info
Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss
Orthodox not interested in reunion with Rome | National Catholic Reporter
32 views
Skip to first unread message
vjp...@at.biostrategist.dot.dot.com
Jun 8, 2017, 4:35:31 PM6/8/17
to
https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/faith-and-justice/orthodox-not-interested-reunion-rome
[50]Thomas Reese | Jun. 1, 2017 [51]Faith and Justice
When it comes to theology, the Catholic Church and the Orthodox
churches are very close. We accept the same Nicene Creed, we recognize
each other's priestly and episcopal ordinations, as well as the
sacraments of baptism, confession and Eucharist. Catholic and Orthodox
teaching on morals are also quite compatible, with both being more
conservative than their Protestant colleagues.
The touchy issue has always been the role of the papacy, but Pope John
Paul II invited a worldwide dialogue on this topic, showing that the
Vatican is open to a less intrusive role for the pope in the Eastern
churches than in the West. There were even attempts to resurrect the
title of patriarch of the West for the bishop of Rome, in order to
distinguish his robust role in the Western church from his role in the
East.
Rome is very much interested in improved relations with the Orthodox.
It is deferential to Orthodox feelings. For example, the pope will not
visit a country where a majority of the population is Orthodox without
an invitation from the Orthodox church. An invitation from the
political leadership is not sufficient.
Rome has constantly reached out to the Orthodox churches, especially to
the patriarchs of Constantinople and Moscow. Relations with the
patriarch of Constantinople have improved significantly since the
Jerusalem meeting of Pope Paul VI with Patriarch Athenagoras in 1964
and lifting of mutual excommunications in 1965. Popes and the
ecumenical patriarch meet so frequently that it is now hardly
newsworthy.
It took much longer for a pope to meet with the Russian patriarch,
which finally occurred in Cuba last year. The meeting between Francis
and Patriarch Kirill of Moscow was probably as much a reward to the
pope for his opposition to President Barack Obama's threat to bomb
Syria as it was a show of ecumenical progress.
The Vatican has continued to mute its criticism of Russia in Syria and
Ukraine lest it upset it budding relationship with Kirill, who is
closely aligned with Vladimir Putin.
In ecumenical circles, it was always presumed that Catholics and
Orthodox would find their way to communion long before Catholics and
Protestants did. Some Catholic bishops even wanted to open our
Eucharist to Orthodox Christians, but backed down quickly when Orthodox
bishops objected.
The honest truth is that the Orthodox bishops are not really interested
in reunion.
Thanks to a new [57]survey of religion in Eastern Europe, we now know
that it is not just the Orthodox bishops who are not interested in
reunion. The Pew Research Center found that "few Orthodox Christians in
the region say the two churches should be in communion again, including
as few as 17% in Russia and 19% in Georgia who favor reuniting with the
Catholic Church."
In countries where there are significant numbers of both Catholics and
Orthodox, the Catholics are much more interested in communion than
Orthodox. According to Pew, "In Ukraine, for example, about
three-quarters (74%) of Catholics favor reunification of Roman
Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy, a view held by only about one-third
(34%) of the country's Orthodox population."
The divide appears to go far beyond reunion. Only 56 percent of
Ukrainian Orthodox would accept a Catholic into their family. Again,
Catholics are more ecumenical, with 92 percent saying they would accept
an Orthodox Christian in their family.
[58]Among both Orthodox and Catholics, some hesitation about accepting
the other as a family member-[59][PF.05.10.2017_CE.europe-00-02.png]
This is not good news for ecumenists. It shows that although
theologians may issue consensus papers and bishops may issue joint
statements, Catholic-Orthodox relations at the ground level are pretty
weak, especially among the Orthodox. All of this may prove that culture
may be much more important than theology in relations between Catholics
and Orthodox.
[Jesuit Fr. Thomas Reese is a senior analyst for NCR and author
of Inside the Vatican: The Politics and Organization of the Catholic
Church. His email address is [60]tree...@ncronline.org.]
[50]Thomas Reese | Jun. 1, 2017 [51]Faith and Justice
When it comes to theology, the Catholic Church and the Orthodox
churches are very close. We accept the same Nicene Creed, we recognize
each other's priestly and episcopal ordinations, as well as the
sacraments of baptism, confession and Eucharist. Catholic and Orthodox
teaching on morals are also quite compatible, with both being more
conservative than their Protestant colleagues.
The touchy issue has always been the role of the papacy, but Pope John
Paul II invited a worldwide dialogue on this topic, showing that the
Vatican is open to a less intrusive role for the pope in the Eastern
churches than in the West. There were even attempts to resurrect the
title of patriarch of the West for the bishop of Rome, in order to
distinguish his robust role in the Western church from his role in the
East.
Rome is very much interested in improved relations with the Orthodox.
It is deferential to Orthodox feelings. For example, the pope will not
visit a country where a majority of the population is Orthodox without
an invitation from the Orthodox church. An invitation from the
political leadership is not sufficient.
Rome has constantly reached out to the Orthodox churches, especially to
the patriarchs of Constantinople and Moscow. Relations with the
patriarch of Constantinople have improved significantly since the
Jerusalem meeting of Pope Paul VI with Patriarch Athenagoras in 1964
and lifting of mutual excommunications in 1965. Popes and the
ecumenical patriarch meet so frequently that it is now hardly
newsworthy.
It took much longer for a pope to meet with the Russian patriarch,
which finally occurred in Cuba last year. The meeting between Francis
and Patriarch Kirill of Moscow was probably as much a reward to the
pope for his opposition to President Barack Obama's threat to bomb
Syria as it was a show of ecumenical progress.
The Vatican has continued to mute its criticism of Russia in Syria and
Ukraine lest it upset it budding relationship with Kirill, who is
closely aligned with Vladimir Putin.
In ecumenical circles, it was always presumed that Catholics and
Orthodox would find their way to communion long before Catholics and
Protestants did. Some Catholic bishops even wanted to open our
Eucharist to Orthodox Christians, but backed down quickly when Orthodox
bishops objected.
The honest truth is that the Orthodox bishops are not really interested
in reunion.
Thanks to a new [57]survey of religion in Eastern Europe, we now know
that it is not just the Orthodox bishops who are not interested in
reunion. The Pew Research Center found that "few Orthodox Christians in
the region say the two churches should be in communion again, including
as few as 17% in Russia and 19% in Georgia who favor reuniting with the
Catholic Church."
In countries where there are significant numbers of both Catholics and
Orthodox, the Catholics are much more interested in communion than
Orthodox. According to Pew, "In Ukraine, for example, about
three-quarters (74%) of Catholics favor reunification of Roman
Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy, a view held by only about one-third
(34%) of the country's Orthodox population."
The divide appears to go far beyond reunion. Only 56 percent of
Ukrainian Orthodox would accept a Catholic into their family. Again,
Catholics are more ecumenical, with 92 percent saying they would accept
an Orthodox Christian in their family.
[58]Among both Orthodox and Catholics, some hesitation about accepting
the other as a family member-[59][PF.05.10.2017_CE.europe-00-02.png]
This is not good news for ecumenists. It shows that although
theologians may issue consensus papers and bishops may issue joint
statements, Catholic-Orthodox relations at the ground level are pretty
weak, especially among the Orthodox. All of this may prove that culture
may be much more important than theology in relations between Catholics
and Orthodox.
[Jesuit Fr. Thomas Reese is a senior analyst for NCR and author
of Inside the Vatican: The Politics and Organization of the Catholic
Church. His email address is [60]tree...@ncronline.org.]
Steve Hayes
Jun 8, 2017, 11:26:40 PM6/8/17
to
On Thu, 8 Jun 2017 20:35:30 +0000 (UTC),
vjp...@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com wrote:
>https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/faith-and-justice/orthodox-not-interested-reunion-rome
See here:
https://khanya.wordpress.com/2017/06/03/orthodox-roman-catholic-reunion-redux/
--
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?
vjp...@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com wrote:
>https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/faith-and-justice/orthodox-not-interested-reunion-rome
>
> The touchy issue has always been the role of the papacy, but Pope John
> Paul II invited a worldwide dialogue on this topic, showing that the
> Vatican is open to a less intrusive role for the pope in the Eastern
> churches than in the West. There were even attempts to resurrect the
> title of patriarch of the West for the bishop of Rome, in order to
> distinguish his robust role in the Western church from his role in the
> East.
This article displays not deference, but arrogance.
> The touchy issue has always been the role of the papacy, but Pope John
> Paul II invited a worldwide dialogue on this topic, showing that the
> Vatican is open to a less intrusive role for the pope in the Eastern
> churches than in the West. There were even attempts to resurrect the
> title of patriarch of the West for the bishop of Rome, in order to
> distinguish his robust role in the Western church from his role in the
> East.
See here:
https://khanya.wordpress.com/2017/06/03/orthodox-roman-catholic-reunion-redux/
--
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet and in e-mail?
pyotr filipivich
Jun 9, 2017, 11:57:45 AM6/9/17
to
This is news?
Aside from some who seem to feel that supporting Rome might be a
good career move - "tain't happening."
--
pyotr
After the war two Army Chaplains were mustering out. The one said to
the other "Chaplain, it has been a real pleasure serving God with you.
You in your way, and I in His."
DR...@teikyopost.edu
Jun 10, 2017, 4:51:41 AM6/10/17
to
On Thursday, June 8, 2017 at 4:35:31 PM UTC-4, vjp...@at.biostrategist.dot.dot.com wrote:
> https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/faith-and-justice/orthodox-not-interested-reunion-rome
>
> [50]Thomas Reese | Jun. 1, 2017 [51]Faith and Justice
The continuing divisions among the Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and
> https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/faith-and-justice/orthodox-not-interested-reunion-rome
>
> [50]Thomas Reese | Jun. 1, 2017 [51]Faith and Justice
Oriental Orthodox Churches are of a political nature, with the added
component of inane doctrinal disputes. It is unfortunate that so
many members of the laity do not see through the very effective
methods of propaganda that perpetuate these divisions.
Steve Hayes
Jun 11, 2017, 12:11:02 AM6/11/17
to
Robert
Jun 11, 2017, 1:57:47 PM6/11/17
to
tesla sTinker
Jun 11, 2017, 4:36:25 PM6/11/17
to
well this certainly shows your mentality level, cause JPII was never the
pope, and is why, he had his throat sliced by God. The man was
antichrist. Not pope. Same as the one you have now, is the same dam
thing. And Dammed by God they are. You can count on it.
On 6/8/2017 1:35 PM, vjp...@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com scribbled:
pope, and is why, he had his throat sliced by God. The man was
antichrist. Not pope. Same as the one you have now, is the same dam
thing. And Dammed by God they are. You can count on it.
On 6/8/2017 1:35 PM, vjp...@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com scribbled:
tesla sTinker
Jun 11, 2017, 4:49:23 PM6/11/17
to
To yak in real time irc, with us, we do this council session
on Sundays, at precise 12 pm on California Time Zone in
this chat room, a key is needed and it is 'tcc' It must be
added to the channel name with a space bar. The chat session last
about one hour every Sunday on the topic of Fatima and the Novus Ordo
Communism, and also the topic of Saint Francis and his book that he
wrote of on the theft and takeover of Rome by these antichrists, Called
Works. The true Catholic Church is no longer in Rome. And for the most
part, was hardly ever really there and only at specific times in the
past. Rome is full of paganism. They are not Catholics at all, even
though they pose as such. And that, is exactly what God's Holy true
Scriptures do say would happen of, and it has. So why would anyone
doubt the truth of it? $ and sin is why.
http://www.truecarpentry.org/tccwww/cathwww/zapostolic/prelim/councils/IHMform.htm
world wide chat room
http://chat.efnet.org/irc.cgi?chan=%23IHM'Council
On 6/11/2017 1:36 PM, tesla sTinker scribbled:
servant
Jun 12, 2017, 11:04:49 AM6/12/17
to
>>> https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/faith-and-justice/orthodox-not-interested-reunion-rome
>>>
>>> [50]Thomas Reese | Jun. 1, 2017 [51]Faith and Justice
>>
>>The continuing divisions among the Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and
>>Oriental Orthodox Churches are of a political nature, with the added
>>component of inane doctrinal disputes. It is unfortunate that so
>>many members of the laity do not see through the very effective
>>methods of propaganda that perpetuate these divisions.
>
>Very true.
0 new messages