Harry Potter is a Satanist
Robert
seminary taught by Jesus.
Instead, what we get is a warlock going to witch school.
"I am the Lord Your God. I am a jealous God.
I plague the grandchildren and great-grandchildren
of those who hate me with their ancestor's sin.
But I make whole those who love me for a thousand
generations."
taxdude
news:39672e4d.265730@news-server...
> It would have been nice if the character was a saint going to a
> seminary taught by Jesus.
> Instead, what we get is a warlock going to witch school.
I am really not familiar with the Harry Potter books, but do they differ
from the fantasy genre in any way?
Tolkien and Lewis both had magic systems, so I don't really see what the
problem is in this case.
Come to think of it, I read a slew of books about a boy becoming a wizard.
Anyone read the Earthsea trilogy by Ursula K Leguin?
Loved those books.
iceberg3k
the Movie 2000" (better known in fan circles as "Pocket Monsters:
Revelation Lugia").
-- Mark
-ARK, ASVS, ARCR-C
-"You guys don't seem to mind Garrizzz...zn Keillor and Ace Ventura,
Gov'ner so I don't know how to normalize the "hork index" - Crgre Jvyyneq
-----------------------------------------------------------
Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
Up to 100 minutes free!
http://www.keen.com
Le Critic!
>
> It would have been nice if the character was a saint going to a
> seminary taught by Jesus.
> Instead, what we get is a warlock going to witch school.
>
It makes me mad too, I went into the bookstore with a lighter and set
fire to the unholy witch books, and guess what they called the cops!
Imagine calling the cops on me a good decent Christian fighting
witchcraft. So I called up my priest, he told me trust in the Lord and
try not to get rape in prison because that would be a sin. I found that
by tensing up " back there " I was able to avoid rape, then I got out of
prison on bond. My court date is next week, I can't wait!!
--
~~~ Le (Reformed) Critic! ~~~
Visit Landover Baptist Church ~ http://www.bettybowers.com
Try http://www.truthtree.com - where the Truth will set u free
What the Bible says about homosexuality ~ http://www.visionsofdaniel.com
SumBuny4Me
"iceberg3k" <mberger88...@vax2.winona.msus.edu.invalid> wrote in
message news:0b1f4e51...@usw-ex0107-055.remarq.com...
> *shakes head* Let's just hope he never sees a fansub of "Pokemon
> the Movie 2000" (better known in fan circles as "Pocket Monsters:
> Revelation Lugia").
ROTFLMHO!!!!!
My kids are "into" Poke'Mon, yet they do a lot of volunteer work at the
church.....
I also agree with taxdud,; I have not read the Potter series, yet I am a fan
of sci-fi/fantasy. And how many of us grew up on Fairy tales????
Buny
Priestess Legion (c)
> seminary taught by Jesus.
> Instead, what we get is a warlock going to witch school.
>
Why???So a satanist such as you could flame his ass....???
--
In nomine Dei nostri Satanas Luciferi excelsi!
Priestess Legion
-The Emissary
Mark Johnson
>I am really not familiar with the Harry Potter books, but do they differ
>from the fantasy genre in any way?
>Tolkien and Lewis both had magic systems, so I don't really see what the
>problem is in this case.
Gandalf, you mean. A 'good' wizard - with his moments.
The basic difference is that Harry is thrown in among a group of
witches and occultists - as a long-lost wizard y'see (the 'power' that
apparently little children crave - wave your hand, and I'll show them
kind of thing - no more effort than that). In Lord of the Rings, the
Hobbits were not magicians. And many of their allies had no mystical
power. They were simply - courageous, with what they had. Those apart
from Ganldalf and a few others who dabbled in the 'arts' or who were
given over to them were the evil forces in the story. In Potter, the
evil, so far, is had in those who oppose witchcraft or fail to
practice it, short of common superstitions, perhaps.
Some say you _would_ be better sticking to Lewis, or Tolkien, or
assorted others, simply because like so much fiction of the last
decade or two, it is simply not that competent. The kids seem to hang
on every word, true. But they used to do that reading about Frodo and
company (I know I did).
I don't know that this is satanic stuff. But the recent midnight
unwrapping of the latest in the series had little grade school kids,
on summer vacation, waiting around in a bookstore at 11 PM at night
playacting at riding broomstick handles around wearing little witch
costumes. From Lord of the Rings, you wouldn't have seen that I'm
guessing. Perhaps that's why Lord of the Rings isn't on the required
reading list in so many schools that insist Potter be read.
In other words, maybe for some - there is an agenda. Maybe it's not
just an innocent kid's story about mystical stuff (which is, stated
that broadly, good for kids - like Lord of the Rings, or Narnia).
Maybe the framework for Potter is not that of Gandalf, ultimately, but
that of Sauron?
Peace.
------------------------------------------------------------
* When one finds nothing more to say to God,
* but just knows He is there --
* that, in itself, is the best of prayers.
[Fr. John Vianney, priest of Ars township, France, 1859]
iceberg3k
Hobbit" are NOT on the required reading lists of many schools.
After all, the best way to kill a kid's enjoyment of reading a
wonderful book is to require them to do so...
Mark Johnson
>I'm actually rather glad that "The Lord of the Rings" and "The
>Hobbit" are NOT on the required reading lists of many schools.
>After all, the best way to kill a kid's enjoyment of reading a
>wonderful book is to require them to do so...
I've read through some pages of the Potter books on the store shelves,
and it really seems like rank writing - to me. It _could_ captivate
very active imaginations in children. Some of the stories I loved to
reread as a kid seem pretty poorly written, when I went back to old
shelved/stored away volumes. But Lord of the Rings is beautifully
told, well written, competent, and while referring to good, if
sometimes scary, wizards, does not embrace occultism as does Joanne
Rowling. As for what you say, I don't know that making Lord of the
Rings required reading would turn kids off. It's too well written.
As for some real objections to Rowling's work:
"In dismissing the Christian objections to the series, Professor
Jacobs fails to engage the view of magic repeatedly expressed in the
Bible, that there are two, and only two, sources of supernatural
(i.e., nonscientific) power: God and demons. "Magic" is the word used
to describe supernatural power that does not come from God—if it is of
God we call it a "miracle." Ancient texts indicate that magic was
performed by invoking the secret personal name of the god: even in the
Bible, no miracle (except creation) occurs before God reveals His
personal name ("I Am Who I Am") to Moses. Thus Rowling’s
unpronounceable incantations would be, in ancient terms, (partly) the
secret name of a god (or demon).
There is also the purpose for which supernatural forces are used: it
is interesting to contrast Jesus’ temptations in the desert to use the
supernatural for personal purposes with the world of magic that
Rowling creates. Jesus rejected Satan’s suggestion to create food;
Rowling (apparently) has all food created through magic—and dishes are
washed by magic too! Jesus declined the opportunity to fly (by jumping
off the Temple and being borne up by angels); Rowling’s witches and
wizards fly on brooms for sport. Jesus would not have created
self–shuffling cards. In Rowling’s world, the supernatural is used for
both good and evil to be sure, but mostly it is used for personal
convenience and pleasure.
When I read the first two books to my children, I realized that they
created in me a strong desire to go to Hogwarts School of Magic—not to
glorify God and further His ends, but rather to make supernatural
power my own for my own gratification. The original sin was committed
for the motive of wanting to become like a god.
Brock Fowler
Rockville, Maryland"
[http://www.firstthings.com/ftissues/ft0004/correspondence.html]
iceberg3k
>On Sat, 08 Jul 2000 14:41:43 GMT, "taxdude"
<taxm...@mediaone.net>
>wrote:
>>
>>I am really not familiar with the Harry Potter books, but do
they differ
>>from the fantasy genre in any way?
>>Tolkien and Lewis both had magic systems, so I don't really see
what the
>>problem is in this case.
>>
>
LOL! "The Hobbit" was written for children! The Lord of the
Rings was indeed for adults, but I read it when I was but a wee
lad of 12.
>--Harry Potter is
>for children. Big difference there.
Not really such a big difference. Just in the minds of people.
>No problem, really, just another media blitz for witchcraft. I
>may write a counter-Potter series featuring a kid and angels.
>Think it would sell?
Not if you're writing it to push a Point. Kids see right through
people who are writing to teach them Serious Lessions, and just
breeze right by them. Look at how phenominally UNpopular crap
like "The Giver" - which won a Newberry Honor - are with
children. Kids know when books are preaching at them, and they
don't like it.
Ironically, I think that kids - if they weren't pushed at it by
their parents - would enjoy reading the Bible for its literary
merits. Don't believe me? Look at C.S. Lewis's The Chronicles
of Narnia, a series that has long been popular with children in
the same age bracket that the Harry Potter books are written for.
What Professor Lewis really did in many places was to take
stories from the Bible, put a new coat of paint on them, and sell
them as works of fantasy. This should be the proper model for
Christian literature for children and young adults, not the "I'm
going to teach these kids a LESSON" approach that seems all too
prevalent in "young adult" literature.
Robert
wrote:
>
>I am really not familiar with the Harry Potter books, but do they differ
>from the fantasy genre in any way?
>Tolkien and Lewis both had magic systems, so I don't really see what the
>problem is in this case.
>
All those books you mentioned were written for adults--Harry Potter is
for children. Big difference there.
No problem, really, just another media blitz for witchcraft. I may
write a counter-Potter series featuring a kid and angels. Think it
would sell?
Expede
>From: holyW...@heaven.edu (Robert)
>Date: 7/11/00 12:45 AM Eastern Daylight Time
>Message-id: <396aa504.2145692@news-server>
>
>On Sat, 08 Jul 2000 14:41:43 GMT, "taxdude" <taxm...@mediaone.net>
>wrote:
>>
>>I am really not familiar with the Harry Potter books, but do they differ
>>from the fantasy genre in any way?
>>Tolkien and Lewis both had magic systems, so I don't really see what the
>>problem is in this case.
>>
>
>All those books you mentioned were written for adults--Harry Potter is
>for children. Big difference there.
>No problem, really, just another media blitz for witchcraft. I may
>write a counter-Potter series featuring a kid and angels. Think it
>would sell?
Why bother when the Church already has its own? Angels visit town. People
want sex with angels. Holy Man outraged. Holy Man offerd his children for sex
with townfolks instead. Angels leave town. Holy Man and family leave town.
God destroys town. Holy Man is raped by his daughters.
iceberg3k
>Hobbit for children? No way I can believe that at face
value--prove
>it.
Very well, you are quite within your rights to doubt my words, as
I have not backed them up with evidence yet. I shall rectify
this oversight now.
(From: http://www.tolkiensociety.org/)
"4. The Storyteller
Meanwhile Tolkien continued developing his mythology and
languages. As mentioned above, he told his children stories, some
of which he developed into those published posthumously as Mr.
Bliss, Roverandom, etc. However, according to his own account,
one day when he was engaged in the soul-destroying task of
marking examination papers, he discovered that one candidate had
left one page of an answer-book blank. On this page, moved by who
knows what anarchic daemon, he wrote "In a hole in the ground
there lived a Hobbit".
In typical Tolkien fashion, he then decided he needed to
find out what a Hobbit was, what sort of a hole it lived in, why
it lived in a hole, etc. From this investigation grew a tale that
he told to his younger children, and even passed round. In 1936
an incomplete typescript of it came into the hands of Susan
Dagnall, an employee of the publishing firm of George Allen and
Unwin (merged in 1990 with HarperCollins).
She asked Tolkien to finish it, and presented the complete
story to Stanley Unwin, the then Chairman of the firm. He tried
it out on his 10-year old son Rayner, who wrote an approving
report, and it was published as The Hobbit in 1937. It
immediately scored a success, and has not been out of children's
recommended reading lists ever since. It was so successful that
Stanley Unwin asked if he had any more similar material available
for publication.
By this time Tolkien had begun to make his Legendarium into
what he believed to be a more presentable state, and as he later
noted, hints of it had already made their way into The Hobbit.
He was now calling the full account Quenta Silmarillion, or
Silmarillion for short. He presented some of his "completed"
tales to Unwin, who sent them to his reader. The reader's
reaction was mixed: dislike of the poetry and praise for the
prose (the material was the story of Beren and Lúthien) but the
overall decision at the time was that these were not commercially
publishable. Unwin tactfully this messge relayed to Tolkien, but
asked him again if he was willing to write a sequel to The
Hobbit. Tolkien was disappointed at the apparent failure of The
Silmarillion, but agreed to take up the challenge of "The New
Hobbit".
This soon developed into something much more than a
children's story; for the highly complex 16-year history of what
became The Lord of the Rings consult the works listed below.
Suffice it to say that the now adult Rayner Unwin was deeply
involved in the later stages of this opus, dealing magnificently
with a dilatory and temperamental author who, at one stage, was
offering the whole work to a commercial rival (which rapidly
backed off when the scale and nature of the package became
apparent). It is thanks to Rayner Unwin's advocacy that we owe
the fact that this book was published at all - Andave
laituvalmes! His father's firm decided to incur the probable loss
of £1,000 for the succès d'estime, and publish it under the title
of The Lord of the Rings in three parts during 1954 and 1955,
with USA rights going to Houghton Mifflin. It soon became
apparent that both author and publishers had greatly
underestimated the work's public appeal."
That's a hefty chunk of text, but it's all right there, in black
and white.
Thank you. You may be seated. >:)
iceberg3k
>On Mon, 10 Jul 2000 21:53:32 -0700, iceberg3k
><mberger88...@vax2.winona.msus.edu.invalid> wrote:
>>LOL! "The Hobbit" was written for children! The Lord of the
>>Rings was indeed for adults, but I read it when I was but a wee
>>lad of 12.
>>
prove your
>statement about Tolkien writing for children.
>This is a very short breakdown of the Professor's professional
>history:
>J.R.R. Tolkien (1892--1973) born in Bloemfontein South-Africa,
was
>Professor of anglo-Saxon at Pembroke College, Oxford, from 1925
to
>1945 and then, until his retirement in 1959, Merton Professor of
>English Language and Literature. His chief interest was in the
>literary and linguistic tradition of the English West Midlands,
>especially in Beowolf, the Ancrene Wisse, and Sir Gawain and the
Green
>Knight; but he is better known to the reading public as the
author of
>Farmer Giles of Ham, The Hobbit, the Adventures of Tom Bombadil,
The
>Silmarillion(printed posthumously), and of course the three
volumes of
>The Lord of the Rings...
>
>You brought up many other good points and I agree with most of
them,
>except Tolkien's target audience.
As I wrote in the other thread,
From http://www.tolkiensociety.org:
4. The Storyteller
You are absolutely correct about The Lord of the Rings being an
adult work. I have the one-volume edition on my bookshelf and I
can say for certain that there is no way a child would sit
through this book, beautiful though it may be - it's fully twice
the thickness of a Bible printed on the same paper! Matter of
fact, I have a bookmark sitting in the middle of Book II of "The
Fellowship of the Ring," mocking my inability to make enough time
to continue reading. I also have sitting right next to my copies
of "The Lord of the Rings" and "The Hobbit" a copy of Professor
Tolkien's great book of the mythology of elvenkind, "The
Silmarillion."
The Lord of the Rings is often called a "trilogy." It ISN'T. It
is ONE novel in SIX books, often collected in THREE volumes.
Hope this helps.
Pied Piper
stress this point. This is not Nazi Germany we neither ban nor burn books
in America.
Pax
Robert <holyW...@heaven.edu> wrote in message
news:396aa504.2145692@news-server...
> On Sat, 08 Jul 2000 14:41:43 GMT, "taxdude" <taxm...@mediaone.net>
> wrote:
> >
> >I am really not familiar with the Harry Potter books, but do they differ
> >from the fantasy genre in any way?
> >Tolkien and Lewis both had magic systems, so I don't really see what the
> >problem is in this case.
> >
>
> All those books you mentioned were written for adults--Harry Potter is
> for children. Big difference there.
> No problem, really, just another media blitz for witchcraft. I may
> write a counter-Potter series featuring a kid and angels. Think it
> would sell?
>
>
Robert
it.
On Mon, 10 Jul 2000 21:53:32 -0700, iceberg3k
<mberger88...@vax2.winona.msus.edu.invalid> wrote:
>holyW...@heaven.edu (Robert) wrote:
>>On Sat, 08 Jul 2000 14:41:43 GMT, "taxdude"
><taxm...@mediaone.net>
>>wrote:
>>>
>>>I am really not familiar with the Harry Potter books, but do
>they differ
>>>from the fantasy genre in any way?
>>>Tolkien and Lewis both had magic systems, so I don't really see
>what the
>>>problem is in this case.
>>>
>>
>>All those books you mentioned were written for adults
>
>LOL! "The Hobbit" was written for children! The Lord of the
>Rings was indeed for adults, but I read it when I was but a wee
>lad of 12.
>
>>--Harry Potter is
>>for children. Big difference there.
>
>Not really such a big difference. Just in the minds of people.
>
>>No problem, really, just another media blitz for witchcraft. I
>>may write a counter-Potter series featuring a kid and angels.
>>Think it would sell?
>
>Not if you're writing it to push a Point. Kids see right through
>people who are writing to teach them Serious Lessions, and just
>breeze right by them. Look at how phenominally UNpopular crap
>like "The Giver" - which won a Newberry Honor - are with
>children. Kids know when books are preaching at them, and they
>don't like it.
>
>Ironically, I think that kids - if they weren't pushed at it by
>their parents - would enjoy reading the Bible for its literary
>merits. Don't believe me? Look at C.S. Lewis's The Chronicles
>of Narnia, a series that has long been popular with children in
>the same age bracket that the Harry Potter books are written for.
>
>What Professor Lewis really did in many places was to take
>stories from the Bible, put a new coat of paint on them, and sell
>them as works of fantasy. This should be the proper model for
>Christian literature for children and young adults, not the "I'm
>going to teach these kids a LESSON" approach that seems all too
>prevalent in "young adult" literature.
>
>-- Mark
>-ARK, ASVS, ARCR-C
>-"You guys don't seem to mind Garrizzz...zn Keillor and Ace Ventura,
>Gov'ner so I don't know how to normalize the "hork index" - Crgre Jvyyneq
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------
>
>Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
>Up to 100 minutes free!
>http://www.keen.com
>
Robert
<mberger88...@vax2.winona.msus.edu.invalid> wrote:
>LOL! "The Hobbit" was written for children! The Lord of the
>Rings was indeed for adults, but I read it when I was but a wee
>lad of 12.
>
statement about Tolkien writing for children.
This is a very short breakdown of the Professor's professional
history:
J.R.R. Tolkien (1892--1973) born in Bloemfontein South-Africa, was
Professor of anglo-Saxon at Pembroke College, Oxford, from 1925 to
1945 and then, until his retirement in 1959, Merton Professor of
English Language and Literature. His chief interest was in the
literary and linguistic tradition of the English West Midlands,
especially in Beowolf, the Ancrene Wisse, and Sir Gawain and the Green
Knight; but he is better known to the reading public as the author of
Farmer Giles of Ham, The Hobbit, the Adventures of Tom Bombadil, The
Silmarillion(printed posthumously), and of course the three volumes of
The Lord of the Rings...
You brought up many other good points and I agree with most of them,
except Tolkien's target audience.
Robert
title. Sorry.
On Tue, 11 Jul 2000 22:19:32 -0700, iceberg3k
Robert
On Tue, 11 Jul 2000 22:19:32 -0700, iceberg3k
<mberger88...@vax2.winona.msus.edu.invalid> wrote:
>holyW...@heaven.edu (Robert) wrote:
>>Hobbit for children? No way I can believe that at face
>value--prove
>>it.
>
>Very well, you are quite within your rights to doubt my words, as
>I have not backed them up with evidence yet. I shall rectify
>this oversight now.
>
>(From: http://www.tolkiensociety.org/)
>
>That's a hefty chunk of text, but it's all right there, in black
>and white.
>
>Thank you. You may be seated. >:)
>
>-- Mark
>-ARK, ASVS, ARCR-C
>-"You guys don't seem to mind Garrizzz...zn Keillor and Ace Ventura,
>Gov'ner so I don't know how to normalize the "hork index" - Crgre Jvyyneq
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------
>
>Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
>Up to 100 minutes free!
>http://www.keen.com
>
Expede
>Message-id: <396c0655.5517520@news-server>
>
>To be continued after a short, and well deserved, sleep.
>
No one ever accused you of being conscious...
paul...@my-deja.com
> Hobbit for children? No way I can believe that at face value--prove
> it.
Almost any discussion of the LotR cycle (it's history as literature,
not the contents thereof) will note that the Hobbit began as stories
Tolkien told his children. The Trilogy itself was written for his son
(or sons?) during their service in the military.
A recently finished reading my 8-year old daughter The Hobbit...or
rather, I'd read her the chapter she had reached in her own reading at
bedtime. Took her about 2 weeks to finish the novel. Why is this so
unbelievable?
Paul
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
paul...@my-deja.com
> It would have been nice if the character was a saint going to a
> seminary taught by Jesus.
If someone gets the confirmation of belief that being taught directly
by Christ would provide, would they be demonstrating the heroic virtues
that are the hallmark of all the Saints since the death of the last
disciple?
A novel of a child going to a junior seminary and facing challenges to
his faith because some of the students don't live up to the ideals of
the school would be a more appropriate parallel.
> Instead, what we get is a warlock going to witch school.
Yup...good reading too, though the magical formulae in the books have
nothing to do with the way magick really works.
> "I am the Lord Your God.
Yours, pumpkin, not mine.
paul...@my-deja.com
> All those books you mentioned were written for adults--Harry Potter is
> for children. Big difference there.
That one's already been exploded.
> No problem, really, just another media blitz for witchcraft. I may
> write a counter-Potter series featuring a kid and angels. Think it
> would sell?
>
Don't know. Can you write worth a damn?
Alan W. Craft
Ah, but then there's conscious with a conscience.
Alan