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ECKANKAR: Follow the Money - Part 2 Publishing Royalties
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Peetee Aitchei
Sep 20, 2014, 12:02:57 AM9/20/14
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See - ECKANKAR: Follow the Money - Part 1 - DONATIONS
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.religion.eckankar/uSS7h2citAY/l8mKmT9TAzEJ
---------------------------------------------
ECKANKAR: Follow the Money - Part 2 - PUBLISHING ROYALTIES
A thoroughly misguided uninformed but genuine and devout ECKist stated:
*Ultimately all one can attest to with honesty is what one has perceived
real for oneself.*
I agree, because to me that is very True, and somewhat Rational to boot!
In this second of the "Follow the Money" series here is a few issues that are perceived as REAL for oneself. Knowledge, facts, and evidence is Power. But Wisdom is even more Powerful.
Given what I know, given what I have seen, then without any doubt whatsoever
in my mind I honestly present the following which I believe is True.
As of April 2012 .. subject to latter changes:
Harold Klemp is paid a $200K+ Salary
Joan Klemp is paid a $100K+ Salary
Eckankar *donations* bought and pay 100% of the ongoing expenses of their
Home in Eden Prairie MN, plus their vacation home by the Beach.
Eckankar *donations* bought all their motor cars and luxury camper van and
then pays 100% of their running expenses.
Eckankar *donations* then pay 100% of their health care costs, life insurance,
legal costs, annual subscriptions, and more.
The only thing Joan and Harold pay for out of their own pocket is food,
personal care products, household groceries, and gifts to friends and family.
Over and above ALL this basic Employment Agreement / Salary Conditions
Harold (and at times Joan) then is personally paid a Royalty Percentage (%)
for everything that his name is listed upon as the "author" et al.
That is applied to ALL the books, discourses, videos, audio tapes and more.
Over and above, everything already listed above, and some other matters I will not mention here.
Post-July 1982 everything sold by Eckankar with Paul Twitchells and Gail
Twitchell-Gross' names on it then 100% of the set Royalties went to
Eckankar Corp.
Since then Harold made multiple changes to the *system* during the 1980s,
including the creation of the Living ECK Master Sole Corporation of whom
he is the ONLY owner and authority. This living ECK master Sole corporation
has complete CONTROL over the Eckankar Corp as well as the Eckankar Board of
Trustees who can be legally dismissed at any time without any reason required.
In matters "publishing" this next item is the classic example which has been
repeated constantly since the late 1980s to this day. Klemp takes existing
books like the "Eckankar Dictionary" written by Twitchell in the 1960s, then
Klemp slightly edits the content here and there .....
.... actually he doesn't do this because someone in the ESC does it all for
him, he simply gives it the tick of approval ...... maybe even adds a comment
now and then, but mostly he doesn't say a word about such things ....
Klemp then via Eckankar re-publishes that original content almost verbatim,
someone in ESC Art Publishing department creates a new fancy colored cover,
they put Klemps name on it as *author*; and then Klemp gets paid his standard Royalty % for the new book sales, which goes straight into his personal bank
account.
The second classic example of how this little rort operates is that Harold
is provided with stunning snazzy Initiate Reports from devout Eckists (plus a
few who lie through their teeth about the inner experiences pushing for a new
Initiation or a Gig on the local Satsang Board).
Then twice a year Klemp tells the audience what these other people have
written to ESC. This *literary content* from those Seminars are first paid
for by WW attendance fees and the online streaming. Klemp gets his cut of the
Royalties of that too, well he's is the *author* right?
Next Eckankar put out a paper text version of these *talks* which they sell
for $8 (?) to the members directly through the Eckankar Book Store and the
Charter Satsangs across the world. Klemp gets his Royalty % out of that too,
then comes the Audio sales, the Video DVD sales, and then those talks are
repackaged later into the *Mahanta Transcripts* series of books and more.
Yet *AGAIN* gets his usual Royalty cut of all of those RECYCLED publications
-- because KLEMP is the Legally Registered Author at the Copyright Office,
NOT ECKANKAR Corp. See?
Eckankar gets their small Royalty % cut, and the Publishing & Printing arms of
Eckankar Corp make their profits from producing and selling these items to the
public and to the Eckist members; but the LARGEST Profit from these sales is
Klemps personal % Royalty payments!
So the question anyone could ask President Skelsky, or the Board of Trustees,
the 'Mahanta', or the inner master or your common sense even, is: *How much is
Klemp's personal Royalty % applied to all this Eckankar material?*
Is it 10%, 25%, 50%, 75% or more? Please note the legal Copyright ownership
belongs to KLEMP and not to Eckankar.
So, when Klemp dies, or anytime beforehand, he has the Legal power to gift or
to Sell those Right to anyone for the next 70 years plus. Exactly the same as
Gail-Twitchell-Gross-Anderson did when she SOLD all her Copyright Ownership
and Royalty Rights of twitchell's writings to Eckankar - First tranch in 1979
and the balance in July 1982 which she sold for $500,000 using the Donated
funds from Eckists to pay her out and get her out of the way permanently!
At any time of his choosing Klemp has the Legal Right to STOP Eckankar Corp
from selling his *published creations and writings*.
That same legal Right will flow via his Deceased Estate and there is nothing
you or anyone can do about that.
The last question deserving of an HONEST answer is how much does all this add
up to as PERSONAL ANNUAL INCOME into the Klemp family home each and every year?
Given no one ever sees Klemp in REAL Life but twice as often as Punxsutawney
Phil in Pennsylvania, and he has never written an original book in his life
does the personal income equal the effort, talent and competency in the role
HE ACTS OUT on the public stage?
You see it wasn't Klemp who write his first two books about his life - it was
Patti Simpson who wrote and edited those!!! She had to painstakingly help
Klemp for months to write his first two books about his so called "grandiose
spiritual life". Utter Bollocks! Those two books *by* Klemp were the most
difficult things she ever had to supervise (ie DO Herself) in her role as
Publicist for Eckankar back in the 70s and early 80s before she quit and
walked away from all the silliness.
Now let's again consider what the Eckists said before at the top of this post
here: *Ultimately all one can attest to with honesty is what one has perceived
real for oneself.*
Now ain't that the TRUTH if ever you had the opportunity to see it and know it?
It should mean that all Pro-Eckankar, Pro-Marman people should take a Vow of
Silence for life when it comes to the subject of Eckankar past and present !!!
Please do realize that I don't blame Eckists for this, in any way whatsoever.
It is not the memberships *fault*, they are NOT to blame for this; even those
who at one time or another have sat on the Board of Trustees .... for they are
ALL gullible victims here of 50 years of lies, false pretenses, intentional
manipulation, disinformation, and fraud.
What do you really KNOW?
(a simple rhetorical take away question for the reader)
Peace!
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.religion.eckankar/uSS7h2citAY/l8mKmT9TAzEJ
---------------------------------------------
ECKANKAR: Follow the Money - Part 2 - PUBLISHING ROYALTIES
A thoroughly misguided uninformed but genuine and devout ECKist stated:
*Ultimately all one can attest to with honesty is what one has perceived
real for oneself.*
I agree, because to me that is very True, and somewhat Rational to boot!
In this second of the "Follow the Money" series here is a few issues that are perceived as REAL for oneself. Knowledge, facts, and evidence is Power. But Wisdom is even more Powerful.
Given what I know, given what I have seen, then without any doubt whatsoever
in my mind I honestly present the following which I believe is True.
As of April 2012 .. subject to latter changes:
Harold Klemp is paid a $200K+ Salary
Joan Klemp is paid a $100K+ Salary
Eckankar *donations* bought and pay 100% of the ongoing expenses of their
Home in Eden Prairie MN, plus their vacation home by the Beach.
Eckankar *donations* bought all their motor cars and luxury camper van and
then pays 100% of their running expenses.
Eckankar *donations* then pay 100% of their health care costs, life insurance,
legal costs, annual subscriptions, and more.
The only thing Joan and Harold pay for out of their own pocket is food,
personal care products, household groceries, and gifts to friends and family.
Over and above ALL this basic Employment Agreement / Salary Conditions
Harold (and at times Joan) then is personally paid a Royalty Percentage (%)
for everything that his name is listed upon as the "author" et al.
That is applied to ALL the books, discourses, videos, audio tapes and more.
Over and above, everything already listed above, and some other matters I will not mention here.
Post-July 1982 everything sold by Eckankar with Paul Twitchells and Gail
Twitchell-Gross' names on it then 100% of the set Royalties went to
Eckankar Corp.
Since then Harold made multiple changes to the *system* during the 1980s,
including the creation of the Living ECK Master Sole Corporation of whom
he is the ONLY owner and authority. This living ECK master Sole corporation
has complete CONTROL over the Eckankar Corp as well as the Eckankar Board of
Trustees who can be legally dismissed at any time without any reason required.
In matters "publishing" this next item is the classic example which has been
repeated constantly since the late 1980s to this day. Klemp takes existing
books like the "Eckankar Dictionary" written by Twitchell in the 1960s, then
Klemp slightly edits the content here and there .....
.... actually he doesn't do this because someone in the ESC does it all for
him, he simply gives it the tick of approval ...... maybe even adds a comment
now and then, but mostly he doesn't say a word about such things ....
Klemp then via Eckankar re-publishes that original content almost verbatim,
someone in ESC Art Publishing department creates a new fancy colored cover,
they put Klemps name on it as *author*; and then Klemp gets paid his standard Royalty % for the new book sales, which goes straight into his personal bank
account.
The second classic example of how this little rort operates is that Harold
is provided with stunning snazzy Initiate Reports from devout Eckists (plus a
few who lie through their teeth about the inner experiences pushing for a new
Initiation or a Gig on the local Satsang Board).
Then twice a year Klemp tells the audience what these other people have
written to ESC. This *literary content* from those Seminars are first paid
for by WW attendance fees and the online streaming. Klemp gets his cut of the
Royalties of that too, well he's is the *author* right?
Next Eckankar put out a paper text version of these *talks* which they sell
for $8 (?) to the members directly through the Eckankar Book Store and the
Charter Satsangs across the world. Klemp gets his Royalty % out of that too,
then comes the Audio sales, the Video DVD sales, and then those talks are
repackaged later into the *Mahanta Transcripts* series of books and more.
Yet *AGAIN* gets his usual Royalty cut of all of those RECYCLED publications
-- because KLEMP is the Legally Registered Author at the Copyright Office,
NOT ECKANKAR Corp. See?
Eckankar gets their small Royalty % cut, and the Publishing & Printing arms of
Eckankar Corp make their profits from producing and selling these items to the
public and to the Eckist members; but the LARGEST Profit from these sales is
Klemps personal % Royalty payments!
So the question anyone could ask President Skelsky, or the Board of Trustees,
the 'Mahanta', or the inner master or your common sense even, is: *How much is
Klemp's personal Royalty % applied to all this Eckankar material?*
Is it 10%, 25%, 50%, 75% or more? Please note the legal Copyright ownership
belongs to KLEMP and not to Eckankar.
So, when Klemp dies, or anytime beforehand, he has the Legal power to gift or
to Sell those Right to anyone for the next 70 years plus. Exactly the same as
Gail-Twitchell-Gross-Anderson did when she SOLD all her Copyright Ownership
and Royalty Rights of twitchell's writings to Eckankar - First tranch in 1979
and the balance in July 1982 which she sold for $500,000 using the Donated
funds from Eckists to pay her out and get her out of the way permanently!
At any time of his choosing Klemp has the Legal Right to STOP Eckankar Corp
from selling his *published creations and writings*.
That same legal Right will flow via his Deceased Estate and there is nothing
you or anyone can do about that.
The last question deserving of an HONEST answer is how much does all this add
up to as PERSONAL ANNUAL INCOME into the Klemp family home each and every year?
Given no one ever sees Klemp in REAL Life but twice as often as Punxsutawney
Phil in Pennsylvania, and he has never written an original book in his life
does the personal income equal the effort, talent and competency in the role
HE ACTS OUT on the public stage?
You see it wasn't Klemp who write his first two books about his life - it was
Patti Simpson who wrote and edited those!!! She had to painstakingly help
Klemp for months to write his first two books about his so called "grandiose
spiritual life". Utter Bollocks! Those two books *by* Klemp were the most
difficult things she ever had to supervise (ie DO Herself) in her role as
Publicist for Eckankar back in the 70s and early 80s before she quit and
walked away from all the silliness.
Now let's again consider what the Eckists said before at the top of this post
here: *Ultimately all one can attest to with honesty is what one has perceived
real for oneself.*
Now ain't that the TRUTH if ever you had the opportunity to see it and know it?
It should mean that all Pro-Eckankar, Pro-Marman people should take a Vow of
Silence for life when it comes to the subject of Eckankar past and present !!!
Please do realize that I don't blame Eckists for this, in any way whatsoever.
It is not the memberships *fault*, they are NOT to blame for this; even those
who at one time or another have sat on the Board of Trustees .... for they are
ALL gullible victims here of 50 years of lies, false pretenses, intentional
manipulation, disinformation, and fraud.
What do you really KNOW?
(a simple rhetorical take away question for the reader)
Peace!
wernertrp
Sep 20, 2014, 8:44:00 AM9/20/14
to
The hihest payed CEO in USA is in the range up to 500 Million $ per year.
The highest income of a person including funds is 1,2 Billion $ per year.
Mark Zuckerberg
Richard Kinder
dusty...@gmail.com
Sep 20, 2014, 2:18:55 PM9/20/14
to
Peetee Aitchei aka Sean Arundell, aka Santim Vah, aka JR Clark wrote:
What do you really KNOW?
Peace!
What do you really KNOW?
-----------
Everyone knows you are trying to set yourself up to be assassinated, PT HI. Since you are a current member of Eckankar, it would follow your hateful grudges against this religion to make Eckankar look pretty bad and indirectly set someone up to have them murdered to protect its doctrine. I have taken out a term life insurance policy on all three of you.
A bulleted list of Eckankar's resources and their cost to Eckankar participants would suffice. Start with cost of membership and then the cost of all expected donations. Did you have to pay a fee to visit the temple?
Check out this new religion. Members can actually walk away healed. And if they are lucky, they may be able to identify the conflict between their subconscious and conscious states that led to the problem.
Secrets of Enlightenment $18.99
http://jhbooks.org/ebooks/home/11-secrets-of-enlightenment-ebook.html
That's $1.73 per secret.
Meet Archbishop Humble
http://jimhumble.org/
Visit the church and check out the sacrements
http://genesis2church.org/
Sacrament Testimonials
https://www.youtube.com/user/MMStestimonials/videos
More Testimony
https://twitter.com/mmstestimonials
And more Testimonies
https://www.facebook.com/MMStestimonials
Testimonies by Category
http://genesis2church.org/all-mms-testimonials
Thy will be done, Father in Heaven in the name of healing and cures.
Amen
Name of Jaxen, Dusty Jaxen
willowfield.blogspot.com
Message has been deleted
Peetee Aitchei
Sep 20, 2014, 8:15:04 PM9/20/14
to
Zuckerberg and Kinder are not sent Tax Free Donations of Real Estate,
Cash, Shares, Bonds, Jewelry, Gold and more to the tune of $millions
per year every year for nothing. Klemp is. And before him Darwin and
Twitchell.
The Temple of ECK alone cost $10 million. Didn't bat an eye lid in the
Accounts Dept or the Board as the bank accounts were still full to over
flowing.
The Roman Catholic Church is the Template, the Facsimile being used here.
The First ECK Crusade was carried out here from the mid 1990s, but they
only used words. Fanatics are fanatics, and extremists are extremists so there's a hairs breadth of difference between the beliefs of those in ISIL
and ECKists.
The difference at present is a few hundred years of stewing in their own
insane juices passing the madness down their family trees, where anything
is Justifiable as it is 'written' in the Book and the Inner Master told me so.
I can see the future, can you? :-)
Skardicus
Nov 25, 2018, 6:21:14 AM11/25/18
to
Why do you care how much the leader of a church makes? it is not an uncommon business practice in publishing for copyrights you own to update books and republish. i dont thik any eckist is confused about their donations being the revenue source for Harold and Joan. eckankar is popular and worldwide. It can be a bit disillusioning when faced with how corporations work for anyone whos never been a major shareholder or a corporate director. $100,000 and $200,000 for the couples yearly income is surprisingly low. Harold has been the leader of eckankar for 36 years or so. hes still getting startup level income. most religions have a business side eckankar is really standard in its business practices. when i was an eckist in the 80s yearly memberships were a set price and even more expenive then. $120. But if the reason someone wants to give up on studying and serving the eck is due too an elderly religios leader making upper middle class wages then we all have to draw the line somewhere. How do you think the donations should be distrbuted? thank you for your enlightening post. btw where is his beach house at? Surely not MN. peace to you and yours
fife
Nov 25, 2018, 9:05:27 AM11/25/18
to
Huh. How's life been? Still in Austin?
Henosis Sage
Nov 25, 2018, 10:09:15 PM11/25/18
to
On Sunday, 25 November 2018 22:21:14 UTC+11, Skardicus wrote:
> Why do you care how much the leader of a church makes? it is not an uncommon business practice in publishing for copyrights you own to update books and republish. i dont thik any eckist is confused about their donations being the revenue source for Harold and Joan. eckankar is popular and worldwide. It can be a bit disillusioning when faced with how corporations work for anyone whos never been a major shareholder or a corporate director. $100,000 and $200,000 for the couples yearly income is surprisingly low. Harold has been the leader of eckankar for 36 years or so. hes still getting startup level income. most religions have a business side eckankar is really standard in its business practices. when i was an eckist in the 80s yearly memberships were a set price and even more expenive then. $120. But if the reason someone wants to give up on studying and serving the eck is due too an elderly religios leader making upper middle class wages then we all have to draw the line somewhere. How do you think the donations should be distrbuted? thank you for your enlightening post. btw where is his beach house at? Surely not MN. peace to you and yours
-----------------
> Why do you care how much the leader of a church makes? it is not an uncommon business practice in publishing for copyrights you own to update books and republish. i dont thik any eckist is confused about their donations being the revenue source for Harold and Joan. eckankar is popular and worldwide. It can be a bit disillusioning when faced with how corporations work for anyone whos never been a major shareholder or a corporate director. $100,000 and $200,000 for the couples yearly income is surprisingly low. Harold has been the leader of eckankar for 36 years or so. hes still getting startup level income. most religions have a business side eckankar is really standard in its business practices. when i was an eckist in the 80s yearly memberships were a set price and even more expenive then. $120. But if the reason someone wants to give up on studying and serving the eck is due too an elderly religios leader making upper middle class wages then we all have to draw the line somewhere. How do you think the donations should be distrbuted? thank you for your enlightening post. btw where is his beach house at? Surely not MN. peace to you and yours
Before I attend to your questions I have a few of my own you can address and then we'll see where we go from there ... is that OK with you S.?
1) You're 4 years too late - what took you so long? :-)
2) The material above and elsewhere has been researched and presented in good faith. What more do you expect from me by asking such "loaded" questions now, given that fact?
3) Have you tried 'soul travel' to locate the beach house? Or asked Wah Z direct if there is one? That might work.
4) If you had perused all the relevant materials long ago presented here there would no need for you to be asking "Why do you care how much the leader of a church makes?" because the answer would already be clear and you'd realize the question was moot. So why are you asking such manipulative questions of me now? 5)Do you have a specific personal issue about people doing proper research about matters like this which is frankly quite "normal" and not uncommon at all?
6) "How do you think the donations should be distrbuted?"
You are asking the wrong question, again. Have another look. Actually follow the many facts and the meaning of those facts over time and then think really carefully about why you now need to ask so many questions of me in late 2018.
Is Harold dead yet? I feel he is going to be sorely disappointed.
andrew...@gmail.com
Jan 11, 2019, 4:45:42 PM1/11/19
to
I appreciate your research, thank you.
By any chance do you know Harold Klemp's birthdate?
thanks
fife
Jan 11, 2019, 4:55:47 PM1/11/19
to
Henosis Sage
Jan 11, 2019, 6:36:25 PM1/11/19
to
can't prove it, info provided by another and unconfirmed.
wernertrp
Jan 13, 2019, 5:58:00 AM1/13/19
to
https://www.legacy.com/obituaries/name/jan-cox-obituary?pid=178931403
Twitchell konnte einmal in seinem eine Religion erfinden.
Dieser Kerl s.o. könnte jede Woche eine neue Religion erfinden wenn er will.
Message has been deleted
fife
Jan 13, 2019, 7:45:26 AM1/13/19
to
Etznab
Jan 13, 2019, 7:54:59 AM1/13/19
to
Why is Jan Cox mentioned on this thread?
fife
Jan 13, 2019, 8:33:28 AM1/13/19
to
I believe Werner is comparing Jan Cox as a philosopher to Paul Twitchell as a philosopher. So this comparison is germane to Eckankar.
At this link https://www.jancox.com the text reads: "Rather than fruitlessly argue about what is real and what is not, Consider it in these terms: There is the silent, Primary Reality in which man physically exists (the inner mind?), and then a Secondary Reality which is the product of his mental activity (the outer mind?). If you orient yourself for the moment on this basis, much needless confusion can be avoided, and your sight clarified."
(and)
"The subject here is the mind, "you", the process called "consciousness" and how it works. ...."
At this link https://www.jancox.com the text reads: "Rather than fruitlessly argue about what is real and what is not, Consider it in these terms: There is the silent, Primary Reality in which man physically exists (the inner mind?), and then a Secondary Reality which is the product of his mental activity (the outer mind?). If you orient yourself for the moment on this basis, much needless confusion can be avoided, and your sight clarified."
(and)
"The subject here is the mind, "you", the process called "consciousness" and how it works. ...."
fife
Jan 13, 2019, 9:02:25 AM1/13/19
to
I believe what's being said is that first you have to have consciousness, and clear consciousness, before you can reach pure thought and the kind of light and sound experience Eckankar talks about. For it to be of any value. On any topic. Money, philosophy, psychology, personality, ....
fife
Jan 13, 2019, 9:29:44 AM1/13/19
to
And that consciousness is a process. Not just of the outer mind. But first, of the inner mind, and then, secondarily, of the outer mind.
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