Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss

for evolutionists

7 views
Skip to first unread message

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Aug 28, 2021, 10:45:14 AM8/28/21
to
What came first. The skeleton structure of a life form, or its muscle
and meat? How does evolution explain that?

James
The Bible is truths
www.jw.org


Lucifer

unread,
Aug 28, 2021, 5:12:12 PM8/28/21
to
On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 10:45:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>What came first. The skeleton structure of a life form, or its muscle
>and meat? How does evolution explain that?

What is the exact method by which God created?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Aug 29, 2021, 10:40:43 AM8/29/21
to
The Bible doesn't say.

James
The Bible is truths
www.jw.org


>
>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Aug 30, 2021, 12:44:24 AM8/30/21
to
On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 10:40:40 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 07:12:08 +1000, Lucifer
><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 10:45:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>
>>>What came first. The skeleton structure of a life form, or its muscle
>>>and meat? How does evolution explain that?
>>
>>What is the exact method by which God created?
>
>The Bible doesn't say.

So it could have been evolution. Thanks.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Aug 31, 2021, 9:25:15 AM8/31/21
to
On Mon, 30 Aug 2021 14:44:17 +1000, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 10:40:40 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 07:12:08 +1000, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 10:45:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>
>>>>What came first. The skeleton structure of a life form, or its muscle
>>>>and meat? How does evolution explain that?
>>>
>>>What is the exact method by which God created?
>>
>>The Bible doesn't say.
>
>So it could have been evolution. Thanks.

Since evolution contradicts the Bible, it couldn't be that.

(Genesis 1:1) In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

(Genesis 1:27) And God went on to create the man in his image, in
God’s image he created him; male and female he created them.

Lucifer

unread,
Aug 31, 2021, 6:45:52 PM8/31/21
to
That contradicts your claims God doesn't cause our problems.

Do you believe God knows what you are thinking?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 1, 2021, 10:15:15 AM9/1/21
to
On Wed, 01 Sep 2021 08:45:46 +1000, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 31 Aug 2021 09:25:13 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 30 Aug 2021 14:44:17 +1000, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 10:40:40 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 07:12:08 +1000, Lucifer
>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 10:45:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>What came first. The skeleton structure of a life form, or its muscle
>>>>>>and meat? How does evolution explain that?
>>>>>
>>>>>What is the exact method by which God created?
>>>>
>>>>The Bible doesn't say.
>>>
>>>So it could have been evolution. Thanks.
>>
>>Since evolution contradicts the Bible, it couldn't be that.
>>
>>(Genesis 1:1) In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
>>
>>(Genesis 1:27) And God went on to create the man in his image, in
>>God’s image he created him; male and female he created them.
>
>That contradicts your claims God doesn't cause our problems.

He don't. To be blunt, it was the misuse of free will that caused all
the problems.

>
>Do you believe God knows what you are thinking?

Of course, if He wants to.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 1, 2021, 4:21:05 PM9/1/21
to
On Wed, 01 Sep 2021 10:15:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Wed, 01 Sep 2021 08:45:46 +1000, Lucifer
><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 31 Aug 2021 09:25:13 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, 30 Aug 2021 14:44:17 +1000, Lucifer
>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 10:40:40 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 07:12:08 +1000, Lucifer
>>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 10:45:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>What came first. The skeleton structure of a life form, or its muscle
>>>>>>>and meat? How does evolution explain that?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>What is the exact method by which God created?
>>>>>
>>>>>The Bible doesn't say.
>>>>
>>>>So it could have been evolution. Thanks.
>>>
>>>Since evolution contradicts the Bible, it couldn't be that.
>>>
>>>(Genesis 1:1) In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
>>>
>>>(Genesis 1:27) And God went on to create the man in his image, in
>>>God’s image he created him; male and female he created them.
>>
>>That contradicts your claims God doesn't cause our problems.
>
>He don't.

He don't?

>To be blunt, it was the misuse of free will that caused all
>the problems.

So God do indirectly, by the free will he gave us.

>>Do you believe God knows what you are thinking?
>
>Of course, if He wants to.

Your leaders have you afraid to even think "wrong" things.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 1, 2021, 7:20:09 PM9/1/21
to
On Thu, 02 Sep 2021 06:20:59 +1000, Lucifer
I can't blame God about something He never did. For example, a
homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
will. I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.

>
>>>Do you believe God knows what you are thinking?
>>
>>Of course, if He wants to.
>
>Your leaders have you afraid to even think "wrong" things.

I am sure that would be what they want, but I think wrong things all
the time:(
I just try not to follow through with them.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 2, 2021, 12:23:25 AM9/2/21
to
You blame Adam for something he could not have done.

>For example, a
>homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
>will.

Free will that God gave him?

>I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.

You would rather try to blame Adam when a created being
can't possibly be to blame.

>>>>Do you believe God knows what you are thinking?
>>>
>>>Of course, if He wants to.
>>
>>Your leaders have you afraid to even think "wrong" things.
>
>I am sure that would be what they want, but I think wrong things all
>the time:(
>I just try not to follow through with them.

You should. When you have doubts about the truth of
the Watchtower follow through with research.

They have you afraid to even think outside the JW box.

Do you agree with the policy of covering up ram pent
pedophilia in the JW organisation?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 2, 2021, 8:22:50 AM9/2/21
to
On Thu, 02 Sep 2021 14:23:19 +1000, Lucifer
Oh really! Who ate the forbidden fruit? Did the fruit just tear itself
off the tree and leap into
his mouth?

>
>>For example, a
>>homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
>>will.
>
>Free will that God gave him?

Yes, its either be that or programmed robots.

>
>>I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.
>
>You would rather try to blame Adam when a created being
>can't possibly be to blame.

True. There is no way I blame God for Adam's free will decision to eat
the forbidden fruit thus willfully disobeying his Creator.

>
>>>>>Do you believe God knows what you are thinking?
>>>>
>>>>Of course, if He wants to.
>>>
>>>Your leaders have you afraid to even think "wrong" things.
>>
>>I am sure that would be what they want, but I think wrong things all
>>the time:(
>>I just try not to follow through with them.
>
>You should. When you have doubts about the truth of
>the Watchtower follow through with research.

I have and do. I don't call them doubts, but rather just more research
needed. I have yet to find one time when any JW Bible aid reading
material, was false.

I was talking to my neighbor this morning. He said when he went to
church, he was the only one wearing a mask. He tried to go there the
other day, and it was closed, because 3 members got Covid 19.

The JW headquarters keeps looking out for us, that is why we still
stay isolated and hold our meetings on zoom in our homes.

>
>They have you afraid to even think outside the JW box.

Where do you get this stuff from? You need to change your anti-JW
source. I think and go outside of the "JW box" when I need to. Even
being here is literately outside of the box.

>
>Do you agree with the policy of covering up ram pent
>pedophilia in the JW organisation?

Try ALL churches and large organizations, etc. They all have their
pedophiles, and thieves, and adulterers etc.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 2, 2021, 10:02:29 AM9/2/21
to
You do so repeatedly.

>Who ate the forbidden fruit? Did the fruit just tear itself
>off the tree and leap into
> his mouth?

Who created the tree and forbade it? Did the tree put itself
in the Garden?

>>>For example, a
>>>homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
>>>will.
>>
>>Free will that God gave him?
>
>Yes, its either be that or programmed robots.

Sometimes you say God can make everything good without
making us robots.

>>>I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.
>>
>>You would rather try to blame Adam when a created being
>>can't possibly be to blame.
>
>True.

Thank you for your admission.

>There is no way I blame God for Adam's free will decision to eat
>the forbidden fruit thus willfully disobeying his Creator.
>
>>>>>>Do you believe God knows what you are thinking?
>>>>>
>>>>>Of course, if He wants to.
>>>>
>>>>Your leaders have you afraid to even think "wrong" things.
>>>
>>>I am sure that would be what they want, but I think wrong things all
>>>the time:(
>>>I just try not to follow through with them.
>>
>>You should. When you have doubts about the truth of
>>the Watchtower follow through with research.
>
>I have and do. I don't call them doubts, but rather just more research
>needed. I have yet to find one time when any JW Bible aid reading
>material, was false.
>
>I was talking to my neighbor this morning. He said when he went to
>church, he was the only one wearing a mask. He tried to go there the
>other day, and it was closed, because 3 members got Covid 19.
>
>The JW headquarters keeps looking out for us, that is why we still
>stay isolated and hold our meetings on zoom in our homes.

The government closed the meeting halls.

>>They have you afraid to even think outside the JW box.
>
>Where do you get this stuff from? You need to change your anti-JW
>source. I think and go outside of the "JW box" when I need to. Even
>being here is literately outside of the box.

You don't dare even consider your leaders might be lying.

>>Do you agree with the policy of covering up rampant
>>pedophilia in the JW organisation?
>
>Try ALL churches and large organizations, etc. They all have their
>pedophiles, and thieves, and adulterers etc.

The JWs are the ones refusing to compensate their victims.
I hope they are deregistered.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 3, 2021, 3:26:07 PM9/3/21
to
On Fri, 03 Sep 2021 00:02:23 +1000, Lucifer
God created all the trees. He let Adam eat all the trees but one. And
Adam apparently enjoyed all the trees but that one. That was a test of
his Creator's loyalty, which he failed.

>
>>>>For example, a
>>>>homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
>>>>will.
>>>
>>>Free will that God gave him?
>>
>>Yes, its either be that or programmed robots.
>
>Sometimes you say God can make everything good without
>making us robots.

That is how it will be in the "new earth".

>
>>>>I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.
>>>
>>>You would rather try to blame Adam when a created being
>>>can't possibly be to blame.
>>
>>True.
>
>Thank you for your admission.

Yes, Adam is to blame, not God.

>
>>There is no way I blame God for Adam's free will decision to eat
>>the forbidden fruit thus willfully disobeying his Creator.
>>
>>>>>>>Do you believe God knows what you are thinking?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Of course, if He wants to.
>>>>>
>>>>>Your leaders have you afraid to even think "wrong" things.
>>>>
>>>>I am sure that would be what they want, but I think wrong things all
>>>>the time:(
>>>>I just try not to follow through with them.
>>>
>>>You should. When you have doubts about the truth of
>>>the Watchtower follow through with research.
>>
>>I have and do. I don't call them doubts, but rather just more research
>>needed. I have yet to find one time when any JW Bible aid reading
>>material, was false.
>>
>>I was talking to my neighbor this morning. He said when he went to
>>church, he was the only one wearing a mask. He tried to go there the
>>other day, and it was closed, because 3 members got Covid 19.
>>
>>The JW headquarters keeps looking out for us, that is why we still
>>stay isolated and hold our meetings on zoom in our homes.
>
>The government closed the meeting halls.

Maybe where you live, but not here.

>
>>>They have you afraid to even think outside the JW box.
>>
>>Where do you get this stuff from? You need to change your anti-JW
>>source. I think and go outside of the "JW box" when I need to. Even
>>being here is literately outside of the box.
>
>You don't dare even consider your leaders might be lying.

Of course, no one is perfect. A long time ago they once had in the
Watchtower on being cautious on what we read in it. Check it with the
Bible. A rotten apple can get in anywhere.

>
>>>Do you agree with the policy of covering up rampant
>>>pedophilia in the JW organisation?
>>
>>Try ALL churches and large organizations, etc. They all have their
>>pedophiles, and thieves, and adulterers etc.
>
>The JWs are the ones refusing to compensate their victims.
>I hope they are deregistered.

Each case needs to be studied separately. If they won't willingly
compensate a real victim, a judge will do that for them. They are not
above reasonable law.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 3, 2021, 6:52:39 PM9/3/21
to
God failed a loyalty test?

>>>>>For example, a
>>>>>homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
>>>>>will.
>>>>
>>>>Free will that God gave him?
>>>
>>>Yes, its either be that or programmed robots.
>>
>>Sometimes you say God can make everything good without
>>making us robots.
>
>That is how it will be in the "new earth".

It should be that way now.

What would you think of a human father who left his children
in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
love him?

>>>>>I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.
>>>>
>>>>You would rather try to blame Adam when a created being
>>>>can't possibly be to blame.
>>>
>>>True.
>>
>>Thank you for your admission.
>
>Yes, Adam is to blame, not God.

Are you to blame for your panic attacks?

>>>>They have you afraid to even think outside the JW box.
>>>
>>>Where do you get this stuff from? You need to change your anti-JW
>>>source. I think and go outside of the "JW box" when I need to. Even
>>>being here is literately outside of the box.
>>
>>You don't dare even consider your leaders might be lying.
>
>Of course, no one is perfect. A long time ago they once had in the
>Watchtower on being cautious on what we read in it. Check it with the
>Bible. A rotten apple can get in anywhere.

The entire JW organisation is rotten. They cover up child abuse.

>>>>Do you agree with the policy of covering up rampant
>>>>pedophilia in the JW organisation?
>>>
>>>Try ALL churches and large organizations, etc. They all have their
>>>pedophiles, and thieves, and adulterers etc.
>>
>>The JWs are the ones refusing to compensate their victims.
>>I hope they are deregistered.
>
>Each case needs to be studied separately. If they won't willingly
>compensate a real victim, a judge will do that for them. They are not
>above reasonable law.

Do you approve of them refusing to sign up to compensate
their victims?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 5, 2021, 10:46:46 AM9/5/21
to
On Sat, 04 Sep 2021 08:52:31 +1000, Lucifer
I meant "his loyalty to his Creator".

>
>>>>>>For example, a
>>>>>>homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
>>>>>>will.
>>>>>
>>>>>Free will that God gave him?
>>>>
>>>>Yes, its either be that or programmed robots.
>>>
>>>Sometimes you say God can make everything good without
>>>making us robots.
>>
>>That is how it will be in the "new earth".
>
>It should be that way now.
>
>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>love him?

I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.

>
>>>>>>I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.
>>>>>
>>>>>You would rather try to blame Adam when a created being
>>>>>can't possibly be to blame.
>>>>
>>>>True.
>>>
>>>Thank you for your admission.
>>
>>Yes, Adam is to blame, not God.
>
>Are you to blame for your panic attacks?

Of course not. Random medical chance is at fault.

>
>>>>>They have you afraid to even think outside the JW box.
>>>>
>>>>Where do you get this stuff from? You need to change your anti-JW
>>>>source. I think and go outside of the "JW box" when I need to. Even
>>>>being here is literately outside of the box.
>>>
>>>You don't dare even consider your leaders might be lying.
>>
>>Of course, no one is perfect. A long time ago they once had in the
>>Watchtower on being cautious on what we read in it. Check it with the
>>Bible. A rotten apple can get in anywhere.
>
>The entire JW organisation is rotten. They cover up child abuse.

Each account should be dealt with individually. If a mentally troubled
child makes that accusation ABOUT YOU, wouldn't you want a thorough
investigation? Yet the world may call that a 'cover up'.

But on the other hand, if it is being covered up, those JW's should be
removed, and legal processes done if applicable. God wants his
congregations to remain clean. (2 Cor 7:1)


>
>>>>>Do you agree with the policy of covering up rampant
>>>>>pedophilia in the JW organisation?
>>>>
>>>>Try ALL churches and large organizations, etc. They all have their
>>>>pedophiles, and thieves, and adulterers etc.
>>>
>>>The JWs are the ones refusing to compensate their victims.
>>>I hope they are deregistered.
>>
>>Each case needs to be studied separately. If they won't willingly
>>compensate a real victim, a judge will do that for them. They are not
>>above reasonable law.
>
>Do you approve of them refusing to sign up to compensate
>their victims

No, the victims should be compensated.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 6, 2021, 1:02:25 AM9/6/21
to
Is God loyal to his creator?

>>>>>>>For example, a
>>>>>>>homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
>>>>>>>will.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Free will that God gave him?
>>>>>
>>>>>Yes, its either be that or programmed robots.
>>>>
>>>>Sometimes you say God can make everything good without
>>>>making us robots.
>>>
>>>That is how it will be in the "new earth".
>>
>>It should be that way now.
>>
>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>love him?
>
>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.

How are you going to get God to change his ways?

>>>>>>>I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You would rather try to blame Adam when a created being
>>>>>>can't possibly be to blame.
>>>>>
>>>>>True.
>>>>
>>>>Thank you for your admission.
>>>
>>>Yes, Adam is to blame, not God.
>>
>>Are you to blame for your panic attacks?
>
>Of course not. Random medical chance is at fault.

Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.

>>>>>>They have you afraid to even think outside the JW box.
>>>>>
>>>>>Where do you get this stuff from? You need to change your anti-JW
>>>>>source. I think and go outside of the "JW box" when I need to. Even
>>>>>being here is literately outside of the box.
>>>>
>>>>You don't dare even consider your leaders might be lying.
>>>
>>>Of course, no one is perfect. A long time ago they once had in the
>>>Watchtower on being cautious on what we read in it. Check it with the
>>>Bible. A rotten apple can get in anywhere.
>>
>>The entire JW organisation is rotten. They cover up child abuse.
>
>Each account should be dealt with individually. If a mentally troubled
>child makes that accusation ABOUT YOU, wouldn't you want a thorough
>investigation? Yet the world may call that a 'cover up'.
>
>But on the other hand, if it is being covered up, those JW's should be
>removed, and legal processes done if applicable. God wants his
>congregations to remain clean. (2 Cor 7:1)

God always has what he wills.

>>>>>>Do you agree with the policy of covering up rampant
>>>>>>pedophilia in the JW organisation?
>>>>>
>>>>>Try ALL churches and large organizations, etc. They all have their
>>>>>pedophiles, and thieves, and adulterers etc.
>>>>
>>>>The JWs are the ones refusing to compensate their victims.
>>>>I hope they are deregistered.
>>>
>>>Each case needs to be studied separately. If they won't willingly
>>>compensate a real victim, a judge will do that for them. They are not
>>>above reasonable law.
>>
>>Do you approve of them refusing to sign up to compensate
>>their victims
>
>No, the victims should be compensated.

Your morality is higher than that of God.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 9, 2021, 10:22:16 AM9/9/21
to
On Mon, 06 Sep 2021 15:02:21 +1000, Lucifer
He IS the Creator. But He always lived from infinity to the past, to
infinity in the future. (Ps 90:2)

>
>>>>>>>>For example, a
>>>>>>>>homosexual gets Aids and dies. He misused the wonderful gift of free
>>>>>>>>will.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Free will that God gave him?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Yes, its either be that or programmed robots.
>>>>>
>>>>>Sometimes you say God can make everything good without
>>>>>making us robots.
>>>>
>>>>That is how it will be in the "new earth".
>>>
>>>It should be that way now.
>>>
>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>love him?
>>
>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>
>How are you going to get God to change his ways?

Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
the opposite. God won't do that.

>
>>>>>>>>I can't blame God for his actions that killed him.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You would rather try to blame Adam when a created being
>>>>>>>can't possibly be to blame.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>True.
>>>>>
>>>>>Thank you for your admission.
>>>>
>>>>Yes, Adam is to blame, not God.
>>>
>>>Are you to blame for your panic attacks?
>>
>>Of course not. Random medical chance is at fault.
>
>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.

Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.
>
>>>>>>>They have you afraid to even think outside the JW box.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Where do you get this stuff from? You need to change your anti-JW
>>>>>>source. I think and go outside of the "JW box" when I need to. Even
>>>>>>being here is literately outside of the box.
>>>>>
>>>>>You don't dare even consider your leaders might be lying.
>>>>
>>>>Of course, no one is perfect. A long time ago they once had in the
>>>>Watchtower on being cautious on what we read in it. Check it with the
>>>>Bible. A rotten apple can get in anywhere.
>>>
>>>The entire JW organisation is rotten. They cover up child abuse.
>>
>>Each account should be dealt with individually. If a mentally troubled
>>child makes that accusation ABOUT YOU, wouldn't you want a thorough
>>investigation? Yet the world may call that a 'cover up'.
>>
>>But on the other hand, if it is being covered up, those JW's should be
>>removed, and legal processes done if applicable. God wants his
>>congregations to remain clean. (2 Cor 7:1)
>
>God always has what he wills.

Most of the time, yes. God can will every person on earth to repent.
But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.

>
>>>>>>>Do you agree with the policy of covering up rampant
>>>>>>>pedophilia in the JW organisation?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Try ALL churches and large organizations, etc. They all have their
>>>>>>pedophiles, and thieves, and adulterers etc.
>>>>>
>>>>>The JWs are the ones refusing to compensate their victims.
>>>>>I hope they are deregistered.
>>>>
>>>>Each case needs to be studied separately. If they won't willingly
>>>>compensate a real victim, a judge will do that for them. They are not
>>>>above reasonable law.
>>>
>>>Do you approve of them refusing to sign up to compensate
>>>their victims
>>
>>No, the victims should be compensated.
>
>Your morality is higher than that of God.

I'll pretend I didn't hear that. If God's morality was a mountain, my
morality would be a tiny grain of sand.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 9, 2021, 8:39:15 PM9/9/21
to
On Thu, 09 Sep 2021 10:22:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Mon, 06 Sep 2021 15:02:21 +1000, Lucifer
><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:46:43 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 04 Sep 2021 08:52:31 +1000, Lucifer
>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>He IS the Creator. But He always lived from infinity to the past, to
>infinity in the future. (Ps 90:2)

In reality the God concept was created around 2,000 years ago
and will expire soon.

>>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>>love him?
>>>
>>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>>
>>How are you going to get God to change his ways?
>
>Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
>the opposite. God won't do that.

Do you think it good for the human father to leave a known child
molester in charge of his children?

>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>
>Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
>and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
>has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.

Play the cards God dealt.

>>God always has what he wills.
>
>Most of the time, yes.

Always, you said.

>God can will every person on earth to repent.
>But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.

As you said, every part of God's design needs to be amended.
God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.

>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>
>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.

Your morality is higher than that of God.
Your morality is higher than that of God.
Your morality is higher than that of God.
Your morality is higher than that of God.
Your morality is higher than that of God.

>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.

You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 11, 2021, 10:16:44 AM9/11/21
to
On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 10:39:14 +1000, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 09 Sep 2021 10:22:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 06 Sep 2021 15:02:21 +1000, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:46:43 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sat, 04 Sep 2021 08:52:31 +1000, Lucifer
>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>He IS the Creator. But He always lived from infinity to the past, to
>>infinity in the future. (Ps 90:2)
>
>In reality the God concept was created around 2,000 years ago
>and will expire soon.

The ancient Sumatrans, I believe, had the first god concept.

The Jews' God did things. The other false gods just stood there, as
statues.

>
>>>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>>>love him?
>>>>
>>>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>>>
>>>How are you going to get God to change his ways?
>>
>>Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
>>the opposite. God won't do that.
>
>Do you think it good for the human father to leave a known child
>molester in charge of his children?

He should be electrocuted at midnight.

>
>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>
>>Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
>>and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
>>has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.
>
>Play the cards God dealt.

Play the cards random chance dealt:

(Ecclesiastes 9:11) I have seen something further under the sun, that
the swift do not always win the race, nor do the mighty win the
battle, nor do the wise always have the food, nor do the intelligent
always have the riches, nor do those with knowledge always have
success, because time and unexpected events overtake them all.


>
>>>God always has what he wills.
>>
>>Most of the time, yes.
>
>Always, you said.

I didn't word it right. Not everything God wills, happens. It gets
kind of picky here,

If God just wants something, like all humans to be righteous, that
doesn't happen. If God sends His word out for humans to be righteous,
they would all become robots, and thus programmed as righteous.

>
>>God can will every person on earth to repent.
>>But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.
>
>As you said, every part of God's design needs to be amended.
>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.

And adults need to consult with a nursery school child on what to do
next.

>
>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>
>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>
>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>Your morality is higher than that of God.

Ignorance Ignored.

>
>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>
>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea>

The sea should have it so good.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 11, 2021, 9:23:53 PM9/11/21
to
On Sat, 11 Sep 2021 10:16:39 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 10:39:14 +1000, Lucifer
><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 09 Sep 2021 10:22:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, 06 Sep 2021 15:02:21 +1000, Lucifer
>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:46:43 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Sat, 04 Sep 2021 08:52:31 +1000, Lucifer
>>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>He IS the Creator. But He always lived from infinity to the past, to
>>>infinity in the future. (Ps 90:2)
>>
>>In reality the God concept was created around 2,000 years ago
>>and will expire soon.
>
>The ancient Sumatrans, I believe, had the first god concept.
>
>The Jews' God did things. The other false gods just stood there, as
>statues.

Never said an unkind word, unlike your God.

>>>>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>>>>love him?
>>>>>
>>>>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>>>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>>>>
>>>>How are you going to get God to change his ways?
>>>
>>>Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
>>>the opposite. God won't do that.
>>
>>Do you think it good for the human father to leave a known child
>>molester in charge of his children?
>
>He should be electrocuted at midnight.

How should we punish God?

>>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>>
>>>Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
>>>and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
>>>has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.
>>
>>Play the cards God dealt.
>
>Play the cards random chance dealt:
>
>(Ecclesiastes 9:11) I have seen something further under the sun, that
>the swift do not always win the race, nor do the mighty win the
>battle, nor do the wise always have the food, nor do the intelligent
>always have the riches, nor do those with knowledge always have
>success, because time and unexpected events overtake them all.

Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.

>>>>God always has what he wills.
>>>
>>>Most of the time, yes.
>>
>>Always, you said.
>
>I didn't word it right. Not everything God wills, happens. It gets
>kind of picky here,
>
>If God just wants something, like all humans to be righteous, that
>doesn't happen. If God sends His word out for humans to be righteous,
>they would all become robots, and thus programmed as righteous.

Are all righteous people robots?

>>>God can will every person on earth to repent.
>>>But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.
>>
>>As you said, every part of God's design needs to be amended.
>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>
>And adults need to consult with a nursery school child on what to do
>next.

God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.

>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>
>>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>>
>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>
>Ignorance Ignored.

Your morality is higher than that of God.

>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>
>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>
>The sea should have it so good.

Mark 11:23
“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 12, 2021, 12:11:27 PM9/12/21
to
On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 11:23:27 +1000, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Sat, 11 Sep 2021 10:16:39 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 10:39:14 +1000, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 09 Sep 2021 10:22:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Mon, 06 Sep 2021 15:02:21 +1000, Lucifer
>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:46:43 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Sat, 04 Sep 2021 08:52:31 +1000, Lucifer
>>>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>He IS the Creator. But He always lived from infinity to the past, to
>>>>infinity in the future. (Ps 90:2)
>>>
>>>In reality the God concept was created around 2,000 years ago
>>>and will expire soon.
>>
>>The ancient Sumatrans, I believe, had the first god concept.
>>
>>The Jews' God did things. The other false gods just stood there, as
>>statues.
>
>Never said an unkind word, unlike your God.

In case you are unaware of it, those false gods are DEAD. The breath
of life is not in them. And they always stay 'stoned'. But my God
Jehovah, is life itself. Life only comes from previous life. That is a
rule of life.

>
>>>>>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>>>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>>>>>love him?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>>>>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>>>>>
>>>>>How are you going to get God to change his ways?
>>>>
>>>>Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
>>>>the opposite. God won't do that.
>>>
>>>Do you think it good for the human father to leave a known child
>>>molester in charge of his children?
>>
>>He should be electrocuted at midnight.
>
>How should we punish God?

Not at all. It was the father that did it.

>
>>>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>>>
>>>>Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
>>>>and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
>>>>has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.
>>>
>>>Play the cards God dealt.
>>
>>Play the cards random chance dealt:
>>
>>(Ecclesiastes 9:11) I have seen something further under the sun, that
>>the swift do not always win the race, nor do the mighty win the
>>battle, nor do the wise always have the food, nor do the intelligent
>>always have the riches, nor do those with knowledge always have
>>success, because time and unexpected events overtake them all.
>
>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.


>
>>>>>God always has what he wills.
>>>>
>>>>Most of the time, yes.
>>>
>>>Always, you said.
>>
>>I didn't word it right. Not everything God wills, happens. It gets
>>kind of picky here,
>>
>>If God just wants something, like all humans to be righteous, that
>>doesn't happen. If God sends His word out for humans to be righteous,
>>they would all become robots, and thus programmed as righteous.
>
>Are all righteous people robots?

I am sure you are not a robot.

>
>>>>God can will every person on earth to repent.
>>>>But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.
>>>
>>>As you said, every part of God's design needs to be amended.
>>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>>
>>And adults need to consult with a nursery school child on what to do
>>next.
>
>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.

Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.

>
>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>
>>>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>>>
>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>
>>Ignorance Ignored.
>
>Your morality is higher than that of God.

Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.

>
>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>
>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>
>>The sea should have it so good.
>
>Mark 11:23
>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.

What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
in parables. Can you figure it out?

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 13, 2021, 1:23:03 AM9/13/21
to
On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 12:11:19 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Sun, 12 Sep 2021 11:23:27 +1000, Lucifer
><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 11 Sep 2021 10:16:39 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 10 Sep 2021 10:39:14 +1000, Lucifer
>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Thu, 09 Sep 2021 10:22:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Mon, 06 Sep 2021 15:02:21 +1000, Lucifer
>>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Sun, 05 Sep 2021 10:46:43 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On Sat, 04 Sep 2021 08:52:31 +1000, Lucifer
>>>>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>He IS the Creator. But He always lived from infinity to the past, to
>>>>>infinity in the future. (Ps 90:2)
>>>>
>>>>In reality the God concept was created around 2,000 years ago
>>>>and will expire soon.
>>>
>>>The ancient Sumatrans, I believe, had the first god concept.
>>>
>>>The Jews' God did things. The other false gods just stood there, as
>>>statues.
>>
>>Never said an unkind word, unlike your God.
>
>In case you are unaware of it, those false gods are DEAD. The breath
>of life is not in them. And they always stay 'stoned'. But my God
>Jehovah, is life itself. Life only comes from previous life. That is a
>rule of life.

What previous life did Jehovah come from?

>>>>>>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>>>>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>>>>>>love him?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>>>>>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>How are you going to get God to change his ways?
>>>>>
>>>>>Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
>>>>>the opposite. God won't do that.
>>>>
>>>>Do you think it good for the human father to leave a known child
>>>>molester in charge of his children?
>>>
>>>He should be electrocuted at midnight.
>>
>>How should we punish God?
>
>Not at all. It was the father that did it.

You said God is doing the same as the father.

>>>>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>>>>
>>>>>Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
>>>>>and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
>>>>>has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.
>>>>
>>>>Play the cards God dealt.
>>>
>>>Play the cards random chance dealt:
>>>
>>>(Ecclesiastes 9:11) I have seen something further under the sun, that
>>>the swift do not always win the race, nor do the mighty win the
>>>battle, nor do the wise always have the food, nor do the intelligent
>>>always have the riches, nor do those with knowledge always have
>>>success, because time and unexpected events overtake them all.
>>
>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.

It was actually God of course.

>>>>>>God always has what he wills.
>>>>>
>>>>>Most of the time, yes.
>>>>
>>>>Always, you said.
>>>
>>>I didn't word it right. Not everything God wills, happens. It gets
>>>kind of picky here,
>>>
>>>If God just wants something, like all humans to be righteous, that
>>>doesn't happen. If God sends His word out for humans to be righteous,
>>>they would all become robots, and thus programmed as righteous.
>>
>>Are all righteous people robots?
>
>I am sure you are not a robot.

The old politician's trick; in addition to changing the subject, blame
others for your errors. You are pretty good at those.

>>>>>God can will every person on earth to repent.
>>>>>But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.
>>>>
>>>>As you said, every part of God's design needs to be amended.
>>>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>>>
>>>And adults need to consult with a nursery school child on what to do
>>>next.
>>
>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>
>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.

Please try to stay on topic.

God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.

>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>
>>>>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>>>>
>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>
>>>Ignorance Ignored.
>>
>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>
>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.

Please try to stay on topic.

>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>
>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>
>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>
>>Mark 11:23
>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>
>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>in parables. Can you figure it out?

The writer was trying to impress us.

You know nothing about the God you promote.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 16, 2021, 10:20:11 AM9/16/21
to
On Mon, 13 Sep 2021 15:22:58 +1000, Lucifer
Himself.

>
>>>>>>>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>>>>>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>>>>>>>love him?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>>>>>>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>How are you going to get God to change his ways?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
>>>>>>the opposite. God won't do that.
>>>>>
>>>>>Do you think it good for the human father to leave a known child
>>>>>molester in charge of his children?
>>>>
>>>>He should be electrocuted at midnight.
>>>
>>>How should we punish God?
>>
>>Not at all. It was the father that did it.
>
>You said God is doing the same as the father.

Show me where I said that. I know you lie at the drop of a hat. So
prove it please.

>
>>>>>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
>>>>>>and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
>>>>>>has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.
>>>>>
>>>>>Play the cards God dealt.
>>>>
>>>>Play the cards random chance dealt:
>>>>
>>>>(Ecclesiastes 9:11) I have seen something further under the sun, that
>>>>the swift do not always win the race, nor do the mighty win the
>>>>battle, nor do the wise always have the food, nor do the intelligent
>>>>always have the riches, nor do those with knowledge always have
>>>>success, because time and unexpected events overtake them all.
>>>
>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>
>It was actually God of course.

Of course you would say that. You are digging your own grave when you
talk like that.

>
>>>>>>>God always has what he wills.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Most of the time, yes.
>>>>>
>>>>>Always, you said.
>>>>
>>>>I didn't word it right. Not everything God wills, happens. It gets
>>>>kind of picky here,
>>>>
>>>>If God just wants something, like all humans to be righteous, that
>>>>doesn't happen. If God sends His word out for humans to be righteous,
>>>>they would all become robots, and thus programmed as righteous.
>>>
>>>Are all righteous people robots?
>>
>>I am sure you are not a robot.
>
>The old politician's trick; in addition to changing the subject, blame
>others for your errors. You are pretty good at those.

That is my original statement. Can't you come up with something new?

>
>>>>>>God can will every person on earth to repent.
>>>>>>But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.
>>>>>
>>>>>As you said, every part of God's design needs to be amended.
>>>>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>>>>
>>>>And adults need to consult with a nursery school child on what to do
>>>>next.
>>>
>>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>>
>>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.
>
>Please try to stay on topic.

That is "on topic". Humans are imperfect. Why would a perfect God seek
council from imperfect lowly beings?

>
>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do

See right above
.
>
>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>>>>>
>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>
>>>>Ignorance Ignored.
>>>
>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>
>>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.
>
>Please try to stay on topic.


That is "on topic". Humans are imperfect. Why would a perfect high God
seek council from imperfect lowly beings? Do you follow council given
by nursery school kids?


>
>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>
>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>
>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>
>>>Mark 11:23
>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>
>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>
>The writer was trying to impress us.
>
>You know nothing about the God you promote.

I have given you many Bible truths. To ignore them, is to dig your own
grave.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 16, 2021, 2:07:36 PM9/16/21
to
Like only comes from like, right? So God can only produce more
God's. Macrocreation is not possible.

>>>>>>>>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>>>>>>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>>>>>>>>love him?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>>>>>>>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>How are you going to get God to change his ways?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
>>>>>>>the opposite. God won't do that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Do you think it good for the human father to leave a known child
>>>>>>molester in charge of his children?
>>>>>
>>>>>He should be electrocuted at midnight.
>>>>
>>>>How should we punish God?
>>>
>>>Not at all. It was the father that did it.
>>
>>You said God is doing the same as the father.
>
>Show me where I said that. I know you lie at the drop of a hat. So
>prove it please.

How dare you accuse God of creating liars!
You are digging your own grave.

You said God is doing far worse than the father.
How should we punish God?

>>>>>>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
>>>>>>>and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
>>>>>>>has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Play the cards God dealt.
>>>>>
>>>>>Play the cards random chance dealt:
>>>>>
>>>>>(Ecclesiastes 9:11) I have seen something further under the sun, that
>>>>>the swift do not always win the race, nor do the mighty win the
>>>>>battle, nor do the wise always have the food, nor do the intelligent
>>>>>always have the riches, nor do those with knowledge always have
>>>>>success, because time and unexpected events overtake them all.
>>>>
>>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>
>>It was actually God of course.
>
>Of course you would say that. You are digging your own grave when you
>talk like that.

That doesn't work with people who are not members of your cult.

>>>>>>>>God always has what he wills.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Most of the time, yes.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Always, you said.
>>>>>
>>>>>I didn't word it right. Not everything God wills, happens. It gets
>>>>>kind of picky here,
>>>>>
>>>>>If God just wants something, like all humans to be righteous, that
>>>>>doesn't happen. If God sends His word out for humans to be righteous,
>>>>>they would all become robots, and thus programmed as righteous.

Are all righteous people robots?

>>>>>>>God can will every person on earth to repent.
>>>>>>>But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>As you said, every part of God's design needs to be amended.
>>>>>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>>>>>
>>>>>And adults need to consult with a nursery school child on what to do
>>>>>next.
>>>>
>>>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>>>
>>>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.
>>
>>Please try to stay on topic.
>
>That is "on topic". Humans are imperfect. Why would a perfect God seek
>council from imperfect lowly beings?

To discover what we want and need.

>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>
>>>>>Ignorance Ignored.
>>>>
>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>
>>>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.
>>
>>Please try to stay on topic.
>
>That is "on topic". Humans are imperfect.

Why would a perfect God create imperfect humans?

>Why would a perfect high God
>seek council from imperfect lowly beings?

To discover what we want and need.

>Do you follow council given by nursery school kids?

If it was my job to care for nursery school baby goats I
would listen to them.

>>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>>
>>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>>
>>>>Mark 11:23
>>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>>
>>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>>
>>The writer was trying to impress us.
>>
>>You know nothing about the God you promote.
>
>I have given you many Bible truths.

You said truths are what some people believe even though they
may be false.

>To ignore them, is to dig your own grave.

You gunna blow your doG whistle to summon your tame doG?
You have no evidence for your claims.
You don't even know if there is a God.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 20, 2021, 7:52:29 AM9/20/21
to
On Fri, 17 Sep 2021 04:07:31 +1000, Lucifer
Actually it's: Life only comes from life. There is no spontaneous life
in the world, at this time.

>So God can only produce more
>God's. Macrocreation is not possible.

Obviously it is possible, since all the many life forms are here. God
is the only exception, since He always was. (Ps 90:2)


>
>>>>>>>>>>>What would you think of a human father who left his children
>>>>>>>>>>>in the charge of a known pedophile to see if they would still
>>>>>>>>>>>love him?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I would think that father needs to change his ways. Does that father
>>>>>>>>>>have universal issues to answer? No. thus he shouldn't do that.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>How are you going to get God to change his ways?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Well, if EVERYTHING He does it good, then any changes made would be
>>>>>>>>the opposite. God won't do that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Do you think it good for the human father to leave a known child
>>>>>>>molester in charge of his children?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>He should be electrocuted at midnight.
>>>>>
>>>>>How should we punish God?
>>>>
>>>>Not at all. It was the father that did it.
>>>
>>>You said God is doing the same as the father.
>>
>>Show me where I said that. I know you lie at the drop of a hat. So
>>prove it please.
>
>How dare you accuse God of creating liars!
>You are digging your own grave.

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>You said God is doing far worse than the father.

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>How should we punish God?

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>>>>>>>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Negatrons. Basically there is a big difference between a medical issue
>>>>>>>>and a moral issue. A moral issue is a choice matter. A medical issue
>>>>>>>>has no choices. You just end up with it. Play the cards you are dealt.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Play the cards God dealt.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Play the cards random chance dealt:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>(Ecclesiastes 9:11) I have seen something further under the sun, that
>>>>>>the swift do not always win the race, nor do the mighty win the
>>>>>>battle, nor do the wise always have the food, nor do the intelligent
>>>>>>always have the riches, nor do those with knowledge always have
>>>>>>success, because time and unexpected events overtake them all.
>>>>>
>>>>>Random medical chance caused Adam to sin.
>>>
>>>It was actually God of course.
>>
>>Of course you would say that. You are digging your own grave when you
>>talk like that.
>
>That doesn't work with people who are not members of your cult.

Yes it can. We have many, many ongoing Bible studies, who are not JW's
yet.

>
>>>>>>>>>God always has what he wills.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Most of the time, yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Always, you said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I didn't word it right. Not everything God wills, happens. It gets
>>>>>>kind of picky here,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>If God just wants something, like all humans to be righteous, that
>>>>>>doesn't happen. If God sends His word out for humans to be righteous,
>>>>>>they would all become robots, and thus programmed as righteous.
>
>Are all righteous people robots?

Only if God wanted to make it so.

>
>>>>>>>>God can will every person on earth to repent.
>>>>>>>>But that just will not happen. However, He has the right attitude.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>As you said, every part of God's design needs to be amended.
>>>>>>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>And adults need to consult with a nursery school child on what to do
>>>>>>next.
>>>>>
>>>>>God should consult with us to learn what he needs to do.
>>>>
>>>>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.
>>>
>>>Please try to stay on topic.
>>
>>That is "on topic". Humans are imperfect. Why would a perfect God seek
>>council from imperfect lowly beings?
>
>To discover what we want and need.

God can read our minds. So there is no reason to come to us for
council.

>
>>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Ignorance Ignored.
>>>>>
>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>
>>>>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.
>>>
>>>Please try to stay on topic.
>>
>>That is "on topic". Humans are imperfect.
>
>Why would a perfect God create imperfect humans?

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>>Why would a perfect high God
>>seek council from imperfect lowly beings?
>
>To discover what we want and need.
>
>>Do you follow council given by nursery school kids?
>
>If it was my job to care for nursery school baby goats I
>would listen to them.
>
>>>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>>>
>>>>>Mark 11:23
>>>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>>>
>>>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>>>
>>>The writer was trying to impress us.
>>>
>>>You know nothing about the God you promote.
>>
>>I have given you many Bible truths.
>
>You said truths are what some people believe even though they
>may be false.

That is always possible. It is also possible that truths presented to
you, are REALLY truths.

>
>>To ignore them, is to dig your own grave.
>
>You gunna blow your doG whistle to summon your tame doG?

???

>You have no evidence for your claims.

You are even stepping on the evidence. You are immersed in evidence.

>You don't even know if there is a God.

There is some super intelligent thing
out there that created all of these life forms. We call Him Jehovah
God.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 20, 2021, 8:33:48 AM9/20/21
to
I've never seen a dinosaur give birth to a bird.

>God is the only exception, since He always was. (Ps 90:2)

We are told God is life so God must have come from a
super God.

>>Are all righteous people robots?
>
>Only if God wanted to make it so.

Why did you say God can't make everything good without
making us robots?

>God can read our minds.

That is a viscous lie from your masters to make you afraid
to even think for yourself.

>So there is no reason to come to us for council.

You said God is an unthinking emotion.

>>>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Ignorance Ignored.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>
>>>>>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.
>>>>
>>>>Please try to stay on topic.
>>>
>>>That is "on topic". Humans are imperfect.
>>
>>Why would a perfect God create imperfect humans?
>
>You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
>meaning.

What about my question?

>>>Why would a perfect high God
>>>seek council from imperfect lowly beings?
>>
>>To discover what we want and need.
>>
>>>Do you follow council given by nursery school kids?
>>
>>If it was my job to care for nursery school baby goats I
>>would listen to them.
>>
>>>>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Mark 11:23
>>>>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>>>>
>>>>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>>>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>>>>
>>>>The writer was trying to impress us.
>>>>
>>>>You know nothing about the God you promote.
>>>
>>>I have given you many Bible truths.
>>
>>You said truths are what some people believe even though they
>>may be false.
>
>That is always possible. It is also possible that truths presented to
>you, are REALLY truths.

But not true.

>>>To ignore them, is to dig your own grave.
>>
>>You gunna blow your doG whistle to summon your tame doG?
>
>???
>
>>You have no evidence for your claims.
>
>You are even stepping on the evidence. You are immersed in evidence.

There is a place where there are so many fossils that people
do walk on them.

If you are serious about becoming an atheist you should look
on youtube.

>>You don't even know if there is a God.
>
>There is some super intelligent thing
>out there that created all of these life forms.

How many times must I tell you?
Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.

>We call Him Jehovah God.

We call the process evolution.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 22, 2021, 8:16:27 PM9/22/21
to
On Mon, 20 Sep 2021 22:33:43 +1000, Lucifer
Macrocreation must be possible, since there are millions of different
life forms on this planet.

>>
>>Obviously it is possible, since all the many life forms are here.
>
>I've never seen a dinosaur give birth to a bird.
>

Nor has anyone, although evolutionists say dinosaurs turned into
birds:

There once was a man who took evolution in school.
He thought that the evolutionary tree was cool.
And decided to share it with God-fearing aunt Milly,
Who looked at the bird line, and said it was silly.
Yet said, if evolution ever worked in reverse,
My chickens would eat me, before I could eat them first.



>>God is the only exception, since He always was. (Ps 90:2)
>
>We are told God is life so God must have come from a
>super God.

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>>>Are all righteous people robots?
>>
>>Only if God wanted to make it so.
>
>Why did you say God can't make everything good without
>making us robots?

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>>God can read our minds.
>
>That is a viscous lie from your masters to make you afraid
>to even think for yourself.

This is not a Jim Jones cult. We have no human main leader. Our leader
is Jesus. We don't have a gun arsenal saved up like some cults do. We
all don't live together in a camp. There are millions of us, but we
all have the same religious doctrines:


"cult
/k?lt/
Learn to pronounce
noun
noun: cult; plural noun: cults

a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a
particular figure or object.
"the cult of St. Olaf"
a relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or
practices regarded by others as strange or sinister."

The first definition could apply to ANY religion.
The second definition says a "small group of people".
We have several million baptized members, although our doctrines based
on the Bible, are not readily believed by other religions.

When Jesus came along, one could say he started a cult. (by
definition) So if you want to call us a cult, be my guest.



>
>>So there is no reason to come to us for council.
>
>You said God is an unthinking emotion.

What do you mean?

>
>>>>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I'll pretend I didn't hear that.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Ignorance Ignored.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Your morality is higher than that of God.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Perfection has nothing to do with imperfection.
>>>>>
>>>>>Please try to stay on topic.
>>>>
>>>>That is "on topic". Humans are imperfect.
>>>
>>>Why would a perfect God create imperfect humans?
>>
>>You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
>>meaning.
>
>What about my question?

It is based on God, which you don't believe. So my answer can't help
you when you disbelieve.

>
>>>>Why would a perfect high God
>>>>seek council from imperfect lowly beings?
>>>
>>>To discover what we want and need.
>>>
>>>>Do you follow council given by nursery school kids?
>>>
>>>If it was my job to care for nursery school baby goats I
>>>would listen to them.
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Mark 11:23
>>>>>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>>>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>>>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>>>>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>>>>>
>>>>>The writer was trying to impress us.
>>>>>
>>>>>You know nothing about the God you promote.
>>>>
>>>>I have given you many Bible truths.
>>>
>>>You said truths are what some people believe even though they
>>>may be false.
>>
>>That is always possible. It is also possible that truths presented to
>>you, are REALLY truths.
>
>But not true.

Show me one Bible verse that is not true.

>
>>>>To ignore them, is to dig your own grave.
>>>
>>>You gunna blow your doG whistle to summon your tame doG?
>>
>>???
>>
>>>You have no evidence for your claims.
>>
>>You are even stepping on the evidence. You are immersed in evidence.
>
>There is a place where there are so many fossils that people
>do walk on them.

So?

>
>If you are serious about becoming an atheist you should look
>on youtube.

If you are serious about becoming a true Christian, you should read
the Bible.

>
>>>You don't even know if there is a God.
>>
>>There is some super intelligent thing
>>out there that created all of these life forms.
>
>How many times must I tell you?
>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.

If evolution went nuts here on earth, with millions of life forms, why
can't it even produce a microbe on another planet or moon within our
solar system?

>
>>We call Him Jehovah God.
>
>We call the process evolution.

Rather, it should be called BRAINLESS evolution. What came first, the
human skeleton, or the skin and organs?

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 23, 2021, 5:40:55 AM9/23/21
to
Creation teaches that like can only come from like so we
must all be Gods.

>>>Obviously it is possible, since all the many life forms are here.
>>
>>I've never seen a dinosaur give birth to a bird.
>
>Nor has anyone, although evolutionists say dinosaurs turned into
>birds:

I did hear about the 1800 victims of over 1000 JW child
molesters the church is hiding.

>>>God is the only exception, since He always was. (Ps 90:2)

Change "always" to "never" to correct.

>>>>Are all righteous people robots?
>>>
>>>Only if God wanted to make it so.

Why did you say God can't make everything good without
making us robots?

>>That is a viscous lie from your masters to make you afraid
>>to even think for yourself.
>
>This is not a Jim Jones cult. We have no human main leader. Our leader
>is Jesus. We don't have a gun arsenal saved up like some cults do. We
>all don't live together in a camp. There are millions of us, but we
>all have the same religious doctrines:

I understand you are embarrassed about getting caught up in a cult.

>>You said God is an unthinking emotion.
>
>What do you mean?

You said God IS love.

Your morality is higher than that of God.

>>>>>>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Mark 11:23
>>>>>>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>>>>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>>>>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>>>>>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The writer was trying to impress us.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You know nothing about the God you promote.
>>>>>
>>>>>I have given you many Bible truths.
>>>>
>>>>You said truths are what some people believe even though they
>>>>may be false.
>>>
>>>That is always possible. It is also possible that truths presented to
>>>you, are REALLY truths.
>>
>>But not true.
>
>Show me one Bible verse that is not true.

Genesis 1:1
In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

>>>>You have no evidence for your claims.
>>>
>>>You are even stepping on the evidence. You are immersed in evidence.
>>
>>There is a place where there are so many fossils that people
>>do walk on them.
>
>So?

That's evidence.

>>If you are serious about becoming an atheist you should look
>>on youtube.
>
>If you are serious about becoming a true Christian, you should read
>the Bible.

I agree.

>>>>You don't even know if there is a God.
>>>
>>>There is some super intelligent thing
>>>out there that created all of these life forms.
>>
>>How many times must I tell you?
>>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>
>If evolution went nuts here on earth, with millions of life forms, why
>can't it even produce a microbe on another planet or moon within our
>solar system?

Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.

>>>We call Him Jehovah God.
>>
>>We call the process evolution.
>
>Rather, it should be called BRAINLESS evolution.

Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.

>What came first, the
>human skeleton, or the skin and organs?

I don't know, and you don't know.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 23, 2021, 1:30:38 PM9/23/21
to
On Thu, 23 Sep 2021 19:40:50 +1000, Lucifer
You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>>>>Obviously it is possible, since all the many life forms are here.
>>>
>>>I've never seen a dinosaur give birth to a bird.
>>
>>Nor has anyone, although evolutionists say dinosaurs turned into
>>birds:
>
>I did hear about the 1800 victims of over 1000 JW child
>molesters the church is hiding.

Hearsay isn't recognized as evidence in a court of law. If that is
true, let me see your source.

>
>>>>God is the only exception, since He always was. (Ps 90:2)
>
>Change "always" to "never" to correct.

If you must change the word, use "eternally".
>
>>>>>Are all righteous people robots?
>>>>
>>>>Only if God wanted to make it so.
>
>Why did you say God can't make everything good without
>making us robots?

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>>>That is a viscous lie from your masters to make you afraid
>>>to even think for yourself.
>>
>>This is not a Jim Jones cult. We have no human main leader. Our leader
>>is Jesus. We don't have a gun arsenal saved up like some cults do. We
>>all don't live together in a camp. There are millions of us, but we
>>all have the same religious doctrines:
>
>I understand you are embarrassed about getting caught up in a cult.

I am never happy about a lie.

>
>>>You said God is an unthinking emotion.
>>
>>What do you mean?
>
>You said God IS love.

Yes He is. (1 John 4:8)

>
>Your morality is higher than that of God.

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>>>>>>>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Mark 11:23
>>>>>>>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>>>>>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>>>>>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>>>>>>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The writer was trying to impress us.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You know nothing about the God you promote.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I have given you many Bible truths.
>>>>>
>>>>>You said truths are what some people believe even though they
>>>>>may be false.
>>>>
>>>>That is always possible. It is also possible that truths presented to
>>>>you, are REALLY truths.
>>>
>>>But not true.
>>
>>Show me one Bible verse that is not true.
>
>Genesis 1:1
>In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

You didn't prove it was a lie. All you did was quote it.

>
>>>>>You have no evidence for your claims.
>>>>
>>>>You are even stepping on the evidence. You are immersed in evidence.
>>>
>>>There is a place where there are so many fossils that people
>>>do walk on them.
>>
>>So?
>
>That's evidence.

That is evidence that they once existed. Not evidence of who or what
created them.

>
>>>If you are serious about becoming an atheist you should look
>>>on youtube.
>>
>>If you are serious about becoming a true Christian, you should read
>>the Bible.
>
>I agree.
>
>>>>>You don't even know if there is a God.
>>>>
>>>>There is some super intelligent thing
>>>>out there that created all of these life forms.
>>>
>>>How many times must I tell you?
>>>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>>
>>If evolution went nuts here on earth, with millions of life forms, why
>>can't it even produce a microbe on another planet or moon within our
>>solar system?
>
>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.

Same question.
>
>>>>We call Him Jehovah God.
>>>
>>>We call the process evolution.
>>
>>Rather, it should be called BRAINLESS evolution.
>
>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>
>>What came first, the
>>human skeleton, or the skin and organs?
>
>I don't know, and you don't know.
>

That is why I am asking.

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 23, 2021, 4:15:32 PM9/23/21
to
On Thu, 23 Sep 2021 13:30:21 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Thu, 23 Sep 2021 19:40:50 +1000, Lucifer
><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 22 Sep 2021 20:16:21 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, 20 Sep 2021 22:33:43 +1000, Lucifer
>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>>Creation teaches that like can only come from like so we
>>must all be Gods.
>
>You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
>meaning.

Genesis 3:5
“For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened,
and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

>>>>>Obviously it is possible, since all the many life forms are here.
>>>>
>>>>I've never seen a dinosaur give birth to a bird.
>>>
>>>Nor has anyone, although evolutionists say dinosaurs turned into
>>>birds:
>>
>>I did hear about the 1800 victims of over 1000 JW child
>>molesters the church is hiding.
>
>Hearsay isn't recognized as evidence in a court of law. If that is
>true, let me see your source.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=jw+pedo+protests

PROTEST: Jehovahs Witness Pedophile SCANDAL
Should Ex Jehovah’s Witnesses do Protests?
Protest JW London Convention
London JW Protest
Jehovah's Witness World Headquarters Protest - 05 Nov 2017
JW Campus Protest
W5: Sex abuse accusations within the Jehovah's Witnesses
A conversation with Mikaysha Shaley (ex-JW, sex abuse and domestic
violence victim)

>>>>>God is the only exception, since He always was. (Ps 90:2)
>>
>>Change "always" to "never" to correct.
>
>If you must change the word, use "eternally".

Then it would still be incorrect.

>>>>>>Are all righteous people robots?
>>>>>
>>>>>Only if God wanted to make it so.

Why did you say God can't make everything good without
making us robots?

>>>>That is a viscous lie from your masters to make you afraid
>>>>to even think for yourself.
>>>
>>>This is not a Jim Jones cult. We have no human main leader. Our leader
>>>is Jesus. We don't have a gun arsenal saved up like some cults do. We
>>>all don't live together in a camp. There are millions of us, but we
>>>all have the same religious doctrines:
>>
>>I understand you are embarrassed about getting caught up in a cult.
>
>I am never happy about a lie.

It must be a relief for you to be working on breaking free.

>>>>You said God is an unthinking emotion.
>>>
>>>What do you mean?
>>
>>You said God IS love.
>
>Yes He is. (1 John 4:8)

Love is an unthinking emotion.

Your morality is higher than that of God.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>>>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Mark 11:23
>>>>>>>>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>>>>>>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>>>>>>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>>>>>>>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>The writer was trying to impress us.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>You know nothing about the God you promote.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I have given you many Bible truths.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You said truths are what some people believe even though they
>>>>>>may be false.
>>>>>
>>>>>That is always possible. It is also possible that truths presented to
>>>>>you, are REALLY truths.
>>>>
>>>>But not true.
>>>
>>>Show me one Bible verse that is not true.
>>
>>Genesis 1:1
>>In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
>
>You didn't prove it was a lie. All you did was quote it.

I did what you asked.

>>>>>>You have no evidence for your claims.
>>>>>
>>>>>You are even stepping on the evidence. You are immersed in evidence.
>>>>
>>>>There is a place where there are so many fossils that people
>>>>do walk on them.
>>>
>>>So?
>>
>>That's evidence.
>
>That is evidence that they once existed. Not evidence of who or what
>created them.

You need to understand the context.

>>>>If you are serious about becoming an atheist you should look
>>>>on youtube.
>>>
>>>If you are serious about becoming a true Christian, you should read
>>>the Bible.
>>
>>I agree.
>>
>>>>>>You don't even know if there is a God.
>>>>>
>>>>>There is some super intelligent thing
>>>>>out there that created all of these life forms.
>>>>
>>>>How many times must I tell you?
>>>>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>>>
>>>If evolution went nuts here on earth, with millions of life forms, why
>>>can't it even produce a microbe on another planet or moon within our
>>>solar system?
>>
>>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>
>Same question.
>>
>>>>>We call Him Jehovah God.
>>>>
>>>>We call the process evolution.
>>>
>>>Rather, it should be called BRAINLESS evolution.
>>
>>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>>
>>>What came first, the
>>>human skeleton, or the skin and organs?
>>
>>I don't know, and you don't know.
>>
>That is why I am asking.

Like you I don't know. All we can do is observe that life exists.
We have a huge amount of evidence which indicates that life
evolved over millions of years to become what we see today.
No serious alternatives have been offered.

>James

servant

unread,
Sep 23, 2021, 4:26:44 PM9/23/21
to

My friend james is being disingenuous when he tries, in vain, to deflect
info about jw vatican hiding child sex abusers he knows is fully accurate.

He asks for evidence about an example of 1000 cases being hidden. I
personallly have given him multiple times such evidence.

The link below provides those 1000 cases example. It is from asmaller
population country then the u.s. where the numbers are far higher.

Butt why does my friend james think being disingenuous is just fine? Read
this from the link below about their deceptive behavior with fully legal
judicial requests for their hidden info: "

"They have no compunction about lying to us, who live in what they call
`Caesar's World,' [as opposed to God's]. They believe in this doctrine that
says it's OK to lie to us to the worldly people, because they're a
protected faith." Some Witnesses call the doctrine which permits deceiving
secular outsiders "theocratic warfare."

'The Secret Database of Jehovah's Witness Child Abusers'

https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-secret-database-of-jehovahs-witness-child-abusers

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 23, 2021, 9:19:30 PM9/23/21
to
Need to register.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 26, 2021, 9:03:12 AM9/26/21
to
On 23 Sep 2021 20:26:42 GMT, servant wrote:

>
>My friend james is being disingenuous when he tries, in vain, to deflect
>info about jw vatican hiding child sex abusers he knows is fully accurate.

My friend servant makes untrue statements about me. He has no proof
and only claims that. Anyone can claim anything but without evidence,
those claims are only full of air.

I make it a point to always tell the truth. I base my reputation on
that. I am not disingenuous in my statements. I speak to what I
believe to be is the real truth. I may be wrong at times, but a lie is
when the liar knows its a lie, but still tells it anyway. Look it up.

I have heard of a Witness database of child abusers from anti-Witness
people. I would hope they would keep track of them so as to protect
the children. As to how many names are on such a list, I have never
seen proof. Whatever the amount, I agree with keeping a list.

>
>He asks for evidence about an example of 1000 cases being hidden. I
>personallly have given him multiple times such evidence.

I have no recollection of evidence of him showing me 1000 cases or
other large amounts. If he did, my memory don't recall it.
>
>The link below provides those 1000 cases example. It is from asmaller
>population country then the u.s. where the numbers are far higher.
>
>Butt why does my friend james think being disingenuous is just fine?

Again, I don't.

>Read
>this from the link below about their deceptive behavior with fully legal
>judicial requests for their hidden info: "

Even in the Bible, it shows that at times it is best to not obey the
government authorities. First, overall we should obey the authorities:

(Romans 13:1) Let every person be in subjection to the superior
authorities, for there is no authority except by God; the existing
authorities stand placed in their relative positions by God.

Now let's say the government set up a firing squad, and they demanded
we tell them the names of the people in our congregation. In this
case, must we obey Rom 13:1? See for yourself:

(Acts 5:29) In answer Peter and the other apostles said: “We must obey
God as ruler rather than men.

Peter and others were told not to preach about Jesus. Yet the Bible at
Mt 28:19,20 says to preach. Thus the final authority is God.


>
>"They have no compunction about lying to us, who live in what they call
>`Caesar's World,' [as opposed to God's].

Actually it is Satan's world:

(2 Corinthians 4:4) among whom the god of this system of things has
blinded the minds of the unbelievers, so that the illumination of the
glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might
not shine through.

>They believe in this doctrine that
>says it's OK to lie to us to the worldly people, because they're a
>protected faith."

Refusing to give out information, and lying, are two different things.
If that government firing squad mentioned above, asked me for the name
of a brother, I would not lie to them, but would keep a tight lip on
giving his name.


>Some Witnesses call the doctrine which permits deceiving
>secular outsiders "theocratic warfare."

Yes, Scriptures like that at Acts 5:29 could be called theocratic
warfare.

>
>'The Secret Database of Jehovah's Witness Child Abusers'
>
>https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-secret-database-of-jehovahs-witness-child-abusers

I have read all the info, but it is lacking in proof. It makes a lot
of claims, but little proof. I am not saying it is all wrong, for I
agree with such a list in order to not have them be alone with
children.

This subject is one of strong feelings. Thus research should be done
on any person claimed to be involved in this. They have their rights
also. If you were accused of sexual child abuse, you would want to see
any evidence, would you not?

At any rate, God will soon eliminate the problems of sexual abuse of
children, and all other problems:

(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
former things have passed away.”

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 26, 2021, 9:07:40 AM9/26/21
to
Who? You?

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 26, 2021, 11:31:45 AM9/26/21
to
On Fri, 24 Sep 2021 06:15:26 +1000, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 23 Sep 2021 13:30:21 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 23 Sep 2021 19:40:50 +1000, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wed, 22 Sep 2021 20:16:21 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Mon, 20 Sep 2021 22:33:43 +1000, Lucifer
>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>>Creation teaches that like can only come from like so we
>>>must all be Gods.
>>
>>You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
>>meaning.
>
>Genesis 3:5
>“For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened,
>and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

That statement is from a lying bad angel. You wonder how much of it
you can believe?

>
>>>>>>Obviously it is possible, since all the many life forms are here.
>>>>>
>>>>>I've never seen a dinosaur give birth to a bird.
>>>>
>>>>Nor has anyone, although evolutionists say dinosaurs turned into
>>>>birds:
>>>
>>>I did hear about the 1800 victims of over 1000 JW child
>>>molesters the church is hiding.
>>
>>Hearsay isn't recognized as evidence in a court of law. If that is
>>true, let me see your source.
>
>https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=jw+pedo+protests

Thank you. Your "source" is nothing but a web page that needs its
source. Has anyone ever seen that alleged database of 1800 names?

At any rate, I am glad that they keep track of those on a list. This
helps to protect the children by not permitting them to be alone with
children.

I
>
>PROTEST: Jehovahs Witness Pedophile SCANDAL
>Should Ex Jehovah’s Witnesses do Protests?
>Protest JW London Convention
>London JW Protest
>Jehovah's Witness World Headquarters Protest - 05 Nov 2017
>JW Campus Protest
>W5: Sex abuse accusations within the Jehovah's Witnesses
>A conversation with Mikaysha Shaley (ex-JW, sex abuse and domestic
>violence victim)

Yes, pedophilia should be discussed and expose those doing it, to
protect the children.

>
>>>>>>God is the only exception, since He always was. (Ps 90:2)
>>>
>>>Change "always" to "never" to correct.
>>
>>If you must change the word, use "eternally".
>
>Then it would still be incorrect.
>

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.


>>>>>>>Are all righteous people robots?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Only if God wanted to make it so.
>
>Why did you say God can't make everything good without
>making us robots?

Is that what I said? God will make everything good soon, but not make
them robots. They will use their free will to always be good. (Rev
21:3,4)

>
>>>>>That is a viscous lie from your masters to make you afraid
>>>>>to even think for yourself.
>>>>
>>>>This is not a Jim Jones cult. We have no human main leader. Our leader
>>>>is Jesus. We don't have a gun arsenal saved up like some cults do. We
>>>>all don't live together in a camp. There are millions of us, but we
>>>>all have the same religious doctrines:
>>>
>>>I understand you are embarrassed about getting caught up in a cult.
>>
>>I am never happy about a lie.
>
>It must be a relief for you to be working on breaking free.

I have no need to do that. But I must always be cautious in what I
say.

>
>>>>>You said God is an unthinking emotion.
>>>>
>>>>What do you mean?
>>>
>>>You said God IS love.
>>
>>Yes He is. (1 John 4:8)
>
>Love is an unthinking emotion.

One has to know why one loves something. I know there is a phrase
"Love at first sight" which seems to back up your comment. But the
mind also has something to do with it.

>
>Your morality is higher than that of God.

You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.

>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>If God's morality was a mountain, my
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>morality would be a tiny grain of sand.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>You would be able to throw God's morality into the sea.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>The sea should have it so good.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Mark 11:23
>>>>>>>>>>>“Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, ‘Go, throw
>>>>>>>>>>>yourself into the sea,’ and does not doubt in their heart but believes
>>>>>>>>>>>that what they say will happen, it will be done for them.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>What does that Scripture mean to you? For a while, Jesus only talked
>>>>>>>>>>in parables. Can you figure it out?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The writer was trying to impress us.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>You know nothing about the God you promote.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I have given you many Bible truths.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You said truths are what some people believe even though they
>>>>>>>may be false.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>That is always possible. It is also possible that truths presented to
>>>>>>you, are REALLY truths.
>>>>>
>>>>>But not true.
>>>>
>>>>Show me one Bible verse that is not true.
>>>
>>>Genesis 1:1
>>>In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
>>
>>You didn't prove it was a lie. All you did was quote it.
>
>I did what you asked.

Yes you did, thank you.

Now follow through if you can, and prove that it is a lie.

>
>>>>>>>You have no evidence for your claims.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You are even stepping on the evidence. You are immersed in evidence.
>>>>>
>>>>>There is a place where there are so many fossils that people
>>>>>do walk on them.
>>>>
>>>>So?
>>>
>>>That's evidence.
>>
>>That is evidence that they once existed. Not evidence of who or what
>>created them.
>
>You need to understand the context.

Always.

>
>>>>>If you are serious about becoming an atheist you should look
>>>>>on youtube.
>>>>
>>>>If you are serious about becoming a true Christian, you should read
>>>>the Bible.
>>>
>>>I agree.
>>>
>>>>>>>You don't even know if there is a God.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>There is some super intelligent thing
>>>>>>out there that created all of these life forms.
>>>>>
>>>>>How many times must I tell you?
>>>>>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>>>>
>>>>If evolution went nuts here on earth, with millions of life forms, why
>>>>can't it even produce a microbe on another planet or moon within our
>>>>solar system?
>>>
>>>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>>
>>Same question.

Why don't we see at least microbes on other planets or moons? It
exploded here on earth, why not other places?

>>>
>>>>>>We call Him Jehovah God.
>>>>>
>>>>>We call the process evolution.
>>>>
>>>>Rather, it should be called BRAINLESS evolution.
>>>
>>>Evolution is the name we give to a natural process.
>>>
>>>>What came first, the
>>>>human skeleton, or the skin and organs?
>>>
>>>I don't know, and you don't know.
>>>
>>That is why I am asking.
>
>Like you I don't know. All we can do is observe that life exists.
>We have a huge amount of evidence which indicates that life
>evolved over millions of years to become what we see today.
>No serious alternatives have been offered.

Why does this alleged brainless evolution always in the long run, seem
to evolve positively? For example, evolution teaches that early humans
were more like morons, with grunts and groans. But today we have
geniuses. In the long run, why did mindless evolution seem to always
climb the positive ladder?

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 26, 2021, 3:38:45 PM9/26/21
to
Says become a member to read this story.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 28, 2021, 8:35:51 AM9/28/21
to
On Mon, 30 Aug 2021 14:44:17 +1000, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 10:40:40 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 07:12:08 +1000, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 10:45:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>
>>>>What came first. The skeleton structure of a life form, or its muscle
>>>>and meat? How does evolution explain that?
>>>
>>>What is the exact method by which God created?
>>
>>The Bible doesn't say.
>
>So it could have been evolution. Thanks.

No way. Evolution is mindless, and thus not capable of creating things
like the complexities of the human brain. Evolution has the IQ of
exactly 0. Yet the highest IQ's today still can't figure the human
brain mechanisms out completely. Is that not a logical picture here?

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 28, 2021, 7:16:09 PM9/28/21
to
If an all everything God did not need to come from
somewhere and did not need to be created then neither does life.

You can't have it both ways.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 29, 2021, 8:46:44 AM9/29/21
to
On Wed, 29 Sep 2021 09:16:05 +1000, Lucifer
Why not? Actually, that is the truth today. God never had a beginning,
but He created many life forms.

>
>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Sep 29, 2021, 3:58:14 PM9/29/21
to
If God didn't need a beginning then neither did lessor beings.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Sep 30, 2021, 8:09:45 AM9/30/21
to
On Thu, 30 Sep 2021 05:58:12 +1000, Lucifer
You said you don't believe in God. Therefore your statement has no
meaning.


zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 6, 2021, 9:50:54 AM10/6/21
to
On Thu, 30 Sep 2021 05:58:12 +1000, Lucifer
The Bible doesn't say why God created the angels and humans. The
angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
invisible to us.

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 7, 2021, 5:37:39 AM10/7/21
to
The bible does suggest God created beings that can suffer
because he is a sadist. What else could it be? God was not
compelled to set things up so we suffer.

>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>invisible to us.

You believe that?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 10, 2021, 6:34:44 AM10/10/21
to
On Thu, 07 Oct 2021 20:37:33 +1100, Lucifer
The Bible suggests no such thing. Rather it says God is love:

(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
God is love.

>What else could it be? God was not
>compelled to set things up so we suffer.

An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
happiness for His creation.

Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.

>
>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>invisible to us.
>
>You believe that?

That's right out of the Bible:

(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
began taking as wives all whom they chose.

(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
incorruption.

James
Understand the Bible
www.jw.org

Got any Bible questions? Fire away.

>
>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 10, 2021, 3:08:10 PM10/10/21
to
The bible says God is love but it talks about a God that is
a sadist.

>(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
>God is love.
>
>>What else could it be? God was not
>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>
>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>happiness for His creation.
>
>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.

God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.

>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>invisible to us.
>>
>>You believe that?
>
>That's right out of the Bible:
>
>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>
>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>incorruption.

You believe that?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 11, 2021, 11:18:23 AM10/11/21
to
On Mon, 11 Oct 2021 06:08:04 +1100, Lucifer
Define what you mean.

>
>>(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
>>God is love.
>>
>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>
>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>happiness for His creation.
>>
>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>
>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.

And God does not want us to suffer. He feels bad that so many people
listen to Satan, and do bad things.

>
>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>invisible to us.
>>>
>>>You believe that?
>>
>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>
>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>
>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>incorruption.
>
>You believe that?
>

101%



James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

Have any Bible questions?

>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 11, 2021, 7:24:11 PM10/11/21
to
It appears from the bible God wants us to suffer.

>>>(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
>>>God is love.
>>>
>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>
>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>
>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>
>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>
>And God does not want us to suffer.

Is God an automaton?

>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.

God must be so embarrassed.

>>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>>invisible to us.
>>>>
>>>>You believe that?
>>>
>>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>>
>>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>>
>>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>>incorruption.
>>
>>You believe that?
>>
>
>101%

Why?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 12, 2021, 12:07:54 PM10/12/21
to
On Tue, 12 Oct 2021 10:24:05 +1100, Lucifer
You are misinterpreting the Bible. Does this sound like God wants us
to suffer?

(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
former things have passed away.”

If you looked at no other Scriptures, what would you call God here?


>
>>>>(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
>>>>God is love.
>>>>
>>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>
>>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>>
>>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>>
>>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>
>>And God does not want us to suffer.
>
>Is God an automaton?

God is an eternally powerful super SPIRIT being.

(John 4:24) God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship
with spirit and truth.”

>
>>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.
>
>God must be so embarrassed.

Embarrassment has to do with something negative. God makes no errors,
thus never gets embarrassed.

>
>>>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>>>invisible to us.
>>>>>
>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>
>>>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>>>
>>>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>>>
>>>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>>>incorruption.
>>>
>>>You believe that?
>>>
>>
>>101%
>
>Why?

Because:

(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for
teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining
in righteousness,



James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

If you have any Bible questions, just ask.

>
>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 12, 2021, 5:30:00 PM10/12/21
to
Perhaps. I'd like you to explain why God repeatedly doing things
that are bad or pointless is a good thing.

>Does this sound like God wants us to suffer?
>
>(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
>say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
>them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
>4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
>no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
>former things have passed away.”

Yes it does. If God did not want us to suffer he would not have
created conditions that need his corrections, and he would not
tease us with promises.

>If you looked at no other Scriptures, what would you call God here?

Definitely a sadist.

>>>>>(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
>>>>>God is love.
>>>>>
>>>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>
>>>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>>>
>>>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>>>
>>>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>
>>>And God does not want us to suffer.
>>
>>Is God an automaton?
>
>God is an eternally powerful super SPIRIT being.

Are all spirits automatons?

>(John 4:24) God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship
>with spirit and truth.”

What does that mean?

>>>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.
>>
>>God must be so embarrassed.
>
>Embarrassment has to do with something negative. God makes no errors,
>thus never gets embarrassed.

It would be better for God's reputation for you to say God makes
stupid mistakes and has no idea how to correct them.

>>>>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>>>>invisible to us.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>
>>>>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>>>>
>>>>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>>>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>>>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>>>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>>>>
>>>>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>>>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>>>>incorruption.
>>>>
>>>>You believe that?
>>>>
>>>
>>>101%
>>
>>Why?
>
>Because:
>
>(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for
>teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining
>in righteousness,

You believe that?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 14, 2021, 5:21:11 PM10/14/21
to
On Wed, 13 Oct 2021 08:29:54 +1100, Lucifer
List "bad" and "pointless".

>
>>Does this sound like God wants us to suffer?
>>
>>(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
>>say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
>>them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
>>4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
>>no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
>>former things have passed away.”
>
>Yes it does. If God did not want us to suffer he would not have
>created conditions that need his corrections, and he would not
>tease us with promises.

ALL of God's promises come true. All of them.

>
>>If you looked at no other Scriptures, what would you call God here?
>
>Definitely a sadist.

Now I know you are lying. Rev 21:3,4 is all positive things. You have
not once mentioned God as having some positive virtues.

Even Hitler had some positive attributes. For example, he treated his
dog kindly. Although his doctor was killing him with drugs, he treated
him kindly.

>
>>>>>>(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
>>>>>>God is love.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>>>>
>>>>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>
>>>>And God does not want us to suffer.
>>>
>>>Is God an automaton?
>>
>>God is an eternally powerful super SPIRIT being.
>
>Are all spirits automatons?

Spirit beings were not created by flesh and blood.

>
>>(John 4:24) God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship
>>with spirit and truth.”

>What does that mean?

The spirit in this case means one's life force. So that could mean to
worship God with all of our might. And we should worship Him with only
truths, no lies or false doctrines.


>
>>>>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.
>>>
>>>God must be so embarrassed.
>>
>>Embarrassment has to do with something negative. God makes no errors,
>>thus never gets embarrassed.
>
>It would be better for God's reputation for you to say God makes
>stupid mistakes and has no idea how to correct them.

Why don't you just say that God is an idiot. That is what you are
describing. But anyone with a half of brain can see that God is a
zillion times that.

>
>>>>>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>>>>>invisible to us.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>>>>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>>>>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>>>>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>>>>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>>>>>incorruption.
>>>>>
>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>101%
>>>
>>>Why?
>>
>>Because:
>>
>>(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for
>>teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining
>>in righteousness,
>
>You believe that?

Totally!!

James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.


>
>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 14, 2021, 9:47:33 PM10/14/21
to
I found this;
Top 10 Horrifying Moments in the Bible
https://listverse.com/2012/06/23/top-10-horrifying-moments-in-the-bible/

Now, please explain why God repeatedly doing things
that are bad or pointless is a good thing.

You told me things that God has done that are bad, such as
your panic attacks, and you even said God needs to change
everything.

>>>Does this sound like God wants us to suffer?
>>>
>>>(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
>>>say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
>>>them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
>>>4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
>>>no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
>>>former things have passed away.”
>>
>>Yes it does. If God did not want us to suffer he would not have
>>created conditions that need his corrections, and he would not
>>tease us with promises.
>
>ALL of God's promises come true. All of them.

Even Matthew 16:28 ?

>>>If you looked at no other Scriptures, what would you call God here?
>>
>>Definitely a sadist.
>
>Now I know you are lying. Rev 21:3,4 is all positive things.

You think tears and death and mourning and outcry and pain
are good things?
Even God knows he is doing a terrible wrong.

>You have
>not once mentioned God as having some positive virtues.

You haven't told me any good things about God.

>Even Hitler had some positive attributes. For example, he treated his
>dog kindly. Although his doctor was killing him with drugs, he treated
>him kindly.

And the nazis had "God With Us" on their belt buckles.

>>>>>>>(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
>>>>>>>God is love.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>>>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>
>>>>>And God does not want us to suffer.
>>>>
>>>>Is God an automaton?
>>>
>>>God is an eternally powerful super SPIRIT being.
>>
>>Are all spirits automatons?
>
>Spirit beings were not created by flesh and blood.

Are all spirits automatons?

>>>(John 4:24) God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship
>>>with spirit and truth.”
>
>>What does that mean?
>
>The spirit in this case means one's life force. So that could mean to
>worship God with all of our might.

Worship is stupid.

>And we should worship Him with only truths, no lies or false doctrines.

That won't work.

>>>>>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.
>>>>
>>>>God must be so embarrassed.
>>>
>>>Embarrassment has to do with something negative. God makes no errors,
>>>thus never gets embarrassed.
>>
>>It would be better for God's reputation for you to say God makes
>>stupid mistakes and has no idea how to correct them.
>
>Why don't you just say that God is an idiot. That is what you are
>describing.

That's the way the bible describes God.

>But anyone with a half of brain can see that God is a zillion times that.

God is like a zillion idiots?

>>>>>>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>>>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>>>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>>>>>>invisible to us.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>>>>>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>>>>>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>>>>>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>>>>>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>>>>>>incorruption.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>101%
>>>>
>>>>Why?
>>>
>>>Because:
>>>
>>>(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for
>>>teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining
>>>in righteousness,
>>
>>You believe that?
>
>Totally!!

Why?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 15, 2021, 8:01:29 AM10/15/21
to
On Fri, 15 Oct 2021 12:47:27 +1100, Lucifer
1.The Torment of Job
Job, chapters 1, 2, and 38-42.
--Job's sufferings were a test for Job and answer accusations from
Satan. God has a right to test His creations and His accusers.

2. The Hand Writing on the Wall
Daniel 5
-- It was a prophecy of what would happen to king Belshazzar. This
wicked king's days were numbered. God had the right to predict it.

3. The Massacre of the Innocents
Matthew 2:16-18.
--This was done by Herod, not God. A prophecy in Jeremiah predicted
it. God has the right to record prophecies.

4. The Obliteration of Sodom and Gomorrah
Genesis 19:1-29.
--Because of the extreme wickedness of those cities, God judged them
adversely. This is a warning for us today.

5. The Locusts of the Abyss
Revelation 9:7-11
--Something horrible is going to take place, brought on by man’s
contemptible sin, resulting in God’s final fury against it.

6. The Ten Plagues of Egypt
Exodus 7:14-12:29.
--God “hardened Pharaoh’s heart”. Pharaoh already had a hardened
heart. God just amplified what he already had.

7. The Flood of Noah
Genesis 6:9-8:22
--The earth was so corrupt back then, that everything they did was bad
all the time. And with ONLY Noah and his family righteous, God
adversely judged the rest of the inhabitants of that time.

8. God’s Judgment against Jerusalem
Ezekiel 22:17-22
--"God is, once again, infuriated with the impenitent sinners in
Jerusalem. They are supposed to be his chosen people, but they
repeatedly defy him, disobey his laws, and ignore the many instances
of his justice against such impenitence"

9. The Passion of Christ
Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John
--Up to then, mankind was doomed for eternal death. God sent His only
firstborn Son, to be a ransom for mankind. Now mankind has the
opportunity to receive eternal life.

10. The Lake of Fire
Revelation 19:20, 20:10, 14, 15.
--The writer of this (not the Bible writer) has got it so messed up, I
don't know where to begin to straighten it out. Let's just say, the
Lake of fire is not literal and "hell" is the common grave of all
unconscious dead mankind.


>
>Now, please explain why God repeatedly doing things
>that are bad or pointless is a good thing.

He doesn't, as shown above.

>
>You told me things that God has done that are bad, such as
>your panic attacks, and you even said God needs to change
>everything.

I have never said that God did things that are bad. Only to the
wrongdoer do things look bad. Because of what humans have done, God
will change everything for the better.

>
>>>>Does this sound like God wants us to suffer?
>>>>
>>>>(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
>>>>say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
>>>>them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
>>>>4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
>>>>no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
>>>>former things have passed away.”
>>>
>>>Yes it does. If God did not want us to suffer he would not have
>>>created conditions that need his corrections, and he would not
>>>tease us with promises.
>>
>>ALL of God's promises come true. All of them.
>
>Even Matthew 16:28 ?

Yes, even Mt 16:28.

(Matthew 16:28) Truly I say to you that there are some of those
standing here who will not taste death at all until first they see the
Son of man coming in his Kingdom.”

This occurred at the transfiguration. Jesus' face shown like the sun.
It will be that way when Jesus takes over his literal kingdom.
>
>>>>If you looked at no other Scriptures, what would you call God here?
>>>
>>>Definitely a sadist.
>>
>>Now I know you are lying. Rev 21:3,4 is all positive things.
>
>You think tears and death and mourning and outcry and pain
>are good things?
>Even God knows he is doing a terrible wrong.

You are misinterpreting it. It says :

"And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no
more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former
things have passed away.”

So God is going to REMOVE those things, not give them to them.


>
>>You have
>>not once mentioned God as having some positive virtues.
>
>You haven't told me any good things about God.

"And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no
more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former
things have passed away."

>
>>Even Hitler had some positive attributes. For example, he treated his
>>dog kindly. Although his doctor was killing him with drugs, he treated
>>him kindly.
>
>And the nazis had "God With Us" on their belt buckles.

Yes, they mispelled "God". It should read "god with us". (see 2 Cor
4:4)

>
>>>>>>>>(1 John 4:8) Whoever does not love has not come to know God, because
>>>>>>>>God is love.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>>>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>>>>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>And God does not want us to suffer.
>>>>>
>>>>>Is God an automaton?
>>>>
>>>>God is an eternally powerful super SPIRIT being.
>>>
>>>Are all spirits automatons?
>>
>>Spirit beings were not created by flesh and blood.
>
>Are all spirits automatons?

Not even near so. Spirits do not look anything like humans. and are on
a higher level of intelligence.
>
>>>>(John 4:24) God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship
>>>>with spirit and truth.”
>>
>>>What does that mean?
>>
>>The spirit in this case means one's life force. So that could mean to
>>worship God with all of our might.
>
>Worship is stupid.

So is downgrading God. Its like downgrading one's boss. It won't go
well for you.

>
>>And we should worship Him with only truths, no lies or false doctrines.
>
>That won't work.

Why?

>
>>>>>>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.
>>>>>
>>>>>God must be so embarrassed.
>>>>
>>>>Embarrassment has to do with something negative. God makes no errors,
>>>>thus never gets embarrassed.
>>>
>>>It would be better for God's reputation for you to say God makes
>>>stupid mistakes and has no idea how to correct them.
>>
>>Why don't you just say that God is an idiot. That is what you are
>>describing.
>
>That's the way the bible describes God.
>
>>But anyone with a half of brain can see that God is a zillion times that.
>
>God is like a zillion idiots?
>

No, He is like the IQ of an idiot multiplied a zillion times.

>>>>>>>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>>>>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>>>>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>>>>>>>invisible to us.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>>>>>>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>>>>>>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>>>>>>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>>>>>>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>>>>>>>incorruption.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>101%
>>>>>
>>>>>Why?
>>>>

Flesh and blood cannot inherit God's kingdom. That means that physical
bodies cannot get into Heaven. They have to have spirit bodies. (like
the angels have)

>>>>Because:
>>>>
>>>>(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for
>>>>teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining
>>>>in righteousness,
>>>
>>>You believe that?
>>
>>Totally!!
>
>Why?

Because I have researched the Bible and found it to be true. (of
course the miracles cannot be proven, so I accept them on faith)

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 15, 2021, 6:34:40 PM10/15/21
to
Where above?

>>You told me things that God has done that are bad, such as
>>your panic attacks, and you even said God needs to change
>>everything.
>
>I have never said that God did things that are bad. Only to the
>wrongdoer do things look bad.

You only say that because you are a sociopath.

>Because of what humans have done, God
>will change everything for the better.

That shows you know God is doing a terrible wrong now.

>>>>>Does this sound like God wants us to suffer?
>>>>>
>>>>>(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
>>>>>say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
>>>>>them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
>>>>>4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
>>>>>no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
>>>>>former things have passed away.”
>>>>
>>>>Yes it does. If God did not want us to suffer he would not have
>>>>created conditions that need his corrections, and he would not
>>>>tease us with promises.
>>>
>>>ALL of God's promises come true. All of them.
>>
>>Even Matthew 16:28 ?
>
>Yes, even Mt 16:28.
>
>(Matthew 16:28) Truly I say to you that there are some of those
>standing here who will not taste death at all until first they see the
>Son of man coming in his Kingdom.”
>
>This occurred at the transfiguration. Jesus' face shown like the sun.
>It will be that way when Jesus takes over his literal kingdom.

Matthew 16:28 can't happen as there are none alive who
were standing there. So that's one false promise of many.

Malachi 3:6 says God will never change for the better so
God's promises to correct His errors will never happen.

>>>>>If you looked at no other Scriptures, what would you call God here?
>>>>
>>>>Definitely a sadist.
>>>
>>>Now I know you are lying. Rev 21:3,4 is all positive things.
>>
>>You think tears and death and mourning and outcry and pain
>>are good things?
>>Even God knows he is doing a terrible wrong.
>
>You are misinterpreting it. It says :
>
>"And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no
>more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former
>things have passed away.”
>
>So God is going to REMOVE those things, not give them to them.

Malachi 3:6 says you are wrong.

>>>You have
>>>not once mentioned God as having some positive virtues.
>>
>>You haven't told me any good things about God.
>
>"And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no
>more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former
>things have passed away."

Why do you never say good things about God?

>>>Even Hitler had some positive attributes. For example, he treated his
>>>dog kindly. Although his doctor was killing him with drugs, he treated
>>>him kindly.
>>
>>And the nazis had "God With Us" on their belt buckles.
>
>Yes, they mispelled "God". It should read "god with us". (see 2 Cor
>4:4)

In this case God is considered a name hence it is capitalised.

>>>>>>>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>>>>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>>>>>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>And God does not want us to suffer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Is God an automaton?
>>>>>
>>>>>God is an eternally powerful super SPIRIT being.
>>>>
>>>>Are all spirits automatons?
>>>
>>>Spirit beings were not created by flesh and blood.
>>
>>Are all spirits automatons?
>
>Not even near so. Spirits do not look anything like humans. and are on
>a higher level of intelligence.

What powers do spirits have?

>>>>>(John 4:24) God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship
>>>>>with spirit and truth.”
>>>
>>>>What does that mean?
>>>
>>>The spirit in this case means one's life force. So that could mean to
>>>worship God with all of our might.
>>
>>Worship is stupid.
>
>So is downgrading God. Its like downgrading one's boss. It won't go
>well for you.

So we should go along with everything Satan does?

What sort of religion controls its people through fear?

>>>And we should worship Him with only truths, no lies or false doctrines.
>>
>>That won't work.
>
>Why?

Worship is a lie. All religious doctrines are lies.

>>>>>>>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>God must be so embarrassed.
>>>>>
>>>>>Embarrassment has to do with something negative. God makes no errors,
>>>>>thus never gets embarrassed.
>>>>
>>>>It would be better for God's reputation for you to say God makes
>>>>stupid mistakes and has no idea how to correct them.
>>>
>>>Why don't you just say that God is an idiot. That is what you are
>>>describing.
>>
>>That's the way the bible describes God.
>>
>>>But anyone with a half of brain can see that God is a zillion times that.
>>
>>God is like a zillion idiots?
>>
>No, He is like the IQ of an idiot multiplied a zillion times.

Does God create idiots to make himself look good?

>>>>>>>>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>>>>>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>>>>>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>>>>>>>>invisible to us.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>>>>>>>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>>>>>>>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>>>>>>>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>>>>>>>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>>>>>>>>incorruption.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>101%
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Why?
>>>>>
>
>Flesh and blood cannot inherit God's kingdom. That means that physical
>bodies cannot get into Heaven. They have to have spirit bodies. (like
>the angels have)

Why didn't God start us off in heaven as spirit beings?

>>>>Because:
>>>>>
>>>>>(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for
>>>>>teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining
>>>>>in righteousness,
>>>>
>>>>You believe that?
>>>
>>>Totally!!
>>
>>Why?
>
>Because I have researched the Bible and found it to be true. (of
>course the miracles cannot be proven, so I accept them on faith)

Every Jehovah Witness in the world should watch this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJuJZHSljh8

Ex Jehovah Witnesses of Arizona
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClEphwVqfR6j6ds6deBHvZA

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 16, 2021, 4:01:53 AM10/16/21
to
On Sat, 16 Oct 2021 09:34:34 +1100, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
Those 10 listings.

>
>>>You told me things that God has done that are bad, such as
>>>your panic attacks, and you even said God needs to change
>>>everything.
>>
>>I have never said that God did things that are bad. Only to the
>>wrongdoer do things look bad.
>
>You only say that because you are a sociopath.

"What is a Sociopath?

People often confuse the terms sociopath and psychopath and use them
interchangeably. They aren't’t different in the clinical sense. Both
terms refer to people who have antisocial personality disorder (ASPD).
Those with ASPD have no regard for others’ rights or feelings, lack
empathy and remorse for wrongdoings, and have the need to exploit and
manipulate others for personal gain."

You've got to be kidding! I fit that scenerio?



>
>>Because of what humans have done, God
>>will change everything for the better.
>
>That shows you know God is doing a terrible wrong now.

God is staying out of human affairs right now. But soon He will take
completly over.

>
>>>>>>Does this sound like God wants us to suffer?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
>>>>>>say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
>>>>>>them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
>>>>>>4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
>>>>>>no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
>>>>>>former things have passed away.”
>>>>>
>>>>>Yes it does. If God did not want us to suffer he would not have
>>>>>created conditions that need his corrections, and he would not
>>>>>tease us with promises.
>>>>
>>>>ALL of God's promises come true. All of them.
>>>
>>>Even Matthew 16:28 ?
>>
>>Yes, even Mt 16:28.
>>
>>(Matthew 16:28) Truly I say to you that there are some of those
>>standing here who will not taste death at all until first they see the
>>Son of man coming in his Kingdom.”
>>
>>This occurred at the transfiguration. Jesus' face shown like the sun.
>>It will be that way when Jesus takes over his literal kingdom.
>
>Matthew 16:28 can't happen as there are none alive who
333>were standing there. So that's one false promise of many.

3333You don't understand. During the transfiguation Jesus was acting
out what it will be like in his kingdom. (government) So they saw a
brief vision of Jesus' kingdom.

>
>Malachi 3:6 says God will never change for the better so
>God's promises to correct His errors will never happen.

It does not say that. Notice:

(Malachi 3:6) “For I am Jehovah; I do not change. And you are sons of
Jacob; you have not yet come to your finish.

>
>>>>>>If you looked at no other Scriptures, what would you call God here?
>>>>>
>>>>>Definitely a sadist.
>>>>
>>>>Now I know you are lying. Rev 21:3,4 is all positive things.
>>>
>>>You think tears and death and mourning and outcry and pain
>>>are good things?
>>>Even God knows he is doing a terrible wrong.
>>
>>You are misinterpreting it. It says :
>>
>>"And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no
>>more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former
>>things have passed away.”
>>
>>So God is going to REMOVE those things, not give them to them.
>
>Malachi 3:6 says you are wrong.

That Scripture tells us that God's moral qualities will not change. If
God hated homosexuality in the OT, He still does in the NT.

>
>>>>You have
>>>>not once mentioned God as having some positive virtues.
>>>
>>>You haven't told me any good things about God.
>>
>>"And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no
>>more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former
>>things have passed away."
>
>Why do you never say good things about God?

I do, but you don't listen.

>
>>>>Even Hitler had some positive attributes. For example, he treated his
>>>>dog kindly. Although his doctor was killing him with drugs, he treated
>>>>him kindly.
>>>
>>>And the nazis had "God With Us" on their belt buckles.
>>
>>Yes, they mispelled "God". It should read "god with us". (see 2 Cor
>>4:4)
>
>In this case God is considered a name hence it is capitalised.

"God" is not a name, but is:

"(in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and
ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme
being."
(https://www.google.com/search?q=define+God&sa=Google+Search)

>
>>>>>>>>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>>>>>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>>>>>>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>And God does not want us to suffer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Is God an automaton?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>God is an eternally powerful super SPIRIT being.
>>>>>
>>>>>Are all spirits automatons?
>>>>
>>>>Spirit beings were not created by flesh and blood.
>>>
>>>Are all spirits automatons?
>>
>>Not even near so. Spirits do not look anything like humans. and are on
>>a higher level of intelligence.
>
>What powers do spirits have?

According to the Bible, they can stand unharmed in a fiery inferno.
They can pass through walls. They can strike people blind. They can
move at or about the speed of light. They can fly. And there are
probably a thousand other things they can do that the Bible doesn't
mention.

>
>>>>>>(John 4:24) God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship
>>>>>>with spirit and truth.”
>>>>
>>>>>What does that mean?
>>>>
>>>>The spirit in this case means one's life force. So that could mean to
>>>>worship God with all of our might.
>>>
>>>Worship is stupid.
>>
>>So is downgrading God. Its like downgrading one's boss. It won't go
>>well for you.
>
>So we should go along with everything Satan does?

You appear to be. And it will not go well with you.

>
>What sort of religion controls its people through fear?

The Catholics, Baptists, Methodists, Lutherons, and most all other
religions that preach of hellfire.

>
>>>>And we should worship Him with only truths, no lies or false doctrines.
>>>
>>>That won't work.
>>
>>Why?
>
>Worship is a lie. All religious doctrines are lies.

You mean like, "love your neighbor as yourself." Do not steal, do not
commit adultery, do not murder, etc.

>
>>>>>>>>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>God must be so embarrassed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Embarrassment has to do with something negative. God makes no errors,
>>>>>>thus never gets embarrassed.
>>>>>
>>>>>It would be better for God's reputation for you to say God makes
>>>>>stupid mistakes and has no idea how to correct them.
>>>>
>>>>Why don't you just say that God is an idiot. That is what you are
>>>>describing.
>>>
>>>That's the way the bible describes God.
>>>
>>>>But anyone with a half of brain can see that God is a zillion times that.
>>>
>>>God is like a zillion idiots?
>>>
>>No, He is like the IQ of an idiot multiplied a zillion times.
>
>Does God create idiots to make himself look good?

No, God creates only perfection:

4 The Rock, perfect is his activity,
For all his ways are justice.

(Deut 32:4) A God of faithfulness who is never unjust;
Righteous and upright is he.

>
>>>>>>>>>>>>The angels are supposed to live in the spirit world. (whatever that is)
>>>>>>>>>>>>And the humans in the physical world. We cannot live in their world
>>>>>>>>>>>>with our physical bodies, but they can live in our world, but are
>>>>>>>>>>>>invisible to us.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>That's right out of the Bible:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>(Genesis 6:1, 2) Now when men started to grow in number on the surface
>>>>>>>>>>of the ground and daughters were born to them, 2 the sons of the true
>>>>>>>>>>God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they
>>>>>>>>>>began taking as wives all whom they chose.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>(1 Corinthians 15:50) But I tell you this, brothers, that flesh and
>>>>>>>>>>blood cannot inherit God’s Kingdom, nor does corruption inherit
>>>>>>>>>>incorruption.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>101%
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Why?
>>>>>>
>>
>>Flesh and blood cannot inherit God's kingdom. That means that physical
>>bodies cannot get into Heaven. They have to have spirit bodies. (like
>>the angels have)
>
>Why didn't God start us off in heaven as spirit beings?

The Bible doesn't answer that one.

>
>>>>>Because:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for
>>>>>>teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining
>>>>>>in righteousness,
>>>>>
>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>
>>>>Totally!!
>>>
>>>Why?
>>
>>Because I have researched the Bible and found it to be true. (of
>>course the miracles cannot be proven, so I accept them on faith)
>
>Every Jehovah Witness in the world should watch this
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJuJZHSljh8
>
>Ex Jehovah Witnesses of Arizona
>https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClEphwVqfR6j6ds6deBHvZA

It is highly anti-JW. I don't choose to use my time in that endeavor.
If you have questions from that video, just ask.

any

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 16, 2021, 4:53:13 AM10/16/21
to
On Thu, 30 Sep 2021 05:58:12 +1000, Lucifer
Then you wouldn't be here. Is that what you want?

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 16, 2021, 5:15:21 AM10/16/21
to
Above the 10 listings that describe God doing stupid and
pointless things?

>>>>You told me things that God has done that are bad, such as
>>>>your panic attacks, and you even said God needs to change
>>>>everything.
>>>
>>>I have never said that God did things that are bad. Only to the
>>>wrongdoer do things look bad.
>>
>>You only say that because you are a sociopath.
>
>"What is a Sociopath?
>
>People often confuse the terms sociopath and psychopath and use them
>interchangeably. They aren't’t different in the clinical sense. Both
>terms refer to people who have antisocial personality disorder (ASPD).
>Those with ASPD have no regard for others’ rights or feelings, lack
>empathy and remorse for wrongdoings, and have the need to exploit and
>manipulate others for personal gain."
>
>You've got to be kidding! I fit that scenerio?

In your posts you do.
You show total lack of regard for people suffering terribly
under God's rule.

>>>Because of what humans have done, God
>>>will change everything for the better.
>>
>>That shows you know God is doing a terrible wrong now.
>
>God is staying out of human affairs right now. But soon He will take
>completly over.

Thanks for the warning. How much more time do we have to
continue to advance beyond God?

>>>>>>>Does this sound like God wants us to suffer?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>(Revelation 21:3, 4) With that I heard a loud voice from the throne
>>>>>>>say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with
>>>>>>>them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them.
>>>>>>>4 And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be
>>>>>>>no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The
>>>>>>>former things have passed away.”
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Yes it does. If God did not want us to suffer he would not have
>>>>>>created conditions that need his corrections, and he would not
>>>>>>tease us with promises.
>>>>>
>>>>>ALL of God's promises come true. All of them.
>>>>
>>>>Even Matthew 16:28 ?
>>>
>>>Yes, even Mt 16:28.
>>>
>>>(Matthew 16:28) Truly I say to you that there are some of those
>>>standing here who will not taste death at all until first they see the
>>>Son of man coming in his Kingdom.”
>>>
>>>This occurred at the transfiguration. Jesus' face shown like the sun.
>>>It will be that way when Jesus takes over his literal kingdom.
>>
>>Matthew 16:28 can't happen as there are none alive who
>333>were standing there. So that's one false promise of many.
>
>3333You don't understand. During the transfiguation Jesus was acting
>out what it will be like in his kingdom. (government) So they saw a
>brief vision of Jesus' kingdom.

Why the 3s?

>>Malachi 3:6 says God will never change for the better so
>>God's promises to correct His errors will never happen.
>
>It does not say that. Notice:
>
>(Malachi 3:6) “For I am Jehovah; I do not change.

That's what I said.

>And you are sons of
>Jacob; you have not yet come to your finish.
>>
>>>>>>>If you looked at no other Scriptures, what would you call God here?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Definitely a sadist.
>>>>>
>>>>>Now I know you are lying. Rev 21:3,4 is all positive things.
>>>>
>>>>You think tears and death and mourning and outcry and pain
>>>>are good things?
>>>>Even God knows he is doing a terrible wrong.
>>>
>>>You are misinterpreting it. It says :
>>>
>>>"And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no
>>>more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former
>>>things have passed away.”
>>>
>>>So God is going to REMOVE those things, not give them to them.
>>
>>Malachi 3:6 says you are wrong.
>
>That Scripture tells us that God's moral qualities will not change. If
>God hated homosexuality in the OT, He still does in the NT.

Now you are calling God stupid.

>>>>>You have
>>>>>not once mentioned God as having some positive virtues.
>>>>
>>>>You haven't told me any good things about God.
>>>
>>>"And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no
>>>more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former
>>>things have passed away."
>>
>>Why do you never say good things about God?
>
>I do, but you don't listen.

You need to write them in your posts.
You are always complaining about the results of God creating.

>>>>>Even Hitler had some positive attributes. For example, he treated his
>>>>>dog kindly. Although his doctor was killing him with drugs, he treated
>>>>>him kindly.
>>>>
>>>>And the nazis had "God With Us" on their belt buckles.
>>>
>>>Yes, they mispelled "God". It should read "god with us". (see 2 Cor
>>>4:4)
>>
>>In this case God is considered a name hence it is capitalised.
>
>"God" is not a name, but is:
>
>"(in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and
>ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme
>being."
>(https://www.google.com/search?q=define+God&sa=Google+Search)

In that case it should be god.

>>>>>>>>>>>>What else could it be? God was not
>>>>>>>>>>>>compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>An infinite IQ can see the future and what is NEEDED for ETERNAL
>>>>>>>>>>>happiness for His creation.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Our IQ compared to God's, is about like a flea fetus' IQ.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>God was not compelled to set things up so we suffer.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>And God does not want us to suffer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Is God an automaton?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>God is an eternally powerful super SPIRIT being.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Are all spirits automatons?
>>>>>
>>>>>Spirit beings were not created by flesh and blood.
>>>>
>>>>Are all spirits automatons?
>>>
>>>Not even near so. Spirits do not look anything like humans. and are on
>>>a higher level of intelligence.
>>
>>What powers do spirits have?
>
>According to the Bible, they can stand unharmed in a fiery inferno.

That's good news. It means the people in hell are not being harmed.
Jesus failed.

>They can pass through walls. They can strike people blind. They can
>move at or about the speed of light. They can fly. And there are
>probably a thousand other things they can do that the Bible doesn't
>mention.

I saw that movie! What was it called?

>>>>>>>(John 4:24) God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship
>>>>>>>with spirit and truth.”
>>>>>
>>>>>>What does that mean?
>>>>>
>>>>>The spirit in this case means one's life force. So that could mean to
>>>>>worship God with all of our might.
>>>>
>>>>Worship is stupid.
>>>
>>>So is downgrading God. Its like downgrading one's boss. It won't go
>>>well for you.
>>
>>So we should go along with everything Satan does?
>
>You appear to be. And it will not go well with you.

I'm not downgrading our boss Satan.

>>What sort of religion controls its people through fear?
>
>The Catholics, Baptists, Methodists, Lutherons, and most all other
>religions that preach of hellfire.

Why are you afraid?

>>>>>And we should worship Him with only truths, no lies or false doctrines.
>>>>
>>>>That won't work.
>>>
>>>Why?
>>
>>Worship is a lie. All religious doctrines are lies.
>
>You mean like, "love your neighbor as yourself." Do not steal, do not
>commit adultery, do not murder, etc.

Why do we need to be told those things?
Genocide, rape, murder, and slavery are doctrines.

>>>>>>>>>He feels bad that so many people listen to Satan, and do bad things.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>God must be so embarrassed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Embarrassment has to do with something negative. God makes no errors,
>>>>>>>thus never gets embarrassed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>It would be better for God's reputation for you to say God makes
>>>>>>stupid mistakes and has no idea how to correct them.
>>>>>
>>>>>Why don't you just say that God is an idiot. That is what you are
>>>>>describing.
>>>>
>>>>That's the way the bible describes God.
>>>>
>>>>>But anyone with a half of brain can see that God is a zillion times that.
>>>>
>>>>God is like a zillion idiots?
>>>>
>>>No, He is like the IQ of an idiot multiplied a zillion times.
>>
>>Does God create idiots to make himself look good?
>
>No, God creates only perfection:
>
>4 The Rock, perfect is his activity,
>For all his ways are justice.
>
>(Deut 32:4) A God of faithfulness who is never unjust;
>Righteous and upright is he.

It would be better for God's reputation for you to say God makes
stupid mistakes and has no idea how to correct them.

You are saying God chooses to be stupid and malicious.

>>>Flesh and blood cannot inherit God's kingdom. That means that physical
>>>bodies cannot get into Heaven. They have to have spirit bodies. (like
>>>the angels have)

Why did Jesus create hell if spirits can't feel pain?
You wrote, "Spirits can stand unharmed in a fiery inferno."

>>Why didn't God start us off in heaven as spirit beings?
>
>The Bible doesn't answer that one.

What is your thinking on this?

>>>>>>Because:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for
>>>>>>>teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining
>>>>>>>in righteousness,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You believe that?
>>>>>
>>>>>Totally!!
>>>>
>>>>Why?
>>>
>>>Because I have researched the Bible and found it to be true. (of
>>>course the miracles cannot be proven, so I accept them on faith)
>>
>>Every Jehovah Witness in the world should watch this
>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJuJZHSljh8
>>
>>Ex Jehovah Witnesses of Arizona
>>https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClEphwVqfR6j6ds6deBHvZA
>
>It is highly anti-JW.

With good reason.

>I don't choose to use my time in that endeavor.

You are afraid.

You lie about always telling the truth.
You don't want to know the truth.

>If you have questions from that video, just ask.

Thank you.
What is the name of the video?
How long does it run for?
How does it start?

>any
>James

Any James now?

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 16, 2021, 5:20:01 AM10/16/21
to
Are you saying God can't exist?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 18, 2021, 10:51:35 AM10/18/21
to
On Sat, 16 Oct 2021 20:19:58 +1100, Lucifer
My answer was based on your statement. God has always existed, and
will continue to exist forever.

servant

unread,
Oct 18, 2021, 4:09:32 PM10/18/21
to

After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
have always been here"; no evidence of course:

****

This test should be easy for my friend james, show anywhere in church
history the jw existed prior to the the end of the 19th century? We need
his to understand why they are any more valid then the mormans, christian
science, the adventist and others who popped up only in the 19th century.

Btw, *all* find confirmation of their validity in scripture. "We only
follow God's word". *All* have leaders with directt confirmation by divine
revelation they are the *true* followers of Christ..

Empty assertion without church history evidence of the kind "here we are,
so there must have been jw" since the 1st century will not serve.

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 18, 2021, 4:35:01 PM10/18/21
to
I must disagree with you there.
God can only exist while humans exist. Humans have existed for
around 200,000 years and will cease to exist sometime in the
distant future.

>James
>
>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.

Sir sir! <Raises hand>
Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
get anything right?

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 18, 2021, 4:57:44 PM10/18/21
to
On 18 Oct 2021 20:09:28 GMT, servant wrote:

>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>have always been here"; no evidence of course:

James has a motto. "We don't need no stinkin' evidence."
In James' world James says it and it is so.

As Ned Flanders says,
"I've done everything the bible says to do,
even those parts that contradict the other parts."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTU_qaK0NeU

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 19, 2021, 4:52:35 PM10/19/21
to
On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 07:57:39 +1100, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On 18 Oct 2021 20:09:28 GMT, servant wrote:
>
>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>
>James has a motto. "We don't need no stinkin' evidence."
>In James' world James says it and it is so.

Those Scriptures I quote usually have been researched over and over
again. They are the truth as I know it. And we should prove whatever
we can.

(1 Thessalonians 5:21) Make sure of all things; hold fast to what is
fine.

-- King James
1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.



>
>As Ned Flanders says,
>"I've done everything the bible says to do,
>even those parts that contradict the other parts."
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTU_qaK0NeU

What contradictions?

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 19, 2021, 5:52:34 PM10/19/21
to
On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 16:52:25 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 07:57:39 +1100, Lucifer
><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>On 18 Oct 2021 20:09:28 GMT, servant wrote:
>>
>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>>
>>James has a motto. "We don't need no stinkin' evidence."
>>In James' world James says it and it is so.
>
>Those Scriptures I quote usually have been researched over and over
>again.

By biased people.

>They are the truth as I know it.

Why are you called to attend meetings and watch Watchtower
videos?

>And we should prove whatever we can.

You can't prove what the bible says.

>>As Ned Flanders says,
>>"I've done everything the bible says to do,
>>even those parts that contradict the other parts."
>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTU_qaK0NeU
>
>What contradictions?

There are some that can't be resolved, such as
Ex 33:20 vs EX 33:11.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 20, 2021, 3:02:54 AM10/20/21
to
On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 07:34:56 +1100, Lucifer
God existed before humans since He created them.
Humans have existed for about 6000 years.
Humans will live forever on a paradise earth.
>
>>James
>>
>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>
>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>get anything right?

If God was made up by humans, why put God in such a role? Why not just
only make God always good? Did they screw up?


James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 20, 2021, 5:09:54 AM10/20/21
to
Humans had to exist in order to create God.
Humans have existed for between 200,000 and 400,000 years.
Aborigines have been in Australia for around 50,000 years.
The Sun will cease to exist some time in the distant future.

I have truth on my side.

>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>
>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>get anything right?
>
>If God was made up by humans, why put God in such a role? Why not just
>only make God always good? Did they screw up?

The people who created God tried to explain why we are in such
a mess.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 20, 2021, 9:18:05 AM10/20/21
to
On Wed, 20 Oct 2021 08:52:28 +1100, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 16:52:25 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 07:57:39 +1100, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On 18 Oct 2021 20:09:28 GMT, servant wrote:
>>>
>>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>>>
>>>James has a motto. "We don't need no stinkin' evidence."
>>>In James' world James says it and it is so.
>>
>>Those Scriptures I quote usually have been researched over and over
>>again.
>
>By biased people.

Anyone that has his own beliefs, is biased. But you don't know the
JW's. Their #1 goal is to find the TRUTH in the Scriptures. And with
Jehovah's help they have been doing that.
>
>>They are the truth as I know it.
>
>Why are you called to attend meetings and watch Watchtower
>videos?

We are getting spiritual food at the proper time. Unlike the churches
that stay stagnated.

>
>>And we should prove whatever we can.
>
>You can't prove what the bible says.

On the contrary. It names names, cities, geographical areas,
prophecies, etc. These can be looked up in secular history. (not the
prophecies) And has been.

>
>>>As Ned Flanders says,
>>>"I've done everything the bible says to do,
>>>even those parts that contradict the other parts."
>>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTU_qaK0NeU
>>
>>What contradictions?
>
>There are some that can't be resolved, such as
>Ex 33:20 vs EX 33:11.

Thank you for those examples. There is no contradictions and here is
why:

(Exodus 33:20) But he added: “You cannot see my face, for no man can
see me and live.”

Yet Moses continued to live.

(Exodus 33:11) Jehovah spoke to Moses face-to-face, just as one man
would speak to another man. When he returned to the camp, Joshua the
son of Nun, his minister and attendant, would not depart from the
tent.

Jesus' disciple Stephen under inspiration tells us:

(Acts 7:53) you who received the Law as transmitted by angels but have
not kept it.”

Thus the "Jehovah" in Ex 33:11 was an angel. A spokesman for God. Thus
Moses could look upon his face and not die.



James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.


>
>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 20, 2021, 2:38:39 PM10/20/21
to
How does one man speak to another man, face to face?

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 22, 2021, 8:40:32 AM10/22/21
to
On Thu, 21 Oct 2021 05:38:33 +1100, Lucifer
According to Stephen, Moses talked to a representative of God, a
materialized angel. It was he, whom Moses met face to face.
If it was the Creator of stars, God Himself, Moses would have been
vaporized.


>
>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 22, 2021, 5:57:45 PM10/22/21
to
Does one man speak to another man, face to face, via an angel?

>James

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 22, 2021, 6:13:38 PM10/22/21
to

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 22, 2021, 6:46:24 PM10/22/21
to
On Wed, 20 Oct 2021 20:09:49 +1100, Lucifer
If humans created the Bible, why does the Bible show the Israelites
weaknesses and sins? If it is all fiction anyway, why not make
everyone look good?

>Humans have existed for between 200,000 and 400,000 years.
>Aborigines have been in Australia for around 50,000 years.
>The Sun will cease to exist some time in the distant future.

And the moon is slowly moving away from the earth.

As for 400,000 years, when does history record great civilizations? It
is usually around 6000 years. That should tell you something.
>
>I have truth on my side.

And you have lies on your side.

>
>>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>>
>>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>>get anything right?
>>
>>If God was made up by humans, why put God in such a role? Why not just
>>only make God always good? Did they screw up?
>
>The people who created God tried to explain why we are in such
>a mess.

Since you don't know, they didn't do such a good job, did they?

>
>>James
>>
>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>
>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>get anything right?

Put your hand down child, and hear the answer.

Since we are made in His image, that makes you a bumbling idiot also,
that can't get anything right.


James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 23, 2021, 2:42:56 AM10/23/21
to
The bible looks like it was created by stupid humans.

>>Humans have existed for between 200,000 and 400,000 years.
>>Aborigines have been in Australia for around 50,000 years.
>>The Sun will cease to exist some time in the distant future.
>
>And the moon is slowly moving away from the earth.
>
>As for 400,000 years, when does history record great civilizations? It
>is usually around 6000 years. That should tell you something.

If true it says history only goes back around 6,000 years.

>>I have truth on my side.
>
>And you have lies on your side.
>
>>
>>>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>>>
>>>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>>>get anything right?
>>>
>>>If God was made up by humans, why put God in such a role? Why not just
>>>only make God always good? Did they screw up?
>>
>>The people who created God tried to explain why we are in such
>>a mess.
>
>Since you don't know, they didn't do such a good job, did they?

It's not possible to make God look good while describing his
stupid mistakes.

>>>James
>>>
>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>
>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>get anything right?
>
>Put your hand down child, and hear the answer.
>
>Since we are made in His image, that makes you a bumbling idiot also,
>that can't get anything right.

We exceed God because we came about by a natural process
over millions of years.

Religion makes people stupid.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 24, 2021, 10:27:57 AM10/24/21
to
Yes, Moses received the Law by means of an angel who represented God.


James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.

>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 24, 2021, 2:27:20 PM10/24/21
to
What is the purpose of the angel when two men talk face to face?

>James
>understand the Bible
>www.jw.org
>
>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 25, 2021, 3:26:05 AM10/25/21
to
On Mon, 25 Oct 2021 05:27:16 +1100, Lucifer
It was an angel and a man talking face to face.
>
>>James
>>understand the Bible
>>www.jw.org
>>
>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>
>How does one man speak to another man, face to face?

It was an angel and a man.

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 25, 2021, 4:31:11 AM10/25/21
to
How does one man speak to another man, face to face?

>James
>understand the Bible
>www.jw.org
>
>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 25, 2021, 10:24:19 AM10/25/21
to
On Sat, 23 Oct 2021 17:42:51 +1100, Lucifer
Well let's see. In the first century, orbital flight had not yet
occurred. So how did they know the following:

(Isaiah 40:22) There is One who dwells above the circle of the earth,
And its inhabitants are like grasshoppers. He is stretching out the
heavens like a fine gauze, And he spreads them out like a tent to
dwell in.

(Job 26:7) He stretches out the northern sky over empty space,
Suspending the earth upon nothing;

So those stupid humans describes what we know today. A round
(spherical) earth floating in space.

The Hebrew word at Isaiah 40:22, Hhug, can also mean spherical.

>
>>>Humans have existed for between 200,000 and 400,000 years.
>>>Aborigines have been in Australia for around 50,000 years.
>>>The Sun will cease to exist some time in the distant future.
>>
>>And the moon is slowly moving away from the earth.
>>
>>As for 400,000 years, when does history record great civilizations? It
>>is usually around 6000 years. That should tell you something.
>
>If true it says history only goes back around 6,000 years.

It is true.
>
>>>I have truth on my side.
>>
>>And you have lies on your side.
>>
>>>
>>>>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>>>>
>>>>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>>>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>>>>get anything right?
>>>>
>>>>If God was made up by humans, why put God in such a role? Why not just
>>>>only make God always good? Did they screw up?
>>>
>>>The people who created God tried to explain why we are in such
>>>a mess.
>>
>>Since you don't know, they didn't do such a good job, did they?
>
>It's not possible to make God look good while describing his
>stupid mistakes.

What is your proof?

>
>>>>James
>>>>
>>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>>
>>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>>get anything right?
>>
>>Put your hand down child, and hear the answer.
>>
>>Since we are made in His image, that makes you a bumbling idiot also,
>>that can't get anything right.
>
>We exceed God because we came about by a natural process
>over millions of years.

Then why did evolution give humans a spiritual side of their
personality?

>
>Religion makes people stupid

In most cases, you are correct. But JW's go only by the Bible.

James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.

>
>>James

servant

unread,
Oct 25, 2021, 12:22:40 PM10/25/21
to

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 25, 2021, 5:06:00 PM10/25/21
to
>>>>>>>>>>If God didn't need a beginning then neither did lesser beings.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Then you wouldn't be here. Is that what you want?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Are you saying God can't exist?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>My answer was based on your statement. God has always existed, and
>>>>>>>will continue to exist forever.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I must disagree with you there.
>>>>>>God can only exist while humans exist. Humans have existed for
>>>>>>around 200,000 years and will cease to exist sometime in the
>>>>>>distant future
>>>>>
>>>>>I must disagree with you there.
>>>>>
>>>>>God existed before humans since He created them.
>>>>>Humans have existed for about 6000 years.
>>>>>Humans will live forever on a paradise earth.
>>>>
>>>>I must disagree with you there.
>>>>
>>>>Humans had to exist in order to create God.
>>>
>>>If humans created the Bible, why does the Bible show the Israelites
>>>weaknesses and sins? If it is all fiction anyway, why not make
>>>everyone look good?
>>
>>The bible looks like it was created by stupid humans.
>
>Well let's see. In the first century, orbital flight had not yet
>occurred. So how did they know the following:

What makes you think they "knew" the following?

>(Isaiah 40:22) There is One who dwells above the circle of the earth,
>And its inhabitants are like grasshoppers. He is stretching out the
>heavens like a fine gauze, And he spreads them out like a tent to
>dwell in.
>(Job 26:7) He stretches out the northern sky over empty space,
>Suspending the earth upon nothing;
>
>So those stupid humans describes what we know today. A round
>(spherical) earth floating in space.
>
>The Hebrew word at Isaiah 40:22, Hhug, can also mean spherical.

How did they know about the flat earth with the solid dome?

>>>>Humans have existed for between 200,000 and 400,000 years.
>>>>Aborigines have been in Australia for around 50,000 years.
>>>>The Sun will cease to exist some time in the distant future.
>>>
>>>And the moon is slowly moving away from the earth.
>>>
>>>As for 400,000 years, when does history record great civilizations? It
>>>is usually around 6000 years. That should tell you something.
>>
>>If true it says history only goes back around 6,000 years.
>
>It is true.
>>
>>>>I have truth on my side.
>>>
>>>And you have lies on your side.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>>>>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>>>>>get anything right?
>>>>>
>>>>>If God was made up by humans, why put God in such a role? Why not just
>>>>>only make God always good? Did they screw up?
>>>>
>>>>The people who created God tried to explain why we are in such
>>>>a mess.
>>>
>>>Since you don't know, they didn't do such a good job, did they?
>>
>>It's not possible to make God look good while describing his
>>stupid mistakes.
>
>What is your proof?

The bible.

>>>>>James
>>>>>
>>>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>>>
>>>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>>>get anything right?
>>>
>>>Put your hand down child, and hear the answer.
>>>
>>>Since we are made in His image, that makes you a bumbling idiot also,
>>>that can't get anything right.
>>
>>We exceed God because we came about by a natural process
>>over millions of years.
>
>Then why did evolution give humans a spiritual side of their
>personality?

It may have been an evolutionary advantage.
Now religion just holds us back.

P+Barker

unread,
Oct 25, 2021, 6:35:49 PM10/25/21
to
On 25 Oct 2021 16:22:38 GMT, servant wrote:

>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>have always been here"; no evidence of course:

This shouldn't surprise you at all.
james either bypasses the question, or he ignores it.
he has no real answers for why the jw's even exist.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 27, 2021, 9:48:12 AM10/27/21
to
On 25 Oct 2021 16:22:38 GMT, servant wrote:

>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>
>****
>
>This test should be easy for my friend james, show anywhere in church
>history the jw existed prior to the the end of the 19th century? We need
>his to understand why they are any more valid then the mormans, christian
>science, the adventist and others who popped up only in the 19th century.

The true religion in the last days will have the Bible truths. (John
4:23,24)
The Bible says what God made, remains forever. It will never die out
(Ec 3:14) Thus you may not find Bible truths listed in some
historical documents. But those truths have been passed down through
the ages to our day.

It is a similar thing with the extinction of the dinosaurs. How do
they know an asteroid or comet wiped them out. It is not in any
written historical records, is it. No. they just take whatever
evidence they have today and reason on it.

It could have been a biological plague of some kind. No one really
knows feor sure.


>
>Btw, *all* find confirmation of their validity in scripture. "We only
>follow God's word". *All* have leaders with directt confirmation by divine
>revelation they are the *true* followers of Christ..

Please humor me. What 'direct confirmation by divine revelation'
happened to the JW leaders at Bethel to prove they were the real
followers of God and Christ?
>
>Empty assertion without church history evidence of the kind "here we are,
>so there must have been jw" since the 1st century will not serve.

Actually, the Bible predicted that the truth will become evident in
the last days:

-- Revised Standard
Proverbs 4:18 But the path of the righteous is like the light of
dawn, which shines brighter and brighter until full day.

And just how bright does the day get? Isa 2:2-4

2. And it shall come to pass in the latter days, that the mountain of
Jehovah's house shall be established on the top of the mountains, and
shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
3. And many peoples shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to
the mountain of Jehovah, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will
teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion
shall go forth the law, and the word of Jehovah from Jerusalem.
4. And he will judge between the nations, and will decide concerning
many peoples; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and
their spears into pruning-hooks; nation shall not lift up sword
against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. (ASB--American
Standard Bible)

So, how do we know that the JW's are the true religion, and not the
Mormons, Adventists, or Christian Scientists, etc?

(Acts 15:14-17) Sym´e·on has related thoroughly how God for the first
time turned his attention to the nations to take out of them a people
for his name. 15 And with this the words of the Prophets agree, just
as it is written: 16 ‘After these things I will return and raise up
again the tent of David that is fallen down; I will rebuild its ruins
and restore it, 17 so that the men who remain may earnestly seek
Jehovah, together with people of all the nations, people who are
called by my name, says Jehovah, who is doing these things,

Note: people who are called by my name,!

What is the Morman name= Morman
What is the Adventist name= Adventists
What is the Christian Scientist name= Christian Scientist What is the
JW's name= Jehovah's Witnesses.

Which one fulfils Acts 15:14,17?

James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

servant

unread,
Oct 27, 2021, 10:53:51 AM10/27/21
to

>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
Note to any readers who have followed the previous 3 failures, save time as
the below 4th effort is a total failure I'm sorry to say.

Fiend james tries to find in scripture 2000 uears after the fact possible
jw bits. All the other 19th century popup religions do likewise, sorry
friend james, no cigar.
>
>>****
>
>>This test should be easy for my friend james, show anywhere in church
>>history the jw existed prior to the the end of the 19th century? We need
>
>>his to understand why they are any more valid then the mormans, christian
>
>>science, the adventist and others who popped up only in the 19th century.
>


Recalling evidence from church history was the question friend james goes
off the rails right away:

>The true religion in the last days will have the
Bible truths.
(John

Bingo, and all ofthe 19th century out of nowhere churches say
"amen", exactly what we got.

>4:23,24)
>The Bible says what God made, remains forever. It will never die out
>(Ec 3:14) Thus you may not find Bible truths listed in some
>historical documents. But those truths have been passed down through
>the ages to our day.

Bingo; bingo all above say, that is exactly and only us described.

Sad, friend james now goes off the rails and into the ditch as to the
evidence from church history requested:
>It is a similar thing with the extinction of the dinosaurs. How do

>they know an asteroid or comet wiped them out. It is not in any
>written historical records, is it. No. they just take whatever
>evidence they have today and reason on it.

Sorry friend james, there is an unbroken record of church documentation
back into the 1st century. Disciples of the apostles wrote of what
they
had learned from them. . And so on for these 2000 years.

Relevant to the question for church history evidence of jw existing at
*any* timeme, there just ain't none.

>It could have been a biological plague of some kind. No one really
>knows feor sure.

You mean the jw do not appear in history until the 19th century because of
a disease, how interesting. >
>
>
>>Btw, *all* find confirmation of their validity in scripture. "We only
>
>>follow God's word". *All* have leaders with directt confirmation by divine
>
>>revelation they are the *true* followers of Christ..
>
>Please humor me. What 'direct confirmation by divine revelation'
>happened to the JW leaders at Bethel to prove they were the real
>followers of God and Christ?

I'm speaking of the reason the other popup 19th century religions use, God
told them using prophets.

But since you asked, one possible jw connection is that russell dabbled in
adventism for awhile. E g. white was their prophet with direct
communication with the divine.
>>
He took various adventist doctrines which originate with her "prophecy"
into his new religion.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 29, 2021, 8:47:06 AM10/29/21
to
On 27 Oct 2021 14:53:50 GMT, servant wrote:

>
>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>Note to any readers who have followed the previous 3 failures, save time as
>the below 4th effort is a total failure I'm sorry to say.
>
>Fiend james tries to find in scripture 2000 uears after the fact possible
>jw bits. All the other 19th century popup religions do likewise, sorry
>friend james, no cigar.

Good. I don't smoke.

As I said before, God's word always exists. It never goes totally
silent. So from the 1st century to the 19th century it existed
somewhere, at sometime. Then it became more public in the 19th century
and on to today. (Pr 4:18):

-- King James
Isaiah 40:8 The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of
our God shall stand for ever.

>>
>>>****
>>
>>>This test should be easy for my friend james, show anywhere in church
>>>history the jw existed prior to the the end of the 19th century? We need
>>
>>>his to understand why they are any more valid then the mormans, christian
>>
>>>science, the adventist and others who popped up only in the 19th century.
>>
>
>
>Recalling evidence from church history was the question friend james goes
>off the rails right away:

-- King James
Isaiah 40:8 The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of
our God shall stand for ever.

>
>>The true religion in the last days will have the
>Bible truths.
>(John
>
>Bingo, and all ofthe 19th century out of nowhere churches say
>"amen", exactly what we got.

-- King James
Isaiah 40:8 The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of
our God shall stand for ever.
>
>>4:23,24)
>>The Bible says what God made, remains forever. It will never die out
>>(Ec 3:14) Thus you may not find Bible truths listed in some
>>historical documents. But those truths have been passed down through
>>the ages to our day.
>
>Bingo; bingo all above say, that is exactly and only us described.
>
>Sad, friend james now goes off the rails and into the ditch as to the
>evidence from church history requested:
>>It is a similar thing with the extinction of the dinosaurs. How do

-- King James
Isaiah 40:8 The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of
our God shall stand for ever.
>
>>they know an asteroid or comet wiped them out. It is not in any
>>written historical records, is it. No. they just take whatever
>>evidence they have today and reason on it.
>
>Sorry friend james, there is an unbroken record of church documentation
>back into the 1st century. Disciples of the apostles wrote of what
>they
>had learned from them. . And so on for these 2000 years.
>
>Relevant to the question for church history evidence of jw existing at
>*any* timeme, there just ain't none.

-- King James
Isaiah 40:8 The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of
our God shall stand for ever.
>
>>It could have been a biological plague of some kind. No one really
>>knows feor sure.

Did you do some snipping here?
>
>You mean the jw do not appear in history until the 19th century because of
>a disease, how interesting. >

That is not what is meant. JW's took the name "Jehovah's Witnesses"
from Isa 43:10-12. Before that, they were just called "Bible
Students".

>>
>>
>>>Btw, *all* find confirmation of their validity in scripture. "We only
>>
>>>follow God's word". *All* have leaders with directt confirmation by divine
>>
>>>revelation they are the *true* followers of Christ..
>>
>>Please humor me. What 'direct confirmation by divine revelation'
>>happened to the JW leaders at Bethel to prove they were the real
>>followers of God and Christ?
>
>I'm speaking of the reason the other popup 19th century religions use, God
>told them using prophets.

Give me an example if you can.

>
>But since you asked, one possible jw connection is that russell dabbled in
>adventism for awhile. E g. white was their prophet with direct
>communication with the divine.

Not all professed Christian religions are TOTALLY false. Each has a
small bit of truth.

>>>
>He took various adventist doctrines which originate with her "prophecy"
>into his new religion.

It wasn't HIS religion. It was the Bible's religion.

servant

unread,
Oct 29, 2021, 12:04:04 PM10/29/21
to

>>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>>Note to any readers who have followed the previous 3 failures, save time as
>>the below 4th effort is a total failure I'm sorry to say.
>>
>>Fiend james tries to find in scripture 2000 uears after the fact possible
>>jw bits. All the other 19th century popup religions do likewise, sorry
>>friend james, no cigar.
>
>Good. I don't smoke.
But you do smolder, no?

>

Friend james restates his circular logic, "we are here, so there must be
evidence in the previous 2000 years for the jw".

>As I said before, God's word always exists. It never goes totally
>silent. So from the 1st century to the 19th century it existed
>somewhere, at sometime. Then it became more public in the 19th century
>and on to today.

Oh dear, friend james just gave total validity to all the 19th century
popup religions,ie. mormons, christian science, advintis,christadelphians
and others.. They all claim *exactly* that same reason you should join them
as the one "true" religion.

Sorry friend james, the reason you are stuck having *no* evidence for the
jw existing in prior church history is because there is absolutely none.

So when scripture warns us of false religions and their false teachers
severall times, the jw *must*
be considered as among them.

Saying "we follow the bible and it describes us" does no good. All the
popup 19th century religions do likewise, just ask them and they will have
"proof" by the ton they will be happy to show you in scripture.

Btw, for you to say that 1885 years after the fact the "real" religion
appears; is to make Christ a liar.

He said His church being established would stand even against hell and
prevail. If we had to wait 1885 years for the "real deal" to popup; it
means somewhere along the line the church ceased/failed and He lied to us.

I'm guessing here, a search of the watchtower etc. archives has no answer
for the failure in prior church history question?

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 30, 2021, 10:10:55 AM10/30/21
to
On 29 Oct 2021 16:04:02 GMT, servant wrote:

>
>>>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>>>Note to any readers who have followed the previous 3 failures, save time as
>>>the below 4th effort is a total failure I'm sorry to say.
>>>
>>>Fiend james tries to find in scripture 2000 uears after the fact possible
>>>jw bits. All the other 19th century popup religions do likewise, sorry
>>>friend james, no cigar.
>>
>>Good. I don't smoke.
>But you do smolder, no?

That's strange. I was going to say a similar thing about smolder.

>
>>
>
>Friend james restates his circular logic, "we are here, so there must be
>evidence in the previous 2000 years for the jw".

You are forgetting the Scripture that basically says God's Word exists
forever. See below.

>
>>As I said before, God's word always exists. It never goes totally
>>silent. So from the 1st century to the 19th century it existed
>>somewhere, at sometime. Then it became more public in the 19th century
>>and on to today.
>
>Oh dear, friend james just gave total validity to all the 19th century
>popup religions,ie. mormons, christian science, advintis,christadelphians
>and others.. They all claim *exactly* that same reason you should join them
>as the one "true" religion.

I never met a religion yet that didn't claim to be the true one. The
test is if they follow the Bible. For example, how many religions
participated in WWII? Most of them did. They each supported the
country they were in.

Thus, German Catholics were killing American Catholics and American
Baptists were killing German Baptists. Yet, Jesus said to love and
pray for your enemies. (Mt 5:44)
>
>Sorry friend james, the reason you are stuck having *no* evidence for the
>jw existing in prior church history is because there is absolutely none.

I am not aware of ANY true Bible doctrines until the 19the century.
They existed somewhere, but apparently was not written down because
God's word lasts forever, recorded or not.



>
>So when scripture warns us of false religions and their false teachers
>severall times, the jw *must*
> be considered as among them.

You are thinking of Christendom, not JW's.

>
>Saying "we follow the bible and it describes us" does no good. All the
>popup 19th century religions do likewise, just ask them and they will have
>"proof" by the ton they will be happy to show you in scripture.

Yes, they are like the 1st century Scribes and Pharisees who
misinterpreted the Scriptures.

>
>Btw, for you to say that 1885 years after the fact the "real" religion
>appears; is to make Christ a liar.

Not at all. Jesus said this for the last days:

-- King James
Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all
the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Just read the cover of any Watchtower magazine. It says,

"ANOUNCING JEHOVAH'S KINGDOM"

Do you know what that means? Please answer this time.


>
>He said His church being established would stand even against hell and
>prevail. If we had to wait 1885 years for the "real deal" to popup; it
>means somewhere along the line the church ceased/failed and He lied to us.

Just because it is not recorded somewhere, doesn't mean his 'church'
hasn't always been around. Remember, God's word will always exist.
>
>I'm guessing here, a search of the watchtower etc. archives has no answer
>for the failure in prior church history question?

See above where it doesn't take a public record to prove that it was
still active.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 30, 2021, 12:01:01 PM10/30/21
to
On Wed, 20 Oct 2021 08:52:28 +1100, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 16:52:25 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 07:57:39 +1100, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On 18 Oct 2021 20:09:28 GMT, servant wrote:
>>>
>>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>>>
>>>James has a motto. "We don't need no stinkin' evidence."
>>>In James' world James says it and it is so.
>>
>>Those Scriptures I quote usually have been researched over and over
>>again.
>
>By biased people.

They don't fit the definition below.


biased
adjective

1. unfairly prejudiced for or against someone or something

Example: "we will not tolerate this biased media coverage"

>
>>They are the truth as I know it.
>
>Why are you called to attend meetings and watch Watchtower
>videos?

The meetings are now held in our homes with zoom.

>>And we should prove whatever we can.
>
>You can't prove what the bible says.

The Bible talks about Jesus. Historical records show that Jesus
existed.

>
>>>As Ned Flanders says,
>>>"I've done everything the bible says to do,
>>>even those parts that contradict the other parts."
>>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTU_qaK0NeU
>>
>>What contradictions?
>
>There are some that can't be resolved, such as
>Ex 33:20 vs EX 33:11.

According to the Bible, Ex 33:20 and Ex 33:11 are not contradictory.

James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org

If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.



>>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Oct 30, 2021, 5:00:50 PM10/30/21
to
On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 07:34:56 +1100, Lucifer
<LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:

>On Mon, 18 Oct 2021 10:51:30 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 16 Oct 2021 20:19:58 +1100, Lucifer
>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 16 Oct 2021 04:53:10 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Thu, 30 Sep 2021 05:58:12 +1000, Lucifer
>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Wed, 29 Sep 2021 08:46:35 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Wed, 29 Sep 2021 09:16:05 +1000, Lucifer
>>>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On Tue, 28 Sep 2021 08:35:46 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On Mon, 30 Aug 2021 14:44:17 +1000, Lucifer
>>>>>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 10:40:40 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>On Sun, 29 Aug 2021 07:12:08 +1000, Lucifer
>>>>>>>>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>On Sat, 28 Aug 2021 10:45:11 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>What came first. The skeleton structure of a life form, or its muscle
>>>>>>>>>>>>and meat? How does evolution explain that?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>What is the exact method by which God created?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>The Bible doesn't say.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>So it could have been evolution. Thanks.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>No way. Evolution is mindless, and thus not capable of creating things
>>>>>>>>like the complexities of the human brain. Evolution has the IQ of
>>>>>>>>exactly 0. Yet the highest IQ's today still can't figure the human
>>>>>>>>brain mechanisms out completely. Is that not a logical picture here?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>If an all everything God did not need to come from
>>>>>>>somewhere and did not need to be created then neither does life.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You can't have it both ways.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Why not? Actually, that is the truth today. God never had a beginning,
>>>>>>but He created many life forms.
>>>>>
>>>>>If God didn't need a beginning then neither did lessor beings.
>>>>
>>>>Then you wouldn't be here. Is that what you want?
>>>
>>>Are you saying God can't exist?
>>
>>My answer was based on your statement. God has always existed, and
>>will continue to exist forever.
>
>I must disagree with you there.
>God can only exist while humans exist. Humans have existed for
>around 200,000 years and will cease to exist sometime in the
>distant future.

Sounds like a Satanic prophecy. I will correct it:
God can exist even if all humans didn't exist. Humans have existed
around 6000 years, and will continue to exist for all eternity.

>
>>James
>>
>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>
>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>get anything right?

You are contradicting your own logic. You say that men made up God.
Then why would they "describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
get anything right?"

teresita

unread,
Oct 30, 2021, 5:08:18 PM10/30/21
to
fOn Sat, 30 Oct 2021, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

> You are contradicting your own logic. You say that men made up God.
> Then why would they "describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
> get anything right?"

"And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good.
And the evening and the morning were the sixth day."

"And the LORD God said unto the serpent, 'Because thou hast done this,
thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field;
upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of
thy life.'"

Bumbling idiot.

--
https://twitter.com/x3na

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 30, 2021, 5:27:07 PM10/30/21
to
On Sat, 30 Oct 2021 12:00:59 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Wed, 20 Oct 2021 08:52:28 +1100, Lucifer
><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 16:52:25 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>
>>>On Tue, 19 Oct 2021 07:57:39 +1100, Lucifer
>>><LuciferMo...@bigpond.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On 18 Oct 2021 20:09:28 GMT, servant wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>>>>
>>>>James has a motto. "We don't need no stinkin' evidence."
>>>>In James' world James says it and it is so.
>>>
>>>Those Scriptures I quote usually have been researched over and over
>>>again.
>>
>>By biased people.
>
>They don't fit the definition below.
>
>
>biased
>adjective
>
>1. unfairly prejudiced for or against someone or something
>
>Example: "we will not tolerate this biased media coverage"

They are biased towards people believing whatever gives
them control.

>>>They are the truth as I know it.

Why are you called to attend meetings and watch Watchtower
videos?

>>>And we should prove whatever we can.
>>
>>You can't prove what the bible says.
>
>The Bible talks about Jesus. Historical records show that Jesus
>existed.

No they don't. There certainly was no magical Jesus.

>>>>As Ned Flanders says,
>>>>"I've done everything the bible says to do,
>>>>even those parts that contradict the other parts."
>>>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTU_qaK0NeU
>>>
>>>What contradictions?
>>
>>There are some that can't be resolved, such as
>>Ex 33:20 vs EX 33:11.
>
>According to the Bible, Ex 33:20 and Ex 33:11 are not contradictory.

According to you they are, and you say Ex 33:11 is wrong.

Does 'a man speak to another man' via an angel?

Do you personally speak to another man via an angel?

>James

servant

unread,
Oct 30, 2021, 5:40:03 PM10/30/21
to
For any readers still following, do yourself a time saving favor and skip
the frankly embarrissing effort to avoid the *real* question on table from
friend james. For the scorecard, skip to the last line. .


>>>>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>>>>Note to any readers who have followed the previous 3 failures, save time as
>>>>the below 4th effort is a total failure I'm sorry to say.
>>>>
>>>>Fiend james tries to find in scripture 2000 uears after the fact possible
>>>>jw bits. All the other 19th century popup religions do likewise, sorry
>>>>friend james, no cigar.
>>
>>Friend james restates his circular logic, "we are here, so there must be
>>evidence in the previous 2000 years for the jw".
>
>You are forgetting the Scripture that basically says God's Word exists
>forever. See below.
>


Indeed see below, *all* the 19th century popup religions say the same, jw
just one among the crowd.>>

Friend james if you have failed on the question of finding jw in church
history, equally it is a failure to find them uniquely defined in scripture
that is any different then the 19th century crowd of popups.

>>>As I said before, God's word always exists. It never goes totally
>>>silent. So from the 1st century to the 19th century it existed
>>>somewhere, at sometime. Then it became more public in the 19th century
>>>and on to today.

Sure, the question at hand has no bearing on the point that all accept.
The question at hand is to find the jw in that "some/where/sometime", it
just ain't there..
>>
>>Oh dear, friend james just gave total validity to all the 19th century
>>popup religions,ie. mormons, christian science, advintis,christadelphians
>>and others.. They all claim *exactly* that same reason you should join them
>>as the one "true" religion.
>
>I never met a religion yet that didn't claim to be the true one. The
>test is if they follow the Bible. For example, how many religions
>participated in WWII? Most of them did. They each supported the
>country they were in.

Now now friend james, trying to interject > extrainious to the question
bits is a bust from the start.

You have just shot yourself in the foot by showing the jw don't fiffer from
countless other anytime who accept the bible.

>Thus, German Catholics were killing American Catholics and American
>Baptists were killing German Baptists. Yet, Jesus said to love and
>pray for your enemies. (Mt 5:44)
>>
Sitting here waiting until you get over that irrelevant bit. It doesn't
still find the jw anywhere prior to the 19th century.

>>Sorry friend james, the reason you are stuck having *no* evidence for the
>>jw existing in prior church history is because there is absolutely none.
>
>I am not aware of ANY true Bible doctrines until the 19the century.

>They existed somewhere, but apparently was not written down because
After that display of obvious lame bitcircular logic, let's get on to a
relevant point.

>>God's word lasts forever, recorded or not.

Indeed, and the jw claim of being here before the 19th century finds no
suppport in it, *none* at all.
>
>
>>So when scripture warns us of false religions and their false teachers
>>severall times, the jw *must*
>> be considered as among them.
>
>You are thinking of Christendom, not JW's.

Nope,that is a jw invented label that has no bearing on the warnings and
doesn't excuse the jw from them.
>>
>>Saying "we follow the bible and it describes us" does no good. All the
>>popup 19th century religions do likewise, just ask them and they will have
>>"proof" by the ton they will be happy to show you in scripture.
>
>Yes, they are like the 1st century Scribes and Pharisees who
>misinterpreted the Scriptures.

Smile, and the jw find nothing to excuse themselves still from the other
popup religions in that claim, in fact it cements them all the more with
them.
>>
>>Btw, for you to say that 1885 years after the fact the "real" religion

Friend james insertss bits here not addressing the point, snipped.
>>appears; is to make Christ a liar.
>
>Not at all. Jesus said this for the last days:
>
>-- King James
>Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all
>the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
>
>Just read the cover of any Watchtower magazine. It says,
>
>"ANOUNCING JEHOVAH'S KINGDOM"
>
>Do you know what that means? Please answer this time.
>
>
>>He said His church being established would stand even against hell and
>>prevail. If we had to wait 1885 years for the "real deal" to popup; it
>>means somewhere along the line the church ceased/failed and He lied to us.
>
>Just because it is not recorded somewhere, doesn't mean his 'church'
>hasn't always been around. Remember, God's word will always exist.

Please stop trying to avoid the point as made, it makes me embarrassed for
you when you pull that.
>>
>>I'm guessing here, a search of the watchtower etc. archives has no answer

Thus far on the jw claim to prior presense, church history 5, jw 0.

Lucifer

unread,
Oct 30, 2021, 8:50:37 PM10/30/21
to
>>>>>>If God didn't need a beginning then neither did lesser beings.
>>>>>
>>>>>Then you wouldn't be here. Is that what you want?
>>>>
>>>>Are you saying God can't exist?
>>>
>>>My answer was based on your statement. God has always existed, and
>>>will continue to exist forever.
>>
>>I must disagree with you there.
>>God can only exist while humans exist. Humans have existed for
>>around 200,000 years and will cease to exist sometime in the
>>distant future.
>
>Sounds like a Satanic prophecy. I will correct it:
>God can exist even if all humans didn't exist. Humans have existed
>around 6000 years, and will continue to exist for all eternity.

I look forward to your correction.
Perhaps in your next post.

>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>
>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>get anything right?
>
>You are contradicting your own logic. You say that men made up God.

I am only the messenger.

>Then why would they "describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>get anything right?"

They were trying to explain the reason we are in such a mess.

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Nov 1, 2021, 10:05:03 AM11/1/21
to
On 30 Oct 2021 21:25:29 GMT, servant wrote:

>For any readers still following, do yourself a time saving favor and skip
>the frankly embarrissing effort to avoid the *real* question on table from
>friend james. For the scorecard, skip to the last line. .

I avoid no questions. If you don't like my answers, that doesn't mean
I am avoiding your questions. Any other readers following this would
know that. I fear no questions.

>
>
>>>>>>>After 3 or so failed tries friend james has yet to answer the below with
>>>>>>>evidence from church history, his best effort; "we are here, so we must
>>>>>>>have always been here"; no evidence of course:
>>>>>Note to any readers who have followed the previous 3 failures, save time as
>>>>>the below 4th effort is a total failure I'm sorry to say.
>>>>>
>>>>>Fiend james tries to find in scripture 2000 uears after the fact possible
>>>>>jw bits. All the other 19th century popup religions do likewise, sorry
>>>>>friend james, no cigar.
>>>
>>>Friend james restates his circular logic, "we are here, so there must be
>>>evidence in the previous 2000 years for the jw".
>>
>>You are forgetting the Scripture that basically says God's Word exists
>>forever. See below.
>>
>
>
>Indeed see below, *all* the 19th century popup religions say the same, jw
>just one among the crowd.>>

If another religion agrees with one of the JW doctrines, that doesn't
nullify the doctrine of the JW's.
>
>Friend james if you have failed on the question of finding jw in church
>history, equally it is a failure to find them uniquely defined in scripture
>that is any different then the 19th century crowd of popups.

You keep making the same statements over and over again. Frankly, I
get tired of repeating the same answer. Try something new.

>
>>>>As I said before, God's word always exists. It never goes totally
>>>>silent. So from the 1st century to the 19th century it existed
>>>>somewhere, at sometime. Then it became more public in the 19th century
>>>>and on to today.
>
>Sure, the question at hand has no bearing on the point that all accept.
>The question at hand is to find the jw in that "some/where/sometime", it
>just ain't there..

Here we go again. Try a new statement or question. And as I keep
saying it, God's word never dies out. Thus from the 1st century
onward, someone somewhere perpetuated them.

>>>
>>>Oh dear, friend james just gave total validity to all the 19th century
>>>popup religions,ie. mormons, christian science, advintis,christadelphians
>>>and others.. They all claim *exactly* that same reason you should join them
>>>as the one "true" religion.
>>
>>I never met a religion yet that didn't claim to be the true one. The
>>test is if they follow the Bible. For example, how many religions
>>participated in WWII? Most of them did. They each supported the
>>country they were in.
>
>Now now friend james, trying to interject > extrainious to the question
>bits is a bust from the start.

Your sounding like the old broken record. And my answer is the same.
Here it is again. Show me where it is not the truth, if you can:

-- Revised Standard
Isaiah 40:8 The grass withers, the flower fades; but the word of our
God will stand for ever.

Is there anything in that verse that you don't understand? I would be
more than happy to explain it to you. Thus God's word is not dead but
is always "ALIVE". (Heb 4:12) And was so, all through the centuries.
>
>You have just shot yourself in the foot by showing the jw don't fiffer from
>countless other anytime who accept the bible.

Being that we agree with a few doctrines, doesn't make JW's not the
true religion. You will know the true religion by its works. And who
is the ONLY religion pronouncing the good news of God's kingdom?
This would be the true religion, would it not:

- Revised Standard
Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached
throughout the whole world, as a testimony to all nations; and then
the end will come.

Grab hold of any Watchtower magazine and read the cover. It says:

"ANNOUNCING JEHOVAH'S KINGDOM".

I have asked this before, do you know what God's kingdom is that is
preached at Mt 24:14?

>
>>Thus, German Catholics were killing American Catholics and American
>>Baptists were killing German Baptists. Yet, Jesus said to love and
>>pray for your enemies. (Mt 5:44)
>>>
>Sitting here waiting until you get over that irrelevant bit. It doesn't
>still find the jw anywhere prior to the 19th century.

See above.
>
>>>Sorry friend james, the reason you are stuck having *no* evidence for the
>>>jw existing in prior church history is because there is absolutely none.
>>
>>I am not aware of ANY true Bible doctrines until the 19the century.
>
>>They existed somewhere, but apparently was not written down because
>After that display of obvious lame bitcircular logic, let's get on to a
>relevant point.

We just go round and round on this. Isa 40:8 and Heb 4:12 shows that
God's word always exists. Or don't you believe in the Bible?

>
>>>God's word lasts forever, recorded or not.
>
>Indeed, and the jw claim of being here before the 19th century finds no
>suppport in it, *none* at all.

Just the Bible Scriptures, which you seem to ignore.

>>
>>
>>>So when scripture warns us of false religions and their false teachers
>>>severall times, the jw *must*
>>> be considered as among them.
>>
>>You are thinking of Christendom, not JW's.
>
>Nope,that is a jw invented label that has no bearing on the warnings and
>doesn't excuse the jw from them.

That word "Christendom" has been around long before the JW's were
incorporated:

"By the 10th century the religious and cultural community known as
Christendom had come into being and was poised to enter a prolonged
period of growth and expansion."
(https://www.britannica.com/place/Christendom)



>>>
>>>Saying "we follow the bible and it describes us" does no good. All the
>>>popup 19th century religions do likewise, just ask them and they will have
>>>"proof" by the ton they will be happy to show you in scripture.
>>
>>Yes, they are like the 1st century Scribes and Pharisees who
>>misinterpreted the Scriptures.
>
>Smile, and the jw find nothing to excuse themselves still from the other
>popup religions in that claim, in fact it cements them all the more with
>them.

What planet have you been visiting? JW's are distinct from the other
religions claiming to be Christian. MOST of them believe in hellfire,
an immortal soul, the Trinity, all good persons go to Heaven,
Purgatory, Limbo, the cross as a symbol of Christianity, celebration
of pagan holidays such as Halloween and Easter, etc, etc. JW's do none
of the above.
>>>
>>>Btw, for you to say that 1885 years after the fact the "real" religion
>
>Friend james insertss bits here not addressing the point, snipped.

I haven't done any snipping for a cow's age.

>>>appears; is to make Christ a liar.
>>
>>Not at all. Jesus said this for the last days:
>>
>>-- King James
>>Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all
>>the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
>>
>>Just read the cover of any Watchtower magazine. It says,
>>
>>"ANOUNCING JEHOVAH'S KINGDOM"
>>
>>Do you know what that means? Please answer this time.
>>

Do you want to know what it is?

>>
>>>He said His church being established would stand even against hell and
>>>prevail. If we had to wait 1885 years for the "real deal" to popup; it
>>>means somewhere along the line the church ceased/failed and He lied to us.
>>
>>Just because it is not recorded somewhere, doesn't mean his 'church'
>>hasn't always been around. Remember, God's word will always exist.
>
>Please stop trying to avoid the point as made, it makes me embarrassed for
>you when you pull that.

Please stop ignoring my answers and repeating your same statement over
and over. Accept that we differ here, and move on.
>>>
>>>I'm guessing here, a search of the watchtower etc. archives has no answer
>
>Thus far on the jw claim to prior presense, church history 5, jw 0.

Church history 5, the Bible 100. Isa 40:8 and Heb 4:12. Oh, by the
way, have a good day, really.

servant

unread,
Nov 1, 2021, 10:59:34 AM11/1/21
to

>>For any readers still following, do yourself a time saving favor and skip
>>the frankly embarrissing effort to avoid the *real* question on table from
>>friend james. For the scorecard, skip to the last line. .
>

Friend james is of a mind:
>I avoid no questions. If you don't like my answers, that doesn't mean
>I am avoiding your questions. Any other readers following this would
>know that. I fear no questions.

Friend james, i'M so very happy you raise this response. That is how you
avoid the hard question, plug in a responce, any response just to have a
response regardless of how irrellevant to the question it really is.

The jw are taught this response behavior in classes where they are taught
what to say when a topic or question comes up. Just plug in this response
and declare it relevant.

Thatt is friend jame's problem with this question from church history. He
didn't have a relevant response to plug in because it never came up in his
"responses" clsses. Soe he goes to the online archive of watchtower and
such to find if there is a jw response written sometime in the past. To
date and multiple "response" attempts the qustion remains unanswered. His
best "response" is circular logic, 'here we are so we must have exited
during the past 1885 years" or "we follow the bible and the bible doesn't
change, so we have always existed", the latter avery very weak excuse of a
"response".

Whe in church history is there *any* evidence of the jw ever existing
before mr. russel constructed his new theory of scripture doctrines at
about 1885 years after the fact? The same as other 19th century popup
religions,ie mormon; adventist nd others? The jw use the same kind of
circular logic as the other popup religions, great company, no?


zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Nov 1, 2021, 5:20:16 PM11/1/21
to
On Sun, 31 Oct 2021 08:27:00 +1100, Lucifer

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Nov 1, 2021, 5:48:29 PM11/1/21
to
On Sat, 30 Oct 2021 14:07:49 -0700, teresita
<tere...@news.giganews.com> wrote:

>fOn Sat, 30 Oct 2021, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>
>> You are contradicting your own logic. You say that men made up God.
>> Then why would they "describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>> get anything right?"
>
>"And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good.
>And the evening and the morning were the sixth day."

Yes, that happened thousands of years ago.

>
>"And the LORD God said unto the serpent, 'Because thou hast done this,
>thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field;
>upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of
>thy life.'"
>
>Bumbling idiot.

Snakes used to have legs.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Nov 1, 2021, 5:55:31 PM11/1/21
to
On Sun, 31 Oct 2021 11:50:32 +1100, Lucifer
If you ask a question, I will answer it.

>
>>>>If anyone has any Bible questions, just ask.
>>>
>>>Sir sir! <Raises hand>
>>>Why does the bible describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>>get anything right?
>>
>>You are contradicting your own logic. You say that men made up God.
>
>I am only the messenger.

I am only a disciple of Christ.

>
>>Then why would they "describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>get anything right?"
>
>They were trying to explain the reason we are in such a mess.

Satan has pulled the wool over your eyes. Yes, Satan has you in his
grip. You are a puppet of Satan. He pulls the string and you dance.

(2 Corinthians 4:3, 4) If, in fact, the good news we declare is
veiled, it is veiled among those who are perishing, 4 among whom the
god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers,
so that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ,
who is the image of God, might not shine through.

James
understand the Bible
www.jw.org


>
>>James

Lucifer

unread,
Nov 2, 2021, 4:39:18 AM11/2/21
to
That's the sort of thing. Trying to blame a created being for the
actions of the creator won't wash. We are far more sophisticated
than the bible writers.

>James

Lucifer

unread,
Nov 2, 2021, 4:51:03 AM11/2/21
to
On Mon, 01 Nov 2021 17:48:26 -0400, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:

>On Sat, 30 Oct 2021 14:07:49 -0700, teresita
><tere...@news.giganews.com> wrote:
>
>>fOn Sat, 30 Oct 2021, zeb...@windstream.net wrote:
>>
>>> You are contradicting your own logic. You say that men made up God.
>>> Then why would they "describe God as a bumbling idiot that can't
>>> get anything right?"
>>
>>"And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good.
>>And the evening and the morning were the sixth day."
>
>Yes, that happened thousands of years ago.

When God makes something good it stays good.

>>"And the LORD God said unto the serpent, 'Because thou hast done this,
>>thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field;
>>upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of
>>thy life.'"
>>
>>Bumbling idiot.
>
>Snakes used to have legs.

The snake said, "but I already... Oh, right. You got me there."

>James

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Nov 2, 2021, 11:38:32 AM11/2/21
to
On 01 Nov 2021 14:59:32 GMT, servant wrote:

>
>>>For any readers still following, do yourself a time saving favor and skip
>>>the frankly embarrissing effort to avoid the *real* question on table from
>>>friend james. For the scorecard, skip to the last line. .
>>
>
>Friend james is of a mind:
>>I avoid no questions. If you don't like my answers, that doesn't mean
>>I am avoiding your questions. Any other readers following this would
>>know that. I fear no questions.
>
>Friend james, i'M so very happy you raise this response. That is how you
>avoid the hard question, plug in a responce, any response just to have a
>response regardless of how irrellevant to the question it really is.

Not at all. I try to answer any and all questions.

>
>The jw are taught this response behavior in classes where they are taught
>what to say when a topic or question comes up. Just plug in this response
>and declare it relevant.

Yes, JW's are prepared to answer many questions, with Scriptural
answers. You don't prepare your statements? We research when we can,
so as to give the most truthful answer.

>
>Thatt is friend jame's problem with this question from church history. He
>didn't have a relevant response to plug in because it never came up in his
>"responses" clsses. Soe he goes to the online archive of watchtower and
>such to find if there is a jw response written sometime in the past. To
>date and multiple "response" attempts the qustion remains unanswered. His
>best "response" is circular logic, 'here we are so we must have exited

>during the past 1885 years" or "we follow the bible and the bible doesn't
>change, so we have always existed", the latter avery very weak excuse of a
>"response".

You are misinterpreting what I say. I rarely go to jw.org to find
answers. Many times I use the internet to support my comment. Your
lack of knowledge about me is apparent in your above narrative.
>
>Whe in church history is there *any* evidence of the jw ever existing
>before mr. russel constructed his new theory of scripture doctrines at
>about 1885 years after the fact? The same as other 19th century popup
>religions,ie mormon; adventist nd others? The jw use the same kind of
>circular logic as the other popup religions, great company, no?

You keep on forgetting this Scripture:

- King James
Isaiah 40:8 The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of
our God shall stand for ever.

All through the centuries, someone somewhere has been copying the
Scriptures. They just blossomed out in the 19th century.

zeb...@windstream.net

unread,
Nov 2, 2021, 11:47:33 AM11/2/21
to
On Tue, 02 Nov 2021 19:39:11 +1100, Lucifer
You can prophesize the future? No? That would be a good trick. All
prophecies have come true except a few yet to be fulfilled. Sorry, but
you are not more sophisticated than the original Bible writers. God
Himself was inspiring them to write down God's words. You and others
have no advantage over them.
It is loading more messages.
0 new messages