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The "Slatkin 75" who profited from the fraud

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ptsc

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Dec 18, 2001, 5:17:28 PM12/18/01
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Tom Klemesrud

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Dec 18, 2001, 7:31:52 PM12/18/01
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ptsc wrote:
>
> http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm

Linwood (Chip) Lacy 1,000,000 2,080,972 (1,080,972)

This guy is an Earthlink director. He used to direct Ingram Micro.
Wasn't the equipment first used for the infrastructure of Earthlink
leased from Ingram Micro?

[citation]
#! rnews 5038
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Path: lavc!lavc!tom.klemesrud
From: tom.kl...@support.com
Subject: Earthlink Dir. Resign 1/4
Message-ID: <960523024...@support.com>
References: <Pine.SUN.3.93.96052...@mariner.cris.com>
Organization: L.A. Valley College Public BBS (818)985-7150
X-Mailer: TBBS/PIMP v3.35
Distribution: world
Date: Thu, 23 May 96 02:42:03 -0700


Two days after the Los Angeles Times identified Ingram Micro
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer Linwood A. ("Chip") Lacy Jr.
as a Board Director of Scientologist run Earthlink; the Los
Angeles Times reports that Chip Lacy has resigned from Ingram
Micro.

[citation]
Los Angeles Times Wednesday May 22, 1996

"INGRAM MICRO EXECUTIVE RESIGNS: In an untimely management jolt, Linwood
A. Lacy Jr. resigned as chief executive of Ingram Micro Inc., just
months before the giant computer products distributor was to go public.

[snip]

Lacy ... was the highest-ranking outsider in a company owned and
run by the Ingram family of Tennessee. In fact, Lacy's decision to
resign stemmed from a subtle power struggle between Lacy and the family,
said David Dukes, co-chairman of Ingram Micro. The disagreement
centered on control of certain functions and decisions as Ingram
Micro's parent company planned a complex break-up."
[end citation]

Just two day before on May 20 1996 the Los Angeles Times reported:

[Citation]
"THE CUTTING EDGE; EarthLink's in the Clouds, but a Few of Them Are
Angry;
Cyberspace: Critics of the Internet service provider's 'boy wonder'
founder
question his religious ties, firm's viability."


Monday, May 20, 1996
By AMY HARMON, Times Staff Writer (Los Angeles Times)

It's hard to navigate Southern California's corner of cyberspace
these days without tripping over the terrestrial tendrils of Sky Dylan
Dayton's EarthLink Network.

The precocious 24-year-old entrepreneur founded the Internet service
provider two years ago, and since then it has enjoyed a rise that can
only be described as, well, meteoric.

While other fledgling providers have stumbled because of technical
problems and lack of capital, Pasadena-based EarthLink is now the
third-largest Internet-only consumer access provider in the nation, with
more than 100,000 customers--about half in the Los Angeles area.

Nos. 1 and 2, Netcom Communications Inc. and Performance Systems
International, both turned to the stock market to finance their growth,
raising $140 million and $134 million, respectively, in recent
offerings.

EarthLink's expansion, however, has so far been privately funded by an
eclectic mix of investors, including El Dorado Ventures, a venture
capitalist firm; Warren Musser, president of Safeguard Scientific; and
National Media Corp., an infomercial production company.

Dayton, a graduate of the Delphi Academy, which is run on principles
set out by Church of Scientology founder L. Ron Hubbard, started his
first business when he was 18. He co-founded Cafe Mocha, a West Los
Angeles coffee shop, in 1990 and launched a graphics design firm in
1992.

[snip]

Earlier this year, EarthLink's board of directors, which now includes
former AT&T multimedia chief Robert Kavner and Ingram Micro Chairman
Chip
Lacy, installed some more experienced managers to help keep the firm in
stable orbit.

[snip]

And Dayton's involvement in the Church of Scientology--he is listed in
a recent issue of the church's Celebrity magazine as having completed
one
of its management courses--has attracted the attention of church critics
and Netizens monitoring a high-stakes legal battle involving
dissemination of copyrighted church documents over the Internet.

Discussions on Internet news groups such as la.general and
alt.religion.scientology and a World Wide Web site have focused on
Dayton's affiliation with the church--and on the actions of another
Earthlink employee in battling church critics on the Internet. The
global
computer network has become an important battleground in a long-running
war between the church and critics who say they're exposing the fallacy
of its doctrines.

Dayton acknowledges that at the beginning, a large portion of
EarthLink employees were Scientologists. With the company's growth,
though, the proportion has fallen to a small fraction, he says.

Earthlink also used Hubbard management techniques in its early days.
Dayton says the Hubbard methods are secular and have nothing to do with
the religion of Scientology, and that in any case they are no longer in
use at the company. Dayton vehemently denies any links between the
church
and Earthlink and says his private religious beliefs are irrelevant to
his business.

[ Continued In Next Message... ]

_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
_/ Tom Klemesrud, Sysop _/ _/ L.A. Valley College BBS _/
_/ tom.kl...@support.com _/ _/ FidoNet 1:102/837 KoX _/
_/ ro...@support.com _/ _/ North Hollywood, CA USA _/
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
#! rnews 3430
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Path: lavc!lavc!tom.klemesrud
From: tom.kl...@support.com
Subject: Earthlink Dir. Resign 2/4
Message-ID: <960523024...@support.com>
References: <Pine.SUN.3.93.96052...@mariner.cris.com>
Organization: L.A. Valley College Public BBS (818)985-7150
X-Mailer: TBBS/PIMP v3.35
Distribution: world
Date: Thu, 23 May 96 02:42:04 -0700


[ ...Continued From Previous Message ]

[snip ... end citation]


Taking a closer look at the history of the Earthlink Board
member, here's some history:

[citation]

CALIFORNIA SECRETARY OF STATE, CORPORATE RECORD.

NAME: MICRO D, INC.
TYPE OF CORPORATION: ARTICLES OF INCORPORATION (DOMESTIC)
CORPORATE STATUS: MERGED OUT
DATE OF INCORPORATION/QUALIFICATION: 07/05/1979
MAILING ADDRESS: 2801 S YALE ST
SANTA ANA, CA 92704
REGISTERED AGENT: WAYNE R ORTENBURGER
REGISTERED OFFICE: 2801 S YALE ST
SANTA ANA, CA 92704
*PRESIDENT: LINWOOD A LACY JR
2801 S YALE ST
SANTA ANA, CA 92704
STATEMENT OF OFFICERS FILE NUMBER: 275574
STATEMENT OF OFFICERS FILE DATE: 06/21/88
CORPORATE NUMBER: 934878
HISTORY:
DATE: 04/27/1983
TRANSACTION: CERTIFICATE OF AMENDMENT
COMMENT: NAME CHANGED FROM: MICRO DISTRIBUTORS
OTHER CORP NO: 00934878

DATE: 03/21/1989
TRANSACTION: MERGER
COMMENT: OUTGOING-MERGED INTO C1130770 INGRAM COMPUTER INC.
OTHER CORP NO: 01130770
AMENDMENT NO: D0302575

SURVIVING CORPORATION: INGRAM COMPUTER INC.; 01130770


INDIANA SECRETARY OF STATE, CORPORATE/LTD PARTNERSHIP RECORDS

NAME: INGRAM INDUSTRIES INC.
ASSUMED-NAME: INGRAM DISTRIBUTION GROUP INC INGRAM BOOK COMPANY IN
Allen
COUNTY
TYPE: FOREIGN CORPORATION FOR-PROFIT
STATUS: ACTIVE
DATE OF INCORPORATION/QUALIFICATION: 04/18/1990
Original Incorporation: 06/14/1962
ACTS: PROFIT
MAILING ADDRESS: 4400 Harding Road
Nashville, TN 37205
STATE OF INCORPORATION: TENNESSEE
REGISTERED AGENT: C T Corp. System
REGISTERED OFFICE: One N. Capitol Avenue
Indianapolis, IN 46204
ANNUAL-REPORT: 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995
*PRESIDENT: Linwood A. Lacy
4400 Harding Road
Nashville, TN 37205
SECRETARY: James E. Anderson
4400 Harding Rd.
Nashville, TN 37205
FEIN: 620673043
NUMBER: 1990040738


OREGON SECRETARY OF STATE, CORPORATE RECORD

Name: INGRAM INDUSTRIES INC.
Type: CORPORATION (PROFIT)
Status: ACTIVE
Filing Date: 7/19/1994
Number: 41099383
Officers/Directors/Partners/Members:
JAMES E AMDERSON JR
SECRETARY
4400 HARDING RD
NASHVILLE, TN 37205

* LINWOOD A LACY JR
PRESIDENT
4400 HARDING RD
NASHVILLE, TN 37205


PENNSYLVANIA DEPARTMENT OF STATE, CORPORATE/LTD PARTNERSHIP
RECORD

NAME: INGRAM MICRO INC.
TYPE: FOREIGN BUSINESS
STATUS: IN GOOD STANDING (ACTIVE)
DATE OF INCORPORATION/QUALIFICATION: 09/17/1993
MAILING ADDRESS: 1600 E ST ANDREW PLACE
[ Continued In Next Message... ]

_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
_/ Tom Klemesrud, Sysop _/ _/ L.A. Valley College BBS _/
_/ tom.kl...@support.com _/ _/ FidoNet 1:102/837 KoX _/
_/ ro...@support.com _/ _/ North Hollywood, CA USA _/
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
#! rnews 3695
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Path: lavc!lavc!tom.klemesrud
From: tom.kl...@support.com
Subject: Earthlink Dir. Resign 3/4
Message-ID: <960523024...@support.com>
References: <Pine.SUN.3.93.96052...@mariner.cris.com>
Organization: L.A. Valley College Public BBS (818)985-7150
X-Mailer: TBBS/PIMP v3.35
Distribution: world
Date: Thu, 23 May 96 02:42:04 -0700


[ ...Continued From Previous Message ]

SANTA ANA, CA 92705-0000
STATE: CALIFORNIA
REGISTERED OFFICE: % CT CORPORATION SYSTEM
PA 00000-0000
DAUPHIN COUNTY
OFFICERS:
Name Title

* LINWOOD A LACY JR CEO
JAMES E ANDERSON JR SECRETARY
THOMAS H LUNN TREASURER

Effective 09/17/1993

[end citation]

The Los Angeles Times article mentioned the Ingram family of
Tennessee. It apears from the data that Director Lacy founded
a computer business in Orange County, CA called Micro D; and
later merged with the Ingram family of Tennessee (Nashville area)
to form INGRAM COMPUTERS in 1989. In 1990 Lacy formed INGRAM
INDUSTRIES in Indiana, with a mailing address in Nashville,
Tennessee. Later in 1993, Ingram Micro was formed in Santa Ana.

The Ingram groups of companies include the INGRAM BOOK GROUP,
INGRAM ENTERTAINMENT, INGRAM EXPORT DIVISION and INGRAM MICRO.
http://www.ingram.com

INGRAM BOOK is a sister company of INGRAM MICRO and appears to
operates as a seperate unit out of Tennessee, providing wholesale
distribution of books, periodicals, multimedia and spoken audio
to booksellers, librarians ans specialty retailers.

"Ingram Book Group's Publisher Partners" include 370k of names
including Forbes Inc. to The Los Angeles Times. But here are
a few that caught my eye:

ACADEMY MOTION PICTURES
AMER MEDICAL ASSOC
AMER PHARMACEUTICAL ASSOC
AMERICAN FAMILY FOUNDATION
AMERICAN PSYCHIATRIC PRESS
AMERICAN PSYCHOLOGICAL ASSOC
ARYAN BOOKS INTERNATIONAL
ASHTON TATE (BOOKS)
ASYLUM ARTS
AUM PUBLICATIONS <--------
BIBLESOFT
BODYMIND
BRIDGE INK
BRIDGE PUBLICATIONS <-------
BRIDGE PUBLISHING INC
BRIDGE WORKS PUBLISHING
BRITISH PSYCHOLOGICAL SOCIETY
BUREAU NATL AFFAIRS
BUTTERWORTH LEGAL PUBS INC
CADENCE BOOKS
CELEBRITY ACCESS PUBLICATIONS
CHICAGO RELIGIOUS TASK FORCE O
CHURCH & SYNAGOGUE LIB ASSN
CHURCH BYTES INC
CHURCH OF LIGHT
CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY OF N Y <---------
CONGRESSIONAL EDUCATION ASSOCI
CONGRESSIONAL INFO SERVIC INC
CONGRESSIONAL QUARTELY
CONGRESSIONAL STAFF DIRECTORY
COVENANT COMMUNICATIONS
CURRENCY PRESS
DAUGHTERS OF THE MOON
DYNAMIC KEY PUBLICATIONS
DYNAMIC PUBLISHING
EARTH DESIGN
EARTH HEART
EARTH LOVE PUBLISHING HOUSE
EARTH MOTHER PRODUCTIONS
EARTH NEWS
EARTH PRESS
EARTH SOUNDS
EARTH VIEW INC
EARTHQUEST PRESS
EARTHSCAN
EARTHSPIRIT INC
EARTHWORKS
ERA PUBLICATIONS
FREE SPIRIT PUBLISHING
FREEDOM BOOKS
FREEDOM EDITIONS
FREEDOM HOUSE
FREEDOM PUBLISHING COMPANY
FREEMAN INSTITUTE
GALLERY PUBLICATIONS
INGRAM BOOK CO
[ Continued In Next Message... ]

_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
_/ Tom Klemesrud, Sysop _/ _/ L.A. Valley College BBS _/
_/ tom.kl...@support.com _/ _/ FidoNet 1:102/837 KoX _/
_/ ro...@support.com _/ _/ North Hollywood, CA USA _/
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
#! rnews 1346
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Path: lavc!lavc!tom.klemesrud
From: tom.kl...@support.com
Subject: Earthlink Dir. Resign 4/4
Message-ID: <960523024...@support.com>
References: <Pine.SUN.3.93.96052...@mariner.cris.com>
Organization: L.A. Valley College Public BBS (818)985-7150
X-Mailer: TBBS/PIMP v3.35
Distribution: world
Date: Thu, 23 May 96 02:42:04 -0700


[ ...Continued From Previous Message ]

INGRAM DENNYS LTD
INGRAM ENTERTAINMENT
INGRAM MERCHANDISING SERVICES
INGRAM MICRO
INST FOR EDUCATIONAL MANAGEMEN
INST FOR HISTORICAL REVIEW
LIGHTSIDE PRODUCTIONS INC
MAGICKAL CHILDE
MARVEL COMICS GROUP
MILITARY COLLECTORS
MILITARY MARKETING SERVICES
MILNER PRESS
MIND COMMUNICATION
MINDBODY PRESS
MINDSCAPE
MIRAMAX
MOON PUBLICATIONS
NATL RIFLE ASSN
NEW AGE BIBLE & PHILOSOPHY CNT

And a whole bunch more.

Tom Klemesrud SP5


_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
_/ Tom Klemesrud, Sysop _/ _/ L.A. Valley College BBS _/
_/ tom.kl...@support.com _/ _/ FidoNet 1:102/837 KoX _/
_/ ro...@support.com _/ _/ North Hollywood, CA USA _/
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/


LronsScam

unread,
Dec 18, 2001, 8:05:49 PM12/18/01
to

Just for the ARS archives. :)

The addy of ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> <ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias
DOT net>>,
In article ID <a3gv1uc3g40mi1f3g...@4ax.com>,
On or about Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:17:28 -0500,
In this thy group <alt.religion.scientology> cometh;

ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> says...

>http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm
>


REED E. SLATKIN
Schedule of 75
Largest Net-Debtors
For the Period
January 1, 1986 through April 30, 2001
 

Investor Name
Receipt
Amount
Disbursement
Amount
Net
Overpayment
 

Joel Kreiner & Stina Hans
$ 3,143,315
$ 9,009,898
$ (5,866,583)
William W. & Anne Hutchins
1,611,206
7,100,839
(5,489,632)
R.E. (Burt) Laing
423,465
5,779,597
(5,356,132)
Robert & Karen Rakow & Highlands Group
3,056,077
8,273,876
(5,217,798)
Jeffrey B. & Debra Schwartz
2,643,071
7,731,232
(5,088,161)
Glenn & Barbara Johnson
772,000
5,262,657
(4,490,657)
Linda Rosen
10,742,865
15,069,844
(4,326,979)
Joseph C. & Molly Walton
2,203,000
6,487,765
(4,284,765)
Richard & Barbara Levine
2,566,969
6,639,764
(4,072,794)
Richard & Joanne McMullin
426,174
4,213,197
(3,787,023)
Anthony & Margaret Hitchman
751,500
4,499,969
(3,748,469)
Arlo Gordin
5,070,559
8,794,782
(3,724,222)
Richard & Judith Freedman
2,193,291
5,719,047
(3,525,756)
Donald Rackemann
700,000
4,125,600
(3,425,600)
Brian & Joan Reso
1,120,174
4,137,779
(3,017,605)
James William Firman
551,825
3,494,131
(2,942,306)
Jean Batesman Summers
572,081
3,487,081
(2,915,000)
Armyan B. Bernstein et al
3,447,988
6,326,963
(2,878,975)
Daniel W. & Myrna Jacobs
760,500
3,486,201
(2,725,701)
Chris Mancuso & Mancuso LLC
1,827,800
4,306,214
(2,478,414)
Ron Rakow
1,201,053
3,608,666
(2,407,613)
Ansel Slome
600,000
2,880,900
(2,280,900)
Peter Henman Laufer & Milova
2,121,699
4,393,143
(2,271,445)
David Singer & Diana Venegas
1,614,800
3,824,556
(2,209,756)
Stuart & Deborah Steinberg
518,734
2,648,653
(2,129,919)
Roy & Lynette MacNeill
4,332,748
6,397,250
(2,064,502)
Paul & Ann Minshull
0
2,056,000
(2,056,000)
Donald & Karen Simons
2,342,000
4,345,919
(2,003,919)
Michael & Anne Kananack
1,902,021
3,903,943
(2,001,922)
Denise Del Bianco
501,085
2,475,000
(1,973,915)
Peter Summers
1,152,521
3,070,000
(1,917,479)
Peter & Hilary Jackson
653,708
2,556,321
(1,902,613)
John & Alexandra Rome Mudd
600,000
2,434,617
(1,834,617)
Robert & Susie Coelho Rounds
1,790,230
3,563,214
(1,772,984)
Sally Jo Levy Soverinsky
2,332,135
3,939,018
(1,606,883)
Bernard & Carol Levine
175,000
1,761,400
(1,586,400)
Tony & Joan Lonstein
5,929,800
7,475,651
(1,545,851)
Ronald & Ellen Schmier
1,489,575
2,962,000
(1,472,425)
Ralph Cooper & Karen Rounds
3,211,076
4,657,121
(1,446,045)
Sandra Codding
700,000
2,137,000
(1,437,000)
Joel Stevens
825,000
2,167,500
(1,342,500)
Bentley Richards
1,925,000
3,192,000
(1,267,000)
Lawrence & Sheila Gluck
1,211,479
2,431,720
(1,220,241)
Charles Lyons
2,527,243
3,732,786
(1,205,543)
Mary T. Walton
244,000
1,415,000
(1,171,000)
Dick & Patricia Zimmerman
371,865
1,531,792
(1,159,926)
Lee S. Minshull
1,897,365
3,052,359
(1,154,994)
Jean Janu
330,006
1,468,611
(1,138,605)
Armand Berstein
0
1,122,000
(1,122,000)
John & Sara Isham
360,000
1,472,263
(1,112,263)
Michael & Sara Doughty (Champ Frame)
823,000
1,913,651
(1,090,651)
William Reilly
859,010
1,948,000
(1,088,990)
Nathan & Lucille Bercovitz
270,000
1,357,831
(1,087,831)


Linwood (Chip) Lacy
1,000,000
2,080,972
(1,080,972)

Adrienne Rappoport
468,458
1,545,950
(1,077,492)
Rachel Walton
174,000
1,246,410
(1,072,410)
Michael Humphrey (aka Mark Parker)
1,000,000
1,998,794
(998,794)
Kevin & Maryann O'Donnell
20,831,975
21,818,364
(986,389)
George W. Murgatroid III
2,204,951
3,189,340
(984,389)
Omega Trust Linda Heineman
753,259
1,708,000
(954,741)
Peter Coyote
393,000
1,336,442
(943,442)
Bernardo & Jeanne Lan
729,515
1,665,000
(935,485)
Timothy & Betsy White
652,626
1,543,008
(890,383)
Walter & Majorie Butcher
279,151
1,140,500
(861,349)
Mary Thompson
450,000
1,272,190
(822,190)
Robert Engel (Green Key)
500,000
1,311,644
(811,644)
Dinu & Francine Goldenberg
875,000
1,660,000
(785,000)
Jill Tate Higgins (OS II Inc)
1,500,000
2,238,703
(738,703)
Irving & Lillian Rakow
137,500
839,000
(701,500)
Don & Elizabeth Curier
2,600,000
3,268,000
(668,000)
Jeffrey & Shelley Katke
532,500
1,198,000
(665,500)
John Coale & Greta Van Susteren
2,076,130
2,735,000
(658,870)
Thomas M. Skrenes
275,000
932,113
(657,113)
Jeff & Jill B. Choder
326,300
961,000
(634,700)
Anna R. Hawken
1,365,322
1,995,000
(629,678)
 

TOTALS
$ 128,520,701
$ 279,525,749
$ (151,005,048)
 

Balance of Net Debtors (371 Accounts)
$ 85,521,034
$ 129,997,262
$ (44,476,228)
 

Note: 
Receipts and disbursements include all receipts from and disbursements
to each Investor regardless of the description or type.

Source: 
Books and records of the Debtor.

Warrior

unread,
Dec 18, 2001, 10:21:32 PM12/18/01
to
I'm posting some of the names in the report webbed at
http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm
so I can make my comments in brackets like this [ ].


REED E. SLATKIN

Schedule of 75 Largest Net-Debtors
For the Period January 1, 1986 through April 30, 2001

Investor Name Receipt Amount Disbursement Amount Net Overpayment

Joel Kreiner $ 3,143,315 $ 9,009,898 $ (5,866,583)
& Stina Hans

[Joel was at one time the Deputy Guardian Legal for the United States
Guardian Office. He also represented me during 1977-1979 in a civil
suit stemming from a felony hit-and-run auto incident in which I was
a victim in 1977. He's a very long-time member of the cult; and he
has been an "OT" since at least 1977. I also knew his one-time legal
partner, James Q. Fisher, through dealings I had regarding my Scien-
tologist employer's tax fraud and other financial irregularities during
the mid-80s. Kreiner's legal representation of the cult in the U.S. vs.
the E-Meter case also comes to mind.]

Anthony 751,500 4,499,969 (3,748,469)
& Margaret Hitchman

[Tony Hitchman is another very long-term member of the Scientology cult,
and like Joel, is an "OT". When I was in the cult he was a very prominent
lecturer, amongst other things. He is also a long-time friend of Irene
Dirmann.]

Arlo Gordin 5,070,559 8,794,782 (3,724,222)

[Arlo used to be my wife's chiropractor during the mid-80s. He is an
"OT" and long-time cult member as well. ]

David Singer 1,614,800 3,824,556 (2,209,756)
& Diana Venegas

[I have a promotional piece which has Diana's "success story". In it,
she is described as an "award winning international fashion designer".
She is an "OT" too.]

Michael 1,902,021 3,903,943 (2,001,922)
& Anne Kananack

[Another "OT". I first became aquainted with Michael Jesse Kananack
back in the late 70s when he was the bankruptcy attorney for Bob Mills,
the then owner of the Optimum Press. It seems Bob got audited by the
IRS over some tax matters!]

George W. 2,204,951 3,189,340 (984,389)
Murgatroid III

[Another "OT", George 'Skip' Murgatroyd is a former partner of Kanancak
and Coale. He is a long-time Scientologist, and a personal friend of
former Guardian Office staff member Neal Sobol, who used to work at
Kananack's Wilshire Blvd. office in LA.]

John Coale 2,076,130 2,735,000 (658,870)
& Greta Van Susteren

[John 'Bhopal' Coale is another long-time Scientologist who had a
legal practice (maybe he still does) with Kananack and Murgatroyd.]

[The above 7 "friends of Reed Slatkin" accounts made a cool $19.2 million!
Looks like Slatkin sure took extra special good care of his "friends".
I wonder how many wogs lost money as a result of Slatkin's fraud...]

TOTALS $ 128,520,701 279,525,749 $ (151,005,048)

Balance of Net $ 85,521,034 $ 129,997,262 $ (44,476,228)
Debtors
(371 Accounts)


Note:  Receipts and disbursements include all receipts from and disbursements to
each Investor regardless of the description or type.

Source:  Books and records of the Debtor.

===

Warrior - Sunshine disinfects
http://warrior.offlines.org

STICKWORK

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 12:29:02 AM12/19/01
to
Using my rudimentary math skills,

if all transaction winners disgorge

their 150 mil., and add to that the

remaining assets, transaction losers

should get back roughly .60 on the

dollar after legal fees.

STICKWORK

JimDBB

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 12:53:24 AM12/19/01
to
>Subject: Re: The "Slatkin 75" who profited from the fraud
>From: Warrior war...@entheta.net

Thanks for posting this, Warrior. I think that you should at long last realize
the "OT" designation doesn't exist in the real world. "She's an OT too"...this
sounds to me as thought you are still a scientologist.
You should have, by now, deprogrammed yourself from this bullshit.

JImdbb

Cambridge

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 5:16:50 AM12/19/01
to
On 18 Dec 2001
in message <9vp13...@drn.newsguy.com>
Warrior <war...@entheta.net> wrote:

>I'm posting some of the names in the report webbed at
>http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm
>so I can make my comments in brackets like this [ ].
>
>REED E. SLATKIN
>
>Schedule of 75 Largest Net-Debtors
>For the Period January 1, 1986 through April 30, 2001
>
>Investor Name Receipt Amount Disbursement Amount Net Overpayment
>
>Joel Kreiner $ 3,143,315 $ 9,009,898 $ (5,866,583)
>& Stina Hans
>
>[Joel was at one time the Deputy Guardian Legal for the United States
>Guardian Office. He also represented me during 1977-1979 in a civil
>suit stemming from a felony hit-and-run auto incident in which I was
>a victim in 1977. He's a very long-time member of the cult; and he
>has been an "OT" since at least 1977. I also knew his one-time legal
>partner, James Q. Fisher, through dealings I had regarding my Scien-
>tologist employer's tax fraud and other financial irregularities during
>the mid-80s. Kreiner's legal representation of the cult in the U.S. vs.
>the E-Meter case also comes to mind.]

It seems that you might have missed the following. Whether you did or
not, I feel it bears repeating in light of this development in Slatkin:

Date: 15 Dec 2001
Message-ID: <BRTMOQXG3724...@anonymous.poster>
From: Cambridge <camb...@ivy.league>
Subject: Re: Sherman Lenske Declaration 86-02-04
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
References: <ed50f9cb8257a396...@remailer.cryptofortress.com>,
<p8ah1u4ppa3o06eel...@4ax.com>

There is also another attorney who seems to be very entangled with Karno
and the Lenskes, but who has gotten little mention, and that is Joel
Kreiner. I have made something of a study of him and his embroilment in all
these matters, and I think it's necessary to start recognizing his role in
many important events. I include him in the Invisible Empire.

With that in mind, and keeping in mind that date outlines, or "timelines,"
are certainly not my forte, it does help to lay the known and likely
Karno/Lenske/Kreiner involvements out in some sort of chronology. Here is
the best I've come up with so far, including the events where it has been
necessary to read between the lines, as I was referring to above, in order
to see the controlling hand of these attorneys in the events. I freely
admit to extrapolation in places, but only where I feel it is warranted and
is supported by other facts. I identify those extrapolations. Although the
first confirmed and unequivocal involvement of Norton S. Karno's firm is 5
November 1973, I believe there is a good foundation for deducing the
involvement of Karno in several other events that happened earlier in 1973,
which I start off with:

25 June 1973
A trust instrument is executed establishing the existence of "The United
States Church(es) of Scientology Trust" ("the Trust;" "the Trustee fund")
with L. Ron Hubbard named as the sole Trustee. (Based on later events, it
seems a likely possibility that this Trust instrument was drafted by Norton
S. Karno or someone at his firm, which is why I include it here. I freely
admit that this is not confirmed and that it bears further investigation.
The Tax Court that discusses this Trust apparently had access to the Trust
instrument, and it may be part of their public record, so there may be some
hope of confirming this at some point.) What is certain is that California
attorney Joel Kreiner is the Deputy Guardian Legal U.S. at this time, and
that the Trust instrument was drawn up by some attorney familiar with
trusts and the related tax issues. Kreiner is also a Director and the
Secretary for HASI, Inc. at the time, which has its own relevance in
developing events.
http://wpxx02.toxi.uni-wuerzburg.de/~cowen/essays/irslegal/240984.html

2 July 1973
An IRS audit of L. Ron Hubbard and Mary Sue Hubbard for the tax years 1971
and 1972 is begun by IRS's OIO. It is been being worked on by Thomas R.
Crate in OIO, under the supervision of Howard Rosen. (It is my informed
belief that Norton S. Karno is representing L. Ron Hubbard by this time,
based on events that happen in relation to IRS within a very few months
which involve Karno's firm of Karno, Rudnick & Fischer, and based on the
continuing involvement of Norton Karno in tax-related and business affairs
of L. Ron Hubbard.)

19 September 1973
After having been ordered by IRS earlier in the year to produce certain
documents, CSC and Henning Heldt file with United States District Court,
Central District of California, a notice to take the depositions of
Regional Commissioner of Internal Revenue Homer Croasmun, Internal Revenue
Service Group Manager James Argue, and Internal Revenue Agent Robert H.
Cluberton, also requesting that they produce certain records and documents
at the depositions. (It is my informed belief and is very likely indeed
that the law firm that drew up and filed the notice is Karno, Rudnick &
Fischer, as that firm's James Q. Fischer represents CSC and Henning Heldt
at the 5 November 1973 hearing on this and other filings in this case.)
Joel Kreiner is the Deputy Guardian Legal U.S.
http://www.xenu.net/archive/CourtFiles/occf252.html

5 November 1973
(First confirmed involvement of Karno's law firm.) James Q. Fischer of the
law firm Karno, Rudnick & Fischer is representing Henning Heldt (of the
Guardian's Office) and Church of Scientology of California (CSC) in a
hearing in "United States of America and Robert H. Cluberton, Internal
Revenue Agent, Internal Revenue Service, Petitioners v. Church of
Scientology of California and Henning Heldt, Vice President, Respondents."
No. 73-2100-HP United States District Court; C.D. California. Joel Kreiner
is the Deputy Guardian Legal. (In the "Scientology Shyster List," it is
reported that Joel Kreiner and a James Fisher [sic] become partners at some
point. I still have not been able to determine if the James Q. Fischer who
was with Karno is the same person whose name is spelled "Fisher" in the
"Shyster List." It seems likely, but needs confirmation.)
http://www.xenu.net/archive/CourtFiles/occf252.html

1 June 1974
Attorney Joel Kreiner reportedly "steps down" as "as chief legal adviser"
but continues "to hold a legal post" in the Guardian's Office. In that
post, he reportedly is CSC's "primary tax attorney" and has "custody and
control of the Church's tax files." (The Tax Court ruling this is taken
from is very ambiguous about what this "stepping down as chief legal
adviser" means. It doesn't say specifically that Kreiner is no longer the
Deputy Guardian Legal U.S., and in fact says that he continues "to hold a
legal post" in the Guardian's Office. At the very least he is still in the
office of the Deputy Guardian Legal U.S.) According to annual reports filed
with the Arizona Corporations Commission, Kreiner also remains a director
and the Secretary of HASI, Inc.
http://wpxx02.toxi.uni-wuerzburg.de/~cowen/essays/irslegal/240984.html

29 August 1974
There is a Department of the Treasury internal "buck slip" dated August 29,
1974, concerning an FOIA request from Joel Kreiner on behalf of the "Church
of Scientology." (This would certainly be CSC.) The "buck slip" is from a
Treasury Department official to an attorney in the Office of the General
Counsel and contains opinions and requests legal advice as to the
processing of the request. (This establishes Kreiner's continuing
involvement in legal matters on behalf of CSC concerning tax and IRS and US
Treasury Department matters. This "buck slip" concerns an FOIA request from
Kreiner that is contemporary with this period in 1974, and Kreiner is
already established as working in association with the Karno firm on
IRS-related matters at this point in time.)

15 September 1974
Cindy Raymond, "Collections Officer in the US Information Bureau in L.A."
for the US Guardian's Office, allegedly informs Michael Meisner that she
has selected Gerald Bennett Wolfe to "infiltrate the IRS on behalf of the
Church of Scientology." (Again this is a gross instance where all mention
of the attorneys is left out, and no mention of any of their names is
included, but both the Stipulation of Evidence and the later September 1984
US Tax Court ruling state that the senior purpose of the alleged IRS
infiltration was to obtain documents to be used by attorneys in CSC's
litigation against IRS, and/or in relation the audit that was being
conducted on L. Ron Hubbard and Mary Sue Hubbard out of IRS's OIO at the
time. It is a very curious element of the Stipulation of Evidence that,
despite this purported purpose, the Stipulation leaves out all mention of
the documents being routed to the G.O.'s legal department, or to Kreiner
and then on to the attorneys involved in tax issues. Karno's firm is most
decidedly involved in IRS-related legal matters at this time, and Joel
Kreiner continues to be actively and closely involved, as is proven by
previous and ensuing events. Therefore there has to be here an unstated,
and even concealed, connection to Kreiner and to the Karno firm. The most
perplexing aspect of this is that the government's own Stipulation of
Evidence is concealing these necessary connections, and Joel Kreiner's
name appears nowhere in the Stipulation, even though he is named in the
September 1984 Tax Court ruling in relation to this time period. The
Stipulation concentrates almost exclusively on the intelligence-collection
activities and personnel, and almost completely obliterates the very
existence of the attorneys and Guardian's Office Legal Department for whom
the data collection was supposedly being done in the first place. All of
this begins to seem even more incongruous in events that follow almost
immediately.)

11 November 1974
Gerald Wolfe is hired by IRS as a clerk typist despite the fact that there
is a hiring freeze in effect at IRS. (See above notes.)

2 December 1974
The matter of "Church of Scientology of California, a non-profit
corporation, Plaintiff v. Internal Revenue Service, Donald C. Alexander,
Commissioner of Internal Revenue, Department of the Treasury of the United
States, William Simon, Secretary of the Treasury of the United States,
Defendants" is heard in court at 10:00 AM. Appearing for Plaintiff (CSC)
is Joel Kreiner, Attorney At Law. (This is a rather amazing event, coming
less than one month after the hiring of Gerald Wolfe by IRS, because the
Karno firm is already established in representing CSC against IRS, Karno
has definitely been closely associated with Kreiner in Kreiner's position
as the Deputy Guardian Legal U.S. when Karno was retained, and Kreiner has
only recently "stepped down" from being "chif legal adviser." Yet here
Kreiner is standing up for CSC, with no evidence of Karno or Karno's firm
involved in this case against Donald C. Alexander, Commissioner or IRS, and
William Simon, Secretary of the Treasury. Yet we can be absolutely certain
that Karno is still very actively involved with Hubbard's affairs, with the
G.O., and with CSC, as is proven in the later events.)
http://www.xenu.net/archive/CourtFiles/occf251.html

1 January 1975
Meade Emory becomes Assistant to Donald C. Alexander, Commissioner of IRS.
(Included because of Meade Emory's later connection to the Lenskes in
setting up CST, and because CSC has just filed suit against Donald C.
Alexander et al. The timing of Emory's hiring relative to the event
directly above is quite an amazing "coincidence," one of the many very odd
coincidences that keep turning up. But it confirms that Meade Emory was
made Assistant to Commissioner of IRS in the middle of CSC and the G.O.'s
case against Commissioner of IRS and the US Treasury Secretary.)

14 November 1975
Joel Kreiner signs an annual report for HASI, Inc. as its Secretary. It is
the last annual report ever filed for HASI, Inc.

5 December 1975
Norton S. Karno is acting as counsel to Henning Heldt, the G.O., and CSC,
and also has access to and some sort of control over "the Trustee fund,"
most likely set up originally by Karno's firm in June of 1973, as above.
This also links Norton Karno to Martin Greenberg who was the central CPA to
all of CSC and the G.O.'s activities throughout the entanglements with IRS
and the entire "Snow White" affair.
Message ID: <cbdu7tsc2brqtunk0...@4ax.com>

16 April 1976
Joel Kreiner resigns as Secretary of HASI, Inc. and James "Jimmy" Mulligan
resigns as Vice President. Lynn McNeil (Michael Meisner's direct senior in
the G.O.) replaces Mulligan as Vice President, Judy Weigand replaces Joel
Kreiner as Secretary.

5 June 1976
L. Ron Hubbard pays an "adjustment tax," and the IRS tax audit that has
been being conducted out of OIO on him and Mary Sue Hubbard since at least
2 July 1973 is closed. The audit case was for the years 1971 and 1972. It
has been being worked on by Thomas R. Crate in OIO, under the supervision
of Howard Rosen. (Again, it is my informed belief, based on all surrounding
events, that Karno is handling tax and business affairs for L. Ron Hubbard
at this time.)

1 January 1977
Both Sherman and Stephen Lenske are working in Norton S. Karno's law firm,
(now called "Karno & Schwartz"), and they are both representing "various
business interests of Mr. Hubbard." (They only give 1977 as a date.)
Message ID: <ed50f9cb8257a396...@remailer.cryptofortress.com>

10 May 1977
A Certificate of Revocation is issued against HASI, Inc. by the Arizona
Corporation Commission for "FAILURE TO FILE AN ANNUAL REPORT." The statute
cited is ARIZONA REVISED STATUTES SECTION 10-095. Signatories on the
document are Bud Tims, Chairman, Ernest Garfield, Commissioner, Jim
(illegible), Commissioner, and Donald E. Vance, Executive Secretary.
Sherman and Stephen Lenske are handling L. Ron Hubbard's "business affairs"
for the firm of Karno & Schwartz.

22 May 1977
The Certificate of Revocation for HASI, Inc. is mailed back from the postal
service in Silver Springs, Maryland to the Arizona Corporation Commission
as "Moved--Not Forwardable." (This is the last record of HASI, Inc. that
the Arizona Corporation Commission has on file. HASI, Inc. is permanently
revoked as a corporation.)

8 July 1977
The FBI raids the Guardian's Offices on both coasts because of alleged
actions of the Guardian's Office and CSC (which are both being represented
by Norton Karno's firm and by Karno himself as counsel).

1 January 1978
Meade Emory's term as Assistant to Commissioner of IRS ends. (This is only
estimated because Meade Emory gives the dates for his term only as
1975-1977. I'm assuming that it is inclusive of 1977.)

11 April 1978
Shaw Management Corporation is incorporated by Sherman Lenske. Dr. Gene
Denk as President.

15 December 1979
The first known L. Ron Hubbard Will is drawn up by Sherman Lenske, naming
Norton S. Karno as Executor of the Estate, and subordinating the Estate of
L. Ron Hubbard to unspecified "business interests" that Hubbard and Karno
reportedly have in common. The Will also disinherits L. Ron Hubbard, Jr.
(Nibs, later known as Ronald DeWolf).
Message ID: <ed50f9cb8257a396...@remailer.cryptofortress.com>
http://home.earthlink.net/~snefru/deathoflrh/1979.html

1 February 1980
Laurel Sullivan and Gerald Armstrong move from Hemet to Los Angeles, taking
the "LRH Archives" there with them. Of the move, Gerry Armstrong says,
"Because of dealing with Hubbard's lawyers in LA, and for security reasons,
Laurel and I move to the Cedar complex and set up MCCS and the Hubbard
Archive." (Here is another of the generic collective noun "Hubbard's
lawyers." Yet we know that Norton S. Karno is the lawyer who has business
interests with L. Ron Hubbard, and is the named Executor for Hubbard's
Estate, and that Sherman Lenske is the lawyer who just drew up Hubbard's
Will, and that both Sherman and Stephen Lenske are representing "various
business interests of Mr. Hubbard." So I don't know who else would possibly
be "Hubbard's lawyers in LA.")
http://www.reformedscientology.org/htmldocs/1980/eval_1980.htm
Message ID: <34c522e1....@news.dowco.com>

23 February 1980
Mission Corporate Category Sort-Out (MCCS) is set up with Laurel Sullivan
as Mission 1st and Gerald Armstrong as Mission 2nd. (None of the attorneys
named in relation to MCCS have any visible, known connection to the Karno
firm where the Lenske brothers are working, but given the documented deep
involvement of Karno and the Lenskes in L. Ron Hubbard's Estate and
business affairs to this point in time, and the fact that Sherman Lenske
had just drawn up the December 1979 will naming Karno as Executor, and
given the language of that Will, and given the involvement of Karno with
CSC and the G.O., I will remain entirely convinced that MCCS had to have
been run completely under the supervision of the Karno firm until
that is somehow proven otherwise. The lawyers who have been named in
relation to MCCS are Alan Wertheimer, James "Jim" Murphy, and a Ron
Fugikawa. I believe they had to be either in Karno's firm, or had some sort
of junior working relationship with Karno's firm, and will believe that
until there is some evidence to the contrary.)
http://wpxx02.toxi.uni-wuerzburg.de/~cowen/essays/corporate.html#pt2_6

28 February 1980
L. Ron Hubbard disappears, reportedly in the company of Pat and Annie
Broeker. (It must not be forgotten, however, that Norton S. Karno is the
named Executor of L. Ron Hubbard's Estate, and that Norton S. Karno is
involved in business interests with L. Ron Hubbard at the time. It is
therefore almost virtually certain that at least Norton S. Karno, if not
the Lenske brothers as well, know exactly where L. Ron Hubbard is, and are
able to communicate with him. That is borne out by later events.)
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kspaink/cos/rmiller/bfm21.htm

1 June 1980
Gerald Armstrong becomes "involved in the selection of a writer for the
Hubbard biography." Armstrong learns that L. Ron Hubbard has "approved of a
biography proposal prepared by Omar Garrison, a writer who was not a member
of Scientology." (Here is another example where one can almost smell the
attorneys' cologne, but there is no mention of any attorney. Consider: L.
Ron Hubbard's whereabouts are generally unknown. This transaction is
supposedly concerning a writer for a biography of Hubbard's life. Surely
there would be required royalty considerations for Hubbard himself if he
were approving a biography to be written about him, with his own name
trademark being the thing that would generate the sales of the biography.
Hubbard could not be conducting any such royalty negotiations himself,
because he has supposedly disappeared. Through whom did Omar Garrison
supposedly submit this "biography proposal"? What consideration was in the
proposal for Hubbard and his Estate? Who else submitted a proposal, and
where? There are so many unanswered questions raised by these carfully
selective statements by Gerald Armstrong, and they all seem to point to
attorneys representing Hubbard's business and copyright interests. Yet
there is no mention whatsoever of any attorneys being involved. This is
just an incredible omission. This is why I include it here because there is
no possible way Garrison's participation in a biography could have even
been contemplated without attorney-crafted royalty and copyright agreements
and contracts. Armstrong even says that there was a contract with Garrison
regarding at least the access to Hubbard archive materials, but Armstrong
does not and apparently will not say who drew up that contract. It is all
very odd, but one simply must insert Norton Karno and/or the Lenske
brothers into this picture until and unless it is proven that it was some
other attorney or attorneys who handled the Garrison contracts.)
http://www.planetkc.com/sloth/sci/armstrong.html

15 September 1980
Gerald Armstrong is sent (by whom he does not say) to East Grinstead,
England, to meet Omar Garrison. (See my notes for the above record. Also,
every other known transaction later involving L. Ron Hubbard after his
disappearance, e.g. the Rocky Mt. News Interview, the letters for the
courts, and the Declaration in 1983, were conducted through his attorneys,
Sherman and Stephen Lenske. How or why would this be any exception?
Armstrong has already said he was "dealing with Hubbard's lawyers in LA."
Surely, then, Armstrong was working in conjuntion with attorneys at the
Karno firm. How could it possibly be otherwise, with Norton S. Karno named
as Executor of Hubbard's Estate, and these matters related to the alleged
biography being so directly related to the Hubbard Archives, which was the
bulk of the Estate, and to L. Ron Hubbard's name trademarks, and to L. Ron
Hubbard's own literary works and business affairs? Again we are confronted
with an account that carefully sanitizes any mention of attorneys who most
certainly had to be very closely involved. One really begins to wonder why
the attorneys are so meticulously censored from Armstrong's accounts of the
incidents. The only way such a glaring omission could be attributed to
attorney/client privelege is if Armstrong were one of their clients.
Failing that, I cannot come up with any logical explanation for Armstrong
so adroitly omitting all mention of Karno and/or the Lenske brothers, both
of whom were working in the Karno firm at the time, both of them
representing "various business interests of Mr. Hubbard.")

25 September 1980
Informed Visuals, Inc. is incorporated by Sherman Lenske (of the firm Karno
& Schwartz).

28 and 29 September 1980
Two meetings, which are recorded, are held by people involved in MCCS. The
recordings of these meetings later become known in court proceedings as the
"Zolin tapes." One of the people on the recordings, in the few bits of
transcription available, is simply called "Speaker Unidentified." It is
this unidentified speaker who says of the conversations, "It's all
privileged." (This is another indication of an attorney's presence, but
where the identity of that attorney has been protected. Whoever transcribed
the tape certainly knew the identities of everyone else present. How could
they not know the identity of this attorney whose identity is hidden by the
appelation "Speaker Unidentified"? This appears to be a willful cover-up
and protection of the attorney involved, who was almost certainly someone
connected with the Karno firm. The only people I know of who had these
tapes and could have transcribed them before they came into possession of
the courts are Gerald Armstrong and Omar Garrison. Gerald Armstrong
certainly had to know the identities of every attorney and personnel
involved with MCCS, because he was the Mission 2nd.)

1 November 1980
It is around this date that the firm Lenske, Lenske, Heller & Magasin is
formed. (The date has been computed from Sherman Lenske's November 1995
Declaration, in which he says he has been a principal of the firm for "the
past fifteen years.")

10 November 1980
The trial in "CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY OF CALIFORNIA, Petitioner v.
COMMISSIONER OF INTERNAL REVENUE, Respondent," Docket No. 3352-78, United
States Tax Court begins. (I put this here because of the coming involvement
with the Lenskes of former Assistant to Commissioner of IRS Meade Emory,
and, later, of two agents of the United States Treasury Department, all of
which occur while this case is pending in the United States Tax Court.)
http://wpxx02.toxi.uni-wuerzburg.de/~cowen/essays/irslegal/240984.html

21 November 1980
Real Rapid Reproductions is incorporated in Seattle, Washington. Leon
Misterek is the Registered Agent, at 2400 Columbia Square. (Leon Misterek
is a partner of Meade Emory, who at the time is a partner in LeSourd,
Patten, Fleming, Hartung & Emory, also at 2400 Columbia Square. Misterek
will be one of the "founders" of CST with the Lenske brothers.)

2 February 1981
Bridge Publications, Inc. is incorporated. Lawrence E. Heller is Registered
Agent.

15 April 1981
The firm of Lenske, Lenske, Heller & Magasin is supposedly retained by
Norman F. Starkey and Terri Gamboa. The principals include Sherman Lenske,
Stephen Lenske, and Lawrence Heller. There are a variety of reasons given
for their being hired, but all by different people: Norman Starkey says it
was to handle L. Ron Hubbard's "business and literary affairs" surrounding
particularly the new book "Battlefield Earth." Laurel Sullivan says it was
to restructure the corporations to hide L. Ron Hubbard's control of
Scientology. Sherman Lenske says he was hired to start handling "every
aspect of Estate planning" for L. Ron Hubbard. Regardless, Norton S. Karno
is still in the position of Executor of L. Ron Hubbard's Estate by virtue
of the prevailing 15 December 1979 Will that was drafted by Sherman Lenske.
Message ID: <2001101017032...@nym.alias.net>
http://www.lermanet.com/cos/taxanalysts/cst.txt
http://www.lermanet.com/reference/CST/Lenskeinrtcvslerma.htm

1 July 1981
Mary Sue Hubbard is removed from her position as Controller, supposedly by
David Miscavige, but it is done with "a letter prepared by lawyers" saying
that her presence as Controller "implicated Hubbard in all church matters
including the GO cases (Guardians Office)." (I don't believe it takes too
much of a stretch at this point to know who the attorneys are.) Around the
same time the Guardian's Office is disbanded by Sea Org missions. Norman F.
Starkey is an important part of those missions.
http://pages.about.com/beers66/classics4/id5.html

13 October 1981
Author Services, Inc. is incorporated by Lenske, Lenske & Heller as a
for-profit corporation with the purpose of handling L. Ron Hubbard's
"business and literary affairs." The Articles of Incorporation are executed
at the Woodland Hills offices of Lenske, Lenske & Heller. Sherman Lenske is
the Registered Agent. (ASI's incorporation had to have been done under
Sherman Lenske's supervision and control, even though his name does not
appear on the Articles, because of what he says in his 12 November 1995
Declaration, linked to below, about how and why all the corporations were
set up by him as part of L. Ron Hubbard's "Estate planning.")
http://www.lermanet.com/reference/CST/Lenskeinrtcvslerma.htm

12 November 1981
The Church of Scientology of California completes its rebuttal in "CHURCH
OF SCIENTOLOGY OF CALIFORNIA, Petitioner v. COMMISSIONER OF INTERNAL
REVENUE, Respondent," Docket No. 3352-78, United States Tax Court, ending
the trial phase. (The ruling will not be issued and filed by the Tax Court
until 24 September 1984. The events that follow which involve the Lenskes
working with former Assistant to Commissioner of IRS Meade Emory, and with
two agents of the United States Treasury Department, come while this case
is still pending in the Tax Court.)

1 January 1982
Religious Technology Center (RTC) is incorporated by Lenske, Lenske &
Heller.
http://www.lermanet.com/reference/CST/Lenskeinrtcvslerma.htm

10 May 1982
Three documents drawn up or supervised by Sherman Lenske are supposedly
signed on the same day by L. Ron Hubbard: an "Advanced Technology
Assignment," a "Trademarks Assignment," and a new Will. The new Will names
Patrick Broeker as the new Executor, but lists two successor Executors:
Lyman D. Spurlock, Jr. and Norman F. Starkey, in that order of priority.
http://home.earthlink.net/~snefru/deathoflrh/1982.html
Message ID: <3QPJMRRD3722...@frog.gilgamesh.org>

28 May 1982
The Church of Spiritual Technology (CST) is founded by Sherman Lenske,
former Assistant to Commissioner of IRS Meade Emory, Leon Misterek, and
Lyman D. Spurlock, Jr., who has just been named as first successor Executor
of the Estate of L. Ron Hubbard in the 10 May 1982 Will.
http://www.fzint.org/rhilton/CST.htm
http://www.geocities.com/thearscclibrarian/cstlegalpapers02.html

7 June 1982
The principals of Lenske, Lenske & Heller (Sherman Lenske, Stephen Lenske,
and Lawrence E. Heller) are appointed for life as Special Directors of CST
in the Bylaws of CST signed this date.
http://www.geocities.com/thearscclibrarian/cstlegalpapers03.html

3 February 1983
Sherman Lenske utilizes two agents of the United States Treasury Department
to validate documents supposedly executed by L. Ron Hubbard in order to
prove that L. Ron Hubbard is not missing, is alive and well, and that L.
Ron Hubbard's Estate and business affairs are "in good hands." The agents
are U.S. Treasury Department document inspector Howard Doulder, and
Richard L. Brunelle, a forensic chemist with the U.S. Treasury Department's
BATF. (It's staggers the imagination that, after everything now known about
the attorneys involved, as outlined above, none of the names of the
attorneys are mentioned in any of the "Hubbard" documents, and the person
whose name is most prominently featured in the documents, and who is
assigned as having most of the responsibility is David Miscavige.)
http://wpxx02.toxi.uni-wuerzburg.de/~krasel/CoS/books/lamont/append.htm
Message ID: <BKJEKAAX3722...@frog.gilgamesh.org>

I believe that is as far as I care to take this for the moment. I felt it
necessary to outline what is known so far, if even just for my own sake. I
really don't know how dirty things have to get before people finally sit up
and take notice. All of this seems to be about as dirty as it gets.

>What possible motive did Starkey have in 1985 for what appears to have
>been a pretty major fudging of dates by someone who damn well knew
>otherwise? What didn't he want the trial court to know?
>
>ptsc

Very good questions indeed. The same might well be asked about the
Stipulation of Evidence, about Gerald Armstrong and Omar Garrison,
certainly about the attorneys themselves, and even about the "L. Ron
Hubbard" who supposedly wrote letters and affidavits from some hiding spot.
They all seemed unified in a very dedicated campaign to hide and protect
the attorneys.

Cambridge

Heffer

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 12:29:37 PM12/19/01
to
On Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:17:28 -0500, ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT
net> wrote:

>http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm

Paul & Ann Minshull 0 2,056,000 (2,056,000)

Armand Berstein 0 1,122,000 (1,122,000)

Say, can I get on the $0 investment bandwagon, or
is it exclusive to Scientologists and Nigerian
Scammers?

And this one:

R.E. (Burt) Laing 423,465 5,779,597 (5,356,132)

This 13.65x investment return! For every dollar
invested, you $13.65 back. Not bad for a short
term managed investment.

Still, it doesn't beat the $0 deal where you can
get 2,056,000 for nothing.

So, are all 75 Scientologists?

Heffer

Heffer

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 12:36:07 PM12/19/01
to

Using my more polished math skills and the
Scientology 'Exchange' formula:

Given YScienos + XDollars

Flag = 1/2 XDollars ^ YScienos @ OT8

I'd say $75m of that went into Scientology
easily. Miscavige is probably praying they
don't get found out.

Heffer

ptsc

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 12:42:56 PM12/19/01
to
On Wed, 19 Dec 2001 17:29:37 GMT, hef...@scientologylies.com (Heffer) wrote:

>On Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:17:28 -0500, ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT
>net> wrote:

>>http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm

>Paul & Ann Minshull 0 2,056,000 (2,056,000)
>Armand Berstein 0 1,122,000 (1,122,000)

This is probably Armyan Bernstein.

>Say, can I get on the $0 investment bandwagon, or
>is it exclusive to Scientologists and Nigerian
>Scammers?

>And this one:

>R.E. (Burt) Laing 423,465 5,779,597 (5,356,132)

>This 13.65x investment return! For every dollar
>invested, you $13.65 back. Not bad for a short
>term managed investment.

>Still, it doesn't beat the $0 deal where you can
>get 2,056,000 for nothing.

>So, are all 75 Scientologists?

No. It seems about 39 are Scientologists. That sounds like a lot until you
count in the fact that of the original Slatkin investors, an even higher
proportion are Scientologists.

The biggest moneymaker is the duo comprised of Joel Kreiner and Stina Hans.
Kreiner as DG US Legal during the corporate restructuring. He is also
ex-law-partner (and current business partner) with James Q. Fisher. James Q.
Fisher is ex-law-partners with Norton S. Karno.

Hmm. Wonder if we could play "Six Degrees of Norton S. Karno" with the rest of
these people? Probably not, but there are interesting clusters who profited.

The other being ex-law-partners as well. Of the former partners of the law firm
Coale, Kananack and Murgatroyd, all three are on the Slatkin 75. (George W.
"Skip" Murgatroyd, however, is misspelled "Murgatroid.")

ptsc

ptsc

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 2:42:12 PM12/19/01
to
On Wed, 19 Dec 2001 17:29:37 GMT, hef...@scientologylies.com (Heffer) wrote:

>On Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:17:28 -0500, ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT
>net> wrote:

>>http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm

>Paul & Ann Minshull 0 2,056,000 (2,056,000)
>Armand Berstein 0 1,122,000 (1,122,000)

This is probably Armyan Bernstein.

(CORRECTION: This is Armyan Bernstein's DAD.)

ptsc

Feisty

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 7:24:35 PM12/19/01
to

ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in message
news:c7k12us1i9g3mogcr...@4ax.com...

Speaking of lawyers, is Slatkins this guy or just a coincidence? -

www.robertscheer.com/2_localla/00_columns/082700.htm.

Local lawyers do good
By Robert Scheer
Published August 27, 2000 in the Los Angeles Times

"Tempered ecstasy" is the way Santa Monica attorney Brian A. Sun described
the news that after eight months of solitary confinement, Wen Ho Lee will
be getting bail. Sun is the lawyer for the family of the Los Alamos
scientist who faces life imprisonment for improperly downloading files in a
case that has been marked by incredible government deception, and Sun was
concerned that government prosecutors might appeal the judge's bail ruling.
But Thursday afternoon, Sun was scrambling to assemble the bail money that
would allow Lee to go home under conditions of house arrest, where he would
at least be free of the shackles required even when he did his one hour a
week of exercise.
Sometimes the lawyers are not just the good, but the great guys. In this
case, the burden has been carried on a pro bono basis by O'Melveny & Myers
partner Mark Holscher (a former government prosecutor) and associate
Richard Myers, who were able to parse the shroud of national security
hysteria that government prosecutors wrapped around this case.
There's been quite a bit of testimony by reputable scientists that Lee is a
victim of racial profiling, and hats off to our local lawyers Sun,
Holscher, Myers and others for working against yet another era of Asian
bashing.

==

Feisty


> ptsc


ptsc

unread,
Dec 19, 2001, 7:39:23 PM12/19/01
to
On Wed, 19 Dec 2001 18:24:35 -0600, "Feisty" <su...@skytoday.com> wrote:

>Speaking of lawyers, is Slatkins this guy or just a coincidence? -

>www.robertscheer.com/2_localla/00_columns/082700.htm.

>Local lawyers do good
>By Robert Scheer
>Published August 27, 2000 in the Los Angeles Times

>"Tempered ecstasy" is the way Santa Monica attorney Brian A. Sun described
>the news that after eight months of solitary confinement, Wen Ho Lee will
>be getting bail. Sun is the lawyer for the family of the Los Alamos
>scientist who faces life imprisonment for improperly downloading files in a
>case that has been marked by incredible government deception, and Sun was
>concerned that government prosecutors might appeal the judge's bail ruling.
>But Thursday afternoon, Sun was scrambling to assemble the bail money that
>would allow Lee to go home under conditions of house arrest, where he would
>at least be free of the shackles required even when he did his one hour a
>week of exercise.

I am fairly certain that Slatkin's Brian A. Sun and this Brian A. Sun are the
same individual.

ptsc

Rev. Fredric L. Rice

unread,
Dec 18, 2001, 8:44:13 AM12/18/01
to
Xenu allowed Warrior <war...@entheta.net> to write:

>I'm posting some of the names in the report webbed at
>http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm
>so I can make my comments in brackets like this [ ].

Are these some of the crooks that managed to keep the money? For now,
I mean. Is this list of people are the people who actually made money
in this massive fraud scheme?

>REED E. SLATKIN
>Schedule of 75 Largest Net-Debtors
>For the Period January 1, 1986 through April 30, 2001
>
>Investor Name Receipt Amount Disbursement Amount Net Overpayment
>
>Joel Kreiner $ 3,143,315 $ 9,009,898 $ (5,866,583)
>& Stina Hans

Does that mean that he made 66% return on his "investment?"

>[Joel was at one time the Deputy Guardian Legal for the United States
>Guardian Office. He also represented me during 1977-1979 in a civil
>suit stemming from a felony hit-and-run auto incident in which I was
>a victim in 1977. He's a very long-time member of the cult; and he
>has been an "OT" since at least 1977. I also knew his one-time legal
>partner, James Q. Fisher, through dealings I had regarding my Scien-
>tologist employer's tax fraud and other financial irregularities during
>the mid-80s. Kreiner's legal representation of the cult in the U.S. vs.
>the E-Meter case also comes to mind.]

I see that he's not mentioned in the Federal indictments of the
so-called" Snow White" domestic espionage cases.


-- You love drugs! You love drugs, don't you?! You better
not say anything about my mother! Don't you DARE say anything
about my mother! -- Scientology's International President (Audio
files of this nutter at http://www.linkline.com/personal/frice
"What is the name of scientology's secret books?" -- a.r.s. query
"Mein Kampf." -- David Rice

Feisty

unread,
Dec 20, 2001, 12:32:17 AM12/20/01
to

ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in message
news:uoc22usj2r10vhj7d...@4ax.com...

Is that your final answer? ;)) just kidding, (eating crow)

That's interesting that he is the same lawyer. While I am not in depth of
all
the details of that case, I would wonder if his lawyer is connected to $cn.

Feisty

>
> ptsc


michael pattinson

unread,
Dec 20, 2001, 1:03:50 AM12/20/01
to
ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT net> wrote in message news:<c7k12us1i9g3mogcr...@4ax.com>...


**********************************

I personally know 10 of these people.

1. David Singer and Diana Venegas.

David is a super-scieno chiropractor who feeds fellow chiropractors
into the cult through seminars and courses. Major FSM.
Diana is a fashion designer of some talent. Home in Clearwater, very
upscale.
Both very loyal and unquestioning Scientologists who have no clue what
is really going down with the scam at mgt level and the sordid history
of deceit.
I think if they ever opened their eyes and found out they would likely
sue. I doubt that their attorneys or "ethics" would ever let them
study alt.religion.scientology newsgroup to get the facts, though.
Right now, however, they are active participants in expanding the
cult's zone of promising Total Freedom, OT powers and none of the
above really being delivered.

2. Donald and Karen Simons

Don was ownner of "Tel Soft" in Glendale till he sold it in about
1996.
He told me, on his $800,000 boat in Marina Del Rey in 1997 that Reed
Slatkin was the cult members' financial guru, total "expert" etc....I
see he got a profit before the shit hit the fan. Last I heard he was
going to take the boat to live on it at the Sandcastle Hotel mooring
in CW.
Karen has her own business, a very capable woman, who, apparently, has
not had access to ars (alt.religion.scientology) yet to get a bigger
viewpoint on the cult' s sordid history and abuses there posted!

3. Tony and Joan Lonstein

South African. Both done upper levels.
Both had a business in CW in 1980's of inflatable pool toys and
playthings."Pinch-A-Penny", I think, might have been the name of the
firm.
(As a note, I did a design for Tony of a pool dolphin which he took,
had someone change minor details then produced and sold it without
giving me my fee. Said "it was no longer my design")
I would never do business with Tony again, personally.
Both are in the bubble of extreme disinformation and false data with
regard to the cult and have not had access to sites such as
lermanet.com, www.xenu.net or alt.religion.scientology where they
might actually discover why things somehow never feel right on the
"Bridge" but they can't quite understand why!

4. Cooper and Karen Rounds

Cooper is a Californian, father Bill Rounds (now deceased I believe).
Wealthy family.
Last address I have for them is in Colorado. (I have addresses of over
300 top Scientologists).

5.Sandra (Sandy) Codding.
Very wealthy lady from Santa Rosa California now living in New Mexico
or Arizona.
From my memory of Flag Sandy was on the regges prospect list every
week for years. She got utterly sick of them! May not be on lines any
more. She should be able to access alt.religion.scientology to get at
more facts of what she was REALLY facing, and what she has supported
with her money!
Hi Sandy!!if you ever get to read this.

6. Kevin O'Donnell.

Very "in" with the Slatkin "finacial wizard" crowd. Was revered in
""OT"" circles as a finance "wonder boy" and high roller.

7. Bernardo Lan, now deceased through cancer (after OT8). Mexican was
living in Clearwater. Part of the large Lan scientology Mexican clan
from Mexico City.

8.Tim and Betsy White

Young couple, last I heard still living in Clearwater.

9.Don Currier (this is the correct spelling)

Had a big telephone company, based in L.A. area. Sold it.
Very devoted cult member, in with the Slatkin crowd as far as my
memory serves me.

10. John Coale and greta Van Susteren

I was John Coale's "twin" on New OT8 in 1990.
A genuine lawyer, need I say more?
Greta, who I met at the Sandcastle Scientology Hotel a couple of times
is a "celebrity" on Scn lines and handled by Mary Shaw (then
Voegeding), who, it was funny to see, rolled her eyes every time she
told me about trying to get Greta to fit properly into the Flag
Services routines. lol.
Now she is a major TV anchor on CNN, has hosted Larry King Live and
Burden of Proof (now axed), and asks people to email her at
askgreta.com.

************************************

The above people, apparently, made profits on the backs of innocent
scammed investors. In my considered and qualified (24 years in
Scientology) is that huge sums would have gone to so-called donations
to Scientology, IAS and other related projects from the Slatkin fraud.

I wonder how they are going to handle getting it back to give to the
creditors???
OUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!

Love,
Michael.

ptsc

unread,
Dec 20, 2001, 3:53:56 PM12/20/01
to
On Wed, 19 Dec 2001 23:32:17 -0600, "Feisty" <su...@skytoday.com> wrote:

>> I am fairly certain that Slatkin's Brian A. Sun and this Brian A. Sun are
>> the same individual.

>Is that your final answer? ;)) just kidding, (eating crow)

>That's interesting that he is the same lawyer. While I am not in depth of
>all the details of that case, I would wonder if his lawyer is connected to $cn.

I've asked various Slatkin elves about this since then, and I think I can change
that to an unqualified 'yes.' Slatkin's lawyer Brian A. Sun is the same lawyer
who represented Wen Ho Lee. Incidentally, he's damn good.

ptsc

Tilman Hausherr

unread,
Dec 20, 2001, 5:06:49 PM12/20/01
to
On Wed, 19 Dec 2001 18:24:35 -0600, "Feisty" <su...@skytoday.com> wrote
in <bdaU7.76$0s5.35917@news20>:

>www.robertscheer.com/2_localla/00_columns/082700.htm.
>
>Local lawyers do good
>By Robert Scheer
>Published August 27, 2000 in the Los Angeles Times
>
>"Tempered ecstasy" is the way Santa Monica attorney Brian A. Sun described
>the news that after eight months of solitary confinement, Wen Ho Lee will
>be getting bail. Sun is the lawyer for the family of the Los Alamos
>scientist who faces life imprisonment for improperly downloading files in a
>case that has been marked by incredible government deception, and Sun was
>concerned that government prosecutors might appeal the judge's bail ruling.
>But Thursday afternoon, Sun was scrambling to assemble the bail money that
>would allow Lee to go home under conditions of house arrest, where he would
>at least be free of the shackles required even when he did his one hour a
>week of exercise.
>Sometimes the lawyers are not just the good, but the great guys. In this
>case, the burden has been carried on a pro bono basis by O'Melveny & Myers
>partner Mark Holscher (a former government prosecutor) and associate
>Richard Myers, who were able to parse the shroud of national security
>hysteria that government prosecutors wrapped around this case.
>There's been quite a bit of testimony by reputable scientists that Lee is a
>victim of racial profiling, and hats off to our local lawyers Sun,
>Holscher, Myers and others for working against yet another era of Asian
>bashing.

Wow!!!

Reminds me of some scientology lawyer in the 70ies (I'm too lazy to look
up his name), who explained that he represented big-money-corporations
so that he had the resources to represent activists pro-bono.

--
Tilman Hausherr [KoX, SP5.55] Entheta * Enturbulation * Entertainment
til...@berlin.snafu.de http://www.xenu.de

Resistance is futile. You will be enturbulated. Xenu always prevails.

Find broken links on your web site: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/xenulink.html
The Xenu bookstore: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/bookstore.html

Feisty

unread,
Dec 20, 2001, 6:51:32 PM12/20/01
to

Tilman Hausherr <til...@berlin.snafu.de> wrote in message
news:v2o42uclo0srjpmf5...@4ax.com...

That "racial" issue is interesting. I wonder if $cn head mgmt or Slatkin
hired this guy. Slatkin seems too unstable by his (non) testimony to really
give up the
real stuff. It would make sense that $cn mgmt would want someone they could
control and make the right decision or argument to keep the "$cn name" out
of this, as well as keep $cn interest in the good. Slatking is obviously
disposablt to them. If this is a "WISE" "techbook" case, then that would
be the end of them.

An uneducated guess is that if this lawyer could place the "race card" in
this issue of sharing US secrets, then it would seem a parallel that maybe
he could "keep the $cn m.o." out of this case. There is alot at stake.
Extra interesting though that he is representing Slatkin.

I also wonder if he is $cn - was also $cn at the time of that other case.


Feisty

Tom Klemesrud

unread,
Dec 20, 2001, 9:51:46 PM12/20/01
to

ptsc wrote:
>
> On Wed, 19 Dec 2001 17:29:37 GMT, hef...@scientologylies.com (Heffer) wrote:
>
> >On Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:17:28 -0500, ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT
> >net> wrote:
>
> >>http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm
>
> >Paul & Ann Minshull 0 2,056,000 (2,056,000)
> >Armand Berstein 0 1,122,000 (1,122,000)
>
> This is probably Armyan Bernstein.

No it's his father.

LronsScam

unread,
Dec 20, 2001, 9:28:43 PM12/20/01
to
The addy of michael pattinson <kare...@aol.com>,
In article ID <a107a74a.01121...@posting.google.com>,
On or about 19 Dec 2001 22:03:50 -0800,

In this thy group <alt.religion.scientology> cometh;

michael pattinson says...

>10. John Coale and greta Van Susteren
>
>I was John Coale's "twin" on New OT8 in 1990.
>A genuine lawyer, need I say more?


Wow.. this is interesting.

roger gonnet

unread,
Dec 21, 2001, 8:09:27 AM12/21/01
to

"Heffer" <hef...@scientologylies.com> a écrit dans le message de news:
3c20cc63...@news2.lightlink.com...

> On Tue, 18 Dec 2001 17:17:28 -0500, ptsc <ptsc AT nym DOT alias DOT
> net> wrote:
>
> >http://www.slatkinfraud.com/trustee_report_75list.htm
>
> Paul & Ann Minshull 0 2,056,000 (2,056,000)
> Armand Berstein 0 1,122,000 (1,122,000)
>
> Say, can I get on the $0 investment bandwagon, or
> is it exclusive to Scientologists and Nigerian
> Scammers?

Anyway, all his majesty the fraud chief drivel masscabbage has to do to
keep the 60 % that went to his gang is claiming irreproachable morality of
his religious Ponz'Hubbard scheme, calling some of his friends, (the ones
who chant everytime he pushes their blackmail buttons on), then suing
everyone who dared to think that a fraud money could have invaded 100,00 %
of the complex ruthless global scam.

>
> And this one:
>
> R.E. (Burt) Laing 423,465 5,779,597 (5,356,132)
>
> This 13.65x investment return! For every dollar
> invested, you $13.65 back. Not bad for a short
> term managed investment.
>
> Still, it doesn't beat the $0 deal where you can
> get 2,056,000 for nothing.

Yes, I saw that one strange too. Did she say: "i'll pay later, because I
know you're defrauding the others..."??

Besides, are these Minshulls the children of the poor Ruth Minshull, whose
books ware shadowing elrong's "source" books? (Like "Miracles at
breakfast", etc)

roger


Warrior

unread,
Dec 23, 2001, 11:42:22 PM12/23/01
to

In article <20011219005324...@mb-mp.aol.com>, jim...@aol.com
wrote:


>
>Thanks for posting this, Warrior. I think that you should at long last
>realize the "OT" designation doesn't exist in the real world. "She's an

>OT too"...this sounds to me as thought [sic] you are still a scientologist.


>You should have, by now, deprogrammed yourself from this bullshit.
>
>JImdbb

[posted & mailed]

I most certainly do realize that the "OT" designation doesn't exist in the
real world. Note that I wrote:

She's an "OT" too -- not, She's an OT too.

The difference is of course in my use of quotation marks around the
term "OT".

Here's what the _American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language_
says regarding the use of quotation marks, as used by me above:

"Quotation mark -
"Usage:
"These marks may be used to indicate irony or other double meaning."

Irony is defined as:
"1. The use of words to convey the opposite of their literal meaning.
"2. An expression or utterance marked by such a deliberate contrast
between apparent and intended meaning.
"3. A literary style employing such contrasts for humorous or
rhetorical effect."

You say you consider it sounds as though I am still a Scientologist.
Well, I'm not; and I haven't been one for over 12 years. Now that I
have enlightened you regarding my intentional use of quotation marks
around the term "OT", perhaps you understand my writing style better.

I certainly have deprogrammed myself from the BS.

I've never met an "OT" in the sense that Hubbard described. They do
NOT exist.

Comprende?

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