Re: Is Jesus God? No, What about Paul?!

[Snow]

On May 10, 9:04 am, "jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com"
<jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com> wrote:


Whatever .... LOL

What’s fascinating about Paul is that he is double minded and self
serving. I once challenged a Christian to find me a doctrine preached
that Paul did not have both sides of the issue on, they said, that
Paul was the Messiah.

2Co 11:10 As the truth of the Messiah is in me..
2Co 12:9 ..that the power of the Messiah may rest upon me.
2Co 13:3 …the Messiah speaking in me
Gal 2:20 I am crucified with the Messiah: …the Messiah liveth in me
Gal 4:14 And my temptation which was in my flesh ye despised not, nor
rejected; but received me as an angel of Elohim, even as the Messiah
Yashua.

Yes, they do receive you as the Messiah.

1Co 5:4 In the name of our Master Yeshua the Messiah, when ye are
gathered together, and MY SPIRIT, with the power of our Master Yeshua
the Messiah,

They gather together IN PAUL’S SPIRIT who claimed to have ALL POWER
since all power was given unto Yeshua, Paul ALMIGHTY.

Gal 1:24 And they glorified God in me.

Really this is nothing compared to the major doctrinal errors put
forward by the Paul.

1Co 1:17 For Messiah did not send me to immerse

You would be the only one then Paul…

Mat 28:19 “Therefore, go and make taught ones of all the nations,
immersing them in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Set-
apart Spirit,

Still they will not see this or his lies:

1Co 1:14 I thank Elohim that I immersed not one of you except Crispus
and Gaios,

I thought he didn’t send you to immerse Paul?

Act 18:8 And Crispus, the ruler of the congregation, did believe in
the Master with all his household. And MANY of the Corinthians,
hearing, believed and were immersed.

Make up your mind alright... Sheesh!@ Christianity... gotta love it
or burn for eternity!

[jwshe...@satx.rr.com]

Matthew 28:19
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations,
baptizing them in the name
of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Notice: Name singular, three persons

[Snow]

On May 10, 10:51 am, "jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com"

Yes... SINGULAR is correct... The name of the Father. YAHWEH

and of the son and of the set apart spirit.

Isn't it funny how two people can see the same sentence and see a
completely different message. Thank you for pointing that out but
keep in mind that you are talking about a translation that came
throught two different languages since of course you do realize that
Yeshua spoke HEBREW In Israel and your are basing this from a latin
translation... not very accurate at all.

Fortunately, we have many of Yeshua's quotes still in Hebrew because
he quoted the OLD TESTAMENT and we still have a lot of Jewish people
that can read it every Sabbath.

Mat 4:10 Then YESHUA said to him, “Go, Satan! For it has been written,
‘You shall worship YAHWEH your Elohim, and Him alone you shall serve.’
”1 Footnote: 1Dt. 6:13.
We can see the Hebrew text quoted speaks only of YAHWEH. Christians
must run circles around the greatest command in scriptures:

Mar 12:29 And Yeshua answered him, The first of all the commandments
is, Hear, O Israel; YAHWEH is our Elohim, YAHWEH is one:
Mar 12:30 And thou shalt love YAHWEH thy Elohim with all thy heart,
and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy
strength: this is the first commandment.

Here we have a direct quote of Deuteronomy so that we can have no
doubt exactly what is said in the Hebrew:

Deu 6:4 Hear, O Israel: YAHWEH is our Elohim, YAHWEH is one:
Deu 6:5 And thou shalt love YAHWEH thy Elohim with all thine heart,
and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

It does NOT say, Jesus is our God. YAHWEH is Elohim of Elohim, a
title that can’t be ascribed to the Messiah no matter how much they
bend and twist his words.

Deu 10:17 “For YAHWEH your Elohim is Elohim of mighty ones and Master
of masters, the great Ěl, mighty and awesome, who shows no partiality
nor takes a bribe.

[Ike]

On 5/9/2013 7:27 PM, Snow wrote:
> On May 10, 9:04 am, "jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com"
> <jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com> wrote:
>
>
> Whatever .... LOL
>

> What�s fascinating about Paul is that he is double minded and self
> serving.

Oh, here we go with the Paul bashing again.

Hey, Genius: PAUL HELPED WRITE THE GOSPELS, so how could you know
anything about Jesus OTHER than what PAUL WROTE?

Ike

[Terry Cross]

Yeow. Thanks for that, Snow.

TCross

[Terry Cross]

On May 9, 11:54 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 5/9/2013 7:27 PM, Snow wrote:
>
> > On May 10, 9:04 am, "jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com"
> > <jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com> wrote:
>
> > Whatever .... LOL
>

> > What s fascinating about Paul is that he is double minded and self

> > serving.
>
> Oh, here we go with the Paul bashing again.
>
> Hey, Genius: PAUL HELPED WRITE THE GOSPELS, so how could you know
> anything about Jesus OTHER than what PAUL WROTE?

Ike, I have asked you for a source on that information. Do you have
it handy, please?

TCross

[Snow]

On May 10, 4:54 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Oh, here we go with the Paul bashing again.
>
> Hey, Genius: PAUL HELPED WRITE THE GOSPELS, so how could you know
> anything about Jesus OTHER than what PAUL WROTE?
>
> Ike

Whether Paul helped write or directly wrote the entire New Testament
does nothing to change my belief Ike. I am perfectly fine with you
believing that. Since I was not a witness to the events you speak of,
I will defer to your vastly superior first hand knowledge and give
that to you that you must be right.

Since you are correct, that means to me that his confusion is even
worse than I had originally understood since, Yeshua preached on the
Sabbath and told his people:

Mat 5:17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Torah or the
Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to complete.

Well, I'm sorry to inform you Ike but many prophesies in the old
testament simply never happened. So, clearly his mission still isn't
completed and you are sitting back waiting for them to be fulfilled...
I wouldn't want to be a resident of Damascus, the oldest city in the
world that still hasn't been destroyed... You know the one.

Isa 17:1 The message concerning Damascus. “See, Damascus ceases to be
a city, and shall become a heap of ruins.

So, you can't tell me that 'all has been completed"... it simply isn't
logical. So... You know what that means... right?

Look, you and me simply are never going to agree. So why bother
talking to me? Do you have no desire to follow the teachings of your
Savior?

Well, I probably shouldn't ask that because I pretty much already know
the answer. Look, I hope that you manage to work things out for
yourself.

I hope you remember one thing.. Paul said the greatest command was

Gal 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou
shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Now, I'm certain in some way shape or form you think your mean
spirited post are some form a demonstration of love.. I don't see it
like that so, try a new approach and stop being such a control freak.
I wish you all the best. You follow your apostle... I won't.

Take care. Be blessed.

[Ike]

On 5/9/2013 10:30 PM, Snow wrote:
> On May 10, 10:51 am, "jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com"
> <jwsheffi...@satx.rr.com> wrote:
>> Matthew 28:19
>> Go ye therefore, and teach all nations,
>> baptizing them in the name
>> of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
>>
>> Notice: Name singular, three persons
>
> Yes... SINGULAR is correct... The name of the Father. YAHWEH

And the Word proves you're a liar, antichristian.

In the following story, one person (Jesus Christ) is referred to as 1)
the man of God (which he confirms), 2) the angel of God, and 3) God, period.

And that perfectly matches what Isaiah, John, et al said...

Jud 13:
2 And there was a certain man of Zorah, of the family of the Danites,
whose name was Manoah; and his wife was barren, and bare not.
3 And the angel of the LORD appeared unto the woman, and said unto her,
Behold now, thou art barren, and bearest not: but thou shalt conceive,
and bear a son.
4 Now therefore beware, I pray thee, and drink not wine nor strong
drink, and eat not any unclean thing:
5 For, lo, thou shalt conceive, and bear a son; and no razor shall come
on his head: for the child shall be a Nazarite unto God from the womb:
and he shall begin to deliver Israel out of the hand of the Philistines.
6 Then the woman came and told her husband, saying, A man of God came
unto me, and his countenance was like the countenance of an angel of
God, very terrible: but I asked him not whence he was, neither told he
me his name:
7 But he said unto me, Behold, thou shalt conceive, and bear a son; and
now drink no wine nor strong drink, neither eat any unclean thing: for
the child shall be a Nazarite to God from the womb to the day of his death.
8 ¶ Then Manoah intreated the LORD, and said, O my Lord, let the man of
God which thou didst send come again unto us, and teach us what we shall
do unto the child that shall be born.
9 And God hearkened to the voice of Manoah; and the angel of God came
again unto the woman as she sat in the field: but Manoah her husband was
not with her.
10 And the woman made haste, and ran, and shewed her husband, and said
unto him, Behold, the man hath appeared unto me, that came unto me the
other day.
11 And Manoah arose, and went after his wife, and came to the man, and
said unto him, Art thou the man that spakest unto the woman? And he
said, I am.
12 And Manoah said, Now let thy words come to pass. How shall we order
the child, and how shall we do unto him?
13 And the angel of the LORD said unto Manoah, Of all that I said unto
the woman let her beware.
14 She may not eat of any thing that cometh of the vine, neither let
her drink wine or strong drink, nor eat any unclean thing: all that I
commanded her let her observe.
15 ¶ And Manoah said unto the angel of the LORD, I pray thee, let us
detain thee, until we shall have made ready a kid for thee.
16 And the angel of the LORD said unto Manoah, Though thou detain me, I
will not eat of thy bread: and if thou wilt offer a burnt offering, thou
must offer it unto the LORD. For Manoah knew not that he was an angel of
the LORD.
17 And Manoah said unto the angel of the LORD, What is thy name, that
when thy sayings come to pass we may do thee honour?
18 And the angel of the LORD said unto him, Why askest thou thus after
my name, seeing it is secret?
19 So Manoah took a kid with a meat offering, and offered it upon a
rock unto the LORD: and the angel did wondrously; and Manoah and his
wife looked on.
20 For it came to pass, when the flame went up toward heaven from off
the altar, that the angel of the LORD ascended in the flame of the
altar. And Manoah and his wife looked on it, and fell on their faces to
the ground.
21 But the angel of the LORD did no more appear to Manoah and to his
wife. Then Manoah knew that he was an angel of the LORD.
22 And Manoah said unto his wife, We shall surely die, because we have
seen God.
23 But his wife said unto him, If the LORD were pleased to kill us, he
would not have received a burnt offering and a meat offering at our
hands, neither would he have shewed us all these things, nor would as at
this time have told us such things as these.

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/10/2013 6:23 AM, Snow wrote:
> On May 10, 4:54 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Oh, here we go with the Paul bashing again.
>>
>> Hey, Genius: PAUL HELPED WRITE THE GOSPELS, so how could you know
>> anything about Jesus OTHER than what PAUL WROTE?
>>
>> Ike
>
> Whether Paul helped write or directly wrote the entire New Testament
> does nothing to change my belief Ike.

Because you're an antichristian demon, and it doesn't matter what the
Word says, or what the historical facts are, you're going to blaspheme
the Word until you arrive in hell...

...and then you're going to have the nerve to ask, "why?"

Ike

[Snow]

Thank you for the irony Ike. You mistake me for somebody that cares
what you think or believe. Take care and be blessed.

[Ike]

...and the fool continues along the path to perdition.

Ike

[Snow]

On May 11, 8:53 am, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:

> Snow wrote:
> > What's fascinating about Paul is that he is double minded and self
> > serving.
>

> I find no double-mindedness or anything that is self-serving
> in what he wrote -- Only zeal for Christ and his ministry.

I'm fine with that. Some people need Paul, some people don't.. I
don't, You do. I'm glad that he has added some depth into your life
IQN, the good thing is that we do not have to agree on any matter.
You are independent of my good opinion and we have one maker, on judge
and clearly it is not me.

I wish you all the best and my prayers go with you. Be blessed.

[Snow]

On May 11, 6:13 pm, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:

> Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
> Snow wrote:
> > What's fascinating about Paul is that he is double minded and self
> > serving.

> IQN wrote:
> > I find no double-mindedness or anything that is self-serving
> > in what he wrote -- Only zeal for Christ and his ministry.

> Snow wrote:
> > I'm fine with that.  Some people need Paul, some people don't.. I
> > don't, You do.  I'm glad that he has added some depth into your life
> > IQN, the good thing is that we do not have to agree on any matter.
> > You are independent of my good opinion and we have one maker, on judge
> > and clearly it is not me.
>
> > I wish you all the best and my prayers go with you.  Be blessed.
>

> You are being dishonest with the intent of your words.
>
> You bring railing accusations in one breath and blessings in
> the next. Yet when proven in error, you don't consider it
> anything to be noticed.
>
> I understand that you aren't Christian, but that doesn't give you
> license to make false accusations and wild made up lies, which
> you have consistently posted in these newsgroups over the past
> several days.
>
> I know you can do better than this - It's not hard to do.

I understand that in your in mind you believe you have proven
something and you seem to believe you have won some moral victory and
I'm fine with you believing that. It seems to me that all a lot of
you around here are good at is making accusations against each other
in some type in some type of fight for the top dogma as if your deity
is bigger than my deity.

I'm fine with whatever you want to believe because I don't care what
you believe, it has no bearing on anything.

You really should go expend your energy on somebody that cares what
you think.

[Snow]

On May 11, 11:03 pm, Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote:

> Snowjob's not a child of God

Very true. You seem to think that I care. I appreciate whatever you
want to believe and I don't agree and I'm fine with that since we do
not have to agree.

Ne blessed and thank you for the demonstration of your own character.
Your judgment of me does not define me, it defines you need to be
other peoples judges. I think the same applies to the lot of you.
I'm only informing you why you get ignored. Take care.

[duke]

Still no wisdom much less knowledge from ike.

The dukester, American - American

********************************************
Repeal Obama
You simply can't fix stupid.
********************************************

[Michael Christ]

On May 11, 9:19 pm, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
> On May 11, 11:03 pm, Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote:
>
> > Snowjob's not a child of God

Snow wrote:
> Very true.  You seem to think that I care.  I appreciate whatever you
> want to believe and I don't agree and I'm fine with that since we do
> not have to agree.

> Ne blessed and thank you for the demonstration of your own character.
> Your judgment of me does not define me, it defines you need to be
> other peoples judges.  I think the same applies to the lot of you.
> I'm only informing you why you get ignored.  Take care.

You say this but you post material ***you know*** is very provocative
and cuts to the heart of many of the beliefs here. Then your come
back is the shit you post above.

You are a snowjob, Snowy.

By the way, "take care and I appreciate whatever you want to believe".

Asshole.



Michael Christ



>

[Snow]

On May 11, 11:58 pm, Michael Christ <jesusisthelordof...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

Simply stated, if believing what you do makes you into the type of
person that you are, I have no desire to ever share your belief,
period. If you really do respecting what I want to believe, you'll do
more and talk less and you truly won't keep concerning yourself with
what other people believe and you'll take a deeper interest in what
they do as humans beings.

Talk less, do more. Love instead of being right.

[Michael Christ]

On May 11, 10:18 pm, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
> On May 11, 11:58 pm, Michael Christ <jesusisthelordof...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On May 11, 9:19 pm, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
>
> > > On May 11, 11:03 pm, Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Snowjob's not a child of God


Snow wrote:
> > > Very true.  You seem to think that I care.  I appreciate whatever you
> > > want to believe and I don't agree and I'm fine with that since we do
> > > not have to agree.
> > > Ne blessed and thank you for the demonstration of your own character.
> > > Your judgment of me does not define me, it defines you need to be
> > > other peoples judges.  I think the same applies to the lot of you.
> > > I'm only informing you why you get ignored.  Take care.

Michael Christ wrote:
> > You say this but you post material ***you know*** is very provocative
> > and cuts to the heart of many of the beliefs here.  Then your come
> > back is the shit you post above.
>
> > You are a snowjob, Snowy.
>
> > By the way, "take care and I appreciate whatever you want to believe".
>
> > Asshole.

Snow wrote:
> Simply stated, if believing what you do makes you into the type of
> person that you are, I have no desire to ever share your belief,
> period.  If you really do respecting what I want to believe, you'll do
> more and talk less and you truly won't keep concerning yourself with
> what other people believe and you'll take a deeper interest in what
> they do as humans beings.
>
> Talk less, do more.  Love instead of being right.

You were shown why you are an asshole.

Thank God for it.



Michael Christ

[Snow]

On May 12, 7:52 am, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:

> Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote:

> IQN wrote:
> > I know you can do better than this - It's not hard to do.

> Linda Lee wrote:
> > No, Snowjob really can't "do better" of his own accord. Like other
> > children of the Devil, he attacks children of God because he feels
> > inferior, and rightly so.
>
> >    But there's always the possibility God may bless him with a miracle
> >    of enlightenment.
>
> Agreed.
>
> I have seen many things in my lifetime - especially
> someone making a U-Turn in their life, because of
> some type of event. And because of this, I never
> consider anyone completely lost.
>
> There is always hope.

I find this curious. I have to admit that I don't normally read much
of what Linda post because it has always been full of accusations
against me and I've grown so use to it that I usually just ignore it.
I do admit that in the past, I've allowed myself to become ego driven
and have fallen to replies that were tit for tat but I only recently
have posted again after not posting for 3 years now. Clearly she
still holds a grudge and can't forgive... I'm fine with that too. I
forgive her and that is all that matter to me is what I do.

The point being is I wonder how any of you can consider any of my post
an 'attack' on anything any of you have stated.. I've been very clear
that I don't care what you believe when I've stated my position and I
am absolutely fine with you preaching as much Paul as you feel you
need... My position is that I don't need him.

Paul is not my messiah. I have no need to believe him either.

[Barry OGrady]

God is not God.

===========
"I see only with deep regret that God punishes so many of His children
for their numerous stupidities, for which only He Himself can be held
responsible; in my opinion, only His nonexistence could excuse Him."
-Albert Einstein

[Terry Cross]

When perfectly comfortable with one's own beliefs, one is comfortable
also with the beliefs of others. Conversely, the defenders of Paul
are often NOT comfortable with the beliefs of others.

TCross

[Snow]

On May 12, 10:37 am, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:
> On Sat, 11 May 2013 23:50:39 +0000
> Message-ID: <e6c42bdb-7df7-444c...@mq5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>

>
> Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:

> > Paul is not my messiah.
>

> No one here, has said that the Apostle Paul is the Messiah.

>
> Snow wrote:
> > I have no need to believe him either.
>

> And that is your decision. No one here is forcing you.
>
> But, if you tell Scriptural lies, then you will be proven in error,
> either by myself or someone else, for the truths' sake, and for
> the benefit of those that are reading.

This is where you stray from the doctrine of peace that was preached
by the one you claim to believe. We all interpret things in our own
way and where you might get one understanding from something, I would
probably get a different understanding of things.

Just for example, you probably think that you are "saved" because
Yeshua was murdered by Romans like some type of sacrificial lamb. I
don't.

We can both read John 3:16 and get different understanding from it.

Joh 3:16 “For Elohim so loved the world that He gave His only brought-
forth Son, so that everyone who believes in Him should not perish but
possess everlasting life.

You probably see this and say, "I believe in Jesus so I'm saved."

I see this and I say, "I believe in the teachings of Yeshua who taught
that we should partake in communion for forgiveness of sins."

Mat 26:28 “For this is My blood, that of the renewed covenant, which
is shed for many for the forgiveness of sins."

Where you see human/divine blood, I see "the blood of grapes", as
foretold by the prophet. I on the other hand know that human sacrifice
and killing innocents is a violation of the Torah, not a way around
it. But then I don't see the Torah as a curse since I don't follow
Paul. I know "the law" as you call is is compassion.

[Snow]

On May 12, 10:56 am, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
> On May 12, 10:37 am, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sat, 11 May 2013 23:50:39 +0000

> > Message-ID: <e6c42bdb-7df7-444c-94fb-0d990cee6...@mq5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>

A lot of people don't know that Thomas Jefferson removed all the books
of Paul from his version of the bible. He said:

"Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines
of Jesus. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are
twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States

He also removed most of the miracle stories and only kept the wisdom
of Christ... his pure teachings. I thought that was a good way to
proceed. He was a wise man.

[Snow]

[Snow]

On May 12, 11:40 am, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:

>
> Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:

> > A lot of people don't know that Thomas Jefferson removed all the books
> > of Paul from his version of the bible.  He said:
>
> > "Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines
> > of Jesus.  But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are
> > twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
> > Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States

>. . He was a wise man.
>
> Not so wise.
>
> He was a member of the illuminati.

LOL... Your fear is its only power child. What you resist, you
persist. You can not hold another man down, unless you remain their
with him. You must let go to rise up. Let go and Let YHWH. Oh Ye of
little faith... Be a witness, not a fable maker.

Hope this helps you in some way.. it is the only reason I post to
you. Take care and be blessed.

[Mordecai]

Whilst I am an ex-MJ and have no interest in the NT and have not even read
it for well over a decade, I do think that your understanding of Paul is at
fault.

I cannot think of a single thing in the writings of Paul which has been
used to promote Trinity.

If you are interested, I have just mocked Ike about the interpretation of
John 1:14 and the way the interpreters deliberately ... slanted ... the
interpretation to IMPLY that the word (the first part of the verse) is
actually a reference to JC (the second part of the verse.

I contend that "the word" is a reference to the giving of the law of Moses,
with a few key words ... made as in created (the word) compared to
"begotten son" second part of the verse. One is a "what" word. The other a
"who" word.
And tabernacle ... the law or JC?
And that nasty greek word "Hos" which compares - and the natural reading is
the first part of the verse is compared to the second part of the verse.
You ought to see the variation in the translations trying to reconcile this
word in the context of comparing two different glory which they proclaim
refers to the same thing.

So the translation "the word became flesh and dwelt amongst us" ... becomes
"the word was given a form and was given as a tabernacle with men ..."

And whilst I gave a half a dozen tests ... the one I mocked him with was
"And we beheld." If it is the giving the law, my people beheld and gave
witness ... it is too much, we will send Moses in our place. But if this
is JC ... who is "we" and what is the witness?

Trinity, the "true G_d from true G_d" is predicated upon a definition - the
essential, and special distinctive characteristic of a deity is that the
son of a deity is a deity ... which is proved to be true because .... the
BIBLE says you are "Not to use this definition."
You are not to compare G_d to a tree, to an animal, to a man, and by
extension, to a species."

Think of the definition. If you use a species model, then you have defined
a species as more than one. You have further defined the essential
characteristic of G_d ... and so all they are doing is to assume that there
is more than one deity, think in terms of more than one deity, conclude
that there is more than one deity ... and then try to proclaim that whilst
their entire Christian language is to be thought about in multiplicity, you
use a word game to proclaim this is actually a unity.

A verbal internal contradiction which leads to confusion.

But ... that is a little present for you.
You overlooked John chapter one ... or the actual foundation of the
beliefs about trinity. A language definition which presumes its answer.
You might ask where they found this "definition of G_d" seeing it is not in
the bible?
The answer is that the Pagans of Greece, and of Rome taught them that this
was their G_d ... a species ... and the key is procreation.
IOW they learned what their G_d is from the followers of Zeus.

Sigh ... Trinity is such an interesting deception and I ponder things about
it still - but more on the innermost drives in Jews and gentiles and the
hidden motivations within us.
But that is because I do not understand why I think the way I do. What is
my real motivation?
And this gives insight into ... not a deity ... but the way I think. WHY I
think the way I do ... what I (and others) are striving to accomplish.

Deception is a very good tool to examine this. We know something is wrong -
"WHAT IS THE ERROR" and whilst the logic is easy - the motivations are more
complicated.

But ... I was curious about your ideas on Paul.
You see Paul was in favour of the law, and taught it.
He was renown for CONSTANTLY saying he was not against the law - even
though there are only two references in the NT.
He was against Trinity and only worshiped one G_d.
He was very much against "only christians are saved."

His ideas on salvation are not represented by anyone, not the OE, the RCC
or the Protestants.
And though each of these groups has used Paul in their rejection of JC ...
the problem is not Paul but those who interpret him.

A simple example. ...
Paul who demanded jewish christians were to keep all the law, and gentile
christians were not to become Jews, keeping only the laws of Noah. As per
the book of Acts ... We are ... but you are not to be like us - you are to
do only these laws "and for all other matters, to go to the synagogue."

And one of his classic arguments, Paul speaks of Jews coming to G_d with
the law, and gentiles coming "without the law" ... and then made the
argument ... it is not the way you come which is important, it is the
rejection of the way "G_d has set for you" that is evil.

Ergo for a jew to reject the law and become a gentile to enter in as a
gentile is as evil as a gentile becoming a jew in order to enter in as a
jew.
It isn't how you come that is the issue, it is becoming something you are
not in order to enter in which is the issue.

My argument with christianity is that they have stopped Jews coming as jews
and have converted them to gentiles "in order that they get salvation" and
that there are no Jews in christianity.
The MJ's are forced to forsake their language, their law, their covenant
...

Paul did not tell the gentile christians to do this evil. Paul told them
NOT to do it.
But they still do it.

You might have to rethink Paul.
Not that I care. I am not a christian, or an MJ.

But nothing you have written about Paul up till now explains your ideas
about him.


--
Mordecai!

When words and actions disagree, believe actions.
When rhetoric and reality disagree, either rhetoric is wrong or reality is
wrong, and reality is Never wrong.

[Snow]

On May 12, 1:29 pm, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:

> Snow wrote:
> > A lot of people don't know that Thomas Jefferson removed all the books

> > of Paul from his version of the bible. =A0He said:
>
> > "Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines

> > of Jesus. =A0But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are

> > twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
> > Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States
> >. . He was a wise man.

> IQN wrote:
> > Not so wise.
>
> > He was a member of the illuminati.

> Snow wrote:
> > LOL... Your fear is its only power child.  What you resist, you
> > persist. You can not hold another man down, unless you remain their
> > with him. You must let go to rise up.  Let go and Let YHWH.  Oh Ye of
> > little faith... Be a witness, not a fable maker.
>

> Ah, there it is. Absolute denial in the face of truth.
>
> Especially when it comes to the power behind the powers.
>
> Fable maker? That's what you do; and Ridicule is what you
> resort to.
>
> Is this the best you have to offer?
>
> ---
>
> So back on topic...
>
> You have yet to show me anything that proves that Paul,
> in his letters, was contrary to the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
>
> So, I challenge you. Show me absolute proof, using Scripture.
>
> That challenge goes for anybody.

Keep in mind that you asked. I'll begin by demonstrating that Paul
was always a Pharisee teacher that Yeshua said to leave alone:

Mat 9:10 And it came to be, as Yeshua sat at the table in the house,
that see, many tax collectors and sinners came and sat down with Him
and His taught ones.
Mat 9:11 And when the Pharisees saw it, they said to His taught ones,
“Why does your Teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?”

1Co 5:11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone
called ‘a brother,’ if he is one who whores, or greedy of gain, or an
idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler – not even to eat
with such a one.

Mat 9:12 And Yeshua hearing this, said to them, “Those who are strong
have no need of a physician, but those who are sick.
Mat 9:13 “But go and learn what this means, ‘I desire compassion and
not offering.’ For I did not come to call the righteous to repentance,
but sinners.”

Act 23:6 Paul …cried out in the council, “Men and brethren, I am a
Pharisee, the son of a Pharisee.”
Mat 15:12 Then His taught ones came and said to Him, “Do You know that
the Pharisees stumbled when they heard this word?”

Mat 15:13 But He answering, said, “Every plant which My heavenly
Father has not planted shall be uprooted.
Mat 15:14 “LEAVE THEM ALONE. They are blind leaders of the blind. And
if the blind leads the blind, both shall fall into a ditch.”
Mar 8:15 And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven
of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod.


Errors of the Pharisee’s:

Mat 22:32 ‘I am the Elohim of Aḇraham, and the Elohim of Yitsḥaq,
and the Elohim of Yaʽaqoḇ’? Elohim is NOT the Elohim of the dead, but
of the living.”


Rom 14:9 For unto this Messiah died and rose and lived again, to rule
over both THE DEAD and the living.

Mark and Luke confirmed the teaching:

Mar 12:24 And יהושע answering, said to them, “Is this not why you go
astray, because you do not know the Scriptures nor the power of
Elohim?
….
Mar 12:27 “He is not the Elohim of the dead, but Elohim of the living.
You, then, go greatly astray.”

Luk 20:38 “Now He is not the Elohim of the dead, but of the living,
for all live to Him.”

How many times do we see Paul saying, "The dead in Christ"??

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout,
with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the
DEAD in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up
together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so
shall we ever be with the Lord.

It's false prophesy... you know how you can tell?

Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints
which slept arose,
Luk 23:43 And יהושע said to him, “Truly, I say to you today, you shall
be with Me in Paradise.”


Error #3

Rom 5:14 But death reigned from Aḏam until Mosheh, even over those
who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of
Aḏam, who is a type of Him who was to come.

They believe this because they do not know the prophets word:

Eze 18:20 “The being who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the
crookedness of the father, nor the father bear the crookedness of the
son. The righteousness of the righteous is upon himself, and the
wrongness of the wrong is upon himself.
Eze 18:21 “But the wrong1, if he turns from all his sins which he has
done, and he shall guard all My laws, and shall do right-ruling and
righteousness, he shall certainly live, he shall not die. Footnote:
1Similar passages in 3:18-21, 33:8-20.
Eze 18:22 “All the transgressions which he has done shall not be
remembered against him – in his righteousness that he has done, he
shall live.
Eze 18:23 “Have I any pleasure in the death of the wrong?” declares
the Master יהוה. “Is it not that he should turn from his ways, and
live?

Notice that turning from wrong ways... doing what is right the
scriptures say you have found forgiveness?

[Snow]

On May 12, 12:52 pm, Mordecai <"mldavis(please dont

spam)"@internode.on.net> wrote:

> > "Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines
> > of Jesus.  But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are
> > twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
> > Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States
>
> > He also removed most of the miracle stories and only kept the wisdom
> > of Christ... his pure teachings. I thought that was a good way to
> > proceed. He was a wise man.
>
> Whilst I am an ex-MJ and have no interest in  the NT and have not even read
> it for well over a decade, I do think that your understanding of Paul is at
> fault.

I'm fine with you believing that but as a person who has "no
interest", you sure did expend a lot of energy talking about it. I on
the other hand truly do have "no interest" and so you have wasted your
energy trying to sell it to me and I would recommend you share your
wisdom with somebody that is interested.

[Terry Cross]

The book that came to be known as the "Jefferson Bible" was not called
a "bible" by Jefferson. Jefferson also omitted the Hebrew Torah
because he considered the Jewish ideas were highly distorted and
corrupt:

"Their system was Deism; that is, the belief in one only God. But
their ideas of him and of his attributes were degrading and injurious
… Their Ethics were not only imperfect, but often irreconcilable with
the sound dictates of reason and morality, as they respect intercourse
with those around us; and repulsive and anti-social, as respecting
other nations. They needed reformation, therefore, in an eminent
degree." (Letter To Dr. Benjamin Rush, Washington, April 21, 1803,
"Syllabus of an Estimate of the Merit of the Doctrines of Jesus,
Compared with Those of Others." http://www.angelfire.com/co/JeffersonBible/jeffbsyl.html)

TCross

[Terry Cross]

Thanks, Snow. May I add to that list?

Error #4

Here is your formula for salvation, according to Jesus. Also see
Matthew 5.

Mark 10:
17 And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running,
and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I
may inherit eternal life?
18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none
good but one, that is, God.
19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill,
Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy
father and mother.
20 And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I
observed from my youth.
21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing
thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the
poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the
cross, and follow me.

However, in the mouth of Paul, the formula for salvation suffers
mightily. Here is Paul answering exactly the same question:

Acts 16:
29. Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and
fell down before Paul and Silas,
30. And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
31. And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be
saved, and thy house.
32. And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were
in his house.

Error #5

The governments and kingdoms of earth were of no interest to Jesus.

John 18:36: Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my
kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I
should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from
hence.

Paul, however, preaches that the governments of the world are agents
of the divine, setting up the brutality and the horror of Europe's
thousand years of the "divine right of kings." Romans 13:

1. Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no
power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2. Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of
God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt
thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou
shalt have praise of the same:
4. For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that
which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he
is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that
doeth evil.
5. Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also
for conscience sake.
6. For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's
ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.
7. Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due;
custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.

TCross

[Linda Lee]

On May 11, 10:52 pm, Mordecai <"mldavis(please dont

So Mordecai believes Gentiles who convert to Judaism are committing
evil. Interesting.

> It isn't how you come that is the issue, it is becoming something you are
> not in order to enter in which is the issue.

And Mordecai believes Gentile converts are not really Jews...

>
> My argument with christianity is that they have stopped Jews coming as jews
> and have converted them to gentiles "in order that they get salvation" and
> that there are no Jews in christianity.
> The MJ's are forced to forsake their language, their law, their covenant
> ...
>
> Paul did not tell the gentile christians to do this evil. Paul told them
> NOT to do it.
> But they still do it.
>
> You might have to rethink Paul.
> Not that I care.

Not to worry; he doesn't care either.

>
> I am not a christian, or an MJ.
>
> But nothing you have written about Paul up till now explains your ideas
> about him.

Because he's ignorant, and so are you.

[Linda Lee]

On May 12, 12:11 am, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
> On May 12, 12:52 pm, Mordecai <"mldavis(please dont
>
> spam)"@internode.on.net> wrote:
> > > "Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines
> > > of Jesus.  But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are
> > > twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
> > > Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States
>
> > > He also removed most of the miracle stories and only kept the wisdom
> > > of Christ... his pure teachings. I thought that was a good way to
> > > proceed. He was a wise man.
>
> > Whilst I am an ex-MJ and have no interest in  the NT and have not even read
> > it for well over a decade, I do think that your understanding of Paul is at
> > fault.
>
> I'm fine with you believing that but as a person who has "no
> interest", you sure did expend a lot of energy talking about it.

So do you, hypocrite.

>
>  I on
> the other hand truly do have "no interest" and so you have wasted your
> energy trying to sell it to me and I would recommend you share your
> wisdom with somebody that is interested.

Take your own advice. The children of God aren't interested in your
garbage.

[Snow]

On May 12, 6:11 pm, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:

> Now... you can ignore all that has been presented here
> if you wish. But, you still have not shown any absolute
> proof whatsoever.
>
> Want to try again?

A verse that many do not consider when believing Paul an Apostle is:

Mat 19:28 And Yeshua said to them, “Truly I say to you, when the Son
of Adam sits on the throne of His esteem, you who have followed Me in
the rebirth, shall also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve
tribes of Israel.

We see here that we have only Twelve “who have followed in the
rebirth” and judgment is given to them to judge the twelve tribes.
This single verse confirms by the words of the Messiah that Paul is
NOT an apostle because he had only 12.

It's confirmed again in Revelation:

Rev 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them
were the names of the TWELVE DISCIPLES of the Lamb.

But did you notice that he CLEARLY says the twelve are, "YOU" who have
followed ME in the rebirth. Matthew would have been with them and
it's confirmed in Acts:

Act 1:21 “It is therefore necessary that of -->*the men who have been
with us all the time* that the Master Yeshua went in and out among
us,
Act 1:22 beginning from the immersion of John to that day when He was
taken up from us, that one of these should become a witness with us of
His resurrection.”

Even Luke reported it in Acts that it was necessary that of the men
"who have been with us all the time". Three authors confirm the same
thing.

Act 1:26 And they cast their lots, and the lot fell on Matthew. And he
was numbered with the eleven emissaries.

So clearly Matthew was given the apostleship and not Paul. If they
believe Paul was an apostle, they don't believe Matthew, John or Luke
and the recorded words of the Messiah and Peter. Two and Three
witnesses! This is why Luke recorded 3 different accounts of Paul's
supposed transformation! The other great lie is to make it sound as
if Paul is the “apostle of the gentile”:

Act 15:7 And when there had been much dispute, Kĕpha rose up and said
to them, “Men, brothers, you know that a good while ago Elohim
(mistranslated God) chose among US, that by MY mouth the GENTILES
should hear the word of the Good News and believe.

The very fact that Yeshua spent most of his ministry in Gentile lands:

Mat 4:15 The land of Zabulon, and the land of Nephthalim, by the way
of the sea, beyond Jordan, Galilee of the Gentiles;

Luk 2:32 a light for the unveiling of the gentiles, and the esteem of
your people Israel.”

All the Apostle knew to deliver the message to the Gentiles.

Mat 12:18 “See, My Servant whom I have chosen, My Beloved in whom My
being did delight. I shall put My Spirit upon Him, and He shall
declare right-ruling to the Gentiles.

Mat 24:14 “And this Good News of the reign shall be proclaimed in all
the world as a witness to all the Gentiles, and then the end shall
come.

His final command was to go to the Gentiles:

Mat 28:19 “Therefore, go and make taught ones of all the Gentiles,
immersing them in the Name of the Father [Yahweh, the name removed
from Christian bibles 6,772 times] and of the Son [Yeshua] and of the
Set-apart Spirit,
Mat 28:20 teaching them to guard all that I have commanded you. And
see, I am with you always, until the end of the age.” Amĕn.

Unfortunately, Christians have altered the doctrine and the words of
the scriptures from the Greek to make it seem as if Paul was the only
one going to the Gentiles and that is far from the case, all of them
did. Paul's doctrine is not the doctrine put forward by any other
author in the scriptures, Luke gives 3 different accounts of his
conversion and Paul misquotes the Torah, even adding words that were
never written.

Mat 13:24 Another parable He put before them, saying, “The reign of
the heavens has become like a man who sowed good seed in his field,
Mat 13:25 but while men slept, his enemy came and sowed darnel among
the wheat and went away.
Mat 13:26 “And when the blade sprouted and bore fruit, then the darnel
also appeared.
Mat 13:27 “And the servants of the master of the house came and said
to him, ‘Master, did you not sow good seed in your field? From where
then does it have the darnel?’
Mat 13:28 “And he said to them, ‘A man, an enemy did this.’ And the
servants said to him, ‘Do you wish then, that we go and gather them
up?’
Mat 13:29 “But he said, ‘No, lest while you gather up the darnel you
also uproot the wheat with them.
Mat 13:30 ‘Let both grow together until the harvest, and at the time
of harvest I shall say to the reapers, “First gather the darnel and
bind them in bundles to burn them, but gather the wheat into my
granary.” ’ ”

Paul is the darnel... the wolf in sheep's clothing.

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's
clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Gen 49:27 Benjamin shall ravin as a wolf: in the morning he shall
devour the prey, and at night he shall divide the spoil.

Rom 11:1 I say then, Hath YHWH cast away his people? By no means. For
I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of
Benjamin.


"Where possible he (Paul) avoids quoting the teaching of Jesus, in
fact even mentioning it. If we had to rely on Paul, we should not know
that Jesus taught in parables, had delivered the sermon on the mount,
and had taught His disciples the 'Our Father.' Even where they are
specially relevant, Paul passes over the words of the Lord."
Albert Schweitzer


"Paul was the great Coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines
of Jesus."

[duke]

On Sun, 12 May 2013 02:32:55 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindag...@juno.com>

Wow, the daughter of satan speaks out.

[duke]

On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:05:27 -0700 (PDT), Snow <snowp...@eck.net.au> wrote:

>On May 12, 6:11�pm, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:
>
>> Now... you can ignore all that has been presented here
>> if you wish. But, you still have not shown any absolute
>> proof whatsoever.
>>
>> Want to try again?
>
>A verse that many do not consider when believing Paul an Apostle is:
>
>Mat 19:28 And Yeshua said to them, �Truly I say to you, when the Son
>of Adam sits on the throne of His esteem, you who have followed Me in
>the rebirth, shall also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve
>tribes of Israel.

Snow, Paul was actually #14. Matthais replaced Judas after the cross.

True, there were the original 12, like many other 12's in scripture - tribes,
pillars, etc. But "apostle" is a word with equality to "delegate". And hence
Paul became a great delegate in his travels presenting the word of God for the
next 30 years or so.

[Snow]

On May 13, 2:26 am, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:

> Thomas Jefferson and you have something in common, gross spiritual error.
>
> If you would have it your way you would destroy 2/3's of the NT as false.
> Invoking a mans name as your justification show the weakness of your
> points.
>
> In the beginning of your return here I asked a question multiple times
> which you refused to answer. Your agenda is now obvious, albeit cloaked as
> your opinion which you appear to rank highly.
>
> Why could you not just state it up front? Did you think you could introduce
> your tares easier under the guise of personal opinion?
>
> If you honestly feel this is all just your opinions, then my friend you
> have been greatly deceived and that of your own making.

You asked about an 'agenda'. An agenda by definition is something
planned out in advance. This post is a response to a question. Ask
and you will get an answer from me as you are now. Even if you don't
like my opinion it is still mine to share as I see fit with respect to
all other people.

I hope this helps you in some way shape or form and please understand
that I am fine with you believing what you want. Take care and be
blessed.

[Linda Lee]

On May 12, 11:29 am, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:
> On Sun, 12 May 2013 02:32:55 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com>

> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >On May 12, 12:11 am, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
> >> On May 12, 12:52 pm, Mordecai <"mldavis(please dont
>
> >> spam)"@internode.on.net> wrote:
> >> > > "Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines
> >> > > of Jesus. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are
> >> > > twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
> >> > > Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States
>
> >> > > He also removed most of the miracle stories and only kept the wisdom
> >> > > of Christ... his pure teachings. I thought that was a good way to
> >> > > proceed. He was a wise man.
>
> >> > Whilst I am an ex-MJ and have no interest in the NT and have not even read
> >> > it for well over a decade, I do think that your understanding of Paul is at
> >> > fault.
>
> >> I'm fine with you believing that but as a person who has "no
> >> interest", you sure did expend a lot of energy talking about it.
>
> >So do you, hypocrite.
>
> >> I on
> >> the other hand truly do have "no interest" and so you have wasted your
> >> energy trying to sell it to me and I would recommend you share your
> >> wisdom with somebody that is interested.
>
> >Take your own advice. The children of God aren't interested in your
> >garbage.
>
> Wow, the daughter of satan speaks out.

When you side with "Snow"/Snowjob, who says he is not a child of God,
you reveal yourself to be a child of the Devil yourself.

[Linda Lee]

On May 12, 5:23 pm, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:

> On Sun, 12 May 2013 02:18:15 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com>
> wrote:
>
> >> Ergo for a jew to reject the law and become a gentile to enter in as a
> >> gentile is as evil as a gentile becoming a jew in order to enter in as a
> >> jew.
>
> > So Mordecai believes Gentiles who convert to Judaism are committing
> > evil. Interesting.
>

> It doesn't matter. The NT teaches otherwise and is full truth. We are no
> better nor worse than each other in Christ.

>
> >> It isn't how you come that is the issue, it is becoming something you are
> >> not in order to enter in which is the issue.
>
> > And Mordecai believes Gentile converts are not really Jews...
>

> We aren't Jews. Get over it.
>
>

I did not say Gentile Christians were Jews.

[Snow]

On May 13, 2:12 am, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:

> On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:05:27 -0700 (PDT), Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
> >On May 12, 6:11 pm, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:
>
> >> Now... you can ignore all that has been presented here
> >> if you wish. But, you still have not shown any absolute
> >> proof whatsoever.
>
> >> Want to try again?
>
> >A verse that many do not consider when believing Paul an Apostle is:
>
> >Mat 19:28 And Yeshua said to them, Truly I say to you, when the Son
> >of Adam sits on the throne of His esteem, you who have followed Me in
> >the rebirth, shall also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve
> >tribes of Israel.
>
> Snow, Paul was actually #14.  Matthais replaced Judas after the cross.
>
> True, there were the original 12, like many other 12's in scripture - tribes,
> pillars, etc.  But "apostle" is a word with equality to "delegate".  And hence
> Paul became a great delegate in his travels presenting the word of God for the
> next 30 years or so.

You make an excellent point Duke and I stand corrected. I will have
to rethink my logic on this particular issue. Thank you for sharing.
Hope you have a brilliant day.

[Snow]

On May 13, 9:22 am, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:

> This all happened under the covenant of Law, Judaism. *Before* the cross.
> Without the shedding of the blood of the lamb the covenant could not be
> disannulled.

OK. So your deity is a cruel, sadistic deity that murders people and
lies about covenants:

Exo 31:13 “And you, speak to the children of Yisra’ĕl, saying, ‘My
Sabbaths you are to guard, by all means, for it is a sign1 between Me
and you throughout your generations, to know that I, יהוה, am setting
you apart. Footnote: 1The only sign of יהוה setting us apart, the only
sign of the everlasting covenant, is His Sabbaths, one of them being
the seventh day Sabbath. This is repeated in Ezek. 20:12 & 20.

So, he lied when he said, "everlasting' and what he really meant was
that the covenant lasted until Romans murdered his only begotten son
4000 years later or he changed his mind as is his prerogative. I'd
have to be really thankful I'm not "chosen"... All those stories about
people that die for failing to take a day off

Let's hope your deity chooses you.... I want nothing to do with your
deity that lies and murders his own children. Kills the innocent so
the murderers and thieves get front of the line because the "believed"
but for 4000 years before that gave the ax if people broke one of 600
laws.. sounds like a sick tyrant to me.

It's a good thing I don't believe in your deity.

[Snow]

On May 13, 10:03 am, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:

>I will not be a part of it any further
> for biblical reasons.
> I bear you no ill will.

Good for you Pete. It's good to see you actually practice what you
preach. Take care and be blessed. I truly wish you all the best in
return and thank you for your patient comments. I can appreciate that
we do not see eye to eye but the beautiful thing is, we do not have to
agree.

[Up from the Abyss]

"Snow" wrote:

> duke wrote:
> >
> > Snow, Paul was actually #14. Matthais replaced Judas
> > after the cross.

<snip>

> You make an excellent point Duke and I stand corrected.
> I will have to rethink my logic on this particular issue.
> Thank you for sharing. Hope you have a brilliant day.

Yet, there are the names of the twelve apostles upon
twelve foundations of the city. [cf Rev 21:14]

One was certainly not Judas, and not likely to be
Matthias who was *not* directly chosen by Jesus.
But rather was chosen by a game of chance, by
casting lots. Who faded away and not another word
was ever spoken of him.

Paul was the only other hand picked, so to speak,
by Jesus.

[Up from the Abyss]

"Pete" wrote:
> Terry Cross wrote:
> > Snow wrote:
> >>

<snip>

> This all happened under the covenant of Law, Judaism.
> *Before* the cross. Without the shedding of the blood
> of the lamb the covenant could not be disannulled.

Yes it could. By the death of all other parties.

The shedding of the blood of the lamb, does not disannul
the former, it only seals the latter for those who accept.


> This all happened after the cross, the shedding of the Lamb
> that was to be slain for the sin of the whole world. We now
> live under the new covenant, the covenant of the blood of
> Christ Jesus.

Of which, according to Jeremiah 31, what is that NC?

In Ezekiel 11, 18, 36, what is done to the heart, what
is written upon it?


> Therefore they were both right and you wrong.

Ditto to you from my perspective.

<snip>

[Terry Cross]

On May 12, 8:29 am, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:
> On Sun, 12 May 2013 02:32:55 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com>

> wrote:
> >On May 12, 12:11 am, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
> >> On May 12, 12:52 pm, Mordecai <"mldavis(please dont
>
> >> spam)"@internode.on.net> wrote:
> >> > > "Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines
> >> > > of Jesus. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are
> >> > > twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
> >> > > Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States
>
> >> > > He also removed most of the miracle stories and only kept the wisdom
> >> > > of Christ... his pure teachings. I thought that was a good way to
> >> > > proceed. He was a wise man.
>
> >> > Whilst I am an ex-MJ and have no interest in the NT and have not even read
> >> > it for well over a decade, I do think that your understanding of Paul is at
> >> > fault.
>
> >> I'm fine with you believing that but as a person who has "no
> >> interest", you sure did expend a lot of energy talking about it.
>
> >So do you, hypocrite.
>
> >> I on
> >> the other hand truly do have "no interest" and so you have wasted your
> >> energy trying to sell it to me and I would recommend you share your
> >> wisdom with somebody that is interested.
>
> >Take your own advice. The children of God aren't interested in your
> >garbage.
>
> Wow, the daughter of satan speaks out.

It seems that rumors of Linda's death were slightly exaggerated.

TCross

[Terry Cross]

On May 12, 9:26 am, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:
> On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:05:27 -0700 (PDT), Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au>
> wrote:

> Salvation was to always be to the Jew first, then the gentiles at that
> time.


This was Paul, the Pharisee's interpretation. However, we learn that
Jesus began his ministry in Galilee of the Gentiles, spending most of
his three years there, speaking to Jews and Gentiles alike without
preference or racism. Only at the end of his life did he come to
Jerusalem to condemn the Temple, confront the Sanhedrin, and die at
the hands of their wickedness.

I do believe you have permitted the misanthropic Moses to taint your
understanding of Jesus.

TCross

[Terry Cross]

On May 12, 4:22 pm, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:

> This all happened under the covenant of Law, Judaism. *Before* the cross.
> Without the shedding of the blood of the lamb the covenant could not be
> disannulled.

The passage above has nothing to do with Mosaic Law. I am afraid this
is Paul's trick to annul the words of Jesus where they do not agree
with Paul. I do not believe that Jesus lectured and preached for
three years just to have it all come to nothing at the end of his
life.

> > However, in the mouth of Paul, the formula for salvation suffers
> > mightily.  Here is Paul answering exactly the same question:
>
> > Acts 16:
> > 29.        Then he called for a light, and sprang in, and came trembling, and
> > fell down before Paul and Silas,
> > 30.        And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
> > 31.        And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be
> > saved, and thy house.
> > 32.        And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were
> > in his house.
>

> This all happened after the cross, the shedding of the Lamb that was to be
> slain for the sin of the whole world. We now live under the new covenant,
> the covenant of the blood of Christ Jesus.
>

> Therefore they were both right and you wrong.

How generous of you to say that Jesus was "right" !

> > Error #5
>
> > The governments and kingdoms of earth were of no interest to Jesus.
>
> > John 18:36:  Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my
> > kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I
> > should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from
> > hence.
>
> > Paul, however, preaches that the governments of the world are agents
> > of the divine, setting up the brutality and the horror of Europe's
> > thousand years of the "divine right of kings."
>

> Here you admit no distinction between God and Jesus.


What distinction would you like to make.


> You also infer that
> God would have put perfect people in to rule, and that they would rule as
> dictators controlling all aspects of mans life in their kingdoms. Enforcing
> His teachings over that of men and not allowing men any liberty.


That is Paul's inference, not mine. Or rather, Paul forbids us to
question our rulers. It's quite nasty in practice.


> Now if God
> allowed evil men to rule over evil men then the ruler cal limit evil
> without being called a spiritual bigot and thus civil turmoil and unrest
> would occur under a righteous ruler.


Something is lost in the text. Can you explain?

[Ike]

On 5/11/2013 9:58 AM, Michael Christ wrote:
> On May 11, 9:19 pm, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
>> On May 11, 11:03 pm, Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Snowjob's not a child of God
>
> Snow wrote:
>> Very true. You seem to think that I care. I appreciate whatever you
>> want to believe and I don't agree and I'm fine with that since we do
>> not have to agree.
>
>> Ne blessed and thank you for the demonstration of your own character.
>> Your judgment of me does not define me, it defines you need to be
>> other peoples judges. I think the same applies to the lot of you.
>> I'm only informing you why you get ignored. Take care.
>
> You say this but you post material ***you know*** is very provocative
> and cuts to the heart of many of the beliefs here. Then your come
> back is the shit you post above.

Funny...you do the same thing, antichurch antichristian.

And your satanic lies are as bad as her satanic lies of the other extreme.

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/11/2013 9:25 AM, duke wrote:
> On Fri, 10 May 2013 13:28:54 -0400, Ike <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 5/10/2013 10:21 AM, Snow wrote:
>>> On May 10, 10:42 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On 5/10/2013 6:23 AM, Snow wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On May 10, 4:54 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> Oh, here we go with the Paul bashing again.
>>>>
>>>>>> Hey, Genius: PAUL HELPED WRITE THE GOSPELS, so how could you know
>>>>>> anything about Jesus OTHER than what PAUL WROTE?
>>>>
>>>>>> Ike
>>>>
>>>>> Whether Paul helped write or directly wrote the entire New Testament
>>>>> does nothing to change my belief Ike.
>>>>
>>>> Because you're an antichristian demon, and it doesn't matter what the
>>>> Word says, or what the historical facts are, you're going to blaspheme
>>>> the Word until you arrive in hell...
>>>>
>>>> ...and then you're going to have the nerve to ask, "why?"
>>>>
>>>> Ike
>>>
>>> Thank you for the irony Ike. You mistake me for somebody that cares
>>> what you think or believe. Take care and be blessed.
>>
>> ...and the fool continues along the path to perdition.
>>
>> Ike
>
> Still no wisdom much less knowledge from ike.

...said the fool who thinks his "religion" is going to save him, while
rejecting all superior knowledge that proves he's a "religious" fool.

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/11/2013 8:56 PM, Snow wrote:

> This is where you stray from the doctrine of peace that was preached
> by the one you claim to believe.

Jesus NEVER preached a Gospel of worldly peace, Satan; in fact, He
preached THE OPPOSITE.

Unfortunately, that bit of truth blows a huge hole in your private agenda.

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/11/2013 9:03 PM, Snow wrote:

> A lot of people don't know that Thomas Jefferson removed all the books

> of Paul from his version of the bible. He said:
>
> "Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines

> of Jesus. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are

> twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
> Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States

LOL

Classic self-projection on TJ's part.

Ike

[Snow]

Clearly Ike, we interpret things differently and I'm not saying you
are wrong, I hope you understand that.

Yeshua says:

Mat 5:44 “But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those cursing
you, do good to those hating you, and pray for those insulting you and
persecuting you,"
Mat 19:19 ‘Respect your father and your mother,’ and ‘You shall love
your neighbour as yourself.’ ”

Now, I don't know about you Ike but I think I'm a fairly nice guy and
I happen to like my own company. My neighbors are all my good friends
and I would do anything for them within reason because that is how I
believe we should live our lives.. as living examples of what we
believe.

If I am to LOVE all these people, I don't see where I have any time to
hate. I believe it is my job to be the best peacemaker I can be.

You are correct to say that I have an agenda in this case.. it is to
love and be at peace.

Mat 5:9 “Blessed are the peacemakers, because THEY shall be called
sons of Elohim.

Thanks for sharing, take care and be blessed Ike.

[Snow]

On May 13, 6:24 pm, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:

> Now, with that said, the New Covenant does not nullify them,
> in any way -- BUT, if your faith is in the law, then you will be
> judged by the law. NOT, that Christians should ignore them,
> but that, in obedience to them, you should be faithful to God.
>
> God judges the inclination of your heart - if it be towards
> right or wrong -- if you hate or love Him.

This is one of the best statements that you have made but it still
means that you get to pick and choose what Torah you follow and the
reason that you believe this in my opinion is that you have been led
to believe that the Torah is a curse when in fact, the command is
COMPASSION.

That the LAW IS COMPASSION!

Gal 4:19 MY little children
1Co 4:15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet
have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I HAVE begotten you
through the gospel.
VS.
Mat 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your
Father, which is in heaven.

Mat 23:23 “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you
tithe the mint and the anise and the cumin,1 and have neglected the
weightier matters of the Torah: the right-ruling and the compassion
and the belief. These need to have been done, without neglecting the
others. Footnote:1The wording in Lk. 11:42 is somewhat different.

Deu 4:31 (For YHWH thy Elohim is a merciful El;) he will not forsake
thee, neither destroy thee, nor forget the covenant of thy fathers
which he sware unto them.

Isa 45:15 Truly You are Ěl, who hide Yourself, O Elohim of Yisra’ĕl,
Saviour!

[Snow]

“My wife and I just don’t have the same feelings for each other that
we used to have. I guess I just don’t love her anymore, and she
doesn’t love me. What can I do?”

“The feeling isn’t there anymore?” Stephen inquired.

“That’s right,” the man affirmed “and we have three children we’re
really concerned about. What do you suggest?”

“Love her,” Covey replied

“I told you, the feeling just isn’t there anymore.”

“Love her.”

“You don’t understand. The feeling of love just isn’t there.”

“Then love her. If the feeling isn’t there, that’s a good reason to
love her.”

“But how do you love when you don’t love?”

“My friend, love is a verb. Love – the feeling – is a fruit of love
the verb. So love her. Sacrifice. Listen to her. Empathize.
Appreciate. Affirm her. Are you willing to do that?”

Love is a verb. It’s an action requiring your involvement your active
participation. You cannot sit back and expect the world will serve it
to you. You cannot expect that your relationship will continue to
provide love while you’re not putting in any effort. Love has to be
earned and must be continually fought for.

Think about what you’ve done lately to earn love. What actions have
you taken?

Are YOU willing to…

1. Sacrifice. When we enter a relationship we can be overwhelmed by
the sheer amount of change that takes place. We change who we are as
people. Our lifestyle, our habits, our hobbies all change. But giving
up a part of ourselves is a sacrifice that we need to be willing to
make in order to receive something greater in return. A relationship –
a marriage, is a joint venture that requires continual work,
improvement, and commitment. If you find yourself asking “Well what
have you done for me lately?” be careful. This is certainly not in the
spirit of making a relationship work, acting as if you’re on the same
team or cultivating love in the relationship. If fact, asking this
type of selfish question is usually a deal breaker in the end.

2. Listen. I find that most men have a rather strong urge to solve the
problem when talking about any issue. I don’t mean to make this a
broad sweeping statement it’s just an observation of the men I’ve
talked to in my life. Similarly, women can be so chatty, on guard or
defensive at times, that the men can’t get a word in edgewise and when
they do we jump all over them without hearing them out. A sure fire
way to let someone know that you care about them is to simply listen.
Listen without judgement, criticism or handy hints to solving the
problem. Sometimes we all just need a quiet supportive ear.

3. Empathize. Empathy is the ability to share and understand someone
else’s emotions as if they were our own. This can have a profound
effect on the type of relationship you have with another human being –
it creates a very deep and meaningful bond. Everyone is capable of
empathy but not everyone has mastered it. Imagine what it’s like being
your partner. What do they go through? Just for a moment try becoming
the other person and truly seeing the world through their eyes. You’ll
likely get a greater appreciation for who they are, what they do, and
what they’ve overcome.

4. Appreciate. Appreciation is an expression of gratitude. When you
appreciate a loved one you are saying that they are a special and
significant part of your life. Take a minute and think of the ways you
have shown appreciation of someone you love – a spouse, a family
member or a close friend. You don’t need to buy expensive gifts or go
on extravagant holidays to show appreciation. Next time you want to
show appreciation for a loved one try simply saying thank you, spend
some alone time together, and listen to each other keeping it positive
and upbeat. Appreciation asks for nothing in return but it gives
everything.

5. Affirm. When you pay attention and focus on the ones you love most
you can tune into what makes them tick. By paying attention you can
incorporate loving actions and words into every day that affirm what
they mean to you. Affirmations include physical contact like hugging
and holding hands or running your fingers through their hair. It also
includes giving time, attention, gifts, or kind words. Your
affirmation of the one you love should not be conditional to
reciprocity (i.e. don’t wait and simply do it in return) . Relinquish
the fear of looking soft and go out on a limb and affirm your partner
FIRST. Show him that you care about the real, authentic, and imperfect
him. That you’re there for him always even as others come and go.

Love isn’t just a feeling that washes over you and lasts a lifetime.
It is a gift that requires attention, work and dedication. What you
put into that love is what you will receive back. Why not change how
you think of love today? Make the change — love is more than just a
word — love is a verb. - Stephen R. Covey

[Terry Cross]

Very good.

[Linda Lee]

On May 12, 8:09 pm, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:
> On Sun, 12 May 2013 14:40:40 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com>

> Sorry, your comment on what Mordecai said led me to a wrong understanding.


I noticed his comment because I wondered if Jews really accepted
converts to Judaism as Jews; apparently, at least Mordecai does not,
and in fact he says it's evil, which is odd because they accepted
converts even in OT times.

>
> --
> Peter
> A living Stone
> A Disciple of The Lord Jesus Christ
> Joh 13:34-35 KJV

[Linda Lee]

On May 12, 10:02 pm, "Up from the Abyss" <U...@Abyss.net> wrote:
> "Pete" wrote:
> > Terry Cross wrote:
> > > Snow wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> > This all happened under the covenant of Law, Judaism.
> > *Before* the cross.  Without the shedding of the blood
> > of the lamb the covenant could not be disannulled.
>
> Yes it could.  By the death of all other parties.
>
> The shedding of the blood of the lamb, does not disannul
> the former, it only seals the latter for those who accept.
>
> > This all happened after the cross, the shedding of the Lamb
> > that was to be slain for the sin of the whole world. We now
> > live under the new covenant, the covenant of the blood of
> > Christ Jesus.
>
> Of which, according to Jeremiah 31, what is that NC?

Specifically NOT like the old covenant given to their fathers, i.e.
the law of Moses.

Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a
new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
Jer 31:32 NOT ACCORDING TO THE COVENANT THAT I MADE WITH THEIR
FATHERS in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of
the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an
husband unto them, saith the LORD:
Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the
house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law
in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their
God, and they shall be my people.



CHRIST SAID in Matt. 7:12, "Therefore all things whatsoever ye would
that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law
and the prophets."

CHRIST SAID in Matt. 22:40, "On these two commandments hang all the
law and the prophets."

CHRIST SAID in Luke 16:16, "The LAW and the prophets were UNTIL JOHN
[THE BAPTIST - WHO PREACHED "THE WAY OF RIGHTEOUSNESS" I.E. CHRIST,
"OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS"]: since that time the kingdom of God is preached,
and every man presseth into it."

> In Ezekiel 11, 18, 36, what is done to the heart, what
> is written upon it?

NOT THE LAW OF MOSES, BUT "all things whatsoever ye would that men
should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the
prophets".

[Linda Lee]

On May 13, 3:44 am, Terry Cross <tcros...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> It seems that rumors of Linda's death were slightly exaggerated.
>
> TCross

Who was wishing for that? It seems you were the only one mentioning
it. I just didn't have the time or the inclination to suffer some of
you clowns. It's useless to show blind people the light when they
can't see it.

[Terry Cross]

On May 13, 1:16 pm, Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote:
> On May 13, 3:44 am, Terry Cross <tcros...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > It seems that rumors of Linda's death were slightly exaggerated.
>
> > TCross
>
> Who was wishing for that? It seems you were the only one mentioning
> it.

Now you know who cares and who does not. And when the event finally
arrives, who will miss you.

> I just didn't have the time or the inclination to suffer some of
> you clowns. It's useless to show blind people the light when they
> can't see it.

Your language reveals you are no more familiar with "the light" than
Ike or Michael Christ.

TCross

[Terry Cross]

The old Hebrews were interested in converts only if they were
desirable women and the Hebrews wanted to use them as slaves,
concubines, and breading mares to beget children. Otherwise, the law
of Moses was to simply slit their throats and hang them in trees for
the crows.

TCross

[Snow]

On May 14, 7:14 am, Terry Cross <tcros...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> The old Hebrews were interested in converts only if they were
> desirable women and the Hebrews wanted to use them as slaves,
> concubines, and breading mares to beget children.  Otherwise, the law
> of Moses was to simply slit their throats and hang them in trees for
> the crows.
>
> TCross

I never got that meaning from it but then a lot of things in the
translation doing make logical sense so I think for me the goal is to
keep it simple and let my light shine. In the end, what we focus on
is our choice. We can focus on what is beautiful and let our light
shine or not... I think a positive focus is helpful. Take care and be
blessed. I'll share one of my favorite quotes:

"Be so strong that nothing can disturb your peace of mind. Talk
health, happiness, and prosperity to every person you meet. Make all
your friends feel there is something special in them. Look at the
sunny side of everything. Think only the best, be as enthusiastic
about the success of others as you are about your own.

Forget the mistakes of the past and press on to the greater
achievements of the future. Give everyone a smile. Spend so much time
improving yourself that you have no time left to criticize others. Be
too big for worry and too noble for anger.

Optimism, when applied to your life, develops strength and peace
within you"
— Norman Vincent Peale

[Ike]

On 5/11/2013 9:57 PM, Snow wrote:

> LOL... Your fear is its only power child. What you resist, you
> persist. You can not hold another man down, unless you remain their
> with him. You must let go to rise up. Let go and Let YHWH. Oh Ye of
> little faith... Be a witness, not a fable maker.

...said the Babylonian whore.

2co 11:
13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming
themselves into the apostles of Christ.
14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed
as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their
works.

You demonstrate PRECISELY how the antichrist will come, saying "peace,
peace" when there IS NO PEACE.

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/11/2013 10:52 PM, Mordecai wrote:

> If you are interested, I have just mocked Ike about the interpretation of
> John 1:14 and the way the interpreters deliberately ... slanted ... the
> interpretation to IMPLY that the word (the first part of the verse) is
> actually a reference to JC (the second part of the verse.

Now cite a single legitimate scholar that ever insinuated such a thing.

> I...

There's the operative term--"I."

"I" has to find a way to get around the Word, so "I" makes up a story no
scholar in history has proffered 'cause he can't think of another way to
get around the scriptural and historical facts.

[snip the rest of the pointless diatribe from "I."]

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/11/2013 11:55 PM, Snow wrote:

> Keep in mind that you asked. I'll begin by demonstrating that Paul
> was always a Pharisee teacher that Yeshua said to leave alone:

Rhetorical bullshit.

Php 3:
4 ¶ Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man
thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:
5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of
Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
6 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness
which is in the law, blameless.
7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of
the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss
of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9 ¶ And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of
the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the
righteousness which is of God by faith:
10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the
fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect:
but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am
apprehended of Christ Jesus.

All of your Paul bashing comes from the same place that Linda Liars lies
come from--you simply HATE Jesus' Gospel of Grace, and the EXCLUSIVITY
of the thing.

> Mat 9:10 And it came to be, as Yeshua sat at the table in the house,
> that see, many tax collectors and sinners came and sat down with Him
> and His taught ones.
> Mat 9:11 And when the Pharisees saw it, they said to His taught ones,
> “Why does your Teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?”
>
> 1Co 5:11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone
> called ‘a brother,’ if he is one who whores, or greedy of gain, or an
> idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler – not even to eat
> with such a one.

There is no comparison between the "tax collectors and sinners" listed
by Jesus, and the list of ACTUAL grievous sinners given by Paul.

So the problem here is you're an illiterate idiot.

> Mat 9:12 And Yeshua hearing this, said to them, “Those who are strong
> have no need of a physician, but those who are sick.
> Mat 9:13 “But go and learn what this means, ‘I desire compassion and
> not offering.’ For I did not come to call the righteous to repentance,
> but sinners.”
>
> Act 23:6 Paul …cried out in the council, “Men and brethren, I am a
> Pharisee, the son of a Pharisee.”

Context, context, context, bitch: 1) Paul WAS a Pharisee by training and
ordination; that DOESN'T mean Paul any longer taught as a Pharisee, and
2) Paul was pitting the Pharisees and the Sadducees against one another
as demonstration that his "deviation" from tradition (as they perceived
it) was no more grievous than the "deviations" that existed between the
sects of the Jews, like the Pharisees, Sadducees, Herodians, Essenes,
Zealots, etc, etc.

> Mat 15:12 Then His taught ones came and said to Him, “Do You know that
> the Pharisees stumbled when they heard this word?”
>
> Mat 15:13 But He answering, said, “Every plant which My heavenly
> Father has not planted shall be uprooted.
> Mat 15:14 “LEAVE THEM ALONE. They are blind leaders of the blind. And
> if the blind leads the blind, both shall fall into a ditch.”
> Mar 8:15 And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven
> of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod.

And this relates to Paul how?

> Errors of the Pharisee’s:
>
> Mat 22:32 ‘I am the Elohim of Aḇraham, and the Elohim of Yitsḥaq,
> and the Elohim of Yaʽaqoḇ’? Elohim is NOT the Elohim of the dead, but
> of the living.”
>
>
> Rom 14:9 For unto this Messiah died and rose and lived again, to rule
> over both THE DEAD and the living.

Context, context, context, bitch.

In the first story, the reference is to the eternally living, like
Abraham, Issac, Jacob, as a SUBSET of the whole.

In the second story, the reference is to the two eternal states,
ESPECIALLY as it pertains to the End of the Age, when there WILL BE both
the "living" (righteous) and "dead" (unrighteous) in the earth at the
same time.

> How many times do we see Paul saying, "The dead in Christ"??

HE'S TALKING ABOUT THEIR PRESENT PHYSICAL STATE, you moron, AND THAT'S
THE WAY FOLKS WILL BE UNTIL THEIR RESURRECTION.

Not only are you a lying fraud, but you're completely stupid as well.

> 1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout,
> with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the
> DEAD in Christ shall rise first:
> 1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up
> together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so
> shall we ever be with the Lord.
>
> It's false prophesy... you know how you can tell?

It is NOT a false prophecy, you ignorant sot.

> Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints
> which slept arose,
> Luk 23:43 And יהושע said to him, “Truly, I say to you today, you shall
> be with Me in Paradise.”

THAT'S ABOUT THE FIRST RESURRECTION, you moron, NOT THE SECOND OR THIRD.

> Rom 5:14 But death reigned from Aḏam until Mosheh, even over those
> who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of
> Aḏam, who is a type of Him who was to come.
>
> They believe this because they do not know the prophets word:
>
> Eze 18:20 “The being who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the
> crookedness of the father, nor the father bear the crookedness of the
> son. The righteousness of the righteous is upon himself, and the
> wrongness of the wrong is upon himself.
> Eze 18:21 “But the wrong1, if he turns from all his sins which he has
> done, and he shall guard all My laws, and shall do right-ruling and
> righteousness, he shall certainly live, he shall not die. Footnote:
> 1Similar passages in 3:18-21, 33:8-20.
> Eze 18:22 “All the transgressions which he has done shall not be
> remembered against him – in his righteousness that he has done, he
> shall live.
> Eze 18:23 “Have I any pleasure in the death of the wrong?” declares
> the Master יהוה. “Is it not that he should turn from his ways, and
> live?
>
> Notice that turning from wrong ways... doing what is right the
> scriptures say you have found forgiveness?

Yeah. PROBLEM IS, IT NEVER HAPPENED, except in Jesus' case, therefore
THEY WERE ALL LOST, just as Paul said.

See, Ezekiel's prophecy was established to preface THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF
CHRIST, AND NO OTHERS.

Let me know when you get a clue that you don't have a clue, Whore.

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/12/2013 5:38 PM, Linda Lee wrote:

> When you side with "Snow"/Snowjob, who says he is not a child of God,
> you reveal yourself to be a child of the Devil yourself.

...says the one who told the same kind of lies for years, then simply
changed from bearing false witness against Paul to lying about what both
Jesus AND Paul taught.

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/12/2013 7:49 PM, Snow wrote:

> On May 13, 9:22 am, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:
>
>> This all happened under the covenant of Law, Judaism. *Before* the cross.
>> Without the shedding of the blood of the lamb the covenant could not be
>> disannulled.
>

> OK. So your deity is a cruel, sadistic deity that murders people and
> lies about covenants:

The "cruel, sadistic deity" wannabe is you, Snowjob, blaspheming God and
His Word with your out-of-context lies.

> Exo 31:13 “And you, speak to the children of Yisra’ĕl, saying, ‘My
> Sabbaths you are to guard, by all means, for it is a sign1 between Me
> and you throughout your generations, to know that I, יהוה, am setting
> you apart. Footnote: 1The only sign of יהוה setting us apart, the only
> sign of the everlasting covenant, is His Sabbaths, one of them being
> the seventh day Sabbath. This is repeated in Ezek. 20:12 & 20.
>
> So, he lied when he said, "everlasting' and what he really meant was
> that the covenant lasted until Romans murdered his only begotten son
> 4000 years later or he changed his mind as is his prerogative.

Your ignorance comes in lists.

1) The "Jews" of Jesus' day were not by-and-large "Israelites:"
Therefore, the covenant didn't apply to them to begin with.

2) As with all prophecies, there are Triune layers of meaning,
horizontally, vertically, and perpendicularly.

3) The Old Testament prophets spoke of a BETTER covenant to come, one
that people could ACTUAL KEEP, as opposed to the Old one which was
IMPOSSIBLE for anyone (save Jesus) to keep.

> I'd
> have to be really thankful I'm not "chosen"... All those stories about
> people that die for failing to take a day off.

God knows you weren't chosen then, now, or, in all likelihood, any time
in the future.

> Let's hope your deity chooses you.... I want nothing to do with your
> deity that lies and murders his own children.

They weren't "His children," moron; they were the children of the Devil,
JUST LIKE YOU.

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/12/2013 10:02 PM, Up from the Abyss wrote:
> "Snow" wrote:
>> duke wrote:
>>>
>>> Snow, Paul was actually #14. Matthais replaced Judas
>>> after the cross.
>
> <snip>
>
>> You make an excellent point Duke and I stand corrected.
>> I will have to rethink my logic on this particular issue.
>> Thank you for sharing. Hope you have a brilliant day.
>
> Yet, there are the names of the twelve apostles upon
> twelve foundations of the city. [cf Rev 21:14]
>
> One was certainly not Judas, and not likely to be
> Matthias who was *not* directly chosen by Jesus.
> But rather was chosen by a game of chance, by
> casting lots. Who faded away and not another word
> was ever spoken of him.
>
> Paul was the only other hand picked, so to speak,
> by Jesus.

Funny how this "atheist" keeps speaking as if he is a believer, even
declaring that "Paul was hand picked by Jesus."

How could Paul be hand-picked by Jesus if there is no God, and Paul was
selected by Jesus AFTER HE DIED, atheist?

(Even your lies don't make sense, moron.)

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/13/2013 12:42 AM, Pete wrote:

> On Sun, 12 May 2013 19:02:50 -0700, Up from the Abyss <U...@Abyss.net> wrote:
>
>> "Pete" wrote:
>>> Terry Cross wrote:
>>>> Snow wrote:
>>>>>
>>
>> <snip>
>>

>>> This all happened under the covenant of Law, Judaism.
>>> *Before* the cross. Without the shedding of the blood
>>> of the lamb the covenant could not be disannulled.
>>

>> Yes it could. By the death of all other parties.
>>
>> The shedding of the blood of the lamb, does not disannul
>> the former, it only seals the latter for those who accept.

[snip the whole pointless diatribe based on a spurious book, Hebrews]

Ike

[Ike]

On 5/13/2013 9:58 AM, Snow wrote:
> On May 13, 9:00 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 5/11/2013 8:56 PM, Snow wrote:
>>
>>> This is where you stray from the doctrine of peace that was preached
>>> by the one you claim to believe.
>>
>> Jesus NEVER preached a Gospel of worldly peace, Satan; in fact, He
>> preached THE OPPOSITE.
>>
>> Unfortunately, that bit of truth blows a huge hole in your private agenda.
>>
>> Ike
>
> Clearly Ike, we interpret things differently and I'm not saying you
> are wrong, I hope you understand that.
>
> Yeshua says:
>
> Mat 5:44 “But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those cursing
> you, do good to those hating you, and pray for those insulting you and
> persecuting you,"

Yes, but you DON'T agree with their non-Christian religion, to whit...

Mt 10:
34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send
peace, but a sword.
35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the
daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother
in law.
36 And a man’s foes shall be they of his own household.
37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me:
and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not
worthy of me.
39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life
for my sake shall find it.
40 He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me
receiveth him that sent me.
41 He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet shall receive a
prophet’s reward; and he that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a
righteous man shall receive a righteous man’s reward.
42 And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a
cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you,
he shall in no wise lose his reward.

> Mat 19:19 ‘Respect your father and your mother,’ and ‘You shall love
> your neighbour as yourself.’ ”

Same thing.

> Now, I don't know about you Ike but I think I'm a fairly nice guy and
> I happen to like my own company. My neighbors are all my good friends
> and I would do anything for them within reason because that is how I
> believe we should live our lives.. as living examples of what we
> believe.

And I do the same; but I DON'T hedge the Truth because it's inconvenient.

> If I am to LOVE all these people, I don't see where I have any time to
> hate. I believe it is my job to be the best peacemaker I can be.

And here is the pitfall: The "peacemaker" of the Gospel is one who
reconciliates man to God, NOT MAN TO MAN.

That's the difference between the false "peace" of the adversaries and
the true peace of the Gospel.

> You are correct to say that I have an agenda in this case.. it is to
> love and be at peace.
>
> Mat 5:9 “Blessed are the peacemakers, because THEY shall be called
> sons of Elohim.

Wrong kind of "peacemaker."

Satan's "peacemaking" (which hides the hidden personal agenda)...

Da 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in
his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall
destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but
he shall be broken without hand.

Jesus' kind of peacemaking...

Jn 14:
27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world
giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it
be afraid.
28 ¶ Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto
you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the
Father: for my Father is greater than I.
29 And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is
come to pass, ye might believe.

Ike

[Terry Cross]

Remember why Jehovah kicked Saul's butt? Saul failed to kill Agag.
Not convert -- kill. Kill kill kill for a hundred generations from
Moses through David and into the 613 laws of Maimonides.

Destroy the seven Canaanite nations — Deut. 20:17
Not to let any of them remain alive — Deut. 20:16
Wipe out the descendants of Amalek — Deut. 25:19

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/613_commandments

I am doing an unkindness to people to fail to mention that the "Good
Book" is NOT a good book, but a source of evil and a sepsis on the
culture of humanity.

TCross

[Snow]

Jas 4:11 Brothers, do not speak against one another. He that speaks
against a brother and judges his brother, speaks against Torah and
judges Torah. And if you judge Torah, you are not a doer of Torah but
a judge.
Jas 4:12 There is one Lawgiver and Judge, who is able to save and to
destroy. Who are you to judge another?

The way I see it Ike, you got the bases covered coming and going and
you leave no room for actually obeying Yeshua by your belief and I'll
demonstrate why it is that way IN MY GOOD OPNION that is independent
of your good opinion.

Mat 5:9 “Blessed are the peacemakers, because THEY shall be called
sons of Elohim."

The master never specified what would be the fruit of our making
peace, only that we are to be PEACEMAKERS. That we are to LOVE our
enemies and TURN the other cheek is how we demonstrate our faith, is
something I believe for myself and doesn't require that I satisfy your
expectations Ike only that I submit you may just be right but it could
ALSO be:

Isa 2:3 And many peoples shall come and say, “Come, and let us go up
to the mountain of יהוה, to the House of the Elohim of Yaʽaqoḇ, and
let Him teach1 us His ways1, and let us walk in His paths1, for out of
Tsiyon comes forth the Torah1, and the Word1 of יהוה from
Yerushalayim.” Footnote: 1His ways, His paths, the teaching and the
Word of יהוה are used synonymously.
Isa 2:4 And He shall judge between the nations, and shall reprove many
peoples. And they shall beat their swords into ploughshares, and their
spears into pruning hooks. Nation shall not lift up sword against
nation, neither teach battle any more.

Mine is not the one to determine beforehand or PROPHESY as you are
doing, Servants don't always know the outcome of their actions but
what I do know is that Yeshua himself taught us to serve one another
in peace.

You may not like that Ike and I don't think you have to agree with
me. I believe my course is of my Father and in that way, I have have
been told to be HUMBLE, looking to serve and deal compassion where
ever possible. To boldly ask, How may I be of service because I was
created in the image of the creator... Every seed has a forest of
potential and mine is not called to be a judge but a doing of
kindness.

Love Always
Snow

http://www.facebook.com/clickworldpeace

[duke]

On Mon, 13 May 2013 09:14:51 -0700 (PDT), Snow <snowp...@eck.net.au> wrote:

>�My wife and I just don�t have the same feelings for each other that

>we used to have. I guess I just don�t love her anymore, and she
>doesn�t love me. What can I do?�
>
>�The feeling isn�t there anymore?� Stephen inquired.
>
>�That�s right,� the man affirmed �and we have three children we�re
>really concerned about. What do you suggest?�
>
>�Love her,� Covey replied
>
>�I told you, the feeling just isn�t there anymore.�
>
>�Love her.�
>
>�You don�t understand. The feeling of love just isn�t there.�
>
>�Then love her. If the feeling isn�t there, that�s a good reason to
>love her.�
>
>�But how do you love when you don�t love?�
>
>�My friend, love is a verb. Love � the feeling � is a fruit of love
>the verb. So love her. Sacrifice. Listen to her. Empathize.
>Appreciate. Affirm her. Are you willing to do that?�
>
>Love is a verb. It�s an action requiring your involvement your active
>participation. You cannot sit back and expect the world will serve it
>to you. You cannot expect that your relationship will continue to
>provide love while you�re not putting in any effort. Love has to be
>earned and must be continually fought for.
>
>Think about what you�ve done lately to earn love. What actions have
>you taken?

Great post.

The dukester, American - American

********************************************
Repeal Obama
You simply can't fix stupid.
********************************************

[Terry Cross]

On May 14, 11:21 am, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:

Isn't that bizarre? The Catholic and the Syncretist understand Jesus
better than the Christians. :-)

TCross

[Terry Cross]

On May 14, 1:54 pm, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:
> On Mon, 13 May 2013 11:29:30 -0700 (PDT), Terry Cross

>
>  Love has to be earned and must be continually fought for.

> He said.
>
> If love is unlocking the cage and setting the bird free

It is much more than that.

> then where does the
> fight come in?

You have to kill people who don't believe you love them, right? :-)

TCross

[duke]

On Mon, 13 May 2013 06:58:32 -0400, Ike <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On 5/11/2013 9:25 AM, duke wrote:
>> On Fri, 10 May 2013 13:28:54 -0400, Ike <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 5/10/2013 10:21 AM, Snow wrote:
>>>> On May 10, 10:42 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 5/10/2013 6:23 AM, Snow wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On May 10, 4:54 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Oh, here we go with the Paul bashing again.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hey, Genius: PAUL HELPED WRITE THE GOSPELS, so how could you know
>>>>>>> anything about Jesus OTHER than what PAUL WROTE?
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ike
>>>>>
>>>>>> Whether Paul helped write or directly wrote the entire New Testament
>>>>>> does nothing to change my belief Ike.
>>>>>
>>>>> Because you're an antichristian demon, and it doesn't matter what the
>>>>> Word says, or what the historical facts are, you're going to blaspheme
>>>>> the Word until you arrive in hell...
>>>>>
>>>>> ...and then you're going to have the nerve to ask, "why?"
>>>>>
>>>>> Ike
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for the irony Ike. You mistake me for somebody that cares
>>>> what you think or believe. Take care and be blessed.
>>>
>>> ...and the fool continues along the path to perdition.
>>>
>>> Ike
>>
>> Still no wisdom much less knowledge from ike.
>
>...said the fool who thinks his "religion" is going to save him, while
>rejecting all superior knowledge that proves he's a "religious" fool.

ONe thing I don't have to worry about is your superior scripture knowledge to
me, ike. I've seen that you are a lost fool.

[Linda Lee]

On May 13, 5:08 pm, Terry Cross <tcros...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On May 13, 1:16 pm, Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com> wrote:
>
> > On May 13, 3:44 am, Terry Cross <tcros...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > It seems that rumors of Linda's death were slightly exaggerated.
>
> > > TCross
>
> > Who was wishing for that? It seems you were the only one mentioning
> > it.
>
> Now you know who cares and who does not. And when the event finally
> arrives, who will miss you.

If you're saying you'd miss me if I disappeared, that is very nice,
but perplexing to me, as I don't see that you've gained anything from
'knowing' me.

[Linda Lee]

On May 13, 9:50 pm, Ike <xhermaneicklebe...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 5/12/2013 5:38 PM, Linda Lee wrote:
>
> > When you side with "Snow"/Snowjob, who says he is not a child of God,
> > you reveal yourself to be a child of the Devil yourself.
>
> ...says the one who told the same kind of lies for years, then simply
> changed from bearing false witness against Paul

I freely admit I was wrong about Paul in the past, and while I yet
was, I said several times that if I ever was led to believe I had been
wrong, I would admit it here publicly on the ngs where I had publicly
cut him down. And I did. Only unChristian people like you hold it
against me and aren't just glad I realized my mistaken understanding.
I think God led me through all of it, because some people claim Paul
established Christianity, and I was proof that even though I rejected
Paul, I never rejected Christ and that Christ's Gospel was complete in
itself.

>
> to lying about what both
> Jesus AND Paul taught.
>
> Ike

I don't lie about what Christ and Jesus taught; neither taught
believers were to adhere to the law of Moses; both taught those who
walked in the Spirit would exhibit love of their neighbor/fellow man.
You're just irritated that I point out that Christ knows a false
believer with evil in his heart towards his fellow man.

[duke]

On Tue, 14 May 2013 11:49:26 -0700 (PDT), Terry Cross <tcro...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

The Catholic is the original Christian of Jesus Christ.

[Snow]

On May 16, 2:14 am, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 14 May 2013 11:49:26 -0700 (PDT), Terry Cross <tcros...@hotmail.com>

Dear friend, follow the spirit not the ego. Love knows no borders,
only those we ourselves make.

[duke]

On Sun, 12 May 2013 16:22:28 -0700 (PDT), Snow <snowp...@eck.net.au> wrote:

>On May 13, 2:12 am, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:05:27 -0700 (PDT), Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
>> >On May 12, 6:11 pm, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:
>>
>> >> Now... you can ignore all that has been presented here
>> >> if you wish. But, you still have not shown any absolute
>> >> proof whatsoever.
>>
>> >> Want to try again?
>>
>> >A verse that many do not consider when believing Paul an Apostle is:
>>
>> >Mat 19:28 And Yeshua said to them, Truly I say to you, when the Son
>> >of Adam sits on the throne of His esteem, you who have followed Me in
>> >the rebirth, shall also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve
>> >tribes of Israel.

>>
>> Snow, Paul was actually #14.  Matthais replaced Judas after the cross.
>>

>> True, there were the original 12, like many other 12's in scripture - tribes,
>> pillars, etc.  But "apostle" is a word with equality to "delegate".  And hence
>> Paul became a great delegate in his travels presenting the word of God for the
>> next 30 years or so.

>
>You make an excellent point Duke and I stand corrected. I will have
>to rethink my logic on this particular issue. Thank you for sharing.
>Hope you have a brilliant day.

Have a good day.

[duke]

On Sun, 12 May 2013 19:02:27 -0700, "Up from the Abyss" <U...@Abyss.net> wrote:

>
>"Snow" wrote:

>> duke wrote:
>> >
>> > Snow, Paul was actually #14. Matthais replaced Judas
>> > after the cross.
>

><snip>

>
>> You make an excellent point Duke and I stand corrected.
>> I will have to rethink my logic on this particular issue.
>> Thank you for sharing. Hope you have a brilliant day.
>

>Yet, there are the names of the twelve apostles upon
>twelve foundations of the city. [cf Rev 21:14]
>
>One was certainly not Judas, and not likely to be
>Matthias who was *not* directly chosen by Jesus.
>But rather was chosen by a game of chance, by
>casting lots. Who faded away and not another word
>was ever spoken of him.
>
>Paul was the only other hand picked, so to speak,
>by Jesus.

God speaks his way. Matthias was chosen by lot just like Joseph, a 91+ year
old, was chosen by lot to accompany the Virgin and pregnant Mary to Bethlehem.

[duke]

On Mon, 13 May 2013 21:59:04 -0400, Ike <xhermanei...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On 5/12/2013 10:02 PM, Up from the Abyss wrote:
>> "Snow" wrote:
>>> duke wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Snow, Paul was actually #14. Matthais replaced Judas
>>>> after the cross.
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>> You make an excellent point Duke and I stand corrected.
>>> I will have to rethink my logic on this particular issue.
>>> Thank you for sharing. Hope you have a brilliant day.
>>
>> Yet, there are the names of the twelve apostles upon
>> twelve foundations of the city. [cf Rev 21:14]
>>
>> One was certainly not Judas, and not likely to be
>> Matthias who was *not* directly chosen by Jesus.
>> But rather was chosen by a game of chance, by
>> casting lots. Who faded away and not another word
>> was ever spoken of him.
>>
>> Paul was the only other hand picked, so to speak,
>> by Jesus.

>Funny how this "atheist" keeps speaking as if he is a believer, even
>declaring that "Paul was hand picked by Jesus."

You're allowed to speak too and you sure don't know the Word of God.

>How could Paul be hand-picked by Jesus if there is no God, and Paul was
>selected by Jesus AFTER HE DIED, atheist?
>
>(Even your lies don't make sense, moron.)
>
>Ike
>
>
>

[duke]

On Mon, 13 May 2013 10:18:52 -0700, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:

>On Mon, 13 May 2013 01:46:41 -0700 (PDT), Terry Cross
><tcro...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
>> On May 12, 9:26�am, Pete <n...@nya.biz> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 12 May 2013 03:05:27 -0700 (PDT), Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On May 12, 6:11�pm, iqn...@noemail.com wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Now... you can ignore all that has been presented here
>>>>> if you wish. But, you still have not shown any absolute
>>>>> proof whatsoever.
>>>
>>>>> Want to try again?
>>>
>>>> A verse that many do not consider when believing Paul an Apostle is:
>>>
>>>> Mat 19:28 And Yeshua said to them, �Truly I say to you, when the Son
>>>> of Adam sits on the throne of His esteem, you who have followed Me in
>>>> the rebirth, shall also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve
>>>> tribes of Israel.
>>>

>>>> We see here that we have only Twelve �who have followed in the
>>>> rebirth� and judgment is given to them to judge the twelve tribes.
>>>> This single verse confirms by the words of the Messiah that Paul is
>>>> NOT an apostle because he had only 12.
>>>
>>>> It's confirmed again in Revelation:
>>>
>>>> Rev 21:14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them
>>>> were the names of the TWELVE DISCIPLES of the Lamb.
>>>
>>>> But did you notice that he CLEARLY says the twelve are, "YOU" who have
>>>> followed ME in the rebirth. �Matthew would have been with them and
>>>> it's confirmed in Acts:
>>>
>>>> Act 1:21 �It is therefore necessary that of -->*the men who have been
>>>> with us all the time* that the Master Yeshua went in and out among
>>>> us,
>>>> Act 1:22 beginning from the immersion of John to that day when He was
>>>> taken up from us, that one of these should become a witness with us of
>>>> His resurrection.�
>>>
>>>> Even Luke reported it in Acts that it was necessary that of the men
>>>> "who have been with us all the time". Three authors confirm the same
>>>> thing.
>>>
>>>> Act 1:26 And they cast their lots, and the lot fell on Matthew. And he
>>>> was numbered with the eleven emissaries.
>>>
>>>> So clearly Matthew was given the apostleship and not Paul. �If they
>>>> believe Paul was an apostle, they don't believe Matthew, John or Luke
>>>> and the recorded words of the Messiah and Peter. Two and Three
>>>> witnesses! �This is why Luke recorded 3 different accounts of Paul's
>>>> supposed transformation! �The other great lie is to make it sound as
>>>> if Paul is the �apostle of the gentile�:
>>>
>>>> Act 15:7 And when there had been much dispute, K?pha rose up and said
>>>> to them, �Men, brothers, you know that a good while ago Elohim
>>>> (mistranslated God) chose among US, that by MY mouth the GENTILES
>>>> should hear the word of the Good News and believe.
>>>
>>> Salvation was to always be to the Jew first, then the gentiles at that
>>> time.
>>
>> This was Paul, the Pharisee's interpretation. However, we learn that
>> Jesus began his ministry in Galilee of the Gentiles, spending most of
>> his three years there, speaking to Jews and Gentiles alike without
>> preference or racism. Only at the end of his life did he come to
>> Jerusalem to condemn the Temple, confront the Sanhedrin, and die at
>> the hands of their wickedness.
>>
>> I do believe you have permitted the misanthropic Moses to taint your
>> understanding of Jesus.
>>
>> TCross
>
>Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent out and commanded them, saying: "Do not
>go into the way of the Gentiles, and do not enter a city of the Samaritans.
>Mat 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
>Mat 10:7 And as you go, preach, saying, 'The kingdom of heaven is at
>hand.'
>Mat 10:8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out
>demons. Freely you have received, freely give.
>Mat 10:9 Provide neither gold nor silver nor copper in your money belts,
>
>There is a lot you should learn about Israel at that time. The Samarians
>where those that we Jews who married outside of the 12 tribes while in
>captivity which was forbidden.

"We Jews"?

>Yet in any event you can see where the to the Jew first came from, and it
>was Jesus.

[duke]

On Sun, 12 May 2013 14:38:00 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindag...@juno.com>
wrote:

>On May 12, 11:29 am, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 May 2013 02:32:55 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindagirl...@juno.com>
>> wrote:

>> >On May 12, 12:11 am, Snow <snowpheo...@eck.net.au> wrote:
>> >> On May 12, 12:52 pm, Mordecai <"mldavis(please dont
>>
>> >> spam)"@internode.on.net> wrote:
>> >> > > "Paul was the great coryphaeus, and first corrupter of the doctrines
>> >> > > of Jesus. But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are
>> >> > > twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
>> >> > > Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the Untied States
>>
>> >> > > He also removed most of the miracle stories and only kept the wisdom
>> >> > > of Christ... his pure teachings. I thought that was a good way to
>> >> > > proceed. He was a wise man.
>>
>> >> > Whilst I am an ex-MJ and have no interest in the NT and have not even read
>> >> > it for well over a decade, I do think that your understanding of Paul is at
>> >> > fault.
>>
>> >> I'm fine with you believing that but as a person who has "no
>> >> interest", you sure did expend a lot of energy talking about it.
>>
>> >So do you, hypocrite.
>>
>> >> I on
>> >> the other hand truly do have "no interest" and so you have wasted your
>> >> energy trying to sell it to me and I would recommend you share your
>> >> wisdom with somebody that is interested.
>>
>> >Take your own advice. The children of God aren't interested in your
>> >garbage.
>>
>> Wow, the daughter of satan speaks out.

>When you side with "Snow"/Snowjob, who says he is not a child of God,
>you reveal yourself to be a child of the Devil yourself.

Are you judging me?

[duke]

On Mon, 13 May 2013 13:16:21 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindag...@juno.com>
wrote:

>On May 13, 3:44�am, Terry Cross <tcros...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> It seems that rumors of Linda's death were slightly exaggerated.
>>
>> TCross
>
>
>Who was wishing for that? It seems you were the only one mentioning

>it. I just didn't have the time or the inclination to suffer some of

>you clowns. It's useless to show blind people the light when they
>can't see it.

Then how do you know where to point it?

[Snow]

Ironically, I think you were right and have nothing to apologize
about. I think what you missed was that message within the GOOD
SAMARITAN. Did the man in the story worry himself over what other
people believed?? Take a moment with me to read the story:

Luk 10:30 And replying, יהושע said, “A certain man was going down from
Jerusalem to Jerico, and fell among robbers, who, both stripping and
beating him, went away, leaving him half dead.
Luk 10:31 “And by a coincidence a certain PRIEST was going down that
way. And when he saw him, he passed by on the other side.
Luk 10:32 “And likewise a Lĕwite also, when he came to the place, and
seeing, passed by on the other side.
Luk 10:33 “But a certain Samaritan, journeying, came upon him. And
when he saw him, he had **compassion** on him,
Luk 10:34 and he went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil
and wine. And having placed him on his own beast, he brought him to an
inn, and looked after him.
Luk 10:35 “And going out on the next day, he took out two pieces of
silver, gave them to the innkeeper, and said to him, ‘Look after him,
and whatever more you spend I shall repay you when I return.’
Luk 10:36 “Who, then, of these three, do you think, was neighbour1 to
him who fell among the robbers?”

What Is Compassion?

Compassion literally means “to suffer together.” Among emotion
researchers, it is defined as the feeling that arises when you are
confronted with another’s suffering and feel motivated to relieve that
suffering.

Now ask ourselves each and everytime we post... Are you posting to
demonstrate the COMPASSION that is within you? Are you posting to
HELP somebody down the road? Or... are you posting to prove something
you believe for yourself?

I believe you post to help other people and I think you are capable of
great things. Life is to short to waste it in friction when you can
be gathering momentum... Let go of yesterday.... LIVE OUT OF YOUR
IMAGINATION... Live by spirit.. Not your history.

Take care and be blessed. Be the living stone example of compassion
that I know is you.

[duke]

Haahaahaa. Ike is speechless. He can't get over that Hebrews is canonized NT
scripture.

[duke]

>Dear friend, follow the spirit not the ego. Love knows no borders,
>only those we ourselves make.

That is the spirit.

[duke]

On Sun, 12 May 2013 14:38:00 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindag...@juno.com>
wrote:

>On May 12, 11:29 am, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:

>When you side with "Snow"/Snowjob, who says he is not a child of God,
>you reveal yourself to be a child of the Devil yourself.

As far as I know, snow is Jewish, or something akin to that. I've seen snow
speak on love of God and love of neighbor, but I've never seen you even
acknowledge such words in the bible. That's why I see snow as a better
Christian than you are.

[duke]

On Mon, 13 May 2013 12:54:25 -0700 (PDT), Linda Lee <lindag...@juno.com>
wrote:

>On May 12, 10:02 pm, "Up from the Abyss" <U...@Abyss.net> wrote:
>> "Pete" wrote:
>> > Terry Cross wrote:
>> > > Snow wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> > This all happened under the covenant of Law, Judaism.
>> > *Before* the cross.  Without the shedding of the blood
>> > of the lamb the covenant could not be disannulled.
>>
>> Yes it could.  By the death of all other parties.
>>
>> The shedding of the blood of the lamb, does not disannul
>> the former, it only seals the latter for those who accept.
>>

>> > This all happened after the cross, the shedding of the Lamb
>> > that was to be slain for the sin of the whole world. We now
>> > live under the new covenant, the covenant of the blood of
>> > Christ Jesus.
>>
>> Of which, according to Jeremiah 31, what is that NC?
>
>Specifically NOT like the old covenant given to their fathers, i.e.
>the law of Moses.
>
>Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a
>new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
>Jer 31:32 NOT ACCORDING TO THE COVENANT THAT I MADE WITH THEIR
>FATHERS in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of
>the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an
>husband unto them, saith the LORD:
>Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the
>house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law
>in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their
>God, and they shall be my people.
>
>
>
>CHRIST SAID in Matt. 7:12, "Therefore all things whatsoever ye would
>that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law
>and the prophets."
>
>CHRIST SAID in Matt. 22:40, "On these two commandments hang all the
>law and the prophets."
>
>CHRIST SAID in Luke 16:16, "The LAW and the prophets were UNTIL JOHN
>[THE BAPTIST - WHO PREACHED "THE WAY OF RIGHTEOUSNESS" I.E. CHRIST,
>"OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS"]: since that time the kingdom of God is preached,
>and every man presseth into it."

Matthew 22:37-40 (New International Version)
37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all
your soul and with all your mind.’[a] 38 This is the first and greatest
commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[b]
40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

So, linda, where did the 10 commandments disappear to?