The Guardian's Office

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Patty Pieniadz

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Mar 3, 2006, 4:32:44 AM3/3/06
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I joined the Church of Scientology's Guardians Office
{http://www.xenu.net/archive/go/gohist.htm#go_role}
in June 1979 and worked for the Boston GO for two and a half years.

Prior to joining the GO, I was the Executive Director of Narconon
Connecticut.

The qualifications for getting into the Guardian's Office were pretty
much the same as the quals for the Sea Org but in 1978, the GO did not
have the "no LSD rule", so I was able to join the GO even though I was
an "LSD case". An LSD case per Hubbard was anyone that had ever used,
LSD, PCP or Angel dust.

Per Mary Francis Newey, former Dir of Investigations. OSA Boston,
analysis showed that behind every major flap that the church has had,
there was always an EX-GO staff member "majorly" involved.

Well I guess in my case, they were right about that.

In order for me to be accepted into the GO, I had to csw
(Completed Staff Work, a Scientology phrase for writing
a proposal) and get it approved up through the command lines
to The Guardian WW, Jane Kember.

The CSW included a full life history
{http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.religion.scientology/msg/f1e8
4eba646eec6b?hl=en}, which is a very detailed personal history
including drug usage, all sex partners, family names and address, to
name a few of the more egregious questions.

I also had to provide evidence of who I am by providing
documents such as birth certificate, baptismal certificates
old report cards, health records, anything that would provide
evidence that I was who I said I was and could document it
over time.

The GO was extremely concerned about "plants" and being
infiltrated by "suppressive people" and "government agents".

Some of the other things that were needed in the CSW were
attestations from a Scientology Technical person that I made
"case gain" which mean that I made personal gains from Scientology
auditing, or in the real world means that I was deeply
indoctrinated in the Scientology belief system.

I had to show that I was NOT a slow student, and that I had
a good work ethic and could "produce products" and have
"upstats".

I could not be PTS {http://www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/dict2.html#P} or
have any PTS situations in my life and I could not have a psych
history. I also had to not be PTS A to J, which included such things
as not being open minded, not being connected to anyone that was
antagonistic to Scientology and not being a reporter.
{http://www.xenu-directory.net/glossary/glossary_p.htm}

I only had two iffy points that I had to "handle". The first was that
I had a bit of a "psych history". When I was 6 or 7 years old I was
brought to a child psychiatrist for several visits. I believe this
was after I had experience a fractured skull from a car accident. I
had to explain in detail what happened during those few psych visits
so that they could be assured I had not taken any psych drugs or been
PDH'd. PDH'd is Pain, Drugs, Hypnosis and Scientologists believe that
the psychs use Pain, drugs and hypnosis and "implant people" with
commands to destroy Scientology.

The other problem I had was that I was a "drug revert" meaning I had
used drugs after receiving auditing and because of this I had to write
a petition to The Guardian, and ask her to waive this one "out qual"
and prove that I was really all handled drug wise and had made the
appropriate amends and would never do this again.

I'm sure after reading some of my recent reports that the OSA
{http://www.xenu-directory.net/glossary/glossary_o.htm#OSA} guys think
I probably was PDH'd by that Child psychiatrist to get into
Scientology, and then after years and years of being a good
Scientologist, I would turn into a rabid critic. They actually
believe this kind of bunk and figure the only way a good Scientologist
like me, would ever turn would be because (1.) I'm PDH'd or
programmed to do this or (2.) I have hidden crimes that make me do
it.

It took months to get my CSW for joining the GO together and up
through the command lines for approval, but I finally made it and
became the Director of Rehabilitation Boston Guardian's Office.

The Guardian's Office Boston was located on the 4th and 5th floor
of the Boston Org. Only GO staff were allowed on those floors and
admittance required a key. The Keys were a very big deal. The
keys had to be on your person or completely under your control
at all times or else you would end up in a lower condition and would
have to pay to replace the door locks and make keys for all GO staff.

For example, if you went out to a restaurant, and accidentally left
your keys on the table, and out of your sight for 30 seconds, or
whatever it would take for "an agent" to switch your keys, then
you would get a lower condition assignment and have to purchase
new keys. For this reason, most staff wore the keys around their
neck and slept with them under their pillows.

Occasionally a non GO staff would be allowed in the "GO space" or
offices but only with permission and under escort. They could never
be left alone. The 4th Floor was the main GO space, and it was broken
up so that each Bureau had its own room or office. The AG (Assistant
Guardian Boston), Bobby Johnson, and his communicator wife had the
biggest and nicest office, in the building, with a balcony facing out
to the Charles River.

The Invest Office was in the front of the building and had paper shades
and curtains so no one could possibly look in with long range
telescopes. Their (Invest) door was always closed and locked. Only
Invest personnel were allowed in that space and if they did allow
other GO staff in the Invest office, the non Invest GO staff member
would have to be their under escort at all times.

Invest is the Intelligence or spy branch of the Church


The Guardians Office was organized with six Bureaus.

B1 was Investigations/Intel and included Intel gathering
On both external enemies of the Church and internally on it's own
members.

B2 was the Service Bureau which dealt with the training and "handling"
of the Guardians Office staff.

B3 was Public Relations whose purpose was to see that Scientology
was "well known and well thought of".

B4 was Legal and handled all of the Church of Scientology's legal
affairs.

B5 was Finance and would oversee all of the Church's financial
dealings.

B6 was Social Coordination and was responsible for controlling all of
the Narconon's, Applied Scholastics, any school that used LRH tech, as
well as CCHR, (their anti psych program) and other programs that fall
under the label of "Social Reform".


For a more detailed account of these bureaus and their functions see
http://www.xenu.net/archive/go/gohist.htm

BOSTON GO COMMAND CHANNELS

As Dir of Rehab Boston, If I need to get something approved I would
have to send my csw up the command channels.

A separate piece of paper would be stapled on top of each request
with the "routing".


Abbr.

AG -Assistant Guardian
SC - Social Coordination
WW- World Wide located in Saint Hill England
US - United States offices located in Los Angeles


AG SC WW<---------------7
Dir Rehab WW<-----------6
AG US<--------------------5
AG SC US<----------------4
Dir Rehab US<------------3
AG Boston<---------------2
AG SC Bsn <-------------1

From: Dir Rehab Boston.

The arrows and lines would have to be included to show the sequence of
approval and the line would be initialed by each person if they
approved it.

If it was disapproved, a reason would be given and it would be sent
back down to me without going through all the previous signers.

The reason a separate piece of paper was attached on top for approvals
is so that after it was approved, the "routing" sheet could be
shredded and no proof of responsibility could be assigned for writing
or approving the plan, program or project.

Per LRH policy the GO was autonomous and answered only to Mary Sue
Hubbard, who was The Controller and LRH's wife.

Detailed information on the Guardian's office can be found here:


http://www.xenu.net/archive/go/
http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Library/Shelf/wakefield/us-12.html
http://www.wwwaif.net/scn.php


Patty


Maureen O'Keefe

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Mar 3, 2006, 5:29:50 AM3/3/06
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I knew if I stayed up long enough, there'd be something in this snake pit
worth cozying up to and that wasn't either of those two psychopathic farts,
Lynn Farny and Gavino Idda.

I get enough of their foul winds during the work day. I don't need more of
their bodily odors in my off time.

Enjoy!

Maureen O'Keefe
OSA Invest Dir, Boston

roger gonnet

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Mar 3, 2006, 7:50:53 AM3/3/06
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"Patty Pieniadz" <ppienia...@gmail.com> a écrit dans le message de news:
46qgqbF...@individual.net...

>
>
> I joined the Church of Scientology's Guardians Office
> {http://www.xenu.net/archive/go/gohist.htm#go_role}
> in June 1979 and worked for the Boston GO for two and a half years.
>
>
> I'm sure after reading some of my recent reports that the OSA
> {http://www.xenu-directory.net/glossary/glossary_o.htm#OSA} guys think
> I probably was PDH'd by that Child psychiatrist to get into
> Scientology, and then after years and years of being a good
> Scientologist, I would turn into a rabid critic. They actually
> believe this kind of bunk and figure the only way a good Scientologist
> like me, would ever turn would be because (1.) I'm PDH'd or
> programmed to do this or (2.) I have hidden crimes that make me do
> it.

Well, if you are "PHDd" by some psychiatrists some decades ago, you look
nevertheless quite well organized mentally speaking, and terribly clearer than
the Clear Fabricant Hubbard, whose most texts are awfully unclear (sometimes on
purpose, but mostly because he was unclear!)

thanks again for the great report! Illuminating!

roger


nexi...@yahoo.co.in

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Mar 3, 2006, 8:10:20 AM3/3/06
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Patty Pieniadz wrote:

[SNIP a lot of interesting stuff]


> the only way a good Scientologist
> like me, would ever turn would be because (1.) I'm PDH'd or
> programmed to do this or (2.) I have hidden crimes that make me do
> it.

[SNIP more interesting stuff]

forgive me for changing subject, but this is something I have been
curious about since I came to a.r.s. ... (I don't want to intefere
with your "publishing schedule" - maybe you have time to answer it
later)

Is the above the/an *official* explanation for "why a good
Scientologist would ever turn" (official = the explanation that is
communicated to the "remaining good Scientologists" after a Clear or an
OT has blown)?

This would mean, that Scientology has no method (tech, E-Meter...) to
find out whether somebody is "PDH'd or has hidden crimes". You were OT
III, they didn't find out, Tory was a OTVII, they didn't find out....


and

if the above IS their official explanation it is IMHO contradicted by
this HCOB (see below - was posted by wbarwell in another thread).

my interpretation of the HCOB is that

- those "real Clears and real OTs" which are produced by
Dianetics/Scientology, "for the first time in the history of the
universe", can NO MORE be "caused to indulge in bad conduct", so bad
that they would "suddenly cease to be OT and become powerless and human
or animal."

- a Dianeticist/Scientologist in training is either a "real Clear" or
"a real OT" or NOT YET. There is no "not anymore".

- One cannot *pretend* to be Clear or OT (the E-meter is never wrong)


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HUBBARD COMMUNICATIONS OFFICE
Saint Hill Manor, East Grinstead, Sussex

HCO BULLETIN OF 18 JUNE 1965

Remimeo
Franchise

CLASS III AND UP
CLASS VII CHECK SHEET
CLEAR AND OT BEHAVIOR

We know all the attributes of Clear and Operating Thetans.

In the history of this universe there has never been a true Clear
or true OT.

Every Clear ever encountered in this universe was a Keyed-out
Clear - a Release. He still had all his bank, GPMs and engrams.
They were simply keyed out and not influencing him.

We have known that for some time. But here is a new one.

Every Operating Thetan in the history of this universe was only a
KEYED- OUT OT!

This is startling. It accounts for the wild conduct of some OTs.
They still had a complete bank (all their GPMs and engrams,
secondaries, the lot). This bank could be restimulated causing them
to indulge in bad conduct. When it was restimulated too much they
suddenly ceased to be OT and became powerless and human or animal.

Thus there has not only never been a real Clear in this universe,
also there has never been a real Operating Thetan! Every one
contacted on the track or history had an R6 bank, momentarily keyed
out.

....

We are for the first time in the history of the universe making
real Clears and real OTs, no bank.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

~{}{}{}]:)
nexibello

Bode Brausnan

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Mar 3, 2006, 1:34:07 PM3/3/06
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On Fri, 3 Mar 2006 04:32:44 -0500, "Patty Pieniadz"
<ppienia...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I joined the Church of Scientology's Guardians Office

Did you rewally believe Scientology is a "church?"

Do you now believe that Scientology is a "church?"

Kim Palmer

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Mar 3, 2006, 3:53:56 PM3/3/06
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Just a quick comment here - "not being open minded" - sounds ridiculous
when you think about it - no learning going on there if the mind is
closed....but I suppose that was the point ;-)

Susan

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Mar 3, 2006, 4:41:05 PM3/3/06
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"Kim Palmer" <yduzit...@cogeco.ca> wrote in message
news:4408ace3$1...@news2.lightlink.com...

That is exactly what I thought when I first heard that expression. Hubbard
insidiously played this type of stuff all through the cult.

Susan

wbarwell

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Mar 3, 2006, 8:54:42 PM3/3/06
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Susan wrote:


>>> I could not be PTS {http://www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/dict2.html#P} or
>>> have any PTS situations in my life and I could not have a psych
>>> history. I also had to not be PTS A to J, which included such things
>>> as not being open minded,
>>
>> Just a quick comment here - "not being open minded" - sounds ridiculous
>> when you think about it - no learning going on there if the mind is
>> closed....but I suppose that was the point ;-)
>
> That is exactly what I thought when I first heard that expression. Hubbard
> insidiously played this type of stuff all through the cult.

Does anybody recall off hand what HCOPLs or writings
stated this point not to be open minded?
KSW was one, but I know there were several more.

HCO PL 7 Feb 1965 Keeping Scientology Working
Reissued
...

Eight is not worked on hard enough.

Nine is impeded by the "reasonable" attitude of the not quite bright.

Ten is seldom done with enough ferocity.

..


So realize that we have climbed out of the mud by whatever
good luck and good sense, and refuse to sink back into it
again. See that Seven, Eight, Nine and Ten above are
ruthlessly followed and we will never be stopped. Relax
them, get reasonable about it and we will perish.

So far, while keeping myself in complete communication
with all suggestions, I have not failed on Seven. Eight,
Nine and Ten in areas I could supervise closely. But it's
not good enough for just myself and a few others to work
at this.

...

When somebody enrolls, consider he or she has joined up for the
duration of the universe -- never permit an "open-minded" approach.
If they're going to quit let them quit fast. If they enrolled, they're
aboard, and if they're aboard, they're here on the same terms as the
rest of us -- win or die in the attempt. Never let them be half-minded
about being Scientologists. The finest organizations in history have
been tough, dedicated organizations. Not one namby-pamby punch of
panty-waist dilettantes have ever made anything.

--

An Inuit hunter asked the local missionary priest: "If I did not know about
God and sin, would I go to hell?" "No," said the priest, "not if you did
not know." "Then why," asked the Inuit earnestly, "did you tell me?"
-Annie Dillard, Pilgrim at Tinker Creek

Cheerful Charlie

Pts 2

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Mar 4, 2006, 9:51:23 AM3/4/06
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Patty, VWD on your revealings. Here's another URL for the G.O.
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kspaink/cos/SecrServ/go.htm

This kind of sharing takes a great deal of courage and conviction. So
mucho THANKS from many of us. Btw, you write very well.

As one who's endured ops from Michigan, to Florida, and to
Massachusetts, it was of particular interest to read where OSA's
terrorist cells operate independently of one another. I think a lot of
us thought there was one big operation room at a command central
locale...
everybody knew everybody. But this makes much more sense for plausible
deniability for the vile cult we were once in.

In chatting with Mark Bunker, I am willing to
pay (donate) for airfare for you to fly to San Diego, or for Mark to fly
to you, to get your stories interviewed on video at www.xenutv.com If
having your voice or face
on tape is of concern, I'm sure he can blurb them or make fuzzy.

I'm certain $cn will view you as a MAJOR SP criminal now, and can expect
to see all kinds of goofy slander, smear campaigns, hate crap, and
typical cult BS on you. If at anytime you feel your life is threatened,
as an FYI, Arnie Lerma has made arrangements with the FBI for "safe
house" protection.

Your stories on the ruining of Bob Minton, Stealing Trash, and etc.,
are so compelling and confirming.

A question, do you know if $cn Op Frank Ofman is still at the Boston Org
or not? Or his where abouts? He's the guy who slugged Bob M. in the
chops, and stalked and libeled me in Massachusetts news papers.

Lastly, there is a message board at Operation Clambake www.xenu.net
where a lot of former
$cienos and ex-SeaOrgers hang out. You are welcome to join us there.

Keep your reports coming. And best wishes,

Tom
-----------------------------
Cape Cod, MA

www.fairgamed.org

Patty Pieniadz

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Mar 4, 2006, 11:39:56 AM3/4/06
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<nexi...@yahoo.co.in> wrote in message
news:1141391420.1...@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...

> Patty Pieniadz wrote:
>
> [SNIP a lot of interesting stuff]
>> the only way a good Scientologist
>> like me, would ever turn would be because (1.) I'm PDH'd or
>> programmed to do this or (2.) I have hidden crimes that make me do
>> it.
> [SNIP more interesting stuff]
>
> forgive me for changing subject, but this is something I have been
> curious about since I came to a.r.s. ... (I don't want to intefere
> with your "publishing schedule" - maybe you have time to answer it
> later)
>
> Is the above the/an *official* explanation for "why a good
> Scientologist would ever turn" (official = the explanation that is
> communicated to the "remaining good Scientologists" after a Clear or an
> OT has blown)?

They believe that the explanation for my behavior is that I must have hidden
crimes.

But that really doesn't make much sense because I've been sec check enough
times that if I had some hidden crimes they would have found them. Per
Maureen my folders have been time tracked so that means they have spent a
great deal of time trying to explain my defection. Since there's not much
their except the time I set up that implant station on Zeebid, and the time
I ran a whore house on Woldill 5.
;-> they have to explain it in another way

They explain it through the use of the Scn filter that they look through and
that teaches them how to think and what to think about just about
everything. So the most obvious answer to them in explaining my leaving Scn
and posting is that I must be a criminal.

Apparently my crimes against humanity include declaring bankruptcy. To
many Scios this won't make any sense so they will continue to try to make
sense out of it by using the Scn mindset.

They will think that I must be PTS to my husband Bobby. Afterall, Bobby was
the D/ED and then the ED of the Boston Day Org. He was a very much loved
staff member and he did a very good job of getting Boston Org moving. I
suppose he did so well because he had absolutely zero Hubbard admin
training. He held the org together and won several quarterly birthday games
and as his reward he was replaced by a fully brainwashed woman by the name
of Mary Smith. Mary spent almost 2 years out at ITO ( International
Training Org) which is the place Class V org
go to to be turned into full fledged cultists in the valence Hilter Youth.

I'll save that story for a full post to do justice to it.

Bobby blew staff in 1991 but no one made any moves to declare him because
everyone at the org knew that he's possibly the nicest guy they ever met and
certainly not an SP. To declare someone like Bobby would have been a wrong
indication to a lot of people as their was no doubt that he was a good guy.

I'm sure Maureen has labelled Bobby as my "who" and my "why" but Maureen
is only looking through her own warped viewpoint of things. Maureen has
never
really liked Bobby and at one point spent a great deal of effort trying to
get me
to leave him.

She almost successfully ruined my marriage at one point when I went into
agreement with her "views" on things. But I came to realize she was wrong
and
made things right with Bob.

Maureen, is around 55 years old, I have known her for almost 30 years and
that time
she has never had a 2D. NONE. But I have seen her be instumental in
several Scio couples getting divorced. She gives advice on 2D relationships
and most of the time it's to get them to split up. Yet she hasn't had 2D
relationship in 30 years.

I told Mary Francis Newey about this. About Maureen's weird behavior of
destroying
other people's 2D while not having one of her own and Mary Francis agreed
that Maureen was "aberrated" in that area.

But more about that later. That's another story to be told.

The other reason I might be speaking out against the Church and committing
"suppressive acts" is because I'm PDH'd.

Just think! IF someone was smart enough they could have given me the PDH
rundown and they could have handled me! (that was a joke).

The most hard core Scios will go with all 3 reasons.

1. I must have committed heinous crimes against mankind to do what I am
doing.
2. I must be pts to my husband.
3. I must have been pdh'd to be a sleeper in Scn, and then come out years
later
and turn enemy.

I used to believe this baloney and I know that Maureen and the folks at OSA
int
deeply believe it.

It wouldn't occur to them any other way.


Patty

Patty Pieniadz

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Mar 4, 2006, 11:49:02 AM3/4/06
to

"Kim Palmer" <yduzit...@cogeco.ca> wrote in message
news:4408ace3$1...@news2.lightlink.com...
> Patty Pieniadz wrote:

>>
>> I could not be PTS {http://www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/dict2.html#P} or
>> have any PTS situations in my life and I could not have a psych
>> history. I also had to not be PTS A to J, which included such things
>> as not being open minded,
>
> Just a quick comment here - "not being open minded" - sounds ridiculous
> when you think about it - no learning going on there if the mind is
> closed....but I suppose that was the point ;-)


Yes, and now I look back and wonder how I ever was able to agree with the
idea that being open minded was a bad thing.

In Scn-think being opened minded was a bad thing. In Scn-think, a person
has a reactive mind and part of the trap of the reactive mind is to lead you
off the road of Scn. Scientologists believe that the reactive mind is
designed not to be found and
has "traps" in it to lead you astray so that it will survive. In Scn-think,
the reactive mind wants to survive to help your survival and so it will lead
you away from Scn and into "other roads" or other practices" so that you
will forget about getting rid of it.
In Scn-think, only auditing can help you rid yourself permanently of the
reactive mind
and only Scn ethics will keep you on the straight and narrow while you are
going up the "Bridge to Total Freedom".

If you believe all this, then the whole thing makes sense. If you are an
outsider looking in and don't believe that way, then you see this for what
it really is.
Mind control.


Patty


Patty Pieniadz

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Mar 4, 2006, 12:08:02 PM3/4/06
to

"Pts 2" <pt...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:13803-440...@storefull-3337.bay.webtv.net...

> Patty, VWD on your revealings. Here's another URL for the G.O.
> http://www.xs4all.nl/~kspaink/cos/SecrServ/go.htm
>
> This kind of sharing takes a great deal of courage and conviction. So
> mucho THANKS from many of us. Btw, you write very well.

Thanks :)


>
> In chatting with Mark Bunker, I am willing to
> pay (donate) for airfare for you to fly to San Diego, or for Mark to fly
> to you, to get your stories interviewed on video at www.xenutv.com If
> having your voice or face
> on tape is of concern, I'm sure he can blurb them or make fuzzy.

What a very nice offer.

I am currently on a very sensible diet and I've lost 18 pounds in the past
5 weeks. I have a lot more to go. When I get back into a size 10, I might
take you up on this offer. It's going to be a while, I have a lot of pounds
to
get rid of. It won't be necessary to blur anything, at least I hope not!


>
> I'm certain $cn will view you as a MAJOR SP criminal now, and can expect
> to see all kinds of goofy slander, smear campaigns, hate crap, and
> typical cult BS on you. If at anytime you feel your life is threatened,
> as an FYI, Arnie Lerma has made arrangements with the FBI for "safe
> house" protection.

Thank you, but I am very well protected right now as all my friends, family,
co workers, my boss, my neighbors and the local police dept were all
educated about the cult prior to my posting.

All had the same reaction, they were happy to be told and were disgusted at
their behavior.

At one party I pulled up the Religious Freedom Watch Page on me and showed
everyone. I wish I had video'd that because people were at first shocked
and then
they just laughed at the absurdity of it. One friend is a 4th grade teacher
and told me it sounds like something written by one of her 4th graders, just
childish and dumb. But Scn has no perception of this. They do live in an
alternate world.

Patty

>
> Your stories on the ruining of Bob Minton, Stealing Trash, and etc.,
> are so compelling and confirming.
>
> A question, do you know if $cn Op Frank Ofman is still at the Boston Org
> or not? Or his where abouts? He's the guy who slugged Bob M. in the
> chops, and stalked and libeled me in Massachusetts news papers.

Frank Ofman joined OSA after I moved to Connecticut. Not sure of the year.
Maybe the mid 90's. I never had any dealing with him so I can not be
helpful.
I know he married the daugther of Bernard and Carolyn Percy. Iirc, the
daughter
changed her first name a few times and I don't remember what those names
were.

http://www.truthaboutscientology.com/stats/by-name/f/frank-ofman.html

Per this, it looks like he was trained to be a cramming officer in 2002. He
may not be in OSA anymore, but I have no first hand knowledge of him.

>
> Lastly, there is a message board at Operation Clambake www.xenu.net
> where a lot of former
> $cienos and ex-SeaOrgers hang out. You are welcome to join us there.

Eventually, I will probably make it over there. Right now I am working my
way through all the replies that I owe people, all the emails that need to
be replied to
and all the phone calls. So I don't want to add anything more or I'll end
up spending my life on the computer and not on living my life.

Kim Palmer

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Mar 4, 2006, 3:31:04 PM3/4/06
to
A better explanation is unavailable anywhere - thank you - this is the
kind of thing that is important for people to read and to learn because
it will help others out of the trap and many to avoid the trap that is
mind control.

Thank you

Kim P

Mark Thorson

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Mar 4, 2006, 6:10:41 PM3/4/06
to
Patty Pieniadz wrote:
>
> But that really doesn't make much sense because
> I've been sec check enough times that if I had
> some hidden crimes they would have found them.

Not if your auditor was an infiltrator and filed
a false report. We do that all the time! :-)

Mike O'Connor

unread,
Mar 4, 2006, 9:15:41 PM3/4/06
to
In article <120hshg...@corp.supernews.com>,
wbarwell <wbar...@mylinuxisp.com> wrote:

> >>> I could not be PTS {http://www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/dict2.html#P} or
> >>> have any PTS situations in my life and I could not have a psych
> >>> history. I also had to not be PTS A to J, which included such things
> >>> as not being open minded,
> >>
> >> Just a quick comment here - "not being open minded" - sounds ridiculous
> >> when you think about it - no learning going on there if the mind is
> >> closed....but I suppose that was the point ;-)
> >
> > That is exactly what I thought when I first heard that expression. Hubbard
> > insidiously played this type of stuff all through the cult.
>
> Does anybody recall off hand what HCOPLs or writings
> stated this point not to be open minded?
> KSW was one, but I know there were several more.


++++++++++++ SACRED CULT SCRIPTURE +++++++++++++

When somebody enrols, consider he or she has joined up for the duration
of the universe‹never permit an łopen-minded˛ approach. If theyąre
going to quit let them quit fast. If they enrolled, theyąre aboard, and
if theyąre aboard, theyąre here on the same terms as the rest of us‹win

or die in the attempt. Never let them be half-minded about being
Scientologists. The finest organizations in history have been tough,

dedicated organizations. Not one namby-pamby bunch of panty-waist
dilettantes have ever made anything. Itąs a tough universe. The social
veneer makes it seem mild. But only the tigers survive‹and even they
have a hard time. Weąll survive because we are tough and are dedicated.
When we do instruct somebody properly he becomes more and more tiger.
When we instruct half-mindedly and are afraid to offend, scared to
enforce, we donąt make students into good Scientologists and that lets
everybody down. When Mrs. Pattycake comes to us to be taught, turn that
wandering doubt in her eye into a fixed, dedicated glare and sheąll win
and weąll all win. Humour her and we all die a little. The proper
instruction attitude is, łYouąre here so youąre a Scientologist. Now
weąre going to make you into an expert auditor no matter what happens.
Weąd rather have you dead than incapable.˛

-- L. Ron Hubbard
HCO POLICY LETTER OF 7 FEBRUARY 1965
REISSUED 15 JUNE 1970
"KEEPING SCIENTOLOGY WORKING"


++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

--
LYING IS A SCIENTOLOGY SACRAMENT
ASK THEM ABOUT XENU
Remember Lisa McPherson

roger gonnet

unread,
Mar 5, 2006, 4:45:12 AM3/5/06
to

"Patty Pieniadz" <ppienia...@gmail.com> a écrit dans le message de news:
46u1h8F...@individual.net...

>
> <nexi...@yahoo.co.in> wrote in message
> news:1141391420.1...@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
>> Patty Pieniadz wrote:
>>
>> [SNIP a lot of interesting stuff]
>>> the only way a good Scientologist
>>> like me, would ever turn would be because (1.) I'm PDH'd or
>>> programmed to do this or (2.) I have hidden crimes that make me do
>>> it.
>> [SNIP more interesting stuff]
>>
>> forgive me for changing subject, but this is something I have been
>> curious about since I came to a.r.s. ... (I don't want to intefere
>> with your "publishing schedule" - maybe you have time to answer it
>> later)
>>
>> Is the above the/an *official* explanation for "why a good
>> Scientologist would ever turn" (official = the explanation that is
>> communicated to the "remaining good Scientologists" after a Clear or an
>> OT has blown)?
>
> They believe that the explanation for my behavior is that I must have hidden
> crimes.

I don't believe they believe it really, since every time they have seen in the
past the "asking to come back in the group" of their collegues, they can have
observed that most O/Ws disclosed there were similar to their own "crimes" --
but the word "crime" is heavily misacpplicated in scientologgy to mean any error
that could have any negative result (or "not enough positive results") on the
cult.


>
> But that really doesn't make much sense because I've been sec check enough
> times that if I had some hidden crimes they would have found them. Per
> Maureen my folders have been time tracked so that means they have spent a
> great deal of time trying to explain my defection. Since there's not much
> their except the time I set up that implant station on Zeebid, and the time I
> ran a whore house on Woldill 5.
> ;-> they have to explain it in another way
>
>
>
> They explain it through the use of the Scn filter that they look through and
> that teaches them how to think and what to think about just about everything.
> So the most obvious answer to them in explaining my leaving Scn and posting is
> that I must be a criminal.
>
> Apparently my crimes against humanity include declaring bankruptcy. To
> many Scios this won't make any sense so they will continue to try to make
> sense out of it by using the Scn mindset.

They consider the "not enough money" as "acting like a withhold", that's what
ron said. It could explain the crazy reasoning here.


>
> They will think that I must be PTS to my husband Bobby. Afterall, Bobby was
> the D/ED and then the ED of the Boston Day Org. He was a very much loved
> staff member and he did a very good job of getting Boston Org moving. I
> suppose he did so well because he had absolutely zero Hubbard admin training.

You're really right: following the stoopid OEC volumes -especially volumes One
Ethics and Three Finances - is the worse loss of time and energy one can imagine
to drwon the stats of an org. Most of these volumes tells a lot of Hubbard
paranoia and schizophrenia, not to forget his inaptiutude to observe his own
contradictions. FOLO Eu rope has destroyed in three months what my wife and me
had built in eight years at Lyon Org, using what they understood of OEC


He held the org together and won several quarterly birthday games
> and as his reward he was replaced by a fully brainwashed woman by the name of
> Mary Smith. Mary spent almost 2 years out at ITO ( International Training
> Org) which is the place Class V org
> go to to be turned into full fledged cultists in the valence Hilter Youth.
>
> I'll save that story for a full post to do justice to it.
>
> Bobby blew staff in 1991 but no one made any moves to declare him because
> everyone at the org knew that he's possibly the nicest guy they ever met and
> certainly not an SP. To declare someone like Bobby would have been a wrong
> indication to a lot of people as their was no doubt that he was a good guy.

In 1991, yes, but in 1981-82 he would have been declared. Fads of the crime
cult's puppets change...

>
> I'm sure Maureen has labelled Bobby as my "who" and my "why" but Maureen
> is only looking through her own warped viewpoint of things. Maureen has never
> really liked Bobby and at one point spent a great deal of effort trying to get
> me
> to leave him.
>
> She almost successfully ruined my marriage at one point when I went into
> agreement with her "views" on things. But I came to realize she was wrong and
> made things right with Bob.

Do you think she could have been jealous (or in secret love for you, or
whatever?) - just a question.

>
> Maureen, is around 55 years old, I have known her for almost 30 years and that
> time
> she has never had a 2D. NONE. But I have seen her be instumental in
> several Scio couples getting divorced. She gives advice on 2D relationships
> and most of the time it's to get them to split up. Yet she hasn't had 2D
> relationship in 30 years.

This strengthen my doubts on her bahaviour's causes.

>
> I told Mary Francis Newey about this. About Maureen's weird behavior of
> destroying
> other people's 2D while not having one of her own and Mary Francis agreed that
> Maureen was "aberrated" in that area.
>
> But more about that later. That's another story to be told.
>
> The other reason I might be speaking out against the Church and committing
> "suppressive acts" is because I'm PDH'd.
>
> Just think! IF someone was smart enough they could have given me the PDH
> rundown and they could have handled me! (that was a joke).
>
> The most hard core Scios will go with all 3 reasons.
>
> 1. I must have committed heinous crimes against mankind to do what I am
> doing.
> 2. I must be pts to my husband.
> 3. I must have been pdh'd to be a sleeper in Scn, and then come out years
> later
> and turn enemy.
>
> I used to believe this baloney and I know that Maureen and the folks at OSA
> int
> deeply believe it.
>
> It wouldn't occur to them any other way.

Very interesting post, one more!

Thanks, Patty

r


roger gonnet

unread,
Mar 5, 2006, 4:48:40 AM3/5/06
to

"Patty Pieniadz" <ppienia...@gmail.com> a écrit dans le message de news:
46u1h8F...@individual.net...
>
> "Kim Palmer" <yduzit...@cogeco.ca> wrote in message
> news:4408ace3$1...@news2.lightlink.com...
>> Patty Pieniadz wrote:
>
>>>
>>> I could not be PTS {http://www.xemu.demon.co.uk/clam/dict2.html#P} or
>>> have any PTS situations in my life and I could not have a psych
>>> history. I also had to not be PTS A to J, which included such things
>>> as not being open minded,
>>
>> Just a quick comment here - "not being open minded" - sounds ridiculous when
>> you think about it - no learning going on there if the mind is closed....but
>> I suppose that was the point ;-)
>
>
> Yes, and now I look back and wonder how I ever was able to agree with the idea
> that being open minded was a bad thing.

Are you sure you ever were agreeing really with that?

I've asked similar questions to many exes; and most answered that they NEVER
believed really, or never understood really such or such notions, like
"Reality = Agreement",
or like
"Poor = lowstats, = lowtone etc."
or:
"helping low stats is suppressive"

roger gonnet

unread,
Mar 5, 2006, 4:51:14 AM3/5/06
to

"Patty Pieniadz" <ppienia...@gmail.com> a écrit dans le message de news:
46u1h8F...@individual.net...
>
> "Pts 2" <pt...@webtv.net> wrote in message
> news:13803-440...@storefull-3337.bay.webtv.net...
>> Patty, VWD on your revealings. Here's another URL for the G.O.
>> http://www.xs4all.nl/~kspaink/cos/SecrServ/go.htm
>>
>> This kind of sharing takes a great deal of courage and conviction. So
>> mucho THANKS from many of us. Btw, you write very well.
>
> Thanks :)
>
>
>>
>> In chatting with Mark Bunker, I am willing to
>> pay (donate) for airfare for you to fly to San Diego, or for Mark to fly
>> to you, to get your stories interviewed on video at www.xenutv.com If
>> having your voice or face
>> on tape is of concern, I'm sure he can blurb them or make fuzzy.
>
> What a very nice offer.
>
> I am currently on a very sensible diet and I've lost 18 pounds in the past
> 5 weeks. I have a lot more to go. When I get back into a size 10, I might
> take you up on this offer. It's going to be a while, I have a lot of pounds
> to
> get rid of. It won't be necessary to blur anything, at least I hope not!

I'm not sure this has any importance for most people who could listen to you.
Things you're saying are quite interesting!

r


Tilman Hausherr

unread,
Mar 5, 2006, 1:13:55 PM3/5/06
to
On Sat, 4 Mar 2006 11:39:56 -0500, "Patty Pieniadz"
<ppienia...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Maureen, is around 55 years old, I have known her for almost 30 years and
>that time
>she has never had a 2D. NONE. But I have seen her be instumental in
>several Scio couples getting divorced. She gives advice on 2D relationships
>and most of the time it's to get them to split up. Yet she hasn't had 2D
>relationship in 30 years.

Kindof ironic that Maureen O'Keefe has been named a "love goddess" :-)

Or maybe Maureen O'Keefe prefers women, but of course she can't "come
out" within scientology. Very sad!

Tilman

--
Tilman Hausherr [KoX, SP5.55] Entheta * Enturbulation * Entertainment
http://www.xenu.de

Resistance is futile. You will be enturbulated. Xenu always prevails.

Find broken links on your web site: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/xenulink.html
The Xenu bookstore: http://home.snafu.de/tilman/bookstore.html

ladayla

unread,
Mar 5, 2006, 1:43:24 PM3/5/06
to
It's really interesting- the different experiences scn'ists have. You
had to jump through all those hoops to be in the GO, but I didn't have
to jump thru them to audit *you* (GO). I could hear all about the dirty
tricks and whatever else a GO member wanted to tell an auditor. I was
bonded not to talk about or disclose any of it. The bond was something
I thought of as huge at the time. $ 500,000.00 iirc. I told them that I
would sign it, but my signature meant nothing as the amount was out of
my reality. I suggested that they give me a Bond for $500.00 as that
would actually mean something to me. The Bond thing seemed redundant to
me as I was honor-bound by the Auditor's Code to not divulge any info
gotten in session.

la

Patty Pieniadz

unread,
Mar 5, 2006, 3:57:13 PM3/5/06
to

I never really thought about it but you're right. GO/OSA staff have to go
through
a lot of security clearances yet the person that is auditing them and
hearing all the dirt does not.

I know that any one that audited GO/OSA staff had to first get an
OSA Okay. Meaning OSA has to approve of them.

For instance, there was a Class 8 auditor at the Boston Org named Mark List.
I don't know what ever became of Mark but I would hope he smartened up and
left.
Mark was a bit of a rebel and didn't take a lot of guff so OSA would never
approve him to audit or C/S any of the GO/OSA staff.

Mark was also not permitted to audit Earl Cooley who was a big shot Scn
attorney
that lived in Boston.

John Magerowski, a truly wonderful man, and a Class V auditor would go to
Earl's office in downtown Boston or he would go to his penthouse apartment
on the wharf, and audit Earl.

The session folders would be overnighted to RTC or whoever was the C/S and a
new C/S was called in to John.

Mark List was a Class 8 and the highest trained tech terminal on the East
Coast
and they wouldn't let him go near Earl Cooley because Mark didn't have the
right
attitude or in other words was not in the right mindset for them.

Only the most indoctrinated get to be on GO/OSA staff. If you don't behave
yourself, and follow their rules, then you are a "security risk".

Obviously, this means that I was one very indoctrinated Scio.

I'm so glad to be out of there. Every day I am truly freer. But the
freedom
is not from the things Scn thinks is bad. My freedom is the freedom of my
Scn mind. What an evil trap it turned out to be.

Patty

nexi...@yahoo.co.in

unread,
Mar 6, 2006, 9:04:34 AM3/6/06
to
Thanks, Patty

my conclusion:

per "Scientology definition" you don't exist, neither does Tory nor all
the other former Clears and especially former OTs who have turned
critics. Your sheer existence is against the "Scientology laws of
nature"

:D

that would be fun:

a journalist who (after having done some extensive research into the
matter) grills Rinder about that subject ....

I'm looking forward to reading more of your stories

~{}{}{}]:)
nexibello

ladayla

unread,
Mar 6, 2006, 1:15:09 PM3/6/06
to
Thanks for this info about Earl Cooley having been audited. A few years
ago, a lawyer, and I can't for the life of me recall which one, asked
me if Earl Cooley was a scientologist. I was sure that he was but I
couldn't find any kind of proof. Only thing I had was a tape where he
announced that " I am one of you". That wasn't specific enough, of
course. Hopefully, someone reading this post, maybe the Warrior, will
know who that lawyer was/is. If the info is still valuable, the lawyer
can now have it. Earl was quite the showdog for rtc during the
so-called religious freedom crusade in LA. He was good. He would get
all florid and short of breath, and one day he fell on the floor in an
apoplectic seizure, delaying the trial until new strategy could be
devised.Earl Cooley is the guy that the description "junkyard dog" was
taken from.
I hope that you ( or others ) don't think that I am de-railing your
posts when I reply with some old story or another. Your messages jog my
memory, and at this time in my life, I am purging. It is so so good for
me to read things in your messages like" when purpose was senior to
policy" )and "( before policy was senior to tech)". I swear that you
could've been listening in on a conversation I had with ACW last week
when I said exactly those same things.
Stay with us. It is joy for me to read these posts from one who has
personal experiences to relate.

la

Patty Pieniadz

unread,
Mar 6, 2006, 4:06:50 PM3/6/06
to

"ladayla" <mor...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:1141668909.1...@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...


> I hope that you ( or others ) don't think that I am de-railing your
> posts when I reply with some old story or another.


Not at all. I've been reading ars for a while and have always enjoyed your
posts.


Your messages jog my
> memory, and at this time in my life, I am purging. It is so so good for
> me to read things in your messages like" when purpose was senior to
> policy" )and "( before policy was senior to tech)". I swear that you
> could've been listening in on a conversation I had with ACW last week
> when I said exactly those same things.

It's so different now.

I didn't really have much trouble with the C of S for the 30 years I was in.

I had a few incorrect ethics conditions, but other than that I was never
mistreated. I think it's probably because most of the staff knew that I
would not tolerate any crap.

I knew LRH policy and my understanding of it was that it was supposed to be
benign. Obviously I was mistaken.

I was a "standard tech" kind of gal so if staff bothered me with stuff,
including trying to reg me, I handled it by quoting policy at them and got
them off my back.

The fact was that I knew more policy and tech than most of the staff
and when I was being "handled" I usually ended up handling the handler.

My husband once told me that most of the staff were afraid of me. When I
was a Scientologist I would have thought that was a compliment! It meant I
had "ethics presence"! Now that I've left Scn and started to view the
world differently, I cringe at how I used to be. I was cold, unsympathetic,
unreasonable know it all and an intense bitch. I was not nice" to
people. I called things as a saw them and had a low tolerance for "woggy"
behavior. It was tough to confront that about myself but I knew early on
that my journey of getting out of the Scn mindset was going to be an
interesting and difficult ride.

My SP declare tells me that all my certs and awards have been cancelled, but
who cares. I still did the courses and have knowledge of Scn tech and
admin. It's not like they are of any use to anyone outside this newsgroup.
Having a thorough understanding of Scn is like having a thorough
understanding of what a dumbass you've been for so long.

So I have the dubious achievement of being "An Expert on a Wacky Cult".

I am a fully hatted ED, and I've read most of the OEC Volumes and much of
the tech volumes on my own because I wanted to.

I was an old HSDC (Hubbard Standard Dianetics Course) auditor that co-
audited hundreds of hours of R3R and loved it. Some may think that
my indoctrination is showing. I loved auditing and watching people have
realizations about their lives that would release them from some burden that
was weighing them down was just plain right fun.

But honestly, I don't want to get into that because It has no interest for
me anymore. I won't be going into session ever again. I know longer "need
to get a session".

I trained up to Class I Auditor but was mainly trained on admin courses.
including the Data Series Evaluator's Course, and GO PR training courses.
One of these days I'll see if I can find a list of all the courses I've done
because I doubt I could remember them all.

The Scn courses are not useful to me in the real world, but they are
of use to me here on ars in that I can help answer questions about it.

Many of the long term critics know the subject of Scientology very well
but they miss certain nuances that maybe I can explain.

> Stay with us. It is joy for me to read these posts from one who has
> personal experiences to relate.


Oh, I'll be around :)

--
Patty

If you would like to email me, remove the words
"no spam"from my email address.

TIP #1

In order to properly eat a doughnut you need some liquids
to wash it down. Coffee, milk, and Mountain Dew are the
three most widely accepted doughnut chasers with coffee
and milk having the added value of 'dunkability'.


Barbara Schwarz

unread,
Mar 6, 2006, 5:04:06 PM3/6/06
to

Patty Pieniadz schrieb:

> I joined the Church of Scientology's Guardians Office

See, how wise L. Ron Hubbard is not allowing LDS cases like yourself in
the Sea Org. He knew in advance how you would work out, Patty.

--
Barbara Schwarz
Looking for the original Mark (Marty) Rathbun. (No impostor, please!)
--
L. Ron Hubbard: "THE CRIMINAL ACCUSES OTHERS OF THINGS WHICH HE HIMSELF
IS DOING. THE CRIMINAL MIND RELENTLESSLY SEEKS TO DESTROY ANYONE IT
IMAGINES MIGHT EXPOSE IT. THE CRIMINAL ONLY SEES OTHERS AS HE HIMSELF
IS."
L. Ron Hubbard: "HONEST PEOPLE HAVE RIGHTS, TOO."

http://www.thunderstar.net/~Schwarz/
(I am concerned about Dave Touretzky's activities.)

http://www.religiousfreedomwatch.org/extremists/

Read the pages on terrorist-friendly Andreas Heldal-Lund (arrested for
harassment):
http://www.religiousfreedomwatch.org/extremists/lund/Lund04.html

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