Will Chuck Missler Give Refunds in Y2K?
LA
profit$ he made on his Y2K Bomb briefing tapes and his Y2K seminar at
the Anaheim Convention Center when it becomes apparent that his
information was as worthless as the dog doo I scoop from my back yard?
Or is enriching oneself by peddling false information considered
acceptable behavior among the CCCM crowd?
Doug
> Does any one know whether Chuck Missler is planning to
> return the profit$ he made on his Y2K Bomb briefing tapes
> and his Y2K seminar at the Anaheim Convention Center when
> it becomes apparent that his information was as worthless
> as the dog doo I scoop from my back yard?
Let me hazard a guess.
NO WAY.
> Or is enriching oneself by peddling false information
> considered acceptable behavior among the CCCM crowd?
Does the fact that Missler will be speaking the second Friday at Calvary
Chapel of Costa Mesa tell you anything?
Will these people never learn?
Check out the Missler Report on the CC FUAQ site:
http://members.tripod.com/ccfuaq/missler4.htm#y2k
BTW, we called this one more than 6 months ago.
Once again the false prophets of Calvary Chapel have been exposed. The
sad part is that so few CCites seem to care.
LA
>Does the fact that Missler will be speaking the second Friday at Calvary
>Chapel of Costa Mesa tell you anything?
>
>Will these people never learn?
A recent CNN Headline reads:
"Y2K paranoia runs rampant in Arkansas"
Looks like Missler's been doing some Y2K lectures in Arkansas, eh?
Don Robertson
I am in the process of writing a letter to CM asking for an open apology
for the hysteria he has helped spread. I'll post it on this ng as an open
letter. I would encourage others who didn't buy into his hype to do the
same.
Cheers
Don
LA wrote:
> Does any one know whether Chuck Missler is planning to return the
> profit$ he made on his Y2K Bomb briefing tapes and his Y2K seminar at
> the Anaheim Convention Center when it becomes apparent that his
> information was as worthless as the dog doo I scoop from my back yard?
>
Doug
> I am in the process of writing a letter to CM asking for
> an open apology for the hysteria he has helped spread.
LOL. That'll be the day.
> I'll post it on this ng as an open letter. I would
> encourage others who didn't buy into his hype to do the
> same.
To Chuck Smith's credit he didn't _personally_ push the Y2K junk. OTOH,
he did offer his pulpit to Missler once a month over the past couple of
years and Missler pushed it - big time.
Read the Calvary Chapel Frequently Unanswered Questions Page for more
information:
http://members.tripod.com/ccfuaq
Thanks for your support.
Don Robertson
Doug wrote:
> Don Robertson wrote:
>
> > I am in the process of writing a letter to CM asking for
> > an open apology for the hysteria he has helped spread.
>
> LOL. That'll be the day.
>
Oh I know he would never apologise for anything. I've talked with him in
the past and know even when he's wrong he's not the type to back down. The
Calvary Chapel here in Eugene also gave him the pulpit to spew his garbage,
however he did get support from the pastor. Sad to think, all that time
spent teaching a Sunday or Wednasday night sermon on Y2K that could have
been devoted to the teaching of the Gospel.
Cheers
Don
PS Thanks for posting the link to your page Doug, I lost the old one I had
and couldn't find you..
Doug
> PS Thanks for posting the link to your page Doug, I lost
> the old one I had and couldn't find you..
Glad to help.
If you lose it in the future (not that I intend to move the page again),
try a search engine like google. I tried to get it registered with the
main ones as soon as it moved.
I have about a week before seminary starts up again. I'll probably be
putting up some new content on the page in the next week.
For those of you who haven't seen the page, it's at:
Doug
> Oh I know he would never apologise for anything.
The only way to get to Missler is through his attorneys. That seems to
get a public apology.
http://www.khouse.org/slip.html
Even that was not as honest as it should have been.
brian
LA wrote:
> Does any one know whether Chuck Missler is planning to return the
> profit$ he made on his Y2K Bomb briefing tapes and his Y2K seminar at
> the Anaheim Convention Center when it becomes apparent that his
> information was as worthless as the dog doo I scoop from my back yard?
>
> Or is enriching oneself by peddling false information considered
> acceptable behavior among the CCCM crowd?
I think what is sadder is that they deeply desire this to happen, the
destruction of the economy and the sadness and death of thousands this
would have lead to is desired by the gloom crowd. I never have understood
this.
Theodore A. Kaldis
> Does any one know whether Chuck Missler is planning to return the profit$
> he made on his Y2K Bomb briefing tapes and his Y2K seminar at the Anaheim
> Convention Center
What do you suppose?
> when it becomes apparent that his information was as worthless as the dog
> doo I scoop from my back yard?
You mean it hasn't been apparent thus far?
> Or is enriching oneself by peddling false information considered acceptable
> behavior among the CCCM crowd?
Only as long as it's done by the approved heirarchy.
--
Theodore A. Kaldis
kal...@bigpond.com.au
Theodore A. Kaldis
> To Chuck Smith's credit he didn't _personally_ push the Y2K junk. OTOH, he
> did offer his pulpit to Missler once a month over the past couple of years
> and Missler pushed it - big time.
Why should this be to his credit? By allowing Missler to present this
message, Smith implicitly gives his assent to the message being presented,
and I see little difference in this than in having given his explicit
endorsement. In fact, I see duplicity in Smith's behaviour. By remaining
silent on the matter, he leaves open the opportunity to to exonerate himself
in the event that it doesn't come to pass. Draw your own conclusions.
> Read the Calvary Chapel Frequently Unanswered Questions Page for more
> information:
> http://members.tripod.com/ccfuaq
JohnD 70X7
contention that I have with Calvary Chapel, or to be more accurate, that
Calvary has with me." Doug Gilliland at http://members.tripod.com/ccfuaq
This is most telling. I find most Preterists are Potshot artists usually
inordinately displeased with their spiritual upbringing. I am reminded of the
snot nosed Baby Boom generation (to which I belong).
Ask Mr. DeMar how Ezekiel 40 disproves his hokey point about the Temple having
to be standing in Revelation 11.
Preterism is nothing more than avoidance therapy for those who hope to avoid
the coming wrath. And, they will join the ranks of the naysayers in Noah's day
who pooh poohed the global flood. Beware their sweet sounding poison.
I hope Missler changes his mind about persuing litigation regarding the
liablous statements like these and allows a court to decide who's the victim in
these matters.
Ah, but then the potshot artists will cry foul that a Christian dares sue
another Christian. How about the one about back biting?
Eric Simpson
condemned in the Second Ecumenical Council, the same Council which affirmed the
canon of the New Testament Scriptures.
Eric Simpson
http://members.aol.com/JamzSimp/
"The purity of heretics is worse than all debauchery..." St. John Chrysostom.
"And after my skin is destroyed, this I know,
That in my flesh I shall see God..."
(Job 19:26)
The voice of truth in this swamp
>Why should this be to his credit? By allowing Missler to present this
>message, Smith implicitly gives his assent to the message being presented,
>and I see little difference in this than in having given his explicit
>endorsement.
That is because you have not paid close enough attention. Pastor Chuck Smith
had guests on the To Every Man an Answer radio show and at the Calvary Chapel
Costa Mesa pulpit to tell people not to get caught up in the hysteria of Y2K.
He himself shared on MANY occasions not to get overly excited about this thing.
>In fact, I see duplicity in Smith's behaviour. By remaining
>silent on the matter, he leaves open the opportunity to to exonerate himself
>in the event that it doesn't come to pass.
You are wrong in your view. He had Mark Eastman and a pastor named John
Michaels from a Calvary in Nevada (who was a computer systems expert before
being a pastor and who visited Calvary's across the country sharing his view
that Y2K was not going to be a big deal) on TEMA and at CCCM discussing why it
was unwise to freak out over Y2K. Chuck said over and over again that we
should always be prepared, living in Southern California, for an emergency with
a few days worth of food and water. Gayle Erwin has also been speaking at many
Calvary Chapels, sharing that Y2K is not something to fear, and David Rosales
has shared the same view. Even at pastors conferences, pastors were told that
they should be concetrating on the word, and not on Y2K.
Also, you guys seem to forget that Mr. Missler speaks about more than Y2K when
he approaches the pulpit. While I personally do not care for his style or
substance, he does teach on other things. I agree that he should give back
every penny that he made on Y2K. It must bother you boys beyond measure that
Hank Hannegraff was right on about this one.
Once again, you decide to smear Pastor Chuck Smith without cause, proving that
this newsgroup is, like the Y2K mass destruction bug, not based in truth.
That reminds me:
Most of the people who post here do not in any way reflect the attitudes,
opinions, or beliefs of Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa or its affiliates. Most of
the posts here have nothing to do with Calvary Chapel, are not by people who
attend Calvary Chapel, nor are they usually true about Calvary Chapel. If you
wish to learn about Calvary Chapels or what Calvary Chapel is or what Calvary
Chapel teaches, please go to www.calvarychapel.org.
Mostly, this newsgroup is about gossiping, backbiting, and Doug Gillilands and
others love of themselves.
Here are some links to show you what is really happening here:
"Frequently Asked But Unanswered Questions" Answered...
http://home.wmis.net/~ixthys/fabuqa.htm
By the way, Doug Gilliland in the person who is now using the identity
jaco...@pacbell.net
a.r.c.c-c Warning Page
http://www.calvarynet.org/altng
History of the ARCC-C Newsgroup
http://www.xs4all.nl/~ahein/a01.html
Many people who post here are divisive and have agendas which are contrary to
what Jesus has taught. Be very aware of their hypocrisy.
>Draw your own conclusions.
I did. However, I did it based on facts. What did you base your's on?
See Divisvie Doug at http://members.aol.com/arcccfaq/dougg.jpg
Doug
> Why should this be to his credit? By allowing Missler to
> present this message, Smith implicitly gives his assent
> to the message being presented, and I see little
> difference in this than in having given his explicit
> endorsement. In fact, I see duplicity in Smith's
> behaviour. By remaining silent on the matter, he leaves
> open the opportunity to to exonerate himself in the event
> that it doesn't come to pass. Draw your own conclusions.
He wasn't silent on it. When he commented on it, he was against the doom
and gloom crowd - for the most part. This may be out of character for
him - but it should be acknowledged. In fact, I heard him deliberately
misquote a Psalms passage and say something to the effect that he would
not fear Y2K.
I think it was to control the great amount of fear caused by his
resident expert, Chuck Missler. Smith should have pulled the plug on
Missler. It is possible that he may have placed limits on Missler in the
pulpit. Missler was also pulled of the Calvary Satellite Network.
Read the Calvary Chapel FUAQ page:
Doug
> I hope Missler changes his mind about persuing litigation
> regarding the liablous statements like these and allows a
> court to decide who's the victim in these matters.
LOL. Missler has everything to lose and fear in the courts of this
country. Missler's actions are discrediting to the rest of the Calvary
Chapel movement. Most Calvary Chapel pastors that I know have tried to
keep their distance from him as far as possible.
Why do you defend Missler? His advocacy of Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt
(FUD) has robbed widows and orphans with his Y2K scams.
Check out his plagiarism page:
Doug
> Ah, but then the potshot artists will cry foul that a
> Christian dares sue another Christian. How about the one
> about back biting?
How about it?
Missler is discredited. There's nothing you can do to rehabilitate him
at this point.
Check out the Calvary Chapel FUAQ:
Doug
> That is because you have not paid close enough attention.
> Pastor Chuck Smith had guests on the To Every Man an
> Answer radio show and at the Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa
> pulpit to tell people not to get caught up in the
> hysteria of Y2K.
I noted this myself several times already.
The problem is, Chuck Smith allowed Missler in his pulpit and Missler
going to be speaking at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa this month.
> He himself shared on MANY occasions not to get overly
> excited about this thing.
True.
The problem is, Chuck Smith allowed Missler in his pulpit and Missler
going to be speaking at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa this month.
> Also, you guys seem to forget that Mr. Missler speaks
> about more than Y2K when he approaches the pulpit.
In the past year or so. Missler has concentrated his energies on Y2K.
The problem is, Chuck Smith allowed Missler in his pulpit and Missler
going to be speaking at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa this month.
> While I personally do not care for his style or
> substance, he does teach on other things.
Yep, the "Pyramids on Mars", "British Israelitism", "The Gospel in the
Stars" and plenty of other topic straight from the Star or National
Enquirer.
After all, inquiring minds want to know - and Missler is there to feed
them.
The problem is, Chuck Smith allowed Missler in his pulpit and Missler
going to be speaking at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa this month.
> I agree that he should give back every penny that he made
> on Y2K.
So what's the beef? Sounds like we all agree that Missler conned people.
The problem is, Chuck Smith allowed Missler in his pulpit and Missler
going to be speaking at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa this month.
> It must bother you boys beyond measure that
> Hank Hannegraff was right on about this one.
LOL. The CC FUAQ published long before Hanegraaff on this.
The problem is, Chuck Smith allowed Missler in his pulpit and Missler
going to be speaking at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa this month.
> Once again, you decide to smear Pastor Chuck Smith
> without cause, proving that this newsgroup is, like the
> Y2K mass destruction bug, not based in truth.
Already noted.
The problem is, Chuck Smith allowed Missler in his pulpit and Missler
going to be speaking at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa this month.
Read the Calvary Chapel FUAQ page at:
Bubba
downplayed the whole Y2K thing, and in fact, Chuck's books aren't for sale in
our bookstore.
Doug
> I go the the same Calvary Chapel that Chuck Missler goes
> to.
In Idaho?
> Our pastor has downplayed the whole Y2K thing, and in
> fact, Chuck's books aren't for sale in our bookstore.
That's good to hear.
Some other CCs have less discernment.
LA
in this swamp) wrote:
>That is because you have not paid close enough attention. Pastor Chuck Smith
>had guests on the To Every Man an Answer radio show and at the Calvary Chapel
>Costa Mesa pulpit to tell people not to get caught up in the hysteria of Y2K.
>He himself shared on MANY occasions not to get overly excited about this thing.
I'm glad to see Chuck is learning from his errors. Remember the movie
he produced about 25 years ago called "The Parable of the Fig Tree?"
The film showed a huge building in Brussels that allegedly housed the
big computer that was to assign everyone on the planet a personal
account number (invisibly tattooed on the hand or forehead, of
course.) Chuck told us that their were eleven flags in front of the
building. Ten of the flags were obviously for the ten-nation world
governing empire prophesied in Revelation. But what about the 11th
flag? What did IT stand for? Well, Chuck asked a "robot-like" guard
in Brussels who kindly informed him that the eleventh flag is for the
beast that will someday rise out of the sea to rule the world, (and
make war with the saints). Of course, Chuck was always quick to offer
us the comfort of knowing that we will experience his new fangled
"beam me up Scotty" type rapture experience before all this happens.
(Not quite the same rapture that Paul described, BTW.)
Regards,
Lance A.
LA
>An anonymous source wrote:
>> While I personally do not care for his style or
>> substance, he does teach on other things.
>
>Yep, the "Pyramids on Mars", "British Israelitism", "The Gospel in the
>Stars" and plenty of other topic straight from the Star or National
>Enquirer.
A don't forget Missler's regurgitation of that story about Vince
Foster being a secret agent for the Masaad. NSA traced payments from
Israel to Foster's bank account in Switzerland, and used a satellite
to electronically suck the money right out of Foster's account. When
Foster called to check his account balance, and found it to be a big
fat goose egg, he realized the jig was up. Next thing we know, he's
found dead at Fort Marcy Park, apparently from a self-inflicted
gunshot wound. Missler told this whopper at CC of Philadelphia about
5 years ago.
Regards,
Lance A.
"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but
according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they
will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears
away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables." (2 Tim 4:3-4)
LA
>The problem is, Chuck Smith allowed Missler in his pulpit and Missler
>going to be speaking at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa this month.
I wonder what Missler's going to talk about this month? Perhaps he's
going to say the government lost their element of surprise with Y2K
(because of Missler's lectures, no doubt), so they're going to "Plan
B" in the near future, when no one's expecting it.
BTW - Does Smith allow Missler to peddle his books and newsletters
when he speaks at CCCM every month?
Bubba
and all three seem to be well grounded spiritually. They've been a blessing to
us, irregardless of some of the other problems that some of them may be prone
to.
Doug
> BTW - Does Smith allow Missler to peddle his books and
> newsletters when he speaks at CCCM every month?
Yes. Chuck Smith sells them in the Chapel Store which is open before and
after Missler speaks. The Chapel Store has, for all intents and
purposes, replaced the old Maranatha Village.
At the Friday Night session, Missler usually passes out "free" one-year
subscriptions to his "Personal Update" newsletter.
Missler frequently hawks his books and tapes from the Calvary Chapel of
Costa Mesa pulpit. Also, many of the messages which end up as tapes
started out as Friday night messages at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa.
Chuck Smith also sells the audio and video tapes of Missler speaking.
These are a gold-mine of misinformation.
TWAliceon
No, he is non-prophet organization. :>p
DSLSLL
to the y2k concerns until the last Sunday before the new year. At that time
he said that he wasn't going to give it ANY time, however, so many people
had approached him on the subject that he felt it best to say something.
1. God is in control. He will take care of us.
2. The pastor and his family have set aside a few days worth of water.
3. He plans on filling his automobiles up with gas on Wednesday.
4. Everybody doing something (like pulling money out of the bank) will
cause more damage than any y2k bug.
Total time on the subject, 5-7 minutes. I can get the tape if you'd like,
Doug. They cost $2. Most tapes at our bookstore cost $2.
Don't know who this Missler fellow is...I've never heard him preach at our
church. That would be over three years. Don't know about before that time.
Those people (y2k panic scammers) will have to stand before God someday.
Remember it is not our place to judge. Expose, yes. Judge, no.
Theodore A. Kaldis
> It must bother you boys beyond measure that Hank Hannegraff was right on
> about this one.
Not really. Accidents occasionally occur.
Doug
> Don't know who this Missler fellow is...I've never heard
> him preach at our church. That would be over three
> years. Don't know about before that time.
Then you obviously haven't read the CC FUAQ page. Missler gets high
billing on the page. His antics and misadventures have kept us in
stiches for years at Calvary Chapel.
Missler preached (if you can call it that) at Calvary Chapel of Costa
Mesa for many years on a weekly (or is that weakly?) basis.
A few years ago, Missler moved to Idaho (reportedly to escape the coming
earthquake that would level California - but maybe more in fear due to
the earthquake in Big Bear where he did live.)
Missler runs a website called Koinonia House Online at:
Any trendy, cultic doctrine is prime subject matter for Missler. He
specializes in the obscure. He's a half a step above Tex Marrs in the
Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt (FUD) category. Before Missler got on the
Y2K bandwagon he was doing "Prophecy Conferences", which now that Y2K
has fizzled, he is doing at the Anaheim Convention Center. If you've
ever been to Dizzeyland it's across the street in the large convention
center building. They usually pack it out.
Missler now speaks monthly at Calvary Chapel of Costa Mesa. The next two
scheduled appearances are Jan 14, and Feb 4.
Missler can be heard in a number of national radio markets.
Read the CC FUAQ for more information on Missler's activities:
http://members.tripod.com/ccfuaq
Missler is a prime example of the need for a house cleaning at Calvary
Chapel. The fact that he's a featured speaker at Costa Mesa gets him an
automatic "in" at most other local CCs.
DSLSLL
How many times are we to forgive our brother?
Did Jesus say judge, or judge not?
If someone sins and repents, does God forgive them?
Was Aquilla & Priscilla teaching a false doctrine? What did Paul and the
others do when they saw it? Create a web page based on a few loose facts,
alot of hype, some twisting, some out-of-context, dated material....whatever
means necessary to obtain any shred of validity to your conspiracy theory?
No, I think they pulled him aside (after the service - my goodness they let
him finish!) and went over things with them.
Could Chuck have done or said something wrong back in the early eighties?
Sure. Doesn't he have the grace given by God to say, "Gee, I was wrong on
that. I learned from that"? Yes, he is a Pastor and that carries
responsibilities;however it doesn't mean he is perfect and can not EVER,
EVER error in any way, shape or form. If he errors it is the responsibility
of the elders and congregation to be ever watchful and read their own bible
to make sure what the leader of the church is saying is scriptural. Do not
come back and say, "that's what I am doing!" No.
You are out to hurt this man. You are out for revenge. You will not be
satisfied until Calvary Chapel is shut down, disgraced and in utter ruin.
You will not stop.
Revenge is mine, says the Lord.
Do you sin, Doug? Is one sin worse than the other, because in my bible it
says that sin is sin is sin. If a man commits adultry, repents and shows a
repentive heart, does that mean he can't preach anymore? If someone uses a
certain phrase to help explain scripture, and you take it wrong, and they
come back and say, "no, that's not what I meant", does that mean you can say
they denied ever saying it?
I have read what you have to say about Missler. My God says I should not
pay attention to dissenters and idle talkers (gossip), I will draw my own
conclusions because my God also says to judge not. Sure I am to be
discerning, and trust me I will. I will not, however, simply take your word
for it.
Doug <jaco...@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:3873601C...@pacbell.net...
DSLSLL
the pretty graphic, but what did they talk about that was deceitful? You
give no meat.
DSLSLL
links to Missler's letter's and response to the plagarism issue. He handled
the matter appropriately.
DSLSLL
You are talking about the exact same incident! And Missler's letter is not
a "nasty attack letter". I read it.
Here you are wanting an apology for this Chris fellow and continue to dwell
on the plagarism issue that Missler explained AND apologized for AND should
be dropped.
Bitterness.
DSLSLL
president of the Spokane Stake of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day
Saints, said he loves to discuss theology and doctrines of his church, but
is disappointed another church would sponsor a forum soleyly to discredit
Mormon beliefs.'
Isn't that what your doing with the FUQ?
And since Calvary doesn't believe that Mormons are saved, isn't it their
responsibility to witness to them?
Doug
> In your link to Rick Ross' web page, his page states that
> 'Garry Borders, president of the Spokane Stake of the
> Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, said he
> loves to discuss theology and doctrines of his church,
> but is disappointed another church would sponsor a forum
> soleyly to discredit Mormon beliefs.'
First, a point that should be obvious - but apparently isn't - at least
to one person. A web page may have links on it. Those other pages may
contain information that the original author agrees with. Those pages
may also contain information that the original author disagrees with.
Further, Rick Ross collects articles from the mainstream press on
Calvary Chapel. He is a frequent consultant to the mainstream press on
cults as well. He's also a deprogrammer. I link to his page because he's
got some pages on Calvary Chapel. I make no comment about either his
direct content, or the articles he includes - which are second level. He
merely collects mainstream press articles on various groups.
> Isn't that what your doing with the FUQ?
No, but let's suppose for a second that it was. So what? Rick Ross
himself collects articles on groups like Calvary Chapel and other cults.
Here's why it's not, though. I am a CC attendee - or at least I was. My
CC FUAQ page is not put on by some other denomination intent on refuting
Calvayr Chapel. Thus, the main point of claimed similarity is actually
dissimilar.
> And since Calvary doesn't believe that Mormons are saved,
> isn't it their responsibility to witness to them?
Take it up with the author of the article that Rick Ross quotes. Also it
depends upon "how" they are witnessing to the LDS. Again, Rick Ross is
mostly concerned with abusive cults and the authority structure of
Calvary Chapel - particularly the "Moses Principle" qualifies them as an
abusive cult.
Check out the Calvary Chapel FUAQ at:
Doug
> "Plagarism again" is deceitful because it implies that
> Missler did it AGAIN. You are talking about the exact
> same incident!
You are completely wrong. As the page _clearly_ points out:
1. About 1992 - Missler and Lindsey published Magog Factor with a
chapter that was plagiarized from Yamauchi's 1982 book.
5. 1995 - Missler publishes the book "Magog Invasion" with the chapter
that was stolen from Yamauchi still in it
Note that the "again" is 1 & 5. The first act of plagiarism was in 1992
with the book, "Magog Factor". The second act of plagiarism was in 1995
with the book "Magog Invasion".
Doug
> Here you are wanting an apology for this Chris fellow and
> continue to dwell on the plagarism issue that Missler
> explained AND apologized for AND should be dropped.
LOL.
Missler only apologized when he was contacted by the attorneys for Baker
Books. Note that this was the SECOND time that the plagiarism was
pointed out.
You also neglect the initial act of plagiarism. That is stealing.
When Chris tried to point out Missler's theft he was slapped by Missler
and got no support from Greg Laurie or any other CC leader that he
approached on it.
It's amazing the level that people will sink to in order to defend CC
leaders.
Read the CC FUAQ at:
Doug
>
> I hope that people that visit your FUQ (unanswered is one word) click the
> links to Missler's letter's and response to the plagarism issue. He handled
> the matter appropriately.
Missler lied and slandered. Now, maybe that's appropriate in your mind,
but not in mmine.
Doug
> What was talked about at the Prophecy Conference that you
> object to?
Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt (FUD).
That's what's talked about.
Doug
> Could Chuck have done or said something wrong back in the
> early eighties?
By "something" you are referring to the fact that Smith througout the
1970's was teaching that Jesus would return in 1981, right?
That's pretty well documented by the page. Even you would have to admit
that.
> Sure.
Glad to hear the admission.
By Chuck Smith's own standard, anyone who names a date is a false
prophet.
> Doesn't he have the grace given by God to say, "Gee, I
> was wrong on that. I learned from that"?
He could have. Instead he blames Lindsey and denies that he named a
date. He claims he came close to naming a date. When asked he claims it
never happened:
It's all documented at:
http://members.tripod.com/ccfuaq/cc2ndcom.htm
> Yes, he is a Pastor and that carries responsibilities;
> however it doesn't mean he is perfect and can not EVER,
> EVER error in any way, shape or form.
Exactly. However, the fact that - by his own standard - he is a false
prophet - disqualifies him to teach.
> If he errors it is the responsibility of the elders and
> congregation to be ever watchful and read their own bible
> to make sure what the leader of the church is saying is
> scriptural.
LOL. That's exactly what the web page is all about. Some people don't
have the information to make that determination.
> Do not ome back and say, "that's what I am doing!" No.
LOL. Of course that's exactly what the page is doing.
http://members.tripod.com/ccfuaq
Doug
> I HAVE read your FUAQ web page. The whole entire thing.
I really doubt that.
> How many times are we to forgive our brother?
70x7. If a brother sins against us, we forgive them.
> Did Jesus say judge, or judge not?
Yep.
> If someone sins and repents, does God forgive them?
Sure.
Have the Calvary Chapel leaders repented of their heresies?
Nope.
dkgl...@webtv.net
) band wagon.... Which of course leaves me asking ..how much of his
belief system is based on supersttion and fear. Hey he makes a lot of
money with his mssion....tconsider the cost of tapes and "briefing
Packets"... a refund would be an hoorable consideration.
ImBobAndUrNot
whole dehydrated water thing is a scam also. What I got was a bunch of plastic
bottles that say just add water. What do these people think Im stupid or what ?
The voice of truth in this swamp
>Missler lied and slandered. Now, maybe that's appropriate in your mind,
>but not in mmine.
Then why do you specialize in lying and slandering? Actually, it is libeling,
as you write it, but that is beside the point.
Archie
See Divisvie Doug at http://members.aol.com/arcccfaq/dougg.jpg