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The Seven Questions Noel Simply Cannot Face Regarding His Hatred of Nichiren Daishonin +^
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Chas.
Nov 20, 2022, 5:27:34 AM11/20/22
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The Seven Questions Noel Simply Cannot Face Regarding His Hatred of Nichiren Daishonin +
Responding to the following post, which may become deleted out of embarrassment:
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.religion.buddhism.nichiren/uW7dASM3NC4/ywEtC41pCQAJ
On Friday, May 19, 2017 at 11:39:26 PM UTC-7, Noel wrote:
> On Saturday, May 20, 2017 at 2:33:54 PM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > On Friday, May 19, 2017 at 6:32:36 PM UTC-7, Noel wrote:
> > > "Its not just an image in black and white, the Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically."
> > >
> > > Then you can chant to Shakyamuni's or Nichiren's statue and percieve the Gohonzon with your kind of faith that doesn't need optical representations better still all you have to do is think it as it already exists the unseen dimension
> >
> > No, I said the GOHONZON has unseen dimensions, not my mind or some statues. I perceive them when I chant. They only exist in the GOHONZON.
> >
> > You have a real problem parsing an English sentence, Noel. Maybe some remedial reading classes? Glasses?
> >
> > -Chas.
>
> The true aspect and all phenomena have to be present to be a holistic presentation of our life,in other words they have to be side by side because the true aspect doesn't exist by itself. If you have to look into unseen dimensions of the Gohonzon to complete the 10 worlds every time you do gongyo you would have to be visualizing the 5 worlds that are not there so you could transform them.
>
> Since the oneness of true aspect and all phenomena are already present in Nichirens 10 world Gohonzons I don't have to stress about remembering the missing worlds each time I do gongyo or wishfully believe that they are there just so I can justify having a five world Gohonzon as you do
>
> We perceive whatever we like in our mind games and Buddhism is a mind game that your really bad at playing because of your narrow perception of Buddhism. The Gohonzon exists in the seen and unseen to the minutest material phenomena to that which is beyond matter as an infinite potential to the manifestation of that potential that is in my room as a copy of an original 10 world Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon that is missing in your practice and why your practice is only a partial truth that slanders the higher truth...Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
What you just said, Noel, reveals a lot that you did not intend about what you have not perceived, that any person chanting to a Gohonzon ... that was NOT stolen AND NOT received from traitors that turned away from Nichiren Daishonin the moment that he died and actually a long time before that ... will actually perceive. And that's probably why all the worlds are inscribed onto that Gohonzon for you.
Since I have your attention ...
___________________________________________
This was posted in ARBN, responding to a question, which I mentioned should be directed to someone knowledgable in the SGI:
... This from Soka Spirit.
...
... 3) They claim There are Missing Characters on Nichikan
... Gohonzon
...
... There are characters on the Nikken and Nittatsu transcribed
... Gohonzon that are not on the Nichikan Gohonzon. The essence
... of the Gohonzon is the inscription that embodies the power
... of the Law and the power of the Buddha, or
... "Nam-myoho-renge-kyo." This inscription represents the
... enlightened life of Nichiren Daishonin; this is the heart
... of the Gohonzon.
...
... The surrounding names which represent the mutual possession
... of the Ten Worlds are secondary and have varied since
... Nichiren began inscribing Gohonzon. Not all of the Gohonzon
... inscribed by Nichiren are the same by any means. For
... example, of the 120 extant Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon,
... only about a third contain the name Devadatta representing
... the world of Hell; only 65 contain Shariputra and
... Maudgalayana representing people of the two vehicles, and
... so on.
...
... After the Daishonin's death, successive high priests
... exercised their own judgment in how to represent the
... principle of the Ten Worlds.
...
... As usual with this practice, if one has enough seeking
... spirit, one finds the answers one is looking for.
There we go. When the people following Nichiren Shu parade around their stolen Gohonzon obtained there, proclaiming that they have a true ten-world Gohonzon, they are like a Matador holding up the ears of the bull that they have just killed to the roar of the crowd. The prostrate forms of the Buddhas in the ten direction that they have slain are literally everywhere.
What they will never perceive with a stolen Gohonzon, due to the slander involved in receiving it, is what was heard from the SGI: Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the middle is all you need to manifest the ten worlds and all the other jewels in the treasure tower of your life, mirrored in the Gohonzon. The cause for that is chanting with faith, and in the early going, hope substitutes for that faith (because one hopes it might just work.)
It's not just an image in black and white, Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically.
I have seven questions for those minions of darkness at Nichiren Shu waving around their stolen "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon":
1. For all those other Nichiren Gohonzon missing one or another secondary items: are all those Gohonzon faked, like the Gosho letters you call faked?
2. Do those authentic Nichiren non-ten-world Gohonzon work, or not?
3. Did Nichiren Daishonin actually give his followers Gohonzon that were non-functional, or did he chant to them and see that they worked?
4. Do you believe Nichiren Daishonin could be so intentionally cruel to his devoted followers?
5. Do you believe Nichiren Daishonin to be so irresponsibly lazy and careless to neglect to chant to those few hundred Gohonzon that he just spent much careful time inscribing for his followers: to quality assure that the most important product of his life might function properly?
6. Do you really believe Nichiren Daishonin is that stupid? Or do you just hate him that much?
7. And, by the way, do you think that your "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon" has EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY secondary item inscribed on it from all the Gohonzon Nichiren Daishonin ever inscribed? What are YOU missing on your "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon"?
Actually, I can answer that one for you: you have missed entirely everything and all the points of Nichiren Daishonin's practice of Lotus Sutra Buddhism. What you have found is a pointed, utter hatred of Nichiren Daishonin, his followers and the Lotus Sutra, by chanting to a Gohonzon received from the traitors and murderers of Nichiren Shu that now worship statues and chant to stolen Gohonzon copied from those that should only belong to Nichiren Daishonin's true followers pursuing his Kosen Rufu movement.
I would suggest that Nichiren Daishonin inscribed secondary items on some Gohonzon to personalize the Gohonzon in areas of concern, for those followers who needed a leg up to get on their horse and ride. Those who distort that act of deep and thoughtful compassion have turned Nichiren Daishonin's concern for an individual follower and their family, into a weapon of mass destruction to attack his Kosen Rufu movement. Some serious batsu, there!
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
> On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 3:16:31 AM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > 1. For all those other Nichiren Gohonzon missing one or another secondary items: are all those Gohonzon faked, like the Gosho letters you call faked?
>
> BS I didn't call any of Nichiren's Goshos fake. Seems like your just pulling this out of your rectum?
Ah, now if you do not call any of the Goshos "faked" like Katie Higgins and Mark Rogow do, then you have to accept the verdict that Nichiren Daishonin calls you a liar.
Nichiren Daishonin never says that the Gohonzon that he gave out that were missing some of what you call the "ten world Gohonzon" inscriptions were second class in any way. He does not differentiate between what you imply are first class and second class Gohonzon.
If that is so (and it is) then you are making all of that up and calling Nichiren Daishonin a liar and a priest who bestows second class Gohonzon upon his most loyal followers.
You must then be a Nichiren Daishonin hater, just like I said. Deny it and you call yourself a liar.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Tuesday, November 14, 2017 at 11:49:43 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> You are the one who has denied nichirens purpose of his advent that happened during Koan 2 when he started inscribing 10 world gohonzons
>
> Do you accept that the primary purpose of Nichiren's life was to inscribe Gohonzons
How incredibly 180 degrees wrong of you.
No, the primary purpose of Nichiren's life was to propagate the Law at the heart of the Lotus Sutra and lead the Bodhisattvas of the Earth in the Kosen Rufu movement in their vow to receive the Law, spread it widely and protect it without begrudging their lives. The purpose of writing the Gosho to establish the practice of Buddhism for the Latter Day of the Law employs the Gohonzon as a safety zone of focus for chanting and is the primary means to that end, by preventing his followers from chanting to the wrong objects of devotion, such as worshiping statues of a falsely deified Shakaymuni as a man-God like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth, like Jehovah.
How can you not get that simple primary point of the one chapter and two halves at the heart of the Ceremony in the Air in the Lotus Sutra, Noel?
The Gohonzon is not a magical object, with a more powerful "first-class" magic from a "ten-world" Gohonzon! How True Word Tantric is your wizardly thinking! The Gohonzon is literally the great desire of Nichiren Daishonin to protect his followers, the members of the SGI from slandering and hurting themselves, it is the love of a parent in the action of protecting their children.
Daimoku works just fine without the Gohonzon, Nichiren Daishonin chanted his way to inscribing the Gohonzon, before he ever saw one. As I pointed out in the past, Nichiren Daishonin in different places in the Gosho describes three things as the object of devotion, the Law of Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, the Lotus Sutra that contains it and the Gohonzon that is the mirror of that enlightened life state arising from chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo. The key to that is the Law. Without chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, possessing the Gohonzon has little beneficial effect other than the hope you may chant to it later, and many potential risks until that time.
Of the thirty-two characteristics of the Buddha, the Gohonzon is missing one: the far-reaching voice of the Buddha. That sound of Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo emerges from your enlightened Buddha life.
Get your head on straight, Noel.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 1:41:19 AM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> Nichirens Gohonzons evolved from NMRK to 10 world Gohonzons. You just have to look at nichiren shu's 128 Gohonzons that I have posted many times The facts speak for themselves
>
> But I know you have an aversion to click on any link that hasnt been approved by your infantile imagination of what you think that the soka Gakkai deems as kosher
>
> Your not even up to date with the current state of the shifting sands of soka Gakkai
>
> You would have to be the most irrelevant person on arbn
So, now your argument is that there is a fine-grained evolutionary ladder of Gohonzon made by Nichiren Daishonin, from worst to best as he started off as the worst (most provisional) Nichiren Daishonin and gradually became the best (most true) Nichiren Daishonin.
According to your new theory, those first and most loyal followers who received their Gohonzon early on would obviously have been followers of the worst (most provisional) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump would say: they are the LOSERS in faith.
Those last arriving and most recent followers who held out for the very last and best Gohonzon would obviously have been followers of the best (most true) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump would say: they are the WINNERS in faith.
Then, finding the very BEST Gohonzon would be the ultimate struggle to be the BEST follower of the BEST (most true) Nichiren Daishonin and that single Gohonzon might still be in private hands, or worse, have been lost to history.
Then a mad Gohonzon hunt and an evolutionary battle of the fittest would be necessary by all members of the human race, to become the VERY BEST (most true) follower of Nichiren Daishonin would commence, and that struggle might turn out to be in vain, since that pinnacle Gohonzon may have been lost.
That is the logical outcome from you views: the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
Contrasting your hellish belief system, is the view of the SGI, which I have heard many times from many leaders: simply that all that a Gohonzon needs to work is Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the center, and your own far-reaching voice of the Buddha does the "Buddha's work".
In that view, ALL of Nichiren Daishonin's Gohonzon and any qualifying Gohonzon (with Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the center) are the BEST Gohonzon and ANYONE receiving one from the hands of Nichiren Daishonin's true followers (not from traitorous priests, nor a pirate website dispensing stolen Gohonzon downloads transmitted ultimately from a traitorous priesthood source and making that profoundly evil cause,) are obviously the followers of the BEST (MOST TRUE) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump might say, they are all, each and every single one, the WINNERS in faith.
In other words, everyone who plays according to the rules of the Gosho, wins the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
Nichiren Daishonin would then have been the very best Buddha with the best followers all along: no LOSERS, only WINNERS.
I must say, Noel, I like my world, my universe, a whole hell of a lot better than yours.
As everyone knows, there is simply no replacement for talent.
However, in my world, everyone is talented.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Tuesday, November 21, 2017 at 1:40:45 AM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
[snip]
> >In other words, everyone who plays according to the rules of the Gosho, wins the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
>
> Then your the biggest loser
>
[snip the rest of the vitriol]
However, Noel's Fantasy Gohonzon Hunger Games is not the way the world is.
It is only in his mind that he is a winner, because he has found "the golden ticket".
Noel, Nichiren Daishonin is not Willy Wonka!
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Saturday, November 25, 2017 at 10:22:14 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> On Sunday, November 26, 2017 at 2:13:25 PM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > On Thursday, November 23, 2017 at 5:48:56 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> > > There you go again with your delusions of being Mr Right
> >
> > Proving once again by your descent into ignoratio elenchi, that you are avoiding the seven points by firing up the flak batteries.
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignoratio_elenchi
> >
> > Like I said, you CANNOT ADDRESS MY SEVEN POINTS:
> >
> > The Seven Questions Noel Simply Cannot Face Regarding His Hatred of Nichiren Daishonin +
> >
> > Responding to the following post, which may become deleted out of embarrassment:
> > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.religion.buddhism.nichiren/uW7dASM3NC4/ywEtC41pCQAJ
> >
> > On Friday, May 19, 2017 at 11:39:26 PM UTC-7, Noel wrote:
> > > On Saturday, May 20, 2017 at 2:33:54 PM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > > > On Friday, May 19, 2017 at 6:32:36 PM UTC-7, Noel wrote:
> > > > > "Its not just an image in black and white, the Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically."
> > > > >
> > > > > Then you can chant to Shakyamuni's or Nichiren's statue and percieve the Gohonzon with your kind of faith that doesn't need optical representations better still all you have to do is think it as it already exists the unseen dimension
> > > >
> > > > No, I said the GOHONZON has unseen dimensions, not my mind or some statues. I perceive them when I chant. They only exist in the GOHONZON.
> > > >
> > > > You have a real problem parsing an English sentence, Noel. Maybe some remedial reading classes? Glasses?
> > > >
> > > > -Chas.
> > >
> > > The true aspect and all phenomena have to be present to be a holistic presentation of our life,in other words they have to be side by side because the true aspect doesn't exist by itself. If you have to look into unseen dimensions of the Gohonzon to complete the 10 worlds every time you do gongyo you would have to be visualizing the 5 worlds that are not there so you could transform them.
> > >
> > > Since the oneness of true aspect and all phenomena are already present in Nichirens 10 world Gohonzons I don't have to stress about remembering the missing worlds each time I do gongyo or wishfully believe that they are there just so I can justify having a five world Gohonzon as you do
> > >
> > > We perceive whatever we like in our mind games and Buddhism is a mind game that your really bad at playing because of your narrow perception of Buddhism. The Gohonzon exists in the seen and unseen to the minutest material phenomena to that which is beyond matter as an infinite potential to the manifestation of that potential that is in my room as a copy of an original 10 world Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon that is missing in your practice and why your practice is only a partial truth that slanders the higher truth...Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
> >
> > What you just said, Noel, reveals a lot that you did not intend about what you have not perceived, that any person chanting to a Gohonzon ... that was NOT stolen AND NOT received from traitors that turned away from Nichiren Daishonin the moment that he died and actually a long time before that ... will actually perceive. And that's probably why all the worlds are inscribed onto that Gohonzon for you.
> >
> > Since I have your attention ...
> > ___________________________________________
> >
> > This was posted in ARBN, responding to a question, which I mentioned should be directed to someone knowledgable in the SGI:
> >
> > ... This from Soka Spirit.
> > ...
> > ... 3) They claim There are Missing Characters on Nichikan
> > ... Gohonzon
> > ...
> > ... There are characters on the Nikken and Nittatsu transcribed
> > ... Gohonzon that are not on the Nichikan Gohonzon. The essence
> > ... of the Gohonzon is the inscription that embodies the power
> > ... of the Law and the power of the Buddha, or
> > ... "Nam-myoho-renge-kyo." This inscription represents the
> > ... enlightened life of Nichiren Daishonin; this is the heart
> > ... of the Gohonzon.
> > ...
> > ... The surrounding names which represent the mutual possession
> > ... of the Ten Worlds are secondary and have varied since
> > ... Nichiren began inscribing Gohonzon. Not all of the Gohonzon
> > ... inscribed by Nichiren are the same by any means. For
> > ... example, of the 120 extant Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon,
> > ... only about a third contain the name Devadatta representing
> > ... the world of Hell; only 65 contain Shariputra and
> > ... Maudgalayana representing people of the two vehicles, and
> > ... so on.
> > ...
> > ... After the Daishonin's death, successive high priests
> > ... exercised their own judgment in how to represent the
> > ... principle of the Ten Worlds.
> > ...
> > ... As usual with this practice, if one has enough seeking
> > ... spirit, one finds the answers one is looking for.
> >
> > There we go. When the people following Nichiren Shu parade around their stolen Gohonzon obtained there, proclaiming that they have a true ten-world Gohonzon, they are like a Matador holding up the ears of the bull that they have just killed to the roar of the crowd. The prostrate forms of the Buddhas in the ten direction that they have slain are literally everywhere.
> >
> > What they will never perceive with a stolen Gohonzon, due to the slander involved in receiving it, is what was heard from the SGI: Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the middle is all you need to manifest the ten worlds and all the other jewels in the treasure tower of your life, mirrored in the Gohonzon. The cause for that is chanting with faith, and in the early going, hope substitutes for that faith (because one hopes it might just work.)
> >
> > It's not just an image in black and white, Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically.
> >
> > I have seven questions for those minions of darkness at Nichiren Shu waving around their stolen "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon":
> >
> > 1. For all those other Nichiren Gohonzon missing one or another secondary items: are all those Gohonzon faked, like the Gosho letters you call faked?
> >
> > 2. Do those authentic Nichiren non-ten-world Gohonzon work, or not?
> >
> > 3. Did Nichiren Daishonin actually give his followers Gohonzon that were non-functional, or did he chant to them and see that they worked?
> >
> > 4. Do you believe Nichiren Daishonin could be so intentionally cruel to his devoted followers?
> >
> > 5. Do you believe Nichiren Daishonin to be so irresponsibly lazy and careless to neglect to chant to those few hundred Gohonzon that he just spent much careful time inscribing for his followers: to quality assure that the most important product of his life might function properly?
> >
> > 6. Do you really believe Nichiren Daishonin is that stupid? Or do you just hate him that much?
> >
> > 7. And, by the way, do you think that your "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon" has EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY secondary item inscribed on it from all the Gohonzon Nichiren Daishonin ever inscribed? What are YOU missing on your "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon"?
> >
> > Actually, I can answer that one for you: you have missed entirely everything and all the points of Nichiren Daishonin's practice of Lotus Sutra Buddhism. What you have found is a pointed, utter hatred of Nichiren Daishonin, his followers and the Lotus Sutra, by chanting to a Gohonzon received from the traitors and murderers of Nichiren Shu that now worship statues and chant to stolen Gohonzon copied from those that should only belong to Nichiren Daishonin's true followers pursuing his Kosen Rufu movement.
> >
> > I would suggest that Nichiren Daishonin inscribed secondary items on some Gohonzon to personalize the Gohonzon in areas of concern, for those followers who needed a leg up to get on their horse and ride. Those who distort that act of deep and thoughtful compassion have turned Nichiren Daishonin's concern for an individual follower and their family, into a weapon of mass destruction to attack his Kosen Rufu movement. Some serious batsu, there!
> >
> > -Chas.
> > ___________________________________________________________
> >
> > > On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 3:16:31 AM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > > > 1. For all those other Nichiren Gohonzon missing one or another secondary items: are all those Gohonzon faked, like the Gosho letters you call faked?
> > >
> > > BS I didn't call any of Nichiren's Goshos fake. Seems like your just pulling this out of your rectum?
> >
> > Ah, now if you do not call any of the Goshos "faked" like Katie Higgins and Mark Rogow do, then you have to accept the verdict that Nichiren Daishonin calls you a liar.
> >
> > Nichiren Daishonin never says that the Gohonzon that he gave out that were missing some of what you call the "ten world Gohonzon" inscriptions were second class in any way. He does not differentiate between what you imply are first class and second class Gohonzon.
> >
> > If that is so (and it is) then you are making all of that up and calling Nichiren Daishonin a liar and a priest who bestows second class Gohonzon upon his most loyal followers.
> >
> > You must then be a Nichiren Daishonin hater, just like I said. Deny it and you call yourself a liar.
> >
> > -Chas.
> > ___________________________________________________________
> >
> > On Tuesday, November 14, 2017 at 11:49:43 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> > > You are the one who has denied nichirens purpose of his advent that happened during Koan 2 when he started inscribing 10 world gohonzons
> > >
> > > Do you accept that the primary purpose of Nichiren's life was to inscribe Gohonzons
> >
> > How incredibly 180 degrees wrong of you.
> >
> > No, the primary purpose of Nichiren's life was to propagate the Law at the heart of the Lotus Sutra and lead the Bodhisattvas of the Earth in the Kosen Rufu movement in their vow to receive the Law, spread it widely and protect it without begrudging their lives. The purpose of writing the Gosho to establish the practice of Buddhism for the Latter Day of the Law employs the Gohonzon as a safety zone of focus for chanting and is the primary means to that end, by preventing his followers from chanting to the wrong objects of devotion, such as worshiping statues of a falsely deified Shakaymuni as a man-God like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth, like Jehovah.
> >
> > How can you not get that simple primary point of the one chapter and two halves at the heart of the Ceremony in the Air in the Lotus Sutra, Noel?
> >
> > The Gohonzon is not a magical object, with a more powerful "first-class" magic from a "ten-world" Gohonzon! How True Word Tantric is your wizardly thinking! The Gohonzon is literally the great desire of Nichiren Daishonin to protect his followers, the members of the SGI from slandering and hurting themselves, it is the love of a parent in the action of protecting their children.
> >
> > Daimoku works just fine without the Gohonzon, Nichiren Daishonin chanted his way to inscribing the Gohonzon, before he ever saw one. As I pointed out in the past, Nichiren Daishonin in different places in the Gosho describes three things as the object of devotion, the Law of Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, the Lotus Sutra that contains it and the Gohonzon that is the mirror of that enlightened life state arising from chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo. The key to that is the Law. Without chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, possessing the Gohonzon has little beneficial effect other than the hope you may chant to it later, and many potential risks until that time.
> >
> > Of the thirty-two characteristics of the Buddha, the Gohonzon is missing one: the far-reaching voice of the Buddha. That sound of Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo emerges from your enlightened Buddha life.
> >
> > Get your head on straight, Noel.
> >
> > -Chas.
> > ___________________________________________________________
> >
> > On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 1:41:19 AM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> > > Nichirens Gohonzons evolved from NMRK to 10 world Gohonzons. You just have to look at nichiren shu's 128 Gohonzons that I have posted many times The facts speak for themselves
> > >
> > > But I know you have an aversion to click on any link that hasnt been approved by your infantile imagination of what you think that the soka Gakkai deems as kosher
> > >
> > > Your not even up to date with the current state of the shifting sands of soka Gakkai
> > >
> > > You would have to be the most irrelevant person on arbn
> >
> > So, now your argument is that there is a fine-grained evolutionary ladder of Gohonzon made by Nichiren Daishonin, from worst to best as he started off as the worst (most provisional) Nichiren Daishonin and gradually became the best (most true) Nichiren Daishonin.
> >
> > According to your new theory, those first and most loyal followers who received their Gohonzon early on would obviously have been followers of the worst (most provisional) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump would say: they are the LOSERS in faith.
> >
> > Those last arriving and most recent followers who held out for the very last and best Gohonzon would obviously have been followers of the best (most true) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump would say: they are the WINNERS in faith.
> >
> > Then, finding the very BEST Gohonzon would be the ultimate struggle to be the BEST follower of the BEST (most true) Nichiren Daishonin and that single Gohonzon might still be in private hands, or worse, have been lost to history.
> >
> > Then a mad Gohonzon hunt and an evolutionary battle of the fittest would be necessary by all members of the human race, to become the VERY BEST (most true) follower of Nichiren Daishonin would commence, and that struggle might turn out to be in vain, since that pinnacle Gohonzon may have been lost.
> >
> > That is the logical outcome from you views: the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
> >
> > Contrasting your hellish belief system, is the view of the SGI, which I have heard many times from many leaders: simply that all that a Gohonzon needs to work is Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the center, and your own far-reaching voice of the Buddha does the "Buddha's work".
> >
> > In that view, ALL of Nichiren Daishonin's Gohonzon and any qualifying Gohonzon (with Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the center) are the BEST Gohonzon and ANYONE receiving one from the hands of Nichiren Daishonin's true followers (not from traitorous priests, nor a pirate website dispensing stolen Gohonzon downloads transmitted ultimately from a traitorous priesthood source and making that profoundly evil cause,) are obviously the followers of the BEST (MOST TRUE) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump might say, they are all, each and every single one, the WINNERS in faith.
> >
> > In other words, everyone who plays according to the rules of the Gosho, wins the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
> >
> > Nichiren Daishonin would then have been the very best Buddha with the best followers all along: no LOSERS, only WINNERS.
> >
> > I must say, Noel, I like my world, my universe, a whole hell of a lot better than yours.
> >
> > As everyone knows, there is simply no replacement for talent.
> >
> > However, in my world, everyone is talented.
> >
> > -Chas.
> > ___________________________________________________________
> >
> > On Tuesday, November 21, 2017 at 1:40:45 AM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> >
> > [snip]
> >
> > > >In other words, everyone who plays according to the rules of the Gosho, wins the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
> > >
> > > Then your the biggest loser
> > >
> >
> > [snip the rest of the vitriol]
> >
> > However, Noel's Fantasy Gohonzon Hunger Games is not the way the world is.
> >
> > It is only in his mind that he is a winner, because he has found "the golden ticket".
> >
> > Noel, Nichiren Daishonin is not Willy Wonka!
> >
> > =Chas.
>
> "Its not just an image in black and white, the Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically."
>
>
> Have you heard of the three truths san-tai
>
> "three truths ( san-tai): Also, threefold truth, triple truth, or three perceptions of the truth. The truth of non-substantiality, the truth of temporary existence, and the truth of the Middle Way.
>
> The three integral aspects of the truth, or ultimate reality, formulated by T'ien-t'ai (538–597) in The Profound Meaning of the Lotus Sutra and Great Concentration and Insight.
>
> The truth of non-substantiality means that phenomena have no existence of their own; their true nature is non-substantial, indefinable in terms of existence or nonexistence.
>
> The truth of temporary existence means that, although non-substantial, all things possess a temporary reality that is in constant flux.
>
> The truth of the Middle Way means that the true nature of phenomena is that they are neither non-substantial nor temporary, though they display attributes of both. The Middle Way is the essence of things that continues either in a manifest or a latent state.
>
> According to T'ien-t'ai's explanation, the Tripitaka teaching and the connecting teaching do not reveal the truth of the Middle Way and therefore lack the three truths.
>
> The specific teaching reveals the three truths but shows them as being separate from and independent of one another; that is, it does not teach that these three are inseparable aspects of all phenomena. This view is called the separation of the three truths.
>
> The perfect teaching views the three as an integral whole, each possessing all three within itself. This is called the unification of the three truths."
>
> A True 10 world Gohonzon is a perfect manifestation of the heart of the Lotus Sutra...ichinen sanzen
So, now you are saying that by inscribing and bestowing less-than-ten-world Gohonzon upon his most treasured followers before a certain date, that Nichiren Daishonin was slandering the three truths and guaranteeing that his most treasured followers would be slandering the three truths for the rest of their lives, and their families and descendants afterwards, in aeternum? That those Gohonzon would not work after his death? That the "supreme objecto of devotion in all of Jambudvipa" is not supreme?
If that were true, this guy Nichiren Daishonin would have to be hateful in the most sneaky way, because those folks would never know what hit them. However, it is clearly NOT TRUE and you are clearly WRONG ABOUT THIS, and Nichiren Daishonin's less-than-ten-world Gohonzon and his ten-world Gohonzon are the same "supreme object of devotion in all of Jambudvipa", just different in appearance. And then the axiom that all that a Gohonzon needs to work is "Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren" down the middle sounds right.
Poor show, Noel.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Saturday, December 16, 2017 at 9:04:40 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> You are the expert of knowing what has been written in arbn
>
> Can you please find my answers to your questions that I've already given you
I simply remember that your evasive answers were never relevant to my questions and always dodged them in critical ways. I don't remember the locations of those evasions, or have a notion of how to search for them.
Note that I do not think you can actually come up with honest and thoughtful answers and remain a follower of Nichiren Daishonin: because those answers would indicate either a turnaround in your thinking about the flawed nature of the early Gohonzons bestowed upon Nichiren Daishonin's closest followers, or your utter hatred and loathing of Nichiren Daishonin as a despicable betrayer of his earliest and closest followers.
You are in a box with no exit with a nuclear source connected to your demise, Schrödinger's Noel. When we open the box later, will you be dead or alive?
-Chas.
____________________________________________
Quoting from "The Entity of the Mystic Law", Writings of Nichiren Daishonin, p. 418 ...
The Complete and Final Teaching on Perfect Enlightenment Sutra declares, "The beginningless illusions and ignorance that beset all living beings are all produced by the perfectly enlightened mind of the Thus Come Ones."
Responding to the following post, which may become deleted out of embarrassment:
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.religion.buddhism.nichiren/uW7dASM3NC4/ywEtC41pCQAJ
On Friday, May 19, 2017 at 11:39:26 PM UTC-7, Noel wrote:
> On Saturday, May 20, 2017 at 2:33:54 PM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > On Friday, May 19, 2017 at 6:32:36 PM UTC-7, Noel wrote:
> > > "Its not just an image in black and white, the Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically."
> > >
> > > Then you can chant to Shakyamuni's or Nichiren's statue and percieve the Gohonzon with your kind of faith that doesn't need optical representations better still all you have to do is think it as it already exists the unseen dimension
> >
> > No, I said the GOHONZON has unseen dimensions, not my mind or some statues. I perceive them when I chant. They only exist in the GOHONZON.
> >
> > You have a real problem parsing an English sentence, Noel. Maybe some remedial reading classes? Glasses?
> >
> > -Chas.
>
> The true aspect and all phenomena have to be present to be a holistic presentation of our life,in other words they have to be side by side because the true aspect doesn't exist by itself. If you have to look into unseen dimensions of the Gohonzon to complete the 10 worlds every time you do gongyo you would have to be visualizing the 5 worlds that are not there so you could transform them.
>
> Since the oneness of true aspect and all phenomena are already present in Nichirens 10 world Gohonzons I don't have to stress about remembering the missing worlds each time I do gongyo or wishfully believe that they are there just so I can justify having a five world Gohonzon as you do
>
> We perceive whatever we like in our mind games and Buddhism is a mind game that your really bad at playing because of your narrow perception of Buddhism. The Gohonzon exists in the seen and unseen to the minutest material phenomena to that which is beyond matter as an infinite potential to the manifestation of that potential that is in my room as a copy of an original 10 world Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon that is missing in your practice and why your practice is only a partial truth that slanders the higher truth...Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
What you just said, Noel, reveals a lot that you did not intend about what you have not perceived, that any person chanting to a Gohonzon ... that was NOT stolen AND NOT received from traitors that turned away from Nichiren Daishonin the moment that he died and actually a long time before that ... will actually perceive. And that's probably why all the worlds are inscribed onto that Gohonzon for you.
Since I have your attention ...
___________________________________________
This was posted in ARBN, responding to a question, which I mentioned should be directed to someone knowledgable in the SGI:
... This from Soka Spirit.
...
... 3) They claim There are Missing Characters on Nichikan
... Gohonzon
...
... There are characters on the Nikken and Nittatsu transcribed
... Gohonzon that are not on the Nichikan Gohonzon. The essence
... of the Gohonzon is the inscription that embodies the power
... of the Law and the power of the Buddha, or
... "Nam-myoho-renge-kyo." This inscription represents the
... enlightened life of Nichiren Daishonin; this is the heart
... of the Gohonzon.
...
... The surrounding names which represent the mutual possession
... of the Ten Worlds are secondary and have varied since
... Nichiren began inscribing Gohonzon. Not all of the Gohonzon
... inscribed by Nichiren are the same by any means. For
... example, of the 120 extant Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon,
... only about a third contain the name Devadatta representing
... the world of Hell; only 65 contain Shariputra and
... Maudgalayana representing people of the two vehicles, and
... so on.
...
... After the Daishonin's death, successive high priests
... exercised their own judgment in how to represent the
... principle of the Ten Worlds.
...
... As usual with this practice, if one has enough seeking
... spirit, one finds the answers one is looking for.
There we go. When the people following Nichiren Shu parade around their stolen Gohonzon obtained there, proclaiming that they have a true ten-world Gohonzon, they are like a Matador holding up the ears of the bull that they have just killed to the roar of the crowd. The prostrate forms of the Buddhas in the ten direction that they have slain are literally everywhere.
What they will never perceive with a stolen Gohonzon, due to the slander involved in receiving it, is what was heard from the SGI: Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the middle is all you need to manifest the ten worlds and all the other jewels in the treasure tower of your life, mirrored in the Gohonzon. The cause for that is chanting with faith, and in the early going, hope substitutes for that faith (because one hopes it might just work.)
It's not just an image in black and white, Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically.
I have seven questions for those minions of darkness at Nichiren Shu waving around their stolen "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon":
1. For all those other Nichiren Gohonzon missing one or another secondary items: are all those Gohonzon faked, like the Gosho letters you call faked?
2. Do those authentic Nichiren non-ten-world Gohonzon work, or not?
3. Did Nichiren Daishonin actually give his followers Gohonzon that were non-functional, or did he chant to them and see that they worked?
4. Do you believe Nichiren Daishonin could be so intentionally cruel to his devoted followers?
5. Do you believe Nichiren Daishonin to be so irresponsibly lazy and careless to neglect to chant to those few hundred Gohonzon that he just spent much careful time inscribing for his followers: to quality assure that the most important product of his life might function properly?
6. Do you really believe Nichiren Daishonin is that stupid? Or do you just hate him that much?
7. And, by the way, do you think that your "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon" has EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY secondary item inscribed on it from all the Gohonzon Nichiren Daishonin ever inscribed? What are YOU missing on your "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon"?
Actually, I can answer that one for you: you have missed entirely everything and all the points of Nichiren Daishonin's practice of Lotus Sutra Buddhism. What you have found is a pointed, utter hatred of Nichiren Daishonin, his followers and the Lotus Sutra, by chanting to a Gohonzon received from the traitors and murderers of Nichiren Shu that now worship statues and chant to stolen Gohonzon copied from those that should only belong to Nichiren Daishonin's true followers pursuing his Kosen Rufu movement.
I would suggest that Nichiren Daishonin inscribed secondary items on some Gohonzon to personalize the Gohonzon in areas of concern, for those followers who needed a leg up to get on their horse and ride. Those who distort that act of deep and thoughtful compassion have turned Nichiren Daishonin's concern for an individual follower and their family, into a weapon of mass destruction to attack his Kosen Rufu movement. Some serious batsu, there!
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
> On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 3:16:31 AM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > 1. For all those other Nichiren Gohonzon missing one or another secondary items: are all those Gohonzon faked, like the Gosho letters you call faked?
>
> BS I didn't call any of Nichiren's Goshos fake. Seems like your just pulling this out of your rectum?
Ah, now if you do not call any of the Goshos "faked" like Katie Higgins and Mark Rogow do, then you have to accept the verdict that Nichiren Daishonin calls you a liar.
Nichiren Daishonin never says that the Gohonzon that he gave out that were missing some of what you call the "ten world Gohonzon" inscriptions were second class in any way. He does not differentiate between what you imply are first class and second class Gohonzon.
If that is so (and it is) then you are making all of that up and calling Nichiren Daishonin a liar and a priest who bestows second class Gohonzon upon his most loyal followers.
You must then be a Nichiren Daishonin hater, just like I said. Deny it and you call yourself a liar.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Tuesday, November 14, 2017 at 11:49:43 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> You are the one who has denied nichirens purpose of his advent that happened during Koan 2 when he started inscribing 10 world gohonzons
>
> Do you accept that the primary purpose of Nichiren's life was to inscribe Gohonzons
How incredibly 180 degrees wrong of you.
No, the primary purpose of Nichiren's life was to propagate the Law at the heart of the Lotus Sutra and lead the Bodhisattvas of the Earth in the Kosen Rufu movement in their vow to receive the Law, spread it widely and protect it without begrudging their lives. The purpose of writing the Gosho to establish the practice of Buddhism for the Latter Day of the Law employs the Gohonzon as a safety zone of focus for chanting and is the primary means to that end, by preventing his followers from chanting to the wrong objects of devotion, such as worshiping statues of a falsely deified Shakaymuni as a man-God like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth, like Jehovah.
How can you not get that simple primary point of the one chapter and two halves at the heart of the Ceremony in the Air in the Lotus Sutra, Noel?
The Gohonzon is not a magical object, with a more powerful "first-class" magic from a "ten-world" Gohonzon! How True Word Tantric is your wizardly thinking! The Gohonzon is literally the great desire of Nichiren Daishonin to protect his followers, the members of the SGI from slandering and hurting themselves, it is the love of a parent in the action of protecting their children.
Daimoku works just fine without the Gohonzon, Nichiren Daishonin chanted his way to inscribing the Gohonzon, before he ever saw one. As I pointed out in the past, Nichiren Daishonin in different places in the Gosho describes three things as the object of devotion, the Law of Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, the Lotus Sutra that contains it and the Gohonzon that is the mirror of that enlightened life state arising from chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo. The key to that is the Law. Without chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, possessing the Gohonzon has little beneficial effect other than the hope you may chant to it later, and many potential risks until that time.
Of the thirty-two characteristics of the Buddha, the Gohonzon is missing one: the far-reaching voice of the Buddha. That sound of Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo emerges from your enlightened Buddha life.
Get your head on straight, Noel.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 1:41:19 AM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> Nichirens Gohonzons evolved from NMRK to 10 world Gohonzons. You just have to look at nichiren shu's 128 Gohonzons that I have posted many times The facts speak for themselves
>
> But I know you have an aversion to click on any link that hasnt been approved by your infantile imagination of what you think that the soka Gakkai deems as kosher
>
> Your not even up to date with the current state of the shifting sands of soka Gakkai
>
> You would have to be the most irrelevant person on arbn
So, now your argument is that there is a fine-grained evolutionary ladder of Gohonzon made by Nichiren Daishonin, from worst to best as he started off as the worst (most provisional) Nichiren Daishonin and gradually became the best (most true) Nichiren Daishonin.
According to your new theory, those first and most loyal followers who received their Gohonzon early on would obviously have been followers of the worst (most provisional) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump would say: they are the LOSERS in faith.
Those last arriving and most recent followers who held out for the very last and best Gohonzon would obviously have been followers of the best (most true) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump would say: they are the WINNERS in faith.
Then, finding the very BEST Gohonzon would be the ultimate struggle to be the BEST follower of the BEST (most true) Nichiren Daishonin and that single Gohonzon might still be in private hands, or worse, have been lost to history.
Then a mad Gohonzon hunt and an evolutionary battle of the fittest would be necessary by all members of the human race, to become the VERY BEST (most true) follower of Nichiren Daishonin would commence, and that struggle might turn out to be in vain, since that pinnacle Gohonzon may have been lost.
That is the logical outcome from you views: the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
Contrasting your hellish belief system, is the view of the SGI, which I have heard many times from many leaders: simply that all that a Gohonzon needs to work is Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the center, and your own far-reaching voice of the Buddha does the "Buddha's work".
In that view, ALL of Nichiren Daishonin's Gohonzon and any qualifying Gohonzon (with Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the center) are the BEST Gohonzon and ANYONE receiving one from the hands of Nichiren Daishonin's true followers (not from traitorous priests, nor a pirate website dispensing stolen Gohonzon downloads transmitted ultimately from a traitorous priesthood source and making that profoundly evil cause,) are obviously the followers of the BEST (MOST TRUE) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump might say, they are all, each and every single one, the WINNERS in faith.
In other words, everyone who plays according to the rules of the Gosho, wins the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
Nichiren Daishonin would then have been the very best Buddha with the best followers all along: no LOSERS, only WINNERS.
I must say, Noel, I like my world, my universe, a whole hell of a lot better than yours.
As everyone knows, there is simply no replacement for talent.
However, in my world, everyone is talented.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Tuesday, November 21, 2017 at 1:40:45 AM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
[snip]
> >In other words, everyone who plays according to the rules of the Gosho, wins the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
>
> Then your the biggest loser
>
[snip the rest of the vitriol]
However, Noel's Fantasy Gohonzon Hunger Games is not the way the world is.
It is only in his mind that he is a winner, because he has found "the golden ticket".
Noel, Nichiren Daishonin is not Willy Wonka!
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Saturday, November 25, 2017 at 10:22:14 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> On Sunday, November 26, 2017 at 2:13:25 PM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > On Thursday, November 23, 2017 at 5:48:56 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> > > There you go again with your delusions of being Mr Right
> >
> > Proving once again by your descent into ignoratio elenchi, that you are avoiding the seven points by firing up the flak batteries.
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignoratio_elenchi
> >
> > Like I said, you CANNOT ADDRESS MY SEVEN POINTS:
> >
> > The Seven Questions Noel Simply Cannot Face Regarding His Hatred of Nichiren Daishonin +
> >
> > Responding to the following post, which may become deleted out of embarrassment:
> > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.religion.buddhism.nichiren/uW7dASM3NC4/ywEtC41pCQAJ
> >
> > On Friday, May 19, 2017 at 11:39:26 PM UTC-7, Noel wrote:
> > > On Saturday, May 20, 2017 at 2:33:54 PM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > > > On Friday, May 19, 2017 at 6:32:36 PM UTC-7, Noel wrote:
> > > > > "Its not just an image in black and white, the Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically."
> > > > >
> > > > > Then you can chant to Shakyamuni's or Nichiren's statue and percieve the Gohonzon with your kind of faith that doesn't need optical representations better still all you have to do is think it as it already exists the unseen dimension
> > > >
> > > > No, I said the GOHONZON has unseen dimensions, not my mind or some statues. I perceive them when I chant. They only exist in the GOHONZON.
> > > >
> > > > You have a real problem parsing an English sentence, Noel. Maybe some remedial reading classes? Glasses?
> > > >
> > > > -Chas.
> > >
> > > The true aspect and all phenomena have to be present to be a holistic presentation of our life,in other words they have to be side by side because the true aspect doesn't exist by itself. If you have to look into unseen dimensions of the Gohonzon to complete the 10 worlds every time you do gongyo you would have to be visualizing the 5 worlds that are not there so you could transform them.
> > >
> > > Since the oneness of true aspect and all phenomena are already present in Nichirens 10 world Gohonzons I don't have to stress about remembering the missing worlds each time I do gongyo or wishfully believe that they are there just so I can justify having a five world Gohonzon as you do
> > >
> > > We perceive whatever we like in our mind games and Buddhism is a mind game that your really bad at playing because of your narrow perception of Buddhism. The Gohonzon exists in the seen and unseen to the minutest material phenomena to that which is beyond matter as an infinite potential to the manifestation of that potential that is in my room as a copy of an original 10 world Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon that is missing in your practice and why your practice is only a partial truth that slanders the higher truth...Namu Myoho Renge Kyo
> >
> > What you just said, Noel, reveals a lot that you did not intend about what you have not perceived, that any person chanting to a Gohonzon ... that was NOT stolen AND NOT received from traitors that turned away from Nichiren Daishonin the moment that he died and actually a long time before that ... will actually perceive. And that's probably why all the worlds are inscribed onto that Gohonzon for you.
> >
> > Since I have your attention ...
> > ___________________________________________
> >
> > This was posted in ARBN, responding to a question, which I mentioned should be directed to someone knowledgable in the SGI:
> >
> > ... This from Soka Spirit.
> > ...
> > ... 3) They claim There are Missing Characters on Nichikan
> > ... Gohonzon
> > ...
> > ... There are characters on the Nikken and Nittatsu transcribed
> > ... Gohonzon that are not on the Nichikan Gohonzon. The essence
> > ... of the Gohonzon is the inscription that embodies the power
> > ... of the Law and the power of the Buddha, or
> > ... "Nam-myoho-renge-kyo." This inscription represents the
> > ... enlightened life of Nichiren Daishonin; this is the heart
> > ... of the Gohonzon.
> > ...
> > ... The surrounding names which represent the mutual possession
> > ... of the Ten Worlds are secondary and have varied since
> > ... Nichiren began inscribing Gohonzon. Not all of the Gohonzon
> > ... inscribed by Nichiren are the same by any means. For
> > ... example, of the 120 extant Nichiren inscribed Gohonzon,
> > ... only about a third contain the name Devadatta representing
> > ... the world of Hell; only 65 contain Shariputra and
> > ... Maudgalayana representing people of the two vehicles, and
> > ... so on.
> > ...
> > ... After the Daishonin's death, successive high priests
> > ... exercised their own judgment in how to represent the
> > ... principle of the Ten Worlds.
> > ...
> > ... As usual with this practice, if one has enough seeking
> > ... spirit, one finds the answers one is looking for.
> >
> > There we go. When the people following Nichiren Shu parade around their stolen Gohonzon obtained there, proclaiming that they have a true ten-world Gohonzon, they are like a Matador holding up the ears of the bull that they have just killed to the roar of the crowd. The prostrate forms of the Buddhas in the ten direction that they have slain are literally everywhere.
> >
> > What they will never perceive with a stolen Gohonzon, due to the slander involved in receiving it, is what was heard from the SGI: Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the middle is all you need to manifest the ten worlds and all the other jewels in the treasure tower of your life, mirrored in the Gohonzon. The cause for that is chanting with faith, and in the early going, hope substitutes for that faith (because one hopes it might just work.)
> >
> > It's not just an image in black and white, Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically.
> >
> > I have seven questions for those minions of darkness at Nichiren Shu waving around their stolen "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon":
> >
> > 1. For all those other Nichiren Gohonzon missing one or another secondary items: are all those Gohonzon faked, like the Gosho letters you call faked?
> >
> > 2. Do those authentic Nichiren non-ten-world Gohonzon work, or not?
> >
> > 3. Did Nichiren Daishonin actually give his followers Gohonzon that were non-functional, or did he chant to them and see that they worked?
> >
> > 4. Do you believe Nichiren Daishonin could be so intentionally cruel to his devoted followers?
> >
> > 5. Do you believe Nichiren Daishonin to be so irresponsibly lazy and careless to neglect to chant to those few hundred Gohonzon that he just spent much careful time inscribing for his followers: to quality assure that the most important product of his life might function properly?
> >
> > 6. Do you really believe Nichiren Daishonin is that stupid? Or do you just hate him that much?
> >
> > 7. And, by the way, do you think that your "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon" has EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY secondary item inscribed on it from all the Gohonzon Nichiren Daishonin ever inscribed? What are YOU missing on your "authentic Nichiren ten-world Gohonzon"?
> >
> > Actually, I can answer that one for you: you have missed entirely everything and all the points of Nichiren Daishonin's practice of Lotus Sutra Buddhism. What you have found is a pointed, utter hatred of Nichiren Daishonin, his followers and the Lotus Sutra, by chanting to a Gohonzon received from the traitors and murderers of Nichiren Shu that now worship statues and chant to stolen Gohonzon copied from those that should only belong to Nichiren Daishonin's true followers pursuing his Kosen Rufu movement.
> >
> > I would suggest that Nichiren Daishonin inscribed secondary items on some Gohonzon to personalize the Gohonzon in areas of concern, for those followers who needed a leg up to get on their horse and ride. Those who distort that act of deep and thoughtful compassion have turned Nichiren Daishonin's concern for an individual follower and their family, into a weapon of mass destruction to attack his Kosen Rufu movement. Some serious batsu, there!
> >
> > -Chas.
> > ___________________________________________________________
> >
> > > On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 3:16:31 AM UTC+10, Chas. wrote:
> > > > 1. For all those other Nichiren Gohonzon missing one or another secondary items: are all those Gohonzon faked, like the Gosho letters you call faked?
> > >
> > > BS I didn't call any of Nichiren's Goshos fake. Seems like your just pulling this out of your rectum?
> >
> > Ah, now if you do not call any of the Goshos "faked" like Katie Higgins and Mark Rogow do, then you have to accept the verdict that Nichiren Daishonin calls you a liar.
> >
> > Nichiren Daishonin never says that the Gohonzon that he gave out that were missing some of what you call the "ten world Gohonzon" inscriptions were second class in any way. He does not differentiate between what you imply are first class and second class Gohonzon.
> >
> > If that is so (and it is) then you are making all of that up and calling Nichiren Daishonin a liar and a priest who bestows second class Gohonzon upon his most loyal followers.
> >
> > You must then be a Nichiren Daishonin hater, just like I said. Deny it and you call yourself a liar.
> >
> > -Chas.
> > ___________________________________________________________
> >
> > On Tuesday, November 14, 2017 at 11:49:43 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> > > You are the one who has denied nichirens purpose of his advent that happened during Koan 2 when he started inscribing 10 world gohonzons
> > >
> > > Do you accept that the primary purpose of Nichiren's life was to inscribe Gohonzons
> >
> > How incredibly 180 degrees wrong of you.
> >
> > No, the primary purpose of Nichiren's life was to propagate the Law at the heart of the Lotus Sutra and lead the Bodhisattvas of the Earth in the Kosen Rufu movement in their vow to receive the Law, spread it widely and protect it without begrudging their lives. The purpose of writing the Gosho to establish the practice of Buddhism for the Latter Day of the Law employs the Gohonzon as a safety zone of focus for chanting and is the primary means to that end, by preventing his followers from chanting to the wrong objects of devotion, such as worshiping statues of a falsely deified Shakaymuni as a man-God like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth, like Jehovah.
> >
> > How can you not get that simple primary point of the one chapter and two halves at the heart of the Ceremony in the Air in the Lotus Sutra, Noel?
> >
> > The Gohonzon is not a magical object, with a more powerful "first-class" magic from a "ten-world" Gohonzon! How True Word Tantric is your wizardly thinking! The Gohonzon is literally the great desire of Nichiren Daishonin to protect his followers, the members of the SGI from slandering and hurting themselves, it is the love of a parent in the action of protecting their children.
> >
> > Daimoku works just fine without the Gohonzon, Nichiren Daishonin chanted his way to inscribing the Gohonzon, before he ever saw one. As I pointed out in the past, Nichiren Daishonin in different places in the Gosho describes three things as the object of devotion, the Law of Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, the Lotus Sutra that contains it and the Gohonzon that is the mirror of that enlightened life state arising from chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo. The key to that is the Law. Without chanting Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, possessing the Gohonzon has little beneficial effect other than the hope you may chant to it later, and many potential risks until that time.
> >
> > Of the thirty-two characteristics of the Buddha, the Gohonzon is missing one: the far-reaching voice of the Buddha. That sound of Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo emerges from your enlightened Buddha life.
> >
> > Get your head on straight, Noel.
> >
> > -Chas.
> > ___________________________________________________________
> >
> > On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 1:41:19 AM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> > > Nichirens Gohonzons evolved from NMRK to 10 world Gohonzons. You just have to look at nichiren shu's 128 Gohonzons that I have posted many times The facts speak for themselves
> > >
> > > But I know you have an aversion to click on any link that hasnt been approved by your infantile imagination of what you think that the soka Gakkai deems as kosher
> > >
> > > Your not even up to date with the current state of the shifting sands of soka Gakkai
> > >
> > > You would have to be the most irrelevant person on arbn
> >
> > So, now your argument is that there is a fine-grained evolutionary ladder of Gohonzon made by Nichiren Daishonin, from worst to best as he started off as the worst (most provisional) Nichiren Daishonin and gradually became the best (most true) Nichiren Daishonin.
> >
> > According to your new theory, those first and most loyal followers who received their Gohonzon early on would obviously have been followers of the worst (most provisional) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump would say: they are the LOSERS in faith.
> >
> > Those last arriving and most recent followers who held out for the very last and best Gohonzon would obviously have been followers of the best (most true) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump would say: they are the WINNERS in faith.
> >
> > Then, finding the very BEST Gohonzon would be the ultimate struggle to be the BEST follower of the BEST (most true) Nichiren Daishonin and that single Gohonzon might still be in private hands, or worse, have been lost to history.
> >
> > Then a mad Gohonzon hunt and an evolutionary battle of the fittest would be necessary by all members of the human race, to become the VERY BEST (most true) follower of Nichiren Daishonin would commence, and that struggle might turn out to be in vain, since that pinnacle Gohonzon may have been lost.
> >
> > That is the logical outcome from you views: the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
> >
> > Contrasting your hellish belief system, is the view of the SGI, which I have heard many times from many leaders: simply that all that a Gohonzon needs to work is Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the center, and your own far-reaching voice of the Buddha does the "Buddha's work".
> >
> > In that view, ALL of Nichiren Daishonin's Gohonzon and any qualifying Gohonzon (with Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren down the center) are the BEST Gohonzon and ANYONE receiving one from the hands of Nichiren Daishonin's true followers (not from traitorous priests, nor a pirate website dispensing stolen Gohonzon downloads transmitted ultimately from a traitorous priesthood source and making that profoundly evil cause,) are obviously the followers of the BEST (MOST TRUE) Nichiren Daishonin and as our wonderful President Trump might say, they are all, each and every single one, the WINNERS in faith.
> >
> > In other words, everyone who plays according to the rules of the Gosho, wins the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
> >
> > Nichiren Daishonin would then have been the very best Buddha with the best followers all along: no LOSERS, only WINNERS.
> >
> > I must say, Noel, I like my world, my universe, a whole hell of a lot better than yours.
> >
> > As everyone knows, there is simply no replacement for talent.
> >
> > However, in my world, everyone is talented.
> >
> > -Chas.
> > ___________________________________________________________
> >
> > On Tuesday, November 21, 2017 at 1:40:45 AM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> >
> > [snip]
> >
> > > >In other words, everyone who plays according to the rules of the Gosho, wins the Gohonzon Hunger Games.
> > >
> > > Then your the biggest loser
> > >
> >
> > [snip the rest of the vitriol]
> >
> > However, Noel's Fantasy Gohonzon Hunger Games is not the way the world is.
> >
> > It is only in his mind that he is a winner, because he has found "the golden ticket".
> >
> > Noel, Nichiren Daishonin is not Willy Wonka!
> >
> > =Chas.
>
> "Its not just an image in black and white, the Gohonzon has dimensions in the realm of faith that you cannot perceive optically."
>
>
> Have you heard of the three truths san-tai
>
> "three truths ( san-tai): Also, threefold truth, triple truth, or three perceptions of the truth. The truth of non-substantiality, the truth of temporary existence, and the truth of the Middle Way.
>
> The three integral aspects of the truth, or ultimate reality, formulated by T'ien-t'ai (538–597) in The Profound Meaning of the Lotus Sutra and Great Concentration and Insight.
>
> The truth of non-substantiality means that phenomena have no existence of their own; their true nature is non-substantial, indefinable in terms of existence or nonexistence.
>
> The truth of temporary existence means that, although non-substantial, all things possess a temporary reality that is in constant flux.
>
> The truth of the Middle Way means that the true nature of phenomena is that they are neither non-substantial nor temporary, though they display attributes of both. The Middle Way is the essence of things that continues either in a manifest or a latent state.
>
> According to T'ien-t'ai's explanation, the Tripitaka teaching and the connecting teaching do not reveal the truth of the Middle Way and therefore lack the three truths.
>
> The specific teaching reveals the three truths but shows them as being separate from and independent of one another; that is, it does not teach that these three are inseparable aspects of all phenomena. This view is called the separation of the three truths.
>
> The perfect teaching views the three as an integral whole, each possessing all three within itself. This is called the unification of the three truths."
>
> A True 10 world Gohonzon is a perfect manifestation of the heart of the Lotus Sutra...ichinen sanzen
So, now you are saying that by inscribing and bestowing less-than-ten-world Gohonzon upon his most treasured followers before a certain date, that Nichiren Daishonin was slandering the three truths and guaranteeing that his most treasured followers would be slandering the three truths for the rest of their lives, and their families and descendants afterwards, in aeternum? That those Gohonzon would not work after his death? That the "supreme objecto of devotion in all of Jambudvipa" is not supreme?
If that were true, this guy Nichiren Daishonin would have to be hateful in the most sneaky way, because those folks would never know what hit them. However, it is clearly NOT TRUE and you are clearly WRONG ABOUT THIS, and Nichiren Daishonin's less-than-ten-world Gohonzon and his ten-world Gohonzon are the same "supreme object of devotion in all of Jambudvipa", just different in appearance. And then the axiom that all that a Gohonzon needs to work is "Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren" down the middle sounds right.
Poor show, Noel.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Saturday, December 16, 2017 at 9:04:40 PM UTC-8, Noel wrote:
> You are the expert of knowing what has been written in arbn
>
> Can you please find my answers to your questions that I've already given you
I simply remember that your evasive answers were never relevant to my questions and always dodged them in critical ways. I don't remember the locations of those evasions, or have a notion of how to search for them.
Note that I do not think you can actually come up with honest and thoughtful answers and remain a follower of Nichiren Daishonin: because those answers would indicate either a turnaround in your thinking about the flawed nature of the early Gohonzons bestowed upon Nichiren Daishonin's closest followers, or your utter hatred and loathing of Nichiren Daishonin as a despicable betrayer of his earliest and closest followers.
You are in a box with no exit with a nuclear source connected to your demise, Schrödinger's Noel. When we open the box later, will you be dead or alive?
-Chas.
____________________________________________
Quoting from "The Entity of the Mystic Law", Writings of Nichiren Daishonin, p. 418 ...
The Complete and Final Teaching on Perfect Enlightenment Sutra declares, "The beginningless illusions and ignorance that beset all living beings are all produced by the perfectly enlightened mind of the Thus Come Ones."
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