lessons here from jaredite record

[Mulligan]

http://www.lds.org/scriptures/bofm/ether/3?lang=eng#

Seest thou that ye are created after mine own image? Yea, even all men
were created in the beginning after mine own image.

16 Behold, this body, which ye now behold, is the body of my spirit;
and man have I created after the body of my spirit; and even as I
appear unto thee to be in the spirit will I appear unto my people in
the flesh.

and all this, that this man might know that he was God, because of the
many great works which the Lord had showed unto him.

19 And because of the knowledge of this man he could not be kept from
beholding within the veil; and he saw the finger of Jesus, which, when
he saw, he fell with fear; for he knew that it was the finger of the
Lord; and he had faith no longer, for he knew, nothing doubting.

20 Wherefore, having this perfect knowledge of God, he could not be
kept from within the veil; therefore he saw Jesus; and he did minister
unto him.

7 And in that day that they shall exercise afaith in me, saith the
Lord, even as the brother of Jared did, that they may become
bsanctified in me, then will I cmanifest unto them the things which
the brother of Jared saw, even to the unfolding unto them all my
drevelations, saith Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the eFather of the
heavens and of the earth, and all things that in them are.

8 And he that will acontend against the word of the Lord, let him be
accursed; and he that shall bdeny these things, let him be accursed;
for unto them will I show cno greater things, saith Jesus Christ; for
I am he who speaketh.

9 And at my command the heavens are opened and are ashut; and at my
word the bearth shall shake; and at my command the inhabitants thereof
shall pass away, even so as by fire.

10 And he that believeth not my words believeth not my disciples; and
if it so be that I do not speak, judge ye; for ye shall know that it
is I that speaketh, at the alast day.

11 But he that abelieveth these things which I have spoken, him will
I visit with the manifestations of my Spirit, and he shall bknow and
bear record. For because of my Spirit he shall cknow that these things
are dtrue; for it persuadeth men to do good.

16 And then shall my arevelations which I have caused to be written by
my servant John be unfolded in the eyes of all the people. Remember,
when ye see these things, ye shall know that the time is at hand that
they shall be made manifest in very deed.

17 Therefore, awhen ye shall receive this record ye may know that the
work of the Father has commenced upon all the face of the land.

18 Therefore, arepent all ye ends of the earth, and come unto me, and
believe in my gospel, and be baptized in my name; for he that
believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not
shall be damned; and csigns shall follow them that believe in my name.

19 And blessed is he that is found faithful unto my name at the last
day, for he shall be lifted up to dwell in the kingdom prepared for
him from the foundation of the world. And behold it is I that hath
spoken it. Amen.


http://www.lds.org/scriptures/bofm/ether/12?lang=eng

would speak somewhat concerning these things; I would show unto the
world that faith is things which are hoped for and not seen;
wherefore, dispute not because ye see not, for ye receive no witness
until after the trial of your faith.

12 For if there be no faith among the children of men God can do no
miracle among them; wherefore, he showed not himself until after their
faith.

16 Yea, and even all they who wrought miracles wrought them by faith,
even those who were before Christ and also those who were after.

18 And neither at any time hath any wrought miracles until after their
faith; wherefore they first believed in the Son of God.

19 And there were many whose faith was so exceedingly strong, even
before Christ came, who could not be kept from within the veil, but
truly saw with their eyes the things which they had beheld with an eye
of faith, and they were glad.

20 And behold, we have seen in this record that one of these was the
brother of Jared; for so great was his faith in God, that when God put
forth his finger he could not hide it from the sight of the brother of
Jared, because of his word which he had spoken unto him, which word he
had obtained by faith.

21 And after the brother of Jared had beheld the finger of the Lord,
because of the promise which the brother of Jared had obtained by
faith, the Lord could not withhold anything from his sight

26 And when I had said this, the Lord spake unto me, saying: Fools
mock, but they shall mourn; and my grace is sufficient for the meek,
that they shall take no advantage of your weakness;

27 And if men come unto me I will show unto them their weakness. I
give unto men weakness that they may be humble; and my grace is
sufficient for all men that humble themselves before me; for if they
humble themselves before me, and have faith in me, then will I make
weak things become strong unto them.

28 Behold, I will show unto the Gentiles their weakness, and I will
show unto them that faith, hope and charity bringeth unto me—the
fountain of all righteousness.

30 For the brother of Jared said unto the mountain Zerin, Remove—and
it was removed. And if he had not had faith it would not have moved;
wherefore thou workest after men have faith.

33 And again, I remember that thou hast said that thou hast loved the
world, even unto the laying down of thy life for the world, that thou
mightest take it again to prepare a place for the children of men.

[Mulligan]

On Dec 27, 9:49 am, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:

> and all this, that this man might know that he was God, because of the
> many great works which the Lord had showed unto him.
>
>  19 And because of the knowledge of this man he could not be kept from
> beholding within the veil; and he saw the finger of Jesus, which, when
> he saw, he fell with fear; for he knew that it was the finger of the
> Lord; and he had faith no longer, for he knew, nothing doubting.
>

increasing faith because of things happening leads to knowledge

as knowledge grows towards 100% confidence ....

[Nick Youngh]

On 27 dec, 18:56, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 27, 9:49 am, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:

Lessons here from the Jaredite records

On 29 jun, 19:17, Geiserik <dejonghn...@hotmail.com> wrote:
(Wikipedia)
The Book of Ether parallels in many ways the story of The Book of
Mormon as a whole. A small group (Jared and his companions; Lehi and
his family) separate themselves from a wicked society (the Tower of
Babel; Jerusalem just prior to its destruction) and establish a new
nation (the Jaredites; the Nephites) in "the promised land." In each
case the group is divided following the death of the original leaders
and the divisions contend for many generations. The fortunes of the
nations are dependent upon their obedience to God -- righteousness
brings prosperity and wickedness brings destruction (sometimes
delayed). Ultimately, the wicked prevail and the nation is destroyed.
[citation needed]

> > > > On 29 jun, 14:54, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> The Mormon book Ether has no dates under its pages, but could be dated
> by some remarkable events.
> First is there the confounding of languages in the Tower of Babylon.
> Up till now Mormons dated that event as far as 2000BC.
> But there could not have been a confounding of Lenguages without tower
> and modern archeologist put the date of the
> rebuilding of the Ziggurat around 610BC,the time of Lehi and Nephi.


> (Wikipedia)


> > > > Etemenanki (Sumerian: "temple of the foundation of heaven and earth")
> > > > was the name of a ziggurat dedicated to Marduk in the city of Babylon.
> > > > It was famously rebuilt by the 6th century BC Neo-Babylonian dynasty
> > > > rulers Nabopolassar and Nebuchadnezzar II. According to modern
> > > > scholars such as Stephen L. Harris, the biblical story of the Tower of
> > > > Babel was likely influenced by Etemenanki during the Babylonian
> > > > captivity of the Hebrews.


> Not surprising straight thereafter Erher comes with a sea journey from
> the Red Sea till "the promised land"" clearly the same journey as
> that of Lehi and Nephi in 600BC ,
> which was the same as "the circumnavigation of Africa"by pharaoah
> Necho in the same year"


> > > Herodotus, The Histories 4.42
> > > Libya is washed on all sides by the sea except where it joins Asia, as
> > > was first demonstrated, so far as our knowledge goes, by the Egyptian
> > > king Necho, who, after calling off the construction of the canal
> > > between the Nile and the Arabian gulf, sent out a fleet manned by a
> > > Phoenician crew with orders to sail west about and return to Egypt and
> > > the Mediterranean by way of the Straits of Gibraltar. The Phoenicians
> > > sailed from the Arabian gulf into the southern ocean, and every autumn
> > > put in at some convenient spot on the Libyan coast, sowed a patch of
> > > ground, and waited for next year's harvest. Then, having got in their
> > > grain, they put to sea again, and after two full years rounded the
> > > Pillars of Heracles in the course of the third, and returned to Egypt.
> > > These men made a statement which I do not myself believe, though
> > > others may, to the effect that as they sailed on a westerly course
> > > round the southern end of Libya, they had the sun on their right - to
> > > northward of them. This is how Libya was first discovered by sea.-


> Another time indication comes from the 2 million invasion army of the
> Persian king Xerxes (500BC)


> > The numbers of troops which Xerxes mustered for the second invasion of
> > Greece have been the subject of endless dispute, because the numbers
> > given in ancient sources are very large indeed. Herodotus claimed that
> > there were, in total, 2.5 million military personnel, accompanied by
> > an equivalent number of support personnel.[3] The poet Simonides, who
> > was a near-contemporary, talks of four million; Ctesias gave 800,000
> > as the total number of the army that was assembled by Xerxes.[4



All those events give thebook Ether a dating like the book Jacob from
544BC till 421BC


> The BYU students moderating Wikipedia seem to agree with these dates
> for ETHER and go even further by suggesting that Nephi was the brother of Jared, and Jared Lehi, whose youngest son Jacob ruled long and just like Orihah.

[Mulligan]

On Dec 28, 1:03 pm, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@live.nl> wrote:

> All those events give thebook Ether a dating like the book Jacob from
> 544BC till 421BC

ridiculous assertion

[Nick Youngh]

Please reason with which arguments you do not agree and why ?

[Nick Youngh]

The confusion of speach at the tower of Babylon ?
The circumnavigatuin of Afrika ?
The 2 million army of Xerxes I ?
The similrity berween Ether and the BoM s a whole

[Mulligan]

are you alleged the confounding of languages occurred during those
purported dates?

[Nick Youngh]

On 29 dec, 20:12, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:> > > > All

those events give thebook Ether a dating like the book Jacob from
> > > > 544BC till 421BC
>
> > > ridiculous assertion
>
> > Please reason with which arguments you do not agree and why ?
>
> are you alleged the confounding of languages occurred during those
> purported dates?

The Mormon book of Ether could be dated by the following historical
events
1 confounding of Languages at Babylon 610BC
2 circumnavifation of Africa from the Red Sea till "the promised land"
597BC
3 2 million Greek invasion army 480BC.

Do you realise that we are dealing with historical evidence of the BoM
and that the BoM happened in real ?
You seem to have problems with the late date of the Babylonian
confounding of speach at 610BC, so letme check what I wrote about it
and what Wikipedo is saying about it.

[Nick Youngh]

> are you alleged the confounding of languages occurred during those
> > purported dates?
>
> The Mormon book of Ether could be dated by the following historical
> events
> 1 confounding of Languages at Babylon 610BC
> 2 circumnavifation of Africa from the Red Sea till "the promised land"
> 597BC
> 3 2 million Greek invasion army 480BC.
>
> Do you realise that we are dealing with historical evidence of the BoM
> and that the BoM happened in real ?
> You seem to have problems with the late date of the Babylonian
> confounding of speach at 610BC, so letme check what I wrote about it
> and what Wikipedo is saying about it.

Modern scholars agree that the biblical stories of the tower of
Babylon originated during the Jewish exile in Babylon,

Nebukadnezas policy of bringing foreign professionals to the
construction of the rebuilding of the elrmanki zigurat caused the
confounding of languages 610BC

There could not be a confounding of speaches without building a tower.

Please come with your arguments for an older date and how old.

[Mulligan]

On Dec 30, 5:38 am, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@live.nl> wrote:
> On 29 dec, 20:12, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:> > > > All
> those events give thebook Ether a dating like the book Jacob from
>
> > > > > 544BC till 421BC
>
> > > > ridiculous assertion
>
> > > Please reason with which arguments you do not agree and why ?
>
> > are you alleged the confounding of languages occurred during those
> > purported dates?
>
> The Mormon book of Ether could be dated by the following historical
> events
> 1 confounding of Languages at Babylon 610BC

how many generations went by from the counfounding?
was every one 6 months old?

[Nick Youngh]

till what ?

> was every one 6 months old?

when ?

[Mulligan]

The book of ether we were discussin.
did it fall out of your brain?

[Nick Youngh]

> > when ?- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet weergeven -
>
> - Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht weergeven -

[Nick Youngh]

No its you who is confused
There are three real historical happenings that could date the book of
Ether
The rebuilding of the Zigurat of Emenanki in 610 BC
The circumnavigation of Africa in 600 BC (from the Red Sea till
Israël)
The Greek invasion army of XerxesI in 480 BC
These dates are exact and if you want count by generations, you
should say from which event till what event.
From the tower of Babylon till the seatravel only one generation from
610-600 Lehi and Nephi, Jared and the brother of Jared.
You should realise that the brother of Jared and Nephi seem to be the
same person, so may be 3 generations

You also do not realise that the BoM and so Ether are situated in
Israel "the promissed land".and not in Amerika.

All this proves that the BoM is historical correct and happened in
real.
So please stop ridiculing the BoM by talking about a seatravel to
America in 2000BC

>
>
>
> > > was every one 6 months old?
>

[Mulligan]

On Dec 31, 3:35 pm, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@live.nl> wrote:
> On 31 dec 2012, 22:47, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Dec 31, 12:44 pm, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@live.nl> wrote:
>
> > > On 31 dec, 21:19, Mulligan <quarke...@gmail.com> wrote:> On Dec 30, 5:38 am, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@live.nl> wrote:>
> > > > > > are you alleged the confounding of languages occurred during those
> > > > > > purported dates?
>
> > > > > The Mormon book of Ether could be dated by the following historical
> > > > > events
> > > > > 1 confounding of Languages at Babylon 610BC
>
> > > > how many generations went by from the counfounding?
> > > till what ?
>
> > The book of ether we were discussin.
> > did it fall out of your brain?
>
> No its you who is confused
> There are three real historical happenings that could date the book of
> Ether
> The rebuilding of the Zigurat of Emenanki in 610 BC
> The circumnavigation of Africa in 600 BC (from the Red Sea till
> Israël)
> The Greek invasion army of XerxesI in 480 BC
> These dates are exact and if you want count  by generations, you
> should say from which event till what event.

the people in ether till they died and the record discovered.

[Mulligan]

> > - Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht weergeven -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

speaking dutch?

show quoted text display?

[Nick Youngh]

> Jaredite seems to refer to Erets Israël

>
>
>
> > > > was every one 6 months old?
>
> > > when ?- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet weergeven -
>

> > - Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht weergeven -- Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht niet weergeven -

[Mulligan]

> show quoted text display?- Hide quoted text -

[Nick Youngh]

On 1 jan, 00:45, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:>
> > speaking dutch?
Yes,I am Dutch from Holland

[Nick Youngh]

On 1 jan, 00:36, Mulligan <t2judgm...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > No its you who is confused
> > There are three real historical happenings that could date the book of
> > Ether
> > The rebuilding of the Zigurat of Emenanki in 610 BC
> > The circumnavigation of Africa in 600 BC (from the Red Sea till
> > Israël)
> > The Greek invasion army of XerxesI in 480 BC
> > These dates are exact and if you want count  by generations, you
> > should say from which event till what event.
>

> the people in ether till they died and the record discovered.-

The people in Ether were normal Jews (Jaredites- Eretz Israël)
They lived from the resurrection of the Tower of Bable 610BC till the
3 million army of Xerxes I
Koning Coresh in the Bible, koning Coriantumr inthe BoM
Their final battle is the battle of Thermopilae in 480BC
Restless fighter Shiz is king Leonidas of Sparta.

So the Jaredites were Jewish Persians and they lived from 610BC till
480 BC 130 years say 4 generation.

[Mulligan]

chapter 9 and 10 while mentioned skipping of uncounted generations
has at least 12 listed there specifically

[Nick Youngh]

On 2 jan, 22:03, Mulligan <quarke...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > The people in Ether were normal Jews (Jaredites- Eretz Israël)
> > They lived from the resurrection of the Tower of Bable 610BC till the
> > 3 million army of Xerxes I
> > Koning Coresh in the Bible, koning Coriantumr inthe BoM
> > Their final battle is the battle of Thermopilae in 480BC
> > Restless fighter Shiz is king Leonidas of Sparta.
>
> > So the Jaredites were Jewish Persians and they lived from 610BC till
> > 480 BC 130 years say 4 generation.
>
> chapter 9 and 10 while mentioned  skipping of uncounted generations
> has at least 12 listed there specifically

What is your point,what you try to prove ?
Ether could be dated by the historical events discribed.
Counting years by generations of unknown people leads to nowhere

[A Really Really Large Number]

On Jan 7, 2:48 pm, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@live.nl> wrote:
> On 2 jan, 22:03, Mulligan <quarke...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > The people in Ether were normal Jews (Jaredites- Eretz Israël)
> > > They lived from the resurrection of the Tower of Bable 610BC till the
> > > 3 million army of Xerxes I
> > > Koning Coresh in the Bible, koning Coriantumr inthe BoM
> > > Their final battle is the battle of Thermopilae in 480BC
> > > Restless fighter Shiz is king Leonidas of Sparta.
>
> > > So the Jaredites were Jewish Persians and they lived from 610BC till
> > > 480 BC 130 years say 4 generation.
>
> > chapter 9 and 10 while mentioned  skipping of uncounted generations
> > has at least 12 listed there specifically
>
> What is your point,what you try to prove ?

That you are a numbnutz fruitcake

[Nick Youngh]

On 7 jan, 23:57, A Really Really Large Number <yos...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> On Jan 7, 2:48 pm, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@live.nl> wrote:
>
> > What is your point,what you try to prove ?
>

> That you are a numbnutz fruitcake-

Do you realise, that I am proving that the BoM is historically correct
and happened in real ?

[�RLMeasures]

In article
<7cdb88c6-33ed-4899...@17g2000vba.googlegroups.com>, Nick

Youngh <dejon...@live.nl> wrote:

> On 7 jan, 23:57, A Really Really Large Number <yos...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:

> > On Jan 7, 2:48=A0pm, Nick Youngh <dejonghn...@live.nl> wrote:
> >
> > > What is your point,what you try to prove ?
> >
> > That you are a numbnutz fruitcake-
>
> Do you realise, that I am proving that the BoM is historically correct
> and happened in real ?

*** Tilting at windmills?

[A Really Really Large Number]

I already did that.

[Logan Sacket]

That's like trying to prove Obama is a US Citizen. There ain't no
evidence yet.

[sully]

more like trying to introduce a right winger to a fact.

They repulse each other.

[Nick Youngh]

On 8 jan, 23:47, logan.sac...@gmail.com (Logan Sacket) wrote:
> On Tue, 8 Jan 2013 03:02:26 -0800 (PST), Nick Youngh>

> >Do you realise, that I am proving that the BoM is historically correct
> >and happened in real ?
>
> That's like trying to prove Obama is a US Citizen.  There ain't no
> evidence yet.

The BoM relates a seatravel in 600bC from the Red Sea till "the
promised land"
The father of historywriting Herodotus writes about the
circumnavigation of Afrika by Pharao Necho in 600bC.(from the red sea
till the Nile No doubt the same travel.
Is that not sufficient evidence, that the BoM happened in real ?

[Logan Sacket]

On Tue, 8 Jan 2013 15:03:12 -0800 (PST), sully <suls...@yahoo.com>
wrote:

Facts are facts. When they don't exist, you shouldn't pretend that
they do.

[Logan Sacket]

OK, you're right. That says it all.

[sully]

I agree with that, and when they do exist you shouldn't deny them.

[Logan Sacket]

On Wed, 9 Jan 2013 15:26:30 -0800 (PST), sully <suls...@yahoo.com>

Agreed.