sure that it occurred as
it occurred and continues to occur in every penal institution throughout
the world. I asked for specific written authorization from her government
for her or any other guard to do so. A "carte blanche", so to speak.
I assume you have a citation that you can _quote_ for us documenting
your claim that one must receive written permission from Berlin to
strike an inmate?
REPLY: That is rather common knwledge. Ask one of your Nizkor friends.
If both of you are in doubt, refer to one of your "authorities", such as
Kogon. Though, as expected, he freely mixes fact with fiction, even he
referred to it.
(Sounds a bit odd eh? excuse me, this prisoner is trying to escape.
quick! send a letter to berlin asking if we can hit him! )
Reply: I am not talking only about escaping prisoners. For that
evaluation, please see how American officer Col B. Andrus applied his
regulations for diisorderly or escaping prisoners and try to avoid looking
like a hypocrite after you have done so.
> She is a liar, and you are
> worse than a liar if you seriously expect people to believe this
nonsense.
Yes, well, i find your 'letter from berlin' claim a bit weird.
Care to back it up?
REPLY: Have already done so.
--